Is this a problem?

[Xuperman]

Even though the now constant fluidity of the transfer reality will keep things interesting, there will be the inevitable dead space on boards like this until late summer. I want to throw something out for discussion that has perplexed me for a very, very long time.

Looking at the general landscape of D1 BBall, particularly during Tourney time, it always seems to be loaded with INTERNATIONAL talent in most cases. "WHY" does X continue to do nothing, to procure any of these fine players? What is not being done HERE, that so many are reaping significant benefit?

In particular in the "Big Man" area. Through what methods and channels are so many programs getting a plethora of TRUE BIGS, from say Africa, South America, Eastern Europe? Xavier desperately needs to roster these type guys to have any realistic long term success in this league....nearly everybody else in conference has them. One would think a fine institution like Xavier, would be a magnet for these guys. What are we not doing?

Just would like to hear from some of the more experienced voices here, on why X continues to have zero success landing these type players.

[xavierj]

Even though the now constant fluidity of the transfer reality will keep things interesting, there will be the inevitable dead space on boards like this until late summer. I want to throw something out for discussion that has perplexed me for a very, very long time.

Looking at the general landscape of D1 BBall, particularly during Tourney time, it always seems to be loaded with INTERNATIONAL talent in most cases. "WHY" does X continue to do nothing, to procure any of these fine players? What is not being done HERE, that so many are reaping significant benefit?

In particular in the "Big Man" area. Through what methods and channels are so many programs getting a plethora of TRUE BIGS, from say Africa, South America, Eastern Europe? Xavier desperately needs to roster these type guys to have any realistic long term success in this league....nearly everybody else in conference has them. One would think a fine institution like Xavier, would be a magnet for these guys. What are we not doing?

Just would like to hear from some of the more experienced voices here, on why X continues to have zero success landing these type players.

Who are the foreign guys in the Big East. Seton Hall and Georgetown I think had one. UConn has one, but he is more of a finesse guy. I don’t think Nova and Creighton have any.

[xu82]

Even though the now constant fluidity of the transfer reality will keep things interesting, there will be the inevitable dead space on boards like this until late summer. I want to throw something out for discussion that has perplexed me for a very, very long time.

Looking at the general landscape of D1 BBall, particularly during Tourney time, it always seems to be loaded with INTERNATIONAL talent in most cases. "WHY" does X continue to do nothing, to procure any of these fine players? What is not being done HERE, that so many are reaping significant benefit?

In particular in the "Big Man" area. Through what methods and channels are so many programs getting a plethora of TRUE BIGS, from say Africa, South America, Eastern Europe? Xavier desperately needs to roster these type guys to have any realistic long term success in this league....nearly everybody else in conference has them. One would think a fine institution like Xavier, would be a magnet for these guys. What are we not doing?

Just would like to hear from some of the more experienced voices here, on why X continues to have zero success landing these type players.

Being the team guy that I am, I am willing to commit a full month, maybe even two, to scouring Italy in search of our next great big man. I will do this in much the same manner that OJ searched every golf course in Florida searching for the real killer.

But first, I’m going to need a little advance for expenses. To whom do I submit this invoice?

[Xuperman]

Who are the foreign guys in the Big East. Seton Hall and Georgetown I think had one. UConn has one, but he is more of a finesse guy. I don’t think Nova and Creighton have any.

C'mon. A list of names is not necessary (there are plenty). Its just that I perceive this as a problem for X in today's game. Point is, X does not get ANY International talent, where as many top programs do....some high profile programs rely on it.

I only pose the question for discussion. What is keeping Xavier from utilizing this vast International pool of talent? Is it a financial situation to have scouts in other countries or just an overall philosophy?

[Xavier]

Always thought it would be cool to have international scout but at the end of the day I don’t know that it’s a huge difference and worth spending the money.

[Xuperman]

Always thought it would be cool to have international scout but at the end of the day I don’t know that it’s a huge difference and worth spending the money.

That's my point. Is it a full time job or just connections that funnel this top talent thru?

