What isn’t wrong with Louisville?

[IM4X]

It just keeps getting worse. Third straight losses and this last one kind of tells you just how bad it is.




https://mobile.twitter.com/jeffgreer/status/1482486763872473088?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5 Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1482486763872473088%7Ctwgr% 5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.espn.com%2Fmens-college-basketball%2Fstory%2F_%2Fid%2F33085916%2Fgonzaga-reclaims-no-1-ranking-men-basketball-top-25-poll-baylor-falls-no-5

[GoMuskies]

Their worst stretch in 60 years.

https://twitter.com/RealCardGame/status/1482486715030061057?s=20

[D-West & PO-Z]

Hate. To. See. It.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Quote from a thread identified as "Mack is Failing" from Louisville Men's Basketball Fan Forum............

"I never want to jump on the negative bandwagon but I have never liked Mack after his first year here. Prickly and insecure is totally cool if you have some substance."

[xukeith]

I usually do not feel sorry for any d1 coaches but this is sad. Mack came out and said,
" I can't figure out how to motivate these players!"
He looks completely powerless, hopeless, clueless. How does any d 1basketball coach NOT know how to motivate players. Maybe some assistant coaches dropped the ball or recruiting blew up in his face.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I usually do not feel sorry for any d1 coaches but this is sad. Mack came out and said,
" I can't figure out how to motivate these players!"
He looks completely powerless, hopeless, clueless. How does any d 1basketball coach NOT know how to motivate players. Maybe some assistant coaches dropped the ball or recruiting blew up in his face.

He sounds totally defeated in post game pressers. He is saying many things that you typically only hear from coaches who are going to be on their way out.

[drudy23]

And the bags under his eyes look like he's been on a 2 month bender.

[xukeith]

I wonder in the ACC where probably 6-8 teams are struggling how their fan bases are.
Virginia is a good school (won a national championship). They are losing way too much for a top program.
Notre Dame hasn't had a good year in maybe 5 years.
VTech 7 losses.
Syracuse 9 losses.
Florida St has the longest team in nation (inches tall) and they have 5 losses. It looks like each team except UNC and Duke have blown up.

Maybe this is proof football schools damage the basketball programs.

[xudash]

And the bags under his eyes look like he's been on a 2 month bender.

I'm not a sadist, but, well, karma is a bitch.

The more I think about all this, the more I am so pleased to have Travis in the first chair, because of his personality - - and all this assumes that he is continuing to track towards becoming a solid D1 coach that could be our keeper for years to come.

[IM4X]

I usually do not feel sorry for any d1 coaches but this is sad. Mack came out and said,
" I can't figure out how to motivate these players!"
He looks completely powerless, hopeless, clueless. How does any d 1basketball coach NOT know how to motivate players. Maybe some assistant coaches dropped the ball or recruiting blew up in his face.

He made a similar comment one year when he had a rough stretch at X. He really doesn’t like taking ownership when things go poorly. It always going to be the players or the assistants or some other person or thing that must be responsible for his failures.

[xu82]

I'm not a sadist, but, well, karma is a bitch.

The more I think about all this, the more I am so pleased to have Travis in the first chair, because of his personality - - and all this assumes that he is continuing to track towards becoming a solid D1 coach that could be our keeper for years to come.

There’s more to life than money, but he went for the big contract like so many before him.

I am hopeful that Travis is growing into the job. Not perfect, but who is? Just keep making progress. I bet the Browns wish they had been more patient with Belichick.

[GoMuskies]

There’s more to life than money, but he went for the big contract like so many before him.


In fairness, I don't think it was JUST money in this case. This was a chance to make the wife happy and move to a higher-prestige program with a bigger fanbase in a city he would mostly own.

Unfortunately for him and Kristi, he blew it. Davenport might let him have Bellarmine, but otherwise he has to uproot the family from the dream and most limely move them somewhere that is neither his nor her hometown.

[drudy23]

In fairness, I don't think it was JUST money in this case. This was a chance to make the wife happy and move to a higher-prestige program with a bigger fanbase in a city he would mostly own.

Unfortunately for him and Kristi, he blew it. Davenport might let him have Bellarmine, but otherwise he has to uproot the family from the dream and most limely move them somewhere that is neither his nor her hometown.

Does he really have to do that? He's always said he wants to retire early. This could push him to that.

I'm sure he has plenty of money to do it, and he will be paid millions to leave. At the end of the day, regardless of what happens, he doesn't have a financial worry for the rest of his life. That's why you take these jobs - even when you lose, you win.

[xudash]

There’s more to life than money, but he went for the big contract like so many before him.

I am hopeful that Travis is growing into the job. Not perfect, but who is? Just keep making progress. I bet the Browns wish they had been more patient with Belichick.

Ha! Truer words have never been typed.

[xu82]

In fairness, I don't think it was JUST money in this case. This was a chance to make the wife happy and move to a higher-prestige program with a bigger fanbase in a city he would mostly own.

Unfortunately for him and Kristi, he blew it. Davenport might let him have Bellarmine, but otherwise he has to uproot the family from the dream and most limely move them somewhere that is neither his nor her hometown.

Totally agree, there were many factors. I’m pretty sure money was high on the list, but certainly not the sole reason. I don’t want to see bad things happen to anyone, but sometimes you make your own bed, and it doesn’t work out.

[Masterofreality]

There’s more to life than money, but he went for the big contract like so many before him.

I am hopeful that Travis is growing into the job. Not perfect, but who is? Just keep making progress. I bet the Browns wish they had been more patient with Belichick.

Modell fired Belichick on his move out of town to Baltimore. That is another reason why Modell should never sniff less than a 1,000,000 from the Pro Football HOF.
Any owner who fires Paul Brown and Bill Belichick in the same lifetime has no business being an NFL owner.

[Masterofreality]

In fairness, I don't think it was JUST money in this case. This was a chance to make the wife happy and move to a higher-prestige program with a bigger fanbase in a city he would mostly own.

Unfortunately for him and Kristi, he blew it. Davenport might let him have Bellarmine, but otherwise he has to uproot the family from the dream and most limely move them somewhere that is neither his nor her hometown.

I have a feeling that Scott is getting close to being done. 65 years old. Mack would be a suitable replacement.
Ya got what ya wanted Christi.

[Xville]

F mack. I don’t care if bad things happen to him. Hope he gets fired f him. He will be fine with him and his family swimming in money.

[bourbonman]

I have a feeling that Scott is getting close to being done. 65 years old. Mack would be a suitable replacement.
Ya got what ya wanted Christi.

I like the Bellarmine program and Davenport is a class act. Please keep Mack away from it.

[Masterofreality]

I like the Bellarmine program and Davenport is a class act. Please keep Mack away from it.

Me too. I lived close to the campus and many of my cousins went there. One played for the Knights in the early 70’s.

My point would be it is a perfect place to rehabilitate your image if Scott wants to retire.

[basket]

He made a similar comment one year when he had a rough stretch at X. He really doesn’t like taking ownership when things go poorly. It always going to be the players or the assistants or some other person or thing that must be responsible for his failures.

That is SO much a St.X trait!!

[atljar]

^----- Must be an Elder kid. Jealousy is a bitch. :pointandlaugh:

[Blue Blooded-05]

Went to the Hookerville boards last night seeking a little schadenfreude. Came away feeling a little sad, to be honest. General consensus of Mack is that he has quit on the team and is tanking to get his $12M buyout.

I have called Mack a bunch of names over the years but I never once called him a quitter.

Hookerville fans have been paranoid about getting the death penalty from the NCAA for the past few years. Ironically, their current situation is arguably worse. They’re without a president. They’re without an AD. They have a tanking head coach with no one to fire him with a buyout they cannot afford anyway leading a program that might go on multi-year probation any day now. What recruit/transfer would want any part of that situation? This could be a decade long rebuild.

Back to Mack... I honestly feel bad for him at this point. Failure sucks and he seems to be taking it very hard. At this point, I sincerely hope this experience humbles him and allows him to refocus.

[D-West & PO-Z]

^----- Must be an Elder kid. Jealousy is a bitch. :pointandlaugh:

Ha, right!?

[Masterofreality]

Mack is making $3.8 million at Louisewer. He could have stayed at Xavier and made $3 million. I have that on ironclad authority.
You Go Christy!!!!!

[Muskie]

Mack is making $3.8 million at Louisewer. He could have stayed at Xavier and made $3 million. I have that on ironclad authority.
You Go Christy!!!!!

800k does buy a lot of bait.

[bleedXblue]

Went to the Hookerville boards last night seeking a little schadenfreude. Came away feeling a little sad, to be honest. General consensus of Mack is that he has quit on the team and is tanking to get his $12M buyout.

I have called Mack a bunch of names over the years but I never once called him a quitter.

Hookerville fans have been paranoid about getting the death penalty from the NCAA for the past few years. Ironically, their current situation is arguably worse. They’re without a president. They’re without an AD. They have a tanking head coach with no one to fire him with a buyout they cannot afford anyway leading a program that might go on multi-year probation any day now. What recruit/transfer would want any part of that situation? This could be a decade long rebuild.

Back to Mack... I honestly feel bad for him at this point. Failure sucks and he seems to be taking it very hard. At this point, I sincerely hope this experience humbles him and allows him to refocus.

what's happened recently that would cause new sanctions?

[Xville]

what's happened recently that would cause new sanctions?

The Brian Bowen thing is still outstanding. Yeah only five years ago..the ncaa moves swiftly lol

[Masterofreality]

800k does buy a lot of bait.

Taxes

[markchal]

I mean I'd still take him back here...we haven't even been to the tournament since he's left and he won a BE title here. No coach leaves a job perfectly, that's just the nature of it.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

I mean I'd still take him back here...we haven't even been to the tournament since he's left and he won a BE title here. No coach leaves a job perfectly, that's just the nature of it.

I'd sooner schedule the Dayton Liars for a home and home than see Mack back here. He quit on us, the team, the fans everyone!

[boozehound]

None of these guys ever think that they are going to fail at the next level. In their mind it's Xavier holding them back due to lack of resources, etc.

$3MM is a big chunk for X to break off for Chris Mack. I wonder if we might have regretted that as some point? His recruiting was a little inconsistent and his best teams tended to underperform in key situations (Big East Tournament, NCAA Tournament, and against Villanova). He had 2 pretty improbable runs that really helped his legacy out. I know you can't really play the 'what if' game, but I'm going to anyways.

