Xavier 2023-2024 Season

[D-West & PO-Z]

Figured we might need a general thread for all things X 2023-2024 season. At least I think we usually have one of these.

Anyway, I just noticed we play at midnight eastern time on 11/17 against Washington. Woof. And of course my family and I are leaving at the crack of dawn the next day to go to FL for the week. That will be one of the longer times I have to go without knowing what happened in a game if I want to record and watch later without knowing.

[xudash]

That's funny. I noticed that Washington tip time too and I started to attempt to fix my Google calendar.

Safe travels to the Sunshine State.

[Masterofreality]

Just go out to Vegas.
Only a 9pm tip out there! ;-)

[D-West & PO-Z]

Just go out to Vegas.
Only a 9pm tip out there! ;-)

I wish!

[D-West & PO-Z]

That's funny. I noticed that Washington tip time too and I started to attempt to fix my Google calendar.

Safe travels to the Sunshine State.

Thanks!

[atljar]

That will be one of the longer times I have to go without knowing what happened in a game if I want to record and watch later without knowing.

Absolutely impossible for me. Ive tried and failed so many times. I always end up seeing the results on social media, on the radio or news, or friends text me etc. So frustrating!

[xu82]

Just go out to Vegas.
Only a 9pm tip out there! ;-)

Any recommendations on where to stay? :-)

[94GRAD]

Any recommendations on where to stay? :-)

I hear the Stratosphere is the place to be.

[Masterofreality]

I hear the Stratosphere is the place to be.

As modern as Dana Gardens!!! ;-)

[muskiefan82]

Phil Martelli, Jr. will be the acting coach when Bryant comes to visit Xavier. If dad comes, we need Stanley Burrell to suit up again just to make the old man laugh.

[X-band '01]

I wonder if he'd sign my copy of Young Frankenstein.

[94GRAD]

I wonder if he'd sign my copy of Young Frankenstein.

It's Young Frankensteen!

[paulxu]

Knockers?

[sirthought]

Phil Martelli, Jr. will be the acting coach when Bryant comes to visit Xavier. If dad comes, we need Stanley Burrell to suit up again just to make the old man laugh.

good one!

[GoMuskies]

Dad Martelli is too busy being the acting coach for Michigan.

[American X]

Save Nemeiksa, the super-experienced Senior transfers who are going to make Xavier a tournament team are underwhelming, to say the least.

[Xuperman]

A SMC win suddenly is huge because, a UH win, while certainly possible, will be a double digit dog situation. Say we get SMC and UC. Does anyone think those are T1 come selection Sunday?

So far, Coach Miller's ensemble looks inconsistent, TO prone and are worrisome shooters from the field and the line. Big East prognostication at this point, is heading in a less than positive direction. The conference is extremely tough in the top half....predicting X gets swept by 4 teams (so that's at least 4 bad endings at Cintas). If this becomes reality, 12 regular season BE wins becomes highly unlikely, but 10-11 is more than doable. Get 1 or 2 more at MSG late, and who knows. This NonCon will not move the needle much regardless.

[Xavier]

meh. After Purdue I thought Houston at home was a toss up. I’ll be shocked if that’s a double digit line. I think you’re underestimating the impact Cintas will
Have. I don’t see us getting swept by the top 4 at home.

Regardless I agree with your overall point, we look and feel like a bubble team. The loss to Washington won’t help (is that going to be a Q2 loss? I assume so bc I think they looked pretty bad themselves). SMC and houston might be our only Q1 opportunities in the OOC. I think after Purdue and Washington it appears we will have an up and down year, win a couple we really shouldn’t and lose a couple we shouldn’t

[Xville]

I think we are all still very scarred from the Steele years. The years where the team looked the exact same from November to March (which was typically like what we just saw.)

This team will get better. X is only 4 games in, 1 with Lazar.

Lastly, I don’t think Washington is bad. Not good, but not bad. I think they are very similar to st johns… just meh. NIT team with 1-2 players that are really damn good but not much else.

[Xuperman]

Barring nothing unexpected with the Cougars, a SMC loss would make a 10 pt spread a a near certainty.

[Xuperman]

meh. After Purdue I thought Houston at home was a toss up. I’ll be shocked if that’s a double digit line. I think you’re underestimating the impact Cintas will
Have. I don’t see us getting swept by the top 4 at home.

Regardless I agree with your overall point, we look and feel like a bubble team. The loss to Washington won’t help (is that going to be a Q2 loss? I assume so bc I think they looked pretty bad themselves). SMC and houston might be our only Q1 opportunities in the OOC. I think after Purdue and Washington it appears we will have an up and down year, win a couple we really shouldn’t and lose a couple we shouldn’t

I didn't mean to imply that the perceived "Top4" will all get Cintas dubs. I am thinking the chances of an unexpected team to sweep us.

The boys had better have gotten at least 1 home win against MU,CU,UCONN,VU. Otherwise, our powder will be wet selection Sunday.

[drudy23]

With so many newcomers, the Crosstown Shootout concerns me this year. This could be the year.

[X-band '01]

Better not have a hangover against Bryant on Friday - they just knocked off a Top 10 FAU team on the road by 9.

[noteggs]

Guess Jr is a chip off the old block…

[D-West & PO-Z]

With so many newcomers, the Crosstown Shootout concerns me this year. This could be the year.

Certainly the most concerned I've been for the game at Cintas in 20 years.

[D-West & PO-Z]

but 10-11 is more than doable.

Thinking you mean 10-10. We play 20 conference games.

I predicted 10-10 at the onset and 1-1 in the BE tourney.

If we do that, I think it puts us on the right side of the bubble. But I did think we'd win 1 in Vegas. Sunday will be big.

[X-man]

I think we need to watch out for Bryant this Friday, when the arena will not have the usual student section there because of Thanksgiving. Bryant knocked off #10 FAU last night at FAU Arena. That may speak more about FAU being overrated than about Bryant, given their losses to Manhattan, Rutgers, and BU. But still....

[Xuperman]

Thinking you mean 10-10. We play 20 conference games.

I predicted 10-10 at the onset and 1-1 in the BE tourney.

If we do that, I think it puts us on the right side of the bubble. But I did think we'd win 1 in Vegas. Sunday will be big.

I only meant to say 10-11 BE wins are more doable than 12. If it ends up 10-10, the rest of the OOC schedule had better turn around quick....like tonight.

If X ends up with 4 OOC loses (14 overall reg season loses), that is beyond precarious for the desired post season aspirations.

[paulxu]

In the next 30 days, we play 6 games.

They're all at home.

[GoMuskies]

Feels like we're right on schedule so far. Figured we'd lose to Purdue and go 1-1 in Vegas. Not exactly how I expected to go 1-1 in Vegas, but 1-1 it is.

[bleedXblue]

Better not have a hangover against Bryant on Friday - they just knocked off a Top 10 FAU team on the road by 9.

And also have a few head scratching losses........

[murray87]

And now Phil Martelli Jr coaching them:

https://www.providencejournal.com/story/sports/college/2023/11/18/bryant-bulldogs-mens-basketball-stuns-no-10-florida-atlantic/71641713007/

[bleedXblue]

It's early but a few observation through 5 games.

1. Defensive rebounding better drastically improve or it's going to be a long year
2. Same can be said for FT shooting
3. Safe to say this isn't going to be a great shooting team
4. Better play damn good D and prevent as many 2nd chance PTS as possible

[Xville]

I think the rebounding is fine. It sucked last night but x more than held their own against Purdue on the road and out rebounded Washington.

I do agree with the ft shooting—yikes and outside shooting in general. It may get better once the season rolls along and they get a bunch of games in at home.

I like the talent and the depth and I think that ball movement is improving.

As rodgers said, R-E-L-A-X

We have miller and this will be a tourney team. We aren’t headed by Tin foil anymore.

[bjf123]

As rodgers said, R-E-L-A-X


But, but, you don’t understand. This is a fan board. We can’t relax. We have to panic! Don’t you see that the sky is falling? We’re doomed!


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[stammina0721]

Certainly the most concerned I've been for the game at Cintas in 20 years.

This is where I disagree. The guys really don't know the history that well and didn't really play with these guys in the summer as much as previous teams. I see our guys treating it as just another game amd since X is definitely more talented I am actually not as concerned about that game as I have been in previous years.

[Three Point Pete]

In the next 30 days, we play 6 games.

They're all at home.I could see winning 5!

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[noteggs]

Not this year, but sounds like X will be playing in the Fort Myers’s tip off next year (sorry if previous reported). That sounds like a great place to go over Thanksgiving!

[X-band '01]

Had not heard that yet. Would fall in line with a 2-game MTE tournament.

[X-band '01]

2024 Fort Myers Tip-Off (Beach Division) (https://www.fortmyerstipoff.com/2023/11/20/2024-fort-myers-tip-off-beach-division-announced/)

Other three teams in the field would be Michigan, Virginia Tech and South Carolina.

[XUGRAD80]

2024 Fort Myers Tip-Off (Beach Division) (https://www.fortmyerstipoff.com/2023/11/20/2024-fort-myers-tip-off-beach-division-announced/)

Other three teams in the field would be Michigan, Virginia Tech and South Carolina.

That’s a good field, with a team from the B10, ACC, SEC, and BigE each representing their conference. All of them from the eastern time zone, and the tournament being held in the eastern times zone too. Shouldn’t be any midnight game starts and probably no ESPN+ coverage to worry about. Cheap flights from Cincinnati, if you’re willing to travel on Thanksgiving, can be had.

[XUBison]

2024 Fort Myers Tip-Off (Beach Division) (https://www.fortmyerstipoff.com/2023/11/20/2024-fort-myers-tip-off-beach-division-announced/)

Other three teams in the field would be Michigan, Virginia Tech and South Carolina.

Ummm, X hoops 15 minutes from my house? Yes, please!

[XUGRAD80]

Ummm, X hoops 15 minutes from my house? Yes, please!

I wouldn’t broadcast that too much or you’ll end up with all kinds of new house guests next Thanksgiving. LOL :laugh:

[noteggs]

Interesting article on Des and potential draft. Guess enjoy him while we got him.

https://www.on3.com/news/the-top-nba-draft-prospects-in-the-big-east-1-0-trey-alexander-donovan-clingan-stephon-castle/

[JEHARDI]

Interesting article on Des and potential draft. Guess enjoy him while we got him.

https://www.on3.com/news/the-top-nba-draft-prospects-in-the-big-east-1-0-trey-alexander-donovan-clingan-stephon-castle/

Early but a 3rd year would serve him well.

[XUBison]

Early but a 3rd year would serve him well.

Why? His game has already taken as big a leap as it’s going to take.

[XUGRAD80]

Why? His game has already taken as big a leap as it’s going to take.

You think that what we are seeing right now is the ceiling of his game? I certainly don’t. I think that he can (and will) become a much better player, given time. Physically he might not get much better, but mentally he can still improve quite a bit. He’s only played a season as a part time player, and a handful of games as a starter. He still has a lot to learn.

[xukeith]

You think that what we are seeing right now is the ceiling of his game? I certainly don’t. I think that he can (and will) become a much better player, given time. Physically he might not get much better, but mentally he can still improve quite a bit. He’s only played a season as a part time player, and a handful of games as a starter. He still has a lot to learn.

I think another year would help Dez become a better shooter, all round better rebounder too.
Similar to Colby Jones' development as a shooter.

[sirthought]

Claude needs to vastly improve his FT and 3PT percentage before he'll get a serious sniff. I'd say he shows great maturity on handling and distributing, but I think all of those areas haven't reached their potential either. Honestly, he's a smart player and uses a bit more of an old man's game than the pure athletics that many NBA types use. I think he can improve going stronger to the hoop at times, rather than just get fouled on the way up. If he's that far improved by the end of this year, I'll be shocked.

[XUBison]

You think that what we are seeing right now is the ceiling of his game? I certainly don’t. I think that he can (and will) become a much better player, given time. Physically he might not get much better, but mentally he can still improve quite a bit. He’s only played a season as a part time player, and a handful of games as a starter. He still has a lot to learn.

Not at all what I meant, but nice try.

[XUGRAD80]

Not at all what I meant, but nice try.

Please explain your remark then. Seems I’m not the only one that misunderstands what you meant when you said “His game has already taken as big a leap as it’s going to take.”

