Random Anti-Matta Thought of the Day

[GuyFawkes38]

Is it just me, or was Thad Matta an average recruiter at X. A large chunk of the guys Matta recruited simply didn't work out.

There are some notable exceptions to the list below. Brandon Cole had an awful injury which hampered his career. Justin Cage was a great pick up. Duncan and Thornton were awesome. And I guess Stan.

But Miller is a much better recruiter than Thad was at X. And this explains why X struggled in 2005 and 2006. You can blame it on Thad.


2002 recruits:
Brandon Cole
Dedrick Finn
Randy Holbrook
Angelo Smith

2003 recruits:
Robert Barker
Justin Cage
Boubacar Coly
Justin Doellman

2004 Recruits:
Dupree Lucas
Brian Thornton
Stanley Burrell
Josh Duncan

[Cheesehead]

It's been 4 years. Let it go. Who Cares? Seriously, let it go.

[GuyFawkes38]

It's been 4 years. Let it go. Who Cares? Seriously, let it go.

come on now. Ha!!! Is there a "no mentioning the name Matta" policy on this board. I don't hate Matta or anything. Quite the opposite. He was an incredible game coach.

This is just a random thought which came up from a conversation with a friend who asked me if Miller struggled coaching in 2005 and 2006.

I don't think he struggled. He simply didn't have the players. A lot of Matta's recruits didn't come through in the ways Miller's have.

[Mark 3 Pointer]

Is it just me, or was Thad Matta an average recruiter at X. A large chunk of the guys Matta recruited simply didn't work out.

There are some notable exceptions to the list below. Brandon Cole had an awful injury which hampered his career. Justin Cage was a great pick up. Duncan and Thornton were awesome. And I guess Stan.

But Miller is a much better recruiter than Thad was at X. And this explains why X struggled in 2005 and 2006. You can blame it on Thad.


2002 recruits:
Brandon Cole
Dedrick Finn
Randy Holbrook
Angelo Smith

2003 recruits:
Robert Barker
Justin Cage
Boubacar Coly
Justin Doellman

2004 Recruits:
Dupree Lucas
Brian Thornton
Stanley Burrell
Josh Duncan

Cole
Finn
Cage
Doellman
Thornton
Duncan
Burrell

All seemed to be pretty decent contributors to me. 7 of12 ain't bad! I hate Matta but he did a good job while he was here.

[GuyFawkes38]

Cole
Finn
Cage
Doellman
Thornton
Duncan
Burrell

All seemed to be pretty decent contributors to me. 7 of12 ain't bad! I hate Matta but he did a good job while he was here.

I wouldn't include Finn on the list. Duncan and Cage were great. But Burrell and Doellman strike me as more like role players (very, very good role players). And Cole and Thornton battled injury issues (of course, that wasn't Matta's fault).

Maybe I'm being too hard on Matta since Miller has assembled an incredible unit of kids.

That being said, its hard not to recognize a slight dip in the talent level between Prosser and Miller. Along with injuries, I think that explains the struggles in 2005 and 2006.

[Tardy Turtle]

So if Matta and Anti-Matta collided, would the universe collapse upon itself?

[Cheesehead]

(Doellman) being a 4-year start is not a role player, Guy. Please look at his stats:

17th place in Scoring
16 th place in rebounds
3rd in Blocks
132 Career Games
also had 282 career Assists

Definitely NOT a role player.

[Smails]

I think 5 of those guys scored 1000 points if you count Thornton's time at Vandy. Sorry Guy, Thad could recruit.....he still can.

Doellman a role player? Please tell me you're joking. He's probably the best all-around player since DWest.

[DC Muskie]

Hey Knobber.

He averaged 26 wins a season, went to our first Elite Eight and coached a National Player of the Year.

Yeah, Matta couldn't get it done.

What's next from your random mind? Top Jimmy just couldn't land the trillion dollar gift?

[GoMuskies]

Who knows what Barker and Coly might have been capable of? Neither really got a chance due to injury.

