Game Thread: Xavier vs. Butler (February 26, 2017) Big East Conference

[BMoreX]

Didn't see a game thread yet.

And what do we have here....https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170226/0fce233585410da8fac7eb615a48c3ea.jpg

[GoMuskies]

Xavier +2. Won't touch it.

[GIMMFD]

Throwbacks.. we have to win. PLEASEEE

[bjf123]

We've blown enough halftime leads. Maybe it's good we're not leading.


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[nasdadjr]

Gonna be close but Butler will win in the end cause we won't make enough plays. That's just how it is. The guys are playing tough but they just are not as talented.

[Muskie]

Gonna be close but Butler will win in the end cause we won't make enough plays. That's just how it is. The guys are playing tough but they just are not as talented.

You're a beacon of positive energy as usual.


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[X Factor]

Gonna be close but Butler will win in the end cause we won't make enough plays. That's just how it is. The guys are playing tough but they just are not as talented.

Yep, Butler just has more weapons on offense. If it turns into a FT contest, we're in trouble.

[nasdadjr]

They are just all around better and we have zero depth. It's just the reality of this season. I hope the small ball experiment is over after this season and we go back to getting a real traditional big. That being said still gonna cheer for these guys and hope for the miracle

[nasdadjr]

And put it down. With how this team is playing as painful as it is to ever say this... Butler is hittin on all cylinders going into March. Picking them in the final Four may make you some serious cash

[AviatorX]

They are just all around better and we have zero depth. It's just the reality of this season. I hope the small ball experiment is over after this season and we go back to getting a real traditional big. That being said still gonna cheer for these guys and hope for the miracle

Yeah, X should probably overreact after one frustrating season that had a whole list of ills and go against the grain of the rest of the sport. Good idea.

Forget about last year's program best regular season employing the same strategy.

[X Factor]

Multiple straight possessions with turnovers. Late in the second half. Same old thing.

[HenryMuto]

Everyone at the game today ? One page thread. God damn turnovers.

[whopper]

Why dont the announcers mention that the turnovers happened with Goodin out! They have never mentioned it

[X Factor]

Another complete meltdown

[X Factor]

Why dont the announcers mention that the turnovers happened with Goodin out! They have never mentioned it

Does that really matter? We have other players you know who are supposed to take care of the ball!

[Xville]

Another loss....great

[X Factor]

Baldwin has abused Goodin today and the rest of Xavier. Great freshman for Butler.

[HenryMuto]

Was one hell of a game until those 5 turnovers in like 2 minutes.

[X Factor]

There are A LOT of Xavier fans who weren't even alive the last time Xavier lost 5 in a row. I was 4 years old.

[GoMuskies]

Remaining shitty

[X Factor]

All five losses by 7 or more points.

[X Factor]

When's the last time Xavier lost 3 homes games in a season?

[BMoreX]

Well this sucks.

[GoMuskies]

Really don't want our season coming down to a road game at DePaul. Dangerous.

[whopper]

Does that really matter? We have other players you know who are supposed to take care of the ball! On this team sad to say there is only one real ball handler with zero backup and the turnovers were way out on the floor without penetration.. The "and one" on Goodin was a killer..he can't afford to do it Bleuitt, Macura and Bernard are not good ball handlers for their height and can't just rise up and hit 18 footers at the end of shot clock which masks poor ball handling. They are a very good and deep team and may be more physically talented than Villanova. Martin looks as big as Gaston in the post game line up and Baldwin looks very good. One other guard would really help and we know why we are short. I think they will be at Marquette if they play like today though

[mistabeecee41]

need 3 more or we'll be sweating on selection sunday. don't care how confident the dancecard is, doesn't include the human aspect that we're 3-5 since we've lost a key player.

[X Factor]

Goodin had 5 or 6 turnovers today.

[AviatorX]

When's the last time Xavier lost 3 homes games in a season?

All of 2 seasons ago.

[xavierj]

Baldwin has abused Goodin today and the rest of Xavier. Great freshman for Butler.