[Xuperman]

This is where I disagree. The guys really don't know the history that well and didn't really play with these guys in the summer as much as previous teams. I see our guys treating it as just another game amd since X is definitely more talented I am actually not as concerned about that game as I have been in previous years.

Nothing posted here applies. As of yesterday, the size of their post players is remarkable and they have no shortage of skilled/athletic players composing a fairly deep bench. Top 1/3 in the B12?

No, this game is certainly reason for concern.

[Xville]

X will be the first team they play this year that is a real basketball team. Not concerned. X will be 7-8 point favorites at home.

[XUGRAD80]

Nothing posted here applies. As of yesterday, the size of their post players is remarkable and they have no shortage of skilled/athletic players composing a fairly deep bench. Top 1/3 in the B12?

No, this game is certainly reason for concern.

There’s a very good likelihood of UC coming into the game undefeated. However, the level of competition hasn’t been nearly as high as what X has played. But what you say about their size and depth is quite true. They are a much improved team over what they have been the last couple of years. More athletic, deeper, and better shooters. I’m also worried that other than Dez X doesn’t have anyone who has actually played in the game before, and only Dez and Craft have even experienced the atmosphere and intensity. On the other hand it will be only the 2nd road game for UC and certainly the most hostile crowd that many of them will have ever experienced. I’m not super confident but there are reasons to believe that X can and will win the game.

[Xavier]

X will be the first team they play this year that is a real basketball team. Not concerned. X will be 7-8 point favorites at home.

I figured around 5-7 point Favorites, too. The fellas on the musketeer report podcast said they wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a pickem or UC slightly favored.

[Xville]

I figured around 5-7 point Favorites, too. The fellas on the musketeer report podcast said they wouldn’t be surprised if it’s a pickem or UC slightly favored.

Well, they are on crack then. Sagarin says x 3 on a neutral court. So it will safely be 6-7 if not more at cintas

[GoMuskies]

Sagarin still has a lot of last year noise. 4.5 sounds about right to me.

[American X]

With Trey Green out and some shooting desperately needed against Houston, Reid Ducharme could not even sniff the floor?

[paulxu]

We really would have helped ourselves with a win at home over Houston.

Sh*t

[drudy23]

With Trey Green out and some shooting desperately needed against Houston, Reid Ducharme could not even sniff the floor?

We're getting to the point in this season where, if we haven't seem much of you, we likely aren't for the remainder of the year.

[bleedXblue]

X will be the first team they play this year that is a real basketball team. Not concerned. X will be 7-8 point favorites at home.

You should be concerned. They're pretty good and motivated to beat us for sure. Yeah they haven't played much yet, but they've beaten all of those teams handlily except Howard.

And never mind them........WE have our own issues. TO's and shooting to name just a few. Our margin for error is razor thin.

[bleedXblue]

We're getting to the point in this season where, if we haven't seem much of you, we likely aren't for the remainder of the year.

Correct and in today's game if you cant sniff the floor as a frosh the likelihood of ever being a serious contributor is SLIM. I dont see Reid or Craft being here next year.

[GoMuskies]

Georgia Tech beat Dook, so they might be a real team. They're no Oakland, of course....

[bleedXblue]

Georgia Tech beat Dook, so they might be a real team. They're no Oakland, of course....

UC beat them by 35. Just sayin.....

[drudy23]

First year in some time I think UC may have the better team. We probably have the better upside, but I think they're better than us right now. Doesn't mean we can't/won't win.

So many newcomers usually is also a bad omen for the Shootout. Des, Free and Hunter better be damn sure their teammates understand what this game means.

[GoMuskies]

UC must have a load of newcomers too if their team doesn't suck.

[Xville]

You should be concerned. They're pretty good and motivated to beat us for sure. Yeah they haven't played much yet, but they've beaten all of those teams handlily except Howard.

And never mind them........WE have our own issues. TO's and shooting to name just a few. Our margin for error is razor thin.

I’m not concerned. If it was at their dump, maybe I’d be, but x isn’t losing to them at home. The opponents they have played are a collective high powered 15-31. Uc sucks

[Xville]

Georgia Tech beat Dook, so they might be a real team. They're no Oakland, of course....

Meh. Hard to win the road in conference and duke is everyone’s Super Bowl.

[XUGRAD80]

Georgia Tech beat Dook, so they might be a real team. They're no Oakland, of course....

I was at the UC-GT game with some friends that are big UC fans/supporters. GT looked terrible in that game, just terrible. I wouldn’t take anything from them beating Duke, other than perhaps Duke isn’t all that.

I’ve no doubt that UC is improved, and X is not as good as they were at the end of last year. But I also wonder what we would be saying about X if they had played the same schedule that UC has? It’s easy to look good when you’re playing nobodies.

[XUGRAD80]

UC must have a load of newcomers too if their team doesn't suck.

New backcourt, new wing (actually he was on the team but was injured all year), and a new starting forward. Only the big Russian kid, Lakvin, is back in the starting lineup. Much better depth too. Not a great team, but I wouldn’t say that they suck. It won’t be any easy win.

[D-West & PO-Z]

We're getting to the point in this season where, if we haven't seem much of you, we likely aren't for the remainder of the year.

Yep

[D-West & PO-Z]

Correct and in today's game if you cant sniff the floor as a frosh the likelihood of ever being a serious contributor is SLIM. I dont see Reid or Craft being here next year.

This is probably more true now than ever before but it has not been true in the history of X basketball. But given all the new faces, could be true.

[American X]

Is it a requirement to have a white guy who is supposed to be an incredible shooter but never does anything? Now we have two of them.

[drudy23]

Is it a requirement to have a white guy who is supposed to be an incredible shooter but never does anything? Now we have two of them.

Those two can definitely shoot. It's the other things that are likely keeping them down.

I don't envy younger players in the current landscape of college athletics. If you aren't a bona fide stud, coaches are over-recruiting you in the portal. It has to be super frustrating, and if we're being honest, also hinders development.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Those two can definitely shoot. It's the other things that are likely keeping them down.

I don't envy younger players in the current landscape of college athletics. If you aren't a bona fide stud, coaches are over-recruiting you in the portal. It has to be super frustrating, and if we're being honest, also hinders development.

On the flip side, alleviates the frustration some players probably felt who were late bloomers or underrecruited and are/became super talented but at a school with little to no chance of making the tourney, let alone winning a game.

Craft seems to at least be related to injury somewhat. But I'm not sure if you take Olivari off the team that all of a sudden Ducharme is playing any sort of significant mins.

[drudy23]

On the flip side, alleviates the frustration some players probably felt who were late bloomers or underrecruited and are/became super talented but at a school with little to no chance of making the tourney, let alone winning a game.

Craft seems to at least be related to injury somewhat. But I'm not sure if you take Olivari off the team that all of a sudden Ducharme is playing any sort of significant mins.

I've watched Craft warm up at every home game. He looks completely fine, moves well, shoots well, and occasionally throws in a sweet dunk. I think they may be trying to preserve another season for him at this point, although I have no clue what those rules are.

[GoMuskies]

I think they may be trying to preserve another season for him at this point, although I have no clue what those rules are.

I suspect he's trying to preserve another year for himself but not at Xavier.

[xukeith]

I've watched Craft warm up at every home game. He looks completely fine, moves well, shoots well, and occasionally throws in a sweet dunk. I think they may be trying to preserve another season for him at this point, although I have no clue what those rules are.

Miller mentioned Craft needed a full year with no injuries so he can be in best shape and really prepared for a great single season performance.
Not sure if that was coach speak or not.

[Xville]

Crafts numbers at the skill factory were very impressive and I expected quite a bit from him. His shot seems to take a really long time, and he doesn’t seem very athletic for this level. With Reid, I’m not that surprised. His numbers were very meh and didn’t grow from his junior to senior year. I know he was on a team with an absurd number of d1 guys but still.

Lots of time for these guys especially Reid, but this is big time college athletics

[bleedXblue]

I suspect he's trying to preserve another year for himself but not at Xavier.

This is 10000% correct

There is no other explanation. He's healthy enough to play but I think Sean told him his minutes would be limited and they are holding him out to preserve a year of eligibility

[Xavier]

You never know what you’re going to get in the transfer pool. Making the tournament is off the table. Thought we might manage getting to bubble territory but if we are in the bubble mix the last two games cost us. Need to just root for improvement from the young guys.

[Three Point Pete]

Best case I see: can get better shooting FT, a matter of practice. As these guys play more together, TOs should improve. I think we can still salvage a winning record.

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[drudy23]

I'll mention it again - I'm worried about our talent pipeline.

We continue to whiff on priority guys on the recruiting trail and within the portal. When's the last time X got their main priority guy?

We're becoming close to entering the back half of the league in terms of talent, and that's not good, and has never happened.

I don't care what the recruiting rankings say, we were getting better players under Mack.

[Xavier]

Sean has only had one year. And landed one of the best transfers in the country last year. It’s why I was confident in the incoming transfers. But Mack brought X it’s two best seasons, I don’t want to compare one year of recruiting to that. Unfair.

[xukeith]

Who would have thought Thad Matta's Butler team is better than X.
Will X improve?

Are they close to Christmas break where the most "progress" happens?


This is what happens I guess when you rely on athleticism over sound fundamental players. Who are we kidding? .

[Xavier]

Is that sarcasm? Has anyone looked at this team and thought the athleticism jumped out? Lol

[xukeith]

Imagine X playing DePaul, Georgetoown, Butler, SH, Providence , and SJU all on the road. Tonight's team might win 2 BE road games.

As much as I enjoy The SM Podcast, this has to be making Miller miserable. Hoep he can turn this ship around. He isn't getting younder.

[UCGRAD4X]

Imagine X playing DePaul, Georgetoown, Butler, SH, Providence , and SJU all on the road. Tonight's team might win 2 BE road games.

As much as I enjoy The SM Podcast, this has to be making Miller miserable. Hoep he can turn this ship around. He isn't getting younder.

What did you see tonight that makes you confident that they can win two games on the road.

[UCGRAD4X]

When is the last time Xavier lost three straight non-cons at home? When's the last time they lost 3 non-cons at home all season?

[drudy23]

When is the last time Xavier lost three straight non-cons at home? When's the last time they lost 3 non-cons at home all season?

It has to be back in the 70s or early 80s.

[D-West & PO-Z]

When is the last time Xavier lost three straight non-cons at home? When's the last time they lost 3 non-cons at home all season?

Or lost 2 buy games.

[American X]

Winning the Shootout and 10 Big East games would be maximizing the capability of this team. Getting to 12 Big East wins and a shot at the Tournament would make Sean Miller a miracle worker. Just too many mismatched pieces for something coherent and consistent.

[bjf123]

When is the last time Xavier lost three straight non-cons at home? When's the last time they lost 3 non-cons at home all season?

There’s a very real chance it could become 4 straight non-con losses in a row on Saturday. I’m sure that’s never happened at Cintas. The boos will be deafening at the end of that game.

In the postgame radio interview, Sean alluded to how most of the players have no point of reference for the magnitude of the game. I’m afraid it could overwhelm them.


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[Xville]

Cintas is going to be juiced up and I hope the team thrives off that energy. Need a win, and this could be a catalyst to a lot of good things. Just win baby

[bleedXblue]

I'll mention it again - I'm worried about our talent pipeline.

We continue to whiff on priority guys on the recruiting trail and within the portal. When's the last time X got their main priority guy?

We're becoming close to entering the back half of the league in terms of talent, and that's not good, and has never happened.

I don't care what the recruiting rankings say, we were getting better players under Mack.

Agree 1000%

Sean was supposed to ELEVATE recruiting.

Its clear he needs help and the guys on the staff now aren't getting it done

Steele could recruit...that is for sure.

Big misses cant continue to happen and whoever signed up a guy from Serbia and North Texas for IMMEDIATE contribution should be heavily scrutinized.

Nzeh and Ducharme cant get on the floor last night? Cmon.

[Xville]

Agree 1000%

Sean was supposed to ELEVATE recruiting.

Its clear he needs help and the guys on the staff now aren't getting it done

Steele could recruit...that is for sure.

