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It could be full to capacity on every single run and lose a bunch of money, right? I know you don't like the word "loss", but the point is that we aren't in the black on this thing for a long, long time ... if ever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kahns Krazy
How do we know when this has been the right decision? What are the metrics, and what is the timeline?
Many would same the same for you as well. The door swings both ways. You were wrong about UC in that argument and time will prove you wrong here as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kahns Krazy
Just so you know, I hope the streetcar is a huge success and that the fairytales you all believe come true but those that understand Cincinnati and those that live and work here know it will be a huge money loser and will not deliever on the promises many have stated.
Ouch!!Quote:
Originally Posted by xeus
I don't think so. I believe at capacity, the fares would more than offset the operating costs. I can check on that for you.Quote:
Originally Posted by xeus
Edit: Here's some numbers for you:
The capacity of the streetcar is 130 passengers. Running every 15 minutes on average (every 10 minutes peak, every 20 off peak, 2 directions) according to the feasibility study, would result in fares exceeding operating costs by approximately $2 million per year. I guess you would refer to that as "profit". That even assumes that each person gets on at one end of the line and gets off at the other. Real life capacity would be greater than this, because the same seat can be sold more than once on each trip.
Based on some of the numbers in the feasibility study, the theoretical capacity of the existing line in a given year is about 15 million riders. I'm not sure what that would do to the operating costs, but it would likely generate excess fare revenue in the neighborhood of $10m a year.
I would say we are in the black if (a) the area around the streetcar increases in value, generating incremental property taxes, (b) the population increases in the area, generating income taxes, and (c) commerce increases in the area, generating jobs and sales taxes. You would take that impact over the life of the streetcar line - say 30 years, and discount the incremental cash flows (including the operating costs) back to the present day. You'd compare that to your initial investment.
When you consider all of that, you would also consider the trends that existed before implementation. That is, if the area was losing 1,000 residents per year and starts adding 1,000 residents per year, the net impact is 2,000 residents gained.
To borrow your line, the only thing that swings both ways here is you. Wait, maybe that's not exactly how you put it. Anyway, my argument was that UC was a lock for the NCAA tournament. UC, in fact, went to the NCAA tournament. You were wrong, and there is proof.Quote:
Originally Posted by _LH
Time proved me right that time, and time will prove me right again.
Not directly related to OTR, but seems like an appropriate quote from Will Leitch of Deadspin fame (http://deadspin.com/5486157/):
yeah, there really is potential for a lot more development in downtown and OTR. It's a lovely setting.Quote:
The sleeping city desperate for a revival.
Cincinnati and St. Louis are more similar cities than is often noted. A baseball tradition unrivalled by any city other than New York or Boston. An urban sensibility that's both more cosmopolitan and more backwoods that anyone on either side of the extreme is willing to admit. A downtown area that's far lovelier than people realize and vastly underutilized. The impossibility of grabbing a bit to eat past 9:30 p.m. without having to find a casino. A simmering history of racial divisiveness. The color red. The difference is that, baseball-wise, Cincinnati has been dormant as St. Louis has been ascendant; the Reds are long, long overdue. I've spent many, many evenings in Cincinnati, and that town is rabid to care about its Reds again. If they get hot and are close in September, that place will froth into a frenzy. It will carry them.
You may have a point there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kahns Krazy
You were wrong then and wrong now. UC was not a lock at the time you claimed they were. Locks can lose out and make it. UC was not in that position. I also believe UC didn't make it in at all that year. Andy Kennedy's year. You lose.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kahns Krazy
I wish LH was a UC fan.
I wish you would leave the board.Quote:
Originally Posted by GoMuskies
How am I wrong all the way around? Are you denying that you rapidly post and insult people who you disagree with? There is plenty of proof in this thread alone.Quote:
Originally Posted by _LH
I have not "missed" any points that 87 and the rest have made. They are all reasonable points.
I still think you are not a serious individual. There's no way. This is your entertainment when you get bored
Go back and read what you wrote. You are wrong all the way around. Sorry. Sweet 16 did the insulting, not me. I am simply replying to a number of posts directed at me, not "rapid" posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyTwoTimes37
Most of what I have said against the streetcar has been the same thing 87 said but nice try.
