Coach Steele

[OTRMUSKIE]

And go...

[GoMuskies]

No, they were saying boooo....urns.

[xudash]

No.

[IM4X]

I am going to speak up when I think a coach isn’t doing his best or if a coach isn’t good enough.

In Steele’s case, I believe he is simply not coaching nearly to the level he is capable. His players are doing a lot of the same stupid things they’ve been doing for a long, long time and he apparently has not been doing enough to fix it. He absolutely has earned criticism as have his players.

Still, I am nowhere near ready for the “Fire Steele” conversation. I am simply at the “WTF&$@$” Steele... “You and your team should be so much better and smarter than this” stage.

[OTRMUSKIE]

not His fault players miss shots but he is clearly being out coached. I think he needs new bench coaches. We are all frustrated and I started this thread tongue in cheek but I’m very concerned right now.

[xu koop scoop]

No. He lost himself as a great assistant. He lost Murray & others. He may not have good assistants right now. Their importance is often overlooked. He was outcoached by iconic Jay Wright, McDermott with 500 career wins & an established coach at Seton Hall. His Core 4 got us to the NIT last year & that was only due to a late season surge. His supporting cast is no better this year than last year. I do wish he'd finally say, "The lineup I've been playing isn't getting it done." Then he might try starting KyKy or Freemantle with Jones at the same time. Maybe even go back to Leighton Schrand for a game to send a message. Just remember, when Coach Steele gets good after 5 or so seasons, he can then leave like ALL the others have done

[XU 87]

not His fault players miss shots but he is clearly being out coached. I think he needs new bench coaches. We are all frustrated and I started this thread tongue in cheek but I’m very concerned right now.

Coaching has nothing to do with multiple players missing wide open threes. They weren’t even guarding Goodin. The guy can’t shoot.

[XU 87]

[QUOTE=Maybe even go back to Leighton Schrand for a game to send a message. [/QUOTE]

I’m speechless.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

I am going to speak up when I think a coach isn’t doing his best or if a coach isn’t good enough.

In Steele’s case, I believe he is simply not coaching nearly to the level he is capable. His players are doing a lot of the same stupid things they’ve been doing for a long, long time and he apparently has not been doing enough to fix it. He absolutely has earned criticism as have his players.

Still, I am nowhere near ready for the “Fire Steele” conversation. I am simply at the “WTF&$@$” Steele... “You and your team should be so much better and smarter than this” stage.

Yes, the players share a bunch of the blame for their performance. But, Steele is the coach. It is his job to put together a plan that allows his team to play to their strengths, minimize their weaknesses and do the opposite to our opponents. It is hard to argue that he has done that. Who among us, before this season began, was lamenting "Gee we only have four starters back and that transfer from O.U. who was their best player?" We expected more. First from the players but also from our coach.

My take is that he just isn't yet ready. And that assessment probably applies to the rest of his staff as well. But, like you, there is absolutely no way I support his termination. We all need to give him time to grow into his job. It may be painful. To date, it has been painful. But, if we want a coach to be loyal to us (and, let's face it, we haven't found that coach in recent times), we need to be loyal to him. We've got to show him our commitment so he can grow and become the coach we all want him to be.

[bjf123]

Way too early to be talking about this. As I said in another thread, if we’re struggling like this again next year and don’t make the NCAA tourney for a 3rd straight year, assuming we don’t make it this year, then his seat gets hot. He still doesn’t get fired.


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[xu koop scoop]

Weren't we 3-8 in BE last year & somehow win 6 of last 7 to finish 9-9. We are only 1-3 at this point. 9-9 looks difficult again, yet I would accept that & move on.

[GoMuskies]

Weren't we 3-8 in BE last year & somehow win 6 of last 7 to finish 9-9. We are only 1-3 at this point. 9-9 looks difficult again, yet I would accept that & move on.

Accept that? Hell, I'd vote for a contract extension and a raise!

[KFX]

Yes, the players share a bunch of the blame for their performance. But, Steele is the coach. It is his job to put together a plan that allows his team to play to their strengths, minimize their weaknesses and do the opposite to our opponents. It is hard to argue that he has done that. Who among us, before this season began, was lamenting "Gee we only have four starters back and that transfer from O.U. who was their best player?" We expected more. First from the players but also from our coach.

My take is that he just isn't yet ready. And that assessment probably applies to the rest of his staff as well. But, like you, there is absolutely no way I support his termination. We all need to give him time to grow into his job. It may be painful. To date, it has been painful. But, if we want a coach to be loyal to us (and, let's face it, we haven't found that coach in recent times), we need to be loyal to him. We've got to show him our commitment so he can grow and become the coach we all want him to be.

I’m no fan of Steele but good take here.

[AviatorX]

Accept that? Hell, I'd vote for a contract extension and a raise!

Seriously. That probably means white jerseys the first game of the NCAA’s.

[xu koop scoop]

(Consider comment in a humorous, yet over the top payback vein), No desire to Fire Steele, but setting Mack's house on Fire for what he did seems reasonable.

[whopper]

I think to save the season the fans have to suck it up and support the team even when the play is unsupportable. I can dissect a game with the best of them and still play at 64 2 or 3 x a week, but I would hate to see Cintas turned into a negative environment or even apathetic. Every game is winnable still, and I have seen at UConn the fans become apathetic and negative and it hurts the team and (in the case of a Jesuit private school) the value add a good Big East schedule gives for enrollment, endowment etc. I am very aggravated (again my blood pressure goes from 120 to 180 during a tight and/or bad game and pulse from 62 to 85) and watched Butler, Villanova, Seton Hall, Marquette games this weekend wishing we played like them but have to accept the bad with the good. Love reading all the analysis.

[UCGRAD4X]

I think to save the season the fans have to suck it up and support the team even when the play is unsupportable. I can dissect a game with the best of them and still play at 64 2 or 3 x a week, but I would hate to see Cintas turned into a negative environment or even apathetic. Every game is winnable still, and I have seen at UConn the fans become apathetic and negative and it hurts the team and (in the case of a Jesuit private school) the value add a good Big East schedule gives for enrollment, endowment etc. I am very aggravated (again my blood pressure goes from 120 to 180 during a tight and/or bad game and pulse from 62 to 85) and watched Butler, Villanova, Seton Hall, Marquette games this weekend wishing we played like them but have to accept the bad with the good. Love reading all the analysis.

What adds to the frustration is that this is happening at Cintas. If it happens on the road we say, "Man it's tough to win on the road in the Big East."

Not for Seton Hall or Creighton, apparently.

I can't see many of our fans becoming complacent and making the home court even less of an advantage. I hope they are few and far between.

[hydmuskie]

Steele has this season and the next before I would seriously question him. When I look through the recruiting lens I am always looking for 2 strong contributors in each recruiting class. I think kyKy and Zach have the potential to be that by the end of this season with Miles being a sleeper.

Next year seems to be loaded too - but we won't know till the class shows up and we get to 5 games into conf play.

My jury is out till end of next year - but I think we are right where I expected him to be. Middle of the pack of the 2nd most difficult conf in the land. Would I like more? Hell ya!!! But reality is that we are who we are - and its a decent enough place...

and because i can't help myself - look at UC and the AAC.... ugggghhhhhhh

[OTRMUSKIE]

I just hope Travis isn’t all the coaches VD has had over the years. It scares me to think we could fall like VD did after the 80’s. They are good this year but we all know that is just a fluke. Please Steele make me proud again!!!!

[OTRMUSKIE]

Way too early to be talking about this. As I said in another thread, if we’re struggling like this again next year and don’t make the NCAA tourney for a 3rd straight year, assuming we don’t make it this year, then his seat gets hot. He still doesn’t get fired.

I agree with this. My dad just told me he has seen X struggle in Jan only to heat up when it counts so let’s hope the past is the future. BTW Justin Doellman and David Bell at Madtree after the game. Not sure why Bell was there. He is tiny.
Next year seems to be loaded too - but we won't know till the class shows up and we get to 5 games into conf play.

My jury is out till end of next year - but I think we are right where I expected him to be. Middle of the pack of the 2nd most difficult conf in the land. Would I like more? Hell ya!!! But reality is that we are who we are - and its a decent enough place...

and because i can't help myself - look at UC and the AAC.... ugggghhhhhhh



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[stammina0721]

This is the worst thread ever. You started it I'll hopefully end it... And stop!!!

[bjf123]

Well, this is not a good stat. Hope it’s not a precursor to finishing under .500 in conference play for the first time in decades.

https://twitter.com/PaulFritschner/status/1216124177729585152


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[kellernr]

not His fault players miss shots but he is clearly being out coached. I think he needs new bench coaches. We are all frustrated and I started this thread tongue in cheek but I’m very concerned right now.I would say it's his fault guys are missing shots becuase he is playing those guys extended minutes. Q needs to come off the bench to help light a fire under him. Didnt Duncan get pulled from the starting lineup as a senior when he wasnt playing great then tore it up as the 6th man? Tandy isnt the saviour forms but atleast he can shoot and his misses arent off by much. Q barely draws iron on most shots.

I dont mind moore out there becuase hes a good defender but you cannot play him with Q. Already down 2 offensive threats there.

I would really like to see Miles get on the floor. Need the rebounding help and he apparently looked great in spain over the summer. Also gets him some game experience so hes not trying to get up to game speed next season the first few months. The way this team shoots Jones should have 20-25 rebounds a game. Hes getting out muscled and out hustled by smaller guys out there.

They arent going to make the tourney next year either since Scruggs and Marshall are most likely leaving early which leaves Carter as the most experienced player for them. Hopefully Paul and Naji stay to play with Odom at PG but its doubtful.

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[stammina0721]

And you guys continue the nonsense

[IM4X]

I think to save the season the fans have to suck it up and support the team even when the play is unsupportable. I can dissect a game with the best of them and still play at 64 2 or 3 x a week, but I would hate to see Cintas turned into a negative environment or even apathetic. Every game is winnable still, and I have seen at UConn the fans become apathetic and negative and it hurts the team and (in the case of a Jesuit private school) the value add a good Big East schedule gives for enrollment, endowment etc. I am very aggravated (again my blood pressure goes from 120 to 180 during a tight and/or bad game and pulse from 62 to 85) and watched Butler, Villanova, Seton Hall, Marquette games this weekend wishing we played like them but have to accept the bad with the good. Love reading all the analysis.

Okay... so your pulse only goes up to 85 in bad games... Wow, you must be a in tip top shape.

[xu82]

This thread is very disappointing.

[stammina0721]

Come on guys just stop. Chris Mack lost an entire recruiting class. One with zero recruits who started and finished at X as far as I can recall. If that doesn't cost him then 12-5 won't cost Steele in year 1.5. Just stop and be reasonable

[xudash]

I just hope Travis isn’t all the coaches VD has had over the years. It scares me to think we could fall like VD did after the 80’s. They are good this year but we all know that is just a fluke. Please Steele make me proud again!!!!

Understanding that bad things and bad coaches can happen to even P5 programs, I’m not too worried about this specific scenario.

VD is a mid major in a now bad conference with virtually no TV money. We have a lot to offer in the event we eventually have to offer it.

Finally, let’s not forget that we were headed for the abyss last year, and with a bunch of new moving parts. Steele has to be given credit for turning last season around and almost getting them to the tournament.

[IM4X]

Well, this is not a good stat. Hope it’s not a precursor to finishing under .500 in conference play for the first time in decades.

https://twitter.com/PaulFritschner/status/1216124177729585152



That stat ought to be blown up and put on the wall in the screening room, on the walls of the workout room, and above the doorway of the players entrance to the basketball court.

It ought to make these coaches and players seriously embarrassed And light a fire... or we are heading for one very bad second half of the season.

[X-band '01]

I would like to congratulate Travis Steele on receiving the Sacrament of Fire _____ in his second season.

[BigMoeMusketeer]

There is virtually no way Xavier is better next year than this year.

[JTG]

There is virtually no way Xavier is better next year than this year.

Have you ever heard the term "addition by subtraction" ? This group just doesn't work together.

[vee4xu]

87: Coaching has nothing to do with multiple players missing wide open threes. They weren’t even guarding Goodin. The guy can’t shoot.

Then that means one of two things. Either the coach is okay with a guy who can't shoot threes taking only threes instead of driving to the basket(bad), or the coach isn't okay with it and the player is saying screw you, I'm chucking them up anyway (also bad). Steele should realize that the other team is allowing this certain horrible three point shooter to chuck them up because they know he can't make them and he won't stop taking them. That falls on the coach.

[XU 23]

I recall Sean Miller not getting an NIT bid his first year and barely making the tournament as like a 14 seed the second year. Definitely not time to panic yet.

[bourbonman]

There hasn’t been a coach fan posts haven’t demanded being fired in the first 2 years. Seriously. Go back and research Matt’s, Miller and Mack. Gosh almighty. Folks would have been running Prosser early on, but there weren’t these fan posts in those days. I certainly have no idea if Steele will survive. But he will be here through next year and probably the following. Steele was left with a rather empty cupboard. Thankfully we have Marshall and Scruggs. Miles who I love graduates. Give this a bit of time with his own men. Otherwise, let’s fire his a$$ so we can get to the next guy we can bellyache about.

[vee4xu]

Throughout my career I have given countless annual job performance reviews and received one each year. In those meetings, there is a list of goals and objectives that were to be achieved each year. It doesn't take a brain surgeon to compare what was expected to what was achieved. If was was achieved falls short once, you give the benefit of the doubt. If what was achieved falls short a second year in a row, then something has to be done. Does it mean firing someone, not necessarily. But, it does mean making changes to what is currently being done to try and achieve these goals because obviously it isn't happening. If it happens a third year, the person failing to meet the goals and objectives needs to be told they'll have to seek employment elsewhere. It may seem cold, but it's real. X should be looking at the men's basketball situation this same way.

[scoscox]

87: Coaching has nothing to do with multiple players missing wide open threes. They weren’t even guarding Goodin. The guy can’t shoot.

Then that means one of two things. Either the coach is okay with a guy who can't shoot threes taking only threes instead of driving to the basket(bad), or the coach isn't okay with it and the player is saying screw you, I'm chucking them up anyway (also bad). Steele should realize that the other team is allowing this certain horrible three point shooter to chuck them up because they know he can't make them and he won't stop taking them. That falls on the coach.

i don't think coaches are completely blameless when it comes to shooting, but it's definitely not the most controllable aspect of the game. steele's quote after the game today seems like he's been less than forceful when it comes to q's shooting. told him he has to make an adjustment to start driving... no shit! you should have been telling him this every practice for the last three years. i hope that's the case, but i'm not confident

[D-West & PO-Z]

Havent read this whole thread yet. My answer though is no.

I do think the talent on our team though is not adding up to results on the court. We should be winning more. I think some of it is personnel and Travis isnt solely responsible for that as he only really has 1 class in and a second that was partly him partly Mack. I think some of it is his in game coaching and somehow for whatever reason his message he delivers in pressers (which I am sure is same in practice) is not getting through or being followed.

I really think Steele will benefit to an extent once there are no more players on the team who were there when he was an assistant.

I am confident in his recruiting abilities. Need to see more in game coaching development.

[Xville]

There is virtually no way Xavier is better next year than this year.

If paul and naji stay, they will be better, otherwise absolutely.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Remember some on here being frustrated with the Tre and JP teams and ready to move on and see what the team would look like after them. We were going to be more athletic and potentially better. Yikes.

[IM4X]

Then that means one of two things. Either the coach is okay with a guy who can't shoot threes taking only threes instead of driving to the basket(bad), or the coach isn't okay with it and the player is saying screw you, I'm chucking them up anyway (also bad). Steele should realize that the other team is allowing this certain horrible three point shooter to chuck them up because they know he can't make them and he won't stop taking them. That falls on the coach.

