Game Thread: Xavier v Cincinnati (12/14/2024)

[paulxu]

https://i5.walmartimages.com/asr/2a1f45a0-e1cc-4202-89d7-1b7b5c27f309_1.3c18d8e111cdcd7e8a271effb6000907.jp eg?odnHeight=612&odnWidth=612&odnBg=FFFFFFVS.https://img.freepik.com/premium-vector/cute-little-bearcat-cartoon-laughing_188253-3444.jpg?w=360

CINCINNATI --- The Xavier University Musketeers, 8-2, visit the No. 22/23 University of Cincinnati Bearcats, 7-1, on Saturday at 2 p.m. for the annual Skyline Chili Crosstown Shootout. Xavier is shooting for its sixth-straight win in the series and its 10th win in 12 meetings.

Xavier's game vs. UC begins a stretch of three-straight games vs. ranked opponents. XU's next three games are at No. 22 Cincinnati, XU's BIG EAST opener at No. 18 and two-time defending National Champion UConn on Dec. 18, and No. 6 Marquette in XU's BIG EAST home opener on Dec. 21.

THE MATCHUP

XAVIER UNIVERSITY MUSKETEERS (8-2, 0-0 BIG EAST)
UNIVERSITY OF CINCINNATI BEARCATS (7-1, 0-0 BIG 12)
SATURDAY, DECEMBER 14, 2024 AT 2:00 P.M. ET
AT FIFTH THIRD ARENA IN CINCINNATI, OHIO

TV, RADIO AND LIVE STATS

TV/Stream: ESPN+ with play-by-play from John Schriffen and analysis from Sean Farnham.
Xavier Radio: 55KRC with play-by-play from Xavier Hall of Famer Joe Sunderman ('79) and analysis from XU all-time leading scorer and Hall of Famer Byron Larkin ('88). XU broadcast is also available on the Varsity Network and on Sirius XM.

Live Stats: Media stats at Statbroadcast.com (http://Statbroadcast.com) and fan stats at GoXavier.com (http://GoXavier.com).

[paulxu]

Was going to use their mascot in the thread, but didn't want the site to get a demand letter.

[bleedXblue]

Was going to use their mascot in the thread, but didn't want the site to get a demand letter.

HA!

[94GRAD]

Was going to use their mascot in the thread, but didn't want the site to get a demand letter.

Public reps since the man is keeping me down!

[Xavier]

It’s the crosstown. It’s big. But beyond that, it’s an enormous opportunity to get a win that will help come March. I think UC did themselves no favors with the schedule. The committee has shown to look through that. They will only make the tournament based on Big12 play, so a win over X will do wonders for them as well.

Both teams need the win. I’d feel confident if it was at Cintas. It’s been 5 years, Wes and fanbase dying for this. I don’t feel good at all but it’s also just tough to really tell what this UC team is. Everytime I’ve watched a little bit of them they just sort of shoot a bunch of 3s.

[drudy23]

Win please.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

It's not like we scheduled a bunch of top 50 opponents, we get off the block slow and so does UC. Both teams need the wins to carry into the conference season. After the TCU loss I said this was a must win. Fact is, it is a must win. If we don't, it will be catchup all through conference. I think it's a toss up gaime, I could it go any which way, blown out, blow them out, or win/lose in a close game.

[MHettel]

After we win, I think we should all chip in for new statue of Zach Fremantle to be placed outside of UCs arena.

We’ve won 6 in a row. Hell be 5-0 as a player, and 6-0 as a part of the team

[xu82]

Is this only on ESPN+ again? Screw them, I’m not being forced into another stream. Go X!

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Yes only on plus. I will thank my 5 year old twins for making me get Disney/Espn combo.

[Xville]

For betting purposes, hoping for a -8 or higher and a juicy money line :)

[bleedXblue]

For betting purposes, hoping for a -8 or higher and a juicy money line :)

Opening at 5 or so, and I see that going up. I think it will end around us getting 7 or 8

[A Fan]

This is the first time in memory that I lack confidence Xavier will beat UC on Saturday. Sean will undoubtedly pull out everything in his toolbox to get them to play to their full potential, but I just don’t think it will be enough to secure a win. Because of this expectation, I won’t be too disappointed if they lose. However, disappointment will set in if they lose by more than 15 points, as it would signal a troubling prediction—that they’ll struggle to be the sixth-best team in the Big East and likely miss the tournament. Am I being too pessimistic?

[94GRAD]

Opening at 5 or so, and I see that going up. I think it will end around us getting 7 or 8

If this happens, here's everyone's play. Take uc -5, wait for the line to 7/8 then take X +7/8. If X loses by 6/7, you hit both, otherwise you only lose the juice. Also, bet the X money line when it hits the 7/8 number.

[Xville]

This is the first time in memory that I lack confidence Xavier will beat UC on Saturday. Sean will undoubtedly pull out everything in his toolbox to get them to play to their full potential, but I just don’t think it will be enough to secure a win. Because of this expectation, I won’t be too disappointed if they lose. However, disappointment will set in if they lose by more than 15 points, as it would signal a troubling prediction—that they’ll struggle to be the sixth-best team in the Big East and likely miss the tournament. Am I being too pessimistic?

I want them to win 1 of the next three. It'd be nice if the win was UC, but I honestly don't care that much as long as there is one win. All three of these games, X is going to be a dog.

[Xville]

If this happens, here's everyone's play. Take uc -5, wait for the line to 7/8 then take X +7/8. If X loses by 6/7, you hit both, otherwise you only lose the juice. Also, bet the X money line when it hits the 7/8 number.

I'll be shocked if it opens as low as 5, if that occurs, I'm not touching unless the line significantly moves one way or the other.