Goodin was actually ok today. Made some mistakes, but I will take 11, 7 and 6 from a freshman point guard. Xavier hit lacks toughness and didn't bear down when they went up 2 with 5 minutes left. Hopefully the can get the next 2 and be able to relax a little. Xavier actually played good defense but Butler just made some tough shots. Would be nice if they could play a team who has an off night.

[drudy23]

Can we panic yet?

[xavierj]

Can we panic yet?

I think a lot of you have been for a while. Do whatever makes you feel good. Fact of the matter is, not having Edmond is just a disaster for Xavier. Hard to replace a pro and expect things to run smoothly.

[Muskie in dayton]

This game was a microcosm of our season. Every time things started looking up, something shitty would happen to us, or we would do something shitty to break our momentum. Then it all went to hell at the end.

[X Factor]

Goodin was actually ok today. Made some mistakes, but I will take 11, 7 and 6 from a freshman point guard. Xavier hit lacks toughness and didn't bear down when they went up 2 with 5 minutes left. Hopefully the can get the next 2 and be able to relax a little. Xavier actually played good defense but Butler just made some tough shots. Would be nice if they could play a team who has an off night.

Goodin's just not efficient and is ZERO threat from three. He also had 6 turnovers, a few crucial ones late in the second half. Baldwin made more than 50% of his shots and made huge plays on offense and defense to lead Butler to a road win.

Xavier should NEVER be in a position where they can relax this year.

You want Xavier to play a team who has an off night? I think the problem is Xavier's defense. X is ranked 68th by KenPom in defense!! We stink at defense.

[AviatorX]

Goodin's just not efficient and is ZERO threat from three. He also had 6 turnovers, a few crucial ones late in the second half. Baldwin made more than 50% of his shots and made huge plays on offense and defense to lead Butler to a road win.

Xavier should NEVER be in a position where they can relax this year.

You want Xavier to play a team who has an off night? I think the problem is Xavier's defense. X is ranked 68th by KenPom in defense!! We stink at defense.

Yeah, Baldwin has been one of the best freshman in the country this season. No question.

[AviatorX]

So much senior leadership and hustle from Bernard out there today, too. Too bad it couldn't get X over the hump.

[OTRMUSKIE]

This team sucks!!!! If x doesn't win next two it's NIT

[SemajParlor]

I did not foresee Xavier's season being as it has been.

[xavierj]

I did not foresee Xavier's season being as it has been.

I didn't either. I saw Eddie Eiykor, Myles Davis and Edmond Summer playing key roles. I saw Jones, Goodin and Gaston being 12-16 minute guys spelling the others. Would have been a different team with a focused Myles Davis all year and a healthy Sumner.

[bleedXblue]

Can we panic yet?

What good does that do?

This team just isn't very good.

[bleedXblue]

Goodin's just not efficient and is ZERO threat from three. He also had 6 turnovers, a few crucial ones late in the second half. Baldwin made more than 50% of his shots and made huge plays on offense and defense to lead Butler to a road win.

Xavier should NEVER be in a position where they can relax this year.

You want Xavier to play a team who has an off night? I think the problem is Xavier's defense. X is ranked 68th by KenPom in defense!! We stink at defense.

It starts and ends here for the most part. We cant get stops when we need to. End of story and it isn't changing this year.

[nasdadjr]

Yeah, X should probably overreact after one frustrating season that had a whole list of ills and go against the grain of the rest of the sport. Good idea.

Forget about last year's program best regular season employing the same strategy.

Haha. We have no one on this team anywhere close to what Farr and Reynolds provided last year. They were not small ball players

[whopper]

You can't have a 40 minute player in Goodin who literally can't afford do make a single foul..his fouls per minute are not horrible but he is the one player they can't afford to lose. He did have a bad turnover coming in cold near the end but the bad stretch was with him not on the floor. They had a 71-69 lead and forced a missed shot, Martin came up from a scrum and hit the "circus shot" and O'Mara made a perfect volleyball serve from frustration(not malice). If (and i know all the "if" jokes, they are up 2 with the ball and in the bonus. It was not meant to be and I have never(and I go back to Lew Alcindor) seen a team that gets less easy baskets than Xavier(lack of team speed/quickness). They may win the national championship in a half court league.