Here are Chris Mack's 4 deep runs:

2010: Miller's players (Crawford / Lyons / Holloway)
2012: Sweet 16 by beating 7 seed Notre Dame and 15 seed Lehigh. That team probably wasn't beating a 2 seed.
2015: Sweet 16 by beating 11 seed Ole Miss and 14 Seed Georgia State. I don't think that team would have likely beaten a 3 seed had Georgia state not pulled off the upset.
2017: Elite 8 by beating No 6 Maryland, No 3 Florida State, No 2 Arizona. This one was a legit road to the Elite 8.

The first run was Miller's team and the second two Sweet 16 runs we caught an undeniable break due to another upset in our bracket. We still had to win the games, but it's a lot easier to beat a 15 seed than a 2 seed. If those results were normalized, things could have looked a lot different.

2010: Made Sweet 16 with Miller's Team (Crawford / Lyons / Holloway)
2011: No 6 Xavier lost to No 11 Marquette
2012: Made tournament won 1 game (most likely scenario)
2013: Missed NCAA tournament
2014: Lost in play-in game to NC State
2015: Made tournament and won 1 game (most likely scenario)
2016: No. 2 seed lost to Wisconsin in second round
2017: Legit Elite 8 Run from a team that struggled (11 seed)
2018: No. 1 seed that lost in second Round.

Mack could have very easily been a coach that had 1 really good run, and blew it with both a 2 seed and a 1 seed in a 3 year span. There was a stretch there from 2011 to 2016 where things looked kind of rough until we got Blueitt. Remember the lauded recruiting class of Canty, Latham, McKenzie, and Martin? We were in the A10 for some of that time too. It could have been a real shit show if we were in the Big East.

That might be some of what we are seeing at Louisville. I'm not sure Mack is a good of a coach as everyone thought he was.

[webxu]

None of these guys ever think that they are going to fail at the next level. In their mind it's Xavier holding them back due to lack of resources, etc.

$3MM is a big chunk for X to break off for Chris Mack. I wonder if we might have regretted that as some point? His recruiting was a little inconsistent and his best teams tended to underperform in key situations (Big East Tournament, NCAA Tournament, and against Villanova). He had 2 pretty improbable runs that really helped his legacy out. I know you can't really play the 'what if' game, but I'm going to anyways.

Here are Chris Mack's 4 deep runs:

2010: Miller's players (Crawford / Lyons / Holloway)
2012: Sweet 16 by beating 7 seed Notre Dame and 15 seed Lehigh. That team probably wasn't beating a 2 seed.
2015: Sweet 16 by beating 11 seed Ole Miss and 14 Seed Georgia State. I don't think that team would have likely beaten a 3 seed had Georgia state not pulled off the upset.
2017: Elite 8 by beating No 6 Maryland, No 3 Florida State, No 2 Arizona. This one was a legit road to the Elite 8.

The first run was Miller's team and the second two Sweet 16 runs we caught an undeniable break due to another upset in our bracket. We still had to win the games, but it's a lot easier to beat a 15 seed than a 2 seed. If those results were normalized, things could have looked a lot different.

2010: Made Sweet 16 with Miller's Team (Crawford / Lyons / Holloway)
2011: No 6 Xavier lost to No 11 Marquette
2012: Made tournament won 1 game (most likely scenario)
2013: Missed NCAA tournament
2014: Lost in play-in game to NC State
2015: Made tournament and won 1 game (most likely scenario)
2016: No. 2 seed lost to Wisconsin in second round
2017: Legit Elite 8 Run from a team that struggled (11 seed)
2018: No. 1 seed that lost in second Round.

Mack could have very easily been a coach that had 1 really good run, and blew it with both a 2 seed and a 1 seed in a 3 year span. There was a stretch there from 2011 to 2016 where things looked kind of rough until we got Blueitt. Remember the lauded recruiting class of Canty, Latham, McKenzie, and Martin? We were in the A10 for some of that time too. It could have been a real shit show if we were in the Big East.

That might be some of what we are seeing at Louisville. I'm not sure Mack is a good of a coach as everyone thought he was.

AMEN! I have been saying this for years.. he caught some lucky breaks to obtain all those Sweet 16's. Very easily could be looking a coach that rode Crawford to a Sweet 16 and Blueitt to an Elite 8 and thats it.. flip side you could argue by "average performance" the 2016 and 2018 teams should have at least made the Sweet 16.

[Xavier]

I mean he left to coach Louisville. Xavier isn’t even close in comparison, it was an easy move.

[GoMuskies]

I mean he left to coach Louisville. Xavier isn’t even close in comparison, it was an easy move.

He's done a great job of helping Xavier close the gap!

[boozehound]

AMEN! I have been saying this for years.. he caught some lucky breaks to obtain all those Sweet 16's. Very easily could be looking a coach that rode Crawford to a Sweet 16 and Blueitt to an Elite 8 and thats it.. flip side you could argue by "average performance" the 2016 and 2018 teams should have at least made the Sweet 16.

At least one of those teams should have made a Sweet 16, for sure. You could argue that (especially) the 1 seed 'should' have made a Final 4 (or at least an Elite 8). That doesn't always happen, of course.

[Masterofreality]

I mean he left to coach Louisville. Xavier isn’t even close in comparison, it was an easy move.

Louisville is a f%#king mess. In all respects.

[Xavier]

Louisville is a f%#king mess. In all respects.

It is. But it’s still Louisville. They are a top 10 program. Just look at the YUM center to Cintas. Mack has done a good job making it look average though.

[IM4X]

I mean he left to coach Louisville. Xavier isn’t even close to being corrupt and slimy in comparison, it was an easy move for a coach like him with a huge ego and little scruples.

Fixed it for you.

[bleedXblue]

Louisville is a f%#king mess. In all respects.

And was a mess when he took the job. Hence why so many questioned the move.

[xu82]

He's done a great job of helping Xavier close the gap!

That is VERY funny.

….and true.

[Masterofreality]

It is. But it’s still Louisville. They are a top 10 program. Just look at the YUM center to Cintas. Mack has done a good job making it look average though.

*Was* a Top 10 program. SucKS was too at one time. The past tells zero about the present or future.
Right now they are drawing 54% of capacity in the Yum Center and declining.
And the building they play in is a public building and not on U of L’s campus.
Georgetown plays in the cavernous Verizon Center. The building is irrelevant.

[xuphan]

*Was* a Top 10 program. SucKS was too at one time. The past tells zero about the present or future.
Right now they are drawing less people into the Yum Center than Xavier.
And the building they play in is a public building and not on U of L’s campus.
Georgetown plays in the cavernous Verizon Center. The building is irrelevant.

I do wonder if Louisville regrets getting rid of Slick Rick. Even with all of his transgressions, I do wonder if they wish he was still there. Especially with the state they are now in under Buick Mack.

[Xville]

*Was* a Top 10 program. SucKS was too at one time. The past tells zero about the present or future.
Right now they are drawing 54% of capacity in the Yum Center and declining.
And the building they play in is a public building and not on U of L’s campus.
Georgetown plays in the cavernous Verizon Center. The building is irrelevant.

Attendance during the last two years is irrelevant to whether they are a top ten program. They are. You know this state and city lives and breathes basketball and there is little to compete for entertainment dollar with no pro sports… fans will be back once this Covid garbage is past us, and they hire a competent coach. UK is down about 28% this year, going to tell me they aren’t a top ten program next?

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Attendance during the last two years is irrelevant to whether they are a top ten program. They are. You know this state and city lives and breathes basketball and there is little to compete for entertainment dollar with no pro sports… fans will be back once this Covid garbage is past us, and they hire a competent coach. UK is down about 28% this year, going to tell me they aren’t a top ten program next?

Louisville is not a top ten program. They are, however, a top ten mess.

[Xville]

Louisville is not a top ten program. They are, however, a top ten mess.

If you truly believe they aren’t, I’d love for you to list ten programs that are higher

[Masterofreality]

If you truly believe they aren’t, I’d love for you to list ten programs that are higher

If you believe that Clifton Community College and Georgetown are “Top 10 Programs” then you believe that Louisville is a Top 10 Program.
The past is past.

[Xville]

If you believe that Clifton Community College and Georgetown are “Top 10 Programs” then you believe that Louisville is a Top 10 Program.
The past is past.

Comparing Georgetown and uc to Louisville is ridiculous. Please enlighten us and list ten programs higher

[Masterofreality]

Comparing Georgetown and uc to Louisville is ridiculous. Please enlighten us and list ten programs higher

Duke
North Carolina
Villanova
UCLA
Kentucky
Indiana
Kansas
Arizona
UConn
Michigan State

There. Louisville’s success since Crum is strictly because of cheating.(See NCAA violations.)

[Xville]

Duke
North Carolina
Villanova
UCLA
Kentucky
Indiana
Kansas
Arizona
UConn
Michigan State

There. Louisville’s success since Crum is strictly because of cheating.(See NCAA violations.)

Oh dear gawd whatever. Almost every single one of those schools have been caught cheating. Have a good night. There is zero reasoning with you.

Funny you list Kentucky… I guess cal stopped cheating when he got to uk, pitino only cheated at Louisville, and Eddie Sutton must have been set up.

[Masterofreality]

Oh dear gawd whatever. Almost every single one of those schools have been caught cheating. Have a good night. There is zero reasoning with you.

Hahahahahaha! You call me out. I give you a factual answer and you give me fuckery as a response because you can’t take it. The hilarity is unmatched.
Louisville is not a “Top 10 program”. Slink back under your bridge, troll.

[Xville]

[QUOTE=Masterofreality;718034]Hahahahahaha! You call me out. I give you a factual answer and you give me fuckery as a response because you can’t take it. The hilarity is unmatched.
Louisville is not a “Top 10 program”. Slink back under your bridge, troll.[/QUOTE

Except, not a fact since Louisville still made a final four in 05 which by the way is after Indiana and Arizona and that’s even considering your statement which is stupid considering almost all of those programs have been caught cheating, some more than once. Indiana hasn’t even made the tournament in 6 years.

[Masterofreality]

[QUOTE=Masterofreality;718034]Hahahahahaha! You call me out. I give you a factual answer and you give me fuckery as a response because you can’t take it. The hilarity is unmatched.
Louisville is not a “Top 10 program”. Slink back under your bridge, troll.[/QUOTE

Except, not a fact since Louisville still made a final four in 05 which by the way is after Indiana and Arizona and that’s even considering your statement which is stupid considering almost all of those programs have been caught cheating, some more than once.

