Eligibility Question

[muskies1235]

I have seen it mentioned a few times by Brian Snow that Xavier will return it's top 4 players next year.

Does anyone know who that is in reference to?

My understanding was that Hankins was a one year guy

[Xville]

Not sure if you are being sarcastic or not, but I assume snow is talking about the "core 4." Regardless, pretty ignorant by Snow considering that any of them could leave after the year ends.

[xavier513]

Not sure if you are being sarcastic or not, but I assume snow is talking about the "core 4." Regardless, pretty ignorant by Snow considering that any of them could leave after the year ends.

None of the Core 4 (which by the way is Goodin, Jones, Scruggs & Marshall for those who need help on the obvious) will transfer out. I'm pretty confident in that. Although, you're right, you never know when someone will bolt early (see: Gates, Kaiser). Paul and Naji were both 5 year high school guys and top 50 recruits. It would be a shock to me if either are 4 year players. That puts some pressure on making the tournament next season. We'll have an entirely new team in 2020-2021. Apparently Steele wants to add another freshman (Zach Harvey?) and a grad transfer for next season. I'll let you guys do the math.

[GoMuskies]

Scruggs could leave. Naji? Where would he go?

[xavier513]

Scruggs could leave. Naji? Where would he go?

They are sophomores that I don't expect to be here when they are seniors. Is that surprising to you? How many former top 50 recruits do you think play college basketball when they are 23? They will make plenty of money in Europe and if they improve next season could even be drafted.

[muskies1235]

Not sure if you are being sarcastic or not, but I assume snow is talking about the "core 4." Regardless, pretty ignorant by Snow considering that any of them could leave after the year ends.

I was legitimately asking.

He's said it a number of times and I don't think there's much of an argument to be made that he's one of the top 4 players on the team. He's probably the second best player on the roster right now behind Paul.

I know there have been cases where guys get granted a 6th year of eligibility so i didn't know if i had missed something or if Brian thinks Hankins isn't one of the 4 best guys.

[muskies1235]

How many former top 50 recruits do you think play college basketball when they are 23?

I don't know about specific ages, but more often than not top 50 guys are 4 year players, especially those who were in the back half of the top 50.

[XUGRAD80]

Castlin, Welage, Haskins are all grad transfers and their eligibility is up after this year. Will Hardin, Kennedy, and James return? Who knows, hard to see ALL of them back. That leaves Naji, Q, Jones, and Scruggs....the top 4 players in Snow’s opinion. 5 freshman are already signed.

Snow has been quoted as saying that he expects another freshman to be added, a grad transfer, and a regular transfer. But it’s all speculation at this point.

4 core returners, 5 freshman for sure...that’s 9....3 other potential returners....that’s 12....3 additions per Snow...that’s 15....

Limit is 13....numbers don’t equal out.....hmmmmm

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Castlin, Welage, Haskins are all grad transfers and their eligibility is up after this year. Will Hardin, Kennedy, and James return? Who knows, hard to see ALL of them back. That leaves Naji, Q, Jones, and Scruggs....the top 4 players in Snow’s opinion. 5 freshman are already signed.

Snow has been quoted as saying that he expects another freshman to be added, a grad transfer, and a regular transfer. But it’s all speculation at this point.

4 core returners, 5 freshman for sure...that’s 9....3 other potential returners....that’s 12....3 additions per Snow...that’s 15....

Limit is 13....numbers don’t equal out.....hmmmmm


The math is provocative. Watching the game last night reinforced my feeling that were I coaching X, I'd focus my recruiting efforts on players I thought were going to stay four years. That would, in all likelihood, lead away from higher ranked recruits and probably toward smaller, lesser known recruits who either don't have aspirations to play at the next level or to recruits who really value the degree. I really like those two frosh guards; they ate us up.

[GoMuskies]

Watching the game last night reinforced my feeling that were I coaching X, I'd focus my recruiting efforts on players I thought were going to stay four years. That would, in all likelihood, lead away from higher ranked recruits and probably toward smaller, lesser known recruits who either don't have aspirations to play at the next level or to recruits who really value the degree.