I can’t disagree with this assessment.

sorry Vee... it was late... I was tired and mistyped.

[AviatorX]

I can’t think of a high major coach off the top of my head that got fired for performance after two seasons outside of Billy Clyde at UK (and that is murky at best). Can anyone think of what that list would look like? What about after three seasons?

Travis is going to get four years no matter what. Xavier definitely plays in a major conference, but some of the talk on here is hilarious, it’s still Xavier basketball, not UK hoops or Alabama football. Archie missed the tournament his first two years in Bloomington (with a lottery pick McDonalds AA and highly ranked talent all over the place) and he still isn’t on the hot seat at all (well, anywhere outside of message boards). People need to get a grip.

[AviatorX]

One more thought: someone should compile a list of retired coaches Steele should consider bringing on as an assistant to help with in game coaching. I think that’s usually what comes next after this thread is started in our coaching crisis process.

Bob Knight is back in the Midwest...

[X Factor]

You're not officially the head coach of Xavier until someone starts the "Fire ____" thread about you on Xavierhoops.

Welcome to Xavier, Coach.

Steele has a lot of work to do. The next few weeks will be telling.

[OTRMUSKIE]

All it will take is a RUN part TRÈS and he will be getting a 10 year contract extension. Sports fans can be very forgiving.

[XU 87]

87: Coaching has nothing to do with multiple players missing wide open threes. They weren’t even guarding Goodin. The guy can’t shoot.

Then that means one of two things. Either the coach is okay with a guy who can't shoot threes taking only threes instead of driving to the basket(bad), or the coach isn't okay with it and the player is saying screw you, I'm chucking them up anyway (also bad). Steele should realize that the other team is allowing this certain horrible three point shooter to chuck them up because they know he can't make them and he won't stop taking them. That falls on the coach.

Those were WIDE OPEN threes that Q took. He HAS to make a few. If he incapable of making wide open threes, then he shouldn't be out there, which eventually is what happened.

I'm more concerned about the defense falling apart in the second half and the fact that this team got out rebounded, again, and this time by a poor rebounding team. Those are things attributable to coaching.

[Xer4ever]

Those were WIDE OPEN threes that Q took. He HAS to make a few. If he incapable of making wide open threes, then he shouldn't be out there, which eventually is what happened.

I'm more concerned about the defense falling apart in the second half and the fact that this team got out rebounded, again, and this time by a poor rebounding team. Those are things attributable to coaching.

I agree 100% about the rebounding. Only thing I would add is it can also be a strong indicator of a teams desire and intensity.

[drudy23]

Then that means one of two things. Either the coach is okay with a guy who can't shoot threes taking only threes instead of driving to the basket(bad), or the coach isn't okay with it and the player is saying screw you, I'm chucking them up anyway (also bad). Steele should realize that the other team is allowing this certain horrible three point shooter to chuck them up because they know he can't make them and he won't stop taking them. That falls on the coach.

This is almost exactly what I wrote in another thread.

All teams have deficiencies. Coaches try to hide them. We seem to be exposing them even further.

Not us - we lead with our deficiencies, and that's exactly what our opponents want us to do. Not only are we leading with what we suck at, we're hand delivering the defense's gameplan to them.

[XU 87]

Only thing I would add is it can also be a strong indicator of a teams desire and intensity.

And therein lies my concern.

[XU 87]

This is almost exactly what I wrote in another thread.

All teams have deficiencies. Coaches try to hide them. We seem to be exposing them even further.

Not us - we lead with our deficiencies, and that's exactly what our opponents want us to do. Not only are we leading with what we suck at, we're hand delivering the defense's gameplan to them.

I get the point you're making, but when the other team is leaving our point guard wide open, with no one near him, at the three, what's he supposed to do? Not shoot? Does Q then drive to the basket, where they have all five defenders packing the paint?

I don't have an answer to the above- other than if a point guard can't make just a few WIDE OPEN threes, then he just can't be out there.

Moore took Q's minutes yesterday in the second half, and went 0-5 from the three. He also had some good looks. So Q and Moore combined for 0-11 from the three, and I don't remember any of them even being close.

[drudy23]

Yes, he can't be out there. Not only does he not make shots, his presence makes it that much harder on everyone else to execute.

If he's out there, Paul and KyKy have to be in the game as well as viable shooting options. Otherwise, KyKy takes his minutes. It's time. The exact same thing is true with Carter. He should never be on the perimeter.

Carter isn't a stretch 4, stop putting him in those situations. Play multiple big guys to allow for some more fluid offensive movement. We're trying to run a Villanova style offense but we lack Villanova style players.

When the other team is daring Carter and Q to shoot, and especially when they're in the game at the same time, there's no chance to be successful over a 40 minute game. It's completely limiting to everyone else on the floor.

[AviatorX]

Yes, he can't be out there. Not only does he not make shots, his presence makes it that much harder on everyone else to execute.

If he's out there, Paul and KyKy have to be in the game as well as viable shooting options. Otherwise, KyKy takes his minutes. It's time. The exact same thing is true with Carter. He should never be on the perimeter.

Carter isn't a stretch 4, stop putting him in those situations. Play multiple big guys to allow for some more fluid offensive movement. We're trying to run a Villanova style offense but we lack Villanova style players.

When the other team is daring Carter and Q to shoot, and especially when they're in the game at the same time, there's no chance to be successful over a 40 minute game. It's completely limiting to everyone else on the floor.

I guess the obvious question is how is playing multiple bigs going to allow for more fluid offensive movement? That’s even more license to jam the paint.

[drudy23]

I guess the obvious question is how is playing multiple bigs going to allow for more fluid offensive movement? That’s even more license to jam the paint.

This only works if the right shooters are on the floor.

Naji has to play 35 minutes, Paul has to play 35 minutes, and KyKy has to play 30. Tyrique 30 minutes. Use James, Freemantle and Carter in the post, and Moore and Q as subs for the guards.

[XU 87]

Carter has actually been showing signs of life lately. He had 8 points and 7 rebounds yesterday.

And a shout out to Naji- He had 21 points, 9 rebounds and 7 assists yesterday.

[bjf123]

To those bitching about Carter shooting 3s, he’s 40% behind the line the last two games. Scruggs is the only guy better than that. Against Creighton, he was the only player to make more than one.


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[drudy23]

All of these dudes can play (even Q), they're just hamstrung by a misfit offense.

You have to find some alternatives to help them reach their ceiling.

[bleedXblue]

We will see if Steele allows this nonsense to continue to happen. Its very, very clear what needs to happen. I think this move will also neuter the complacent vibe and lackadaisical attitude you see at times. If he doesn't make the change, then we know whats going on. If he fears he's going to upset someone in place of making this whole team better, we have a very big issue on our hands.

[drudy23]

To those bitching about Carter shooting 3s, he’s 40% behind the line the last two games. Scruggs is the only guy better than that. Against Creighton, he was the only player to make more than one.


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The percentage is meaningless. Completely irrelevant.

Opposing teams know that Carter isn't going to beat them shooting 3s. And he will continue to be wide open thus making life harder for everyone else.

You can't play 4 on 5 and be successful (and basically 3 on 5 when him and Q are in the game at the same time).

[drudy23]

If he fears he's going to upset someone in place of making this whole team better, we have a very big issue on our hands.

With a young, unproven head coach, that fear is real. Time to put the big boy pants on.

[XU 87]

All of these dudes can play (even Q), they're just hamstrung by a misfit offense.

You have to find some alternatives to help them reach their ceiling.

I don't think any offense is going to help Q on this particular team. His lack of outside shooting was hardly noticeable when he had JP and Bluiett on the floor. His job was to run the offense, penetrate some, and dish to some open shooters. I think he missed something like his first 25 threes his sophomore year, and the team still was fine. We didn't need him to shoot threes. But with the current lineup, his poor shooting is now VERY noticeable without these types of shooters on the floor.

[xuwin]

I get the point you're making, but when the other team is leaving our point guard wide open, with no one near him, at the three, what's he supposed to do? Not shoot? Does Q then drive to the basket, where they have all five defenders packing the paint?

I don't have an answer to the above- other than if a point guard can't make just a few WIDE OPEN threes, then he just can't be out there.

Moore took Q's minutes yesterday in the second half, and went 0-5 from the three. He also had some good looks. So Q and Moore combined for 0-11 from the three, and I don't remember any of them even being close.

Scruggs is their best 3 point shooter and he was 1/1 on three's. Why are we not working more screens for him to get him the open shots?

[drudy23]

I don't think any offense is going to help Q on this particular team. His lack of outside shooting was hardly noticeable when he had JP and Bluiett on the floor. His job was to run the offense, penetrate some, and dish to some open shooters. I think he missed something like his first 25 threes his sophomore year, and the team still was fine. We didn't need him to shoot threes. But with the current lineup, his poor shooting is now VERY noticeable without these types of shooters on the floor.

He was that player (run offense, penetrate and finish, or penetrate and dish) because Tre, Kaiser, JP, and even Naji were lethal when they were open. That doesn't exist on this team. His type of style doesn't fit with how this team is set up, so why is he starting and playing so many minutes? He can't penetrate when his defender is playing off him, and when Carter's defender is protecting the lane (and doesn't care about Carter shooting 3s).

It's just not an offense set up for his skill set. Both Naji's and Q's skills are set up to be complimentary players, but can be lethal in that circumstance.

[XU 87]

Scruggs is their best 3 point shooter and he was 1/1 on three's. Why are we not working more screens for him to get him the open shots?

My guess is that they actually covered Paul on the perimeter yesterday. They literally didn't cover Q, and I don't think they were covering Moore much either on the three. That said, one would think the staff would have tried to find a way to get Paul some more looks on the three.

X lost by 12 points yesterday. If Moore and Q can shoot 4-11 yesterday from the three yesterday, not too much to ask given the looks, we have a tie game.

[drudy23]

If Q is in the game, multiple shooters need to be on the floor (KyKy and Scruggs). Otherwise, he can't be out there. Same with Carter.

All it does is make it very hard for the real shooters to get looks. 4 on 5 is impossible to overcome.

Q and Carter can't be in the game at the same time. That happens often. They've started pretty much every game. And we start out every game with uncontested bricks from those two because they're wide open exactly the way our opponents wanted it.

Then we all talk to our TV and say "well this looks very familiar".

The coaches in our conference are too good not to expose it, and our coach isn't adjusting.

[bjf123]

As I posted in another thread, Carter was our second best 3 point shooter the last two games. Only Scruggs was better. Carter was the only one to make more than 1 from 3 against Creighton.


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[xukeith]

Should UNC fire Coach Williams?
Should ASU fire Hurley?
Should OSU fire Holtman?
Should MSU fire Izzo?
UCLA fire Cronin?

Let us at least be consistent.

[drudy23]

As I posted in another thread, Carter was our second best 3 point shooter the last two games. Only Scruggs was better. Carter was the only one to make more than 1 from 3 against Creighton.


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And what was the end result?

Simple shooting statistics don't tell the whole story.

[XU_Lou]

Should UNC fire Coach Williams?
Should ASU fire Hurley?
Should OSU fire Holtman?
Should MSU fire Izzo?
UCLA fire Cronin?

Let us at least be consistent.


Fire Cronin - absolutely!! And while we're at it, UL should fire Mack as well!

Perhaps Xavier should become the first university to take advantage of the infinite wisdom of their fan base on a message board. Maybe this could become the first "coach by committee" program ever. We would never lose!

In all seriousness, you guys really need to get your expectations in check - especially for next year. We will be extremely young and inexperienced next year. In all likelihood it will be another year of our fanbase slitting their wrists several times throughout the year....

[bjf123]

And what was the end result?

Simple shooting statistics don't tell the whole story.

No, they don’t. It if the opposing D is only goin for let you shoot threes, you want to guy on the floor who’s making them. At the moment, that’s Scruggs, Carter, and Tandy. It sure as hell isn’t Q.


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[IM4X]

Scruggs is their best 3 point shooter and he was 1/1 on three's. Why are we not working more screens for him to get him the open shots?

been posting this thought numerous times this season. It sure seems like coaching 101. Set up your best players for 3s...and make sure you get it to them when they are open. I can count at least 15 times over the past 4 games where Scruggs was wide open and a teammate completely dismissed him (and that better opportunity) for another more questionable one.

Scruggs should be looked at a bit as this team’s Tre. He may not be expected to hit quite as many 3s, but he will be the most effective at shooting them. He is 6-8 over the past 4 games. What if his teammates had found him three times as often (and others held off on shooting threes) during those games... X may have won a few more of them.

This is so obvious and yet it is being compromised because players hear their coach say, “I tell my players if they have a good look, they should take it.”

[xdude]

There hasn’t been a coach fan posts haven’t demanded being fired in the first 2 years. Seriously. Go back and research Matt’s, Miller and Mack. Gosh almighty. Folks would have been running Prosser early on, but there weren’t these fan posts in those days. I certainly have no idea if Steele will survive. But he will be here through next year and probably the following. Steele was left with a rather empty cupboard. Thankfully we have Marshall and Scruggs. Miles who I love graduates. Give this a bit of time with his own men. Otherwise, let’s fire his a$$ so we can get to the next guy we can bellyache about.

Fire! Fire! Fire! Said the Beavis to the Butthead

[IM4X]

I know it gets more people’s attention the way it is, but I wonder if it is a little more fair to the coach if the the OP changed the title of this thread be something like, “Thoughts about Travis” or “How much is Travis to blame” or even “Is Steele’s seat warming up yet”

It seems a bit harsh to have a thread title about firing a coach this early in his career, especially since it is only half way though the season and the team is 12-5.

Just a thought.

[OTRMUSKIE]

I know it gets more people’s attention the way it is, but I wonder if it is a little more fair to the coach if the the OP changed the title of this thread be something like, “Thoughts about Travis” or “How much is Travis to blame” or even “Is Steele’s seat warming up yet”

It seems a bit harsh to have a thread title about firing a coach this early in his career, especially since it is only half way though the season and the team is 12-5.

Just a thought.

Then you’re taking away my freedom of speech. It was started as a joke because I knew people would be going crazy after yesterday’s loss. Hence why I didn’t actually write anything. However as of right now I think there should be some serious concerns with Travis. We arnt seeing anybody develop. The X&O’s are just like Mack’s, non existent. If we had seen improvement it would be one thing but we Havnt. I think Travis should know how the fans feel, maybe that brain of his will kick into gear.

[Muskie in dayton]

I almost replied to this thread yesterday when I got to my car after the game, but decided a cooling off period was a good idea. I'm glad I did.

The answer is no. A mid-season firing is almost unprecedented. Plus he needs at least a full season with a team full of his guys.

I will say I’m greatly concerned about his coaching:
1) It's well established that this team in general and several players in particular are terrible 3-point shooters. Why do we continue to run our offense around the 3 ball and let these guys continue to shoot them?
2) Play to your strengths. Naji, Scruggs and even Gooden can take darn near anyone in the nation off the drive. Why not more of that?
3) The Offensive approach: This team struggles with turnovers when running a set offense, and is clearly not effective. Plus we can easily run 9 deep and are very athletic. Doesn’t that sound like ideal ingredients for a frantic pace of play?
4) Lineup issues: Why do we play both freshmen at the same time? It goes terribly each game yet it continues. Why no James yesterday? And why does Carter get 38 minutes, most on the team??
5) Most concerning, where is the command of this team? I was glad to see he pulled Gooden yesterday after he again thought he was Steph Curry. But that is a drop in the bucket. Or is he actually OK with the sloppy play and poor decision making?