So? George Mason and VCU made Final 4’s too. Loyola has won a National Championship once and made a Final 4 four years ago. Are they Top 10 programs?
Dude your criteria is weak sauce, you keep changing the criteria goalposts after you get proven wrong, and your accusations of cheating by other programs are cretinesque.
Stop embarrassing yourself. Go get some sleep.

Louisville is not a Top 10 program

[Xville]

[QUOTE=Xville;718037]

So? George Mason and VCU made Final 4’s too. Loyola has won a National Championship once and made a Final 4 four years ago. Are they Top 10 programs?
Dude your criteria is weak sauce, you keep changing the criteria goalposts after you get proven wrong, and your accusations of cheating by other programs are cretinesque.
Stop embarrassing yourself. Go get some sleep.

Louisville is not a Top 10 program

“ Louisville is not a top ten program”—-based on what? Your opinion? I’m still trying to figure out what your criteria actually is? Your opinion I guess.

“ accusations of cheating” lol ok buddy——uk, Kansas, uconn, Indiana, Arizona, North Carolina all have been caught cheating. Try again.

I’ll go with the people who actually measure this stuff and agree with them. You do you and live inside your head.

[Lloyd Braun]

Top 10 programs is pretty subjective. Of all time? The last 20 years? At its present state? What’s the present? Louisville is in the discussion. I would put them ahead of Arizona. I could however argue Gonzaga ahead of both. Depends how far back we want to go. Michigan? Ohio State? Syracuse? There’s only so many objective comparisons.

[Xville]

Top 10 programs is pretty subjective. Of all time? The last 20 years? At its present state? What’s the present? Louisville is in the discussion. I would put them ahead of Arizona. I could however argue Gonzaga ahead of both. Depends how far back we want to go. Michigan? Ohio State? Syracuse? There’s only so many objective comparisons.

This is where I would start:

Postseason appearances
Final fours
Championships
Facilities
Fan base
And this is subjective but I’d also say “brand.”

If you want to say “program” think you gotta look at last 20-25 years unless you say all time.

If you say present, that to me sounds like top ten college basketball team, which is a completely separate argument in my opinion.

I’d also nix the ridiculous “ cheating” aspect because otherwise there are going to be programs like Iowa or something in there.

North Carolina—cheated for decades
Arizona—-book is in jail
UConn- Kevin Ollie
Indiana- Sampson
Uk—-has there been a time where they haven’t cheated?

[Masterofreality]

[QUOTE=Masterofreality;718038]

“ Louisville is not a top ten program”—-based on what? Your opinion? I’m still trying to figure out what your criteria actually is? Your opinion I guess.

“ accusations of cheating” lol ok buddy——uk, Kansas, uconn, Indiana, Arizona, North Carolina all have been caught cheating. Try again.

I’ll go with the people who actually measure this stuff and agree with them. You do you and live inside your head.

You are the one who started this iish by claiming Louisewer is a Top 10 program. I proved that they are not by listing those that are after you stupidly demanded an accounting. As to the “cheating” I just refer to NCAA punishments or probation. Louisewer had a NCAA Tournament vacated and recruited with hookers. Have a good time defending them. Laughable.
Scream at yourself in your troll basement under the bridge while you frantically click your keyboard looking for some worthless pundit that claims trash.

[Xville]

[QUOTE=Xville;718040]

You are the one who started this iish by claiming Louisewer is a Top 10 program. I proved that they are not by listing those that are after you stupidly demanded an accounting. As to the “cheating” I just refer to NCAA punishments or probation. Louisewer had a NCAA Tournament vacated and recruited with hookers. Have a good time defending them. Laughable.
Scream at yourself in your troll basement under the bridge while you frantically click your keyboard looking for some worthless pundit that claims trash.

You proved your opinion that those are better. Congrats I guess? Still waiting to hear what your criteria is.

[Masterofreality]

[QUOTE=Masterofreality;718046]

You proved your opinion that those are better. Congrats I guess? Still waiting to hear what your criteria is.

Not my need.
You made a claim. You can’t and haven’t defended it. You just deferred and challenged people to show that your claim was off. I did. You still haven’t defended or proved your claim. Case closed.
Good night.

[Xville]

[QUOTE=Xville;718047]

Not my need.
You made a claim. You can’t and haven’t defended it. You just deferred and challenged people to show that your claim was off. I did. You still haven’t defended or proved your claim. Case closed.
Good night.

You made the claim first that Louisville was not a top ten program. So yeah what is your criteria? Try again.

You tried unsuccessfully with nonsense:

Louisville isn’t one because they haven’t been successful since crum without cheating. Well that’s just simply Wrong based on your criteria… because they made a final four in 05, multiple conference championships, multiple sweet 16s and made postseason appearances since the scandal.

Secondly, if you are going to use that criteria, then you need to go ahead and apply that to your list of schools as well. You don’t get to pick and choose:

Indiana—-Sampson
UConn—Ollie
Arizona—-book is in jail buddy and sanctions are coming
Uk—lol

Your third try at defense was based on attendance this year but yet you mentioned uk, a year in which they are down 28%. Also, we kind of have that whole Covid thing still going on. Nonsense defense.

Louisville is a top ten program in basically every metric. If you want to say they aren’t a top ten team right now, then yeah no shit. If mack pulls a miracle or when they get a competent coach, they will be a top ten team again.

[Masterofreality]

[QUOTE=Masterofreality;718051]

You made the claim first that Louisville was not a top ten program. Try again.

In post 44 of this thread you claimed Louisewer was a Top 10 program. You have given zero proof or support that it is. Then you went further challenging others to prove your unproven Hypothesis wrong. A hypothesis which you have still made with zero evidence.
Guess what? I answered your challenge with 10 schools that are Top 10.
Game. Set. Match.
Know what time it is, brother. Closing time.

[Xville]

[QUOTE=Xville;718053]

In post 44 of this thread you claimed Louisewer was a Top 10 program. You have given zero proof or support that it is. Then you went further challenging others to prove your unproven Hypothesis wrong. A hypothesis which you have still made with zero evidence.
Guess what? I answered your challenge with 10 schools that are Top 10.
Game. Set. Match.
Know what time it is, brother. Closing time.

Top 10 in your opinion with “criteria” that I have already “proven” is bs. Keep digging that hole though Mr. around the green lol

You picked Indiana based on what? They haven’t even made the tourney in 6 years lol. Arizona? Based on what? I thought the past didn’t matter?

[D-West & PO-Z]

You are the one who started this iish by claiming Louisewer is a Top 10 program. I proved that they are not by listing those that are after you stupidly demanded an accounting. As to the “cheating” I just refer to NCAA punishments or probation. Louisewer had a NCAA Tournament vacated and recruited with hookers. Have a good time defending them. Laughable.
Scream at yourself in your troll basement under the bridge while you frantically click your keyboard looking for some worthless pundit that claims trash.

MOR, c'mon. I mean reasonable minds can debate if Louisville is a top 10 program or not. I would lean probably yes. But to say because you listed 10 other programs you have proven someone who thinks so wrong and call your list fact is utterly ridiculous. That is the definition of opinion. It is your opinion Louisville isn't but you haven't proven anything other than you have a different opinion.

[Lloyd Braun]

Top 10 in your opinion with “criteria” that I have already “proven” is bs. Keep digging that hole though Mr. around the green lol

You picked Indiana based on what? They haven’t even made the tourney in 6 years lol. Arizona? Based on what? I thought the past didn’t matter?

I thought maybe I had seen this episode before… there may be more conversations but I did find this (http://www.xavierhoops.com/showthread.php?32794-Chris-Mack-discussion&p=619241&viewfull=1#post619241)

[Masterofreality]

MOR, c'mon. I mean reasonable minds can debate if Louisville is a top 10 program or not. I would lean probably yes. But to say because you listed 10 other programs you have proven someone who thinks so wrong and call your list fact is utterly ridiculous. That is the definition of opinion. It is your opinion Louisville isn't but you haven't proven anything other than you have a different opinion.

Ha! Louisville isn’t even a Top 100 program now.
108 in Torvik
103 in Pomeroy.
Dude sounds like Clifton College fan. “Arise the ghost of Peck Hickman”!! Laughable
DWest.. Hold the guy responsible who made the claim that Louisville is a “Top 10” program to show proof. He hasn’t and can’t.
Ok. To your point. It could be opinion, but he’s has presented zero evidence for it..and he’s wrong.

[GoMuskies]

Louisville is pretty clearly a top 10 program all-time and also pretty clearly a complete dumpster fire at present.

[XUGRAD80]

Louisville is pretty clearly a top 10 program all-time and also pretty clearly a complete dumpster fire at present.


That pretty much sums it up. What it was is not what it is.

[Xville]

Mor there is a difference between top ten program and top ten team. I’m sorry if you didn’t understand that and it’s clear you didn’t since you are throwing out single season stats from this year. They for sure are not a top ten team right now, that’s obvious.

You were the one who said Louisville wasn’t a top ten program. Burden of proof is on you.

Pick a time period..want to do last twenty years?

Fanbase/attendance
Facilities
Final fours
Championships conference and overall titles
NBA drafts
Tournament appearences

[webxu]

We are on to Depaul.

[xubrew]

I think there are certain programs that can make coaches look better than they actually are. I am beginning to think Xavier is in that category. Chris Mack went to Louisville and didn't match the success he had at Xavier. Not even close. Sean Miller perhaps matched the success he had at X, but I wouldn't say he surpassed it.

There is one school in particular that I hesitate to name, so I won't. I'll just say that if Brian Gregory can get a school to the NCAA Tournament and win a game, then HOLY CRAP that place can make coaches look better than they actually are! Another coach went to Indiana and never came close to being as successful as he was at this unnamed program. Power programs should be cautious when they hire coaches from this unnamed program because they have double the resources and support that most of the schools they compete against have, and it simply isn't that hard to win there.

Same with...say...New Mexico State. They will seemingly always win 25+ games no matter who the coach is.

I used to think Tulsa was like that, and perhaps they still are. They aren't really doing well right now, but they're still making it look like Frank Haith doesn't suck nearly as badly as he actually does. I mean when Danny Manning was there, everyone thought he was fantastic. He clearly isn't.

Anyway, you get the idea.

It's not THAT hard to win at Xavier. I don't want to overstate it and insinuate that it's easy, but it's not that hard either. If coaches can't win at a higher level at Arizona, and can't come close to winning at even the same level at freakin' LOUISVILLE, then that's a sure sign that Xavier is very much set up for success. I'm not going to go so far to say Chris Mack is a bad coach, but I honestly no longer think of him as being a really good one. He was just at a place that was very much set up to win when he was at X.

