Game Thread: Xavier vs. Marquette (January 6, 2019)

[paulxu]

https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/kBAAAOSwqfNXkU44/s-l300.jpg VS. https://userscontent2.emaze.com/images/e65e6ccf-8cfe-406f-8d2f-aa01f028df8e/180e9b7f9796db4d9dda57f287b47f70.jpeg


Xavier University Musketeers (9-6, 1-1 BE) vs. No. 16/18 Marquette Golden Eagles (11-3, 0-1 BE)
Sunday, January 6, 2019: 12:00 Noon, EST
Fiserv Forum, (17,600), Milwaukee, WI

Live Chat (http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=XavierHoops)

Notes and Stats (https://goxavier.com/news/2019/1/3/mens-basketball-looks-to-bounce-back-on-sunday-vs-marquette-in-milwaukee.aspx?path=mbball)

Television: FOX National, including FOX 19 in Cincinnati, with play-by-play from Brian Anderson and analysis from Stephen Bardo. The courtside reporter is Katie George. FOX 19 will air a post-game wrapup show live from Fiserv Forum.

Radio: 700 WLW-AM, including via iHeart Radio, TuneIn and SiriusXM (380) and Internet (968) with play-by-play from XU Hall of Famer and former Musketeer standout Joe Sunderman ('79). Analysis will be provided by Xavier Hall of Famer and XU all-time leading scorer Byron Larkin ('88).

[paulxu]

Snipe's Redemption Game.

Get some.

[Muskie]

Hopefully, it's not National Marquette Day this year.

[SkyWalker]

One positive today. Going in, we have a better conference record. Hoping we still do on the way out.

[Olsingledigit]

Throwing bricks.1-8

[kellernr]

Why is Castlin allowed on the floor?

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[X Factor]

Brutal. Get Castlin out of there. Play a freshman, at least they'll get some experience.

[Lloyd Braun]

Castlin hasn’t exactly had a great start. Yikes. Goodin bites on most pump fakes including those from 30 feet.

[GoMuskies]

Why is Castlin allowed on the floor?

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I was going to as a similar question. What does he add that Kennedy and Harden could not?

[Lloyd Braun]

I thought Welage would be a good matchup for us against Marquette. Hopefully we see him for 25+ mins

[Lloyd Braun]

I was going to as a similar question. What does he add that Kennedy and Harden could not?

Leadership!

[Blue Blooded-05]

Leadership!

Hopefully not leadership by example

[bleedXblue]

Do we know where the rim is?

[GoMuskies]

Fox stole NBA on NBC’s music.

[xuinmd]

I agree on Castlin. Don't see any positives from. Double turnover to start the game. Lose the initial possession and possession to begin second half.

[bleedXblue]

Leadership!

i hope this is a joke....

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

I think a majority of our shots haven’t hit the rim

[whopper]

he can drive a bit and rebound a bit but we need spacing and he has been not too accurate. This does not look good so far.

[drudy23]

This is going to get ugly. No point in getting upset about it.

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

Naji at point. Gulp.

[kellernr]

Leadership!Leadership doesnt score points.

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[paulxu]

TO on first possession...sign of things to come.

Ugh. This will not be pretty.

[Lloyd Braun]

Fox stole NBA on NBC’s music.

They had to have purchased it right? Fox wouldn’t do that would they?

[kellernr]

Naji at point. Gulp.He really needs to learn to keep his dribble closer to his body. It's easy to get a steal when you are dribbling 4ft in front of you.

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[Lloyd Braun]

i hope this is a joke....




Leadership doesnt score points.

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Guess I need to have sarcasm font on next time? Who in their right mind would defend Castlin at this point

[GoMuskies]

They had to have purchased it right? Fox wouldn’t do that would they?

I’m sure they bought it. NBC isn’t using it.

[X Factor]

There was Goodin's patented step-back jumper that hits nothing but backboard. I knew we'd seen it soon enough.

[GoMuskies]

I’d complain about that Q shot...but who else should shoot right now?

[noteggs]

Anim averaging 6.4 per already has 8. What the heck

[kellernr]

Key to beating X. Just send them to the ft throw line. We cant hit shit

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[X Factor]

We suck

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

There is no doubt about it. This is a bad basketball team. And Quentin and Naji are at the heart of all of its problems

[bleedXblue]

There is no doubt about it. This is a bad basketball team. And Quentin and Naji are at the heart of all of its problems

And nothing is changing as they continue to make bad decisions and take bad shots

[paulxu]

Paging Stanley Burrell.....

[X Factor]

Great defense from Naji

[drudy23]

"best defensive team in years"

[GoMuskies]

Marquette is playing like shit. This could be a 30 point game right now.

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

We have two FGs in 12 minutes.

[Blue Blooded-05]

Q to Naji right through the 5-hole...turnover

Symbolic in so many ways

[drudy23]

The ironic thing is we're playing Howard pretty well. Everyone else, not so much.

[GoMuskies]

Please let Castlin lead from the bench.

[Olsingledigit]

Embarrassing.

[noteggs]

Anim averaging 6.4 per already has 8. What the heck

Make that 12

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

At least Steel is finally decided to sit Quentin after his, literally, sickening play

[whopper]

Look at Providence v Villanova yesterday. There is something to be said for playing it now like it is zero to zero because we really have to go back to the drawing board.

[kellernr]

This is a new record. Ive already decided to turn the game off. Q and Naji both make the laziest passes and take the worst shots. They need to be leaders on this team and looks like they dont care when they are out there.

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[bleedXblue]

I did not think it would get this bad. This is a rudderless team on the court. Not a single leader. I feel bad for Steele. Most of this is not on him.

[xu82]

On the bright side, there’s football on later......

[xuinmd]

I don't know if in more over 50 years of watching college basketball have I seen a team play this poorly.

[GoMuskies]

Go Jazz

[SM#24]

On the bright side, there’s football on later......

By halftime

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

Weird. Eli made a shot...

[xu82]

It took 13 minutes to get into double digits.

[drudy23]

Wow, some tenacity. Haven't seen that all year.

[kellernr]

It took 13 minutes to get into double digits.I will be stoked if they can get to 50 by the end of the game.

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[MITTENMUSKIE16]

So when misses hit some rim instead of all backboard it lets you actually get some offensive rebounds. Nice concept.

[GoMuskies]

Kennedy should start over Castlin.

[CP05XU08CU13]

One of the most PATHETIC Xavier teams I have ever seen. Coach Steele does not seem to have much fire. I think his tenure at Xavier will be short lived. Need a coach that knows how to motivate and get the most out of his players.

[kellernr]

If we could hit FTs it would be a 6 or 7 pt game right now. Been in the bonus since the 12 minute mark

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[Lloyd Braun]

I will be stoked if they can get to 50 by the end of the game.

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Garbage time will close the gap

[Olsingledigit]

Jones is 2-7 from the line.

[noteggs]

Team looks better w Elias and Kennedy on court

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

Team looks better w Elias and Kennedy on court

Seriously. This little vacation to the bench has been needed for Q.

[DexterBailey84]

I'm sorry but Goodin is terrible.....huge disappointment!
Naji not too far behind....both seem like they couldn't care less out there.

[Olsingledigit]

We reached 50% on fts with Scruggs Last two.

[GoMuskies]

Harden’s J is ugly.

[xu82]

I try very hard to be positive and upbeat, but they do make it difficult....

[GoMuskies]

I try very hard to be positive and upbeat, but they do make it difficult....

We’re in this game.

[X Factor]

How in the heck did Naji lose track of Howard????

[xu82]

Get to single digits by the half!!!

[drudy23]

The announcer just called Marshall a premier defender.

[X Factor]

Did Bardo just call Naji a premier defender?

[noteggs]

Harden’s J is ugly.

Is it ever

[GoMuskies]

Harden and Kennedy have made this watchable.

[Olsingledigit]

Under 10 at the half. Amazing.

[whopper]

I hoep TS can reel Q back in. There is clearly something out of synch but I have too many good memories of the past 2 years to be too critical or think it can't be fixed. Ditto Tyrique, the travel and missed foul shots are worth 4-5 points. Marquette has not been too good this game either.

[X Factor]

Halfway though the year, name one area this team has improved?

[GoMuskies]

At least we got to see Louisville’s own Miss America, Katie George.

[bleedXblue]

One of the most PATHETIC Xavier teams I have ever seen. Coach Steele does not seem to have much fire. I think his tenure at Xavier will be short lived. Need a coach that knows how to motivate and get the most out of his players.

go away

[bleedXblue]

Halfway though the year, name one area this team has improved?

defensively for sure dont know the stats but they are much better IMHO

[bleedXblue]

Harden and Kennedy have made this watchable.

gotta play guys who want to play. they may never be great/good players, but I would rather see them play hard and struggle than some of the lackadaisical stuff I am seeing now

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Not to be a broken record, but Jones and Goodin both have serious challenge next year. Freemantle and Tandy can play and will relegate them to the bench. Jones already has so he may be working things out now.