I know there has been early concerns about all X coaches, but this one feels different than those in the past. This team is rudderless, and their play is only getting worse. Watching the games and listening to Steele is giving me Dave Shula Bengals flashbacks. It needs to change real soon.

[bjf123]

Numbers 1 and 2 are easy.

1. We’re running our offense around shooting the 3 because the defenses are daring us to shoot that.

2. They might be good at penetrating the lane, but the defense is staying in close to prevent that, resulting in turnovers and blocked shots. And we’re right back to number 1, shooting threes that we keep missing because that’s what the defense is giving us.


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[XUBison]

...This is so obvious and yet it is being compromised because players hear their coach say, “I tell my players if they have a good look, they should take it.”

What is Jay Wright’s mantra? Good shot, better shot, best shot? Yeah, that‘s not happening here.

[IM4X]

What is Jay Wright’s mantra? Good shot, better shot, best shot? Yeah, that‘s not happening here.

Exactly!

Conversely, I believe Steele’s matto is, “I don’t care if you can’t shoot at all... if you’re open from 3, just shoot the f¥<king ball!”

[Xavier]

The X&O’s are just like Mack’s, non existent.

I don’t know if this is a joke too or not. Mack is one of the best coaches at drawing up plays out of a time out. Almost always successful. I can’t remember if the Arizona play to get to the sweet 16 was out of a time out or not but it was a great call.

[IM4X]

Then you’re taking away my freedom of speech. It was started as a joke because I knew people would be going crazy after yesterday’s loss. Hence why I didn’t actually write anything. However as of right now I think there should be some serious concerns with Travis. We arnt seeing anybody develop. The X&O’s are just like Mack’s, non existent. If we had seen improvement it would be one thing but we Havnt. I think Travis should know how the fans feel, maybe that brain of his will kick into gear.

I don’t want to take away your freedom of speech... I just don’t want X coaches to feel like family one minute and then that we don’t want him here the next just because of a few things that we are not liking at this stage of the season.

I like that you have set up a thread for us all to vent and I even really like that it is a place where Steele can look (if he so chooses) to see what some fans are thinking. If you’ve looked at my more recent posts, you’d have seen I have not been so easy on him. Still, I think it might be a little much for us fans to be throwing around the “fire” word about a coach in only his second year with a 12-5 record way though the season. That’s all I’m saying.

[scoscox]

i think travis has done a great job on BLOB's and OOT's especially at the end of halves. not sure there's been any drop off there. also, travis has said repeatedly in press conferences that "we want to get the best shot for xavier", so maybe those are contradictory ideas in a sense, but he has said something along the "get the best shot" lines

[drudy23]

I don’t know if this is a joke too or not. Mack is one of the best coaches at drawing up plays out of a time out. Almost always successful. I can’t remember if the Arizona play to get to the sweet 16 was out of a time out or not but it was a great call.

Agreed. Mack has always had a great offensive mind. He's one of the best at the X's and O's and most coaches across the nation would tell you that.

[drudy23]

but he has said something along the "get the best shot" lines

Well, no one is listening to him.

[OTRMUSKIE]

I don’t know if this is a joke too or not. Mack is one of the best coaches at drawing up plays out of a time out. Almost always successful. I can’t remember if the Arizona play to get to the sweet 16 was out of a time out or not but it was a great call.

I apologize. Mack was the best out of bounds coach I have ever seen. If they have awards for best OOB coach his face would be on it. After that, mack can suck a bag O’ D&&ks. Lousiville will have him running for 4th street live by the end of 2022.

[D-West & PO-Z]

KyKy needs to play a lot more. At one point in the game I saw his defender glued to him. The D is way off on Q and on several of our other players packing to paint and letting us shoot open shots knowing chances arent good. Kyky should at least open things up some.

Also this really needs to be Scruggs team imo. He needs to be encouraged by Steele to be more aggressive and be our go to player. There are too many times he disappears, he needs to not let that happen but Steele needs to not let it happen also.

[Smooth]

Numbers 1 and 2 are easy.

1. We’re running our offense around shooting the 3 because the defenses are daring us to shoot that.

2. They might be good at penetrating the lane, but the defense is staying in close to prevent that, resulting in turnovers and blocked shots. And we’re right back to number 1, shooting threes that we keep missing because that’s what the defense is giving us.


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I've been working on a strategy to help Xavier and a reply to your post seems like the best place to post it. My strategy is to use 1. to avoid 2. and get to 3. which is: make a 2.

That is intentionally confusing, so here are more specific details: Nobody on Xavier follows their shot on a 3-point attempt. Rarely does any college player follow his own shot despite the fact that a large percentage of 3 point misses bounce back towards the shooter. Xavier should rotate a player in front of the shooter about 15 feet from the basket to get the rebound. That player will pass the ball to another player on the perimeter who is unguarded (per #1 above) and that player can either pass into or drive the paint since the defenders have either moved out to get the rebound or made a break towards the offensive basket. This would overcome #2 above.

X would basically be using a missed 3-pointer as a pass and a way to move the defense. This is not a new strategy as interior players will sometimes take a low-percentage shot when they can't pass the ball knowing that they are in a good position to get the rebound if (when) the shot misses. The defense will move and the player is likely to get a better shot on his second attempt. This is locally known as the "Jamel McLean" in honor of the player whose shooting percentage from 2 feet was similar to Xavier's shooting percentage from 22 feet.

Seriously, with analytics being used in all sports, the coaching staff should know a) what percentage of 3's X misses, b) what percentage of those misses bounce back towards the shooter and c) what percentage of those rebounds X gets. They can study the tape (view the digital?) to see where the defense is and can position the offense to take advantage of those tendencies.

I'm not saying X should just jack 3's to employ this strategy. Our regular offense should be employed (errr....improved) but, at the end of the shot clock, maybe we can get at least 2 points off of a desperation 3. Maybe.

[Muskie in dayton]

I've been working on a strategy to help Xavier and a reply to your post seems like the best place to post it. My strategy is to use 1. to avoid 2. and get to 3. which is: make a 2.

That is intentionally confusing, so here are more specific details: Nobody on Xavier follows their shot on a 3-point attempt. Rarely does any college player follow his own shot despite the fact that a large percentage of 3 point misses bounce back towards the shooter. Xavier should rotate a player in front of the shooter about 15 feet from the basket to get the rebound. That player will pass the ball to another player on the perimeter who is unguarded (per #1 above) and that player can either pass into or drive the paint since the defenders have either moved out to get the rebound or made a break towards the offensive basket. This would overcome #2 above.

X would basically be using a missed 3-pointer as a pass and a way to move the defense. This is not a new strategy as interior players will sometimes take a low-percentage shot when they can't pass the ball knowing that they are in a good position to get the rebound if (when) the shot misses. The defense will move and the player is likely to get a better shot on his second attempt. This is locally known as the "Jamel McLean" in honor of the player whose shooting percentage from 2 feet was similar to Xavier's shooting percentage from 22 feet.

Seriously, with analytics being used in all sports, the coaching staff should know a) what percentage of 3's X misses, b) what percentage of those misses bounce back towards the shooter and c) what percentage of those rebounds X gets. They can study the tape (view the digital?) to see where the defense is and can position the offense to take advantage of those tendencies.

I'm not saying X should just jack 3's to employ this strategy. Our regular offense should be employed (errr....improved) but, at the end of the shot clock, maybe we can get at least 2 points off of a desperation 3. Maybe.

This is brilliant. Seriously. So if they make 25% of the 3’s, then take this approach, assume they get offensive rebounds on 50% of the shots, then score a 2 75% of the time after that by taking it to the rack (their strength), they average roughly 1.5 points per possession. (3*.25) + (.5 * .75 * 2). There are on average 60 possessions per team in a college basketball game. That’s 90 ppg - a winning formula! If we play fast we can even increase those possessions!

Do you have a day job?

[X Factor]

You forgot one thing Smooth. Our players throw up an awful lot of airballs and shots that bruise the backboard at a high speed from three.

[bleedXblue]

This is brilliant. Seriously. So if they make 25% of the 3’s, then take this approach, assume they get offensive rebounds on 50% of the shots, then score a 2 75% of the time after that by taking it to the rack (their strength), they average roughly 1.5 points per possession. (3*.25) + (.5 * .75 * 2). There are on average 60 possessions per team in a college basketball game. That’s 90 ppg - a winning formula! If we play fast we can even increase those possessions!

Do you have a day job?

I don't think taking the ball to the basket is this teams "strength". Its simply desired more b/c we cant shoot 3's.

I do like being more aggressive in crashing the boards and following shots, but someone has to rotate back to prevent a layup on the other end too.

I'm still in the camp of placing more emphasis on creating more turnovers by being more aggressive defensively. This isn't simply just full court pressing. It can be half court traps, double teaming in the post and just being more aggressive in general. If we can create 5 more TO's a game by doing this AND take care of the ball better ourselves, we could get 8-10 more possessions a game........which should result in more points. Kind of the same theory as Smooth is talking about. We need more possessions.........b/c trying to get this team to improve their shooting is a long shot at best

[Xville]

All I want is something different against marquette....different starting lineup, different offensive or defensive scheme, 30 minutes for tandy...something. The "we do what we do" mantra is not working for this team..I mean effing do something. Even defensively, this team has sucked donkey ass the last couple of games, how about try a zone? Something, anything

[XUGRAD80]

Or....they could just keep the same scheme and just EXECUTE it better?

Or....it could be that the problem isn’t with the scheme, and changing the scheme won’t change the outcome because they can’t run that one either?

Or....could it be that they just don’t have the TALENT needed to compete?

The coaches see the players practice. They get to watch the films of the games and PRACTICE over and over. They get lots of different views. They know a heck of a lot more about what is going on with the players, the players strengths and abilities, and how well they can play, than ANY of us. They can’t afford to panic and just start making changes just for the sake of change. They experiment with changes in PRACTICE and see what the results of those changes might be. If the players perform well in practice, they are given a chance to do the same in the games. Why in the world would a coach start/play a player that sucks in practice over someone that performs better in practice? Just so he can say that he tired “something”? Just to make fans happy? News flash...unless the WIN, fans aren’t going to be happy. And if they do win, fans will be happy no matter who plays or what scheme they play.

[Xville]

Or....they could just keep the same scheme and just EXECUTE it better?

Or....it could be that the problem isn’t with the scheme, and changing the scheme won’t change the outcome because they can’t run that one either?

Or....could it be that they just don’t have the TALENT needed to compete?

The coaches see the players practice. They get to watch the films of the games and PRACTICE over and over. They get lots of different views. They know a heck of a lot more about what is going on with the players, the players strengths and abilities, and how well they can play, than ANY of us. They can’t afford to panic and just start making changes just for the sake of change. They experiment with changes in PRACTICE and see what the results of those changes might be. If the players perform well in practice, they are given a chance to do the same in the games. Why in the world would a coach start/play a player that sucks in practice over someone that performs better in practice? Just so he can say that he tired “something”? Just to make fans happy? News flash...unless the WIN, fans aren’t going to be happy. And if they do win, fans will be happy no matter who plays or what scheme they play.

Disagree coaches are wrong all the time.

[Caf]

I apologize. Mack was the best out of bounds coach I have ever seen. If they have awards for best OOB coach his face would be on it. After that, mack can suck a bag O’ D&&ks. Lousiville will have him running for 4th street live by the end of 2022.

Yeah I'm not getting the offensive praise for Mack outside of timeouts and out of bounds.

[Muskie4106]

Accept that? Hell, I'd vote for a contract extension and a raise!

I can't agree more. We go 9-9 in this league this year. Not only do we make the NCAA tourney. Lock him in a contract for 10 more years

[drudy23]

I can't agree more. We go 9-9 in this league this year. Not only do we make the NCAA tourney. Lock him in a contract for 10 more years

We just came off a 1 seed two years ago, and going 9-9 gets you a 10 year extension?

[SM#24]

This is almost exactly what I wrote in another thread.

All teams have deficiencies. Coaches try to hide them. We seem to be exposing them even further.

Not us - we lead with our deficiencies, and that's exactly what our opponents want us to do. Not only are we leading with what we suck at, we're hand delivering the defense's gameplan to them.

I strongly agree with everything drudy23 writes in this thread, especially this. Walking into the game, I told multiple people this game was about three point shooting...defending Creighton's 3s and us not taking any. We could crush this team inside. I don't care if they pack it in and I don't care how wide open the looks are, we cannot shoot 3s. In the Creighton game, we generated 81% more points per shot from 2 than from 3.

This is clearly a team that should not take a lot of 3s. I used 20 attempts as the cutoff. We've had 10 games where we shot more than 20 and 7 games with less. Here's our make % and where it ranks nationally.
20+ attempts = 26.9% = 344th
<20 attempts = 35.7% = 78th
Total = 29.7% = 314th

I believe this team has much more talent than we're giving them credit for. But they also have glaring deficiencies and they are well known, especially to the opposing coaches. But we're playing right into the other's team strategy.
Too me, that's all on coaching. If he's stuck with player's that don't fit "his" system, then either change the system or make significant modifications. I've had the same thought that was previously stated that we're trying to run Villanova's offense. Which on the surface sounds fine since it works pretty well for them. This roster brings different skills to the mix. This offense we're running will never execute well with this roster. There are schemes, motions, plays that can be run to have Jones, Carter, Freemantle operate down low; to create space for Naji, Scruggs, Q, Tandy to drive. The only players that should be given license to shoot 3s are Scruggs and Tandy at this point.

[Masterofreality]

Greetings guys!
I was at the game Saturday, and I have a lot of thoughts....but I'm going to hold most of them until the next game or two is played. Mostly about how this staff is handling things. But the one thing I will say right now is this.
We always used to jump all over (and rightly so) The Yellow Toothed Gnome for not ever taking accountability and throwing his players under the bus. Steele isn't at that level...yet, but his Press Conference answers after direct questions about specific things are extremely disappointing. I have lots of examples, but a couple stood out to me:
I think it was Andy Katz that asked him a direct question about the offense. Then I think Shannon asked about the bad rebounding.Steele gave a blowoff answer to both questions- "We gotta be better"...and "We gotta fix it". (Uh, OK...and..). But then he immediately defaulted back to talking about defense. Everything is about defense, when his offense is a dumpster fire (for a lot of reasons, some on scheme, some on the players). He then made the statement that "Our defense was tied to our offense after the first 15 minutes." Welp, not really when you watch the tape. Creighton had 7 wide ass open 3 point looks in the first 12 minutes and had them rim out or just miss. After that, they did what they do..make them. Our defense was no better, or worse, in the first 15 minutes than the second half, and guys didn't stop trying. Creighton just made the shots that they always do.
See, this is a guy deflecting a shortcoming, just like Cronin used to do. You're offensive scheme sucks so you deflect and blame losses on defense, because that is an easy deflect. People can see clearly when you can't put the ball in the basket, but they have a lot harder time seeing a defensive issue so it's easy to take the heat off yourself as a coach by outwardly or surreptitiously blaming the players for bad D. Creighton scored exactly what they have been averaging all year- 77 points. No worse, no better. What they do. Somebody else asked Steele why KyKy wasn't in there earlier in the second half, but Moore was when we obviously needed offense. Steele's answer? (Of course)- Tandy's defense kept him out. Uhhh, I "checked the tape". KyKy gave up only one basket to his man, and that was off a mismatch that McDermott engineered with Jefferson who is 4 inched taller than KyKy and bully boyed him to the hoop. Other than that, KyKy was solid, but he couldn't get on the floor, while Moore, who gave up some drive to the hoop baskets, could? OooooooooooKkkkkkkkkkk.
I'm just gonna say that here we are in effectively (counting Spain) Game 21, and probably at least 60 practices and we have the same issues every freaking game. There has been an entire Holiday Season to "fix things" with no school and lots of practices, but, yeah, the same issues.
Oh, one last thing. Cintas was pretty apprehensive and sedate Saturday. Our fans know basketball, and there was little confidence in the crowd that we were going to win that game. Maybe because most of the students weren't there, but I'm afraid this collective team (including coaches) is losing the faithful.
Ok, I'm done, for now.