[XfansinKy]

I think a lot of you have been for a while. Do whatever makes you feel good. Fact of the matter is, not having Edmond is just a disaster for Xavier. Hard to replace a pro and expect things to run smoothly.

When they announced his injury, my first inadvertent words were, "Season's over".

[AviatorX]

Haha. We have no one on this team anywhere close to what Farr and Reynolds provided last year. They were not small ball players

What did you call surrounding either of those guys with 4 guards? Which is what X did the vast majority of the time last year.

So I take it Gaston, OMara and Jones are small ball guys?

[Snipe]

10 pounds of suck in a 5 pound bag.

This team is painful to watch because they show you they can play with all of their opponents, and then, collapse mode.

It is all too familiar. And time is running short to right this ship. Just saying that proves that I am delusional.

I will give it up to the Butler Bulldogs. That is a fine basketball team.

I propose a toast to FIREDUPKAREN!

[muskieindent]

When they announced his injury, my first inadvertent words were, "Season's over".
Losing Myles was a big setback . Sumner going down was the nail in the coffin. He was probably the one guy we could least afford to lose followed closely by Tre.

[xavierj]

Goodin's just not efficient and is ZERO threat from three. He also had 6 turnovers, a few crucial ones late in the second half. Baldwin made more than 50% of his shots and made huge plays on offense and defense to lead Butler to a road win.

Xavier should NEVER be in a position where they can relax this year.

You want Xavier to play a team who has an off night? I think the problem is Xavier's defense. X is ranked 68th by KenPom in defense!! We stink at defense.

SYRACUSE was 63 and Oklahoma was 65 last year. Both made the final 4. In today's game a Butler guard hit a step back three at end of shot clock with a guy 6-8 on him. And then Martin nailed a 15 foot fadeaway with 2 guys on him late
In 2nd half. Then Xavier had Bernard, Macura and Blueitt miss wide open 3's on the same possession.

[X Factor]

SYRACUSE was 63 and Oklahoma was 65 last year. Both made the final 4. In today's game a Butler guard hit a step back three at end of shot clock with a guy 6-8 on him. And then Martin nailed a 15 foot fadeaway with 2 guys on him late
In 2nd half. Then Xavier had Bernard, Macura and Blueitt miss wide open 3's on the same possession.

That's not true. According to KenPom, OU was ranked #18 and Syracuse was ranked #17 in defensive efficiency last year. They were both really good defensively.
Xavier is pretty bad defensively.

[GoMuskies]

If Xavier loses to Marquette, it looks like there's a good chance we'll be playing Wednesday in MSG. Yuck.

[vee4xu]

Really don't want our season coming down to a road game at DePaul. Dangerous.

Did I hear correctly yesterday during the DePaul vs Seton Hall game that this season is the last one the DePaul is playing in whatever the name is of their current venue? If so, think of this. DePaul's last game in an arena, senior night for them and should X loose to Marquette, they would be playing to not have a losing record in the conference in, what 35 years? Oh, and hoping to not end the regular season on a seven game losing streak.

Sleep well, all.

[vee4xu]

Listening to Mack's postgame radio show today, he sounds just like he has over the entire losing streak.

Like our hustle.
Too many turnovers at critical times.
Give other team credit, they made some tough shots.
Have to find some way to get a win.

There are probably others, but these are the ones he's delivered in the same forlorn monotone over the past three weeks. Not good.

[AviatorX]

Listening to Mack's postgame radio show today, he sounds just like he has over the entire losing streak.

Like our hustle.
Too many turnovers at critical times.
Give other team credit, they made some tough shots.
Have to find some way to get a win.

There are probably others, but these are the ones he's delivered in the same forlorn monotone over the past three weeks. Not good.

I'm sure the closed doors message to the team is different. What is he supposed to say in these interviews?

[muethibp]

Did I hear correctly yesterday during the DePaul vs Seton Hall game that this season is the last one the DePaul is playing in whatever the name is of their current venue? If so, think of this. DePaul's last game in an arena, senior night for them and should X loose to Marquette, they would be playing to not have a losing record in the conference in, what 35 years? Oh, and hoping to not end the regular season on a seven game losing streak.