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[X Factor]

defensively for sure dont know the stats but they are much better IMHO

No. Their defensive ranking 125th.

[noteggs]

Who starts in 2nd

[GoMuskies]

Not to be a broken record, but Jones and Goodin both have serious challenge next year. Freemantle and Tandy can play and will relegate them to the bench. Jones already has so he may be working things out now.


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Tandy and Q will both start. Tandy gets Castlin’s spot.

[X Factor]

Who starts in 2nd

Same five who ended the 1st.

[xu82]

Who starts in 2nd

Have you been stretching?

[scoscox]

Not to be a broken record, but Jones and Goodin both have serious challenge next year. Freemantle and Tandy can play and will relegate them to the bench. Jones already has so he may be working things out now.


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Especially if we get harlond Beverly as well. Q will see a lot more of the bench

[bleedXblue]

Especially if we get harlond Beverly as well. Q will see a lot more of the bench

Beverly would be HUGE

[GoMuskies]

Take Q out.

[X Factor]

Goodin is awful at finishing around the rim. No touch.

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

I don’t understand why Q is back out there.

[whopper]

this foul advantage is not helping us at all.

[paulxu]

I'm sorry. This is embarrassing.

[noteggs]

Have you been stretching?

Yes if walking to the bathroom counts

[ArizonaXUGrad]

This year is embarrassing, but that is what you get with three low level recruits getting serious time. Put you seat belt on, it’s going to be a rough ride to nowhere this year.


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[Xuperman]

Days like today, all you can do is “remember the chin”.

[drudy23]

Did Welage make the trip?

[scoscox]

This year is embarrassing, but that is what you get with three low level recruits getting serious time. Put you seat belt on, it’s going to be a rough ride to nowhere this year.


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Three?

[paulxu]

We are 0-9 from 3.
Would seem we'd at least try to get Welage some shots.

[XUBob]

At some point in time you have to be able to shoot the ball. This team lacks shooters big time, I know I’m stating the obvious. Our d hasn’t been horrible but when you struggle to score like this group does every mistake is magnified tenfold. We all know it is going to be a long year, hoping for a brighter future.

[SkyWalker]

Do we practice between games??? I feel this team is getting worse.

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

We have 9 made field goals and 2 assists. Idk which one is worse.

[GoMuskies]

I'm glad Steele is playing Kennedy and Harden so much. They aren't worse than the guys they're replacing, and they're at least playing hard. May as well get then some experience.

[Xville]

There isnt one thing this team does well.

[IM4X]

PATHETIC PERFORMANCE


Not sure these guys guys deserve scholarships. Steele and staff should consider paying back whatever they’ve earned so far. So much of it is his inability to take control of this team... Every small bit of momentum gets squandered by these guys forcing garbage.

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

This game needs to be an eye opener for Q. Realize he is pretty bad at some things, and he needs to try his absolute best to only do the things he does well.

[GoMuskies]

Spida's in the building! Most exciting thing I've seen all day!

[whopper]

with that sequence you know iit is not your day. The next 8 minutes will be the biggest character minutes for Xavier that I have seen. It is zero zero now as far as I am concerned.

[GoMuskies]

Now that the game is likely out of reach we've decided to play.

[Lloyd Braun]

We are currently 0 for 10 from three. Our best shooter has one shot attempt in the game. Eyebrow raised at coaching.

[bjf123]

We’re headed for our first 20 loss season since Bob Staak’s 3rd season. That was also the the last time we had a losing conference record at 1-11. That streak ends this year.


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[CP05XU08CU13]

You go away. I am just stating the obvious. We were a #1 seed in the tournament last year. The drop off should not be this bad.

[scoscox]

Keep elias in for the love of god

[GoMuskies]

We are currently 0 for 10 from three. Our best shooter has one shot attempt in the game. Eyebrow raised at coaching.

3 shots for Welage in 90 seconds. Lol

[Lloyd Braun]

3 shots for Welage in 90 seconds. Lol

Clearly the coaches read the board and made the adjustment at the under 8 TO.

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

Paul. All heart.

[SkyWalker]

3 shots for Welage in 90 seconds. Lol


Coaching adjustment.

[XU 87]

You go away. I am just stating the obvious. We were a #1 seed in the tournament last year. The drop off should not be this bad.

They don’t count last year’s stats towards this year.

[Muskie]

You go away. I am just stating the obvious. We were a #1 seed in the tournament last year. The drop off should not be this bad.

We lost more than 60% of the scoring, had a bad recruiting class coming in, our Coach left (probably in part because of the bad recruiting class), and we have mismatched personnel. What exactly were you expecting? We are lucky this team is as competitive as it is.

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

Castling hasn’t scored a point since the UDM game.

[XUBison]

How is it possible that Welage, our only good shooter, got his 2nd shot with just over 5 mins left in the game? That blows my mind.

[GoMuskies]

Welage iso to drive wouldn't have been my call.

[IM4X]

Okay... If Steele starts off the post game presser with “I’m proud of how our guys didn’t give up today,” I give Shannon permission to bitch slap him.

[GoMuskies]

Marquette -7.5 was way too easy.

[whopper]

he probably drew a foul but will not get that call. Damn it back to 20 and it was a 20 point game or better

[SkyWalker]

4 assists. Lots of individual play, TEAM!

[bleedXblue]

You go away. I am just stating the obvious. We were a #1 seed in the tournament last year. The drop off should not be this bad.

4 posts and you are calling out the coach? FU

[ArizonaXUGrad]

We suck, we don’t have the horses to compete. It’s obvious. I don’t say bad things about Mack on here because he was a great coach for our program, but fuck him for leaving the cupboard so bare. This team is Scruggs and Marshall and a PG that needs to stop shooting.

I feel bad for Steele for having to give serious minutes to black holes like Goodin, Jones, and Castlin because he has to.

Last thing, Wojo leaving in his best to run up the score is pure Duke bullshit. Karma sucks and I can’t wait to watch it bite his ass.


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[bleedXblue]

4 assists says a lot. We don't share the ball well and even when we do can cant make a jump shot.

[bleedXblue]

We suck, we don’t have the horses to compete. It’s obvious. I don’t say bad things about Mack on here because he was a great coach for our program, but fuck him for leaving the cupboard so bare. This team is Scruggs and Marshall and a PG that needs to stop shooting.

I feel bad for Steele for having to give serious minutes to black holes like Goodin, Jones, and Castlin because he has to.

Last thing, Wojo leaving in his best to run up the score is pure Duke bullshit. Karma sucks and I can’t wait to watch it bite his ass.


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Agreed on Wojo. Up 15 under 2 minutes and he leaves his guys in.....Ahole

[GoMuskies]

Lol, we're the fanbase complaining about running up the score now. Perfect. Wojo was fine.

[XUBison]

4 posts and you are calling out the coach? FU

What is the minimum number of posts required before one is permitted to call out a coach? Asking for a friend...

[GoMuskies]

What is the minimum number of posts required before one is permitted to call out a coach? Asking for a friend...

17

[GreatWhiteNorth]

This team has no 3pt shooters. I worry about next year. You just can’t win without outside shooting.

[X Factor]

This team has no 3pt shooters. I worry about next year. You just can’t win without outside shooting.

Not in today's game. Golden State and Sacramento combined to make 41 three pointers last night. That's the way the game is going.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

This team has no 3pt shooters. I worry about next year. You just can’t win without outside shooting.

Tandy and Bishop can shoot, Kennedy and Harden should be able to shoot but I think Harden is a lost cause.

Wojo did leave his guys in and run it up. The code is if the road pulls their horses you do as the home team that’s up.


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[vee4xu]

Ah, just like the old days! Anyone who graduated in 1978, like me, or before, you know what I mean. At any rate, Welage and Castlin have to sit and anyone, I mean anyone on the bench needs to play instead. If you're gonna get drilled, then at least get drilled while allowing someone who can remotely possibly help next year playing. Hankins is a great contributor, the other two grad transfers are definitely not. I image Castlin being from Columbia would at least be great help at study table, though.

[GoMuskies]

Wojo was fine. We didn't pull our horses. Come to think of it, we dont have any horses to pull.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Wojo was fine. We didn't pull our horses. Come to think of it, we dont have any horses to pull.

Agree to disagree, Harden Kennedy Welage all in at the end. Anyone at risk of doing something was out.


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[whopper]

looks like Depaul is going to beat Seton Hall at Depaul. This was a bad day for sure for X but there is a lot of character ball to be played

[GoMuskies]

Agree to disagree, Harden Kennedy Welage all in at the end. Anyone at risk of doing something was out.


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Those guys were in for a while at that point. It wasn't like we subbed those guys in at 2 minutes.

[bjf123]

Agree to disagree, Harden Kennedy Welage all in at the end. Anyone at risk of doing something was out.