[drudy23]

Greetings guys!
I was at the game Saturday, and I have a lot of thoughts....but I'm going to hold most of them until the next game or two is played. Mostly about how this staff is handling things. But the one thing I will say right now is this.
We always used to jump all over (and rightly so) The Yellow Toothed Gnome for not ever taking accountability and throwing his players under the bus. Steele isn't at that level...yet, but his Press Conference answers after direct questions about specific things are extremely disappointing. I have lots of examples, but a couple stood out to me:
I think it was Andy Katz that asked him a direct question about the offense. Then I think Shannon asked about the bad rebounding.Steele gave a blowoff answer to both questions- "We gotta be better"...and "We gotta fix it". (Uh, OK...and..). But then he immediately defaulted back to talking about defense. Everything is about defense, when his offense is a dumpster fire (for a lot of reasons, some on scheme, some on the players). He then made the statement that "Our defense was tied to our offense after the first 15 minutes." Welp, not really when you watch the tape. Creighton had 7 wide ass open 3 point looks in the first 12 minutes and had them rim out or just miss. After that, they did what they do..make them. Our defense was no better, or worse, in the first 15 minutes than the second half, and guys didn't stop trying. Creighton just made the shots that they always do.
See, this is a guy deflecting a shortcoming, just like Cronin used to do. You're offensive scheme sucks so you deflect and blame losses on defense, because that is an easy deflect. People can see clearly when you can't put the ball in the basket, but they have a lot harder time seeing a defensive issue so it's easy to take the heat off yourself as a coach by outwardly or surreptitiously blaming the players for bad D. Creighton scored exactly what they have been averaging all year- 77 points. No worse, no better. What they do. Somebody else asked Steele why KyKy wasn't in there earlier in the second half, but Moore was when we obviously needed offense. Steele's answer? (Of course)- Tandy's defense kept him out. Uhhh, I "checked the tape. KyKy gave up only one basket to his man, and that was off a mismatch that McDermott engineered with Jefferson who is 4 inched taller than KyKy and bully boyed him to the hoop. Other than that, KyKy was solid, but he couldn't get on the floor, while Moore, who gave up some drive to the hoop baskets, could? OooooooooooKkkkkkkkkkk.
I'm just gonna say that here we are in effectively (counting Spain) Game 21, and probably at least 60 practices and we have the same issues every freaking game. There has been an entire Holiday Season to "fix things" with no school and lots of practices, but, yeah, the same issues.
Ok, I'm done, for now.

I have mentioned numerous times that Steele has many Cronin tendencies....and I don't like it.

[nuts4xu]

There has been an entire Holiday Season to "fix things" with no school and lots of practices, but, yeah, the same issues.

I have seen so many Xavier teams over the years make some giant leaps during the holiday break. I have seen teams come together, gain cohesiveness, and figure things out. I hoped to see that type of improvement, but so far, the break hasn't been fruitful.

The season is a lifetime, and there is a lot of quality scalps left on our schedule. We need to do things differently, most notably, score more points than our opponents. We do that, i like our chances in March.

[Xville]

I have mentioned numerous times that Steele has many Cronin tendencies....and I don't like it.

Yep. I have defended Steele since he was hired and absolutely loved the hire, but his press conferences lately have been effing terrible. If you think your worst shooter continuing to shoot 3s multiple times a game is seriously not a problem, then you dont know what the fuck you are doing. The mick cronin comparisons are really frightening.

[XUGRAD80]

Disagree coaches are wrong all the time.

Didn’t really expect you to agree with me....

I’m certainly not saying that coaches can’t make mistakes, they are all human too. But I am saying that they amount of information, and the experience that they have, is FAR superior to anything that anyone has here. I’m also trying to point out that virtually anything that we can think of, the coaching staff has probably ALREADY thought of and has either:

Rejected it outright
Tried it in practice and found it doesn’t work
Is working toward putting it into use by practicing it
Or plans to try it sometime in the future when they have time

They only get a very limited number of hours in which to plan, teach, practice, and perfect new schemes. It’s not just a matter of showing the players a film, putting it up on a chalkboard, walking though it, and expecting them to execute it properly. It takes time. Time to teach each player where they are supposed to be, what they should expect to happen, and how to adjust when something unexpected happens.

Do you spend those limited number of hours trying to perfect a scheme that the players are already familiar with? Or do you throw that out and start all over from scratch?

I don’t know of a single coach that would take the latter approach in the middle of a season. Offseason? Sure. Middle of the season? No way. At the most they will introduce some new concepts, make some adjustments, or possible add in a change up defense or offense that they can run with certain personal for a few minutes at a time. Steele may change his strategy a little and decide to press more. He may introduce a little bit of zone from time to time. But I don’t see him making any major changes or telling players not to shoot wide open shots and instead drive into the defense. He may make some changes to the rotation, possible even try putting Freemantle and Jones in together.....

But the point is.....he has probably already tried these things in PRACTICE. If they work in practice we will probably see them in games. But if they don’t work in practice we probably won’t. I’m going to go under the assumption that the reason we haven’t seen them in games is because they haven’t worked in practice, or it’s his professional opinion that they aren’t worth trying because of the personal he has. I doubt very seriously if there is anything that we can think of that someone on the coaching staff...or someone that Steele has talked with...has not already thought of and suggested.

[Xville]

Coaching is not rocket science and basketball is really not complicated even though most of these guys are paid like they cured cancer. If you are a high d 1 coach and you have two guys on the team (tandy and scruggs) that can actually shoot the 3, then you design plays to get them open. You do not do the same crap every game, and expect a different result. Q shooting is bad, travis seems to think that's not a problem. It is a problem, period. If you as a high major d 1 coach can not make wrinkles to get the ball into the right players hands on offense, then you have no business being a major d1 coach.

[Masterofreality]

XUGrad80- You left out & disregarded the off season work that Coaches are supposed to do breaking down tape, closely reviewing what players can and can’t do well, then tailoring the scheme to fit them. If people change then you change where needed. Not sure this scheme fits these players like it did guys like Tre & JP

[SM#24]

I agree it's hard to install a completely new system mid-season. Doesn't mean you can't make modifications in personnel and philosophy. Defensively, you could mix in some 1-3-1 and press (but I still prefer M2M as the pre-dominant defense). Offensively, we have to stop this offense that's designed to get everyone a look from 3 when not everyone can shoot them.
Right shot, at right time, by the right player. Most of our shots are the full opposite of this.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Yep. I have defended Steele since he was hired and absolutely loved the hire, but his press conferences lately have been effing terrible. If you think your worst shooter continuing to shoot 3s multiple times a game is seriously not a problem, then you dont know what the fuck you are doing. The mick cronin comparisons are really frightening.

I thought he did say something about telling Q to stop shooting and drive? I didnt watch or read it all thought so I could be wrong.

[Xville]

I thought he did say something about telling Q to stop shooting and drive? I didnt watch or read it all thought so I could be wrong.

He said it but kind of in a joking manner, and the offense has been brought up numerous times in press conferences and he has been very flippant in his responses. It is croninesque and that's concerning.

I still like the hire, and I'm not going to completely judge Steele until after year 4, but the tendencies I'm starting to see are quite concerning.

[bjf123]

I can't agree more. We go 9-9 in this league this year. Not only do we make the NCAA tourney. Lock him in a contract for 10 more years

I’ll be thrilled if we end up 9-9. I just don’t see it happening.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[BandDad]

I feel bad for Travis as his two seniors both have serious warts. Don't need to go into Q's - I think the 11 pages of posts before this have done that. Everyone is talking about Q's performance in the Creighton game, but we had cut it to three late with a few minutes left and looked like we were going to complete the comeback. He put Tyrique back in at this point and he allowed three straight buckets and fouled on a fourth possession. I VCR'd the game and went home and watched. Tyrique was pouting I believe because both him and Q were on the bench.

First, I would try to play 9-10 guys and play attacking defense everywhere - press, 1-3-1, man-to-man, etc. A little bit of zone just to mix it up would not hurt when we are getting torched in the man-to-man.

Second, have Tandy play many more minutes. Someone posted earlier (very astutely) that just the threat of him on the perimeter opens up the lane more for the other players.

Third, figure out how to get Scruggs more looks (not just necessarily from three). He can score from all three distances.

[X Factor]

I VCR'd the game and went home and watched.

I remember doing that back in the 90's with Xavier games and Chicago Bulls games.

[XU 23]

Down to 46 on KenPom, 3 spots behind UC. Yikes

[XUGRAD80]

Coaching is not rocket science and basketball is really not complicated even though most of these guys are paid like they cured cancer. If you are a high d 1 coach and you have two guys on the team (tandy and scruggs) that can actually shoot the 3, then you design plays to get them open. You do not do the same crap every game, and expect a different result. Q shooting is bad, travis seems to think that's not a problem. It is a problem, period. If you as a high major d 1 coach can not make wrinkles to get the ball into the right players hands on offense, then you have no business being a major d1 coach.

If it’s so easy....then why do so many people fail at it? Are they all idiots? I’m sure each and everyone of us here would LOVE to be paid like these coaches are paid, and do what they are doing. Steele spent FIFTEEN YEARS as an ASSISTANT before he got the chance to be a head coach. Maybe it’s just me, but I figure he must have learned SOMETHING along the way. Something you can’t learn by just watching TV, reading message boards, or playing on a HS team.

[AviatorX]

If it’s so easy....then why do so many people fail at it? Are they all idiots? I’m sure each and everyone of us here would LOVE to be paid like these coaches are paid, and do what they are doing. Steele spent FIFTEEN YEARS as an ASSISTANT before he got the chance to be a head coach. Maybe it’s just me, but I figure he must have learned SOMETHING along the way. Something you can’t learn by just watching TV, reading message boards, or playing on a HS team.

You could rewrite XVille's post to read something like "if you're a high major d1 coach playing against a team that only has two guys who can shoot and you let those guys take the majority of the other team's perimeter shots, then you have no business being a major d1 coach."

There's obviously a middle ground. Identifying the changes that need to be made is easy. Implementing them successfully considering the scope of this team's limitations and the talent they're going to face the rest of the way is another story. This is before we consider any potential non-physical limitations like Travis sliding over a chair when the upperclassman see his as #2, etc. Travis better figure it out.

I personally do not care at all what coaches say in press conferences/to the media so I'm not going to get worked up if Steele isn't firm enough in how he talks about identifying the obvious issues, though I understand why some would like him to show it a bit more. I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt on that one (for now). He has 14 BE games to work on the second part of the equation.

I also think people throw around the terms "draw something up" and "design plays" way too frequently. This isn't middle school ball. You're never going to be a good offensive team that has a chance to make a deep run running a high percentage of called sets as opposed to a read and react system. That said, there comes a point where you throw in the towel and start to micro manage (Travis has alluded to doing this last year to some success), even if the ceiling will never be as high. We are for sure at (or past) that point.

[XUGRAD80]

XUGrad80- You left out & disregarded the off season work that Coaches are supposed to do breaking down tape, closely reviewing what players can and can’t do well, then tailoring the scheme to fit them. If people change then you change where needed. Not sure this scheme fits these players like it did guys like Tre & JP

No, I don’t think I disregarded that. Remember this team had several practices before a trip overseas, and then several more practices before the first game. They are currently 12-5 for the year. So they have had SOME success. Are they where they need to be right now? NO! Does that mean you tear things up start from scratch, as some seem to be suggesting? Or that you write the rest of the season off and use it to prepare for next year? I don’t think so. It also doesn’t mean that the players can not improve between now and March, either. They NEED to improve. But changing the scheme is no guarantee that the results will improve, either. At this point though it would only add complexity and doubt to the players. Sometimes the worst thing you can do is to make players stop and THINK. They need to just play, without looking over their shoulders and without having to stop and think what they need to do next. If these players have the talent that most seem to think they have, they don’t need to change the schemes. And if they don’t have the talent, then changing the schemes probably isn’t going to help much and might even make it worse.

[Xville]

No, I don’t think I disregarded that. Remember this team had several practices before a trip overseas, and then several more practices before the first game. They are currently 12-5 for the year. So they have had SOME success. Are they where they need to be right now? NO! Does that mean you tear things up start from scratch, as some seem to be suggesting? Or that you write the rest of the season off and use it to prepare for next year? I don’t think so. It also doesn’t mean that the players can not improve between now and March, either. They NEED to improve. But changing the scheme is no guarantee that the results will improve, either. At this point though it would only add complexity and doubt to the players. Sometimes the worst thing you can do is to make players stop and THINK. They need to just play, without looking over their shoulders and without having to stop and think what they need to do next. If these players have the talent that most seem to think they have, they don’t need to change the schemes. And if they don’t have the talent, then changing the schemes probably isn’t going to help much and might even make it worse.

Yeah instead we should just let q and the other terrible shooters on this team shoot as many threes as they want and pray they start to fall instead.

Coachs fail for several reasons but a big one is that some have too big of egos to admit that what they are doing isnt working. I'm hoping this isnt the case with travis, but not acknowledging that the offense is a freaking trainwreck, and instead saying how they just need to get better defensively is highly concerning. Should they be better on defense? Absolutely, but to act a bit smug about honest questions surrounding this teams offense is really disconcerting.

I'm not even talking about overhauling the entire offense, I'm talking about wrinkles to get Paul and kyky some looks....which, if they start making them, would open the game up a ton for everyone else. Put your players in the best positions to win the game...carter and q shooting 3s is not the answer

[noteggs]

Something you can’t learn by just watching TV, reading message boards, or playing on a HS team.

Damn! There goes my whole resume...

[XUGRAD80]

Damn! There goes my whole resume...

The same can be said for 99% of the people here. LOL

[IM4X]

I have seen so many Xavier teams over the years make some giant leaps during the holiday break. I have seen teams come together, gain cohesiveness, and figure things out. I hoped to see that type of improvement, but so far, the break hasn't been fruitful.

The season is a lifetime, and there is a lot of quality scalps left on our schedule. We need to do things differently, most notably, score more points than our opponents. We do that, i like our chances in March.

You mean “The season is a marathon.”

At least that’s what Travis keeps tells the media after each mile marker he and the team drop even further off the pace needed to reach their goal of an NCAA tournament birth.”

Some might say that “It’s only a few losses to good BE teams,” and while that’s technically true, they were double digit losses on our home court... which means next time around those teams are going to be even tougher to beat. We’re digging ourselves into a hole.

Not saying it is panic time, but everyone (including Travis) is looking just a little toO comfortable about the situation.

If we buy into Steele’s narrative that “The season is a marathon,” then he needs to wake up to that reality and understand that more than half of the ”regular season marathon” is finished... that he and his team have fallen behind and that they are fading fast.

