Duke BB Losing Luster?

[waggy]

It's the first time I've seen Duke's recent slide put in print. Too bad their one FF trip in recent years was at the expense of the Muskies. They are still a great program.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/19303-Fans-Bedeviled-Is-Duke-Basketball-Losing-Its-Luster--230408

[Xman95]

They definitely aren't what they were in the days of G.Hill, Laettner, Hurley, Parks, etc. But they still have a very good program and, with one or two key recruits, they'll be back in title contention and will be back on the map with the best of the best. Even the best programs have down years. UCLA went through its dry spell, UNC had the Doherty years, UK isn't the Kentucky many remember, etc. Duke is in the same boat.

The difference is that Duke's past isn't quite as storied as those others and, if some key players aren't brought in soon to turn things around, it's possible the slide will be harder to recover from and will last longer than what a program like UNC would have to endure.

It's similar (but not the same, I know) as the Yankees making a bad move vs. a team like the Royals making a bad move. It's easier for the Yanks to recover because of the organization/resources, while the Royals might take several more years to rebound from the same bad move. Duke, as an organization/program, isn't the same as UNC, UCLA, etc. and might not be able to right the ship as easily.

If it doesn't make sense...hey, I'm freakin' tired!

[Miller'sTale]

I think the issue for Duke is not so much in Coach K losing his ability to coach, or in Duke losing its luster as a program as much as it speaks to the changing world of D1 basketball, and I fear a similar effect might hit our Muskies down the road.

For years, Coach K relied on coaching kids into great players. He always had his McD's all americans but he took good talent and coached it into great talent with a team mentality. The Duke teams of the mid 90's sent players to the NBA, but their worth as a program was based more upon the accomplishments of the team than on draft picks. As the game has changed, and 1 and done becomes the norm, Duke will continue to slide unless Coach K changes his approach. The point - kids with talent just aren't hanging aroudn like the used to.

The NBA rule requiring one year of college experience is severely hurting schools like Duke and I fear it will impact us in the future as well. Duke had a reputation for building program-type teams, not striking gold every few years with a dominant recruiting class.

[Juice]

I think part of Duke's problem is that they are no longer recruiting great athletes. They are recruiting good, smart players like Scheyer, Paulus, Singler, etc. but once they play a team that has athletes better than theirs they get beat. They all can shoot well but none of them can guard anyone one on one nor can they take anyone to the hole. They rely heavily on the outside shot. The only guy that could beat someone off the dribble was Nelson.
They no longer recruit guys like Grant Hill, Elton Brand, Jason Williams, and Corey Maggette and it shows against teams like UNC and Pitt.

[Xman95]

Just wondering, is it possible the Duke lacrosse scandal hurt its b-ball recruiting? It seems ridiculous at first, but maybe it now has a reputation as a school for a bunch of rich, racist, white boys. It sure seems the b-ball team is less colorful than it used to be.

By no means am I saying that only black kids can ball. But, if the majority of the top black H.S. players automatically cross you off their list, you need to get the majority of 5-star white kids and/or the minorities willing to consider your school. And, with so many others seeking the services of these young men, you're not going to get all of those kids.

I don't know if this really is the case, just throwing it out there as a possibility and to get the thoughts of others.

(FYI - this isn't intended to be a black vs. white thing or the tip of a racial iceburg. It's just wondering whether an incident at Duke, despite the LAX kids being cleared, has hurt its recruiting, primarily with minorities.)

[D-West & PO-Z]

I think the issue for Duke is not so much in Coach K losing his ability to coach, or in Duke losing its luster as a program as much as it speaks to the changing world of D1 basketball, and I fear a similar effect might hit our Muskies down the road.

For years, Coach K relied on coaching kids into great players. He always had his McD's all americans but he took good talent and coached it into great talent with a team mentality. The Duke teams of the mid 90's sent players to the NBA, but their worth as a program was based more upon the accomplishments of the team than on draft picks. As the game has changed, and 1 and done becomes the norm, Duke will continue to slide unless Coach K changes his approach. The point - kids with talent just aren't hanging aroudn like the used to.

The NBA rule requiring one year of college experience is severely hurting schools like Duke and I fear it will impact us in the future as well. Duke had a reputation for building program-type teams, not striking gold every few years with a dominant recruiting class.

I'm not really sure that your post makes any sense. It may make sense for Duke that they are getting one and done type players and it is hurting them, although most of their players arent one and done, but this doesnt make any sense for hurting the muskies. XU has never had a one and done player and doesnt look to have any in the future. I'm not sure how this can hurt Xavier.

On the one hand it sounds like you are saying that Coach K recruits kids that he makes very good basketball players and maybe this is hurting him since other teams are recruiting kids who are good right away and then leaving after a year. That scenario would actually help Duke once those kids were upper classmen. Then you say kids just arent hanging around like they used to like that affects Duke when you said before those arent the kids Duke is getting.

Basically I am really confused on what you are trying to say here. Is Duke recruiting one and done kids and that is hurting them? Are they not recruiting one and done kids and that is hurting them? It seems like you said both in the above post.

[Snipe]

Next year we will pass Duke as a program.

[991 Dana]

Next year we will pass Duke as a program.

...not before Dayton does

[Miller'sTale]

Sorry - I see the confusion - it makes sense in my head I promise...

All I'm saying is that with all the one-and-done stuff going on, Duke's ability to retain players until they are juniors/seniors is diminishing - they have to instead recruit the players that only plan to stay one year, which is something I dont' get the impression Coach K is really excited about doing. Likewise, I don't think Miller/Xavier wants to recruit one and done players - we like the idea of our kids graduating and developing into great players. Does that help?

[waggy]

Luol Deng was a one and done player that would have made them a lot better if he would have stayed 4 years. Besides the refs he was probably the biggest difference-maker for Duke that day.

[Stonebreaker]

Nobody fears Duke anymore.....that's the biggest change in the last coupla years.