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Scruggs had fouled out, so he couldn’t be in there. Other than that, Goodin had a terrible game. No reason for him to be out there. Same with Castlin.


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[xuinmd]

I had a nightmare last night. I dreamed we were to play a nit game vis ud in dayton. I smiled when I woke up because I ralized we are not getting a bid to anywhere. I wish mack had been forced to coach this team.

[bjf123]

FWIW, in the post game presser, Steele started off saying he was proud of his guys. Felt they competed the whole game and didn’t quit.


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[scoscox]

I agree for the most part. Everyone besides Quentin gave pretty good effort

[Xville]

FWIW, in the post game presser, Steele started off saying he was proud of his guys. Felt they competed the whole game and didn’t quit.


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I think he realizes what most of us do...there isnt much talent on the team and they are what they are. No need to get that upset.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

FWIW, in the post game presser, Steele started off saying he was proud of his guys. Felt they competed the whole game and didn’t quit.


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I don’t disagree at all, this a team that has to play a near perfect to get wins on a nightly basis. Steele is playing poker with 4 cards right now. It’s hard to get a real assessment about anything right now with the talent disparity.


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[XUBison]

Ah, just like the old days! Anyone who graduated in 1978, like me, or before, you know what I mean. At any rate, Welage and Castlin have to sit and anyone, I mean anyone on the bench needs to play instead. If you're gonna get drilled, then at least get drilled while allowing someone who can remotely possibly help next year playing. Hankins is a great contributor, the other two grad transfers are definitely not. I image Castlin being from Columbia would at least be great help at study table, though.

Wrong on Welage. He has been a major contributor, as much as that term can apply to anyone on this team. I suspect he is not well liked though, by at least some on this team. The guy has legit “in the gym” range, yet he often stands wide open, while one of our goobers instead opts to chuck, travel, or charge his way to a ridiculous shot.

[JTG]

Agreed on Wojo. Up 15 under 2 minutes and he leaves his guys in.....Ahole
Karma, Mack did that all the time. What goes around comes around.

[IM4X]

FWIW, in the post game presser, Steele started off saying he was proud of his guys. Felt they competed the whole game and didn’t quit.


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Say it isn’t so. LOL.

So F’n predictable... just like I said he would.

And no one probably said anything.

Put me on record as officially calling out Steele for not having control
of this team. Same tired crap. He and his players all made it like this team would be much better than they are. Honestly, these players have enough talent to play with just about every team they played. These players are undisciplined, have no leadership, and just continue to screw up any positive momentum in a game they have and much of that is on coaching.

No this team team is not as talented as last year’s, but neither is any other team in the BE. It is understandable that X might struggle at the start of the season, but not getting better is very much pointed at Steele and staff. Nice guy. But his flatter my team when they play like crap isn’t working. No question we have at least 4 more wins with Mack at the helm. Come on Steele.

[CP05XU08CU13]

Some people have lives and families to take care of bleedXblue and don’t have time to post thousands of times on this website. Sorry I didn’t realize this discussion board existed until recently. Nice to know that there are classy fans to welcome the newcomers.

[JTG]

Wrong on Welage. He has been a major contributor, as much as that term can apply to anyone on this team. I suspect he is not well liked though, by at least some on this team. The guy has legit “in the gym” range, yet he often stands wide open, while one of our goobers instead opts to chuck, travel, or charge his way to a ridiculous shot.

I i4i7x8zx4tv
I agree with this, Welage can be all by himself, and our resident goober, Goodin, will dribble into the lane for an airball. In fact, that was the first thing I saw when I turned the recording on after coming home from church. So I just flipped it off. I seriously think Q has told Steele "Fuck off, you have to play me, you don't have a choice ".

[muskieindent]

What a disastrous game for Goodin. We have no chance if he doesnt play better. One point in 20 minutes. Larkin said he thinks his confidence is really low. Steele needs to put get this team fixed in between the ears.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

If the debate on this team is lack of talent vs. poor coaching, I'm not sure where I come down. but, I'm interested in how others think about this so I'm going to put this out there.

Just a few months ago, this board (in general) was pretty optimistic about this year's team. We had four starters returning (Scruggs being a sometime starter), we had three grad transfers one of whom was the DII player of the Year, we had Hardin returning (a four star prospect who had been unable to crack the lineup as a frosh given lots of talent on last year's team) and we had Kennedy and James. To many, it appeared we had above average ingredients to do something this year.

We had a rookie head coach but hey, after all, he had been with the program for ten years, the last few as Associate Head Coach. And, he was credited with being our lead recruiter. So, it wasn't like we had a virgin coach here.

After the first few games, some cracks appeared. The team did not appear to be jelling, we seemed to flat out quit against U.C. and the guys we thought were our leaders (Naji and Q) didn't seem to be leading.

Did we truly miss on the talent side? Are we that much worse than many of us first thought? Or, is it our coach?

I can't tell. While it seems like it is some of both, I have to wonder what Wojo, Willard or Wright would be able to achieve with this group. Our guys aren't playing with confidence (admittedly a tough ask given their record) and our leaders aren't leading. In particular, Q strikes me as almost uninterested.

Anyway, wonder how others come down on this.

[bleedXblue]

Some people have lives and families to take care of bleedXblue and don’t have time to post thousands of times on this website. Sorry I didn’t realize this discussion board existed until recently. Nice to know that there are classy fans to welcome the newcomers.

I feel like this board is very welcoming. But when you come and post nothing positive and call out the coaching in almost every single post so far, its obvious you have an agenda. If you can't see what he's dealing with and understand this is going to be a tough year for whole bunch of different reasons then I don't know what to tell you. Steele isn't going anywhere until he gets a chance to recruit and bring in his guys. I think its going to a long, long 2-3 years for you.

[scoscox]

I don't know what to think about Steele at this point, but it helps to remember that Sean Miller went 17-12 in his first year in the A-10 and Chris Mack went 17-14 in his 4th year in the A-10. Travis is dealing with a much tougher hand in the Big East

[IM4X]

Blue...

these are Steele’s guys... at least a lot of them are.

I don’t think anyone should be talking about running Steele out of town. But do you think these players are playing as well as you thought they would be?

Are they looking as good as Steele and the players let on before the season... all that “we have tremendous chemistry” talk. “Look out for Jones who lost all this weight and added muscle... he will be a beast” Scruggs is going to be a huge weapon from 3”

sorry Steele... not seeing it.

I expected better out of the gate. I was okay that they struggled at first... but this team should be improving in areas it isn’t... playing smarter... playing harder.

[xu82]

4 assists says a lot. We don't share the ball well and even when we do can cant make a jump shot.

It seems we share the ball a bit too much, but not with our team.

[IM4X]

It seems we share the ball a bit too much, but not with our team.

Post of the day!

[bleedXblue]

Blue...

these are Steele’s guys... at least a lot of them are.

I don’t think anyone should be talking about running Steele out of town. But do you think these players are playing as well as you thought they would be?

Are they looking as good as Steele and the players let on before the season... all that “we have tremendous chemistry” talk. “Look out for Jones who lost all this weight and added muscle... he will be a beast” Scruggs is going to be a huge weapon from 3”

sorry Steele... not seeing it.

I expected better out of the gate. I was okay that they struggled at first... but this team should be improving in areas it isn’t... playing smarter.

We lost the best single class to ever play at X last year. We lost the best coach X had ever had. It's Steele's first year. 2 frosh who aren't contributing much of anything. We lost a significant impact transfer in Evan B. Steele had to piece the transfers together over spring and summer to just get a 10-11 man roster together. To not think there were going to be some challenges through that would be extremely naive.

I think expectations were probably a bit high for this group.Steele isn't going to be a high performing head coach right now. Rarely do you see that right out of the gate. Naji and Scruggs are going to be fine and we can build around them. After that, we honestly don't have much. Very disappointed in Jones and Q. Not progressing and not leading more than anything. They sulk and hang their heads instead of pulling their team up around them.

I hate this, but am not going to start questioning Steele right now. Have we all not learned our lesson after Skip, Matta, Sean and Mack all struggled in their tenure's?

[IM4X]

We lost the best single class to ever play at X last year. We lost the best coach X had ever had. It's Steele's first year. 2 frosh who aren't contributing much of anything. We lost a significant impact transfer in Evan B. Steele had to piece the transfers together over spring and summer to just get a 10-11 man roster together. To not think there were going to be some challenges through that would be extremely naive.

I think expectations were probably a bit high for this group.Steele isn't going to be a high performing head coach right now. Rarely do you see that right out of the gate. Naji and Scruggs are going to be fine and we can build around them. After that, we honestly don't have much. Very disappointed in Jones and Q. Not progressing and not leading more than anything. They sulk and hang their heads instead of pulling their team up around them.

I hate this, but am not going to start questioning Steele right now. Have we all not learned our lesson after Skip, Matta, Sean and Mack all struggled in their tenure's?