Big misses cant continue to happen and whoever signed up a guy from Serbia and North Texas for IMMEDIATE contribution should be heavily scrutinized.

Nzeh and Ducharme cant get on the floor last night? Cmon.

There’s been one recruiting year. One in which he grabbed green, swain who look like are going to be absolute studs. It was also a year in which he thought we would have hunter and free. Kind of hard to grab guys when you don’t expect to be able to offer minutes until it was too late and then x was behind on portal recruiting at that position. Dayvion and olivari seem to be getting better each game but it’s certainly taking some time.

Who are all these priority guys x is missing out on? We missed on ike but that was niland he wanted to say out west.


I’m not sure what some of you expect. Steele really fucked this program over in multiple ways. Recruits don’t see it as the school that gets to the tourney every year and wins anymore. Steele broke that culture of winning, it’s going to take a bit to get it back. One season does not a program make.

[Xavier]

Its clear he needs help and the guys on the staff now aren't getting it done

Steele could recruit...that is for sure.

Big misses cant continue to happen and whoever signed up a guy from Serbia and North Texas for IMMEDIATE contribution should be heavily scrutinized.

.

He could? Never looked like X had a wealth of talent during Steele years. Maybe I’m wrong.

There’s a huge overreaction to Sean’s Ability to get talent. Boum was the main piece to make the offense go last year. To Xville point, we’d be fine if Hunter and Free were available.

Front court was never supposed to be an issue. The transfer guards would look a lot better with affective movement, space, etc. that those two would’ve provided. I don’t think they were recruited to carry the team. Their style sort of fits the scheme from last year, but with such poor frontcourt play the offense doesn’t run well at all. Swain and Green will be very good Xavier players. With Free/Hunter available no one would question the talent.

[bjf123]

Sean was supposed to ELEVATE recruiting.

It’s clear he needs help and the guys on the staff now aren't getting it done.

You can’t fault Sean and staff with a recruiting blunder on the Euro bigs when those were last minute emergency fills to replace Hunter and Free. At that point, just about everyone had committed elsewhere.


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[GoMuskies]

Listen, I am thrilled Sean is back and am as convinced as ever that he will elevate the program to new heights....but I also have that little twinge that reminds me that coaches who go back for a second stint at a school almost never find success in that second stint. I can't think of anyone who did better the second time around. Homer Drew at Valpo is about the most successful example I'm aware of. I think (hope?) Sean is a unique case, but I also worry a little when he's running us through what's shaping up to be our worst season in three decades.

[D-West & PO-Z]

There’s been one recruiting year. One in which he grabbed green, swain who look like are going to be absolute studs. It was also a year in which he thought we would have hunter and free. Kind of hard to grab guys when you don’t expect to be able to offer minutes until it was too late and then x was behind on portal recruiting at that position. Dayvion and olivari seem to be getting better each game but it’s certainly taking some time.

Who are all these priority guys x is missing out on? We missed on ike but that was niland he wanted to say out west.


I’m not sure what some of you expect. Steele really fucked this program over in multiple ways. Recruits don’t see it as the school that gets to the tourney every year and wins anymore. Steele broke that culture of winning, it’s going to take a bit to get it back. One season does not a program make.

Absolutely agree. Public reps since the man is holding me down.

This year sucks, no denying that. But I am nowhere near feeling the need to criticize Miller's recruiting 1 year in.

Great points on Swain and Green, both are going to be players. Sean had to piece together a lot very late in the offseason.

I am sure he evaluates his staff every year and if he feels there needs to be any changes, great, if not, also great. But acting like Miller hasn't lived up to his recruiting responsibilities at this point is just silly.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Listen, I am thrilled Sean is back and am as convinced as ever that he will elevate the program to new heights....but I also have that little twinge that reminds me that coaches who go back for a second stint at a school almost never find success in that second stint. I can't think of anyone who did better the second time around. Homer Drew at Valpo is about the most successful example I'm aware of. I think (hope?) Sean is a unique case, but I also worry a little when he's running us through what's shaping up to be our worst season in three decades.

Is there a list anywhere that shows those examples? I'd be curious to see it. Would be shocked if any had the level of success Miller had at their next school (or schools) before returning to the prior school. I could be wrong in assuming most of them flamed out. I know Miller didn't live up to AZ standards with being unsuccessful of reaching the Final 4 while there, but he had a ton of success both recruiting wise and on the court. This season was fucked from the moment Free and Hunter both went down, despite me trying to trick myself into that not being the case.

Edit: I know Matta is one example and he had even more success than Miller but his return was under different circumstances than Miller's in how greatly his health effected his ability to coach. Although Butler looks decent to start the year.

[GoMuskies]

Not sure I have a list. Actually, now that I think about it Mack Brown is actually having a pretty solid run at UNC. Not as good as the first time around, but still way better than Tar Heel fans are used to. It's probably more of a college football issue than a basketball one anyway (Bill Walsh, Bobby Petrino, Brady Hoke, Johnny Majors).

And Greg Schiano seems to be doing okay at Rutgers, too, as another example. Again, not as well as the first time, but pretty decent.

I probably just worry too much!

[bleedXblue]

He could? Never looked like X had a wealth of talent during Steele years. Maybe I’m wrong.

There’s a huge overreaction to Sean’s Ability to get talent. Boum was the main piece to make the offense go last year. To Xville point, we’d be fine if Hunter and Free were available.

Front court was never supposed to be an issue. The transfer guards would look a lot better with affective movement, space, etc. that those two would’ve provided. I don’t think they were recruited to carry the team. Their style sort of fits the scheme from last year, but with such poor frontcourt play the offense doesn’t run well at all. Swain and Green will be very good Xavier players. With Free/Hunter available no one would question the talent.

You cant be serious? Colby, Naji, Edmond, Tyrique, Macura, Blueitt etc. All on his watch and I am sure I'm missing some others worth mentioning

[bleedXblue]

You can’t fault Sean and staff with a recruiting blunder on the Euro bigs when those were last minute emergency fills to replace Hunter and Free. At that point, just about everyone had committed elsewhere.


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Ok fair enough....Ousmane was signed in April of last year?

[waggy]

I don’t think the issues are talent. The problems are the intangibles that make a team. Sure, that they aren’t Uber talented gets exposed because they’re not yet a team.

[Xville]

You cant be serious? Colby, Naji, Edmond, Tyrique, Macura, Blueitt etc. All on his watch and I am sure I'm missing some others worth mentioning

So outside of blueitt, those guys as freshmen were pretty meh. You could maybe see some flashes here and there but they needed to grow significantly. Green and swain are getting significant minutes (swain will probably be starting soon), ciani is getting minutes and showing flashes and you guys want to talk to me about miller having trouble recruiting? SMH.

[GoMuskies]

This team is going to be what it's going to be (not great, Bob). The test will be whether Miller can hold it all (at least the pieces he wants to hold) together for the next couple of years so that we get the benefit of these guys are upperclassmen. Building that way is trickier than ever.

[Xavier]

You cant be serious? Colby, Naji, Edmond, Tyrique, Macura, Blueitt etc. All on his watch and I am sure I'm missing some others worth mentioning

Oh you meant great as an assistant at recruiting? Way different. Is Colby the only one he has as a head coach? Can’t remember if Colby originally committed to Mack and stayed on or it was all Steele

[GoMuskies]

Zach Freemantle and Jack Nunge were nice pickups by the Tin man.

[bjf123]

Ok fair enough....Ousmane was signed in April of last year?

And he’s not one of the Euro bigs.


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[Masterofreality]

On reflection on last night's game.
Our Euros are not tough. They really are soft. I believe that is evident when you watch European Basketball at any level vs the US. I'm shocked about how fundamentally unsound they are too, from free throws to mistakes on defensive assignments, these guys are weak. Jerome & Free would make a BIG difference- even just in leadership and toughness. But it is ludicrous how bad those guys are. Gietas is the oldest but a total non factor. Lazar looks like a stumblebum out there and Ciani keeps making mental D mistakes and gets pushed around.
I don't know if there is a thing Sean can do about that.

The last thing is the shooting. Last year, Souley, Kunk, Colby, Jack could all shoot and stretch the defense. Add Zach into that at times.
This year the only guy I have confidence in when he throws one up there is Quincy. Dez keeps hoisting backboard balls and we have few stretch players.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Agree 1000%

Sean was supposed to ELEVATE recruiting.

Its clear he needs help and the guys on the staff now aren't getting it done

Steele could recruit...that is for sure.

Big misses cant continue to happen and whoever signed up a guy from Serbia and North Texas for IMMEDIATE contribution should be heavily scrutinized.

Nzeh and Ducharme cant get on the floor last night? Cmon.


WHOA! This board is getting too negative, we are losing perspective.

High expectations around a program like ours are great. That level of expectations built Cintas, got Miller to return to X and is, at least, partly responsible for a stable of young talent on this year's team.

We have a lot of new talent that hasn't yet meshed. Green and Swain are going to be great players. Our guard play, at times, has been pretty good. Dez is an average shooter (he's only a sophomore) and has been asked to lead this team. He's not ready for that. A previous poster made an important point about the Euros. Miller was forced to replace Hunter and Free late in the off season. He did what he could given his circumstances. I, for one, expected a higher caliber of play from our Bigs. But, if you think about it, being the best junior player in Latvia isn't nearly the equivalent of being even the best high school player in the Bronx.

Most of us began the season with a natural, recurring and completely understandable bias that caused us to think our talent was near the top of the B.E. Time to re-think that position. We have some good players. We have some young, inexperienced players. And, we have a team that until these first few games of the season had never played together and likely, had never felt the high expectations we put upon them.

I am going to dial back those expectations and try to enjoy watching them grow as the season progresses. That means I have no assumption this team will place anywhere other than the middle of the league. I am hopeful and somewhat confident we will witness steady improvement. Maybe we do something at MSG at season end. Perhaps we make the NIT.

Admittedly, six weeks ago I had a different outlook. But those expectations came from heart and today my head now tells me something else.

So, let's not collectively slit our wrists. Yeah, we are surprised, disappointed and in some cases stunned by results we didn't anticipate. I'll give Miller credit. He kind of warned us that we should focus our attention on following this team's improvement. I'm going to try and downshift and approach the remainder of the season with a different attitude.

We have a young, inexperienced team. That is now clear. So, let's see how they get tougher (in difficult games) and how they improve once conference play begins. Saturday could be a positive sign in that regard.

[bleedXblue]

So outside of blueitt, those guys as freshmen were pretty meh. You could maybe see some flashes here and there but they needed to grow significantly. Green and swain are getting significant minutes (swain will probably be starting soon), ciani is getting minutes and showing flashes and you guys want to talk to me about miller having trouble recruiting? SMH.

Transfers are a significant part of recruiting now. Probably equally as important as recruiting freshman.

[Xville]

Transfers are a significant part of recruiting now. Probably equally as important as recruiting freshman.

He had to get so many transfers because he whiffed on freshman classes which is why x is where it is today. Those transfers were all pretty mediocre until miller got a hold of them.

[bleedXblue]

Who are all the amazing transfers he got? I’ll say Nunge turned out to be a good surprise. People wanted to run hunter out of town until miller got a hold of him.

He had to get so many transfers because he whiffed on freshman classes which is why x is where it is today.

I'm saying transfers NOW are way more pivotal than they were even 2-3 years ago with the rules changing and NIL.

[Xville]

I'm saying transfers NOW are way more pivotal than they were even 2-3 years ago with the rules changing and NIL.

Fair. So, let’s see who miller gets without there being some surprise season ending before it begins injuries.

He got Boum, he got olivari and McKnight. Those guys would look pretty good with free and/or hunter in there.

X needs a game quickly. Last night sucked but questioning miller and x already on recruiting is ridiculous imo.

I really don’t know what some expect. This isn’t a big state school that miller comes into and starts grabbing mcds. To get to the level of recruiting like that of a nova, UConn, zags it’s going to take years of repeated success in the tourney. Not going to happen right away. This isn’t duke, Kansas or Kentucky or even a big state school where x has the pick of the litter. Let the cake bake and let him fill up the pipeline.

[bleedXblue]

Fair. So, let’s see who miller gets without there being some surprise season ending before it begins injuries.

He got Boum, he got olivari and McKnight. Those guys would look pretty good with free and/or hunter in there.