Kenpom says 9 or 10 and usually its pretty close but with a rivlary they may tighten up the number. I'm assuming something like 6.5 or 7

[bleedXblue]

If this is a close game with 3-4 minutes left:

1. UC is not a strong FT shooting team. Advantage X
2. Who's making sure we get good shots on our last 4-5 possessions? Ball should be in the of hands of Zac and he should be looking pass first to open 3's as they will double him up for sure
3. PROTECT THE DAMN BALL

[drudy23]

Have to win 1 of the next 3, preferably 2.

If we lose all 3, I would bet we are nowhere to be found in the tournament projections, which will not make me happy at this point in the season.

[Xavier]

Win one and still on track.(IMO) Win 2 and we are looking pretty good. Win all 3 (extremely doubtful) and we are talking about how high we our seed could get.

The question is. If we win one, wouldn’t it be better to win one of the BE games? I anticipate both those teams would be better wins resume wise. UC is the easiest of the 3 though.

[webxu]

To be fair, I didnt think we would win last years shootout with that squad and they did, so anything can happen!

[drudy23]

Eventually UC is gonna win one I just hope it's a year where we're not desperate for a quality win.

We've yet to beat anyone, and that's not good.

[Three Point Pete]

If this is a close game with 3-4 minutes left:

1. UC is not a strong FT shooting team. Advantage X
2. Who's making sure we get good shots on our last 4-5 possessions? Ball should be in the of hands of Zac and he should be looking pass first to open 3's as they will double him up for sure
3. PROTECT THE DAMN BALL

What he said!
4. Avoid foul trouble

Sent from my SM-A326U using Tapatalk

[GoMuskies]

I see UC -8.

[xukeith]

What is the over /under on number of technical fouls called? 2?

[94GRAD]

https://x.com/SeanMillerPod/status/1867688861570412769

[Xville]

I see UC -8.

Grabbed it at 7.5, wish it was 8.5 but I’ll take it. Grabbed a little +240 for the hell of it too.

[X-band '01]

Eventually UC is gonna win one I just hope it's a year where we're not desperate for a quality win.

We've yet to beat anyone, and that's not good.

UC hasn't really beaten anyone either, and they got punched in the nose when they ran into a physical Villanova team.

Having an angry Viktor Lakhin on their team would have probably given them a more decisive edge this year. Too bad he ran off to Clemson. Aziz Bandiago is a decent post player for UC, but doesn't scream alpha dog in a game like this.

Heck, UC fans always talk about a Xavier player that will come out of nowhere for a career game. Maddox, perhaps?

[X-band '01]

I wouldn't stop laughing for a week if said player turns out to be John Hugley IV.

[xudash]

I wouldn't stop laughing for a week if said player turns out to be John Hugley IV.

Good one! That would be a riot, and certainly possibly divine intervention.

[MHettel]

Does anyone know how ESPN+ works?

I have it. That’s not an issue. But I may not be able watch due to the time.

I see they have on demand Replays, but I have no idea if everything that plays is also available later on demand. It doesn’t appear so, because there are so few available. And I have no idea how long they ARE available if they are at all.

Of course I can’t get a fucking answer on their website. You’d think k this would be a routine question…..

[xukeith]

Does anyone know how ESPN+ works?

I have it. That’s not an issue. But I may not be able watch due to the time.

I see they have on demand Replays, but I have no idea if everything that plays is also available later on demand. It doesn’t appear so, because there are so few available. And I have no idea how long they ARE available if they are at all.

Of course I can’t get a fucking answer on their website. You’d think k this would be a routine question…..

I am not sure either but I would pause the live stream at tip off, then go about my day and then return home later then un pause it.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

I have zero issue streaming on demand on the site. I have watched several games a day or two later most often are F1 races and Bundesliga.

[XU 23]

In my opinion, UC sucks

[bjf123]

I just tried clicking on the game, knowing it hasn’t started and got an error about not being available for purchase in my area (greater Cincinnati). WTF? I hope that’s just because it hasn’t started.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GoMuskies]

In my opinion, UC sucks


That's not an opinion. That's a fact.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Fuck UC. Let’s go X!

[XU_Lou]

I just tried clicking on the game, knowing it hasn’t started and got an error about not being available for purchase in my area (greater Cincinnati). WTF? I hope that’s just because it hasn’t started.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Likely. I couldn't pull up the TCU broadcast until after it started.

[noteggs]

Anyone having quality issues?

[KabeX]

Anyone else having issues with this awful feed?

[XUBison]

Anyone else having issues with this awful feed?

Yep.

[noteggs]

Commercials are coming in fine

[stammina0721]

Just want to say massive fail by both schools allowing this game to be on ESPN +. Screw them both

[XUBison]

Hunter… ugh. Reminds me of Darnell Williams after his injury— just not the same.

[KabeX]

Wow. That's a shot? Horrible.

[xukeith]

Clearly UC has better athletes. Imagine what a team does when they have tall post players who can catch lobs

[noteggs]

Bad war so far

[Blue Blooded-05]

I’d rather have Will Caudle than Hugley

[xukeith]

Miller prefers getting good guards over bigs. How is that working for X?

[xu82]

Just want to say massive fail by both schools allowing this game to be on ESPN +. Screw them both


It’s just one more thing that makes me care a little less.

[Xville]

X hasn’t played particularity well and they are in the game, I’ll take it

[KabeX]

This feed is so bad I might just turn it off (already listening to B & J)

[KabeX]

And .... BOOM

[noteggs]

Wow didn’t play great but I’ll take a 1 point lead at half

[Strange Brew]

Watching the play by play on the app it looks like the boys are up after shooting well, subpar.

Also it looks like the officiating is one sided. Probably why the game isn’t on TV. UC wants to steal the results! Stop the steal! :)

[Blue Blooded-05]

I have no idea how we’re winning at halftime but I’ll take it

[KsMuskie]

Where’s Conwell?

[A Fan]

We caught UC on a bad day. They are not good.

