Politics Thread

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08-22-2020, 02:05 PM
Juice

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulxu

You make a good point, but that's the age old argument: a president takes credit for the good things (I created the best....etc.) then he gets credit for the bad things. Especially the ones he is directly responsible for, and there are a lot on that list.

I'm inclined to go with these 70 former Republicans who served in a variety of capacities in National Security on which way to go this year:

https://www.defendingdemocracytogeth...onal-security/

They list 10 reasons that they think we should consider, and why those reasons compel them to support Biden. This is not the media over-stating anything.
The downside is, as one Republican noted, by doing this they help the country remove a danger to itself...but may write them out of a needed conversation on remaking the Republican party after Trump has gone.

Those are the same people that led this country into endless wars in the Middle East and are pissed off that they have no influence in this country anymore. It's actually a positive (for Trump) those losers are endorsing Biden. They are funded by Democrats and led by Bill Kristol.

They are the same as Kasich and other Never Trump Republicans. They lost influence because their policies failed or turned out not to be Republicans in the first place.
08-22-2020, 02:28 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulxu

You make a good point, but that's the age old argument: a president takes credit for the good things (I created the best....etc.) then he gets credit for the bad things. Especially the ones he is directly responsible for, and there are a lot on that list.

I'm inclined to go with these 70 former Republicans who served in a variety of capacities in National Security on which way to go this year:

https://www.defendingdemocracytogeth...onal-security/

They list 10 reasons that they think we should consider, and why those reasons compel them to support Biden. This is not the media over-stating anything.
The downside is, as one Republican noted, by doing this they help the country remove a danger to itself...but may write them out of a needed conversation on remaking the Republican party after Trump has gone.

Lol a bunch of former beaurecrats who no longer have any power are made at trump for hurting their feelings.
08-22-2020, 02:30 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulxu

Pick out a couple for me that are "downright lies." I'm curious.

The beginning, the middle and the end.
08-22-2020, 02:56 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by X-man

Actually the protesters, including Black Lives Matter protesters, have denounced the looters and the violent. As much as Trump and the right would like you to believe that they are one and the same, they are not. And there are not, as someone once said, "fine people on both sides".

You live in a wonderful fantasyland. It's a shame the rest of us live in reality.
08-22-2020, 03:00 PM
X Factor

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

You live in a wonderful fantasyland. It's a shame the rest of us live in reality.

No kidding. BLM protesters are the ones rioting and looting. They're the ones marching through residential neighborhoods yelling obscene chants at night trying to disturb the peace. Where are the denouncements from BLM and the Democrats?

Trump DID denounce and condemn Neo-Nazis and White supremacists in Charlottesville. To say otherwise is a lie and a hoax.
08-22-2020, 03:03 PM
Xville

Quote:

Originally Posted by XU_Lou

He simply regurgitates whatever the mainstream media spews - which of course we all know, they always tell the truth....

Hey Xville - be careful - sounds like Tuesday in the Ville is going to be crazy. All kinds of facts and rumors of many groups coming to town to create total mayhem. I've been following this group to keep abreast of what's happening: https://www.facebook.com/groups/2027964934099596/

When you got a wimp for a mayor, and a wimp for a governor....this is the kind of crap that happens. Fischer only cares about his career aspirations so he doesnt want to upset his voting block, and beshear is only tough when it comes to preaching on coronavirus. Both dems, shocking I know....next to us, is indiana a state run by republicans that has surpassed ky in every way, and with a major city (indianapolis) that while under republican control saw extreme growth and prosperity. Sadly now it is run by dems so it will probably turn into Detroit soon enough.
08-22-2020, 03:05 PM
xudash

Quote:

Originally Posted by boozehound

Honestly if your initial response had been an admission that your comments were in bad form I would have been good with that and just moved on. Many pages of doubling down (some from yourself most from others) ensued along with a nearly surgical attempt to explain it.

I never asked for evidence that she 'slept her way to the top' nor did I really latch on to the 'whore' part of that comment at all. I still don't really get the explanation about 'faking her race' but that doesn't really matter. I think you are conflating my position with X-man.

You keep asking me to explain liberalism as though I'm a liberal, which I'm not. I'm probably closer to a moderate / conservative who thinks that Trump is pretty much never the lesser of two evils. There actually seem to be quite a few of those. I also don't (Trump not withstanding) buy into the whole 'hate the other parties candidates' thing. I have voted for Obama, George W Bush, and Mitt Romney for example. I think they are all good people who were / are doing what they think is best for the country, even if I don't agree with all of their positions on individual issues.