I agree. I also cannot imagine that he is being serious. If he is, then, wow.Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyTwoTimes37
I saw LH on Fountain Square last night after the Red's game. He drove down from the 'burbs where he shares a house with his older sister. He, as you would expect, arrived alone and spent the bulk of the evening by himself. However, it's interesting to note that eventhough he didn't know a single soul he did manage to get himself engaged in several arguments throughout the evening. He was overheard yelling "you're wrong" at a 12 year old girl who insisted the Red's had clinched last night. He went nose-to-nose with a 68 year old grandmother saying "nice try" when she disagreed with his argument that it was really Joey Votto in Bruce's uniform who hit the walk off HR. He was overheard talking to himself that he really wished he had a condo near Gateway with some form of conveyance to Fountain Square because he had no idea so much was going on downtown these days.
Again, I said pretty much the same thing 87 and other detractors said but nice try.Quote:
Originally Posted by boozehound
This thread is getting very interesting, to say the least.
OVER THE LINE! One day ban.Quote:
Originally Posted by _LH
If you have to resort to base personal attacks, do not post in the first place. If you cannot handle off-season Out on the Mall arguments, remain quiet.
That goes for everyone. This is a family board.
I was thinking the opposite, like time to lock the thread.Quote:
Originally Posted by boozehound
To be honest, this thread was civil and very informative until LH hijacked it. Great points were made by both sides. Looking at LH's past comments, he's done the exact same thing in other threads. It's bizarre, to say the least.Quote:
Originally Posted by American X
Is it a coincidence that the last thread LH posted in was locked up as well for the exact same reasons?Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbiemcgee
Really I think Sweet 16 hijacked the thread and if you look at the thread LH's opinion and posts were pretty similar to XU87's.
I don't know that it is his opinions per se, as much as the way that he chooses to voice them that is the problem.
Not according to Jimmy.Quote:
Originally Posted by boozehound
Some people like downtown Cincinnati..
http://cmsimg.cincinnati.com/apps/pb...W=485&Border=0
Cincinnati Reds outfielders Jonny Gomes and Jay Bruce celebrates at Mynt Martini Bar in downtown Cincinnati after clinching of the NL Central pennant the morning of Wednesday September 29, 2010.
It's not a matter of him voicing his opinion. But the fact that he gave no facts to support his opinion, rapidly posted, said everyone was lying/wrong while offering no evidence, and insulted others.Quote:
Originally Posted by George Remus
LH?!?Quote:
Originally Posted by George Remus
I think we have a duplicate user name for LH - Good call!Quote:
Originally Posted by Snipe
The IP Address will be the determining factor
I thought that too. It says he joined in October 2008, which is a while ago, but maybe it is an alter ego for LH when he is banned.Quote:
Originally Posted by Snipe
He hasn't started calling people liars and gays yet though, so maybe it isn't him.
If you take the time to look, he posted as many facts as you did and agreed with those that presented facts and numbers. As far as rapidly posting, how many posts do you have in this thread, Jim?Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyTwoTimes37
This thread is quickly turning into a Japanese Nic Cage commercial
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0i4vRcLGcg
Bizarre and unexplainable
hilarious. you just can't let it go.Quote:
Originally Posted by George Remus
Jimmy2times can't seem to let it go, nor Sweet 16.Quote:
Originally Posted by Snipe
Are we going to witness something today that quite possibly has never happened before and may never happen again........same person using two different screen names gets both names banned simultaneously.
Hahaha. That would be quite the feat. I think Guy would even appreciate that kind of accomplishment. The IP confirmation is a must though if we want to document this in the history books legitimately (assuming George gets banned too)Quote:
Originally Posted by sweet16
See.
It's possible but not likely that LH and George are one in the same. George was a Musketeer Madness regular poster, and I don't ever recall LH being banned by the brass over there at any point.
But I did see Superman earlier today but not Clark Kent. Just saying....
Well that was fun. If someone wants to start another thread about the streetcar and downtown issues be my guest.