[KabeX]

Foster has gotten beat at least 5 times (some of which were alley oops) but he has to move his feet.

[Xville]

Our d is garbage today and uc still can’t score

[Strange Brew]

Let’s go X!

[Xville]

That 3 was huge!!!! Big time

[xukeith]

Freemantle in back to back plays: hustle long rebound, feed Hunter 2 fts. Then Zach deflects ball on defense and McKnight finds Conwell for 3.

Except Zach(just off bench), X is looking tired on defense

[Xville]

Please take hunter out of the game. He needs to sit

[Strange Brew]

It’s over.

[xukeith]

X blows a 7 point lead. ughh

[xukeith]

Maybe if X had Green, we would be up a couple.

[Xville]

ESPN plus is hot garbage

[KabeX]

Choke F'in City

[Xville]

Anticlutch as hell. This team doesn’t value the ball at all.

Horrible game to watch, and horrible shitty channel

[KabeX]

Better t up some 3s

[KabeX]

Better t up some 3s
Thank you Ryan.

[XU 23]

2nd game in a row we’ve blown a big half 2 lead.

[xu82]

I have the score up on a tab on my iPad. Thrilling.

[xukeith]

I guess 6 2nd half turnovers and not grabbing a rebound off UC missed free throw really hurt. I thought up 7 with 4 minutes to go I was feeling good.
Bad news X lost. X wasn't embarrased.

Good news: I made $20 on my first ever online gamble taking X and 7.5 points.

[Xville]

I guess 6 2nd half turnovers and not grabbing a rebound off UC missed free throw really hurt. I thought up 7 with 4 minutes to go I was feeling good.

Yeah honestly thought we had a really ugly win at that point. Then, we started not valuing the ball at all and basically grave the game away.

[GoMuskies]

UC still sucks! I couldn't watch the game, but I'm certain that's true.

[paulxu]

From the point we were up 7, almost all their points were layups and dunks.
We miss a good defensive presence in the middle. People will attack there all year.

Edit: yes, I believe they still suck.

[XU 23]

2nd game in a row we’ve blown a big half 2 lead.

2nd of 3

[XU 87]

Two unforced turnovers at the end were again a killer.

[xukeith]

From the point we were up 7, almost all their points were layups and dunks.
We miss a good defensive presence in the middle. People will attack there all year.

Edit: yes, I believe they still suck.

I guess when getting transfers we learn getting 1 "good" big is not a wise investment if said big man gets injured. Also don't rely on experienced post players with history of injuries.

[HenryMuto]

Could not watch but that 4 point play with 16 seconds left must been exciting to give them a chance but could not finish.

[Three Point Pete]

Maddox and Hughley have to step up.

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[drudy23]

Sigh....

Dayvion, Maddox and Hugley need to find their games. I think part of Sean's philosophy to push the pace also puts Dayvion in situations where he turns the ball over too much.

Sucks losing the Shootout, but sucks even more when you're desperate for a resume win. We've got work to do and we need to stack some wins.

[Xville]

As much of a head case as he was at times, abou would help this team tremendously. Hindsight 20/20 but he’d be really good for us with free out there playing the 4

[xukeith]

X misses Nunge and Colby Jones.

Swain needs more bulk. No excuse for 0 rebounds in 24 minutes of action.
Our biggest contributers were 2 players who signed onto X for 4 years.
The bandaid transfer portal system doesn't work so amazingly well for most teams.
I hope X can win 11-12 BE games. it will be tough.

[drudy23]

I just can't believe we're still in a situation where we're fighting for our tournament lives.

It shouldn't be this way. I'm tired of living on the edge every year.

[SkyWalker]

Sigh....

Dayvion, Maddox and Hugley need to find their games. I think part of Sean's philosophy to push the pace also puts Dayvion in situations where he turns the ball over too much.

Sucks losing the Shootout, but sucks even more when you're desperate for a resume win. We've got work to do and we need to stack some wins.

I'm not sure Hugley has a game.

[Xville]

I just can't believe we're still in a situation where we're fighting for our tournament lives.

It shouldn't be this way. I'm tired of living on the edge every year.

Good thing is that the big East is pretty medicore, but it’s going to be tough to have a winning record in conference. X has just has a glaring weakness and I don’t know what they are supposed to do about it. Uc completely took away the fast break and our half court offense is just so weak without anyone besides free inside

[nickgyp]

I thought when Xavier was up 7 points or whatever the lead was, UC had 5-6 possessions and didn’t score. Xavier also failed to score. Missed opportunities against a mediocre UC squad. A very winnable game even with only one and a half players showing up for the Muskies.

[GoMuskies]

I just can't believe we're still in a situation where we're fighting for our tournament lives.

It shouldn't be this way. I'm tired of living on the edge every year.

We didn't live anywhere near the edge last year. We're currently on pace for more of the same this year.

[OTRMUSKIE]

Did you really expect a win today? We have won 5/6 they had to win one eventually and it took everything they had to beat X. Only bad loss this year was that TCU one. TCU is atrocious and we needed that. Need to go 13-7 in BEAST to make the dance imho. Weak OOC schedule is going to kill us.

[Xville]

We didn't live anywhere near the edge last year. We're currently on pace for more of the same this year.

Meh it’s not THAT bad. We didn’t lose any buy games. I think we are at least a bubble team.

[xukeith]

X can learn and limit mistakes. X played a 80% good game today. Low turnovers , huge hustle plays, but like every loss this year, X got tired and folded.
Maddox, Hugely, and Hunter (off the bench) are not enough vs top 50 teams. Freemantle needs to play 30 minutes, not a minute more.
Hunter was okay. Not awful. Hugely is still not strong in his new body. Maybe it takes him until February to find out how to play better.
Losing Green didn't help.