[boozehound]

I think that's a pretty fair assessment, brew. Well put. It will be interesting to see where the rest of Chris Mack's career goes. Does Louisville stick it out? I think that they might have intended to, but with the level of shit show this season is becoming, that will be increasingly difficult.

Does he go to another major program? Smaller program? Retire? Does he reboot and find success?

It's possible that Mack just isn't that good of a coach, but I suppose it's also possible (albeit less likely) that Louisville is impossible to win at right now. It's also possible that Chris is just having trouble making the jump to a higher level program in an elite conference (no offense to the Big East).

[Mel Cooley XU'81]

Great post Brew.

Clearly expressed, original, provocative.

Great post.

[STL_XUfan]

I think there are certain programs that can make coaches look better than they actually are. I am beginning to think Xavier is in that category. Chris Mack went to Louisville and didn't match the success he had at Xavier. Not even close. Sean Miller perhaps matched the success he had at X, but I wouldn't say he surpassed it.

There is one school in particular that I hesitate to name, so I won't. I'll just say that if Brian Gregory can get a school to the NCAA Tournament and win a game, then HOLY CRAP that place can make coaches look better than they actually are! Another coach went to Indiana and never came close to being as successful as he was at this unnamed program. Power programs should be cautious when they hire coaches from this unnamed program because they have double the resources and support that most of the schools they compete against have, and it simply isn't that hard to win there.

Same with...say...New Mexico State. They will seemingly always win 25+ games no matter who the coach is.

I used to think Tulsa was like that, and perhaps they still are. They aren't really doing well right now, but they're still making it look like Frank Haith doesn't suck nearly as badly as he actually does. I mean when Danny Manning was there, everyone thought he was fantastic. He clearly isn't.

Anyway, you get the idea.

It's not THAT hard to win at Xavier. I don't want to overstate it and insinuate that it's easy, but it's not that hard either. If coaches can't win at a higher level at Arizona, and can't come close to winning at even the same level at freakin' LOUISVILLE, then that's a sure sign that Xavier is very much set up for success. I'm not going to go so far to say Chris Mack is a bad coach, but I honestly no longer think of him as being a really good one. He was just at a place that was very much set up to win when he was at X.

I would add one caveat to this great analysis. There is an element of consistency that helps schools like X make coaches look better. When these type of schools go to hire a coach, it is because their coach got poached after great seasons. So they are in an overall better place (fan enthusiasm, money, season tickets, support for investments), and the coach they are hiring is stepping in to keep the train rolling along. While the "bigger fish" hiring coaches from these types of schools are normally in some sort of trouble and that coach has to build the program back up rather than just keeping it rolling.

[Xville]

I think that's a pretty fair assessment, brew. Well put. It will be interesting to see where the rest of Chris Mack's career goes. Does Louisville stick it out? I think that they might have intended to, but with the level of shit show this season is becoming, that will be increasingly difficult.

Does he go to another major program? Smaller program? Retire? Does he reboot and find success?

It's possible that Mack just isn't that good of a coach, but I suppose it's also possible (albeit less likely) that Louisville is impossible to win at right now. It's also possible that Chris is just having trouble making the jump to a higher level program in an elite conference (no offense to the Big East).

I think the big part of the problem with mack is that at best he is an inconsistent recruiter, if not a pretty mediocre one. We saw that at Xavier. The talent he did have in the early part of his tenure at Louisville has left early which wasn’t really a consistent issue at x, but is always going to be at Louisville and those pieces need to be replaced almost on a yearly basis.

[Masterofreality]

I think there are certain programs that can make coaches look better than they actually are. I am beginning to think Xavier is in that category. Chris Mack went to Louisville and didn't match the success he had at Xavier. Not even close. Sean Miller perhaps matched the success he had at X, but I wouldn't say he surpassed it.

There is one school in particular that I hesitate to name, so I won't. I'll just say that if Brian Gregory can get a school to the NCAA Tournament and win a game, then HOLY CRAP that place can make coaches look better than they actually are! Another coach went to Indiana and never came close to being as successful as he was at this unnamed program. Power programs should be cautious when they hire coaches from this unnamed program because they have double the resources and support that most of the schools they compete against have, and it simply isn't that hard to win there.

Same with...say...New Mexico State. They will seemingly always win 25+ games no matter who the coach is.

I used to think Tulsa was like that, and perhaps they still are. They aren't really doing well right now, but they're still making it look like Frank Haith doesn't suck nearly as badly as he actually does. I mean when Danny Manning was there, everyone thought he was fantastic. He clearly isn't.

Anyway, you get the idea.

It's not THAT hard to win at Xavier. I don't want to overstate it and insinuate that it's easy, but it's not that hard either. If coaches can't win at a higher level at Arizona, and can't come close to winning at even the same level at freakin' LOUISVILLE, then that's a sure sign that Xavier is very much set up for success. I'm not going to go so far to say Chris Mack is a bad coach, but I honestly no longer think of him as being a really good one. He was just at a place that was very much set up to win when he was at X.

This is a superb post. Props & Congrats since Jack Booted thugs are holding me down.

[boozehound]

I would add one caveat to this great analysis. There is an element of consistency that helps schools like X make coaches look better. When these type of schools go to hire a coach, it is because their coach got poached after great seasons. So they are in an overall better place (fan enthusiasm, money, season tickets, support for investments), and the coach they are hiring is stepping in to keep the train rolling along. While the "bigger fish" hiring coaches from these types of schools are normally in some sort of trouble and that coach has to build the program back up rather than just keeping it rolling.

I had never thought of it that way before, but you are spot on.


I think the big part of the problem with mack is that at best he is an inconsistent recruiter, if not a pretty mediocre one. We saw that at Xavier. The talent he did have in the early part of his tenure at Louisville has left early which wasn’t really a consistent issue at x, but is always going to be at Louisville and those pieces need to be replaced almost on a yearly basis.

Well put. Inconsistent is the right word. We had some big hits (Blueitt, Marshall, Semaj) but a shit ton of misses (The aforementioned and much anticipated Canty/Latham/McKenzie/Martin class). I don't think Semaj ever made the tournament because we couldn't field a decent team around him.

[Masterofreality]

I had never thought of it that way before, but you are spot .

This may be an unpopular take, and maybe X is lucky(?) but the enthusiasm & energy a new coach brings can have a positive effect and with X it has in almost every case so far.
There maybe a learning curve, and I’ll submit that with Steele it has taken longer, but no Coach that Xavier has had in the last 40 years has gotten stale. It happens to even the best of them in many cases. I think Thuggs is getting stale at WVA for example. I think JThompson 3 did so at Georgetown.
In any case, Xavier basketball is never not interesting.

[xu82]

I would add one caveat to this great analysis. There is an element of consistency that helps schools like X make coaches look better. When these type of schools go to hire a coach, it is because their coach got poached after great seasons. So they are in an overall better place (fan enthusiasm, money, season tickets, support for investments), and the coach they are hiring is stepping in to keep the train rolling along. While the "bigger fish" hiring coaches from these types of schools are normally in some sort of trouble and that coach has to build the program back up rather than just keeping it rolling.

That is a very good point. We are always looking at it from the Xavier perspective, which is (somewhat) fortunate I guess.

[xudash]

I think there are certain programs that can make coaches look better than they actually are. I am beginning to think Xavier is in that category. Chris Mack went to Louisville and didn't match the success he had at Xavier. Not even close. Sean Miller perhaps matched the success he had at X, but I wouldn't say he surpassed it.

There is one school in particular that I hesitate to name, so I won't. I'll just say that if Brian Gregory can get a school to the NCAA Tournament and win a game, then HOLY CRAP that place can make coaches look better than they actually are! Another coach went to Indiana and never came close to being as successful as he was at this unnamed program. Power programs should be cautious when they hire coaches from this unnamed program because they have double the resources and support that most of the schools they compete against have, and it simply isn't that hard to win there.

Same with...say...New Mexico State. They will seemingly always win 25+ games no matter who the coach is.

I used to think Tulsa was like that, and perhaps they still are. They aren't really doing well right now, but they're still making it look like Frank Haith doesn't suck nearly as badly as he actually does. I mean when Danny Manning was there, everyone thought he was fantastic. He clearly isn't.

Anyway, you get the idea.

It's not THAT hard to win at Xavier. I don't want to overstate it and insinuate that it's easy, but it's not that hard either. If coaches can't win at a higher level at Arizona, and can't come close to winning at even the same level at freakin' LOUISVILLE, then that's a sure sign that Xavier is very much set up for success. I'm not going to go so far to say Chris Mack is a bad coach, but I honestly no longer think of him as being a really good one. He was just at a place that was very much set up to win when he was at X.

We need to be careful about the bolded statement. We have this discussion about Xavier being the 'cradle of coaches", as it were, but there is a very significant dividing line when it comes to that conversation: pre-Big East and now member of Big East. Obviously, Staak, Gillen, Prosser could be looked at in terms of building the program and in terms of pre-Cintas Center and pre-Big East. Matta and Miller clearly fit in the post-Cintas Center and pre-Big East phase. Mack crossed over to where we are now, and Travis has had to perform in the Big East solely.

Your larger point is spot on: Xavier is very much set up for success. Facilities. Resources. Brand. Administrative and fan support. Conference (the one thing that had been missing for years).

If anything, it makes sense that it is taking longer for Travis to produce at a very high level, especially in light of the fact that Mack did leave him a big hole in his roster, due to the COVID non-sense that none of former coaches ever had to experience, and, most importantly, because Travis Steele is slugging it out in one of the top conferences in the country.

[boozehound]

This may be an unpopular take, and maybe X is lucky(?) but the enthusiasm & energy a new coach brings can have a positive effect and with X it has in almost every case so far.
There maybe a learning curve, and I’ll submit that with Steele it has taken longer, but no Coach that Xavier has had in the last 40 years has gotten stale. It happens to even the best of them in many cases. I think Thuggs is getting stale at WVA for example. I think JThompson 3 did so at Georgetown.
In any case, Xavier basketball is never not interesting.

Interesting. We have spent so many years hoping for our Mark Few or Jay Wright that we probably haven't appreciated the fact that those guys are far more the exception than the rule. I was worried for a while there with Mack that we were going to be mired in mediocrity - being just good enough that he keeps getting extended but never really getting over the hump. I guess you could argue that's kind of what happened, minus that Elite 8 run (which was a blast - especially beating Arizona). The middle of Mack's tenure had some lean years.