[BBC 08]

So if Matta and Anti-Matta collided, would the universe collapse upon itself?

Wanted to rep you for this but couldn't.

[GuyFawkes38]

Everyone's ignoring 2004-2006. Why did we struggle those 2 years? Yes, injuries played a role.

Ultimately, I think you can point to a talent gap in recruiting between Prosser/Miller and Matta.

Doellman and Cage were solid. But not in the same league as West, Sato and Brown (or Crawford in the future).

[DC Muskie]

Everyone's ignoring 2004-2006. Why did we struggle those 2 years? Yes, injuries played a role.

Ultimately, I think you can point to a talent gap in recruiting between Prosser/Miller and Matta.

Doellman and Cage were solid. But not in the same league as West, Sato and Brown (or Crawford in the future).

You know what's funny about this...Matta has said everything he learned about recruiting he learned from Miller. Who actually sat right next to him.

You remember in 2006 we won the A-10 title for the second time in four games in four days. Man we struggled to win.

Seriously, what's the point of this randomness? Nothing, other then to get people to respond to you. Well done.

[GuyFawkes38]

You know what's funny about this...Matta has said everything he learned about recruiting he learned from Miller. Who actually sat right next to him.

You remember in 2006 we won the A-10 title for the second time in four games in four days. Man we struggled to win.

Seriously, what's the point of this randomness? Nothing, other then to get people to respond to you. Well done.

All I have to say is knobber.

[DC Muskie]

All I have to say is knobber.

That's about right.

[MADXSTER]

So if Matta and Anti-Matta collided, would the universe collapse upon itself?

The answer is no. But it would enlarge his schnoz.

[xuwin]

Hey Knobber.

He averaged 26 wins a season, went to our first Elite Eight and coached a National Player of the Year.

Yeah, Matta couldn't get it done.

What's next from your random mind? Top Jimmy just couldn't land the trillion dollar gift?

Matta inherited West, Sato and Chalmers. He didn't leave Sean in anywhere close to the same shape. I think a lot of coaches could have averaged 26 wins a season with the talent that Skip left him.

[DC Muskie]

Matta inherited West, Sato and Chalmers. He didn't leave Sean in anywhere close to the same shape. I think a lot of coaches could have averaged 26 wins a season with the talent that Skip left him.

Well we should have hired you then and saved the school a ton of money.

He coached all of those players the same amount or even more then the guy who recruited them. He then left Sean a few players that were the foundation for a 30 win season.

Seriously, that's the best you got? Any coach in the country could have won 26 games? Why didn't Skip then?

I mean really. Does Sean get credit for the 30 wins, or do we say it was because Thad left him players?

This is one of the things I can't stand about Xavier fans. Still bitch and make up stuff about Matta. We had one bad season where we won 17 games with a first time head coach and 20 years from now people will act like Thad left Sean X-Band, Glow, Nuts and ATL.

[Snipe]

We need a new forum called "The Tool Shed". And Guy needs to have his posting rights restricted to that forum. Keep the tool in the shed.

[xuwin]

Well we should have hired you then and saved the school a ton of money.

He coached all of those players the same amount or even more then the guy who recruited them. He then left Sean a few players that were the foundation for a 30 win season.

Seriously, that's the best you got? Any coach in the country could have won 26 games? Why didn't Skip then?

I mean really. Does Sean get credit for the 30 wins, or do we say it was because Thad left him players?

This is one of the things I can't stand about Xavier fans. Still bitch and make up stuff about Matta. We had one bad season where we won 17 games with a first time head coach and 20 years from now people will act like Thad left Sean X-Band, Glow, Nuts and ATL.

Show me where I said any coach in the country could have done it.

[DC Muskie]

Show me where I said any coach in the country could have done it.

Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to misrepresent the point you were trying to make. So are you saying there is list of coaches that could have won 26 games a season? Who's on this list? Travis Ford? Ron Jirsa?

Again, I apologize for the generalization of Thad's suckiness.