Only having 6 quality players has its drawbacks.
So my hopes are :
X wins 8 games in BE vs GTown, DeP, SH, and Butler.
X wins 3-4 games vs Prov., Nova, UConn, Marquette, SJ, and Creigton

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Meh it’s not THAT bad. We didn’t lose any buy games. I think we are at least a bubble team.

Hell yeah. We crushed all the HBCU teams except one and I have zero doubt that if SC State dared step on the court with us again, we would pulverize them. Plus, we are deep!

[bjf123]

Am I pissed we loss? Of course. Am I surprised we lost? Not really. Had the game been played at Cintas, I have no doubt we’d have won. The next few games will be telling. I’ll be happy if we go 1-1.


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[hoopster68]

Am I pissed we loss? Of course. Am I surprised we lost? Not really. Had the game been played at Cintas, I have no doubt we’d have won. The next few games will be telling. I’ll be happy if we go 1-1.


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Another loss, another example of an inability to close out a game. X is very, very limited. Agree that the BE is a bit weak this year, which might give X a chance. Otherwise, it will be NIT again.

[xukeith]

Another loss, another example of an inability to close out a game. X is very, very limited. Agree that the BE is a bit weak this year, which might give X a chance. Otherwise, it will be NIT again.

Top 4 or NIT. Tough work ahead.

[Xville]

X needs to sacrifice a live chicken in front of Cintas or something. This program got so fucked by that Steele hire.

[GoMuskies]

Top 4 or NIT. Tough work ahead.

Why do we think the Selection Committee will go deeper than top 3 in the Big East this year?

Actually, I forgot St. John's, so fair.

[XUBand]

Just more of the same old shit from last year. You should see the people on Facebook talking about how good we looked and people not being real fans for criticizing this team.

[MHettel]

This years team is underachieving and underwhelming. Oh, and underperforming.

We may be at a crossroads. A huge one. Bigger than just this season.

If this team plays the way we’ve played so far, then we will likely finish around .500 in the BE and miss the tourney. This team CAN play much better. But why don’t they. We have a load of experience and guys that have succeeded in D1. Yet we look bad on defense and offense at different times. Pretty inexplicable.

Guys that should have improved….havent. Guys that have performed in the past…aren’t. We don’t have a single young guy that could develop into a star for us. Swain at this point is the only recruited guy that has any eligibility beyond this year. And he’s got offensive issues.

Last year we were awful. But we had reasons (excuses?) that people pointed to. But there are no excuses for this year.

I realize Traore got hurt. But if we start hanging losses on an injury to a guy that transferred in from a Big West school (or whatever conference it is), then we’re just rationalizing.

This trajectory is not good. Our roster for next year is looking thin with returning guys. I don’t want the portal to be our rebuilding pipeline every year.

This is bad.
They need to hold serve at Cintas for 10 conference games. Get 4 on the road.

These guys better figure it out right now. That statement is not limited to just the players. The PROGRAM is in an urgent situation

[drudy23]

This years team is underachieving and underwhelming. Oh, and underperforming.

We may be at a crossroads. A huge one. Bigger than just this season.

If this team plays the way we’ve played so far, then we will likely finish around .500 in the BE and miss the tourney. This team CAN play much better. But why don’t they. We have a load of experience and guys that have succeeded in D1. Yet we look bad on defense and offense at different times. Pretty inexplicable.

Guys that should have improved….havent. Guys that have performed in the past…aren’t. We don’t have a single young guy that could develop into a star for us. Swain at this point is the only recruited guy that has any eligibility beyond this year. And he’s got offensive issues.

Last year we were awful. But we had reasons (excuses?) that people pointed to. But there are no excuses for this year.

I realize Traore got hurt. But if we start hanging losses on an injury to a guy that transferred in from a Big West school (or whatever conference it is), then we’re just rationalizing.

This trajectory is not good. Our roster for next year is looking thin with returning guys. I don’t want the portal to be our rebuilding pipeline every year.

This is bad.
They need to hold serve at Cintas for 10 conference games. Get 4 on the road.

These guys better figure it out right now. That statement is not limited to just the players. The PROGRAM is in an urgent situation


I’m afraid I might agree.

[xukeith]

I am normally Mr. Negative after losses and have little hope for the next 20 games.

I think yesterday's game wasn't awful. Many times X's defense combined with UC's poor shooting looked great.
I believe Miller will play 7 players consistently and X sadly will be exhausted again in March.

I do hold onto some hope that X can be good enough this year for 11-13 BE wins max. That might be good enough this year for 4th place in BE.

[Xville]

Losing traore made a big difference. He averaged a double-double and has an incredible motor. It’s not just losing him, but it’s what losing him meant to the rest of the starters. Free is playing out of position, swain is playing out of position, foster is starting. It’s a huge loss in many different ways.

Having said that, I’m disappointed in what I am seeing. I know it’s a rivalry game and that on the road it’s going to look like it did at times. However, that was an ugly display of basketball. The only reason x was in the game, is because uc played equally shitty. I can accept that at times our defense just doesn’t have the horses, but our offense has looked like shit(outside of against little sisters of the poor ) for quite some time now. There isn’t an excuse for the offense to consistently look this bad.

[bleedXblue]

This years team is underachieving and underwhelming. Oh, and underperforming.

We may be at a crossroads. A huge one. Bigger than just this season.

If this team plays the way we’ve played so far, then we will likely finish around .500 in the BE and miss the tourney. This team CAN play much better. But why don’t they. We have a load of experience and guys that have succeeded in D1. Yet we look bad on defense and offense at different times. Pretty inexplicable.

Guys that should have improved….havent. Guys that have performed in the past…aren’t. We don’t have a single young guy that could develop into a star for us. Swain at this point is the only recruited guy that has any eligibility beyond this year. And he’s got offensive issues.

Last year we were awful. But we had reasons (excuses?) that people pointed to. But there are no excuses for this year.