[bleedXblue]

I think that's a pretty fair assessment, brew. Well put. It will be interesting to see where the rest of Chris Mack's career goes. Does Louisville stick it out? I think that they might have intended to, but with the level of shit show this season is becoming, that will be increasingly difficult.

Does he go to another major program? Smaller program? Retire? Does he reboot and find success?

It's possible that Mack just isn't that good of a coach, but I suppose it's also possible (albeit less likely) that Louisville is impossible to win at right now. It's also possible that Chris is just having trouble making the jump to a higher level program in an elite conference (no offense to the Big East).

He's losing to Pitt and NC State........they are NOT elite programs.

[Xavgrad08]

The game tonight at Louisville was delayed due at a leaky roof. Take the roof off the list of things that aren’t wrong with Louisville. https://www.wdrb.com/sports/leaky-roof-forces-delayed-start-of-uofl-boston-college-basketball-game/article_fd025b82-798d-11ec-971d-9b0fc02d5d5a.html

[UCGRAD4X]

-
The game tonight at Louisville was delayed due at a leaky roof. Take the roof off the list of things that aren’t wrong with Louisville. https://www.wdrb.com/sports/leaky-roof-forces-delayed-start-of-uofl-boston-college-basketball-game/article_fd025b82-798d-11ec-971d-9b0fc02d5d5a.html

Apparently they had to pick up an "extra" student manager from the portal to keep the water off the court. What were the qualifications? Good with a wet/dry vac, giant sponge, golf umbrella or triple threat?

[webxu]

I think there are certain programs that can make coaches look better than they actually are. I am beginning to think Xavier is in that category. Chris Mack went to Louisville and didn't match the success he had at Xavier. Not even close. Sean Miller perhaps matched the success he had at X, but I wouldn't say he surpassed it.

There is one school in particular that I hesitate to name, so I won't. I'll just say that if Brian Gregory can get a school to the NCAA Tournament and win a game, then HOLY CRAP that place can make coaches look better than they actually are! Another coach went to Indiana and never came close to being as successful as he was at this unnamed program. Power programs should be cautious when they hire coaches from this unnamed program because they have double the resources and support that most of the schools they compete against have, and it simply isn't that hard to win there.

Same with...say...New Mexico State. They will seemingly always win 25+ games no matter who the coach is.

I used to think Tulsa was like that, and perhaps they still are. They aren't really doing well right now, but they're still making it look like Frank Haith doesn't suck nearly as badly as he actually does. I mean when Danny Manning was there, everyone thought he was fantastic. He clearly isn't.

Anyway, you get the idea.

It's not THAT hard to win at Xavier. I don't want to overstate it and insinuate that it's easy, but it's not that hard either. If coaches can't win at a higher level at Arizona, and can't come close to winning at even the same level at freakin' LOUISVILLE, then that's a sure sign that Xavier is very much set up for success. I'm not going to go so far to say Chris Mack is a bad coach, but I honestly no longer think of him as being a really good one. He was just at a place that was very much set up to win when he was at X.

I would argue that Sean Miller surpassed what he did at X. Zona was constantly a top 10 team more like a top 5 during most of his tenure. that didnt translate to a final four, but tourney results can be fluky.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I would argue that Sean Miller surpassed what he did at X. Zona was constantly a top 10 team more like a top 5 during most of his tenure. that didnt translate to a final four, but tourney results can be fluky.

I would agree. It was a disappointment for Miller and Arizona that they didn't make a Final 4 but they were consistently a top team with high seeds while he was there. Just could never get over the hump. I think he went to 3 elite 8's?

[X-Fan]

As someone who does not pay attention to their program at all outside of what we see on Twitter, I would imagine the heat on Mack this season is higher because of the ridiculous stuff with Dino this past off-season. Feels a bit like the year after the Dez/brawl stuff where Mack was neutered a bit by the Administration.

What’s crazy is he was supposed to be walking into a program under a ton of sanctions and should’ve had five or so years to rebuild it with little pressure. The sanctions never came, he had success right away and that (along with the Dino stuff and this really poor season) is causing his welcome to wear out at warp speed. Crazy.

As someone in the 20th year of my career, I’ve definitely witnessed firsthand the whole “grass isn’t greener” scenario. Sometimes you don’t realize how good you have it and ambition gets the best of you.

[GoMuskies]

I would agree. It was a disappointment for Miller and Arizona that they didn't make a Final 4 but they were consistently a top team with high seeds while he was there. Just could never get over the hump. I think he went to 3 elite 8's?

The last few years they weren't very good. Thus the shitcanning.

In his last four years, they won one less NCAA Tournament game than Xavier has won over the last 4 years (that would be 0).

[D-West & PO-Z]

The last few years they weren't very good. Thus the shitcanning.

In his last four years, they won one less NCAA Tournament game than Xavier has won over the last 4 years (that would be 0).

Yeah the ending wasn't great but the vast majority of his time there was really solid. How many of those last few years were mired in the cheating controversy? I am sure that didn't help recruiting or Miller's ability to focus on coaching. Was definitely time for him to go though given all that.

[D-West & PO-Z]

As someone who does not pay attention to their program at all outside of what we see on Twitter, I would imagine the heat on Mack this season is higher because of the ridiculous stuff with Dino this past off-season. Feels a bit like the year after the Dez/brawl stuff where Mack was neutered a bit by the Administration.

What’s crazy is he was supposed to be walking into a program under a ton of sanctions and should’ve had five or so years to rebuild it with little pressure. The sanctions never came, he had success right away and that (along with the Dino stuff and this really poor season) is causing his welcome to wear out at warp speed. Crazy.

As someone in the 20th year of my career, I’ve definitely witnessed firsthand the whole “grass isn’t greener” scenario. Sometimes you don’t realize how good you have it and ambition gets the best of you.

Yeah I mean Dino and that mess and also letting Luke Murray go. I don't know if those decisions were forced on Mack or he made them himself but it gave the appearance of him placing blame on his staff and this season has only got worse.

[Masterofreality]

The game tonight at Louisville was delayed due at a leaky roof. Take the roof off the list of things that aren’t wrong with Louisville. https://www.wdrb.com/sports/leaky-roof-forces-delayed-start-of-uofl-boston-college-basketball-game/article_fd025b82-798d-11ec-971d-9b0fc02d5d5a.html

Yes! But the Yum Center is SUCH A GREAT BUILDING!!!!!

[bourbonman]

Just saw a post from a UofL fan defending the fact they have a great head basketball coach. Jeff Walz - WBB ��

[xu82]

Desmond Claude must have checked out this thread.

Seriously, it’s clearly a tire fire, which can be self-perpetuating. How do you recruit to that mess?

[American X]

Seriously, it’s clearly a tire fire, which can be self-perpetuating. How do you recruit to that mess?

Hookers, blow & cash always make nice gifts.

[Masterofreality]

Hookers, blow & cash always make nice gifts.

In Vegas. Not necessarily in Louisville. :-)

[Blue Blooded-05]

Hookers, blow & cash always make nice gifts.

That would certainly be one way to bring the clap back to the Yum Center

[GoMuskies]

Just saw a post from a UofL fan defending the fact they have a great head basketball coach. Jeff Walz - WBB ��

After last night's fourth quarter in Raleigh, they may be rethinking that as well.

[UCGRAD4X]

hookers, blow & cash always make nice gifts.


in vegas. Not necessarily in louisville. :-)

anywhere

[X-band '01]

Ouch - double-digit loss at home to Notre Dame.

[UCGRAD4X]

https://247sports.com/college/notre-dame/LongFormArticle/Louisville-coach-Chris-Mack-booed-by-home-crowd-in-82-70-loss-to-Notre-Dame--181216475/

Seems to be some discontent among the Loserville faithful.

[X-band '01]

I wonder how long it'll take Louisville to reach double figures in this one. Virginia's finally playing like they have a pulse tonight.

[xu82]

Hookers, blow & cash always make nice gifts.

It’s how they got into this, it can be how they get out! They would NEVER suspect they might do it all over again! I mean…….THAT would be REALLY stupid! Even more stupid than the last time!

[Masterofreality]

One of my cousins, who is a real U of L honk, sent me this after tonight’s loss to VA.
“ No doubt about the fact that Mack and Steele apart are less than them together. Mack is slow to make adjustments. His offense has mostly been a 1-1 exhibition with little passing of movement. His talent evaluation and development has been littto non existent. Now he just seems defeated. Time to part ways”

[boozehound]

I’m starting to wonder if the whole Chris Mack ‘coaching tree’ (including Mack himself) isn’t all just fool’s gold.

[XUBison]

One of my cousins, who is a real U of L honk, sent me this after tonight’s loss to VA.
“ No doubt about the fact that Mack and Steele apart are less than them together. Mack is slow to make adjustments. His offense has mostly been a 1-1 exhibition with little passing of movement. His talent evaluation and development has been littto non existent. Now he just seems defeated. Time to part ways”

Oh crap. So many here have been clammering for X to bring in an experienced bench guy… Please God, no.

[GoMuskies]

This is Louisville's first 4 game losing streak by double digits since 1940. That's a feat never accomplished by Peck Hickman (started in '44), John Dromo, Denzel Crum, Prick Pitino or David Padgett. Congrats on another milestone achievement Coach!

[GoMuskies]

Had it not quite right. Here's the actual tweet from the stat machine Kelly Dickey.

https://twitter.com/RealCardGame/status/1485794119716945924

[XUBison]

Had it not quite right. Here's the actual tweet from the stat machine Kelly Dickey.

https://twitter.com/RealCardGame/status/1485794119716945924

Cue the Billy Gillespie sprint down the hallway 2.0.

[OTRMUSKIE]

Mack told Dino he wanted to move in a new direction. That's why he changed up the coaching staff. Who knew the direction was going to be out of Louisville all together. So sad to see his "Dream Job" fall a part. Dream job my ass. I think transfers are killing schools like X and now Louisville. Not sure why but it's hurting them imo.

[xu82]

I’m starting to wonder if the whole Chris Mack ‘coaching tree’ (including Mack himself) isn’t all just fool’s gold.

He’s no Bill Belichick!

[D-West & PO-Z]

Mack told Dino he wanted to move in a new direction. That's why he changed up the coaching staff. Who knew the direction was going to be out of Louisville all together. So sad to see his "Dream Job" fall a part. Dream job my ass. I think transfers are killing schools like X and now Louisville. Not sure why but it's hurting them imo.

