Politics Thread

[Caf]

So, hes going to get on the court. That's great...except he had to go thru unnecessary complete hell for two weeks, now has a forever black mark on his reputation, and has received death threats. I'm going to say that this is all more than just "sucks."

The final hour shitshow that the democrats pulled was a complete circus and is not the system working. The great thing is that it is going to bite them square in the ass at the midterms.

You're not going to find me defending the Democrats here, but you're ignoring the reality of the situation. A woman came forward and said she 100% knows Brett Kavanaugh assaulted her. The government heard, addressed, and investigated the allegation. What else could have been done to resolve the accusation in a more just manner?

If your gripe is that he's guilty in the minds of others than you gotta be more realistic. There is no justice in the court of public opinion. If he doesn't get on the court because of this I'll join you crying foul, but this was a necessary process. Many would even say it was insufficient.

[boozehound]

So, hes going to get on the court. That's great...except he had to go thru unnecessary complete hell for two weeks, now has a forever black mark on his reputation, and has received death threats. I'm going to say that this is all more than just "sucks."

The final hour shitshow that the democrats pulled was a complete circus and is not the system working. The great thing is that it is going to bite them square in the ass at the midterms.

How would you improve the system, then? Do you punish accusers in cases where insufficient evidence to prosecute or convict is found? What are the potential consequences of that? Doesn't that violate one of the core principles of our justice system?

This is the system working. It's not a perfect system, but it's the best one out there. It's unfortunate that this has been made into the political circus that it has become, but I would argue that is a flaw of the political system, not the justice system.

[Xville]

How would you improve the system, then? Do you punish accusers in cases where insufficient evidence to prosecute or convict is found? What are the potential consequences of that? Doesn't that violate one of the core principles of our justice system?

This is the system working. It's not a perfect system, but it's the best one out there. It's unfortunate that this has been made into the political circus that it has become, but I would argue that is a flaw of the political system, not the justice system.

That's my whole point. This was not the justice system, this was the political circus (doesn't have the right to be called a system) and it was a complete shitshow.

[xudash]

Because he was accused, the accusations were unfounded and he's going to get on the court.

Here's the alternative: he was accused, the allegations were unfounded and he doesn't get on the court.

Should it have come to this?

[Caf]

Should it have come to this?

Are you asking if he should have been accused? Is this discussion officially leaving reality?

[Caf]

That's my whole point. This was not the justice system, this was the political circus (doesn't have the right to be called a system) and it was a complete shitshow.

Fair enough. I still don't see a better alternative. If the committee just moved right along to a vote without the hearing or investigation, all of the problems he's faced would have only been worse.

There are moderates, like myself, who are happy they hit the pause button on this. The people calling for more, and probably the majority of people calling for less, were never going to change their minds anyway.

[STL_XUfan]

That's my whole point. This was not the justice system, this was the political circus (doesn't have the right to be called a system) and it was a complete shitshow.

That is correct, this was not a court room where he was facing criminal charges. This was a hearing for an appointment to the Supreme Court, and the process for that is a political one. It sucks that all of our politicians prefer to have a circus, but that is the process the parties decided to have for this type of an appointment.

[xudash]

Plenty of people, sure. People with brains? Not so sure.

First of all, they aren't 'my' protesters. I don't support any of that shit. I'm not a liberal, I'm just an educated person capable of objective thought. I used to lean far more to the Republican belief system when it was about fiscal conservatism and personal freedom and responsibility, before it became the party of Trump and Hannity

Why do protests have to be 'funded'? Did the Koch brothers fund Charlottesville? Even if protests were somehow 'funded' in some way by Soros (a fact for which there is no concrete evidence that I am aware of) that would be a political activist funding organizations that enable people to (theoretically) peacefully protest. That's a pretty big jump from that, to paying someone to give false testimony about a potential Supreme Court Justice. How can you actually think she would get away with getting paid to give false testimony without it being exposed by someone?

What I do hate, are conspiracy theories. I think they are the hallmark of ignorance, and very dangerous to our society. I'm an equal opportunity hater of conspiracy theories. I don't like the crazy left wing conspiracy theories about the government funding 911 and more than the crazy right wing conspiracies about George Soros somehow funding everything that conservatives hate.

You know what, I've only put myself into this thread because of the Left's heinous treatment of Kavanaugh in this PROCESS. It is not a process. It is a concerted effort on the Left's part to do anything and everything they can to block the Supreme Court from bending back towards the right due to a Supreme being nominated by and confirmed for Trump.

So you don't believe it is possible that deep state gamesmanship crap is taking place. I hope you're right. I frankly don't make it my hobby to dig into it. BTW, we're similar in our beliefs based upon what you revealed about yourself. I place myself as a moderate conservative with an emphasis on the two things you noted: fiscal responsibility and personal freedom and self-reliance (responsibility).

People from the far Right and the far Left bother me. They're extreme, obviously, by default. What happened in Charlottesville was terrible. Loony leftist activist idiots who harass people while they're trying to have dinner or whatever is a great example of a new low for our society.

You mentioned the (theoretically) peaceful protest. There is nothing peaceful about those leftist activists who confront and scream their drivel at people, just as there is nothing peaceful about an idiot mowing people down with a car. At least my brain seems to process what I see as being well past "peaceful" and dare I offer "productive" protests. In short, there is way too much misguided emotion and passion on both ends of the political spectrum now; these people are too lathered up.

As I noted, it isn't my hobby to attempt to track potential conspiracies, but it doesn't take much time to find compelling reporting about the potential for it:

https://nypost.com/2018/10/01/look-w...levator-setup/

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...609-story.html

George Soros is one evil SOB. His vision for the United States is dreadful.

The country seems very split these days and it appears to be on a track that will only lead to a wider fracture. And the Democrats, in particular in this case, made a mockery of a process that otherwise should have gone much more smoothly. It certainly has cost a very good man his reputation and it has put he and his family through hell. And she is clearly getting exposed now. The two front doors nonsense. The fear of flying nonsense. At the very least, to the extent we've learned anything else since last Thursday, it's that Kavanaugh's testimony, as supported by his behavior and actions throughout his career, appears to be more credible than her testimony.

Do you honestly believe that she would serve jail time if her story fell short? This appears to be a situation where certain people knew going in that it was going to come down to "he said" / "she said." Her attorneys coached her through her response stream. Where's the risk in that for your premise? She'll probably end up with a book deal out of all this. Kavanaugh will end up on the court. And they'll both probably have to live rather uncomfortable existences for a while.

[bigdiggins]

Wages have increased this entire time. They just haven’t increased higher than inflation. In other news, the sky is still blue. A .6% spot over inflation isn’t going to move the needle much but it’s something.


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Interesting article on the wage increases being less than some folks feel they should be.

https://www.bloomberg.com/view/artic...r?srnd=premium

[bjf123]

Assuming he is confirmed, and it looks like that will be the case, the top Democrat on the House Judicial Committee has already said they’ll be looking to impeach Kavanaugh when they take control of the House in November. He’ll stay on the bench because you’ll never get 67 Senators to vote to remove him. So, we’ll have to sit through that circus for a few weeks. Yippee.


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