We had these guys pretty much locked up and on the roster as of April 2023:

Nzeh
Craft
Green
Swain
Ducharme
Free
Hunter
Dez
McKnight

9 guys. We knew Colby was gone and Nunge likely to not return. With Free hurt, you might even want to say the number was 8. KyKy was moving on and everyone knew that.

So, was it really that late to look at this roster and know we needed some significant help? Especially in the post.....Yes, we learned about Free and Hunter late in the summer or early fall. For sure hurt us. But, did we not have enough time to address the transfer portal much earlier than what is being depicted?

I could have some of the dates and timing wrong, but it appears we either didnt get busy in the portal soon enough OR we simply missed and couldn't get some of the guys we wanted and had to resort to plugging holes in Sept/Oct with the likes of Ciana, Lazar and Nemekisa (spelling?)

[bleedXblue]

Zach Freemantle and Jack Nunge were nice pickups by the Tin man.

Hankins was pretty damn good too

[waggy]

And none of these "great" players did shit until Miller got here.

[Xville]

We had these guys pretty much locked up and on the roster as of April 2023:

Nzeh
Craft
Green
Swain
Ducharme
Free
Hunter
Dez
McKnight

9 guys. We knew Colby was gone and Nunge likely to not return. With Free hurt, you might even want to say the number was 8. KyKy was moving on and everyone knew that.

So, was it really that late to look at this roster and know we needed some significant help? Especially in the post.....Yes, we learned about Free and Hunter late in the summer or early fall. For sure hurt us. But, did we not have enough time to address the transfer portal much earlier than what is being depicted?

I could have some of the dates and timing wrong, but it appears we either didnt get busy in the portal soon enough OR we simply missed and couldn't get some of the guys we wanted and had to resort to plugging holes in Sept/Oct with the likes of Ciana, Lazar and Nemekisa (spelling?)

You think with what we have now minus the euros and adding free/hunter that x needed significant help?? that team is at worst 7-2 right now

[JTG]

Concerning Free and Hunter, there's nothing in the portal to get in Aug or Sept to replace 2 Big East starters.

[drudy23]

Back to reality post:

When I say I'm worried about our talent pipeline, I'm not putting this blame on Sean. I say it as a forward-looking concern for landing our top targets on the recruiting trail and with top portal targets in the NIL era. Sean will navigate, but when players are looking at NIL, Xavier isn't their first thought. I will be more difficult at a place like X.

Free and Jerome were late scratches that put Sean in scramble mode. He did the best he could with the Euros, but based on the circumstances, we shouldn't expect them to be Dirk Nowitski. It's becoming evident that they aren't going to save this team, and honestly, I'd be surprised if all 3 stick around for 2-3 years. But who knows.

Green and Swain, and maybe even Ducharme are good pieces. I think both should get more minutes. Not concerned about their place at X. They will be solid contributors for their tenure at X.

We have one guy signed for next year who should be solid. One guy. We have no beef in the program. It's a glaring problem.

Boum was a savior last year and our best portal pick-up. Olivari is showing signs of being a strong piece. McKnight, while his numbers are decent, isn't what we expected and probably not a Big East caliber guard. Ousmane plays hard, but reminds me a bit of Travis Taylor. High motor, plays hard, but not a Big East caliber big man.

I'm not convinced our roster is capable of being in the top half of the Big East. I don't think the majority of our players are good enough to get us there. We need a super strong recruiting class and our portal guys have to have a bigger impact. We need to upgrade the talent on this roster.

If we're just banking on development for the next couple of years, I don't think we will see much difference in our place in the Big East. It's a big boy conference and we're not there.

As much as it pains me to say this, I think this is a multi-year rebuild where this staff is going to need to work their asses off to get us back to getting guys that will put us back in the top quarter of the league, because we're nowhere close right now.

[xukeith]

Back to reality post:

When I say I'm worried about our talent pipeline, I'm not putting this blame on Sean. I say it as a forward-looking concern for landing our top targets on the recruiting trail and with top portal targets.

Free and Jerome were late scratches that put Sean in scramble mode. He did the best he could with the Euros, but based on the circumstances, we shouldn't expect them to be Dirk Nowitski. It's becoming evident that they aren't going to save this team, and honestly, I'd be surprised if all 3 stick around for 2-3 years. But who knows.

Green and Swain, and maybe even Ducharme are good pieces. I think both should get more minutes. Not concerned about their place at X. They will be solid contributors for their tenure at X.

We have one guy signed for next year who should be solid. We have no beef in the program. It's a glaring problem.

Boum was a savior last year and our best portal pick-up. Olivari is showing signs of being a strong piece. McKnight, while his numbers are decent, isn't what we expected and probably not a Big East caliber guard. Ousmane plays hard, but reminds me a bit of Travis Taylor. High motor, plays hard, but not a Big East caliber big man.

I'm not convinced our roster is capable of being in the top half of the Big East. I don't think the majority of our players are good enough to get us there. We need a super strong recruiting class and our portal guys have to have a bigger impact. We need to upgrade the talent on this roster.

If we're just banking on development for the next couple of years, I don't think we will see much difference in our place in the Big East. It's a big boy conference and we're not there.

Most transfers who leave programs to higher basketball programs (CUSA--> BE or B12/B10) are good role players . Not likely will a transfer lead his new team in scoring.

I am still holding out hope that Lazar, Swain, and Claude will become leaders, and/or leading scorers.
The rest of the roster outside Olivari and Green , will not likely be great BE players (top 15 in conference) .

I was hoping Miller and coaches could be picky in recruiting transfers. McKnight is good ,solid, and needs a little more scoring each game night.
Abou, Ciani, and Gytis are average and ok in producing consistent rebounding but not dependable scoring options. (all less than 7 points per game.)

Biggest concern is this team's team defense. Miller swore up and down for a year that this 23/24 team will be much improved on defense.
So far? Mixed results.
Oakland, Washington and Deleware all likely will end the season in NET 130-100 range with a winning record(above 0.500)

I agree with some posters that X missed out on getting some top transfers and top 100 high school recruits.

X needs high schoolers in top 120-top 50 range each year. X needs top 10-15% transfers, not just role players.

X competes with some high major programs but is not significantly a winner of recruiting wars.

It is what it is. This year is likely leading X to a final position within 50-100. Less than ideal.

I don't think Miller should be getting a pass either on lack of development or improving play night in and night out. You can only blame inexperience for so long before no excuses exist on losing. In BE either you are a top 5/6 team each year or you are going to be very inconsistent.

[bleedXblue]

You think with what we have now minus the euros and adding free/hunter that x needed significant help?? that team is at worst 7-2 right now


We had two returning post players in Hunter and Free (who was injured and his future in question). Nzeh committed in April and he was signed knowing he was a project. That's it. Hell yeah we need some good depth and help in the post. That's exactly what I'm saying.

[drudy23]

We had two returning post players in Hunter and Free (who was injured and his future in question). Nzeh committed in April and he was signed knowing he was a project. That's it. Hell yeah we need some good depth and help in the post. That's exactly what I'm saying.

For sure. Post play, especially on the offensive side of the ball, is a huge concern.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Transfers are a significant part of recruiting now. Probably equally as important as recruiting freshman.

And Miller got arguably one of the best performing transfers in the country last year.

Again, I think Olivari and McKnight look a lot different today playing with Free and Hunter. We shall never know though.

[noteggs]

To Xville point, we’d be fine if Hunter and Free were available.

Front court was never supposed to be an issue. The transfer guards would look a lot better with affective movement, space, etc. that those two would’ve provided. I don’t think they were recruited to carry the team. Their style sort of fits the scheme from last year, but with such poor frontcourt play the offense doesn’t run well at all. Swain and Green will be very good Xavier players. With Free/Hunter available no one would question the talent.

Very good points. I would like to add Des is also forced into to a much bigger role without Hunter and free. Not only from the offense side, but he’s being asked to shutdown players on the defensive side. Des has been asked to guard players that Hunter would have.

[XUMIOH12]

We had two returning post players in Hunter and Free (who was injured and his future in question). Nzeh committed in April and he was signed knowing he was a project. That's it. Hell yeah we need some good depth and help in the post. That's exactly what I'm saying.

They went after some of the top bigs (and others) in the transfer portal. Whiffed, as those guys were looking for paydays, which Xavier is not up to par with.

[drudy23]

They went after some of the top bigs (and others) in the transfer portal. Whiffed, as those guys were looking for paydays, which Xavier is not up to par with.

My point exactly.

NIL is going to make this very hard with these transfers and wooing the big dawgs necessary to compete in the Big East.

[XUMIOH12]

On reflection on last night's game.
Our Euros are not tough. They really are soft. I believe that is evident when you watch European Basketball at any level vs the US. I'm shocked about how fundamentally unsound they are too, from free throws to mistakes on defensive assignments, these guys are weak. Jerome & Free would make a BIG difference- even just in leadership and toughness. But it is ludicrous how bad those guys are. Gietas is the oldest but a total non factor. Lazar looks like a stumblebum out there and Ciani keeps making mental D mistakes and gets pushed around.
I don't know if there is a thing Sean can do about that.

The last thing is the shooting. Last year, Souley, Kunk, Colby, Jack could all shoot and stretch the defense. Add Zach into that at times.
This year the only guy I have confidence in when he throws one up there is Quincy. Dez keeps hoisting backboard balls and we have few stretch players.

This is it. Shooting is the biggest problem. There are only 2 guys that can legitimately knock down 3s. It kills the spacing and nullifies some of the movement on offense.

It isn't the only problem, but it is the biggest one, and would cover up/buy time for improvement in the other areas.

[XUMIOH12]

My point exactly.

NIL is going to make this very hard with these transfers and wooing the big dawgs necessary to compete in the Big East.

Agree. The top level transfer guys all seem to look for the money, and they get it. Need to be willing to play that game to get the best (maybe they are willing to play the game and just don't have the cash, i don't know). Hard to get too many true immediate impact players otherwise. I don't know how many under the radar Souley Boum transfer types they can find each year.

[bleedXblue]

My point exactly.

NIL is going to make this very hard with these transfers and wooing the big dawgs necessary to compete in the Big East.

Isnt this why Fickell left UC?

[XUMIOH12]

Fair. So, let’s see who miller gets without there being some surprise season ending before it begins injuries.

He got Boum, he got olivari and McKnight. Those guys would look pretty good with free and/or hunter in there.

X needs a game quickly. Last night sucked but questioning miller and x already on recruiting is ridiculous imo.

I really don’t know what some expect. This isn’t a big state school that miller comes into and starts grabbing mcds. To get to the level of recruiting like that of a nova, UConn, zags it’s going to take years of repeated success in the tourney. Not going to happen right away. This isn’t duke, Kansas or Kentucky or even a big state school where x has the pick of the litter. Let the cake bake and let him fill up the pipeline.

I particularly agree with this part. This is a disadvantage for Xavier in recruiting. Not the same resources/campus/size that many recruits look for. Need to re-establish the culture and expectation/ability to win every year. 17-18 season and back is getting further away. The 4 steele years were a major step back in terms of winning (obviously lol).

Miller is 1 freshman class in, and a couple of those guys look pretty good. This year is (hopefully) an anomaly with only returning essentially 1 player. It's been a worst case scenario.

[drudy23]

Isnt this why Fickell left UC?

Wouldn't surprise me.

But at the same time, does Madison WI really have that much more disposable NIL cash than UC? I guess they do with that Big Ten football money.

We're in a tough spot with NIL in a basketball only league and not in a major market. We don't have pockets as deep, which rears it's ugly head every time we need to sign or re-up a coach. It takes yeoman's work to get us there.

[drudy23]

Isnt this why Fickell left UC?

Wouldn't surprise me.

But at the same time, does Madison WI really have that much more disposable NIL cash than UC? I guess they do with that Big Ten football money.

We're in a tough spot with NIL in a basketball only league and not in a major market. We don't have pockets as deep, which rears it's ugly head every time we need to sign or re-up a coach. It takes yeoman's work to get us there.

[MHettel]

I would say that having NIL money to bring in highly rated transfers is our SECOND biggest priority.