I realize Traore got hurt. But if we start hanging losses on an injury to a guy that transferred in from a Big West school (or whatever conference it is), then we’re just rationalizing.

This trajectory is not good. Our roster for next year is looking thin with returning guys. I don’t want the portal to be our rebuilding pipeline every year.

This is bad.
They need to hold serve at Cintas for 10 conference games. Get 4 on the road.

These guys better figure it out right now. That statement is not limited to just the players. The PROGRAM is in an urgent situation

I've said all the same things. We can't be a program that brings in 5-6 new transfers every year. And we will do it AGAIN next year. Where is the foundational recruiting? Xavier isnt going to be able to hang in the NIL world and bring enough year after year. We need to have a talent base that we build off of and complement that with 2-3 needs every year. We should have started the rebuild LAST year. NO idea where we go from here, but it does not look good.

[bleedXblue]

X needs to sacrifice a live chicken in front of Cintas or something. This program got so fucked by that Steele hire.

Agreed, but we gave Miller the BAG to figure it out. If you or anyone else can explain the strategy, please do. 5-6 new players every year cant be it.

[UCGRAD4X]

It seems as if he miscalculated the overseas factor in his recruiting before last year and had to start all over.

[Xville]

Agreed, but we gave Miller the BAG to figure it out. If you or anyone else can explain the strategy, please do. 5-6 new players every year cant be it.

Yeah. As I said before Steele set this program back a decade. He only coached for 4 year but he did more harm than just 4 years. I agree the freshmen recruiting base needs to come back. It’s going to take time, and unfortunate injuries set the progress back a few years.

I’m hoping we can start building 2-3 freshman recruits every year like this one moving forward and when those guys are juniors, we will stabilize. Then, have portal guys fill in the blanks as needed, rather than refill in the roster every year. I assume that Sean’s plan, but I don’t know.

[bleedXblue]

It seems as if he miscalculated the overseas factor in his recruiting before last year and had to start all over.

The Free and Hunter injuries that fall.....summer or whatever it was, I do think we need to circle that recruiting year. We brought it some Euros late that summer or fall to try and salvage last year but NOT ONE of those guys panned out or was worthy of keeping around? Sasa, Gytis and Lazar were all total whiffs? Ducharme was a whiff? Nzeh was a whiff? I dont know....he's a PSU. But you simply cant keep turning the roster over with so many new players.

IMHO, we need to use this recruiting year to reload and as of right now only have 2 frosh coming in when we know we're losing at least 5-6 guys?

Free, McK, Foster, Hunter, Maddox - gone
Green- probable transfer
Hugley- ? Does he have another year?

Whatever you want to call it, last year was a TOTAL failure for the program.

[JTG]

Yeah. As I said before Steele set this program back a decade. He only coached for 4 year but he did more harm than just 4 years. I agree the freshmen recruiting base needs to come back. It’s going to take time, and unfortunate injuries set the progress back a few years.

I’m hoping we can start building 2-3 freshman recruits every year like this one moving forward and when those guys are juniors, we will stabilize. Then, have portal guys fill in the blanks as needed, rather than refill in the roster every year. I assume that Sean’s plan, but I don’t know.

I think Steele's recruiting was pretty decent. The problem was he couldn't coach, once he got them. The problem now is Sean is taking guys set in their ways and trying to change them. Either he recruits to his system, or coaches to his players strengths. Evidently fear of Miller's wrath isn't enough of a motivation. Something has to give.

[Xville]

The Free and Hunter injuries that fall.....summer or whatever it was, I do think we need to circle that recruiting year. We brought it some Euros late that summer or fall to try and salvage last year but NOT ONE of those guys panned out or was worthy of keeping around? Sasa, Gytis and Lazar were all total whiffs? Ducharme was a whiff? Nzeh was a whiff? I dont know....he's a PSU. But you simply cant keep turning the roster over with so many new players.

IMHO, we need to use this recruiting year to reload and as of right now only have 2 frosh coming in when we know we're losing at least 5-6 guys?

Free, McK, Foster, Hunter, Maddox - gone
Green- probable transfer
Hugley- ? Does he have another year?

Whatever you want to call it, last year was a TOTAL failure for the program.

So, next year we have conwell, traore, hugley, swain (maybe), Anderson, healthy fletcher.

Two recruits.


So maybe 3-4 portal guys? Not too bad honestly. A lot of new guys we haven’t seen play much if at all, but not turning the roster completely over. At least it’s starting to stabilize a little bit. We need a stud inside guy… maybe that will be traore but regardless we need another. Cant go into a season again hinging on one inside guy, get a lot of depth in that area please

[bleedXblue]

So, next year we have conwell, traore, hugley, swain (maybe), Anderson, healthy fletcher.

Two recruits.


So maybe 3-4 portal guys? Not too bad honestly. A lot of new guys we haven’t seen play much if at all, but not turning the roster completely over. At least it’s starting to stabilize a little bit. We need a stud inside guy… maybe that will be traore but regardless we need another. Cant go into a season again hinging on one inside guy, get a lot of depth in that area please

Room for 5 more

I'd like to see at least 1 more frosh if not 2. Even if they are more more develomental. We need athleticism and some freaking size and length. that still leaves 3 spots for transfers.

[Double Down]

I agree that X didn’t finish strong but we got no help from officials throughout the game. A big one missed by the zebras at the end of the game when Skillings was shooting free throws and got his own rebound. The reason he got his own rebound was he crossed the line before the ball hit the rim which gave them an extra 2 points at a pivotal point in the game. Big miss by the zebras. Big 12 officials weren’t going to let the cats lose this one if they were able to help.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Joe and Byron pointed out officiating errors throughout the game but I don't recall them catching the foul shot violation. Still, when you go on the road, you are not going to get the calls. So, I don't think we "should hang losses on specific injuries (Traore) or officiating" to paraphrase an earlier poster. At least Miller was truthful in his postgame remarks....."we folded down the stretch". We did just that and we did that with a bunch of veteran, experienced and accomplished players.