Sleep well, all.

I said before the Villanova game that there was a chance that they could lose out. It's becoming a very realistic possibility.

[X-band '01]

Did I hear correctly yesterday during the DePaul vs Seton Hall game that this season is the last one the DePaul is playing in whatever the name is of their current venue? If so, think of this. DePaul's last game in an arena, senior night for them and should X loose to Marquette, they would be playing to not have a losing record in the conference in, what 35 years? Oh, and hoping to not end the regular season on a seven game losing streak.

Sleep well, all.

That is correct. DePaul will be playing their last game at AllState Arena on Saturday.

That said, I'm sure they'll double their usual crowd and will likely have 4,000 in attendance as opposed to 2,000.

[vee4xu]

I'm sure the closed doors message to the team is different. What is he supposed to say in these interviews?

Frankly, it isn't about what he says in the interviews. I can really care less what he says. It's more about the fact that he sounds defeated. Same points, in same monotone voice, he doesn't criticize his players, he doesn't criticize their effort (I applaud him for both) and he sounds like he is just playing out the string. Nothing he's tried is working and so he's just fine with the guys he has going out and doing the best that they can, knowing before the game starts they will likely lose. If there is one thing I would like to hear Mack discuss, how is that this season umpteen teams have been able to hang 50+ points on his team this year? I would really like to hear that answer. Otherwise, the tone in Mack's voice suggests he just wants to be done with this year.

[waggy]

Mack said at least twice post game that it was a tough loss. He wants to win, and even expects to win.

[XMuskieFTW]

That is correct. DePaul will be playing their last game at AllState Arena on Saturday.

That said, I'm sure they'll double their usual crowd and will likely have 4,000 in attendance as opposed to 2,000.

So only 40% X fans instead of 65% this year?

[Masterofreality]

Frankly, it isn't about what he says in the interviews. I can really care less what he says. It's more about the fact that he sounds defeated. Same points, in same monotone voice, he doesn't criticize his players, he doesn't criticize their effort (I applaud him for both) and he sounds like he is just playing out the string. Nothing he's tried is working and so he's just fine with the guys he has going out and doing the best that they can, knowing before the game starts they will likely lose. If there is one thing I would like to hear Mack discuss, how is that this season umpteen teams have been able to hang 50+ points on his team this year? I would really like to hear that answer. Otherwise, the tone in Mack's voice suggests he just wants to be done with this year.

In hockey, when your skate's sharpness deteriorates, it's called "losing your edge". I've begun to wonder this year if CMack has lost his edge....really since the last 5 minutes of the Wisconsin game last year. Some of this could be on the staff too, but even before Ed got hurt, there were disturbing misses in strategy and a slow responsiveness in adjustments. It really shows up against high quality competition.

Yesterday, Xavier played hard, aggressive and well, for the most part. With 6:30 or so to go, CMack pulled Q for a rest for the stretch...I would guess to the under 4 Timeout. At that time, the game was close an up for grabs. Everything was respectable until Holtman got more aggressive with a trap at around 4 minutes. Xavier trailed 74-72 and X had the ball after a JP steal. Then a Butler steal after a trap, bust out break and a layup. 4 point Butler lead. In my opinion, there should have been an immediate time out called (Xavier had 3 left at that point) to get Q back in the game and to readjust the attack. There were less than 4 minutes left at that point. What happened then? No time out, one more turnover on a trap on Bernard and a resulting 6 point lead for Butler. Then out of the timeout, there was no adjustment for the trap, another turnover/steal off JP and another Butler bust out basket for an 8 point lead. Game over. I'm still a CMack supporter, but that was unacceptable for a big time college coach.

Is Chris burned out and still living through a hangover from Bronson Koenig? I don't know, but starting from a 9 point blown lead at Colorado where the game was allowed to erode with, again, no timeout to stop the bleeding, the trend is disturbing.

Reality.