Number 1 will be having NIL money to keep our own guys that are worth a lot on the open market. It will be difficult to ask a player to stay out of loyalty while leaving money on the table

[GoMuskies]

If it truly comes to the point where Xavier can't compete because they don't have the NIL money, I won't really give a fuck honestly. I won't pay attention to any of it at that point and will have more free time. I can assure you I'll never give to an NIL collective. If I ever consider it, I'll come to my senses and just write a check to my own kids instead.

[UCGRAD4X]

I don’t think the issues are talent. The problems are the intangibles that make a team. Sure, that they aren’t Uber talented gets exposed because they’re not yet a team.

I think Stainbrook was our only player that was Uber talented.

[X-band '01]

He was also Uber huge until he got transformed by Xavier's conditioning program. He's the only player I can recall who's played at the Cintas Center both home and away; there was a night and day difference from his Western Michigan days and his Xavier days.

[Xville]

I would say that having NIL money to bring in highly rated transfers is our SECOND biggest priority.

Number 1 will be having NIL money to keep our own guys that are worth a lot on the open market. It will be difficult to ask a player to stay out of loyalty while leaving money on the table

I really don’t see number 1 ever really being an issue at x. Not saying we aren’t going to give some nil to returns, but the kind of money that a ku or uk or duke would offer. If they are that good, they will go to the NBA. I think it’s going to be extremely rare cases where we have a person good enough that someone like uk or Kansas or duke will want and them not being good enough for the nba. That’s rare like a hunter dickinson type.

[MHettel]

I really don’t see number 1 ever really being an issue at x. Not saying we aren’t going to give some nil to returns, but the kind of money that a ku or uk or duke would offer. If they are that good, they will go to the NBA. I think it’s going to be extremely rare cases where we have a person good enough that someone like uk or Kansas or duke will want and them not being good enough for the nba. That’s rare like a hunter dickinson type.

Not sure I agree. I think some of these guys will make more in NIL money than they would as a 2nd round NBA pick with no assurances of making a roster and no guaranteed money as a second round pick.

Take for instance Fremantle. Assume he wasn’t injured at the end of last year. He had a good season and had one more year of eligibility. You don’t think he couldn’t have commanded 300-500k in NIL money from somewhere? He not headed to the NBA, so that’s potentially the best way from him to monetize his Bball skills.

On a related note, counting on Free this year was a little foolish. He had a lingering foot issue that had already required 2 surgeries. Him being unavailable to play had to be among the range of possibilities, right?

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

If it truly comes to the point where Xavier can't compete because they don't have the NIL money, I won't really give a fuck honestly. I won't pay attention to any of it at that point and will have more free time. I can assure you I'll never give to an NIL collective. If I ever consider it, I'll come to my senses and just write a check to my own kids instead.

Completely with you on this. If college basketball devolves into that (and it seems headed in that direction) I'm out.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

BTW. Front page article in today's WSJ claims NCAA has made proposal to Division I colleges that would allow these schools to directly pay their athletes. Maybe this proposal, if accepted, would eliminate NIL, perhaps not. But it clearly is a shift in philosophy by the NCAA.

[Olsingledigit]

And the IRS will classify them as employees.

[bjf123]

If you’re going to pay them directly, why not have them sign a contract to stay at the school for so many years?


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[Xville]

Not sure I agree. I think some of these guys will make more in NIL money than they would as a 2nd round NBA pick with no assurances of making a roster and no guaranteed money as a second round pick.

Take for instance Fremantle. Assume he wasn’t injured at the end of last year. He had a good season and had one more year of eligibility. You don’t think he couldn’t have commanded 300-500k in NIL money from somewhere? He not headed to the NBA, so that’s potentially the best way from him to monetize his Bball skills.

On a related note, counting on Free this year was a little foolish. He had a lingering foot issue that had already required 2 surgeries. Him being unavailable to play had to be among the range of possibilities, right?

To answer the first question, free is a good player but in the same breath, I don’t think he is someone that commands that kind of money nor would the big guys want him. They have better players than him.

To answer the second, I agree because big guys and foots are always a problem once they hurt them in general, but I have no idea what was going on with him. Maybe he was all good in March and they thought he was good to go. I dunno.

[drudy23]

If you’re going to pay them directly, why not have them sign a contract to stay at the school for so many years?


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The contract can't require them to stay. This isn't communist China. They can, however, not be paid if they break the contract, which they won't care about because another school will just be giving them a new one. And do you really want to keep a kid that doesn't want to be there? That's no good either.

Not sure how this would work if they are paid (employee, contractor, stipend, etc) - a ton of legalities and legal cost considerations depending on how this would go.

I can't see how schools could afford this, especially as they are already providing free tuition. It would just provide an even wider gap between the haves and the have nots, and Xavier would probably struggle to keep up in this scenario.

[atljar]

The contract can't require them to stay. This isn't communist China. They can, however, not be paid if they break the contract, which they won't care about because another school will just be giving them a new one. And do you really want to keep a kid that doesn't want to be there? That's no good either.

Not sure how this would work if they are paid (employee, contractor, stipend, etc) - a ton of legalities and legal cost considerations depending on how this would go.

I can't see how schools could afford this, especially as they are already providing free tuition. It would just provide an even wider gap between the haves and the have nots, and Xavier would probably struggle to keep up in this scenario.

Can't require them to stay, but can definitely prevent them from accepting another contract within the ncaa confines. No different than any of the major pro leagues

[D-West & PO-Z]

If you’re going to pay them directly, why not have them sign a contract to stay at the school for so many years?


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Isn't that what they do for coaches? Doesn't make a difference if someone wants them bad enough and wants to pay the buyout.

[D-West & PO-Z]

To answer the first question, free is a good player but in the same breath, I don’t think he is someone that commands that kind of money nor would the big guys want him. They have better players than him.

To answer the second, I agree because big guys and foots are always a problem once they hurt them in general, but I have no idea what was going on with him. Maybe he was all good in March and they thought he was good to go. I dunno.

Yeah, we are what 3 years into NIL? Havent lost anyone to a bigger school/NIL yet. Not saying it couldn't happen but see Colby Jones, fringe 1st round guy chose the NBA route. Probably could have left X after soph year for somewhere else or chose somewhere else and not NBA. Neither happened.

[D-West & PO-Z]

BTW. Front page article in today's WSJ claims NCAA has made proposal to Division I colleges that would allow these schools to directly pay their athletes. Maybe this proposal, if accepted, would eliminate NIL, perhaps not. But it clearly is a shift in philosophy by the NCAA.

That would be worse for college athletics than NIL. Title IX would come into play where it doesn't currently with NIL.

Matt Jones from KSR thinks the NCAA is proposing this as a way for politicians to step in and make rules regarding NIL in college athletics. He doesn't think the NCAA actually wants this (which I agree with, it would be a complete 180 from decades worth of comments on the matter).

[GoMuskies]

So how do we use the momentum from the win over the hated Bearcats to save this seemingly doomed season? Winthrop is next, and they seem to be a pretty good team, honestly. Hopefully the guys have learned that they need to focus in on one game at a time and not take anyone lightly.

I'm not sure if Trey Green is just sick, or if he's essentially out of the rotation. Will be interesting to see how much he plays against Winthrop. Djokovic needs to play a lot better, and Gytis needs to toughen up a lot. And hopefully the transfers keep up their strong play from last night.

[bleedXblue]

So how do we use the momentum from the win over the hated Bearcats to save this seemingly doomed season? Winthrop is next, and they seem to be a pretty good team, honestly. Hopefully the guys have learned that they need to focus in on one game at a time and not take anyone lightly.

I'm not sure if Trey Green is just sick, or if he's essentially out of the rotation. Will be interesting to see how much he plays against Winthrop. Djokovic needs to play a lot better, and Gytis needs to toughen up a lot. And hopefully the transfers keep up their strong play from last night.

Sean said in his post game presser that he was going to shorten the bench some and that guys were going to have to earn "more" playing time in practice. He needs the bench to be productive when they play.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

So how do we use the momentum from the win over the hated Bearcats to save this seemingly doomed season? Winthrop is next, and they seem to be a pretty good team, honestly. Hopefully the guys have learned that they need to focus in on one game at a time and not take anyone lightly.

I'm not sure if Trey Green is just sick, or if he's essentially out of the rotation. Will be interesting to see how much he plays against Winthrop. Djokovic needs to play a lot better, and Gytis needs to toughen up a lot. And hopefully the transfers keep up their strong play from last night.

Didn't realize Green played so little until I checked the box score. I don't know how many minutes per game he has been averaging but the four he played last night might make one question his place in the rotation. I did notice, when he was out on the floor, how much smaller he was than the guys he was guarding. Perhaps potential defensive shortcomings contributed to his lack of playing time. But also, McKnight, Olivari and Claude played so well and the game was so tight, there wasn't much opportunity for Green.

That was a great game last night. For those that weren't there, the crowd, I think, gets the "W". I cannot imagine we would have won this game at U.C.

To your point, going forward, despite great guard play last night, we MUST get more from the Euros. Last night, the three logged 53 minutes total and collectively contributed seven boards and twelve points. Djokovic started, played nineteen minutes, grabbed one rebound and had two points. Not trying to be glass half empty guy, but that is pretty pitiful. We are not going to impact the Big East unless we get better production from our frontcourt.

[bjf123]

That was a great game last night. For those that weren't there, the crowd, I think, gets the "W". I cannot imagine we would have won this game at U.C.


Agreed. I’m usually kind of quiet, but even I was loud last night.


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[muskiefan82]

I remember a Xavier team, figuring things out at 10-9 until a beautiful moment when a guard decided enough was enough and led that team to victory over UC. That team then went on a tear...a RUN really. Perhaps history will repeat itself.

[Xville]

Wish that x had found a way to beat Washington. I think they are going to end up being a tourney team. They just beat Gonzaga to move to 6-3 and are probably a top 3-4 pac team.

In some good news, st Mary’s MAY have righted the ship. They just won at Colorado state to move to .500 . Hopefully, they are getting better, and the early season struggles are behind them.

[Xville]

Quincy is starting to become a favorite of mine. X needs that kind of swagger, and he seems to have a bit of that dog in him we have been searching for. He should be fun to watch during be conference play. Have a feeling he’s going to quiet some programs on the road.

[murray87]

The 85% from the line was so huge obviously. Keep it going boys!

[Xavier]

Losing both those bye games really hurts. Even losing just one, the outlook would be much different. I do see Sean’s vision and the best is yet to come this year. Outside the big 3, there won’t be one big East game I go into thinking it’s going to be a long shot to win. And I think we snag a couple from those top 3 teams. Still a lot to overcome, and I wouldn’t bet on X making the tournament, but my hope today is way higher than it was Saturday morning. The season still has some life to it.

[drudy23]

Losing both those bye games really hurts. Even losing just one, the outlook would be much different. I do see Sean’s vision and the best is yet to come this year. Outside the big 3, there won’t be one big East game I go into thinking it’s going to be a long shot to win. And I think we snag a couple from those top 3 teams. Still a lot to overcome, and I wouldn’t bet on X making the tournament, but my hope today is way higher than it was Saturday morning. The season still has some life to it.

I don't disagree, but it's inevitable we lose some home and road games to those outside the big 3 - also think we steal a couple from the big 3 as well.

[xudash]

Quincy is starting to become a favorite of mine. X needs that kind of swagger, and he seems to have a bit of that dog in him we have been searching for. He should be fun to watch during be conference play. Have a feeling he’s going to quiet some programs on the road.

Thinking the exact same thing. Thoroughly enjoyed it when he sank that one 3 then ran down the court to celebrate a little with the student section.

[waggy]

3 games in the next 8 days are a huge opportunity for the team to go into the holiday break on a nice little win streak and to start the BE season fast. Big week.

[Xville]

3 games in the next 8 days are a huge opportunity for the team to go into the holiday break on a nice little win streak and to start the BE season fast. Big week.

With the next 6-7 games after seton hall, it’s imperative that x wins these next three. 13 conference wins is doable but can’t lose to hall or St. John’s

[xukeith]

With the next 6-7 games after seton hall, it’s imperative that x wins these next three. 13 conference wins is doable but can’t lose to hall or St. John’s

BE wins
Georgetown 2
DePaul 2
Seton Hal 2
St. Johns 2
Butler 1
Providence 1
Villanova 1
Marquette 0
UConn 0
Creighton 1

X would have to steal a couple more BE wins from top 1/2 to get to 12 wins or sweep Providence and Butler to get top 12 wins.
X would also need BE Tourney wins(probably 2 to feel good selection Sunday

That would have X at final record of 20-14 which will be very difficult.