If we do this, we should also re-join the A-10.

There are some four year guys out there that are great to have, but you'd better be focused on getting the best talent if you want to be a serious (and not just an occasional Cinderella) contender for the Final Four. Some of those Georgetown kids are great, but when you focus on that level of recruit you're as likely to end up with Kamall Richards as you are to end up with Mac McClung.

[Xavier]

lesser known recruits who either don't have aspirations to play at the next level or to recruits who really value the degree.

I'd imagine 99% of D1 college basketball players have aspirations to play at the next level.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

I'd imagine 99% of D1 college basketball players have aspirations to play at the next level.

What I meant to say was a focus on recruiting players who aren't coming to college simply to play for just a year so they can move as quickly as possible to become professionals. That allows time for a team to jell and play together. There isn't time for that to occur when focusing on "one and done" players. I don't see how X can ever become an elite program trying to do what Duke, U.K., and others do. And, what fan can really identify with a team that turns over every year.

Until last year, the program that I thought best exemplified that was Nova. Clearly, that changed.

[XUGRAD80]

Those guards got hot and that happens sometimes. Better chance of that happening against X then of them ever sniffing the NBA.


99% of college FRESHMAN D-1 basketball players have those aspirations. Most probably learn pretty quickly if they are realistic or not.


What's wrong with having a program that ISN'T a final 4 or NC contender every year, but that is competitive, entertaining, and prepares the players for a life after college that won't include the NBA? Be realistic. Only about 1% of the players will ever spend any time in the NBA, and even fewer of them will have a real career there. If all you judge the success of a college sports program on is their number of all-americans, or number of championships, then you are missing what the real value of the whole thing is. For us fans, its just entertainment. For the players, its all about experiences, lessons learned, relationships, memories. Things you can't learn in a classroom, but things you will value all of your life. The championships, the banners, the trophies are all just icing on the cake. Even without them its still something that will be cherished forever. No matter if X never wins a NC, or even makes a Final 4, the players will not count their time there as wasted.

[GoMuskies]

Xavier didn't invest all the resources it has into men's basketball to NOT try to compete for championships (and field teams that include some All-Americans and future professionals). Xavier is not competing for one and dones (and likely never will), but there's sure as hell nothing wrong with trying to get as many top 50 players as you can and take the risk some of them blow up and leave after two years.

[AviatorX]

Those guards got hot and that happens sometimes. Better chance of that happening against X then of them ever sniffing the NBA.


99% of college FRESHMAN D-1 basketball players have those aspirations. Most probably learn pretty quickly if they are realistic or not.


What's wrong with having a program that ISN'T a final 4 or NC contender every year, but that is competitive, entertaining, and prepares the players for a life after college that won't include the NBA? Be realistic. Only about 1% of the players will ever spend any time in the NBA, and even fewer of them will have a real career there. If all you judge the success of a college sports program on is their number of all-americans, or number of championships, then you are missing what the real value of the whole thing is. For us fans, its just entertainment. For the players, its all about experiences, lessons learned, relationships, memories. Things you can't learn in a classroom, but things you will value all of your life. The championships, the banners, the trophies are all just icing on the cake. Even without them its still something that will be cherished forever. No matter if X never wins a NC, or even makes a Final 4, the players will not count their time there as wasted.

Is this a paid advertisement for the NCAA? Of course we’re going to measure success by wins, championships, etc. The rest of the picture is somewhat of a yes/no proposition.

[XUGRAD80]

Is this a paid advertisement for the NCAA? Of course we’re going to measure success by wins, championships, etc. The rest of the picture is somewhat of a yes/no proposition.