[muethibp]

In hockey, when your skate's sharpness deteriorates, it's called "losing your edge". I've begun to wonder this year if CMack has lost his edge....really since the last 5 minutes of the Wisconsin game last year. Some of this could be on the staff too, but even before Ed got hurt, there were disturbing misses in strategy and a slow responsiveness in adjustments. It really shows up against high quality competition.

Yesterday, Xavier played hard, aggressive and well, for the most part. With 6:30 or so to go, CMack pulled Q for a rest for the stretch...I would guess to the under 4 Timeout. At that time, the game was close an up for grabs. Everything was respectable until Holtman got more aggressive with a trap at around 4 minutes. Xavier trailed 74-72 and X had the ball after a JP steal. Then a Butler steal after a trap, bust out break and a layup. 4 point Butler lead. In my opinion, there should have been an immediate time out called (Xavier had 3 left at that point) to get Q back in the game and to readjust the attack. What happened? No time out, one more turnover on a trap on Bernard and a resulting 6 point lead for Butler. Then out of the timeout, there was no adjustment for the trap, another turnover/steal off JP and another Butler bust out basket for an 8 point lead. Game over. I'm still a CMack supporter, but that was unacceptable for a big time college coach.

Is Chris burned out and still living through a hangover from Bronson Koenig? I don't know, but starting from a 9 point blown lead at Colorado where the game was allowed to erode with, again, no timeout to stop the bleeding, the trend is disturbing.

Reality.

There was a run in the first half where X gave up like 13 points in 3 minutes around the under-4 TO. X was a frazzled mess and Chris just let it all go on - I guess just praying for the under-4 TO to come in time, which it didn't. They went from up 28-24 to down 36-32 in about 3 minutes until Chris finally got around to calling the TO. The score swing is bad enough but it was so obvious that they were out of sync. Bad enough to miss an obvious TO opportunity in the second half - when they're conserving TOs for the end of the game - but at that point they still had the first half use-it-or-lose-it TO. The house was on fire and Chris just stood there with a hose in his hand watching it happen.

[Masterofreality]

There was a run in the first half where X gave up like 13 points in 3 minutes around the under-4 TO. X was a frazzled mess and Chris just let it all go on - I guess just praying for the under-4 TO to come in time, which it didn't. They went from up 28-24 to down 36-32 in about 3 minutes until Chris finally got around to calling the TO. The score swing is bad enough but it was so obvious that they were out of sync. Bad enough to miss an obvious TO opportunity in the second half - when they're conserving TOs for the end of the game - but at that point they still had the first half use-it-or-lose-it TO. The house was on fire and Chris just stood there with a hose in his hand watching it happen.

Well, not really. To be fair, Butler did go on a run, but those happen. You can't always call a TO and sometimes you have to let your guys play through it. CMack did call a TO with. 3:34 left and X went on a mini run to take back the lead until a last second 3 by Butler gave them the half lead.

I'm not really upset about that.

[XU 87]

Listening to Mack's postgame radio show today, he sounds just like he has over the entire losing streak.

Like our hustle.
Too many turnovers at critical times.
Give other team credit, they made some tough shots.
Have to find some way to get a win.



I would agree with everything he said.

I thought X played well except for the last three minutes. I thought Butler played really well, and made a bunch of tough shots. The game was lost when X made the turnovers at the end of the game.

[markchal]

I felt that sequence that resulted in the O'Mara T was another really tough one. If we could've grabbed that rebound, we had a decent amount of momentum, instead we gave them four easy points.

[GoMuskies]

Forgot about that O'Mara T. Completely inexcusable.

[muethibp]

Well, not really. To be fair, Butler did go on a run, but those happen. You can't always call a TO and sometimes you have to let your guys play through it. CMack did call a TO with. 3:34 left and X went on a mini run to take back the lead until a last second 3 by Butler gave them the half lead.

I'm not really upset about that.

But I acknowledged that you can't always call a TO. But the circumstance I identified - late in the first half, with your use-it-or-lose-it TO in hand - there is no conceivable reason for not calling a TO. Indeed Chris tacitly acknowledged he should have by doing so (albeit too late) and you've acknowledged that calling the TO stopped the run and righted the ship. It was unquestionably the right strategy, Chris just got to it about 5 points and 90 seconds too late.