Really? Can you imagine where X would be the last couple years without guys like Hankins, Johnson, Kunkel???

[D-West & PO-Z]

At one point Louisville was 10-4. They are now 11-9.

[GoMuskies]

Imagine how bad it would be if the ACC wasn't garbage this year.

[XUBison]

Imagine how bad it would be if the ACC wasn't garbage this year.

Yep, although maybe the fact this ACC is trash makes it worse.

[Lloyd Braun]

He’s no Bill Belichick!

Or is he https://www.sportskeeda.com/nfl/how-bill-belichick-former-assistant-coaches-performed-hcs-nfl

[webxu]

At one point Louisville was 10-4. They are now 11-9.

And Pegues coached the first 6 games and was 5-1, so Mack is really 6-8 this year.

[xu82]

Or is he https://www.sportskeeda.com/nfl/how-bill-belichick-former-assistant-coaches-performed-hcs-nfl

That was kinda my (facetious) point, it’s just a myth.

[Xavier]

Things not looking good for Mack today..

[joe titan]

Things not looking good for Mack today..

Cancelled his radio show for tonight.

[D-West & PO-Z]

What a fall/dumpster fire of a job he did there. Unreal.

[atljar]

Athletic reporting they are firing him.
Official tomorrow AM

[Irishjohn68]

If memory serves me right Chris Mack was not well like when he played at Evansville
or when he transferred to Xavier as a player.

[drudy23]

If memory serves me right Chris Mack was not well like when he played at Evansville
or when he transferred to Xavier as a player.

Right after we cue the Pat Kelsey to Louisville board talk, right behind it will be the "I knew Mack in high school and he was a deuche" board talk.

And then probably "Lamar Odom kept us out the tournament" sprinkled in with some "we were going to make the tournament last year" talk.

[HenryMuto]

Mack should have never left.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Right after we cue the Pat Kelsey to Louisville board talk, right behind it will be the "I knew Mack in high school and he was a deuche" board talk.

And then probably "Lamar Odom kept us out the tournament" sprinkled in with some "we were going to make the tournament last year" talk.

Drudy.....by all reports he was a douche @ St. X. Fast forward, he's still a douche. Some things never change.

[OTRMUSKIE]

Well he can always go back to MND. His old girlfriend use to go there while he was coaching . in the immortal words of Chris Griffinhttps://youtube.com/shorts/MpVIZG9d7-Q?feature=share

[IM4X]

Well, Mack’s time seems to officially be up at Louisville. Looks like Karma in fact is paying him a visit. Apparently, it’s just a matter of figuring out the buyout deal. The powers that be appear to have had enough. Please nobody even think of suggesting he come back. No way- No how!

https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/33146828/louisville-cardinals-talks-separate-men-basketball-coach-chris-mack-sources-say

[IM4X]

Lots of people chiming in about the news/rumors. According to one source, there will be a meeting We’d at 8:30am with the Louisville players, Mack and the interim AD.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.aseaofblue.com/platform/amp/2022/1/25/22901918/louisville-basketball-twitter-chris-mack-separation-agreement

[atljar]

We could give them another head coach.....

[X-man]

There's a cautionary tale in here somewhere. Gillen, Matta, Miller, and now apparently Mack all got fired from their jobs (Gillen switched jobs a second time before his firing from UVa). Only Prosser failed to be fired, but of course he sadly died in his office at Wake.

[xavierj]

There's a cautionary tale in here somewhere. Gillen, Matta, Miller, and now apparently Mack all got fired from their jobs (Gillen switched jobs a second time before his firing from UVa. Only Prosser failed to be fired, but of course he sadly died in his office at Wake.

All but Mack had some success though. I think that sounds about right as Mack was the worst coach of them all. He just got lucky with having probably the best talent when he was successful at Xavier. I mean he isn’t at Louisville without being handed Millers guys at first, Crawford and TU, and then landing Trevon, JP and Sumner when in the Big East. I mean his last two years in the A-10 with his guys he had a 19-13 league record. And then his first two years in the Big east he was 19-17. Then Trevon and JP showed up and made him some money. He was a failure at Louisville. They got worse every year under his watch and then he started throwing everyone under the bus.

[bleedXblue]

All but Mack had some success though. I think that sounds about right as Mack was the worst coach of them all. He just got lucky with having probably the best talent when he was successful at Xavier. I mean he isn’t at Louisville without being handed Millers guys at first, Crawford and TU, and then landing Trevon, JP and Sumner when in the Big East. I mean his last two years in the A-10 with his guys he had a 19-13 league record. And then his first two years in the Big east he was 19-17. Then Trevon and JP showed up and made him some money. He was a failure at Louisville. They got worse every year under his watch and then he started throwing everyone under the bus.

That's the coaching profession and I think exactly why he left Xavier. He knew what he had pulled off was going to be very hard to do year in and year out at Xavier. UL came calling, offered him a boatload of cash and it was a good family fit. Cant say I blame him for making 20+ million dollars over a 3-4 year period. Set for life.

[murray87]

Mack should have never left.

He could have realistically been coach for life if he had stayed. But I'm still raw at the way he was mentally checked out at the end of his last season all while having a top 10 team and #1 seed in the tourney. I guess in his mind the 30 pieces of silver was worth it. Nice coaching legacy.

[markchal]

truly baffling how some fans hate every single coach after they leave, when it's a move many of us would make in their shoes. Matta, Miller and Mack all left the program in better shape than they inherited it and took us to new heights. I'm appreciative of ALL of those guys and what they did to build our program.

Mack is the most successful coach in program history, AND he's an alum. I get that he left for a better job, but it's been long enough that the hate should die down a bit.

[Xavier]

I know we give excuses to Steele for covid issues X faced. But Mack’s story could be way different if the tournament didn’t get canceled a couple years ago. Louisville was top 10 I think, at least they were 9th KenPom. In line for 3 seed. Who knows how he does there, I don’t have to tell you about his tournament chokes, but getting to the sweet 16, maybe elite 8 that year buys him a lot more time/builds momentum at new program.

Covid hits and that year is forgotten about.

[Murph85]

truly baffling how some fans hate every single coach after they leave, when it's a move many of us would make in their shoes. Matta, Miller and Mack all left the program in better shape than they inherited it and took us to new heights. I'm appreciative of ALL of those guys and what they did to build our program.

Mack is the most successful coach in program history, AND he's an alum. I get that he left for a better job, but it's been long enough that the hate should die down a bit.


I agree with the basic content of this but he has an Aaron Rodgers thing going.

[xavierj]

truly baffling how some fans hate every single coach after they leave, when it's a move many of us would make in their shoes. Matta, Miller and Mack all left the program in better shape than they inherited it and took us to new heights. I'm appreciative of ALL of those guys and what they did to build our program.

Mack is the most successful coach in program history, AND he's an alum. I get that he left for a better job, but it's been long enough that the hate should die down a bit.

How did he leave the program better than he found it? Xavier was very good before he got the job and he was left with Tu Holloway, Jason Love, Mark Lyons and Jordan Crawford. He left Travis with no recruiting class and role players from the year before Naji Marshall, Quentin Gooden and Paul Scruggs.

[Masterofreality]

All but Mack had some success though. I think that sounds about right as Mack was the worst coach of them all. He just got lucky with having probably the best talent when he was successful at Xavier. I mean he isn’t at Louisville without being handed Millers guys at first, Crawford and TU, and then landing Trevon, JP and Sumner when in the Big East. I mean his last two years in the A-10 with his guys he had a 19-13 league record. And then his first two years in the Big east he was 19-17. Then Trevon and JP showed up and made him some money. He was a failure at Louisville. They got worse every year under his watch and then he started throwing everyone under the bus.

Travis Steele was the reason why Tre and Ed came to XU. Rick Carter found and convinced JP.
Mack had nobody like that to help him at UL.
Just like I said on an earlier thread. Steele & Mack as a combo were super. Apart they are lacking.
And it also proves that Mack being forced to fire Dino and Luke was detrimental. Performance regressed and players were pissed. Luke is now doing a great job at UConn with their guards. Think him not being here contributed to Goodin’s decline? Methinks so.
Again, proving that good Assistants make a much better Coach.

[bleedXblue]

Travis Steele was the reason why Tre and Ed came to XU. Rick Carter found and convinced JP.
Mack had nobody like that to help him at UL.
Just like I said on an earlier thread. Steele & Mack as a combo were super. Apart they are lacking.
And it also proves that Mack being forced to fire Dino and Luke was detrimental. Performance regressed and players were pissed. Luke is now doing a great job at UConn with their guards. Think him not being here contributed to Goodin’s decline? Methinks so.
Again, proving that good Assistants make a much better Coach.

Hence why we need BETTER assistants.........just isnt working right now IMHO

[markchal]

How did he leave the program better than he found it? Xavier was very good before he got the job and he was left with Tu Holloway, Jason Love, Mark Lyons and Jordan Crawford. He left Travis with no recruiting class and role players from the year before Naji Marshall, Quentin Gooden and Paul Scruggs.

Mack inherited a good mid-major and left behind a good major. He's not responsible for jumping conferences, but he IS responsible for winning a Big East Title, the program's first No. 1 seed, and some good tournament runs. That level of success definitely matters and makes a difference.

[bleedXblue]

Mack inherited a good mid-major and left behind a good major. He's not responsible for jumping conferences, but he IS responsible for winning a Big East Title, the program's first No. 1 seed, and some good tournament runs. That level of success definitely matters and makes a difference.

absolutely and without any question.....

To think otherwise is just foolish....

[Xavier]

How did he leave the program better than he found it? Xavier was very good before he got the job and he was left with Tu Holloway, Jason Love, Mark Lyons and Jordan Crawford. He left Travis with no recruiting class and role players from the year before Naji Marshall, Quentin Gooden and Paul Scruggs.

Well, the program never had as much attention- and never had as much success. 2 seed, elite 8, 1 seed and big East champions his last three years as well as Xavier’s highest ever ranking. Player wise maybe not, but Mack brought X to a higher standard. I never thought Xavier could be a 1 seed. He moved the program forward, that can’t be argued

[X-man]

truly baffling how some fans hate every single coach after they leave, when it's a move many of us would make in their shoes. Matta, Miller and Mack all left the program in better shape than they inherited it and took us to new heights. I'm appreciative of ALL of those guys and what they did to build our program.

Mack is the most successful coach in program history, AND he's an alum. I get that he left for a better job, but it's been long enough that the hate should die down a bit.