[IM4X]

Greetings guys!
I was at the game Saturday, and I have a lot of thoughts....but I'm going to hold most of them until the next game or two is played. Mostly about how this staff is handling things. But the one thing I will say right now is this.
We always used to jump all over (and rightly so) The Yellow Toothed Gnome for not ever taking accountability and throwing his players under the bus. Steele isn't at that level...yet, but his Press Conference answers after direct questions about specific things are extremely disappointing. I have lots of examples, but a couple stood out to me:
I think it was Andy Katz that asked him a direct question about the offense. Then I think Shannon asked about the bad rebounding.Steele gave a blowoff answer to both questions- "We gotta be better"...and "We gotta fix it". (Uh, OK...and..). But then he immediately defaulted back to talking about defense. Everything is about defense, when his offense is a dumpster fire (for a lot of reasons, some on scheme, some on the players). He then made the statement that "Our defense was tied to our offense after the first 15 minutes." Welp, not really when you watch the tape. Creighton had 7 wide ass open 3 point looks in the first 12 minutes and had them rim out or just miss. After that, they did what they do..make them. Our defense was no better, or worse, in the first 15 minutes than the second half, and guys didn't stop trying. Creighton just made the shots that they always do.
See, this is a guy deflecting a shortcoming, just like Cronin used to do. You're offensive scheme sucks so you deflect and blame losses on defense, because that is an easy deflect. People can see clearly when you can't put the ball in the basket, but they have a lot harder time seeing a defensive issue so it's easy to take the heat off yourself as a coach by outwardly or surreptitiously blaming the players for bad D. Creighton scored exactly what they have been averaging all year- 77 points. No worse, no better. What they do. Somebody else asked Steele why KyKy wasn't in there earlier in the second half, but Moore was when we obviously needed offense. Steele's answer? (Of course)- Tandy's defense kept him out. Uhhh, I "checked the tape". KyKy gave up only one basket to his man, and that was off a mismatch that McDermott engineered with Jefferson who is 4 inched taller than KyKy and bully boyed him to the hoop. Other than that, KyKy was solid, but he couldn't get on the floor, while Moore, who gave up some drive to the hoop baskets, could? OooooooooooKkkkkkkkkkk.
I'm just gonna say that here we are in effectively (counting Spain) Game 21, and probably at least 60 practices and we have the same issues every freaking game. There has been an entire Holiday Season to "fix things" with no school and lots of practices, but, yeah, the same issues.
Oh, one last thing. Cintas was pretty apprehensive and sedate Saturday. Our fans know basketball, and there was little confidence in the crowd that we were going to win that game. Maybe because most of the students weren't there, but I'm afraid this collective team (including coaches) is losing the faithful.
Ok, I'm done, for now.

I hate to be a yes-man... I really do... but I can’t find one damn thing you wrote here that I disagree with.

[muethibp]

I generally like Travis and think there's a chance he ends up okay. But he's overwhelmed at the moment. Willard and McDermott against him the last two games is just not a fair fight and the results showed it.

[noteggs]

I generally like Travis and think there's a chance he ends up okay. But he's overwhelmed at the moment. Willard and McDermott against him the last two games is just not a fair fight and the results showed it.

Agree and history tells us this is not the first time. Attached is a nice look back on Miller’s and Mack’s early resume from Joel at Banners (guy who posts here from time to time).

Of course doesn’t answer the questions we have this year, but nice perspective.

https://www.bannersontheparkway.com/2020/1/13/21063041/no-way-out-but-through-part-ii-xavier-basketball-travis-steele

[boozehound]

I have some thoughts.

First of all, I think it's hard to run an offense with a team that sucks at shooting. It's not impossible, but would require a shift in philosophy with likely a lot more complex movement off the ball to get open lanes and looks. This team doesn't seem like it has a super-high basketball IQ so that may not be an option for this group.

Second, this is our first coaching change in the Big East. The margin for error is smaller. Miller had some early struggles. Mack had some struggles as well, although his first 2 seasons were pretty solid due to the fact that he inherited a phenomenal point guard in Tu Holloway. Hopefully Travis gets it figured out. If he doesn't, hopefully we have the courage to move on quickly.

[Xville]

I have some thoughts.

First of all, I think it's hard to run an offense with a team that sucks at shooting. It's not impossible, but would require a shift in philosophy with likely a lot more complex movement off the ball to get open lanes and looks. This team doesn't seem like it has a super-high basketball IQ so that may not be an option for this group.

Second, this is our first coaching change in the Big East. The margin for error is smaller. Miller had some early struggles. Mack had some struggles as well, although his first 2 seasons were pretty solid due to the fact that he inherited a phenomenal point guard in Tu Holloway. Hopefully Travis gets it figured out. If he doesn't, hopefully we have the courage to move on quickly.

The entire team doesnt suck at shooting. The ones who are taking the majority of the shots are.

[xukeith]

The entire team does not suck at shooting. The ones who are taking the majority of the shots are.

Only Scruggs is "looking" good.

[XUGRAD80]

The entire team doesnt suck at shooting. The ones who are taking the majority of the shots are.

Number of 3 pointers taken/% made

Naji. 81. 28%
Scruggs. 69. 38%
Goodin. 61. 26%
Moore. 47. 30%
KyKy. 33. 36%
Carter. 32. 31%

I’d say that Scruggs is the ONLY one shooting 1/2 way decent, and he has taken the 2nd most attempts, and made the most #. KyKy has shot horribly the last 2 games. Carter has shot better the last 2 games. Other than telling Goodin not to shoot any...and he didn’t in the 2nd half of the Creighton game.....what changes should be made? Other than trying to get Scruggs some additional shots, I don’t know what else can be done. Do you put KyKy in there and hope he regains his confidence and shot? Do you tell Carter to keep taking them? He only averaged 1 made 3pointer a game last year and is just about at that same pace this year. They really don’t have any GREAT shooters sitting on the bench and that’s not going to change until possibly next year. Virtually every one of the players that transferred out was supposed to be a “shooter”, and none of them panned out.

[bleedXblue]

Number of 3 pointers taken/% made

Naji. 81. 28%
Scruggs. 69. 38%
Goodin. 61. 26%
Moore. 47. 30%
KyKy. 33. 36%
Carter. 32. 31%

I’d say that Scruggs is the ONLY one shooting 1/2 way decent, and he has taken the 2nd most attempts, and made the most #. KyKy has shot horribly the last 2 games. Carter has shot better the last 2 games. Other than telling Goodin not to shoot any...and he didn’t in the 2nd half of the Creighton game.....what changes should be made? Other than trying to get Scruggs some additional shots, I don’t know what else can be done. Do you put KyKy in there and hope he regains his confidence and shot? Do you tell Carter to keep taking them? He only averaged 1 made 3pointer a game last year and is just about at that same pace this year. They really don’t have any GREAT shooters sitting on the bench and that’s not going to change until possibly next year. Virtually every one of the players that transferred out was supposed to be a “shooter”, and none of them panned out.

38% from 3 is better than decent. Its pretty darn good. I think KyKy is still trying to find some his shot. 36% is actually pretty solid. Naji and Q being 1 and 3 in attempts is not good.

[Xville]

38% from 3 is better than decent. Its pretty darn good. I think KyKy is still trying to find some his shot. 36% is actually pretty solid. Naji and Q being 1 and 3 in attempts is not good.

Yeah 38 is better than jp ever had in a season and actually better than two of blueitt's.

I love naji but him and q hurt this team taking that many threes, period.

[IM4X]

38% from 3 is better than decent. Its pretty darn good. I think KyKy is still trying to find some his shot. 36% is actually pretty solid. Naji and Q being 1 and 3 in attempts is not good.

This ^

I posted the 3pt shooting percentages of X players the other day to shine a light on exactly who should be shooting most threes and why ... the numbers are here too... not sure where is the confusion as to who should shoot?

Make sure your best shooters are getting the most looks... but how does the coach really know who the best shooters are? Look at their stats. You know the same ones that have now been posted twice in two days.

Scruggs and Kyky clearly have the highest shooting percentage....
Scruggs and Kyky (and Moore) are hitting the most threes in practice (according to the stats Steele records)
Who was the one player whose 3 point shooting Steele bragged about at the start of last season and who shot above 40% for a long stretch of the season last year? Scruggs. This just isn’t that hard.

Making sure Scruggs and Kyky are getting the most looks from three is like making sure one of your two best free throw shooters has the ball in his hands when you expect your opponent to foul at the end of a game: It’s just a smart decision that improves your probability of success by playing the better percentages.

One last thing: Steele just said on his radio show that X doesn’t have a shooter like Powell... actually X has two shooters doing better from 3 than him... Scruggs and Kyky. So maybe they are not likely going to score as many in a game as Powell, but they are hitting at a higher clip from 3 than him and together they could be a fierce tandem if used properly. So let’s make sure they are shooting more 3s coach... a LOT MORE than anyone else.

[XUGRAD80]

In the last 3 games:

Naji has shot:
SJU 3-6
Hall 2-5
Cre. 1-4
Total of 6-15 for 40%
And has played 116 minutes.....116/15=A 3 point shot taken every 7.73 minutes

Meanwhile:
The combination of KyKY and Scruggs has gone:
12-20 for 60% (KyKy is 2-6 in the two loses, was 4-6 against SJU)
And have played a total of 160 minutes. 160/20=A 3 point shot taken every 8 minutes

So...I think that EVERYONE AGREES that Q needs to stop taking 3 point shots (and he took NONE in the 2nd half of the Creighton game after going 0-7 in the 1st half.....did Steele tell him at halftime to stop? He didn’t play but a couple of minutes in the 2nd half either. KyKy and Moore got the minutes..hmmmm). And I think that everyone would like to see Scruggs and KyKy taking the majority of those shots. No argument on either of those things.

.....BUT what about Marshall? He’s shooting 40% over the last 3 games, and isn’t taking them at an extremely high rate when compared to the 2 best shooters (Scruggs and KyKy).

The thing that I would like to see is not for him to stop shooting them completely. BUT....he often takes 3 point shots when there is NO TEAMMATES anywhere near the basket to rebound his misses. The quick 3 pointers that he misses are like turnovers. He needs to pick his spots better, wait until someone is in rebounding position.

[Caf]

Number of 3 pointers taken/% made

Naji. 81. 28%
Scruggs. 69. 38%
Goodin. 61. 26%
Moore. 47. 30%
KyKy. 33. 36%
Carter. 32. 31%


Out of curiosity I wanted to see what % of a players shots were 3s. Tells a similar story but makes Naji's numbers more palatable.

Naji 37%
Scruggs 38%
Goodin 50%
Moore 84%
KyKy 70%
Carter 31%

[muethibp]

As described in some of these last posts, the stats as well as the eye test tell us that Paul Scruggs is a really, really good player.

The stats and the eye test also tell us that Goodin is not a good player. And he's killing the offense in that teams have stopped guarding him (with good reason) which leaves him in a position where he really has almost no choice but to shoot but also that the other players are subject to extra help defense because Q's guy is not playing Q honestly. It's foolish to say "well, then just don't shoot" because the options if he doesn't shoot aren't real good. Indeed, it's next to impossible to win in contemporary college basketball with a very below average shooting guard; it's just too important to the modern game.

The choice then is you just roll with him and hope he finds a hot streak. That's probably foolhardy. The back of his baseball card, so to speak, tells us over four years at this point that he simply struggles as a shooter. Or he has to just play way, way less. Problem there, of course, is that the depth/alternate options on this team are not good.

In the end, it's a team with some good players but just not enough of them, and missing the absolute star that they really need.

[drudy23]

I have no issue with Naji taking open threes. He's proven he can make them.

He's not as good of a shooter as Paul or KyKy, but can be a threat if he's open. His percentage is low because he takes so many bad ones.

[bleedXblue]

As described in some of these last posts, the stats as well as the eye test tell us that Paul Scruggs is a really, really good player.

The stats and the eye test also tell us that Goodin is not a good player. And he's killing the offense in that teams have stopped guarding him (with good reason) which leaves him in a position where he really has almost no choice but to shoot but also that the other players are subject to extra help defense because Q's guy is not playing Q honestly. It's foolish to say "well, then just don't shoot" because the options if he doesn't shoot aren't real good. Indeed, it's next to impossible to win in contemporary college basketball with a very below average shooting guard; it's just too important to the modern game.

The choice then is you just roll with him and hope he finds a hot streak. That's probably foolhardy. The back of his baseball card, so to speak, tells us over four years at this point that he simply struggles as a shooter. Or he has to just play way, way less. Problem there, of course, is that the depth/alternate options on this team are not good.

In the end, it's a team with some good players but just not enough of them, and missing the absolute star that they really need.

In today's game, you cant afford to have a guy on the floor that cant make shots at a decent clip. The only way that makes sense is if that player brings more to the game in terms of really good defense or creating shots and really establishing the tempo and pace on the offensive end. Also, that player could be the leader of your team and be the guy that everyone looks to for leadership. Unfortunately you guys know this isn't the case the vast majority of the time. But, Steele will keep running him out there........only hope is for a Chalmers like awakening.

[GOX]

In today's game, you cant afford to have a guy on the floor that cant make shots at a decent clip. The only way that makes sense is if that player brings more to the game in terms of really good defense or creating shots and really establishing the tempo and pace on the offensive end. Also, that player could be the leader of your team and be the guy that everyone looks to for leadership. Unfortunately you guys know this isn't the case the vast majority of the time. But, Steele will keep running him out there........only hope is for a Chalmers like awakening.

Some really good posts here. Factual and insightful yet discouraging . Naj and Scruggs are the only A- Big East players on the team. Tandy has potential but is still getting acclimated.
When I look at the remaining schedule and assume that what we have seen the last few games is relatively normative , it seems 9 and 9 is beyond a stretch. If you spin through the remaining schedule, who will we beat?

[xuwin]

38% from 3 is better than decent. Its pretty darn good. I think KyKy is still trying to find some his shot. 36% is actually pretty solid. Naji and Q being 1 and 3 in attempts is not good.

If Naji was getting the same 3 pt shots that Q is his percentage would be better than 28%.

[Mrs. Garrett]

My question would be if the players respect Steele? Does Q have restrictions on shooting 3s that he is ignoring. And if he doesn't why? Yeah Steele isn't the one missing shots, but he is the one allowing the wrong people to shoot too many.

There's just no sense of urgency and there should be given you have 4 guys that are probably done after this year.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

In today's game, you cant afford to have a guy on the floor that cant make shots at a decent clip. The only way that makes sense is if that player brings more to the game in terms of really good defense or creating shots and really establishing the tempo and pace on the offensive end. Also, that player could be the leader of your team and be the guy that everyone looks to for leadership. Unfortunately you guys know this isn't the case the vast majority of the time. But, Steele will keep running him out there........only hope is for a Chalmers like awakening.

What you are suggesting is not rocket science so I ask myself, surely Steele and the players know this, right? Q is quite capable of filling the role you describe. In fact, he has done exactly that at times in his career. Q can't shoot but he is athletic as hell. Last year at Depaul, he did a great job on Strus. When I watched Naji chase Powell around throughout the S.H. game, i wondered why it wasn't Q doing that job. And, plenty of times in the last four years, Q has been able to penetrate and dish. And, when he has done so, Tyrique has been the biggest beneficiary. Q has, over the last four years, played well and, through his leadership, he has helped make those around him better.

I cannot convince myself that Q does not fully understand the other team wants him to shoot the three. He has been our P.G. for four years. He must understand what the other team is trying to do, right? Yet, he takes shot after shot and continues to do so with minimal positive results.

The thing is, Q seems to have developed a chip on his shoulder. It is as if he has to push any criticism of him, for this team's play, right back in the faces of those making those criticisms. I recall several games back, the media reported on a meeting Steele called with Tyrique and Q. Steele had commented, about that meeting, along the lines of telling the seniors "they needed to step up". But, when Q was asked for a comment he said, "He (Steele) said some things; we said some things." It is as if Q simply needs to have the last word.