I complete get what you are saying about losing such a great class. I do. I am separating those higher expectations with expectation Steele passed along Before the start of the season about how dominant Jones would be this year and all the talk about what great chemistry the team would have.

I think we all also recognize that the top tier BE teams are not as good this year. That should have made things a little easier. I would go so far as to say, I believe X had evnough talent to completely turn things around...IF... these guys could make smarter decisions and play hard for anywhere close to 40 minutes a game. Too many times X had a little positive momentum and they go right back playing dumb and reckless. It is hard not to include coaching in that issue happening again and again.

I feel like Steele could be a great coach for X... but I don’t see it happening until he changes his approach.

[xu koop scoop]

Proud of team effort today. I will get reamed for that comment I imagine. We tried 26 FTs to their 10. +16 on FT Attempts shows aggressiveness. We may have been more then +16 if we make 1 plus 1's better. We have 13 TOs to their 10. -3 on TO not bad. We also go -3 on Rebounds. THE 3 PT SHOT CONTINUES TO KILL US. We make 1 of 14 for 7% - horrendous. They make 10 of 29 for 34% - which is mediocre. 17 of 54 overall on FG is 31%, that's worse than their 3pt %. I predict we win the next 2 at home to start BE play at 3-2

[XU 87]

Blue...

these are Steele’s guys... at least a lot of them are.



The only guys on this team that are "Steele's guys" are Castlin and Welage, who were brought in primarily because of last year's bad recruiting class. It was rumored that Hankins was coming to X before Mack left.

[SkyWalker]

If the debate on this team is lack of talent vs. poor coaching, I'm not sure where I come down. but, I'm interested in how others think about this so I'm going to put this out there.

Just a few months ago, this board (in general) was pretty optimistic about this year's team. We had four starters returning (Scruggs being a sometime starter), we had three grad transfers one of whom was the DII player of the Year, we had Hardin returning (a four star prospect who had been unable to crack the lineup as a frosh given lots of talent on last year's team) and we had Kennedy and James. To many, it appeared we had above average ingredients to do something this year.

We had a rookie head coach but hey, after all, he had been with the program for ten years, the last few as Associate Head Coach. And, he was credited with being our lead recruiter. So, it wasn't like we had a virgin coach here.

After the first few games, some cracks appeared. The team did not appear to be jelling, we seemed to flat out quit against U.C. and the guys we thought were our leaders (Naji and Q) didn't seem to be leading.

Did we truly miss on the talent side? Are we that much worse than many of us first thought? Or, is it our coach?

I can't tell. While it seems like it is some of both, I have to wonder what Wojo, Willard or Wright would be able to achieve with this group. Our guys aren't playing with confidence (admittedly a tough ask given their record) and our leaders aren't leading. In particular, Q strikes me as almost uninterested.

Anyway, wonder how others come down on this.

I am going to take a shot at this. I know I am going to get lambasted but here goes. I think the biggest problem is control by Steele. Back in November, I started a thread titled "Head Bands" I asked for opinions on this new look for our Musketeers. I honestly felt and still feel that this was a concession to the players to work with the coach in an atmosphere of friendship, respect and shared goals - a kumbaya moment. I think this backfired and is not something most college coaches would "give away" to their new team. Miller and Mack didn't let the players wear headbands. Almost by definition, I think college basketball coaches are controlling figures. "Do it this way or sit." "I am in charge." "This is my team." How many times have you seen a coach get into a players grill?. This is far different than the recruiting skills that Steele has succesfully demonstrated over the years. You need to have a different relationship with the players as head coach vs head recruiter. I believe the head bands are a symptom of his lack of control or being in charge. He wants to be their friend. Coaches coach/Recruiters sell.

As for the core 4, many have regressed from last year. Q is not a shooter but he successfully ran the offense last year and found the open man. He should be able to do that this year. Tyrique should be better than last year, but has been very inconsistent so far. Naji is very athletic but tends to play out of control frequently but again should be improving over last year. Scruggs seems to be improving the most.

Right now I am putting most of the blame on the coach. I am not convinced he has taken control of this team and the staff is not developing the players as I feel only Scruggs is playing up to last year's standards.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

The only guys on this team that are "Steele's guys" are Castlin and Welage, who were brought in primarily because of last year's bad recruiting class. It was rumored that Hankins was coming to X before Mack left.

If Steele was in charge of recruiting the last few years, aren't they all his guys?

[IM4X]

The only guys on this team that are "Steele's guys" are Castlin and Welage, who were brought in primarily because of last year's bad recruiting class. It was rumored that Hankins was coming to X before Mack left.

I don’t think he’d say that...

Steele's first order of business, he said, will be reaching out to current players. All of them were recruited by Steele to some degree.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cincinnati.com/amp/475752002

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Steele probably doesn’t have control of this team but neither did Mack when Miller left. If you think he did look at the zip em up presser and tell me if didn’t roll Tu and Mark out to look like fools.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[scoscox]

And that was Mack's second year

[XU 87]

If Steele was in charge of recruiting the last few years, aren't they all his guys?

I think we're getting into semantics, but I use the term "his guys" as meaning players that Steele had the final say over as head coach as whether they would be recruited or offered a scholarship. Using that definition, most of these players are "Mack's guys".

[X-man]

I am going to take a shot at this. I know I am going to get lambasted but here goes. I think the biggest problem is control by Steele. Back in November, I started a thread titled "Head Bands" I asked for opinions on this new look for our Musketeers. I honestly felt and still feel that this was a concession to the players to work with the coach in an atmosphere of friendship, respect and shared goals - a kumbaya moment. I think this backfired and is not something most college coaches would "give away" to their new team. Miller and Mack didn't let the players wear headbands. Almost by definition, I think college basketball coaches are controlling figures. "Do it this way or sit." "I am in charge." "This is my team." How many times have you seen a coach get into a players grill?. This is far different than the recruiting skills that Steele has succesfully demonstrated over the years. You need to have a different relationship with the players as head coach vs head recruiter. I believe the head bands are a symptom of his lack of control or being in charge. He wants to be their friend. Coaches coach/Recruiters sell.

As for the core 4, many have regressed from last year. Q is not a shooter but he successfully ran the offense last year and found the open man. He should be able to do that this year. Tyrique should be better than last year, but has been very inconsistent so far. Naji is very athletic but tends to play out of control frequently but again should be improving over last year. Scruggs seems to be improving the most.

Right now I am putting most of the blame on the coach. I am not convinced he has taken control of this team and the staff is not developing the players as I feel only Scruggs is playing up to last year's standards.

I agree that Steele hasn't established his coaching chops enough to get (and keep) his players' attention. But the regressing of returning players has nothing to do with Steele IMHO. It is much easier for Goodin to run an offense and find the open man when he had Tre and JP waiting for his passes. And Tyrique needs room to catch and score this year, just like last year. But this year, teams can pack in the defense and it is much harder for him to get that room. Naji is trying to do too much, but this too stems from the fact that someone needs to pick up the scoring lost when Tre and JP graduated. None of this is Steele's fault. It is way premature to try and judge Steele's transition from associate to head coach. Give him some slack.

[SkyWalker]

I agree that Steele hasn't established his coaching chops enough to get (and keep) his players' attention. But the regressing of returning players has nothing to do with Steele IMHO. It is much easier for Goodin to run an offense and find the open man when he had Tre and JP waiting for his passes. And Tyrique needs room to catch and score this year, just like last year. But this year, teams can pack in the defense and it is much harder for him to get that room. Naji is trying to do too much, but this too stems from the fact that someone needs to pick up the scoring lost when Tre and JP graduated. None of this is Steele's fault. It is way premature to try and judge Steele's transition from associate to head coach. Give him some slack.

I agree with your points but I would like to see some improvement. As for Steele, Miller and Mack were head recruiters too. It is not terminal; it just takes some time.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

I agree that Steele hasn't established his coaching chops enough to get (and keep) his players' attention. But the regressing of returning players has nothing to do with Steele IMHO. It is much easier for Goodin to run an offense and find the open man when he had Tre and JP waiting for his passes. And Tyrique needs room to catch and score this year, just like last year. But this year, teams can pack in the defense and it is much harder for him to get that room. Naji is trying to do too much, but this too stems from the fact that someone needs to pick up the scoring lost when Tre and JP graduated. None of this is Steele's fault. It is way premature to try and judge Steele's transition from associate to head coach. Give him some slack.

I get your point but it still seems, a little bit anyway, of a cop out. For example, Tre was a spot up shooter meaning he generally wasn't going to create his shot. He needed Q (or somebody) to find a way to get him that ball when he was open. Welage is a spot up shooter. Like Tre, he needs Q to get him the ball when he is open. I'm not arguing the two are equivalent in talent but their games were, at least, somewhat similar. It seems like defenses are being packed in more this year (although I have no way to prove that) so Tyrique isn't going to get as many easy attempts. But, many of those "easy attempts" in the past were created by Q penetrating and then, once close to the basket and drawing defenders to him, dishing to Tyrique.