Not me. I only hate the ones who sneak away while lying or sabotaging the program. I'm talking Matta and Mack. No problem with Gillen, Prosser, or Miller choosing to leave because they did so honorably.

[xavierj]

Well, the program never had as much attention- and never had as much success. 2 seed, elite 8, 1 seed and big East champions his last three years as well as Xavier’s highest ever ranking. Player wise maybe not, but Mack brought X to a higher standard. I never thought Xavier could be a 1 seed. He moved the program forward, that can’t be argued

Agree 100%. My point was if Travis didn’t get Trevon to come to Xavier none of that success happens to that extent and Chris Mack is never the Louisville coach. After landing that class with Trevon, Jp and Edmond, he never really built on that for continued success. Like when Gonzaga and Villanova had success with three and four stars, they built in that and started getting 5 stars and NBA players and have had sustained success.

[paulxu]

Like when Gonzaga and Villanova had success with three and four stars, they built in that and started getting 5 stars and NBA players and have had sustained success.

They have the advantage of the same coach staying through that process...in fact, they're both still there.
That has to help, as opposed to our coaches leaving for supposedly greener pastures.

[xukeith]

All but Mack had some success though. I think that sounds about right as Mack was the worst coach of them all. He just got lucky with having probably the best talent when he was successful at Xavier. I mean he isn’t at Louisville without being handed Millers guys at first, Crawford and TU, and then landing Trevon, JP and Sumner when in the Big East. I mean his last two years in the A-10 with his guys he had a 19-13 league record. And then his first two years in the Big east he was 19-17. Then Trevon and JP showed up and made him some money. He was a failure at Louisville. They got worse every year under his watch and then he started throwing everyone under the bus.

Isn't this what coaches do? They recruit talent. Some times talent is exceptional. Other times not so great.
Expecting miracle Final 4 runs every year is a bit of a stretch.

[IM4X]

My point was if Travis didn’t get Trevon to come to Xavier none of that success happens to that extent and Chris Mack is never the Louisville coach. After landing that class with Trevon, Jp and Edmond, he never really built on that for continued success. Like when Gonzaga and Villanova had success with three and four stars, they built in that and started getting 5 stars and NBA players and have had sustained success.

Agree. Without Tre and Ed and JP - all players who were recruited by another coach - he would not have had that #1 seed team. That team should have made it to the final four. They were that good. Mack’s inability to get that team there in the tournament because of his poor coaching told me all I needed to know. He was not ever getting us to a final four. He then tells the press later it was because he couldn’t recruit the players he wanted at X that he couldn’t get to a final four. Total BS. What a classless piece of garbage.

The truth is he was never getting Louisville to a final four. I called it and I am glad Karma prevailed here. I wish those well who have helped X, but only if they don’t then lie and unfairly trashing others- throwing them under the bus while pretending they are without any blame for things going wrong. All Mack’s weakness and shortcomings aren’t really on him. No someone else or some other thing was the reason. Right? He wants to own all the good and none of the bad. He wasn’t to admit to none of his flaws. If he just didn’t have such a huge ego… if he had not been so prickly and not thrown so many others under the bus, then maybe he wouldn’t be crashing and burning right now. Karma.

[Xavier]

Agree 100%. My point was if Travis didn’t get Trevon to come to Xavier none of that success happens to that extent and Chris Mack is never the Louisville coach. After landing that class with Trevon, Jp and Edmond, he never really built on that for continued success. Like when Gonzaga and Villanova had success with three and four stars, they built in that and started getting 5 stars and NBA players and have had sustained success.

I agree, and I think Mack and company tried to capitalize and fell short. (Weren’t they like always in on big recruits and ended up 3rd on their list?) I think they focused too much on trying to land that major guy instead of Gonzaga and Nova who slowly built the program. I still think it Miller stayed he could’ve. And if he knew X was going to Big East he would’ve. But As others say, it’s much more difficult building into a top 15 program with turnover

As for “recruited by another coach” I don’t buy it. Most assistants do majority of recruiting, when head coach comes in and tried to close the deal. At least that’s how I always perceived it. Anyone that came under Mack is a Mack recruit. Not an assistants recruit

[IM4X]

They have the advantage of the same coach staying through that process...in fact, they're both still there.
That has to help, as opposed to our coaches leaving for supposedly greener pastures.

True… but those two coaches come with the whole package: They are classy, have more integrity, are very likable, are more loyal, have elite level coaching ability, know how to land the exact players they need to win, and have a constant drive for self improvement. Mack can’t compare in any of those categories.

[D-West & PO-Z]

True… but those two coaches come with the whole package: They are classy, have more integrity, are very likable, are more loyal, have elite level coaching ability, know how to land the exact players they need to win, and have a constant drive for self improvement. Mack can’t compare in any of those categories.

I'm no Judas Mack fan at the moment, and he lacks in a lot of areas imo but you just made all that stuff up about those other two coaches, other than they clearly can coach and recruit. You have no idea about the other stuff, other than your own personal opinion if you like them. Wasn't Mark Few just arrested and suspended this year? How the hell do you know their drive for improvement? How do you know if the people around them like them?

[Blue Blooded-05]

As everyone seems to be pointing out, there are a lot of lessons and cautionary tales to take away from this mess.

To me, the biggest one is to never listen to your wife. Ever.

You’re welcome

[markchal]

Agree 100%. My point was if Travis didn’t get Trevon to come to Xavier none of that success happens to that extent and Chris Mack is never the Louisville coach. After landing that class with Trevon, Jp and Edmond, he never really built on that for continued success. Like when Gonzaga and Villanova had success with three and four stars, they built in that and started getting 5 stars and NBA players and have had sustained success.

I don't buy this either. Granted, they didn't pan out maybe, but Tyrique, Goodin, Naji and Scruggs were all some of the highest-rated recruits we've had. I think Naji and Scruggs were both top-50 even.

[IM4X]

I'm no Judas Mack fan at the moment, and he lacks in a lot of areas imo but you just made all that stuff up about those other two coaches, other than they clearly can coach and recruit. You have no idea about the other stuff, other than your own personal opinion if you like them. Wasn't Mark Few just arrested and suspended this year? How the hell do you know their drive for improvement? How do you know if the people around them like them?

Made all that stuff up? Really? How do I know their drive for improvement? Where have you been for the last 15-20 years.That is about the most obvious question to answer. I know, simply because they have continually gotten better, recruited better. They prove they get better at knowing what their opponents (especially BE opponents in Wright’s case) are going to throw at them and how to prepare for it.

They also don’t cry about not getting enough talent because of where they coach- they find ways to win with what they have and they go out and find a way to keep pulling in players they know have enough talent and are able to do what they need those players to do. How many times did Mack have Wright’s number? One time and only because X was stacked that year. Wright made sure it never happened again…cause Mack doesn’t know how to take his game to the next level snd he is not nearly as good at X’s and Ox as Wright. Wright was always better prepared than Mack.

Am I making the classy stuff up. Hell no! Have you watched how Wright and Few handle press conferences compared to Mack. Have you seen the respect they give other teams. How they respect the media. How they are not prickly and condescending.

You also can’t possibly believe I am making the loyalty thing up. Those two stuck around and proved they could keep making things better. Mack knew he couldn’t and bolted - then mouthed off how he didn’t get to a final four because he could get enough good players at X. Not true. He had the players - He just wasn’t a good enough coach to do it… and unlike Few and Wright, Mack throws his assistants under the bus when he comes up short. Few and Wright are loyal to their assistants and even help those assistants go on to be head coaches at other schools… then they just reload with new assistants.

That should about cover it for Mack. No integrity. No class. No loyalty. Should I go on. Come on D West… Please!

[noteggs]

As everyone seems to be pointing out, there are a lot of lessons and cautionary tales to take away from this mess.

To me, the biggest one is to never listen to your wife. Ever.

You’re welcome

Public Reps! That’s flat out funny!

[xavierj]

I don't buy this either. Granted, they didn't pan out maybe, but Tyrique, Goodin, Naji and Scruggs were all some of the highest-rated recruits we've had. I think Naji and Scruggs were both top-50 even.

Well it is true. The year after Bluiett is was Kaiser Gates who was a 3 star ranked 140th, the next year Goodin 4 star ranked 78th and Jones 4 star ranked 105th, then Naji 58th, Paul 34th and Hardin 138. Then Dontarius 222, Kennedy 241 and Walter 189. That’s not building on a 2 seed and a 1 seed. Meanwhile Gonzaga and Nova were reeling in 5 stars.

[IM4X]

Was stated on Louisville podcast at about the 9 minute mark: None of the players were happy. Pretty much Mack hates everyone there and everyone there hates Mack. Wow. If anyone is interested there are some extra bits of info about what was going on behind the scenes at least between the players and Mack.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cardchronicle.com/platform/amp/2022/1/26/22902833/card-chronicle-podcast-farewell-chris-mack (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cardchronicle.com/platform/amp/2022/1/26/22902833/card-chronicle-podcast-farewell-chris-mack)

[boozehound]

Well it is true. The year after Bluiett is was Kaiser Gates who was a 3 star ranked 140th, the next year Goodin 4 star ranked 78th and Jones 4 star ranked 105th, then Naji 58th, Paul 34th and Hardin 138. Then Dontarius 222, Kennedy 241 and Walter 189. That’s not building on a 2 seed and a 1 seed. Meanwhile Gonzaga and Nova were reeling in 5 stars.

The Gooden/Jones class was decent and the Marshall, Scruggs, Hardin class was pretty good (minus Harden). If your point was that Mack was never really consistent with recruiting though, I can get on board with that.

My perception of the Mack era from a recruiting perspective is that we were top 2/3 for tons of top 50 guys, especially PGs, but they almost never ended up coming here. It seemed like the staff spent a lot of time chasing guys who were not likely to ever come to X, but maybe not enough time finding the right guys between 50 and 150 to fit a scheme and contribute. It's like they took a 'best player available' approach and then tried to build around it, which led to some odd rosters and real holes to fill with transfers.

If you are in the final 2 for 3 Top 25 guards but you don't land any of them, you don't have shit.

[Masterofreality]

Was stated on Louisville podcast at about the 9 minute mark: None of the players were happy. Pretty much Mack hates everyone there and everyone there hates Mack. Wow. If anyone is interested there are some extra bits of info about what was going on behind the scenes at least between the players and Mack.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cardchronicle.com/platform/amp/2022/1/26/22902833/card-chronicle-podcast-farewell-chris-mack (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cardchronicle.com/platform/amp/2022/1/26/22902833/card-chronicle-podcast-farewell-chris-mack)

“Chris Mack was pissed off at Louisville and Louisville was pissed off at Chris Mack”

[D-West & PO-Z]

Mack got 4.8 million instead of the 12 he would have been owed. $133,000 monthly payments through Jan 2025.