There have been multiple comments on this board about posters sensing something is wrong with this team (beyond shooting, offensive schemes, game planning and in-game decision making). Some posters sense a malaise but cannot identify its source.

I get these are young men and I also recall that maturity, at age twenty two, was not my strong suit. Further, at no time in my career, was my job performance subject to analysis by others on public message boards. So, while I don't point at Q solely for this teams' performance, I am sensitive to his youth and his role on this team. But, I have come to conclude he has become a material part of this team's issues. If, indeed, he feels compelled to thumb his nose at the fans, his coaches and this board, it seems unlikely that such an "awakening" lies in his near future. For whatever reason, he just doesn't seem to want to be a leader on this team.

[jhelmes37]

What you are suggesting is not rocket science so I ask myself, surely Steele and the players know this, right? Q is quite capable of filling the role you describe. In fact, he has done exactly that at times in his career. Q can't shoot but he is athletic as hell. Last year at Depaul, he did a great job on Strus. When I watched Naji chase Powell around throughout the S.H. game, i wondered why it wasn't Q doing that job. And, plenty of times in the last four years, Q has been able to penetrate and dish. And, when he has done so, Tyrique has been the biggest beneficiary. Q has, over the last four years, played well and, through his leadership, he has helped make those around him better.

I cannot convince myself that Q does not fully understand the other team wants him to shoot the three. He has been our P.G. for four years. He must understand what the other team is trying to do, right? Yet, he takes shot after shot and continues to do so with minimal positive results.

The thing is, Q seems to have developed a chip on his shoulder. It is as if he has to push any criticism of him, for this team's play, right back in the faces of those making those criticisms. I recall several games back, the media reported on a meeting Steele called with Tyrique and Q. Steele had commented, about that meeting, along the lines of telling the seniors "they needed to step up". But, when Q was asked for a comment he said, "He (Steele) said some things; we said some things." It is as if Q simply needs to have the last word.

There have been multiple comments on this board about posters sensing something is wrong with this team (beyond shooting, offensive schemes, game planning and in-game decision making). Some posters sense a malaise but cannot identify its source.

I get these are young men and I also recall that maturity, at age twenty two, was not my strong suit. Further, at no time in my career, was my job performance subject to analysis by others on public message boards. So, while I don't point at Q solely for this teams' performance, I am sensitive to his youth and his role on this team. But, I have come to conclude he has become a material part of this team's issues. If, indeed, he feels compelled to thumb his nose at the fans, his coaches and this board, it seems unlikely that such an "awakening" lies in his near future. For whatever reason, he just doesn't seem to want to be a leader on this team.

When faced with negativity, you can either double down on what's not working (usually with inflated ego or pride), or you can accept it and work on changing it.

Sadly, when you're halfway through your senior year, the odds of the latter aren't good...

[Blue Blooded-05]

We can debate this all we want, but deep down we all know what is going to ultimately happen with Steele...

He’ll struggle a bit and frustrate us while he learns the hard way but he’ll eventually right the ship and get us back to the top of the BE, an annual top 4 seed in the Tourney and the cusp of a Final Four... aaaaand then he’ll leave us in the dust for another program and we’ll get to do this all over again!

[GOX]

We can debate this all we want, but deep down we all know what is going to ultimately happen with Steele...

He’ll struggle a bit and frustrate us while he learns the hard way but he’ll eventually right the ship and get us back to the top of the BE, an annual top 4 seed in the Tourney and the cusp of a Final Four... aaaaand then he’ll leave us in the dust for another program and we’ll get to do this all over again!

Annnnnd...we will be there thanking him for taking the program to another level. When should we schedule the Going Away Party?

[BigMoeMusketeer]

We can debate this all we want, but deep down we all know what is going to ultimately happen with Steele...

He’ll struggle a bit and frustrate us while he learns the hard way but he’ll eventually right the ship and get us back to the top of the BE, an annual top 4 seed in the Tourney and the cusp of a Final Four

I think that is optimistic, I'm not sure you can automatically expect that Travis is or will become Sean or Chris. In fact, I'm pretty sure you can't expect that.

[XUGRAD80]

When faced with negativity, you can either double down on what's not working (usually with inflated ego or pride), or you can accept it and work on changing it.

Sadly, when you're halfway through your senior year, the odds of the latter aren't good...

There’s change and then there’s change.....is it a matter of changing the process/scheme? Changing the players? Or working to make both improve? Get the players to play better and to execute the offense and defense better?

Some here say....change the schemes. Run different offenses and defenses. Press more. Zone. Drive to the basket and don’t shoot from the outside.

Others say....change the lineup and the rotation. Even, change the coaches. Or accept what it is for this year and wait until they change players next year and beyond.

Or....is it a matter of keeping the scheme, keeping the players, BUT get the players playing better and smarter?

All of one, or a little of all?

THAT is what the coaching staff has to figure out. They have to decide what (if any) changes that will actually IMPROVE the product are possible and are going to work.

We might start to get some answers tonight. One thing I know is that if Q, KyKy, Carter, Moore, or ANY of the players comes out tonight and goes off, I’m not going to get to excited. All of these players have had individual games where they looked great. Individual games. Let’s see them put games back to back for awhile before we get excited.

[Final4]

We can debate this all we want, but deep down we all know what is going to ultimately happen with Steele...

He’ll struggle a bit and frustrate us while he learns the hard way but he’ll eventually right the ship and get us back to the top of the BE, an annual top 4 seed in the Tourney and the cusp of a Final Four... aaaaand then he’ll leave us in the dust for another program and we’ll get to do this all over again!

I don’t think this happens and it’s the primary reason I liked the hire……….Travis married into a wealthy CINCINNATI family so hopefully his wife serves as an “anchor” to this area first of all and secondly he doesn’t have to chase dollars elsewhere. He could very well provide long term coaching stability.

As of now I think Travis is in over his head. Tonight should be interesting. If we do nothing different tonight and get our doors blown off then Travis is either dumb, stubborn or scared (scared of how the players will react to substantive change).

[bleedXblue]

I don’t think this happens and it’s the primary reason I liked the hire……….Travis married into a wealthy CINCINNATI family so hopefully his wife serves as an “anchor” to this area first of all and secondly he doesn’t have to chase dollars elsewhere. He could very well provide long term coaching stability.

As of now I think Travis is in over his head. Tonight should be interesting. If we do nothing different tonight and get our doors blown off then Travis is either dumb, stubborn or scared (scared of how the players will react to substantive change).

I don't know why you would be afraid of of making change........especially to a Senior who has 1/2 of a year left?

I would just like to see tonight:

1. Better understanding and execution of who should be taking shots on the floor. e.g Tyrique should know by now that he's going to get doubled up in the post most of the time. Guys should be cutting to the basket and/or staying on the perimeter for an open 3.
2. Defensive execution with an emphasis on being more aggressive and creating some easy transition baskets. For the love of God, please do something other than trying to stay in front of your man. Deflect a pass, double up a guy in the post....anything.......
3. Win the rebounding and TO battle. Protect defensive glass and value the ball.

I don't care if we lose. Just want to see some change and acknowledgement/understanding of where we need to get better

[Masterofreality]

I think that is optimistic, I'm not sure you can automatically expect that Travis is or will become Sean or Chris. In fact, I'm pretty sure you can't expect that.

We've gone from "1 step away from the Final 4" to about 8 steps in a year and a half.

[Xville]

The more I am hearing and seeing from.travis, the more I am concerned. I didnt have the pleasure of hearing that coachs show, but from what I have gathered, there should be serious questioning going on from the top down on what the hell is going on in travis' brain right now.

[AviatorX]

We've gone from "1 step away from the Final 4" to about 8 steps in a year and a half.

I must have missed the part where X was one step away from the Final 4 considering the talent gap that's been on display in Xavier's last two Elite 8 appearances, but there's also been some pretty substantial player departures in this window. These two Xavier teams (as constructed) weren't going anywhere near the Final 4 with any coach.

[Xville]

I must have missed the part where X was one step away from the Final 4 considering the talent gap that's been on display in Xavier's last two Elite 8 appearances, but there's also been some pretty substantial player departures in this window. These two Xavier teams (as constructed) weren't going anywhere near the Final 4 with any coach.

In 08 talent gap was huge in that game...in 17, I dont think there was that much, x just laid a complete egg. No one outside of zach collins who really played for gonzaga is in the league.

Also, two years ago the talent was there to get to a final four..maybe if mack had not been so distracted, they would have gotten there.

[GoMuskies]

There was a talent gap in '08 for sure, but the bigger issue is that Xavier played like shit. That UCLA team struggled more with every other opponent in the Tournament (other than their 16 seed) than they did with Xavier. Maybe we were never going to win that game, but we certainly could have made it a lot more interesting than we did.

[Xavier]

Yeah, I am in the group that thought we were right on the brink. There has only been a couple times during the regular season I thought X had the pieces and talent to make the F4. They were close. It certainly feels like we have taken a major step back.

[AviatorX]

In 08 talent gap was huge in that game...in 17, I dont think there was that much, x just laid a complete egg. No one outside of zach collins who really played for gonzaga is in the league.

Also, two years ago the talent was there to get to a final four..maybe if mack had not been so distracted, they would have gotten there.

Don't forget the 1 minute Rui Hachimura played when Gonzaga was up 40. On a serious note, Williams-Goss was a McDonalds (and NCAA) All American. Maybe talent gap isn't the right description (although keep in mind your favorite player Goodin was X's starting PG), but X has been seriously outclassed in their last two opportunities.

[AviatorX]

Yeah, I am in the group that thought we were right on the brink. There has only been a couple times during the regular season I thought X had the pieces and talent to make the F4. They were close. It certainly feels like we have taken a major step back.

I guess my overall point (which doesn't really matter, honestly) is that the X program is just not in a position where they're always going to have the pieces and the talent. A step back was absolutely going to happen regardless of coach.

Obviously this team is currently in the process of taking a giant step back while combining being both wildly overrated at the start of the season and still underachieving.

[noteggs]

The more I am hearing and seeing from.travis, the more I am concerned. I didnt have the pleasure of hearing that coachs show, but from what I have gathered, there should be serious questioning going on from the top down on what the hell is going on in travis' brain right now.

I’ve listened to the show a few times and thought he had decent answers. Attached is his last show.

https://www.collegesportslive.com/video/xavi/mens-basketball/the-travis-steele-show-20200114010216544572/

[Masterofreality]

Yeah, I am in the group that thought we were right on the brink. There has only been a couple times during the regular season I thought X had the pieces and talent to make the F4. They were close. It certainly feels like we have taken a major step back.

Just quoting what Steele and Greg Christopher said when Steele was hired. Christopher said we were just one step away and Steele said it was his job to make that step.

[Xavier]

I guess my overall point (which doesn't really matter, honestly) is that the X program is just not in a position where they're always going to have the pieces and the talent. A step back was absolutely going to happen regardless of coach.

Obviously this team is currently in the process of taking a giant step back while combining being both wildly overrated at the start of the season and still underachieving.

I think thats fair. Especially seeing how this talent has turned out. But at least for a little bit there I thought X was right on the brink of a program that would always be top 15-20. It was probably more the fan in me than realist but I thought Mack was getting us to a slightly lesser version of Nova.

[IM4X]

We lost Hankins, Welage and Castlin.

We added a top 25ish class with Tandy, Bishop, Ramsey, Miles + we picked up Carter and Moore + every one of the core 4 players were expected to take a step forward.

Finally, we saw a team getting a lot better at the end of last season (that would return the core 4).

How does anyone look at this season and think the team won’t be better than what we saw last year?

[XU 87]

We can debate this all we want, but deep down we all know what is going to ultimately happen with Steele...

He’ll struggle a bit and frustrate us while he learns the hard way but he’ll eventually right the ship and get us back to the top of the BE, an annual top 4 seed in the Tourney and the cusp of a Final Four... aaaaand then he’ll leave us in the dust for another program and we’ll get to do this all over again!

Your scenario has happened with every coach since Matta.

[scoscox]

I think thats fair. Especially seeing how this talent has turned out. But at least for a little bit there I thought X was right on the brink of a program that would always be top 15-20. It was probably more the fan in me than realist but I thought Mack was getting us to a slightly lesser version of Nova.

maybe, but obviously mack whiffed on a few recruiting classes and then bolted. we'd have been fine had we done something with our 1 or 2 seed. it would've boosted recruiting to where it needed to be. unfortunately that didn't happen

[scoscox]

We lost Hankins, Welage and Castlin.

We added a top 25ish class with Tandy, Bishop, Ramsey, Miles + we picked up Carter and Moore + every one of the core 4 players were expected to take a step forward.

Finally, we saw a team getting a lot better at the end of last season (that would return the core 4).

How does anyone look at this season and think the team won’t be better than what we saw last year?

we lost harden and bishop as well and are basically back to where we were last year with freemantle/carter instead of hankins and tandy/moore instead of castlin/welage as far as depth goes

[AviatorX]

we lost harden and bishop as well and are basically back to where we were last year with freemantle/carter instead of hankins and tandy/moore instead of castlin/welage as far as depth goes

Also this team is significantly better than last year's team. Small little detail. Last year's team was horrendous for 90% of the season, seems like people have lost sight of that.

[GoMuskies]

Your scenario has happened with every coach since Matta.

That's only two guys, and with Mack the first year was a Sweet Sixteen (obviously with better players than we have now).

[XfansinKy]

I read this and strut back to my abode feeling like Nastrodamus. You have to observe these recruits then players with your brain instead of your heart.

[XU 87]

That's only two guys, and with Mack the first year was a Sweet Sixteen (obviously with better players than we have now).

Matta, Miller and Mack- that's three.

All three had multiple threads about how they can't coach, the program is moving backward etc., etc.

Skip Prosser also had similar threads, but I thought some of those had some truth to them.

[GoMuskies]

Fair enough. You said "since Matta", which I took to mean post-Matta. And Matta, while his third year was looking disastrous, obviously never had a single bad year at Xavier.

He DID leave a pretty shitty roster for Miller once Cole got hurt, though.

[IM4X]

we lost harden and bishop as well and are basically back to where we were last year with freemantle/carter instead of hankins and tandy/moore instead of castlin/welage as far as depth goes

Tandy and Moore clearly offer better defensive skills than Castlin and Welage and maybe (eventually) even better overall offensive skills (we shall see) I do think Hankins was a pretty special player last year- though he is a little different type of big man than Freemantle and Carter (I am imagining Miles will be a better comparison when we eventually see him). I am going to cross my fingers that Ramsey gets healthy and can contribute in a meaningful way.

It only makes sense that returning core 4 would be expected to be better, after watching them play so well at the of end of last season.
Regardless, this team has a much higher ceiling than their current play suggests. I’m ready to see our two best 3 point shooters (Paula and Kyky) get many more looks from 3 to help open up the inside which should create more space and more opportunities to drive and get to the line, getting opponents into foul trouble earlier.

[IM4X]

Matta, Miller and Mack- that's three.

All three had multiple threads about how they can't coach, the program is moving backward etc., etc.

Skip Prosser also had similar threads, but I thought some of those had some truth to them.

Especially his coaching during post season tournaments.

[GoMuskies]

My saying for a long time was that the two best things to ever happen to Xavier basketball were Skip Prosser becoming head coach and Skip Prosser leaving.

However, joining the Big East bumped those down to #2 and #3.

[Blue Blooded-05]

Your scenario has happened with every coach since Matta.

Correct.

That...Was...The...Joke...

[XUGRAD80]

We lost Hankins, Welage and Castlin.

We added a top 25ish class with Tandy, Bishop, Ramsey, Miles + we picked up Carter and Moore + every one of the core 4 players were expected to take a step forward.