[Backyard Champ]

Is it even worth it? I feel like it’s difficult to get international players to even want to play college ball. At the end of the day, I feel like it’s a waste of recruiting time. Maybe I’m missing something, but I don’t see the huge impact international players are making. Certainly not worth the effort to focus recruiting on them.
Only way I could see it being beneficial to pour resources into it, would be if we could get a pipeline of recruits. Even then, I’m not entirely sure it would be a gamble worth taking.

[D-West & PO-Z]

My guess is that the coaches who get these players have some connection through a coach or someone who tips them off to the player. Or they got one from a certain area that leads to others in the future.

Majerus had a couple different players from Australia and New Zealand while at SLU that were really good players for them when he got them to national relevance. This may have been because he had an in due to having Andrew Bogut at Utah? Not sure.

[xeus]

Looking at the general landscape of D1 BBall, particularly during Tourney time, it always seems to be loaded with INTERNATIONAL talent in most cases. "WHY" does X continue to do nothing, to procure any of these fine players? What is not being done HERE, that so many are reaping significant benefit?

I can't tell if you really think this is a problem or if you felt the board needed yet another thread to complain about something.

Here's a list of 24/7's 2020 top international recruits: https://247sports.com/Season/2020-Basketball/RecruitRankings/?InstitutionGroup=highschool&State=Int

Who do you wish X had gone after and why?

I personally think there is a disproportionate ROI to scout and recruit internationally, and there are always additional considerations (and risks) with these kids qualifying. Bottom line is that I haven't seen any issues with X's recruiting at all, and not sure why the lack of international players is a concern for you.

[GIMMFD]

My guess is that the coaches who get these players have some connection through a coach or someone who tips them off to the player. Or they got one from a certain area that leads to others in the future.

Majerus had a couple different players from Australia and New Zealand while at SLU that were really good players for them when he got them to national relevance. This may have been because he had an in due to having Andrew Bogut at Utah? Not sure.

I could just be assuming this but doesn't Gonzaga do pretty well internationally? I'm sure they have a system set up. I know for football there's companies that help grow their exposure and facilitate recruitment to get those guys over, but I'd assume basketball is different considering all the Euro leagues and ability to make money before heading over to the NBA. I'd also have to say having an international scout is not cheap, anybody wanna start a Go FundMe?

[Xuperman]

I can't tell if you really think this is a problem or if you felt the board needed yet another thread to complain about something.

Here's a list of 24/7's 2020 top international recruits: https://247sports.com/Season/2020-Basketball/RecruitRankings/?InstitutionGroup=highschool&State=Int

Who do you wish X had gone after and why?

I personally think there is a disproportionate ROI to scout and recruit internationally, and there are always additional considerations (and risks) with these kids qualifying. Bottom line is that I haven't seen any issues with X's recruiting at all, and not sure why the lack of international players is a concern for you.

Are you kidding? Any of those big guys! But, X is not close to landing one. What is UConn doing that X is not? If the subject of the thread is perceived as a complaint, it's only out of curiosity/jealousy.

[paulxu]

I think Mack flew to Greece once. Does that count?

[whopper]

not a bad thought. Cincinnati is not a cosmopolitan city that may be a destination for foreign players. I assume there are independent contractor scouts representing their players (not as agents of course but kind of a clearing house). University of Hartford Conn actually made the dance as a 16 with a bunch of mediocre Euro players(good for their conference of course). I loved Martin Krempl at Creighton and Mama at Seton Hall and many schools seemed to have an African player via Europe

[xuphan]

Even though the now constant fluidity of the transfer reality will keep things interesting, there will be the inevitable dead space on boards like this until late summer. I want to throw something out for discussion that has perplexed me for a very, very long time.

Looking at the general landscape of D1 BBall, particularly during Tourney time, it always seems to be loaded with INTERNATIONAL talent in most cases. "WHY" does X continue to do nothing, to procure any of these fine players? What is not being done HERE, that so many are reaping significant benefit?