[OTRMUSKIE]

Hire him as an special assistant to the traveling secretary. Steele can use all the help he can get.

[GoMuskies]

The betting favorites for the Louisville job are a familiar crew:

https://www.si.com/college/louisville/basketball/betting-odds-louisville-job
Kenny Payne +400
Scott Davenport +500
Kevin Willard +500
Steve Forbes +600
Wes Miller +700
Mark Pope +900
Chris Holtmann +1000
Ed Cooley +1100
Nate Oats +1200
Eric Musselman +1300
Andy Enfield +1500
Mick Cronin +1500
Matt McMahon +2000
Scott Drew +2500
Bruce Pearl +2500

[GoMuskies]

How many of you here were at the Rivefront Coliseum in November 1988 when Xavier beat #4 Louisville? I was! Louisville's top choice according to the oddsmakers Kenny Payne was the Louisville player who hit the tying three pointer with just a few seconds to go. That set up Tyrone Hill's heroics as the Muskies hurried the ball downcourt and Hill hit the game winner at the buzzer.

[joe titan]

How many of you here were at the Rivefront Coliseum in November 1988 when Xavier beat #4 Louisville? I was! Louisville's top choice according to the oddsmakers Kenny Payne was the Louisville player who hit the tying three pointer with just a few seconds to go. That set up Tyrone Hill's heroics as the Muskies hurried the ball downcourt and Hill hit the game winner at the buzzer.

I attended that game.

[GoMuskies]

I attended that game.

I was a 12 year old kid from Louisville wearing Cardinal red who had never really heard of Xavier. That was the loudest environment I think I'd ever been in. Obviously it made an impression as 6 years later I was a Xavier student!

[xavierj]

How many of you here were at the Rivefront Coliseum in November 1988 when Xavier beat #4 Louisville? I was! Louisville's top choice according to the oddsmakers Kenny Payne was the Louisville player who hit the tying three pointer with just a few seconds to go. That set up Tyrone Hill's heroics as the Muskies hurried the ball downcourt and Hill hit the game winner at the buzzer.

I was there as well. I was a sophomore in High School. Thought for sure after that we would see Xavier in a final 4 relatively quickly. Well 33 years later still looking for that. Remember xavier almost beating them as well at Freedom hall a few years later and then beat them in Alaska late 90’s and in the Ncaa tourney early 2000’s.

[IM4X]

How many of you here were at the Rivefront Coliseum in November 1988 when Xavier beat #4 Louisville? I was! Louisville's top choice according to the oddsmakers Kenny Payne was the Louisville player who hit the tying three pointer with just a few seconds to go. That set up Tyrone Hill's heroics as the Muskies hurried the ball downcourt and Hill hit the game winner at the buzzer.

I was there - on the floor and a hair to the left (if looking form the court) of the basket where Hill made that final bucket. One of about 10 students who were fortune enough to be given those special seats for that game. What amazing seats. What an amazing game and finish.

[Masterofreality]

How many of you here were at the Rivefront Coliseum in November 1988 when Xavier beat #4 Louisville? I was! Louisville's top choice according to the oddsmakers Kenny Payne was the Louisville player who hit the tying three pointer with just a few seconds to go. That set up Tyrone Hill's heroics as the Muskies hurried the ball downcourt and Hill hit the game winner at the buzzer.

Meeeee!! Stan Kimbrough rushed the ball up the court and set up Ty for the game winner!

[Masterofreality]

I was a 12 year old kid from Louisville wearing Cardinal red who had never really heard of Xavier. That was the loudest environment I think I'd ever been in. Obviously it made an impression as 6 years later I was a Xavier student!

The greatest thing was, because we had end zone seats, was that when you looked at the stands, exactly half was blue and half was red.
Blue won

[Masterofreality]

The betting favorites for the Louisville job are a familiar crew:

https://www.si.com/college/louisville/basketball/betting-odds-louisville-job
Kenny Payne +400
Scott Davenport +500
Kevin Willard +500
Steve Forbes +600
Wes Miller +700
Mark Pope +900
Chris Holtmann +1000
Ed Cooley +1100
Nate Oats +1200
Eric Musselman +1300
Andy Enfield +1500
Mick Cronin +1500
Matt McMahon +2000
Scott Drew +2500
Bruce Pearl +2500

That would be the height of hilarity if Davenport & Mack switched jobs! :-))

[xubrew]

Louisville Twitter is hilarious.

They think Bruce Pearl is who they should hire and actually think they may get him.

They also acknowledge that former player and I guess current NBA Assistant Kenny Payne is a candidate, but worry about how he doesn't have any head coaching experience and fear that they'll become like Memphis if they hire a former player from the NBA with no experience.

Yes, Memphis is a school that went on several deep NCAA Tournament runs, but due to NCAA sanctions had to vacate them all and they haven't really recovered from it or been relevant since. Geez, what a shame if Louisville ended up like that!!!

[Lloyd Braun]

I heard Travis Steele is a candidate.

[Masterofreality]

I heard Travis Steele is a candidate.

Please take him!!! (Echoes VD fan with Brian Gregory)

[GoMuskies]

Even now the Louisville and Memphis jobs are in different stratospheres.

[waggy]

How many of you here were at the Rivefront Coliseum in November 1988 when Xavier beat #4 Louisville?

That was a great atmosphere.

[IM4X]

Some more revelations about the firing of Mack. I found it interesting what the interim AD said starting at the 13:50 mark about how the players were no longer really responding to Mack and that was a huge factor in not waiting any longer to let him go.

Can’t help but wonder if he started blaming players (the way he blamed the assistants he fired) for his own shortcomings

https://m.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1247&v=vwzEuJ1LnMs&feature=emb_logo

[Masterofreality]

So Mack is effectively going to get paid $1.2 million/year over this and the next 3 years after.
So he can sit on his boat and fish and be bored, or can take a job, even an Assistant’s job, get paid and be active. Hmmm.
He only wanted to coach to 55, soooo.

[xukeith]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmWdCSv5mug


link is 5-6 minutes of Jeff Goodman, Sean Miller and Randolph Childress give their top candidates to replace Chris Mack at Louisville.

They love Mick Cronin but know he isn't going to Louisville. Matt Painter not leaving his alma mater. Bruce Pearl not leaving Auburn......

Sean looks rested.

[Xuperman]

Easy fix....Get Rick Stansbury in for a quick interview and immediate hire. Problem solved.

[UCGRAD4X]

So Mack is effectively going to get paid $1.2 million/year over this and the next 3 years after.
So he can sit on his boat and fish and be bored, or can take a job, even an Assistant’s job, get paid and be active. Hmmm.
He only wanted to coach to 55, soooo.

There is no way in hell Mack takes any assistant job. His ego is WAY too big for that.

[Masterofreality]

There is no way in hell Mack takes any assistant job. His ego is WAY to big for that.

Maybe, but when your last job was a dumpster fire, egos can take a hit. Self reflection is a valuable tool. So is a punch to the nose.
Let’s see which way he goes with a pocketful of cash

[Lloyd Braun]

Louisville looked like a different team today. Strange…

[Masterofreality]

L

[WCWIII]

Wish the Macks' the best moving forward. But I do want especially want to recognize Mike Pegues and his awesome mother. It was great when they were part of the Xavier program. Hope things work out in the end for them.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Mack's twitter profile now says "retired coach". Thought that was interesting.

[bjf123]

Mack's twitter profile now says "retired coach". Thought that was interesting.

What else would he put? “Disgraced former D1 basketball coach”, “Fired coach”, “Collecting a nice paycheck to do nothing coach”? The possibilities are endless. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[boozehound]

Wish the Macks' the best moving forward. But I do want especially want to recognize Mike Pegues and his awesome mother. It was great when they were part of the Xavier program. Hope things work out in the end for them.

Hopefully Mike can parlay this into some kind of a HC gig.

[xubrew]

HOT TAKE!! Louisville is REALLY bad!!!!

[GoMuskies]

If they had just hit 11 more threes they'd have totally beaten Va Tech yesterday.

[paulxu]

The Hokies’ last win in the series was on February 13, 1991, a 72-56 home victory.

Mike Young is very happy. 31 years is a LONG time.

[GoMuskies]

A prominent group of Louisville boosters is campaigning to bring Tom Jurich back as Louisville AD. These aren't run of the mill boosters, though. If you know the names on Louisville's athletics facilities, these guys ARE those names. It at least covers the names on the baseball stadium, soccer stadium and indoor football practice facility. They're gearing up for a mess down there. Oh, and Denny Crum said if Jurich came back, he's done with Cardinal athletics. This despite the fact that one of his former players is now the head coach, another of his former players is an assistant coach, and the son of one of his former players is another assistant coach. The hatred between the Crums and Jurichs runs deep.

https://www.wdrb.com/sports/crawford-jurich-supporters-to-ramp-up-efforts-to-make-him-a-candidate-for-louisville-ad/article_4bfb4c3c-bad2-11ec-a1b2-9ff6661cbf37.html

[D-West & PO-Z]

Mack's twitter profile now says "retired coach". Thought that was interesting.

He no longer has the retired coach line.

[xavierj]

He no longer has the retired coach line.

His house in Louisville is also up for sale. Heard his dad is pretty sick so bet he is moving back toward Cincinnati until he figures out his next steps in his career.

[D-West & PO-Z]

His house in Louisville is also up for sale. Heard his dad is pretty sick so bet he is moving back toward Cincinnati until he figures out his next steps in his career.

I'd be pretty surprised if he uproots his family from Louisville and it not being bc he took a job somewhere else. I thought that was pat of the reason a lot of people thought he wouldn't coach again any time soon, maybe ever.

Although I just learned of his dad being sick, so I guess that would be possible.

[Xville]

Whispers around town there may be some marriage trouble.

[paulxu]

RIP Mack's dad.

[Xville]

Trying to coverup what was a crazy assistant coach extortion attempt is pretty stupid even by Louisville standards:

https://mobile.twitter.com/ericcrawford/status/1546622329807052803?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcam p%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

Assuming that’s going to be a nice payout for the whistleblower. A friend of mine is a friend of hers and sent me her filing on Friday… I wonder when Louisville is finally going to not do something stupid.