There is a fall off in talent and experience from last year but the composition of all teams generally changes year to year. Players must adjust their style and coaches must coach to help them with their adjustments. Q finished better last year (as I recall) and he made his free throws when he went to the line. I don't see that this year. On the other hand, knowing that Welage is one of our few competent outside shooters, shouldn't Steele try to find ways to get Welage open looks? I don't see that happening either.

There is a talent fall-off. I'll stipulate to that. But, I don't see the coaching adjustments to get the ball to the right people in the right spot. And, there does seem to be something to the argument that Steele isn't asserting enough influence on the play of individuals.

[paulxu]

Just an impression, but when Welage wasn't out there, their defense moved back inside the 3 pt line.
It's as if they knew none of our guys could make a shot out there, so why guard it.
Consequently the lane was a clogged nightmare, as we tried to get the ball inside...pass or drive.
Abysmal shooting day. We need people to set up some decent 3's or it will be a loooong season.

[whopper]

I think everyone realizes that lack of multiple outside threats is killing Qs ability to finish due to spacing, and Tyrique is not getting the momentum on passes that he got last year due to spacing and he isn't finishing (and of course today's bad FT compounds it). I see Scruggs pushing the ball more than Q, who seems to be moving more methodically. I think now that we realize we can sit Q he should be able to play with more pace (due to no need to pace himself)which should give him more "downhill" opportunities and the newly fit Tyrique and the 5 min miler Zach and even Welage should be able to run, not trot , the court. I think people underestimate the threat of Kanter last year with spacing and ability to make own shot. I won't throw anyone under the bus but Q if he makes a turnover (which will happen) could step it up on getting it back or getting into position. Good luck X, for better or worse I will be there and I have had so much "better" I can live with "worse" especially if I see improvement

[noteggs]

I think we're getting into semantics, but I use the term "his guys" as meaning players that Steele had the final say over as head coach as whether they would be recruited or offered a scholarship. Using that definition, most of these players are "Mack's guys".

100% agree! Let’s look at the 2019 class because we seem to be impressed with the talent. First recruit to decide on X was Samari Curtis. Lead recruiter was Steele and Curtis still decided to decommit after Mack left.

All five of the LOI signees in the class of 2019 received an offer while Steele was the head coach. Mack offers - zero. A lead recruiter is important but it’s more critical who’s on the top of the program’s list.

[Muskeagle]

I have no idea how good a coach Travis Steele will be. I will say, I generally like what I've seen from him as a person as he seems honest and calm and the players did seem genuinely enthused to have him back when he was hired. That said, who the hell knows how good he will be?

I teach at a high school and I know the varsity coach fairly well. He's been coaching since the late 80s and has had a lot of success over the years. He's definitely a "tough love" kind of guy, but his players respect him and know he cares about them. He has had the chance to attend a number of X practices over the years and he frequently mentions the transition he witnessed in Mack. The first year, he felt the players ran over him and generally did what they wanted. The next year, and even more in later years, he was in total control.

It's hard to get the guys to see you as the boss and it's hard to be the boss, when you were the "chummy" assistant for so long. I know guys have said this before, but in this one respect alone, it could take a year (given how young all these guys are...maybe two) before he is able to totally assert himself and be seen as the "head" coach.

Guys say all the time...."nope...not going to let the Super Bowl Championship affect me the next year"....but every year, it seems to do it anyway. The team can say..."no, we totally respect coach and know he's the leader," but maybe it really takes some time for it to sink in.

I'm hopeful that he will be great, but I know enough not to judge who he will be on this year.

[XU 87]

I think you raise good points- going from “chummy assistant” to head coach. I had also heard that Mack had a struggle or two to make this transition.

[xukeith]

Paul. All heart.

MVP of teh season so far. Give him the ball from 8 minutes left til the end of the game. Was Q benched most o 2nd half in favor of Harnin and Kennedy?

[MITTENMUSKIE16]

Yes, effectively he was benched for 9 minutes in the first half as well. Unfortunately, rightfully so.

[Caf]

Guys say all the time...."nope...not going to let the Super Bowl Championship affect me the next year"....but every year, it seems to do it anyway. The team can say..."no, we totally respect coach and know he's the leader," but maybe it really takes some time for it to sink in.

I like the Super Bowl analogy and also think it can be applied to the impact of being a 1 seed and regular season BE champs last year. I think we have seen some overconfidence coming into this year mainly in Goodin, but also in Jones and Marshall. Obviously these guys have gone through a crazy amount of change with all that we've lost since last season.

[Xville]

I'm not sure what some of you expected from this game. Did you think we had a really good chance of winning? We were 9 point dogs for a reason. Marquette is good, X is not. The talent isn't there this year, and maybe JP and Tre were able to hide the fact that Q and Tyrique are just not very good basketball players at the Big East level. That last point I am unsure of, but it's a possibility.

To question Steele right now in my opinion is silly. If it is this time next year, and the team looks like this I get it, but the cupboard was left pretty bare. X isn't Kentucky, Duke, Kansas etc that has the ability to reload after 4 guys leave (2 of whom are bouncing from NBA to G League rosters) for professional leagues. I simply believe this is a blip in the radar. Yeah we might only win 15-16 games this year, but I think next year we could be in the twenty range, and two years from now be back to what we are accustomed to seeing. We, myself included, need to keep focus and be patient with this transition.

[GoMuskies]

Personally, I expected us to lose by more than 7.5, which is why I took Marquette -7.5. However, Marquette was pretty awful in the first half. The fact that Xavier out-awfuled them by that margin was pretty hard to take. Marquette sucked for 20 minutes, and the game was never competitive. That's disappointing.

[IM4X]

I'm not sure what some of you expected from this game. Did you think we had a really good chance of winning? We were 9 point dogs for a reason. Marquette is good, X is not. The talent isn't there this year, and maybe JP and Tre were able to hide the fact that Q and Tyrique are just not very good basketball players at the Big East level. That last point I am unsure of, but it's a possibility.

To question Steele right now in my opinion is silly. If it is this time next year, and the team looks like this I get it, but the cupboard was left pretty bare. X isn't Kentucky, Duke, Kansas etc that has the ability to reload after 4 guys leave (2 of whom are bouncing from NBA to G League rosters) for professional leagues. I simply believe this is a blip in the radar. Yeah we might only win 15-16 games this year, but I think next year we could be in the twenty range, and two years from now be back to what we are accustomed to seeing. We, myself included, need to keep focus and be patient with this transition.


Do you mean “silly to question his current appoach” or “silly to question his ability as a head coach?”

It may be silly to read into what is going on now and say “Steele will never have what it takes to be a very good head coach.” On the other hand, I do not think it silly to question his approach at this point. It simply isn’t working. To be a successful head coach one not only has to be able to recognize what is and is not working, but find a way to get his players to fix it. Steele is saying a lot of the things you’d expect a “knowledgeable coach” to say to show he sees the problems with the team. He has not yet shown he can teach them the right things to do to fix it.

In fairness,(as you have pointed out) Steel does not have the depth or overall talent of last season’s team. Mack knew this year’s team was never going to have quite the success of last year’s team. But there is enough talent on this team to be winning more games than they have. This team has shown they can play well enough to compete with and beat most of the teams they’ve played, if they could just stop making so many stupid decisions.

Therein lies the question: whose fault is it that these players are not playing to their potential as individuals and as a team? Whose fault is it that the team does not have the chemistry or discipline now that we were lead to believe they would had? Whose fault is it that they do not appear to be getting even a little smarter with their decisions or a little more tenacious with their play in every game. This team shows laziness with the ball even during the beginning of a game (so tiredness is not always an excuse).

I don’t know if the headband thing is a factor or not, but this team has looked more like a bunch of thrown together parts with no one seeming to understand their role or where they should be. If that is not something to question a coach about then I don’t know what is.

So I can appreciate that Steele has less to work with than last year (included a few key 3 point shooters), but the BE competition is not what it was last year and there is a bit more talent on this roster than the performances and results we’ve seen would suggest.

Steele may still end up being a great coach for X, but he’s going have to get his hands dirtier to really mold this team. I am not going to judge him on whether this team makes the NCAA tournament but rather on how much better he can make THIS team each game. How much better the chemistry of THIS TEAM gets. How much better the decision making gets during THIS SEASON. I believe that will help tell a lot about Steele and his ability to coach.

[Xville]

Do you mean “silly to question his current appoach” or “silly to question his ability as a head coach?”

It may be silly to read into what is going on now and say “Steele will never have what it takes to be a very good head coach.” On the other hand, I do not think it silly to question his approach at this point. It simply isn’t working. To be a successful head coach one not only has to be able to recognize what is and is not working, but find a way to get his players to fix it. Steele is saying a lot of the things you’d expect a “knowledgeable coach” to say to show he sees the problems with the team. He has not yet shown he can teach them the right things to do to fix it.