Which brings me to this......

Is this year's team really better than last year's? I know on paper we are. I get that. We brought in a group of veterans with solid resumes. Last year we had a bunch of last-minute fill-ins teamed with three legit players, McKnight, Quincy and Claude. But take last year's team with the benefit of last years' experience, give them the cupcakes on this year's schedule and would they not have the same record---the very same record---as we have this year?

I understand Miller's strategy. This was the final opportunity to get fifth year players with lots of experience and no agenda other than winning in March, stick them together and let them roll through a season vanquishing younger, less experienced and less talented teams. It may yet work. So far, it has not. So far, we are a big disappointment.

[bleedXblue]

Joe and Byron pointed out officiating errors throughout the game but I don't recall them catching the foul shot violation. Still, when you go on the road, you are not going to get the calls. So, I don't think we "should hang losses on specific injuries (Traore) or officiating" to paraphrase an earlier poster. At least Miller was truthful in his postgame remarks....."we folded down the stretch". We did just that and we did that with a bunch of veteran, experienced and accomplished players.

Which brings me to this......

Is this year's team really better than last year's? I know on paper we are. I get that. We brought in a group of veterans with solid resumes. Last year we had a bunch of last-minute fill-ins teamed with three legit players, McKnight, Quincy and Claude. But take last year's team with the benefit of last years' experience, give them the cupcakes on this year's schedule and would they not have the same record---the very same record---as we have this year?

I understand Miller's strategy. This was the final opportunity to get fifth year players with lots of experience and no agenda other than winning in March, stick them together and let them roll through a season vanquishing younger, less experienced and less talented teams. It may yet work. So far, it has not. So far, we are a big disappointment.

Agree, and you're seeing how tough it is to get 5-6 new guys to gel and mold into new roles, positions etc. Not an easy task and not sustainable every year.

[MHettel]

So, next year we have conwell, traore, hugley, swain (maybe), Anderson, healthy fletcher.

Two recruits.


So maybe 3-4 portal guys? Not too bad honestly. A lot of new guys we haven’t seen play much if at all, but not turning the roster completely over. At least it’s starting to stabilize a little bit. We need a stud inside guy… maybe that will be traore but regardless we need another. Cant go into a season again hinging on one inside guy, get a lot of depth in that area please

Conwell is a keeper. But he’s also on his third school and this year is t shaping up to meet expectations. If he’s looking at next years roster, does he see a tournament squad. 50/50 that he stays

Hugley? Look, we let Ciani and Nzeh walk and those guys at least had 3 years to improve. Hugley has played terrible and there aren’t even flashes. I don’t know how this guy put up number over the last 4 years, but he’s a washed.


Traore. We will see. I think he was a great hit with Free on the floor. His responsibilities would come on the defensive end, with little exposure to his offensive limits. If he’s 100%, he could be a defensive anchor. It will come down to the guys around him, of which there are none projected for next year.

Swain. He’s good defensively. He’s a guy that is good at grabbing long rebounds or loose balls. But he’s not a guy that battles for inside boards. Offensively he’s a liability. His best offensive skill is his speed on the break but his ball handling is loose and his passing is just average. Still a shot that he develops, but I’m not seeing anything beyond what he was doing last year.

Anderson is a question mark for me. Plus athlete and defender that can’t shoot. What’s the ceiling for a team that has a guy like that running point?

Fletcher is a low risk guy worth taking a flyer on. Will he be what his potential indicated 3-4 years ago? If not, what toll have the knee injuries had?

I’m realistically thinking it’s gonna be hard for Miller to put together a compelling recruiting pitch to portal guys next year. If we don’t make the dance this year, it will be 6 out of 7 years. Most of the guys we will be recruiting won’t have any recollection of our entrenched stature as a top 25 team and perennial Sweet 16 achievements.

[Xville]

Conwell is a keeper. But he’s also on his third school and this year is t shaping up to meet expectations. If he’s looking at next years roster, does he see a tournament squad. 50/50 that he stays

Hugley? Look, we let Ciani and Nzeh walk and those guys at least had 3 years to improve. Hugley has played terrible and there aren’t even flashes. I don’t know how this guy put up number over the last 4 years, but he’s a washed.


Traore. We will see. I think he was a great hit with Free on the floor. His responsibilities would come on the defensive end, with little exposure to his offensive limits. If he’s 100%, he could be a defensive anchor. It will come down to the guys around him, of which there are none projected for next year.

Swain. He’s good defensively. He’s a guy that is good at grabbing long rebounds or loose balls. But he’s not a guy that battles for inside boards. Offensively he’s a liability. His best offensive skill is his speed on the break but his ball handling is loose and his passing is just average. Still a shot that he develops, but I’m not seeing anything beyond what he was doing last year.

Anderson is a question mark for me. Plus athlete and defender that can’t shoot. What’s the ceiling for a team that has a guy like that running point?

Fletcher is a low risk guy worth taking a flyer on. Will he be what his potential indicated 3-4 years ago? If not, what toll have the knee injuries had?

I’m realistically thinking it’s gonna be hard for Miller to put together a compelling recruiting pitch to portal guys next year. If we don’t make the dance this year, it will be 6 out of 7 years. Most of the guys we will be recruiting won’t have any recollection of our entrenched stature as a top 25 team and perennial Sweet 16 achievements.

Geez took a turn down to negative town.


I look at it this way. Conwell is a great 2 guard. Stabilizing force.

Swain able to play the three makes a big difference. His offense is coming along. He was probably our second best player yesterday.


Traore is one big guy that is a keeper from what I have seen.

Anderson is an athletic freak and should be great on the defensive end. I’m intrigued by his size.

With nyk already have our backup pg for next year.