[bleedXblue]

But I acknowledged that you can't always call a TO. But the circumstance I identified - late in the first half, with your use-it-or-lose-it TO in hand - there is no conceivable reason for not calling a TO. Indeed Chris tacitly acknowledged he should have by doing so (albeit too late) and you've acknowledged that calling the TO stopped the run and righted the ship. It was unquestionably the right strategy, Chris just got to it about 5 points and 90 seconds too late.

Yes, Coach was asleep at the wheel

[XUMIOH12]

I've always thought that Mack never utilized his TOs appopriately. He wants the team to stop the run themselves, but too often you see the opponents runs go on for way too long.

[nasdadjr]

What did you call surrounding either of those guys with 4 guards? Which is what X did the vast majority of the time last year.

So I take it Gaston, OMara and Jones are small ball guys?

Okay let me break this down...
1. Reynolds and Farr while in with 4 guards at times still have us a traditional lineup just the same way Stainbrook did before them. All three of those guys at any point of being on the floor gave Xavier a legitimate post threat that the opponents had to respect and guard. This allowed Xavier to play inside out and allow our guards to roam and get free for open jumpers. Gaston and Omara don't command anywhere near that type of respect and rightfully so. JP and Blueitt are much better set shooters than creators. That's just who they are. Having those bigger more respectable bigs allowed them to just shoot. Now we don't have that inside threat and are asking those 2 to create off the dribble and that is not their strength... hence JP with like 4 turnovers in 90 seconds yesterday.

2. While Tyrique is good he still isn't polished enough in his passing to make the inside out game work. That is not a knock on him just a fact as of now. I'm sure that will change sooner rather than later.

3. Small ball isn't the Xavier way... never has been and never will. Our most successful teams had a top notch big and we need to get back to that ASAP. Plus it's just an absolute fact... if you want to compete for a final four you can't do it with small ball... you need a big post presence. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but I think the only team to go against that was the Dwayne Wade 5 guard Marquette team however that is not the norm

[AviatorX]

Okay let me break this down...
1. Reynolds and Farr while in with 4 guards at times still have us a traditional lineup just the same way Stainbrook did before them. All three of those guys at any point of being on the floor gave Xavier a legitimate post threat that the opponents had to respect and guard. This allowed Xavier to play inside out and allow our guards to roam and get free for open jumpers. Gaston and Omara don't command anywhere near that type of respect and rightfully so. JP and Blueitt are much better set shooters than creators. That's just who they are. Having those bigger more respectable bigs allowed them to just shoot. Now we don't have that inside threat and are asking those 2 to create off the dribble and that is not their strength... hence JP with like 4 turnovers in 90 seconds yesterday.

2. While Tyrique is good he still isn't polished enough in his passing to make the inside out game work. That is not a knock on him just a fact as of now. I'm sure that will change sooner rather than later.

3. Small ball isn't the Xavier way... never has been and never will. Our most successful teams had a top notch big and we need to get back to that ASAP. Plus it's just an absolute fact... if you want to compete for a final four you can't do it with small ball... you need a big post presence. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but I think the only team to go against that was the Dwayne Wade 5 guard Marquette team however that is not the norm

As for #3, maybe you missed Villanova winning the championship last year? Or Duke the year before with Justise Winslow at the 4? I don't know.

I agree with your first two points -- but you aren't making an argument against the small ball lineup, you are just saying to run it successfully X is gonna need a better fit in the post than they have this year. I think Gaston has been good enough to succeed with it at times this year, but there hasn't been much consistency with the bigs.

The Xavier way? I mean, small ball wasn't anyone's way in the past, but the game is changing. It's also a good way to mask how hard it is to recruit bigs you can really rely on to score with their back to the basket at Xavier's recruiting level.

Maybe we are talking past each other on what the small ball lineup is -- I consider that to be 1 big with 4 perimeter players, so basically anytime we have Trevon at the 4, which is almost all the time the last two seasons. Essentially, playing what many would have said is a 3 10 years ago at the 4 spot.

[casualfan]

You guys are talking ablut two different things.