In fairness,(as you have pointed out) Steel does not have the depth or overall talent of last season’s team. Mack knew this year’s team was never going to have quite the success of last year’s team. But there is enough talent on this team to be winning more games than they have. This team has shown they can play well enough to compete with and beat most of the teams they’ve played, if they could just stop making so many stupid decisions.

Therein lies the question: whose fault is it that these players are not playing to their potential as individuals and as a team? Whose fault is it that the team does not have the chemistry or discipline now that we were lead to believe they would had? Whose fault is it that they do not appear to be getting even a little smarter with their decisions or a little more tenacious with their play in every game. This team shows laziness with the ball even during the beginning of a game (so tiredness is not always an excuse).

I don’t know if the headband thing is a factor or not, but this team has looked more like a bunch of thrown together parts with no one seeming to understand their role or where they should be. If that is not something to question a coach about then I don’t know what is.

So I can appreciate that Steele has less to work with than last year (included a few key 3 point shooters), but the BE competition is not what it was last year and there is a bit more talent on this roster than the performances and results we’ve seen would suggest.

Steele may still end up being a great coach for X, but he’s going have to get his hands dirtier to really mold this team. I am not going to judge him on whether this team makes the NCAA tournament but rather on how much better he can make THIS team each game. How much better the chemistry of THIS TEAM gets. How much better the decision making gets during THIS SEASON. I believe that will help tell a lot about Steele and his ability to coach.

My question back to you would be how do you know that they aren't playing to their potential? We have a total of 4, maybe 5 guys that would normally be on a BE roster, especially Xavier's. Maybe this is the best this team can do given the talent and the square peg round hole roster makeup. I think Scruggs is playing to his potential (based on recruiting ranking) and miles ahead of where he was last year, the other 3 of the 4 aren't presumably but as I stated previously...maybe that is because JP and Tre were able to hide the actual talent level of those 3 guys.

[bleedXblue]

My question back to you would be how do you know that they aren't playing to their potential? We have a total of 4, maybe 5 guys that would normally be on a BE roster, especially Xavier's. Maybe this is the best this team can do given the talent. I think Scruggs is playing to his potential, the other 3 of the 4 aren't presumably but as I stated previously...maybe that is because JP and Tre were able to hide the actual talent level of those 3 guys.

Naji isn't exactly having a bad year. His shot selection is poor at times and he turns it over too much. But those are correctable IMHO. I do think he will get better. More concerned with Q and Jones.

[94GRAD]

Do you mean “silly to question his current appoach” or “silly to question his ability as a head coach?”

It may be silly to read into what is going on now and say “Steele will never have what it takes to be a very good head coach.” On the other hand, I do not think it silly to question his approach at this point. It simply isn’t working. To be a successful head coach one not only has to be able to recognize what is and is not working, but find a way to get his players to fix it. Steele is saying a lot of the things you’d expect a “knowledgeable coach” to say to show he sees the problems with the team. He has not yet shown he can teach them the right things to do to fix it.

In fairness,(as you have pointed out) Steel does not have the depth or overall talent of last season’s team. Mack knew this year’s team was never going to have quite the success of last year’s team. But there is enough talent on this team to be winning more games than they have. This team has shown they can play well enough to compete with and beat most of the teams they’ve played, if they could just stop making so many stupid decisions.

Therein lies the question: whose fault is it that these players are not playing to their potential as individuals and as a team? Whose fault is it that the team does not have the chemistry or discipline now that we were lead to believe they would had? Whose fault is it that they do not appear to be getting even a little smarter with their decisions or a little more tenacious with their play in every game. This team shows laziness with the ball even during the beginning of a game (so tiredness is not always an excuse).

I don’t know if the headband thing is a factor or not, but this team has looked more like a bunch of thrown together parts with no one seeming to understand their role or where they should be. If that is not something to question a coach about then I don’t know what is.

So I can appreciate that Steele has less to work with than last year (included a few key 3 point shooters), but the BE competition is not what it was last year and there is a bit more talent on this roster than the performances and results we’ve seen would suggest.

Steele may still end up being a great coach for X, but he’s going have to get his hands dirtier to really mold this team. I am not going to judge him on whether this team makes the NCAA tournament but rather on how much better he can make THIS team each game. How much better the chemistry of THIS TEAM gets. How much better the decision making gets during THIS SEASON. I believe that will help tell a lot about Steele and his ability to coach.


This is laughable!!! Might as well say "I don't know if the team not all wearing the same shoes is a factor or not." I bet the arm or leg sleeves that some of the players are wearing is a factor as well.

[Masterofreality]

Do you mean “silly to question his current appoach” or “silly to question his ability as a head coach?”

It may be silly to read into what is going on now and say “Steele will never have what it takes to be a very good head coach.” On the other hand, I do not think it silly to question his approach at this point. It simply isn’t working. To be a successful head coach one not only has to be able to recognize what is and is not working, but find a way to get his players to fix it. Steele is saying a lot of the things you’d expect a “knowledgeable coach” to say to show he sees the problems with the team. He has not yet shown he can teach them the right things to do to fix it.

In fairness,(as you have pointed out) Steel does not have the depth or overall talent of last season’s team. Mack knew this year’s team was never going to have quite the success of last year’s team. But there is enough talent on this team to be winning more games than they have. This team has shown they can play well enough to compete with and beat most of the teams they’ve played, if they could just stop making so many stupid decisions.

Therein lies the question: whose fault is it that these players are not playing to their potential as individuals and as a team? Whose fault is it that the team does not have the chemistry or discipline now that we were lead to believe they would had? Whose fault is it that they do not appear to be getting even a little smarter with their decisions or a little more tenacious with their play in every game. This team shows laziness with the ball even during the beginning of a game (so tiredness is not always an excuse).

I don’t know if the headband thing is a factor or not, but this team has looked more like a bunch of thrown together parts with no one seeming to understand their role or where they should be. If that is not something to question a coach about then I don’t know what is.

So I can appreciate that Steele has less to work with than last year (included a few key 3 point shooters), but the BE competition is not what it was last year and there is a bit more talent on this roster than the performances and results we’ve seen would suggest.

Steele may still end up being a great coach for X, but he’s going have to get his hands dirtier to really mold this team. I am not going to judge him on whether this team makes the NCAA tournament but rather on how much better he can make THIS team each game. How much better the chemistry of THIS TEAM gets. How much better the decision making gets during THIS SEASON. I believe that will help tell a lot about Steele and his ability to coach.

Agree with 100% of this. This team is deteriorating as lessons learned from last year fade- especially the returnees (not Paul. He's good enough to just play). And if Travis Steele was too complacent to see that he had to change up last year's offensive approach with this team that doesn't have the shooters- such as introducing more "Princeton Offense" back door cut principles- then that is all on him. You have to mold your approach to the guys you have, not force your system on those who can't handle it.

[Muskie4106]

For all those knocking Steele. I ask you this: What games would we have won if Mack and his staff were here? Very tough question to even answer but I would think MAYBE:

Wisconsin, San Diego State, Seton Hall and that's it. MAYBE MAYBE UC, but doubt it.

Steele is not a bad coach but he's only been a head coach for 1 year. We knew this going in. He needs time to make first year head coaching mistakes.

The difference between Mack and Steele's first year is Mack had TALENT. If Mack was not a FIRST YEAR HEAD COACH I say we win the 2OT game against k-state. Who knows.

Give it time and have some patience. We have been spoiled with TALENT.

Hell who knows maybe we can make a run like Miller did winning 4 games in 4 days and one of those wins was blowout against #1 undefeated St. Joes. Is it likely NO but anything can happen.

The moral of the story is we just are not that talented with too many variables on this team to GEL in a short time. 3 grad transfers, 2 3 star freshman, and a BRAND NEW coaching staff.

Folks we have for now a TOP 10 recruiting class coming in and a lot more basketball to play. WE will be happy again and we have to trust the Xavier Way and the system.

Hopefully we can get some W's this year that we do not expect. GO X

[paulxu]

This is laughable!!! Might as well say "I don't know if the team not all wearing the same shoes is a factor or not." I bet the arm or leg sleeves that some of the players are wearing is a factor as well.

Got to be those silly headbands.

[GoMuskies]

Hell who knows maybe we can make a run like Miller did winning 4 games in 4 days and one of those wins was blowout against #1 undefeated St. Joes. Is it likely NO but anything can happen.


Man, we need to do Xavier history lessons around here. :)

That was Matta's last season. 4 in 4 with Miller was in his second season, but there were no notably good teams in the A-10 that year and we played #3 seed Gonzaga close before losing as a #14 seed.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

This is laughable!!! Might as well say "I don't know if the team not all wearing the same shoes is a factor or not." I bet the arm or leg sleeves that some of the players are wearing is a factor as well.

Huh?

[94GRAD]

Huh?

Read the bolded part of the quote I copied.

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

Do you mean “silly to question his current appoach” or “silly to question his ability as a head coach?”