Finally, we saw a team getting a lot better at the end of last season (that would return the core 4).

How does anyone look at this season and think the team won’t be better than what we saw last year?

Well sure, last summer there was a LOT of optimism by most fans. But a LOT of that was based more on hope and hype than reality. I cautioned people back then that Tandy was coming from a really small school and it would take time for him to adjust, and then he had his injury problem, so that set him back even more. Many people expected Miles to be a defensive force and give some good minutes. I, and others, said he also was a project and now he is redshirted. Bishop was hyped, he’s gone. Ramsey was said to be BE ready physically. He hasn’t really played yet (he MIGHT be ready tonight according to some reports). Moore and Carter were supposed to be big additions, but for most of the season have been non-factors. Finally, the core 4 haven’t really improved and in some ways some have even gone backwards to where they were the first half of last season. Yet here they sit a 12-5 overall and 1-3 in the BE with 14 regular season games left. Over the last 2 games they are definitely trending the wrong way, but that can all change pretty quickly.

Tonight is a VERY important game, and not just for the win-loss column. I’m more interested to see how the players seem to be mentally? Are they just going through the motions? Are they playing hard? Are they defending. Are they winning the 50-50 balls the majority of the time? Are they intimidated by the crowd? I don’t expect them to shoot well, as there is no reason to expect that. But how they play the rest of the game and how they react when things go bad, that is what I want to see.

[drudy23]

Well sure, last summer there was a LOT of optimism by most fans. But a LOT of that was based more on hope and hype than reality. I cautioned people back then that Tandy was coming from a really small school and it would take time for him to adjust, and then he had his injury problem, so that set him back even more. Many people expected Miles to be a defensive force and give some good minutes. I, and others, said he also was a project and now he is redshirted. Bishop was hyped, he’s gone. Ramsey was said to be BE ready physically. He hasn’t really played yet (he MIGHT be ready tonight according to some reports). Moore and Carter were supposed to be big additions, but for most of the season have been non-factors. Finally, the core 4 haven’t really improved and in some ways some have even gone backwards to where they were the first half of last season. Yet here they sit a 12-5 overall and 1-3 in the BE with 14 regular season games left. Over the last 2 games they are definitely trending the wrong way, but that can all change pretty quickly.

.

That's alot of things you just listed for that all to be just random circumstance.

Some blame is appropriate for how the staff has handled these players and situations.

[bleedXblue]

Name one thing this team is better at this year or has improved upon in the last year? I cant think of one. That is sad and inexcusable. We all knew shooting was likely going to be an issue. We turn it over more, rebound less and our "elite" defense has been torched in the last two games. We don't create turn overs to get easy shots.

Someone please help me find something.......

[drudy23]

Steele shouldn't be let off the hook so easy for his comments about how elite he thought the defense would be, this year and last.

He wasn't even close. Not even in the same stratosphere. That assessment alone gives me cause for concern.

[AviatorX]

Name one thing this team is better at this year or has improved upon in the last year? I cant think of one. That is sad and inexcusable. We all knew shooting was likely going to be an issue. We turn it over more, rebound less and our "elite" defense has been torched in the last two games. We don't create turn overs to get easy shots.

Someone please help me find something.......

This is ridiculous. The defense is significantly improved.

[AviatorX]

Steele shouldn't be let off the hook so easy for his comments about how elite he thought the defense would be, this year and last.

He wasn't even close. Not even in the same stratosphere. That assessment alone gives me cause for concern.

Who is letting him off the hook? Those quotes were blasted into oblivion on this board last season. Unless you want someone in an official capacity to somehow hold him accountable for hyperbolic offseason comments? It's a results business and he's 1.5 years in (wayyy too early for the athletic department to be stepping in). No one cares about Steele's quotes in puff pieces.

[drudy23]

Who is letting him off the hook? Those quotes were blasted into oblivion on this board last season. Unless you want someone in an official capacity to somehow hold him accountable for hyperbolic offseason comments? It's a results business and he's 1.5 years in (wayyy too early for the athletic department to be stepping in). No one cares about Steele's quotes in puff pieces.

I'm talking about stupid internet posters like us. That quote alone should be picked on for eternity it was so off.

I don't think anyone believed him when he said it, and it didn't even come close to happening. Kind of like "wtf are you talking about coach, are you high"?

[AviatorX]

I'm talking about stupid internet posters like us. That quote alone should be picked on for eternity it was so off.

I don't think anyone believed him when he said it, and it didn't even come close to happening. Kind of like "wtf are you talking about coach, are you high"?

Ok, agreed that was a hilarious comment. At rock bottom last year, it was likely the worst defense in Xavier's modern era.

This years team has at least shown they can touch elite.

[bleedXblue]

This is ridiculous. The defense is significantly improved.

I think you mean "was" improved. I attribute the statistical difference between this year and last year to be mostly schedule related. We played a much tougher non conference schedule last year. Add to that we were playing a lot of new guys early last year too.

[AviatorX]

I think you mean "was" improved. I attribute the statistical difference between this year and last year to be mostly schedule related. We played a much tougher non conference schedule last year. Add to that we were playing a lot of new guys early last year too.

Great, then you should recognize that this year's KenPom adjusted defensive efficiency is 91.5 as opposed to last year's horrendous 100.5. And that 100.5 number is with the benefit of last year's late season run, it was much worse at one point.

You're just being dishonest if you don't recognize this group's defense is miles and miles ahead of last season. Two bad games doesn't change that.

[xuwillie]

I wouldn't be surprised if X ended up in the same 100 range once the season is over.

[bleedXblue]

Great, then you should recognize that this year's KenPom adjusted defensive efficiency is 91.5 as opposed to last year's horrendous 100.5. And that 100.5 number is with the benefit of last year's late season run, it was much worse at one point.

You're just being dishonest if you don't recognize this group's defense is miles and miles ahead of last season. Two bad games doesn't change that.

Does this take into account moving the 3 pt line back? I would guess it doesn't and everyone has benefitted from this some b/c scoring has to be down versus last year.

[AviatorX]

I wouldn't be surprised if X ended up in the same 100 range once the season is over.

That would be truly shocking. I'd take that bet any day.

[AviatorX]

Does this take into account moving the 3 pt line back? I would guess it doesn't and everyone has benefitted from this some b/c scoring has to be down versus last year.

Yes. Kenpom's adjusted defensive efficiency number is basically the points a defense would allow per 100 possessions against the average division one offense.

What's next - this season X played more games on Sunday so the opposition was hungover? There just isn't an argument that this team's defense isn't markedly better.

[xuwillie]

The big east is so much better than last year so maybe it doesn't get to 100 but it's going up for sure.

[SM#24]

I don’t think our defense is better than how we finished last season.

[beatuc]

I don’t think our defense is better than how we finished last season.

I agree, and the offense to me seems much worse. I think this an 8th place Big East team. I still don't see the urgency.

[bleedXblue]

Yes. Kenpom's adjusted defensive efficiency number is basically the points a defense would allow per 100 possessions against the average division one offense.

What's next - this season X played more games on Sunday so the opposition was hungover? There just isn't an argument that this team's defense isn't markedly better.

I'm not a big KenPom guy......so help me here. If scoring is down in 2020 vs 2019, how does the adjusted def efficeincy not go down?

[bleedXblue]

LOL, D looks great to me.

[AviatorX]

I'm not a big KenPom guy......so help me here. If scoring is down in 2020 vs 2019, how does the adjusted def efficeincy not go down?

It's relative to the "average d-1 offense" year to year.

It's the same as rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic with how this team looks, but the defense is definitely improved.

[GoMuskies]

Just do it.

[Masterofreality]

Can we fire Steele at the airport before he gets back to Cincy?
This is embarrassing. We’re a 8th grade CYO team vs this league.
It’s also total regression at a time when you should be progressing.

[DART87]

I'm not a big KenPom guy......so help me here. If scoring is down in 2020 vs 2019, how does the adjusted def efficeincy not go down?


You don't need Ken Pom numbers to see that this team is terrible right now. Poor effort and poor decision making. I can't stand to watch it...How can Steele stomach this?

[SemajParlor]

Still think this thread is ridiculous. But not a few good days for the trust in Coach Steele camp.

[DART87]

Still think this thread is ridiculous. But not a few good days for the trust in Coach Steele camp.


This is a ridiculous thread. I support Steele, I feel bad for him actually. These upperclassmen should be leading and playing like an experienced unit. I do not see that type of leadership on the floor. Coach can do some things but he is giving them every chance to turn the corner. It is painful to watch.

[Xavgrad08]

I hope Steele grows into the job because X has a lot wrong. What is alarming is we are not improving, or taking a different strategy. I hope Steele improves because a bad hire can really set the program back. (Example Wake Forest). Recruiting might get a little tougher with two years outside the dance. The flip side is we have playing time available at every position.

[bleedXblue]

Still think this thread is ridiculous. But not a few good days for the trust in Coach Steele camp.

He challenged his team after the Creighton game.......and this is how they responded. I still don't think they've quit.

I honestly think Travis is clueless tactically. Good recruiters don't always translate into good coaches. He needs a veteran coach on his bench.

[Masterofreality]

Now Steele doesn’t have the guts to come out & face the music on the postgame radio show. He sends Dante out to answer questions.
That’s trash. Byron and Joe would never embarrass you but you can’t even give your fans an answer or two?
GTFOH.

[drudy23]

He needs a veteran coach on his bench.

This x 1,000

[drudy23]

Now Steele doesn’t have the guts to come out & face the music on the postgame radio show. He sends Dante out to answer questions.
That’s trash. Byron and Joe would never embarrass you but you can’t even give your fans an answer or two?
GTFOH.

That is not a good sign. In fact, if I was the AD, there's no way I let that slide.

Buck up and face the music.

[bleedXblue]

Now Steele doesn’t have the guts to come out & face the music on the postgame radio show. He sends Dante out to answer questions.
That’s trash. Byron and Joe would never embarrass you but you can’t even give your fans an answer or two?
GTFOH.

That long speech after the Creighton game really paid off

Sometimes you're better to leave it alone as a coach and let the team stew on it some.

[DART87]

Now Steele doesn’t have the guts to come out & face the music on the postgame radio show. He sends Dante out to answer questions.
That’s trash. Byron and Joe would never embarrass you but you can’t even give your fans an answer or two?
GTFOH.


Not a good move. I hope it was because he was puking because of what he witnessed on the floor. It made me sick

[drudy23]

Another Cronin move. I don't like it. I don't like it at all.

[SemajParlor]

I don't listen to the radio broadcast / I'm out of the area. Does Steele always do the post game interviews win or lose?

[Go Go Golston]

This is a ridiculous thread. I support Steele, I feel bad for him actually. These upperclassmen should be leading and playing like an experienced unit. I do not see that type of leadership on the floor. Coach can do some things but he is giving them every chance to turn the corner. It is painful to watch.

Everybody should have seen this coming when all four "declared for the NBA draft" and had no business doing it.
Inflated opinions of individual ability and is now a glaring problem.

[X Factor]

I was criticized and made fun of on another Xavier board a couple of years ago for suggesting Xavier hire Eric Musselman. I'm not giving up on Coach Steele yet, but Musselman currently has Arkansas about to go 14-2. They're 28th in Kenpom with a defensive ranking of 15 and an improving offense.

Steele has to make drastic changes. Tell Bryce Moore and Jason Carter thank you for the post-grad year, but their minutes are going to the younger guys. Sit Goodin and only give him 15 minutes a game until he can show he can lead the second string guys and actually contribute.

[drudy23]

Everybody should have seen this coming when all four "declared for the NBA draft" and had no business doing it.
Inflated opinions of individual ability and is now a glaring problem.

Did you hear that from the coach's father in law?

[bleedXblue]

Everybody should have seen this coming when all four "declared for the NBA draft" and had no business doing it.
Inflated opinions of individual ability and is now a glaring problem.

I think you have a really solid point here

[AviatorX]

I was criticized and made fun of on another Xavier board a couple of years ago for suggesting Xavier hire Eric Musselman. I'm not giving up on Coach Steele yet, but Musselman currently has Arkansas about to go 14-2. They're 28th in Kenpom with a defensive ranking of 15 and an improving offense.

Steele has to make drastic changes. Tell Bryce Moore and Jason Carter thank you for the post-grad year, but their minutes are going to the younger guys. Sit Goodin and only give him 15 minutes a game until he can show he can lead the second string guys and actually contribute.

You think Muss would have left the team he had coming back at Nevada last year? He also got a $12.5 million deal from Arkansas.

[AviatorX]

Everybody should have seen this coming when all four "declared for the NBA draft" and had no business doing it.
Inflated opinions of individual ability and is now a glaring problem.

Jesus. I'm open to criticizing Steele and the team, but can we keep it to the non-stupid division, please?

There's literally only upside to going through that process. Any coaching staff in America would tell you that.

[xdude]

Still think this thread is ridiculous. But not a few good days for the trust in Coach Steele camp.

Ugly times. Coach Steele hasn't had it too bad from we the fans yet, give him a minute and the Big East is tough, but the trajectory is not good. Last year's team, with presumably less talent, had the 6 game bust before almost beating Nova to get in the dance. So, we keep hope alive.

That said, against Marquette we looked disjointed and again outmatched, hard to watch. Mr. Steele, who I'm sure isn't listening, play to your players strengths, cause what we got right now sucks.

[X Factor]

You think Muss would have left the team he had coming back at Nevada last year? He also got a $12.5 million deal from Arkansas.

Maybe, maybe not, but he's got his team, in his first year playing very good, and improving...

Like I said, I haven't given up on Coach Steele. Something's wrong. I'm tired of it's the way the roster is constructed argument. Coach them up! If we suck at shooting we better be a great rebounding team and play great defense. We better take care of the basketball and get the most out of every possession! Are those things happening?

[Go Go Golston]

Jesus. I'm open to criticizing Steele and the team, but can we keep it to the non-stupid division, please?

There's literally only upside to going through that process. Any coaching staff in America would tell you that.

And the upside to this TEAM is?
I guess that's why JP Macura declared before his senior season. Oh wait.

[Masterofreality]

Mr. Steele, who I'm sure isn't listening, play to your players strengths, cause what we got right now sucks.

He’s not talking either. He chickened out of the postgame radio interview.

Another Croninesque move.

[xdude]

Maybe, maybe not, but he's got his team, in his first year playing very good, and improving...

Like I said, I haven't given up on Coach Steele. Something's wrong. I'm tired of it's the way the roster is constructed argument. Coach them up! If we suck at shooting we better be a great rebounding team and play great defense. We better take care of the basketball and get the most out of every possession! Are those things happening?

no

[drudy23]

He’s not talking either. He chickened out of the postgame radio interview.

Another Croninesque move.

He's taking their jerseys and putting them in the auxillary locker room as we speak.

[AviatorX]

And the upside to this TEAM is?
I guess that's why JP Macura declared before his senior season. Oh wait.

Honestly it was probably dumb Macura didn't. It's free evaluation of your game from the best of the best. Again, literally any college coach would tell you this - it's actually even more useful when it's guys who have no shot at getting drafted, because then you don't have to be the one puncturing their dream.

[scoscox]

I was criticized and made fun of on another Xavier board a couple of years ago for suggesting Xavier hire Eric Musselman. I'm not giving up on Coach Steele yet, but Musselman currently has Arkansas about to go 14-2. They're 28th in Kenpom with a defensive ranking of 15 and an improving offense.

Steele has to make drastic changes. Tell Bryce Moore and Jason Carter thank you for the post-grad year, but their minutes are going to the younger guys. Sit Goodin and only give him 15 minutes a game until he can show he can lead the second string guys and actually contribute.

we couldn't afford to hire musselman if we wanted to.

goodin needs to sit and someone needs to tear him and naji new assholes when they do dumb shit. i'm tired of watching them not get yelled at.