In that case you either become a fan of the blue bloods, become one of the blue bloods, or you doom yourself to a life of disappointment. The odds are stacked tremendously against a school like Xavier making one F4 or winning one NC, let alone being a consistent threat to do so. 20 wins a year...OK, can do. Win a BE championship or at least a consistent threat to do so? Sure. Be a top 20 team more often than not? Sure. But that’s about it....unless you want to sell your soul to the devil, so to speak. If the recent scandals haven’t shown anything, they have shown that virtually all of the top programs ARE cheating in some way. I’ll never be OK with X being in that crowd that way, and if cheating is what it takes to get there, I’d rather they never make it. I really don’t want to believe that there are any true X fans or alumni out there that would be OK with X cheating. What’s so great about being the “best”, if it brings out the worst in you?

[Xville]

I’m that case you either become a fan of the blue bloods, become one of the blue bloods, or you doom yourself to a life of disappointment. The odds are stacked tremendously against a school like Xavier making one F4 or winning one NC, let alone being a consistent threat to do so. 20 wins a year...OK, can do. Win a BE championship or at least a consistent threat to do so? Sure. Be a top 20 team more often than not? Sure. But that’s about it....unless you want to sell your soul to the devil, so to speak. If the recent scandals haven’t shown anything, they have shown that virtually all of the top programs ARE cheating in some way. I’ll never be OK with X being in that crowd that way, and if cheating is what it takes to get there, I’d rather they never make it. I really don’t want to believe that there are any true X fans or alumni out there that would be OK with X cheating. What’s so great about being the “best”, if it brings out the worst in you?

If villanova and gonzaga can do it, so can xavier.

[XUGRAD80]

If villanova and gonzaga can do it, so can xavier.

Not saying the can’t, or won’t. Only saying that if it takes cheating to do it, I’d rather they didn’t. Both of those programs have top coaches that have been there for years. Xavier doesn’t have that, never has. May never have it. Both are similar in size to X. Both are similar in academic requirements. The Zags never made a F4 until the 16-17 season. Nova has done it more, but has the advantage of being an East Coast team from one of the largest metro areas of the country, and has been a member of the BE for years.

But what separates both of them from most others are their head coaches.

[AviatorX]

In that case you either become a fan of the blue bloods, become one of the blue bloods, or you doom yourself to a life of disappointment. The odds are stacked tremendously against a school like Xavier making one F4 or winning one NC, let alone being a consistent threat to do so. 20 wins a year...OK, can do. Win a BE championship or at least a consistent threat to do so? Sure. Be a top 20 team more often than not? Sure. But that’s about it....unless you want to sell your soul to the devil, so to speak. If the recent scandals haven’t shown anything, they have shown that virtually all of the top programs ARE cheating in some way. I’ll never be OK with X being in that crowd that way, and if cheating is what it takes to get there, I’d rather they never make it. I really don’t want to believe that there are any true X fans or alumni out there that would be OK with X cheating. What’s so great about being the “best”, if it brings out the worst in you?

FYI, Xavier’s name came up multiple times in those “investigations.” Do I think that is a big deal at all? Absolutely not.

[XUGRAD80]

FYI, Xavier’s name came up multiple times in those “investigations.” Do I think that is a big deal at all? Absolutely not.

I certainly hope (and believe) that you are the exception, and not the rule.

[GoMuskies]

I don't think the WAY Xavier's name came up in that investigation was a big deal.

[xufan2020]

I grew up in Cincinnati and I’m an upperclassman in one of the prominent colleges in the tri state.
I hope some of you can just take my word on this, because I’m not dropping names.
I know, through being friends and family friends with local collegiate athletes, that ncaa rules regarding monetary incentives for players are frequently broken by many local universities.
My point is there’re moral levels to “cheating.”
Some of you here think “selling your soul to the devil” to recruit better talent puts you on the level of Louisville or North Carolina. Wrong.
As mentioned, Xavier came up in those NCAA investigations. Maybe some of you were surprised, but I was not. That doesn’t however mean people think less of Xavier as an institution. I know and respect that the alumni on this board want to completely uphold the integrity of the university. I have a lot of family that graduated/donated to X, so I’m not an outsider commenting here.