It may be silly to read into what is going on now and say “Steele will never have what it takes to be a very good head coach.” On the other hand, I do not think it silly to question his approach at this point. It simply isn’t working. To be a successful head coach one not only has to be able to recognize what is and is not working, but find a way to get his players to fix it. Steele is saying a lot of the things you’d expect a “knowledgeable coach” to say to show he sees the problems with the team. He has not yet shown he can teach them the right things to do to fix it.

In fairness,(as you have pointed out) Steel does not have the depth or overall talent of last season’s team. Mack knew this year’s team was never going to have quite the success of last year’s team. But there is enough talent on this team to be winning more games than they have. This team has shown they can play well enough to compete with and beat most of the teams they’ve played, if they could just stop making so many stupid decisions.

Therein lies the question: whose fault is it that these players are not playing to their potential as individuals and as a team? Whose fault is it that the team does not have the chemistry or discipline now that we were lead to believe they would had? Whose fault is it that they do not appear to be getting even a little smarter with their decisions or a little more tenacious with their play in every game. This team shows laziness with the ball even during the beginning of a game (so tiredness is not always an excuse).

I don’t know if the headband thing is a factor or not, but this team has looked more like a bunch of thrown together parts with no one seeming to understand their role or where they should be. If that is not something to question a coach about then I don’t know what is.

So I can appreciate that Steele has less to work with than last year (included a few key 3 point shooters), but the BE competition is not what it was last year and there is a bit more talent on this roster than the performances and results we’ve seen would suggest.

Steele may still end up being a great coach for X, but he’s going have to get his hands dirtier to really mold this team. I am not going to judge him on whether this team makes the NCAA tournament but rather on how much better he can make THIS team each game. How much better the chemistry of THIS TEAM gets. How much better the decision making gets during THIS SEASON. I believe that will help tell a lot about Steele and his ability to coach.

Having re-read your post, I don't find it laughable or unreasonable. While I do not, for a minute, believe the wearing of headbands (or the banning of them) says anything about this team, I think your final paragraph is a reasonable way to assess this year's team and Steele's performance. Are we getting better? I would add that improvement (if it occurs) may be a little choppy. We may see some positive developments show up in one game but disappear the next.

I subscribe (as it seems, do most on this board) that the talent level is lacking a bit on this team. But, I also look at the performance of the Core Four and think I see a bit of a decline from last year. I'm not positive about that as an earlier post noted we had four really good seniors last year who did much of the heavy lifting. So, maybe Naji, Q, Tyrique and Scruggs seemed to be more effective when they were part of that mix than now, when they are being asked to lead.

Nevertheless, I think its an interesting argument even if an academic one. The thinking we share on this board is not going to change the performance of this team. We just need to tough this year out. But, like IM4X, I want to see what Steele is able to accomplish with this group. I want to see whether he can get them to play smarter with fewer turnovers and dumbass shots; how he can get Tyrique to respond, whether Harden, Kennedy and James can mature and get better. I'm O.K. knowing we are NOT winning the B.E. this year but let's not give Steele a complete pass and blame everything on lack of talent. I still think a good coach will find a way to get even average talent to perform better. Let's see what he does.

[IM4X]

This is laughable!!! Might as well say "I don't know if the team not all wearing the same shoes is a factor or not." I bet the arm or leg sleeves that some of the players are wearing is a factor as well.

Uh... I was not suggesting the headbands might be causing player to be playing poorly.

My headband remark was a reference to the thoughts some others made on the board about Steele, allowing players to get away with doing things they believe Mack never would have allowed and how that may have been the beginning of a slippery slope to him losing control and players just doing things their own way.

I was just saying, I have no idea if that decision had any connection to the lack of focus and discipline with this team.

[SkyWalker]

Uh... I was not suggesting the headbands might be causing player to be playing poorly.

My headband remark was a reference to the thoughts some others made on the board about Steele, allowing players to get away with doing things they believe Mack never would have allowed and how that may have been the beginning of a slippery slope to him losing control and players just doing things their own way.

I was just saying, I have no idea if that decision had any connection to the lack of focus and discipline with this team.

Exactly! I originally mentioned the headbands, not as a physical issue with headbands but as a potential control issue.

One other thing...Steele in his previous role as recruiter would vist the kids and tell the everything they wanted to hear. How good they were, how they would fit in at X, how much playing time they would get etc. Selling the school and program so they come to X. As head coach, you often tell players what they are doing wrong; things to change, make free throws, play better defense, things they don't want to hear to play better and win games. It's a different role. Takes time to transition especially since Steele moved over one seat, like Miller and Mack.

[CP05XU08CU13]

I do not have an agenda. I just expect Xavier teams to play with discipline and heart. Maybe we have been spoiled for too long with our teams. Good programs do not rebuild, they reload. Look at programs like Gonzaga. Sure they have had more consistency at the head coaching position, but they play in a crap conference and are located in a not very desirable location. Don’t get me wrong, I cheer for and support other Jesuit schools when they are not playing Xavier. I just hate watching players quit, and this team has quit a few times this year. I believe that starts with the head coach.

[username]

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[X Factor]

I'm not sure where I stand on the headband issue, but I'm definitely against all the in-game celebration that takes place. This was an issue under Mack too. I'm pretty sure our BE tournament loss to Providence last year featured the Jones shoulder shimmy that's being played in the promos now. We took a huge lead that game and then started dancing around as the other team stayed focused and clawed their way back. We celebrate fairly minor stuff and then we hang our heads and curse at our shoes after missed shots etc. I don't recall ever seeing Villanova dwell on the most recent possession like that. They seem to focus on the current one.

I watch a ton of college basketball, and I have to admit, Xavier players seem to do more dancing, mean mugging, shoulder shaking, and screaming when they do something good than most teams.

[bleedXblue]

I watch a ton of college basketball, and I have to admit, Xavier players seem to more dancing, mean mugging, shoulder shaking, and screaming when they do something good than most teams.

I would like to see the demeanor change a bit. All business and taking more of a serious tone. Also the head hanging MUST be addressed......ridiculous its coming from captains

[Jumpin_Jamal_Forever]

The defensive lapses, the stupid turnovers resulting from forcing the ball into poor return situations, the silly in-game celebration (and for the record, I also hate that silly shoulder shaking, the jacked up threes by some of our poorest shooters, the outright quitting against tough opponents (like U.C.) and ignoring Steele when he's communicating from the bench. What is the common thread here? Lack of Discipline.

[IM4X]

Exactly! I originally mentioned the headbands, not as a physical issue with headbands but as a potential control issue.

One other thing...Steele in his previous role as recruiter would vist the kids and tell the everything they wanted to hear. How good they were, how they would fit in at X, how much playing time they would get etc. Selling the school and program so they come to X. As head coach, you often tell players what they are doing wrong; things to change, make free throws, play better defense, things they don't want to hear to play better and win games. It's a different role. Takes time to transition especially since Steele moved over one seat, like Miller and Mack.

He sure looks like the same “tell them what they want to here” kind of coach during the post game press conferences.

Steele: I am proud of the effort my guys gave.

X Fan: Hm... He must be talking about that one stretch of two minutes in the first half and those 3 minutes towards the end just before the beat down.

Steele: They never gave up.

X Fan: Uh... was he watching the same game.

Steele: Our guys need to take better care of the ball.

X Fan: Oh... so he is talking about the same game.

Steele: We need to take better shots.

X Fan: Wait... IÂ’ve heard all this before. Maybe I clicked on an old press conference. Let me see here... nope... new one just with same old remarks.

[94GRAD]

I'm not sure where I stand on the headband issue, but I'm definitely against all the in-game celebration that takes place. This was an issue under Mack too. I'm pretty sure our BE tournament loss to Providence last year featured the Jones shoulder shimmy that's being played in the promos now. We took a huge lead that game and then started dancing around as the other team stayed focused and clawed their way back. We celebrate fairly minor stuff and then we hang our heads and curse at our shoes after missed shots etc. I don't recall ever seeing Villanova dwell on the most recent possession like that. They seem to focus on the current one.


I watch a ton of college basketball, and I have to admit, Xavier players seem to do more dancing, mean mugging, shoulder shaking, and screaming when they do something good than most teams.


The defensive lapses, the stupid turnovers resulting from forcing the ball into poor return situations, the silly in-game celebration (and for the record, I also hate that silly shoulder shaking, the jacked up threes by some of our poorest shooters, the outright quitting against tough opponents (like U.C.) and ignoring Steele when he's communicating from the bench. What is the common thread here? Lack of Discipline.


How old are you guys? Heaven forbid these guys have fun playing an amature sport.

[username]

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[Xville]

I'm old enough to understand that this behavior and way of thinking is detrimental to game strategy and hurts the team's prospect of winning games. It's a lot more fun to stay focused and win the game than it is to celebrate after a sweet dunk. In the moment, a young athlete wants to get distracted and celebrate, so a good coach has to tell them not to do that. Then they get to celebrate on the bus and when they get back to campus after their win.