These 5 Non conference losses are like a anchor weighing X down.

[MHettel]

BE wins
Georgetown 2
DePaul 2
Seton Hal 2
St. Johns 2
Butler 1
Providence 1
Villanova 1
Marquette 0
UConn 0
Creighton 1

X would have to steal a couple more BE wins from top 1/2 to get to 12 wins or sweep Providence and Butler to get top 12 wins.
X would also need BE Tourney wins(probably 2 to feel good selection Sunday

That would have X at final record of 20-14 which will be very difficult.

These 5 Non conference losses are like a anchor weighing X down.

Bubble City!

I count 12 BE wins there. But only 1 against a certain tourney team. Maybe Nova gets in. Also maybe Providence or Butler, but not both (especially if we hope to get in).

We better be rooting for UC and SMU to finish near the top of thier conferences and be strong at-large candidates.

At this point, seeing how we've played so far (and the hole we dug for ourselves), I give us 20% chance of dancing.

[Xville]

I don’t think 12 is really even bubble. That’s 18-13. I guess if you get to the finals, maybe but that’s a tall task. I think x needs 13 to get into the conversation. no reason why x can’t beat Marquette and creighton at home. Neither one of them is UConn as They are beatable due to being highly reliant on outside shooting.

I see 13 wins for this x team if they continue to grow. Losing one buy game would have stunk but not been that big a deal. Losing two blows

[D-West & PO-Z]

We better be rooting for UC

Thank goodness this is an off year, bc if X making the tourney relied on my ability to root for sUCks, we'd be out every year.

Not. Gonna. Happen.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

I don’t think 12 is really even bubble. That’s 18-13. I guess if you get to the finals, maybe but that’s a tall task. I think x needs 13 to get into the conversation. no reason why x can’t beat Marquette and creighton at home. Neither one of them is UConn as They are beatable due to being highly reliant on outside shooting.

I see 13 wins for this x team if they continue to grow. Losing one buy game would have stunk but not been that big a deal. Losing two blows

Love the optimism but I am seeing a different Xavier team than you. I see no chance of us beating Marquette or Creighton or, for that matter, Nova. As I write this, the only conference foe I am confident we can sweep is Georgetown. Will we continue improving? Yes, I'm certain of that. But so will many of the other B.E. teams. There are a bunch of good coaches in the Big East. We will have to improve exponentially to get 13 wins.

We are highly reliant on three guys - Dez, Quincy and McKnight. Our front line is weak, inexperienced and foul prone. Love this team's potential but without a complete transformation from the team we have so far seen, we are a middling conference team this year. I don't see enough talent up front to warrant more optimism and that's not meant to be a put down of the Euros or Abou. But the players our guys are now facing are stronger, more athletic, more experienced and more confident than any they have previously played.

I hold out hope that Miller will work somewhat of a miracle here but that is, in my opinion, what it will take. I hope to be proven wrong by season end.

[paulxu]

I think this season's success hinges on whether the front line gets strong enough to compete; and since this is the first year for the Europeans, that's going to be tough.

In looking at the Oakland and Delaware games, both teams had 3 returners who played significant minutes and contributed points.
We had 4 pts of returning scoring in Claude. Yet we beat St Marys. Head scratching.

But, it's been entertaining so far, and that was my expectation...entertainment.

Let's go X :logo:

[Xavier]

It’s not a great argument, but Marquette just escaped St Thomas last night while Creighton lost at home by 20 to CSU (also a loss to central Michigan), to say X can’t compete with them is ridiculous. I thought X would be lucky to go 1-5 Vs top 3, but seeing those results gives me more hope. I actually think X can give Uconn a good game, too.

I think X needs to go 13-7 in the Big East to be on the bubble and a shot at the tournament. I still wouldn’t bet on it but the big East isn’t exactly good right now outside the top 3.

[waggy]

I think a number of players can play better, but the most potential for improvement is with Djokovic, and Green. There's some offensive potential there. Question is how many points are they gonna give up in the process.

[xukeith]

I think a number of players can play better, but the most potential for improvement is with Djokovic, and Green. There's some offensive potential there. Question is how many points are they gonna give up in the process.

More Swain please.

[American X]

Xavier lost to DePaul(!) last season, so I am not banking any wins, let alone sweeps, this season.

[Three Point Pete]

This has been a different season so far. I can't figure good teams like Nova and X with 3 head scratching losses. Maybe foretells things to come in conference play.

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[X-band '01]

Xavier lost to DePaul(!) last season, so I am not banking any wins, let alone sweeps, this season.

They damn near lost to DePaul twice last year.

[American X]

They damn near lost to DePaul twice last year.

...and beat the National Champions twice. I can live with that this year. That would probably earn a bid.

[drudy23]

Just looked on Broering's site - we have one commit next year and a grand total of zero interest after that.

Our top 2025 targets are cool on Xavier.

Where on earth are we going to get Big East caliber talent? Are we just going to rent Euros and non power school transfers?

Am I the only one concerned about our recruiting profile? We seem to have lost some of the juice in the recruiting landscape, no?

[waggy]

Just looked on Broering's site - we have one commit next year and a grand total of zero interest after that.

Our top 2025 targets are cool on Xavier.

Where on earth are we going to get Big East caliber talent? Are we just going to rent Euros and non power school transfers?

Am I the only one concerned about our recruiting profile? We seem to have lost some of the juice in the recruiting landscape, no?

X has a glut of players next year though with Free and Jerome returning.

Overall I'm good with the recruiting. Abou is a disappointment. I don't know if Sean can fix him.

[waggy]

And I will add that Sean's approach is all about development, so it's critical to keep the guys you do get young in the program to see the fruit of that development. Look at the leap Dez has made. Think how good he will be his senior year.

[drudy23]

And I will add that Sean's approach is all about development, so it's critical to keep the guys you do get young in the program to see the fruit of that development. Look at the leap Dez has made. Think how good he will be his senior year.

It can't be all about development. We need proven commodities to compete in the big leagues. This is a big boy conference.

And we've heard about the leap Des has made, not sure we've witnessed it yet. We're getting virtually nothing from the recruited freshman.

[waggy]

It can't be all about development. We need proven commodities to compete in the big leagues. This is a big boy conference.

And we've heard about the leap Des has made, not sure we've witnessed it yet. We're getting virtually nothing from the recruited freshman.

Are there any impact frosh in the BE?

And if you can't see the jump Dez has made I can't help you.

[Xville]

It can't be all about development. We need proven commodities to compete in the big leagues. This is a big boy conference.

And we've heard about the leap Des has made, not sure we've witnessed it yet. We're getting virtually nothing from the recruited freshman.

You haven’t noticed the leap des has made? Are you watching the games? He just had 21 and 12 and is averaging 15, 4, and 4. What are you talking about

[drudy23]

He's the best player on a bad team. Not so sure I'd say I've noticed a significant upgrade in his skill set, if I'm being honest. Seems pretty much the same player getting more shots. He still struggles to shoot. Of course he's scoring more, he leads the team in shot attempts and minutes. Also leads the team in TOs. Shooting 23% from 3 and 44% from the field. He's been....ok.

C'mon, you can't say you weren't expecting more? Be honest.

[waggy]

C'mon, you can't say you weren't expecting more? Be honest.

Honestly, no. I questioned whether he could step into this role at all based on last year. His improvement has been better than expected for me.

[Xville]

He's the best player on a bad team. Not so sure I'd say I've noticed a significant upgrade in his skill set, if I'm being honest. Seems pretty much the same player getting more shots. He still struggles to shoot. Of course he's scoring more, he leads the team in shot attempts and minutes. Also leads the team in TOs. Shooting 23% from 3 and 44% from the field. He's been....ok.

C'mon, you can't say you weren't expecting more? Be honest.

No I am satisfied with him. He’s not a finished product, but he’s a sophomore. He’s the least of our worries and I’m tired of people criticizing him for his one fault.

[Xuperman]

What I'm seeing is a guy struggling with the role that's been thrust upon him. It looked like he was up to the challenge early on, but things have gone south. He is in a significant shooting slump,....basically since the terrible numbers he put up in the UH game. Making only 5 of his last THIRTY 3's will be a huge mental hurdle to overcome, especially in a BEast gauntlet. It's going to be interesting to see if he can avoid getting mired in a "lack of confidence" situation.....one could argue he is already there.

[paulxu]

I wonder if the "new" recruiting universe is not so much trying to identify high school players to develop into college players, but rather:

1 - use NIL dollars to buy the best talent your resources allow
2 - let lower conferences develop and identify talent, and get them to transfer to your school after they've learned the game (an expansion on the earlier graduate year idea)

[drudy23]

No I am satisfied with him. He’s not a finished product, but he’s a sophomore. He’s the least of our worries and I’m tired of people criticizing him for his one fault.

No one is saying he's bad, but you have to admit, the improvement hasn't lived up to the hype of the improvement. He really hasn't gone out and won a game for us yet. His best games have been in losses. Oliveri has been that guy.

Perhaps it's too soon, but there were many people that told us he's taken a "significant leap" this year. Does anyone see that?

[drudy23]

I wonder if the "new" recruiting universe is not so much trying to identify high school players to develop into college players, but rather:

1 - use NIL dollars to buy the best talent your resources allow
2 - let lower conferences develop and identify talent, and get them to transfer to your school after they've learned the game (an expansion on the earlier graduate year idea)

Of course it is - at this point, it's probably 60/40 when thinking about transfers vs. recruits. Do we have the money to compete with that 60% against the top tier programs in the Big East? Hard to say for sure, but I'd venture to guess if we're on the low end of the coaching pay scale, we're also on the low end of the NIL scale.

No chance we can compete with a program in NYC for NIL dollars. It doesn't make it impossible, because we're better at everything else, but it makes it harder for sure.

[Xville]

I know nil wise we lost out on two players this past offseason kriisa who I personally had zero interest in, and Ike who would have been awesome.

The details of the nil and what the gap was I don’t know.

I’m not that concerned about the nil situation at x, yet.

[Xville]

No one is saying he's bad, but you have to admit, the improvement hasn't lived up to the hype of the improvement. He really hasn't gone out and won a game for us yet. His best games have been in losses. Oliveri has been that guy.

Perhaps it's too soon, but there were many people that told us he's taken a "significant leap" this year. Does anyone see that?

Considering he just had 21 and 12 last night and is averaging 16, 5 and 4 yeah I see that as a significant leap from last year. What would make you happy ? Averaging 25 and 10 from a guard?

Geezus.

[drudy23]

Considering he just had 21 and 12 last night and is averaging 16, 5 and 4 yeah I see that as a significant leap from last year. What would make you happy ? Averaging 25 and 10 from a guard?

Geezus.

You can't just look at increased scoring and say there's been a huge improvement, especially as his shots and minutes have exploded compared to last year. It hasn't translated to winning, and he hasn't shown up in our biggest games. What did those 21 points mean last night when we were consistently down double digits and had zero chance of ever winning that game?

It's like Adam Dunn having 40 home runs and 37 of them being solo shots.

Stats alone never tell the whole story.

[Xville]

You can't just look at increased scoring and say there's been a huge improvement, especially as his shots and minutes have exploded compared to last year. It hasn't translated to winning, and he hasn't shown up in our biggest games. What did those 21 points mean last night when we were consistently down double digits and had zero chance of ever winning that game?

It's like Adam Dunn having 40 home runs and 37 of them being solo shots.

Stats alone never tell the whole story.

They meant if he wasn’t there we’d have lost by 40. Claude is a hell of a player. If you want to continue to disparage the kid, then go ahead. I’ll go with miller on this one who said how much he has developed from last year over a message board poster.

You are right in that scoring is not the only thing. He’s also the teams best on ball defender, and best rebounder from a guard spot.

The “it hasn’t translated to winning” well no shit. Have you seen our inside game? Not his fault.