In particular in the "Big Man" area. Through what methods and channels are so many programs getting a plethora of TRUE BIGS, from say Africa, South America, Eastern Europe? Xavier desperately needs to roster these type guys to have any realistic long term success in this league....nearly everybody else in conference has them. One would think a fine institution like Xavier, would be a magnet for these guys. What are we not doing?

Just would like to hear from some of the more experienced voices here, on why X continues to have zero success landing these type players.

This is not a problem. Steele is a great recruiter. If they are good enough to play, Steele will find them.

[Strange Brew]

not a bad thought. Cincinnati is not a cosmopolitan city that may be a destination for foreign players. I assume there are independent contractor scouts representing their players (not as agents of course but kind of a clearing house). University of Hartford Conn actually made the dance as a 16 with a bunch of mediocre Euro players(good for their conference of course). I loved Martin Krempl at Creighton and Mama at Seton Hall and many schools seemed to have an African player via Europe

It’s too bad because Cincy used to be more cosmopolitan. It had 5 star restaurants downtown and a great German place in the Mason area. Losing Chiquita and PG not really being headquartered there (like it used to be) hurt I guess.

And losing the Delta hub hurt.

[boozehound]

It’s too bad because Cincy used to be more cosmopolitan. It had 5 star restaurants downtown and a great German place in the Mason area. Losing Chiquita and PG not really being headquartered there (like it used to be) hurt I guess.

And losing the Delta hub hurt.

I believe P&G still fully occupies the twin towers as well as the Central building. We left three years ago now, but at the time we left I think Cincy was about as ‘cosmopolitan’ as I can ever recall it being. OTR continues to explode with new bars and restaurants. People are paying like $600K for row houses in the City. The business district was a bit dead in the evenings, but there was nightlife at the banks as well as the aforementioned OTR.

It’s not NYC or Chicago, but for a mid-sized city in the Midwest I think they stack up fairly well. I don’t see the Cincy location as any kind of recruiting problem for international players or otherwise.

[Strange Brew]

I believe P&G still fully occupies the twin towers as well as the Central building. We left three years ago now, but at the time we left I think Cincy was about as ‘cosmopolitan’ as I can ever recall it being. OTR continues to explode with new bars and restaurants. People are paying like $600K for row houses in the City. The business district was a bit dead in the evenings, but there was nightlife at the banks as well as the aforementioned OTR.

It’s not NYC or Chicago, but for a mid-sized city in the Midwest I think they stack up fairly well. I don’t see the Cincy location as any kind of recruiting problem for international players or otherwise.

The towers are still occupied but the business is not as centralized from what the PGers I’ve worked with told me. Cincy is more interesting than the 00’s but in the 80s and 90s it was more International than most Mid-Western/Southern cities. Atlanta and Nashville weren’t what they are now. Neither was Charlotte or Pittsburgh. Before you laugh at Pit it’s getting the Hollywood films Cincy used to.

No sports titles since 1990 also hurts awareness of the city....

[XUGRAD80]

IMO it’s more about relationships between the coaching staff at X and coaches/managers in other countries, AND as more of the top foreign players are coming to the US for prep schools, it is about developing relationships with prep school coaches. I’ve not traveled extensively in Europe or elsewhere, but I have spent some time in England, Italy, Mexico, and Central America and truthfully what most people seem to know about the US is what they have seen on TV programs that play on their networks...The Real Housewives, Dallas/Dynasty, old sitcoms, etc....and the news. They know NY, Washington, LA but the rest of the country is pretty much a mystery. Lots of schools have done really well with no foreign players, others have had them and not done so well. ( UC has had plenty over the last few years, and none of them has been what I’d call impactful. )

[usfldan]

Looking at some of these guys, a number of international players seem to come to the US to finish their high school/prep school education here, and/or are transfers from other colleges. Just as an example, at Baylor one moved to Virginia at 14 and the other is a transfer from UNLV. So while it may help to have connections overseas, I don't think its a requirement.
There was a recruit from Greece (Sasha Vezenkov- I had to look it up), who committed and then decided to stay in Greece. That may have soured Xavier on the idea of recruiting directly overseas. There was also Kanter, so we've not totally avoided international players.