[Masterofreality]

Look, I'm over Beaknose, although I'll never stop calling him that. Thank Gawd he left before Sean went somewhere else. I won't cheer for O-ho-ho State though, for a lot of reasons, almost all of them that have nothing to do with who their basketball coach is. I've never been to the horseshoe for a football game and the only time I've been in their basketball arenas was for High School Tournament games.

Up here the Cuyahoga Socialist State, because there is no major University, (Cleveland State really doesn't count) people act like O-ho-ho State is their local university and that somehow the entire campus was relocated from Columbus. Oh-ho-ho State doesn't even have an extension campus up here but to hear talk, there's no other school in the entire state. You guys downstate are somewhat insulated from it because you have uc myopians to deal with. I have to hear crap about the greatness of every Luck-eye player coach and water boy in every sport every single day and it drives me up a wall.

The latest spin that is being perpertrated is that the David Lighty injury has decimated the Oh-ho-ho State basketball program this year. What?

My answer? I just say that when you tell me that your entire basketball program is "decimated" by the loss of a guy who averaged 9.7 points, shoots 26% from three land in a perimeter oriented offense and only shoots 54% from the free throw line despite being a "slasher" , your recruiting depth sucks. Then I add, maybe an emphasis on building a program with basketball players rather than 1 and done AAU phenoms might serve THE University better. They might mumble something that sounds like "Diebler" or "Keebler" and I can't tell if they're talking about crackers or basketball players.

After that, the silence is deafening.

[Masterofreality]

Oh, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to misrepresent the point you were trying to make. So are you saying there is list of coaches that could have won 26 games a season? Who's on this list? Travis Ford? Ron Jirsa?


Ron Everhart.

[GuyFawkes38]

I honestly have no idea why posters are so alarmed and shocked by this thread.

Discussing the talent level between Prosser's, Matta's and Miller's recruits seems relevant on a Xavier basketball board.

Some people live to be outraged.

[DC Muskie]

I don't think Bob Staak left enough water bottles for Pete.

Discuss...

[Swifty]

He left plenty of talent. The Justins were the heart and soul of a few teams. Thorton was very good, but he was injured all the time, not Matta's fault. Finn went all psycho, I think most people thought he would fill in well based on his replacing a future NBA pick (Young) in the starting lineup as a freshmen and with his spectacular play off the bench during the run. Burrell was also a great pickup, considering his rankings with the recruiters.

[dc_x]

I honestly have no idea why posters are so alarmed and shocked by this thread.

Discussing the talent level between Prosser's, Matta's and Miller's recruits seems relevant on a Xavier basketball board.

Some people live to be outraged.

How do you distinguish between "Matta's" and "Miller's" recruits? Miller was the associate head coach under Matta and probably had the same, if not more influence, in the recruiting of "Matta's" recruits as Thad did.

If you want to compare Skip's recruits to Matta/Miller's, then go ahead...that makes more sense.

[xu15]

I think the Matta stuff that gets brought up is just dumb. Without him leaving, Miller would not be our head coach. In hindsight, I'm pumped he left. Fact is we have one of the best coaches in the nation whom I wouldnt trade for anyone. This is a non issue.

[GuyFawkes38]

I think the Matta stuff that gets brought up is just dumb. Without him leaving, Miller would not be our head coach. In hindsight, I'm pumped he left. Fact is we have one of the best coaches in the nation whom I wouldnt trade for anyone. This is a non issue.

That's really kind of my point this thread (I do think I was off when I called Matta's recruits merely "average").

Looking back it now, it seems clear to me that Miller is attracting better players than Matta did.

[Juice]

That's really kind of my point this thread (I do think I was off when I called Matta's recruits merely "average").

Looking back it now, it seems clear to me that Miller is attracting better players than Matta did.

And the ones he is now recruiting are talented but they are all leaving after a year and he can't develop a consistent program.

[GuyFawkes38]

And the ones he is now recruiting are talented but they are all leaving after a year and he can't develop a consistent program.

True. I wonder if he'll change his approach.