For fun: Here is where I come down on your conservative values:

1. Making the U.S. economy the priority, including trade agreements that do not harm American interests. - I agree with you here. Taking on China is one (maybe the only) thing that I think Trump has generally done well on. I think many Presidents (both Democrat and Republican) sacrificed the long term health of the American economy and worker for short term gains and cheap goods from overseas along with Chinese investment in America.

2. Maintaining serious pressure on China, which I believe to be a dangerous, 21st Century problem; communist regimes do not play nice or fair. - See above. I agree 100%. Let's include Russia in that one too.

3. Legal immigration. Period. Fix a mess that has been kicked down the road for decades. - We probably differ on what this means, but I support border control and legal immigration. I think we should tailor our immigration policy so that we attract people with the skills we need for our economy, whether it's software engineering or picking fruit.

4. Strong national defense. - We probably differ on the degree of this. I'm all in favor of strong national defense, but I do think we spend too much of a portion of our GDP on defense spending while we are racking up a national debt that we can probably never repay.

5. Law and order. - We probably differ on the degree of this as well

Edit: I genuinely appreciate the fact that you posted a thought out response, so I felt it appropriate to respond in kind. Hopefully you take it in the spirit in which it's intended.

First and foremost, I am all for constructive debate and discussion. Moving forward, I hope we can all find a way to get back to a place here where that takes place. And I appreciate most of your response.

Secondly, XU82 was spot on with his post: politics can bring out the worst in people. I noted that I was in bad form with my use of the term “whore“, but I also made it very clear that I went down that road on purpose. Harris, and Biden, IMHO, are fake, shallow empty suites and careerists. Additionally, you were over-baked in your reaction to the race thing. Jamaican father and Indian mother, on the surface, doesn’t directly equate to being an African American, which most people see as a “requirement” for being “Black”. Being the shallow, immoral opportunist that she is, and the fact that she is a California liberal, I assumed she is attempting to play the race card to her advantage. So, we now know she has “lineage” through her island father and she considers herself to be Black.

Thirdly, again going back to XU82’s point, you need to remember that this thread brought out the worst in you, too. You called me “a piece of shit”.

Fourthly, you need to understand that, while I responded to your post, I wasn’t just responding to you. I don’t necessarily feel an obligation or need to explain anything to you, given your name calling. Importantly, I did not double down on anything. I simply expanded my response to provide additional context. It certainly became a long response. I’ll admit to that.

Now, what seems clear is that you are a “Never Trumper”, based on your comments. That’s OK; you’re certainly entitled to that. But referring to yourself as a moderate/conservative strikes me as odd, insofar as you admitted to voting for Obama. Whatever.

So, in an effort to end on a high note - continuing our discussion of the five points:

1. Total agreement (except your missing Trump’s other trade deals, IMO).

2. Total agreement.

3. Absolutely total agreement: bring in talent, earn your citizenship, and contribute to society.

4. I am not sure that we do disagree on this.

5. I am not sure how we could disagree on this, but, like most decent people, I certainly want the corruption taken out of police departments. This, in part, is a union issue, IMO.

Have a good weekend.
08-22-2020, 03:07 PM
bobbiemcgee

trump's conspiracy theories:

.Cruz's father involved in JFK's assassination .Birtherism (still believes it) . Vince Foster was murdered by Hillary . Scalia was murdered ("they found a pillow over his head" debunked) .Vaccines cause autism .NJ muslims cheered 9/11 . climate change hoax . Access Hollywood tape ("don't think it's my voice")
. Joe Scarborough killed his intern (from 1200 miles away) . Obama wiretapped him . 3000 people in PR didn't die ("only 16 to 18" when he was there throwing paper towels) . Ukraine has Hillary's emails and my favorite. Windmills cause cancer.

Vote away, 'pubs.
08-22-2020, 03:47 PM
paulxu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xville

Lol a bunch of former beaurecrats who no longer have any power are made at trump for hurting their feelings.

You think it's only "former" bureaucrats who think those 10 things?

https://youtu.be/P43wDpKQxaM
08-22-2020, 04:52 PM
X Factor

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulxu

You think it's only "former" bureaucrats who think those 10 things?

Harris, Sanders, Booker, ect. were all bashing Biden during the primaries. Both sides do it during the primaries.

Keep voting for the part that disregards life, does not care about law and order or free speech. The party that cares more about people who are in this country illegally. The party that divides by making everything about race, gender, or other identities. The party that does not support our biggest Middle East ally.

Vote for Biden though, a guy who has plagiarized multiple times during his political career, will not protect the innocent unborn, will not protect your freedom of speech or worship, was responsible for a crime bill that sent thousands of black people to jail, was against forced busing and integration, an on and on and on. 50 years in political office and he hasn't accomplished anything, but you think he's NOW going to solve our countries problems.