There are pieces for next year im excited about. Of course Sean will need to fill in the rest.

[Xavier]

I think this is a team that could end up with no bad losses, maybe one or two good wins, and be right in the play in game mix. (According to metrics. I consider TCU a bad loss but not sure the metrics will have it that way)

In terms of long term approach. I look around at the top teams and they have great flowing offense. Guys all around that can score and create for themselves as well as great set plays. I’m not sure X will be able to get to the next level trying to compete with that. (NIL wise). Maybe Xville is right. He didn’t necessarily say it this way- but maybe Sean needs to go back to the roots of a strong Defense and rebounding team. Emphasize size and length.


If you’re able to take away two of three top options- most teams will struggle to win. Just something I’ve been thinking. Watching some of the better teams in country and how far we are away from that type of offense. Maybe X trying to compete that way in this era isn’t a recipe for success. Maybe just overreacting to offensive struggles though. But you become a defensive oriented program, even that can have the same success offensively as we’ve seen current team have.

[Xville]

Two things:

I heard Trey was not even with the team yesterday. Can anyone confirm? That’s pretty telling if so.

Dayvion has been pretty disappointing this year so far. We need more from him offensively. He is getting the assists, but he needs to be more aggressive to get his own shot and try to score as well. Seemed like last year he really started coming in conference play, maybe that’ll be the case again this year. I want more from him.

[MHettel]

Two things:

I heard Trey was not even with the team yesterday. Can anyone confirm? That’s pretty telling if so.

Dayvion has been pretty disappointing this year so far. We need more from him offensively. He is getting the assists, but he needs to be more aggressive to get his own shot and try to score as well. Seemed like last year he really started coming in conference play, maybe that’ll be the case again this year. I want more from him.

Dayvion played 34 minutes and was 1-3 from the floor with 2 points. No 3 pt attempts, no Free Throw attempts. 4 rebs, 9 assist, 1 steal, 3 turnovers, 3 fouls

If you told me we had. A big game coming up and a 5th year PG was leading the opposing team and he’d put up THAT stat line I’d say I’ll take that ALL DAY!

We had only Free doing anything offensively for most of the game. Conwell got hot late. And swain was getting scraps mostly.

Why did Dayvion not assert himself as a scoring threat? How much of the game has to go by before you tell yourself that maybe you attacking the basket or getttong shots off could get the offense going.

I probably put too much emphasis on this, but the guys that show ZERO emotion kinda get on my nerves. There is NO expression on his face. Foul a guy taking a 3….blank stare. Hit an and one shot….blank stare. He says nothing. LEAD!!!!

Where is Kunkel? JP? Stanley? Jalen? Scruggs? Tyrique?

Not all guys can do this. But almost ALL guys can feed off it when someone like that is out there.

This team is pretty lifeless.

[Xville]

Dayvion played 34 minutes and was 1-3 from the floor with 2 points. No 3 pt attempts, no Free Throw attempts. 4 rebs, 9 assist, 1 steal, 3 turnovers, 3 fouls

If you told me we had. A big game coming up and a 5th year PG was leading the opposing team and he’d put up THAT stat line I’d say I’ll take that ALL DAY!

We had only Free doing anything offensively for most of the game. Conwell got hot late. And swain was getting scraps mostly.

Why did Dayvion not assert himself as a scoring threat? How much of the game has to go by before you tell yourself that maybe you attacking the basket or getttong shots off could get the offense going.

I probably put too much emphasis on this, but the guys that show ZERO emotion kinda get on my nerves. There is NO expression on his face. Foul a guy taking a 3….blank stare. Hit an and one shot….blank stare. He says nothing. LEAD!!!!

Where is Kunkel? JP? Stanley? Jalen? Scruggs? Tyrique?

Not all guys can do this. But almost ALL guys can feed off it when someone like that is out there.

This team is pretty lifeless.

I like Dayvion as a person. He was extremely sweet to my daughter last year taking a picture with her and signing about five Xavier things she brought down to the court. So I want to see him do well and wish nothing but the best for him. However, he’s not a leader, he’s just not. He’s extremely quiet, introverted and like you said just isn’t an emotional player. You and I are the same in that way, I need to see some outward expression in sports that you give a shit.


I love that he gets others involved and he rarely turns the ball over. However, what I am hoping is that come Wednesday, a light turns on for him and he realizes that this is it for him in college, and he needs to go down swinging. Dayvion needs to get his and be more aggressive, be a little less nice, be more of a vocal leader etc. as I said, I need more from him. It’s now or never

[Xavier]

I agree, but Freemantle fits the bill there a little. I mean he’s trash talking Martin after hitting the 3 to end the first. He’s definitely got that in him. But it’s not quite there from other guys. Also….not sure Scruggs is the best example. Didn’t he miss the tournament every year? lol

The other thing- we are like 4 possession from being 9-1 and ranked. It’s not saying much bc at the same time just a couple possessions from having another loss to a buy game team. And losing games you have control of in the end are signs of a bad team anyways.

[MHettel]

I agree, but Freemantle fits the bill there a little. I mean he’s trash talking Martin after hitting the 3 to end the first. He’s definitely got that in him. But it’s not quite there from other guys. Also….not sure Scruggs is the best example. Didn’t he miss the tournament every year? lol

The other thing- we are like 4 possession from being 9-1 and ranked. It’s not saying much bc at the same time just a couple possessions from having another loss to a buy game team. And losing games you have control of in the end are signs of a bad team anyways.

Scruggs was on that 1 seed team. Right? He didn’t make the dance under Steele and came back for a fifth year. Then he gets injured and we promptly win the NIT.

Scruggs is actually a great example of a guy playing out of position. He would have been a good 3 and we had him at point. So yeah, not exactly a “winner” in one sense, but spirited at least.