[Xville]

I’ll also say last night was bad but I’m not ready to jump off the ledge. I want to see how x responds at home against a team that has beat a decent Missouri team and the national champions back to back. If it looks ugly, then I’ll be ready to sound the alarms. Otherwise, it was just a loss to a road team that happens to be coached by arguably the best ever.

[drudy23]

They meant if he wasn’t there we’d have lost by 40. Claude is a hell of a player. If you want to continue to disparage the kid, then go ahead. I’ll go with miller on this one who said how much he has developed from last year over a message board poster.

You are right in that scoring is not the only thing. He’s also the teams best on ball defender, and best rebounder from a guard spot.

The “it hasn’t translated to winning” well no shit. Have you seen our inside game? Not his fault.

I'm not disparaging anything. Just not so sure we've seen this completely different player we were told we were going to see. He was good last year. He's still good this year. But a drastic improvement? I wouldn't put it in the drastic category.

I will take a look at what the stats look like comparing more minutes and shots.

[GoMuskies]

Ready to sound the alarm?!? We're 6-6 with losses to every decent team we've played plus Oakland and Delaware. The alarm has been going off for a while now.

[Xville]

Ready to sound the alarm?!? We're 6-6 with losses to every decent team we've played plus Oakland and Delaware. The alarm has been going off for a while now.

They looked pretty good against uc and Winthrop ( I know Winthrop isn’t good and uc probably isn’t either) so I thought they were starting to turn a corner. Will see Saturday if that’s the case or if the St. John’s team is who the team is.

I don’t have expectations of March anymore which sucks but I do want to see continued improvement especially from the young guys. That sounding of the alarm I’m referring to is to not see that continued improvement. I want to be confident that the program has a solid core that can grow and develop.

[muskiefan82]

This is the penance we must pay for that banner in the next 5 years

[Xville]

I'm not disparaging anything. Just not so sure we've seen this completely different player we were told we were going to see. He was good last year. He's still good this year. But a drastic improvement? I wouldn't put it in the drastic category.

I will take a look at what the stats look like comparing more minutes and shots.

Shooting/scoring is one aspect of the game. There are others as I previously stated.

[drudy23]

Shooting/scoring is one aspect of the game. There are others as I previously stated.

You've also said you see this team as a 13 win conference team. Pretty sure you were the only one that saw that.

I think you're HOPING for alot of things, but the reality on the court doesn't back up your arguments.

You're HOPING Lazar will be a serviceable Big East big man, but nothing so far has given evidence of that. At least not in my opinion.

I have that same hope, but I have to balance that vs. what my eyes are seeing. I will admit, I'm on the negative side on this one. Hope I'm wrong.

[Xville]

You've also said you see this team as a 13 win conference team. Pretty sure you were the only one that saw that.

I think you're HOPING for alot of things, but the reality on the court doesn't back up your arguments.

You're HOPING Lazar will be a serviceable Big East big man, but nothing so far has given evidence of that. At least not in my opinion.

I have that same hope, but I have to balance that vs. what my eyes are seeing. I will admit, I'm on the negative side on this one. Hope I'm wrong.

Where did I say lazar will be a serviceable big East big man this year? I said he could develop into a stretch 4 like a free. Right now, he’s a freshman.


If the team continues to develop we shall see what the record is at the end of the year. IMO the future is encouraging because of x playing so many freshmen this year and development will be quicker. Instead, we have threads questioning just about everything with the team and miller.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Lots of angst today after last night's drubbing. Understandable given our on-going expectations for this program. But this, I think, is a true statement.......

I'll say the same thing I saw written about SJU in last night's game thread. "We just aren't that good."

I think our guard play is Big East quality. While Dez, in my opinion, is not a top five talent in this league, he is pretty good. He's our best player and he showed it last night. Olivari, after a fitful start, belongs as does McKnight. I had initial hopes that McKnight would be our version of Tyler Kolek and while that hasn't yet played out, I still see upside.

Our front line has been dreadful. The Euros have disappointed and Abou, although he was considered a coveted catch from the portal, does not seem to belong in the Big East. I saw a comment in the SJU game thread that criticized Miller for this roster. While I agree, the head coach is always ultimately responsible for whatever occurs with this team, there were some extenuating circumstances that affected this team's roster construction. We would be a different team with Free and Hunter. Maybe not top of the league but certainly better than what we have seen.

I see Miller's biggest challenge as holding this team together, squeezing out improvement as the season goes on, keeping the team and fan base from quitting on each other and maybe, if we are lucky, getting us into the NIT. We just don't have the players to make the Big Dance this year.

I'm hopeful, we can start to see more potential from Sasa (who badly needs to hit the weight room) and Dojkovic. That doesn't seem unreasonable given their resumes and the fact they are first year players. I don't think it is an understatement that these guys need to work out for us in order for Miller to be able to continue recruiting well overseas.

And that brings me to a comment made by Drudy, I think, about the lack of recruiting activity for next year. We have only one (certain) open scholarship next year, right? Its a safe assumption that some players will leave but we better hope it isn't any of the guys who are getting minutes. If that occurs, I'll be alarmed for the future. We need the guys on the floor to improve and they need to see improvement in their own performance and in this team in order to take a big step forward next year.

This isn't our year. That's it. We still have a great coach and so I remain optimistic about the future.

[drudy23]

Lots of angst today after last night's drubbing. Understandable given our on-going expectations for this program. But this, I think, is a true statement.......

I'll say the same thing I saw written about SJU in last night's game thread. "We just aren't that good."

I think our guard play is Big East quality. While Dez, in my opinion, is not a top five talent in this league, he is pretty good. He's our best player and he showed it last night. Olivari, after a fitful start, belongs as does McKnight. I had initial hopes that McKnight would be our version of Tyler Kolek and while that hasn't yet played out, I still see upside.

Our front line has been dreadful. The Euros have disappointed and Abou, although he was considered a coveted catch from the portal, does not seem to belong in the Big East. I saw a comment in the SJU game thread that criticized Miller for this roster. While I agree, the head coach is always ultimately responsible for whatever occurs with this team, there were some extenuating circumstances that affected this team's roster construction. We would be a different team with Free and Hunter. Maybe not top of the league but certainly better than what we have seen.

I see Miller's biggest challenge as holding this team together, squeezing out improvement as the season goes on, keeping the team and fan base from quitting on each other and maybe, if we are lucky, getting us into the NIT. We just don't have the players to make the Big Dance this year.

I'm hopeful, we can start to see more potential from Sasa (who badly needs to hit the weight room) and Dojkovic. That doesn't seem unreasonable given their resumes and the fact they are first year players. I don't think it is an understatement that these guys need to work out for us in order for Miller to be able to continue recruiting well overseas.

And that brings me to a comment made by Drudy, I think, about the lack of recruiting activity for next year. We have only one (certain) open scholarship next year, right? Its a safe assumption that some players will leave but we better hope it isn't any of the guys who are getting minutes. If that occurs, I'll be alarmed for the future. We need the guys on the floor to improve and they need to see improvement in their own performance and in this team in order to take a big step forward next year.

This isn't our year. That's it. We still have a great coach and so I remain optimistic about the future.

Agree.

While I've been hard on Claude, he's a critical piece to the puzzle. I'm guessing his coach is hard on him too because he's probably the most vital chess piece. Expectations should be sky-high for him. McKnight I thought would give us more. His numbers are decent, but outside of the UC game, it doesn't seem impactful. Olivari is gone, and that will be a huge loss without an offensive leader to be able to get 20-30 on any given night.

The bigs, ever since Tyrique left, have been a huge hole. I'm not talking about the finesse bigs like Nunge and Freemantle, I'm talking about the dirty work guys that get it done in this conference. We see many of them during the conference season, and most of them eat our lunch.

[Xuperman]

Viewing this team, roster and season results has possible long lasting ramifications. This is not representative of 40 years of Xavier excellence.

This year is NIT at best,. Make no mistake....the roster talent is in jeopardy for next year also.

[drudy23]

Viewing this team, roster and season results has possible long lasting ramifications. This is not representative of 40 years of Xavier excellence.

This year is NIT at best,. Make no mistake....the roster talent is in jeopardy for next year also.

The NIT is stupid. Who cares about the NIT.

[XUBison]

Butler just beat Marquette. We are worse than Butler. Who would have thought that possible this time last year?

[Xville]

Viewing this team, roster and season results has possible long lasting ramifications. This is not representative of 40 years of Xavier excellence.

This year is NIT at best,. Make no mistake....the roster talent is in jeopardy for next year also.

All you have to do is take a look at butler this year and realize how dumb most of this post is.

[Three Point Pete]

Butler, if they beat Hall at home, has a pretty easy path to the top by February.

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[Xuperman]

All you have to do is take a look at butler this year and realize how dumb most of this post is.

Pay attention kids.....this is how a master TROLL slides one in.

[drudy23]

When is the last time we've been under .500 at this point in a season?

MAYBE first year in the A10? Other than that, early 80's?

[Xuperman]

The NIT is stupid. Who cares about the NIT.

IDK...if X is in the only NIT conversation going forward, will this site implode?

[drudy23]

IDK...if X is in the only NIT conversation going forward, will this site implode?

For this year, no. But no one will care if we get there.

If NIT talk becomes consistent over the next few years, yes, this site will implode, and it should.

NIT...GTFOH.

[Xville]

Pay attention kids.....this is how a master TROLL slides one in.

I’m not the one making stupid sky is falling posts based off a year where x returned one player, and btw has at least 17 games left

[Xuperman]

You even know what a troll is? It’s pretty clear by your posts you don’t

You. You are the epitome of a classic TROLL.


Why do you have to be so contentious? Why does everything you write have an “edge” to it? You come across as an angry, argumentative, captious individual who is always looking to start a fight. I asked a simple question, how many times have you seen young Waleskowski play that would in turn justify your position. I’ve never seen him play and only mentioned him because his name was in today’s paper and I know the Donovan family. I know nothing about his game and my comment about playing for X was tongue in cheek given this board’s history with his father. Maybe try decaf for awhile.

"TROLL". Someone that is intentionally irritating to draw a contentious response.

But not only that, you have a LONG history here of being a pompous ass, self proclaimed, know it all.

[Xuperman]

Man,
Those 3 lines and back up testimony from Final4, labels you nicely. You are the king TROLL here. You are in "LOU" territory.

I wonder if any other posters will dare come to your defense?

[XUBison]

Man,
Those 3 lines and back up testimony from Final4, labels you nicely. You are the king TROLL here. You are in "LOU" territory.

I wonder if any other posters will dare come to your defense?

XUp v ville — I knew this board had been missing something this year.

[Xuperman]

XUp v ville — I knew this board had been missing something this year.

Who is going to be the 1st to back up Ville?

C'mon....X is not winning, so why not give this "Hall of Famer" some credence in the mean time?

[Xuperman]

[QUOTE=Xville;773495]Does it matter? I’ve seen plenty of high d 1 talent at the high school level and he’s not it./QUOTE]

See how 'Ville throws shade.....as some sort of keyboard "talent scout"? He has continuously crafted and embellished himself here as some sort of elite cerebral individual (see other threads), however his M.O. is always TROLLish in nature.

Is there anyone here that enjoys/supports XVille and his "shitck"?

Anybody likey?

[Xville]

[QUOTE=Xville;773495]Does it matter? I’ve seen plenty of high d 1 talent at the high school level and he’s not it./QUOTE]

See how 'Ville throws shade.....as some sort of keyboard "talent scout"? He has continuously crafted and embellished himself here as some sort of elite cerebral individual (see other threads), however his M.O. is always TROLLish in nature.

Is there anyone here that enjoys/supports XVille and his "shitck"?

Anybody likey?

You posted for another hour about me. Obsessed? Seek help.

And yes I do know that being in Steele’s corner for four years, being obsessed with Paul McMillan (and still believing he’s high d1) and making sky is falling posts based on half a year with miller at the helm is stupid. Sorry that offends you to the point of calling me a troll.

[xukeith]

To get back to the top half og BE standings in near and future, X needs to raise the talent level from incoming recruits. I don't know how but Villanova, and UConn and Marquette have talent advantages and better options offensively

[Xville]

To get back to the top half og BE standings in near and future, X needs to raise the talent level from incoming recruits. I don't know how but Villanova, and UConn and Marquette have talent advantages and better options offensively

A few things:

X could be top 3 in the BE next year. Get a shooter or 2 and it's a top 15 team.