One is referencing small ball as playing 4 guards around 1 big, like Duke did w Winslow and Nova last year.

The other is calling small ball playing w bigs that are not very good.

That Duke team had Jahlil Okafor. Nova had Ochefu.

Youre both right. You can win a national championship playing 4 perimeter guys around a big.

But that big needs to be pretty damn good.

[AviatorX]

You guys are talking ablut two different things.

One is referencing small ball as playing 4 guards around 1 big, like Duke did w Winslow and Nova last year.

The other is calling small ball playing w bigs that are not very good.

That Duke team had Jahlil Okafor. Nova had Ochefu.

Youre both right. You can win a national championship playing 4 perimeter guys around a big.

But that big needs to be pretty damn good.

Yeah, essentially what I posted above. I agree with nasdad that the bigs need to be more effective to succeed big with this approach to the roster, but I took issue with his original point that X should "abandon the small ball"

I don't know why one would construe "small ball" as having poor bigs as opposed to playing less of them, but who knows.

[scoscox]

Okay let me break this down...
1. Reynolds and Farr while in with 4 guards at times still have us a traditional lineup just the same way Stainbrook did before them. All three of those guys at any point of being on the floor gave Xavier a legitimate post threat that the opponents had to respect and guard. This allowed Xavier to play inside out and allow our guards to roam and get free for open jumpers. Gaston and Omara don't command anywhere near that type of respect and rightfully so. JP and Blueitt are much better set shooters than creators. That's just who they are. Having those bigger more respectable bigs allowed them to just shoot. Now we don't have that inside threat and are asking those 2 to create off the dribble and that is not their strength... hence JP with like 4 turnovers in 90 seconds yesterday.

2. While Tyrique is good he still isn't polished enough in his passing to make the inside out game work. That is not a knock on him just a fact as of now. I'm sure that will change sooner rather than later.

3. Small ball isn't the Xavier way... never has been and never will. Our most successful teams had a top notch big and we need to get back to that ASAP. Plus it's just an absolute fact... if you want to compete for a final four you can't do it with small ball... you need a big post presence. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but I think the only team to go against that was the Dwayne Wade 5 guard Marquette team however that is not the norm

JP and Trevon are actually pretty good creators. Trevon is becoming very good. JP is getting better, definitely needs to take care of it more. Tyrique needs to adjust to the speed of the game a little bit on both ends. His post moves have actually been pretty impressive.

[Masterofreality]

JP and Trevon are actually pretty good creators. Trevon is becoming very good. JP is getting better, definitely needs to take care of it more. Tyrique needs to adjust to the speed of the game a little bit on both ends. His post moves have actually been pretty impressive.

Seems to me I recall that Trevon "created his own shot" at the end of the Seton Hall game at home. #ForTheWin

[vee4xu]

I would agree with everything he said.

I thought X played well except for the last three minutes. I thought Butler played really well, and made a bunch of tough shots. The game was lost when X made the turnovers at the end of the game.

Again, not as much about what he says, but the tone he uses when he says it. Sounds more monotone and worn out each time. I think it has hit Mack hard and he's basically not getting results with anything he tries to fix the issues, so I hear resignation (not from his job, of course) in his voice.

[Masterofreality]

Again, not as much about what he says, but the tone he uses when he says it. Sounds more monotone and worn out each time. I think it has hit Mack hard and he's basically not getting results with anything he tries to fix the issues, so I hear resignation (not from his job, of course) in his voice.

Hey, Vee. I sat yesterday with the Great "Beard" (TitanXMan). His beard is more glorious than I can ever remember. He mentioned that he ran into you in Findlay and was very happy to meet you.

Talk about a random sighting...but another testament to the links of this board!

[vee4xu]

Hey, Vee. I sat yesterday with the Great "Beard" (TitanXMan). His beard is more glorious than I can ever remember. He mentioned that he ran into you in Findlay and was very happy to meet you.

Talk about a random sighting...but another testament to the links of this board!

We did indeed meet. I was out for a Saturday morning run at my annual summer gathering with my classmates. I passed a guy wearing an XU shirt, it was titanman. I introduced myself, we talked for a bit and I invited him to our afternoon of frivolity and drinking. He joined us, spent all afternoon with us and I think, got pretty hammered. Very nice young man.