[profson]

Since we are talking about next year ..... we will have the same issue for a third year, undersized insufficient big men. And Free is gone. So we have to go to the portal for the most expensive and competitive hire. Will be very tough.
It is no use being nostalgic about the past. Apples and oranges. Yes Farr, Reynolds, O'Mara and and others developed, but all were rumored to have thought to transfer, and certainly were constrained by the requirement of sitting out a year.
Nunge was a very special situation because of injuries and wanting to play near home because of his father's death. Today you would be in a bidding war.
We love Tyrique because of his grit, but the reality is he was unders

[profson]

--- undersized and could not shoot beyond three feet.
Hankins was Division 2 (albeit player of the year), so again a special situation, and would need to be paid.today
And of course Nunge and Hankins were effectively from the portal.
Conclusion - very hard for X to develop and keep big men and thus will need to try in the portal.

[xukeith]

I think many teams in transfer portal choose a player who has a history of rehabbing an injury. Many teams stay away from a player with recent injuries.
X and others "gamble" on a discounted athlete.

Nunge, Hunter, Fletcher, Hugely, Stanely, are a few examples.
Maybe Fletcher will be above average for 1 -2 years.
Looks like Hugely has too much health baggage(not used to his body).

[Xville]

--- undersized and could not shoot beyond three feet.
Hankins was Division 2 (albeit player of the year), so again a special situation, and would need to be paid.today
And of course Nunge and Hankins were effectively from the portal.
Conclusion - very hard for X to develop and keep big men and thus will need to try in the portal.

To your point, we will need another regardless of what hugley does, but we do have traore. He’s 6’10 250 and a defense machine

[drudy23]

We are going to find ourselves in a very precarious position next year with no offensive threat in the post. Outside of the Nunge years, it crippled Steele's tenure, and something that seems so glaring, it's still puzzling how the hole can still exist.

Yes, I understand what basketball has moved to...but you still need capable frontcourt players. This program needs to prioritize this position immediately. It cannot succeed at the level we all expect without a major upgrade here.

[Xville]

We are going to find ourselves in a very precarious position next year with no offensive threat in the post. Outside of the Nunge years, it crippled Steele's tenure, and something that seems so glaring, it's still puzzling how the hole can still exist.

Yes, I understand what basketball has moved to...but you still need capable frontcourt players. This program needs to prioritize this position immediately. It cannot succeed at the level we all expect without a major upgrade here.

Not banking on the guy, trust me and Sean needs to get plenty more anyways, but don’t forget about fletcher. If he comes back from injury more like Nunge and not hugley, he can give us some good production. The one year he was actually healthy he averaged 11 and 7. The thing I like most about him is that he’s not a twig. 6’7, 230 with a large frame.


Lots of ifs and buts but this isn’t the worst lineup to start with


Pg Anderson
Sg conwell
Sf swain
Pf fletcher
C traore


Bench: hugley, nyk, forsythe


As I said lots of ifs and buts, and we need a higher level of portal guy. A lot of nil was wasted this year tbh

[muskieindent]

This team won't win many games only making 6 three pointers. Maddox has been very disappointing so far and where has McKnight gone? 2 points?!? You can't score if you don't shoot. We really miss Trabore as Hugley is just eating up space. Maybe Fletcher can provide a spark off the bench. 8-3 at this point is about the worst I would have expected at this point.Lot of season left but so far this has been a big letdown.I thought this team had a lot of potential.I think Marquette is almost a must win in order to get some momentum going.We better hold serve at home or it will be another NIT season

[Xville]

This team won't win many games only making 6 three pointers. Maddox has been very disappointing so far and where has McKnight gone? 2 points?!? You can't score if you don't shoot. We really miss Trabore as Hugley is just eating up space. Maybe Fletcher can provide a spark off the bench. 8-3 at this point is about the worst I would have expected at this point.Lot of season left but so far this has been a big letdown.I thought this team had a lot of potential.I think Marquette is almost a must win in order to get some momentum going.We better hold serve at home or it will be another NIT season

I thought 9-2 was likely. I thought x would beat Tcu because frankly they suck. Other than that, it’s gone how I thought it would go.

I fear that TCU loss is going to end up being very bad. They just got even worse, as Frankie Collins is now out for the season.

The TCU games and UC games were almost identical...with about 7 minutes left in the game and a decent lead, X shit their pants.

[muskieindent]

Joe and Byron pointed out officiating errors throughout the game but I don't recall them catching the foul shot violation. Still, when you go on the road, you are not going to get the calls. So, I don't think we "should hang losses on specific injuries (Traore) or officiating" to paraphrase an earlier poster. At least Miller was truthful in his postgame remarks....."we folded down the stretch". We did just that and we did that with a bunch of veteran, experienced and accomplished players.

Which brings me to this......

Is this year's team really better than last year's? I know on paper we are. I get that. We brought in a group of veterans with solid resumes. Last year we had a bunch of last-minute fill-ins teamed with three legit players, McKnight, Quincy and Claude. But take last year's team with the benefit of last years' experience, give them the cupcakes on this year's schedule and would they not have the same record---the very same record---as we have this year?

I understand Miller's strategy. This was the final opportunity to get fifth year players with lots of experience and no agenda other than winning in March, stick them together and let them roll through a season vanquishing younger, less experienced and less talented teams. It may yet work. So far, it has not. So far, we are a big disappointment.

We miss Dez a lot-aggressive player who will make the play in a tight game.We haven't had anyone step up yet in these close games.I thought Conwell might be that player but he seems content to just shoot 3's.

[Xville]

IMO this team is better because X at least has Free. I don't think it's that much better, but talent-wise as you said on paper is better. Hindsight is 20/20 but we should have kept Abou if we had the opportunity to do so. Of course, could have never imagined that 1.) Hugley would be this bad and 2) Traore would be gone for the season.

[paulxu]

It sure sucks that in mid-December the discussion is for the next year of basketball.