Not hard to understand how UCONN and Nova are where they are--they are modern day bluebloods, and frankly jury is out on Neptune imo. We will see what they look like once Dixon and Moore are gone. If you look at their recruiting for next year it is ok, not great.

UCONN is a different story. They are arguably the best program in modern day college basketball (1985 on).

[xuwillie]

A few things:

X could be top 3 in the BE next year. Get a shooter or 2 and it's a top 15 team.

Not hard to understand how UCONN and Nova are where they are--they are modern day bluebloods, and frankly jury is out on Neptune imo. We will see what they look like once Dixon and Moore are gone. If you look at their recruiting for next year it is ok, not great.

UCONN is a different story. They are arguably the best program in modern day college basketball (1985 on).

Like your optimism but think we are closer to bottom half than top next year unless Miller brings in some real studs that can shoot. We have one three point threat right now and to be top 3 you need several. We are getting good average big east players right now but not great.

[Xville]

Like your optimism but think we are closer to bottom half than top next year unless Miller brings in some real studs that can shoot. We have one three point threat right now and to be top 3 you need several. We are getting good average big east players right now but not great.

Yeah, completely understand and I agree that X needs offensive playmakers/shooters. I think Miller gets at least one shooter in the portal, if not two. I don't see a reason to think otherwise.

My thoughts are also dependent of course on if Jerome and Free come back but as of today, that's the plan according to Miller. Having both of those guys will really open up Claude's game and allow him to do what he does.

[GoMuskies]

It would be nice if Craft or Ducharme had turned out more like Karaban. Think that's the player we were going for with those two pickups. Doesn't look like it's going to happen for either of them.

[JTG]

To get back to the top half og BE standings in near and future, X needs to raise the talent level from incoming recruits. I don't know how but Villanova, and UConn and Marquette have talent advantages and better options offensively

It's easy, they all 3 have better history and National Championships to point to.

[Xville]

It would be nice if Craft or Ducharme had turned out more like Karaban. Think that's the player we were going for with those two pickups. Doesn't look like it's going to happen for either of them.

Really goes to show how much of a crapshoot it can be in that 50-150 ranked range. Craft and Ducharme still have a bit of time but clock is really ticking.

Djokovic has the potential I think.

[GoMuskies]

It's easy, they all 3 have better history and National Championships to point to.

Marquette's better history is ancient history. It's like saying UC and Dayton have better history.

[JTG]

I believe Free back next year when I see it. I'm not sure his foot will ever be right. Hunter I think will be back, which will give us a stopper. But we need shooters, pure no conscience shooters.

[GoMuskies]

Really goes to show how much of a crapshoot it can be in that 50-150 ranked range. Craft and Ducharme still have a bit of time but clock is really ticking.

Djokovic has the potential I think.

Really confused on Ducharme, honestly. Craft is apparently still recovering from injury, and I suspect he and everyone else in the program are already planning for an amiable breakup after the season. But Ducharme is apparently healthy on a bad team that desperately needs shooting help. I understand that freshmen generally need time to develop, but if he's nailed to the bench on THIS team, how much better does he need to get to contribute to a good team?

[A Fan]

Like your optimism but think we are closer to bottom half than top next year unless Miller brings in some real studs that can shoot. We have one three point threat right now and to be top 3 you need several. We are getting good average big east players right now but not great.
We are now 8 out of 11 in the Big East. 1and 3. Assuming we beat DePaul and Georgetown twice..we are at 5 wins. Tell me how we get to 10.

[JTG]

Marquette's better history is ancient history. It's like saying UC and Dayton have better history.

Did you forget D Wade 's FF run? Look I bleed Xavier blue, just like everyone else here. But Marquette is a bigger name than X, it just is.

[GoMuskies]

I guess Butler has great history, too, that makes it hard for Xavier to climb over them. Butler has far better history than Marquette since about 1980.

[xuwillie]

I believe Free back next year when I see it. I'm not sure his foot will ever be right. Hunter I think will be back, which will give us a stopper. But we need shooters, pure no conscience shooters.

Agree on hunter and Free, over under on 1 coming back and I could see the under happening. It would be nice if miller could find some shooters that will be around longer than a year. Haven’t given up on Craft, not following him much is he out for the year? Really could have used another shooter to rest Dez. Man He’s really struggling right now, not going to win many big east games to way he’s playing

[drudy23]

We are now 8 out of 11 in the Big East. 1and 3. Assuming we beat DePaul and Georgetown twice..we are at 5 wins. Tell me how we get to 10.

Not sure I'd make that assumption. In fact, I'd bet against us going 4-0 against them, unfortunately.

[GoMuskies]

Not sure I'd make that assumption. In fact, I'd bet against us going 4-0 against them, unfortunately.

I agree. I still think we'll steal a surprise win or two along the way, though. This one at Providence would be a nice place to start. Almost feels must-win at this point to keep any hope alive.

[Xville]

We are now 8 out of 11 in the Big East. 1and 3. Assuming we beat DePaul and Georgetown twice..we are at 5 wins. Tell me how we get to 10.

So, UConn is the best team in the Big East right? I say that even without Clingan. In other words, that's the toughest it's going to get at home and x was right there.

8 more games at home, 8 on the road. I wouldn't say anything is guaranteed but for the sake of argument, Let's say X loses two more at home(most likely Creighton and Marquette), and loses at Creighton, UConn and Marquette. Can they go 9-2 with hypothetically this remaining:

Depaul twice
Gtown twice
Providence Home and away
Villanova Home
Hall away
Butler Home and away
St. Johns Home

[Xville]

I agree. I still think we'll steal a surprise win or two along the way, though. This one at Providence would be a nice place to start. Almost feels must-win at this point to keep any hope alive.

I think if somehow X can tread water over the next three weeks and be 10-10 thru 20 games, then X has the potential to go on a real run and do what I think they are capable of. If they don't then the focus turns to just seeing continued improvement and that's it from me.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Agree on hunter and Free, over under on 1 coming back and I could see the under happening. It would be nice if miller could find some shooters that will be around longer than a year. Haven’t given up on Craft, not following him much is he out for the year? Really could have used another shooter to rest Dez. Man He’s really struggling right now, not going to win many big east games to way he’s playing

Listened to Miler's radio show this week and he fielded a question about next year's roster. His response was interesting.

First, he was pretty definitive that Hunter and Free will be healthy and are returning. I took note of that because I have been of the opinion that Free will likely not be back. Miller said that Free's recent surgery was more successful than previous surgeries and that Free will return.

He also talked about Craft and seemed to nuance a bit. He reiterated what he had previously said that Craft fell behind others for playing time as a result of his injury. But he didn't make the same definitive comment about Craft returning next year. I was waiting for him, but he didn't say it.

Miller also pointed out the young man coming in next year (from Centerville) and noted that he is a good outside shooter. Then, he made one of the most interesting comments of the show. He talked about going out into the portal in the spring to bring in a couple of players----at least that's what I think I heard. Miller didn't say specifically (as I remember) what skills were needed, just that he would be looking in the portal. I had the pre-game show on for the Michigan - UW game. I was listening to both Miller and to the football commentary and my wife was jabbering at me too. So, I wasn't totally focused on what Miller said. But that's what I think I heard.

What is interesting about his comment, if I heard it correctly, is that in order to bring players on via the portal, current players have to leave. So, if Miller knows he is going to the portal for two players, he must know two players are leaving. Quincy is out of eligibility next year but his scholarship has been awarded to the recruit from Centerville.

Wondering if anyone else heard what I think I heard.

[bleedXblue]

Agree on hunter and Free, over under on 1 coming back and I could see the under happening. It would be nice if miller could find some shooters that will be around longer than a year. Haven’t given up on Craft, not following him much is he out for the year? Really could have used another shooter to rest Dez. Man He’s really struggling right now, not going to win many big east games to way he’s playing

This Free situation.....and to a lesser degree Hunter is really not great for X. Sure, I think we all want both healthy for the entire season next year. But how confident is anyone that Free is going to give us that? Really impacts our ability to recruit a top transfer at that spot when they know Free's slated for a lot of minutes there. Hunter as well. Not a great spot for X and hopefully some of of it works itself out in the next 3-4 months. We'll see.

[Xville]

When is the last time we've been under .500 at this point in a season?

MAYBE first year in the A10? Other than that, early 80's?

How soon we forget...I know I have tried lol. However, Steele's first year X was 11-13 at one point.

[Xville]

Listened to Miler's radio show this week and he fielded a question about next year's roster. His response was interesting.

First, he was pretty definitive that Hunter and Free will be healthy and are returning. I took note of that because I have been of the opinion that Free will likely not be back. Miller said that Free's recent surgery was more successful than previous surgeries and that Free will return.

He also talked about Craft and seemed to nuance a bit. He reiterated what he had previously said that Craft fell behind others for playing time as a result of his injury. But he didn't make the same definitive comment about Craft returning next year. I was waiting for him, but he didn't say it.

Miller also pointed out the young man coming in next year (from Centerville) and noted that he is a good outside shooter. Then, he made one of the most interesting comments of the show. He talked about going out into the portal in the spring to bring in a couple of players----at least that's what I think I heard. Miller didn't say specifically (as I remember) what skills were needed, just that he would be looking in the portal. I had the pre-game show on for the Michigan - UW game. I was listening to both Miller and to the football commentary and my wife was jabbering at me too. So, I wasn't totally focused on what Miller said. But that's what I think I heard.

What is interesting about his comment, if I heard it correctly, is that in order to bring players on via the portal, current players have to leave. So, if Miller knows he is going to the portal for two players, he must know two players are leaving. Quincy is out of eligibility next year but his scholarship has been awarded to the recruit from Centerville.

Wondering if anyone else heard what I think I heard.

Thank you for the insight and regarding Hunter/Free that's what I have heard from Miller numerous times both in the radio shows and the podcast. Of course things can change, but I feel both are back.

In regards to the portal, I'd think out of Nzeh, Ducharme, Craft two of those guys at least won't be back. No inside information, but reading the tea leaves it makes a lot of sense.

[XUGRAD80]

Thank you for the insight and regarding Hunter/Free that's what I have heard from Miller numerous times both in the radio shows and the podcast. Of course things can change, but I feel both are back.

In regards to the portal, I'd think out of Nzeh, Ducharme, Craft two of those guys at least won't be back. No inside information, but reading the tea leaves it makes a lot of sense.

I agree on Ducharme and Craft, not so sure on Nzeh. I think it was well understood that he had a ways to go and shouldn’t expect to play right away. It also wouldn't surprise me if one (or more) of the European players decided to return home and play professionally somewhere in Europe, especially if Free and Hunter return.

[xuwillie]

I know this will come off harsh but is anyone else concerned going into year 3 for Miller and we are still counting on two guys Steele brought in?

[GoMuskies]

No. Steele's probablem wasn't really the guys he brought it. It was properly utilizing and developing them. It's a credit to Miller that he was able to keep the good Steele recruits (and make them better). Miller has brought in plenty of contributors of his own. That team last year would not have been very good without Boum.

[xuwillie]

No. Steele's probablem wasn't really the guys he brought it. It was properly utilizing and developing them. It's a credit to Miller that he was able to keep the good Steele recruits (and make them better). Miller has brought in plenty of contributors of his own. That team last year would not have been very good without Boum.

Yes good contributors and really like how Hunter turned his game around but was hoping by year 3 we would have brought in some real game changers down low.

[drudy23]

Yes good contributors and really like how Hunter turned his game around but was hoping by year 3 we would have brought in some real game changers down low.

Yep.

Where's our next Trevon? JP? DWest? Even a guy like Freemantle who is very good on the offensive end.

Not sure we have anyone at that caliber currently. You knew very early on those guys were going to be special.

[Three Point Pete]

Did Craft take a redshirt year?

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[bleedXblue]

I think everyone assumed (and I know I did) that Miller was going to be able to recruit at a higher level than any previous Xavier coach. It's obviously early and his first full class was pretty good. Next year and the year after are going to be very, very important if we want to be competing for Big East Championships. I'm confident he will get us there.......we need to see an assistant emerge on his staff and start picking some big guys up.

[bleedXblue]

Did Craft take a redshirt year?

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Yes