This also isn't exactly a game of 21 at the Y. The players are playing to determine whether they get to go make millions in the NBA, make decent money doing something they enjoy overseas, or aren't able to market the one skill they've spent all their time working on. Xavier doesn't get sure-bet NBA prospects, so they often do have to play their way into wherever they end up. Having a coach who takes it seriously and doesn't think "oh it's an amateur sport, let then dance if they like to dance" will benefit them in the end.

The in-game celebrating distracts our team from the next possession, comes off as poor sportsmanship, and often seems only to motivate the other team. A lot of people seem to share this perspective. Do you have a rebuttal other than "how old are you?"

Considering that the first and last paragraphs are pure speculation and opinion, someone asking "how old are you" is just as good of an argument.

[username]

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[Muskie4106]

Man, we need to do Xavier history lessons around here. :)

That was Matta's last season. 4 in 4 with Miller was in his second season, but there were no notably good teams in the A-10 that year and we played #3 seed Gonzaga close before losing as a #14 seed.

You are totally right. Oops.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

There is a lot of revisionist history on here. That said, I have never seen a new Xavier coach take over a team with less talent than this one. Steele had 7 guys, just 7 guys including two Freshmen and neither were sure-fire guys. That is really just five guys and the three he was able to grab with some experience weren't exactly the impact grad transfers. The Big East got Cremo and Morrow who are both a lot better.

[94GRAD]

I'm old enough to understand that this behavior and way of thinking is detrimental to game strategy and hurts the team's prospect of winning games. It's a lot more fun to stay focused and win the game than it is to celebrate after a sweet dunk. In the moment, a young athlete wants to get distracted and celebrate, so a good coach has to tell them not to do that. Then they get to celebrate on the bus and when they get back to campus after their win.

This also isn't exactly a game of 21 at the Y. The players are playing to determine whether they get to go make millions in the NBA, make decent money doing something they enjoy overseas, or aren't able to market the one skill they've spent all their time working on. Xavier doesn't get sure-bet NBA prospects, so they often do have to play their way into wherever they end up. Having a coach who takes it seriously and doesn't think "oh it's an amateur sport, let then dance if they like to dance" will benefit them in the end.

The in-game celebrating distracts our team from the next possession, comes off as poor sportsmanship, and often seems only to motivate the other team. A lot of people seem to share this perspective. Do you have a rebuttal other than "how old are you?"

Let me guess, you hate when guys celebrate homeruns/important hits, touchdowns/turnovers/sacks as well?

[xu koop scoop]

Who might have been at the UMass #1 Marcus Camby game our 1st year in A10. 1995. Our last losing season. We lost in OT to #1 UMass at the Gardens.
I only bring this up because I don't remember much of any celebrations after dunks or other fancy shots or blocks. Our boys realized they had a chance to do something special & hunkered down on D for every possession. When we were an A10 Tourney #8 seed & blew out #1 undefeated St Joes in A10 Tourney it seemed all business to our players that day. We had to win that tourney just to get an NCAA bid. That business now, party later mentality got us to the
Elite 8 that year. Celebrate after the victory. Let the other team know fantastic plays are to be expected from you, not celebrated. I realize these memories are from a long ago time, but the celebrations do indeed distract from in game concentration. A 3 second party after a basket can lead to an easy bucket the other way. This ain't a Barnum & Bailey Circus playing on the court. GET SOME PROFESSIONALISM & DISCIPLINE. If you want to go Pro, Act Pro.

[94GRAD]

Who might have been at the UMass #1 Marcus Camby game our 1st year in A10. 1995. Our last losing season. We lost in OT to #1 UMass at the Gardens.
I only bring this up because I don't remember much of any celebrations after dunks or other fancy shots or blocks. Our boys realized they had a chance to do something special & hunkered down on D for every possession. When we were an A10 Tourney #8 seed & blew out #1 undefeated St Joes in A10 Tourney it seemed all business to our players that day. We had to win that tourney just to get an NCAA bid. That business now, party later mentality got us to the
Elite 8 that year. Celebrate after the victory. Let the other team know fantastic plays are to be expected from you, not celebrated. I realize these memories are from a long ago time, but the celebrations do indeed distract from in game concentration. A 3 second party after a basket can lead to an easy bucket the other way. This ain't a Barnum & Bailey Circus playing on the court. GET SOME PROFESSIONALISM & DISCIPLINE. If you want to go Pro, Act Pro.

You guys are F-ing crazy to think that celebrating good plays is a recent development. Google image Lenny Brown/Bob Huggins. Grant/West/Frey/Price/Williams/ all showed emotion and celebrated during games. Please go outside and yell at the clouds while you're at it.

[Caf]

You people are nuts. In a year where we lost our Coach and 68% of our scoring, how have you landed on celebrating and attitude as a problem? We could turn Xavier into West Point and we would still have the same record. Get real.

[username]

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[xu koop scoop]

In Baseball you can hit a Home Run and celebrate. In Football you can score a Touchdown and celebrate. In both those sports, the action stops at that point.
In Basketball celebrating a Basket can result in a quick inbounds to your man & he's scoring while you are celebrating. I see us stealing balls & celebrating while dribbling down court only to have it stolen back. I see acrobatic dunk shots missed when a simple dunk or layup would suffice. I see other teams do the same. I believe our CURRENT team that will be underdogs most of the rest of our games needs to raise their basketball I.Q. to a higher level than their opponents I.Q. That seems laughable as we usually play at a low I.Q. level. Other teams have better shooters & better defenders. Improving our "mental /
focus / discipline" (which I believe can be successfully taught) to a level higher than our opponents gives us a fighting chance.

[noteggs]

You people are nuts. In a year where we lost our Coach and 68% of our scoring, how have you landed on celebrating and attitude as a problem? We could turn Xavier into West Point and we would still have the same record. Get real.

So true. For some reason when someone makes a mistake or two in a game, suddenly it becomes attitude, lazy, or they’re dismissive.

[IM4X]

I would be ecstatic if we were all upset about players only making a mistake or two...

and unlike the team last year, this team is not likely going to shoot their way back into a game.

[waggy]

Last thing, Wojo leaving in his best to run up the score is pure Duke bullshit. Karma sucks and I can’t wait to watch it bite his ass.





Agreed on Wojo. Up 15 under 2 minutes and he leaves his guys in.....Ahole


Lol, we're the fanbase complaining about running up the score now. Perfect. Wojo was fine.


There is a change in the way teams rankings/ratings are calculated this year....

[AviatorX]

No, I don't hate celebrating and having fun. I'm speaking from a practical game strategy standpoint. When you score a touchdown, you've got time to celebrate. Basketball is a little quicker. Have you seriously not seen one of our guys make faces at the camera/dance and not make it back in time to be completely set on defense? It's also pretty embarrassing to act like that and then go on to lose the game in my opinion. If we were firing on all cylinders and dominating, it wouldn't stand out so much. Celebrating your own personal play and not focusing on winning the game as a team is absolutely an indication of the team's faulty mentality this year. I didn't think it was a great idea when I saw it last year, but this year it's not something we can even afford to do.

This board officially sucks this year more than the team on the floor.

[username]

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[Xville]

Nice, more personal attacks without a counter argument. Watch a couple X games and see if you can spot one of the guys losing focus and mishandling the next possession. Also remember it's not just about celebrating but also pouting and hanging their head. It's a flaw in mentality, and we're just seeing some of the symptoms. Then watch a couple Nova games and see if similar behavior is being displayed. Those poor NCAA title holders from Nova must be so sad though that they weren't allowed to have fun! Wright is a big meanie!

This team would still suck if they had different behavior from the one that disapprove of. Its lack of talent on the roster that's the issue. I'd invite you to watch an nba game once in a while, especially one involving lebron james and tell me again how showing emotion one either side of the coin is so awful. Better yet, watch Villanova's championship game last year and maybe you will stop preaching from your pulpit.

[AviatorX]

Nice, more personal attacks without a counter argument. Watch a couple X games and see if you can spot one of the guys losing focus and mishandling the next possession. Also remember it's not just about celebrating but also pouting and hanging their head. It's a flaw in mentality, and we're just seeing some of the symptoms. Then watch a couple Nova games and see if similar behavior is being displayed. Those poor NCAA title holders from Nova must be so sad though that they weren't allowed to have fun! Wright is a big meanie!

Please stop posting.

[Xville]

Did you guys see all that jumping up and down and high fiving during the Georgetown game? Those guys should be ashamed of themselves for celebrating good plays during the game...shame! Shame!

[XUBison]

Did you guys see all that jumping up and down and high fiving during the Georgetown game? Those guys should be ashamed of themselves for celebrating good plays during the game...shame! Shame!

No doubt. We would have won by 20 if it weren’t for all those defensive collapses caused by the distraction of all those ridiculous celebrations. Act like you’ve been there before. Oh shit, they haven’t. Well, this new coach is out of control.