[xavierj]

Was Naji still on the bench at the end? I didn’t see him.

[OTRMUSKIE]

I like our strategy. So we suck at shooting 3’s but let’s confuse the opposing team by shooting 25 of them. I do feel bad for Q, he is a young adult playing for free other then school. He is trying to get out of this slump but just can’t do it. He def has the yips. At this point this is all on Travis not the players. These guys are looking for answers and our coach can’t give them any. Is it time to bring back Miller or Thad? You’re on the Clock Travis, please make me eat crow. All of us 35-45 don’t remember Xavier ever sucking. Older fans def do and younger fans well they weren’t there for the garden days. When you lose to a team
Coached by wojo you truly are not a good coach.

[Xville]

Not even man enough to answer.questions. what a bitch

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Tonight is a VERY important game, and not just for the win-loss column. I’m more interested to see how the players seem to be mentally? Are they just going through the motions? Are they playing hard? Are they defending. Are they winning the 50-50 balls the majority of the time? Are they intimidated by the crowd? I don’t expect them to shoot well, as there is no reason to expect that. But how they play the rest of the game and how they react when things go bad, that is what I want to see.

So, whadda ya think?

[Xville]

Saw that travis said changes are going to be made and starting positions are open. We'll see. All I have seen from Steele is a lot of tough talk and not a lot of action. We will see in a week.

[bleedXblue]

Saw that travis said changes are going to be made and starting positions are open. We'll see. All I have seen from Steele is a lot of tough talk and not a lot of action. We will see in a week.

Change should have been made 5 games ago. INCLUDING sitting guys for bullshit selfish plays. You let it happen over and over without any consequence and then it morphs into a HUGE problem.

[Xavier]

He’s not talking either. He chickened out of the postgame radio interview.

Another Croninesque move.

There are a lot of things Travis has done that are concerning. This is hardly one of them- I know both Mack and Miller would miss them from time to time- usually after an ugly game- still yelling at the team type thing.

It is clear that Travis is in over his head right now. This team is not fun to watch at all. The team was playing better basketball at the end of last year than it is now. So tough.

[jhelmes37]

We lost Hankins, Welage and Castlin.

We added a top 25ish class with Tandy, Bishop, Ramsey, Miles + we picked up Carter and Moore + every one of the core 4 players were expected to take a step forward.

Finally, we saw a team getting a lot better at the end of last season (that would return the core 4).

How does anyone look at this season and think the team won’t be better than what we saw last year?

This is what's killing me... I think we all saw the inspired play at the end of last year and thought if X had played like that all year, they'd have been a top 30 team in the Dance.

So assuming that trend would continue after upgrading the roster and a year of coaching under Steele's belt would be prudent.

But what we're seeing is garbage horsesh*t.

Steele needs to get Mack and/or Miller on the phone for a conference call here. Ask them what the move is.

Mack told Lyons to take a hike and I really think it earned the respect of the players to let a player of that caliber leave. He didn't buy into Mack, and Mack told him to shove it.

Time for Steele to make his move.

And to take some blame and actually come out to press conferences and face the music... that would be nice, too...

[Muskie4106]

Not even man enough to answer.questions. what a bitch

Could not do the post game because he took too long in the locker room and had to do the presser. Depressing game for sure

[XUGRAD80]

So, whadda ya think?

How we lookin’?..........Not good.

Well, they tried pressing, and that didn’t work. They tried putting different lineups in, and that didn’t work. I don’t think it was lack of effort either. I could see looks of frustration in the faces of the players and coaches, but I didn’t see anyone look like they have any answers. The Gang that Couldn’t Shoot Straight, comes to mind. Certainly don’t see any type of leadership from any of the players. The only bright spot seems to be Freemantle on the offensive end, but he still gets pushed around down low by players that are older, bigger, and stronger. He’s just a freshman, so no surprise there. I wouldn’t even consider pulling the redshirt by Miles, as it’s likely he is in the same position of needing to add weight and strength (haven’t seen him since last HS season so can’t say if he has added any bulk yet, but I kinda doubt it) and his presence certainly won’t change anything. It’s NEVER time to PANIC, but that doesn’t mean that you have to keep doing the same old thing and can’t make some changes or additions mid season. Certainly not going to completely revamp the team and how you play, there just isn’t time enough to do that at this point. Nor is it time to just throw in the towel and just play the freshman all the time.

I certainly don’t have any guaranteed solutions, but I’d like to see them TRY:

Having Jones and Freemantle on the court at the same time. Perhaps with Naji, Carter, and Scruggs filling out the lineup.
Playing a zone with that lineup. It’s tall and long and should be hard to drive on and pass on.
Can it score?
Can it rebound?
Can it stop the opposition?
Who knows, but I think it’s worth a try.
They have a week until the next game so they have some time to work on some new stuff.

At this point I wonder just how many games they might win the rest of the season. I figure that they will run into a team or two that has a bad night, and they are likely to have a game or two where they get hot and shoot well. But I don’t see where they have the talent and abilities needed to win more than a few games. Can’t think of anyone that I feel they should be a favorite against. So what? 3-4 wins max? That puts them at 15-16/16-15 going into the BE tourney. Certainly not what anyone expected and certainly not what anyone will accept as successful. Would definitely put Travis on the hot seat IMO.

No matter what, I’m not going to let this ruin MY life. I’m a big fan of Xavier BB, but I’ve been through almost 50 years of fandom and know that doing so is senseless.

[bleedXblue]

This is what's killing me... I think we all saw the inspired play at the end of last year and thought if X had played like that all year, they'd have been a top 30 team in the Dance.

So assuming that trend would continue after upgrading the roster and a year of coaching under Steele's belt would be prudent.

But what we're seeing is garbage horsesh*t.

Steele needs to get Mack and/or Miller on the phone for a conference call here. Ask them what the move is.

Mack told Lyons to take a hike and I really think it earned the respect of the players to let a player of that caliber leave. He didn't buy into Mack, and Mack told him to shove it.

Time for Steele to make his move.

And to take some blame and actually come out to press conferences and face the music... that would be nice, too...

He did go the press conference....LOL he blew off the radio show

[jhelmes37]

He did go the press conference....LOL he blew off the radio show

My bad. I turned that shit off at the 12 minute mark and checked the boards this am.

[xavierj]

My bad. I turned that shit off at the 12 minute mark and checked the boards this am.

There are a lot of questions about Travis but he did take all the blame in the press conference. Someone tried to put it on senior leadership and he seemed a little ticked by the question and said it’s all on him to figure out. Now from what I see, I am not sure if anyone could figure this team out. It’s like they are all playing basketball for the first time. As for Goodin, it’s not that he can’t shoot, it’s that he seems checked out and seems to be giving a piss poor effort, at least according to his body language. He seems like he is somewhere else when he is on the court. Hopefully he can regroup and leave a mark in the last 13 games of his Big East career.

[Xville]

There are a lot of questions about Travis but he did take all the blame in the press conference. Someone tried to put it on senior leadership and he seemed a little ticked by the question and said it’s all on him to figure out. Now from what I see, I am not sure if anyone could figure this team out. It’s like they are all playing basketball for the first time. As for Goodin, it’s not that he can’t shoot, it’s that he seems checked out and seems to be giving a piss poor effort, at least according to his body language. He seems like he is somewhere else when he is on the court. Hopefully he can regroup and leave a mark in the last 13 games of his Big East career.

Glad to hear this from Steele. As far as q, it is time to have a come to Jesus moment with him and the staff. He needs to be told, you either fall in line, and give max effort and be a leader ot here is the door. It has come to that point with him.

[Lamont Sanford]

Saw that travis said changes are going to be made and starting positions are open. We'll see. All I have seen from Steele is a lot of tough talk and not a lot of action. We will see in a week.

+1. Actions speak louder than words. With that said, I don't foresee wholesale changes made.

[X Factor]

There are a lot of questions about Travis but he did take all the blame in the press conference. Someone tried to put it on senior leadership and he seemed a little ticked by the question and said itÂ’s all on him to figure out. Now from what I see, I am not sure if anyone could figure this team out. ItÂ’s like they are all playing basketball for the first time. As for Goodin, itÂ’s not that he canÂ’t shoot, itÂ’s that he seems checked out and seems to be giving a piss poor effort, at least according to his body language. He seems like he is somewhere else when he is on the court. Hopefully he can regroup and leave a mark in the last 13 games of his Big East career.

He's said the same thing after ever loss. "It's on me to figure it out. It's not on them." Obviously whatever he's doing is not working.

Does he ever yell at anyone? I get being a "player's coach", but hold them accountable for stupid mistakes, bad decisions, and lack of effort.

[XfansinKy]

Earlier in the season, coach Steele told Shannon that Dahmir Bishop would be the guy who grew into becoming our most consistent shooter over the course of the season. It was just previous to that when he predicted his guys to be a top 5 defensive team nationally.

[xavierj]

He's said the same thing after ever loss. "It's on me to figure it out. It's not on them." Obviously whatever he's doing is not working.

Does he ever yell at anyone? I get being a "player's coach", but hold them accountable for stupid mistakes, bad decisions, and lack of effort.

I agree with that. Also the assistant coaches also just seem to sit there and are not very engaged. What exactly do they do? Who is the coach in charge of the bigs? The rebounding is there worst I have ever seen by a Xavier team. No one blocks out. Naji, Paul and Goodin have all decreased in rebounds per game, Naji down nearly 2 per game. Only Tyrique is up and Jason Carter rebounding about what Hankins did. Last year in the Big East play Xavier has a plus 80 rebound advantage overall and plus 19 on the offensive end. This year down 22 overall and down 12 on the offensive side.

[Lamont Sanford]

I agree with that. Also the assistant coaches also just seem to sit there and are not very engaged. What exactly do they do? Who is the coach in charge of the bigs? The rebounding is there worst I have ever seen by a Xavier team. No one blocks out.

FYI, Jonas Hayes is in charge of the bigs.

Rebounding is all about heart and effort. There was no effort last night.

[Final4]

I have heard that Fr. Graham is a rather demanding superior and there have been moments when he has been less than patient with subordinates. He knows better than anyone what's at stake here. I wonder how Greg Christopher is doing today?

[Masterofreality]

Mack told Lyons to take a hike and I really think it earned the respect of the players to let a player of that caliber leave. He didn't buy into Mack, and Mack told him to shove it.

Time for Steele to make his move..

After , in 2006, Miller told Dedrick Finn goodbye in mid season. That wound up in a conference championship and an NCAA berth.
Time to act like a real head coach Travis and not the players friend...if you have the guts.

[Xville]

After , in 2006, Miller told Dedrick Finn goodbye in mid season. That wound up in a conference championship and an NCAA berth.
Time to act like a real head coach Travis and not the players friend...if you have the guts.

Wasnt that for some disciplinary reasons outside of basketball?

[Masterofreality]

There are a lot of things Travis has done that are concerning. This is hardly one of them- I know both Mack and Miller would miss them from time to time- usually after an ugly game- still yelling at the team type thing.

It is clear that Travis is in over his head right now. This team is not fun to watch at all. The team was playing better basketball at the end of last year than it is now. So tough.

Mack and Miller didn’t miss post games until their cred was well established. Steele is a year and a half in. That is a red herring

[jhelmes37]

After , in 2006, Miller told Dedrick Finn goodbye in mid season. That wound up in a conference championship and an NCAA berth.
Time to act like a real head coach Travis and not the players friend...if you have the guts.

And the OSU season followed by an Elite 8 and another S16.

Let's do THAT... lol

[UCGRAD4X]

It would be different if it seemed that he is making changes to a formula that is obviously not working. In fact, sometimes he seems to be doubling down on a formula that is obviously defective. That's different. I might even see the argument sometimes made that it is a good system that the team needs to stick with and work through...stay the course. That does not seem to be the case here.

[drudy23]

After , in 2006, Miller told Dedrick Finn goodbye in mid season. That wound up in a conference championship and an NCAA berth.
Time to act like a real head coach Travis and not the players friend...if you have the guts.

Bingo - you're the big dog now.

[AviatorX]

After , in 2006, Miller told Dedrick Finn goodbye in mid season. That wound up in a conference championship and an NCAA berth.
Time to act like a real head coach Travis and not the players friend...if you have the guts.

This team went 8-8 in a really, really bad Atlantic 10.

[Muskie]

Does the season seem even more frustrating when I tell everyone that if the Lineup holds till the end of the year, the Starting 5 will feature four 1,000 point scorer's?

[xubrew]

Travis Steele looked back to one of the greatest teams in Xavier history. He saw that in 2004 the team was 10-9 and just got blown out on the road against a rather crappy GW team. He figured that was the pace he needed to be on! HE IS SUCCEEDING!!!

[jhelmes37]

Well... there’s a touch of truth to that. In both 04 and 17 we were dead in the water...

Maybe there’s hope. Sure don’t feel like that though...

[Muskie]

Well... there’s a touch of truth to that. In both 04 and 17 we were dead in the water...

Maybe there’s hope. Sure don’t feel like that though...

I didn't feel much hope in 2004...

[Masterofreality]

Travis Steele looked back to one of the greatest teams in Xavier history. He saw that in 2004 the team was 10-9 and just got blown out on the road against a rather crappy GW team. He figured that was the pace he needed to be on! HE IS SUCCEEDING!!!

Oh, man. What a horrible memory. I was at the GW game, January 28, 2004, and saw a Xavier team abjectly quit on the court. The only time in my life I've ever seen that. Then they went to udump and lost. Somehow Lionel Chalmers saved the season and XU went on and won 16 out of 17, only losing to Dookcane until they got screwed vs Dook. Hard to see that happening now, but YNK.

[X-band '01]

Oh, man. What a horrible memory. I was at the GW game, January 28, 2004, and saw a Xavier team abjectly quit on the court. The only time in my life I've ever seen that. Then they went to udump and lost. Somehow Lionel Chalmers saved the season and XU went on and won 16 out of 17, only losing to Dookcane until they got screwed vs Dook. Hard to see that happening now, but YNK.

That's why part of me was hoping that we'd hear about a damaged locker room in Milwaukee last night. I just don't see anyone who has the mentality of a Chalmers or Malcolm Bernard to draw the line.

[GoMuskies]

Oh, man. What a horrible memory. I was at the GW game, January 28, 2004, and saw a Xavier team abjectly quit on the court. The only time in my life I've ever seen that. Then they went to udump and lost. Somehow Lionel Chalmers saved the season and XU went on and won 16 out of 17, only losing to Dookcane until they got screwed vs Dook. Hard to see that happening now, but YNK.

I was in Vegas for the Dookane game. What a kick to the gut that one was when it seemed like we had a clear path to an at-large bid despite our earlier troubles. Now we were going to have to beat #1 St. Joe's in the conference tournament, and there was obviously no way that was going to happen. Wonder how that turned out anyway...

[drudy23]

That's why part of me was hoping that we'd hear about a damaged locker room in Milwaukee last night. I just don't see anyone who has the mentality of a Chalmers or Malcolm Bernard to draw the line.

These guys seem more apt to try to one-up Steele than break some shit because they're competitive and pissed.

They don't play pissed.

[drudy23]

Well... there’s a touch of truth to that. In both 04 and 17 we were dead in the water...

Maybe there’s hope. Sure don’t feel like that though...

This feels different.

But I will say, everytime I've had this level of doubt in my life, Xavier threw it right back in my face by pulling it together and frankly, over-achieving.

I just can't see that re-invention this year.