[boozehound]

The towers are still occupied but the business is not as centralized from what the PGers I’ve worked with told me. Cincy is more interesting than the 00’s but in the 80s and 90s it was more International than most Mid-Western/Southern cities. Atlanta and Nashville weren’t what they are now. Neither was Charlotte or Pittsburgh. Before you laugh at Pit it’s getting the Hollywood films Cincy used to.

No sports titles since 1990 also hurts awareness of the city....

In the context of the argument in this thread though, I'm not seeing schools in Pitt, Charlotte, Nashville, etc. luring international recruits that Xavier can't get because they don't want to move to Cincinnati. I think international recruiting has a lot more to do with a coaching staff putting in the time to develop a 'pipeline' to a particular school or region than anything else (as XUGRAD80 stated).

Xavier's campus does kind of suck when compared to a lot of other schools though. That is probably a bigger problem. Unless things have changed a lot in the 15 years since I graduated, that is. There is one bar (RIP Soupies and the Woods) and they are an actual 'real' bar that cards kids. The student housing is mostly on-campus or in Norwood which has a police force that cracks down on partying. No greek life. When I went there we lived in the ghetto on the other side of Reading road so that we could party without having the cops called, but I think we were one of the last houses to do so and we dealt with our share of issues from the locals in the area.

[nuts4xu]

Just would like to hear from some of the more experienced voices here, on why X continues to have zero success landing these type players.

Romain Sato might beg to differ with you on this comment. Xavier and the assistants focus their recruiting efforts in areas they have the best chance to gain talent. On the surface, recruiting true foreign players requires a larger budget. Chris Mack once recruited a kid from Europe, flew across the world to attempt to land him. Kid decided to play for his national team instead.

There are more than enough talented kids in the United States to fill out our roster. You don’t need players from any specific part of the world to be successful. I would prefer our coaches mine talent from Indiana, or New York, or Chicago, or wherever they are best connected.

It is not a “problem” we focus on players based in the United States, and bringing in guys from foreign lands does not mean we suddenly get back to high tournament seeds.

Xavier needs to bring in tall, strong, fast, good shooting, shot blocking, rebounding players that are suited to the style of play this coaching staff wants to play...should be enough kids in this country to fill 11 or 12 spots on our roster.

[xudash]

In the context of the argument in this thread though, I'm not seeing schools in Pitt, Charlotte, Nashville, etc. luring international recruits that Xavier can't get because they don't want to move to Cincinnati. I think international recruiting has a lot more to do with a coaching staff putting in the time to develop a 'pipeline' to a particular school or region than anything else (as XUGRAD80 stated).

Xavier's campus does kind of suck when compared to a lot of other schools though. That is probably a bigger problem. Unless things have changed a lot in the 15 years since I graduated, that is. There is one bar (RIP Soupies and the Woods) and they are an actual 'real' bar that cards kids. The student housing is mostly on-campus or in Norwood which has a police force that cracks down on partying. No greek life. When I went there we lived in the ghetto on the other side of Reading road so that we could party without having the cops called, but I think we were one of the last houses to do so and we dealt with our share of issues from the locals in the area.

If you are pointing out that you have not been back to Xavier's campus in the last 15 years, I would consider retracting your statement about X's campus. Over a quarter billion dollars in capital projects have taken place since then.

[boozehound]

If you are pointing out that you have not been back to Xavier's campus in the last 15 years, I would consider retracting your statement about X's campus. Over a quarter billion dollars in capital projects have taken place since then.

I got my MBA there more recently (had classes in the new Smith Hall) and have attended games there as recently as 2 years ago. They certainly have improved the Campus a lot. I do still think that compared to a lot of larger 'land grant' schools, or even some smaller schools like Villanova, Xavier's student experience lags, unless things have changed a lot. Campus might be a poor choice of wording though - a lot of the issues I see have to do with the surrounding area and off campus experience, which isn't really in the University's control. I'm not sure if/how that factors in to basketball player's decision making process though. I'd like to think that they aren't there to party, but they are still college kids.

[paulxu]

You got to stop into Dana's.