[xudash]

We did indeed meet. I was out for a Saturday morning run at my annual summer gathering with my classmates. I passed a guy wearing an XU shirt, it was titanman. I introduced myself, we talked for a bit and I invited him to our afternoon of frivolity and drinking. He joined us, spent all afternoon with us and I think, got pretty hammered. Very nice young man.

You had the poor bastard hanging out with them! Geez.

And that on top of me introducing him to my younger brother when they were living in Findlay.

We owe titanman muchos drinks.

[D-West & PO-Z]

How did you guys realize that you were who you were on the board? Did one of you just ask the other if they post on xavierhoops? I am always hesitant to ask that. I have asked a couple people before if they ever get on or look at xavierhoops and most look at me like "whats that"? I always feel like a weirdo asking people if they post on xavierhoops.

[MauriceX]

How did you guys realize that you were who you were on the board? Did one of you just ask the other if they post on xavierhoops? I am always hesitant to ask that. I have asked a couple people before if they ever get on or look at xavierhoops and most look at me like "whats that"? I always feel like a weirdo asking people if they post on xavierhoops.

A few years ago at the Xavier @ Georgetown game, I sat next to a group of Xavier fans that were having exact discussions of things we were talking about on the board at the time. I asked them if any of them posted on here... every single one gave me a look like I was a crazy person. It hasn't stopped me from asking others though!

[GoMuskies]

How did you guys realize that you were who you were on the board? Did one of you just ask the other if they post on xavierhoops? I am always hesitant to ask that. I have asked a couple people before if they ever get on or look at xavierhoops and most look at me like "whats that"? I always feel like a weirdo asking people if they post on xavierhoops.

Ask Snipe to teach you the secret handshake.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Ask Snipe to teach you the secret handshake.

HAHAHA then you just go up and try it with random people?? Or is there a secret sign that precedes the secret handshake??

[xudash]

BTW, titanman, you obviously are not a "poor bastard". Just joking, of course.

[scoscox]

A few years ago at the Xavier @ Georgetown game, I sat next to a group of Xavier fans that were having exact discussions of things we were talking about on the board at the time. I asked them if any of them posted on here... every single one gave me a look like I was a crazy person. It hasn't stopped me from asking others though!

Classic move by crazy old Maurice. He's always good for a laugh.

[nasdadjr]

As for #3, maybe you missed Villanova winning the championship last year? Or Duke the year before with Justise Winslow at the 4? I don't know.

I agree with your first two points -- but you aren't making an argument against the small ball lineup, you are just saying to run it successfully X is gonna need a better fit in the post than they have this year. I think Gaston has been good enough to succeed with it at times this year, but there hasn't been much consistency with the bigs.

The Xavier way? I mean, small ball wasn't anyone's way in the past, but the game is changing. It's also a good way to mask how hard it is to recruit bigs you can really rely on to score with their back to the basket at Xavier's recruiting level.

Maybe we are talking past each other on what the small ball lineup is -- I consider that to be 1 big with 4 perimeter players, so basically anytime we have Trevon at the 4, which is almost all the time the last two seasons. Essentially, playing what many would have said is a 3 10 years ago at the 4 spot.

We are talking circles. To me 1 big and 4 perimeter guys is not small ball if that big is a traditional big. For example, when we had stain with 4 guards that still isn't small ball... at least to me. Small ball to me means playing outside in not inside out. By saying we need to get back to regular ball that is what I refer too. When I say I want Xavier to stop the small ball experiment that is what I am really talking about. We don't have the personnel to break guys down off the dribble consistently. Yes, Trevon or JP can beat a guy one on one occasionally. However, that is not sustainable over 40 minutes. Hence why we have lost 5 in a row. Getting a real big that can be that cog down low that makes defenses collapse down is what this team needs.

Oh and by the way to the guy who brought up Nova last year... I think the 35 year old looking Ochefu was about as quality a big as there was in the nation and was the ultimate reason they won it all. Without a big of that quality then they would not have gone the distance