Crosstown Shootout Game Thread (January 26, 2017)

[American X]

http://media2.wcpo.com/photo/2015/02/11/WCPO_Crosstown_2015_1423680065425_13234283_ver1.0_ 640_480.jpg

Xavier Musketeers at University of Cincinnati Bearcats

January 26, 2017

Game Time: 7:00 p.m. ET

Fifth Third Arena | Cincinnati, Oho

TV: ESPN2

RADIO: 55KRC (https://www.iheart.com/live/55krc-1709/?autoplay=true&pname=1196&campid=header&cid=index.html)

Live Chat (http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=XavierHoops)

Live Stats (http://www.gobearcats.com/gametracker/launch/gt_mbaskbl.html?event=1520191&school=cinn&sport=mbaskbl&camefrom=&startschool=&)

GoXavier Preview (http://goxavier.com/news/2017/1/24/mens-basketball-no-24-22-xavier-takes-on-no-19-19-cincinnati-in-annual-skyline-chili-crosstown-shootout.aspx)


http://rushthecourt.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/huggins-dwi.jpg

[Lloyd Braun]

Gray unis. Nice...

[xufan2434]

Gray unis. Nice...

Trying to bring a little Dee Davis magic tonight

[GIMMFD]

This would be an ideal game for Trevon to go off for like 30... man I am zooted!!!

[American X]

Gray unis. Nice...

Those are nice gray uniforms on the cops arresting Huggins.

[xufan2434]

This would be an ideal game for Trevon to go off for like 30... man I am zooted!!!

Haven't really seen Tre jawing with opponents since the Clemson game. I hope UC tries to tonight, he thrives on it. Let's get the swag back tonight! Need the ruthless, pull up from 25 at Providence with a minute left, JP tonight letsss gooooo

[muskieindent]

This would be an ideal game for Trevon to go off for like 30... man I am zooted!!!

He's due.I think he's scored about 5 points total in the 2 Shootouts he's played in.UC has never beaten a ranked Xavier team 0 for 8.We've never beaten them 4 straight.Something has to give tonight.Interestingly UC hasn't beaten X by fewer than 5 points since Joe Stiffends buzzer beater in 1987.

[bobbiemcgee]

What 's the o/u on brawl mentions this year?

[xukeith]

When Tu was a frosh, Jackson, Frease, Anderson, BJ Raymond, Derrek Brown, all trash talked UC at the Shoe for warm ups and the UC players came out ICE cold. Does X have any "EXTREME" competitors like Crawford or Tu that can talk trash?
I hope so.

[THRILLHOUSE]

I'll predict Malcom Bernard makes a couple of big shots/plays to put X over the edge in a close win.

[Xville]

When Tu was a frosh, Jackson, Frease, Anderson, BJ Raymond, Derrek Brown, all trash talked UC at the Shoe for warm ups and the UC players came out ICE cold. Does X have any "EXTREME" competitors like Crawford or Tu that can talk trash?
I hope so.

I miss those kinds of players....JP maybe, but I don't think anyone on the roster can match any of the guys listed above except Frease. May just be me, but even as a Xavier fan, Frease annoyed me....wrote a lot of checks his butt couldn't cash.

[xufan2434]

When Tu was a frosh, Jackson, Frease, Anderson, BJ Raymond, Derrek Brown, all trash talked UC at the Shoe for warm ups and the UC players came out ICE cold. Does X have any "EXTREME" competitors like Crawford or Tu that can talk trash?
I hope so.

Tu, Lyons, CJ, and JCraw were one of a kind that we probably won't see in an X uniform again. No one on this team kind of has that. That's where we miss Jalen. He did a lot of stupid things I admit, but I miss the toughness. They're going to have to be tough to go in there and get a win. JP has it but he can't do it all by himself. We've seen that version of Tre sometimes but not nearly enough. It needs to come out tonight if they want a chance

[RealDeal]

I haven't been following UC lately, is mick still undressing his players after games?

Clubber what's your prediction for the fight?

[KabeX]

Tu, Lyons, CJ, and JCraw were one of a kind that we probably won't see in an X uniform again. No one on this team kind of has that. That's where we miss Jalen. He did a lot of stupid things I admit, but I miss the toughness. They're going to have to be tough to go in there and get a win. JP has it but he can't do it all by himself. We've seen that version of Tre sometimes but not nearly enough. It needs to come out tonight if they want a chance

While I agree no one on this team approaches them, I see no reason we can't have similar steel ballsness in the future. The Big Freakin East pretty much requires it. That said, I really miss Tu.

[Nigel Tufnel]

I'll predict Malcom Bernard makes a couple of big shots/plays to put X over the edge in a close win.

I'm with you on this...

[Harryfe]

I'm with you on this...

Bernard not starting. Gates

[paulxu]

Like to see some points in the paint, and Ed to slow down a little to set up others.

[GreatWhiteNorth]

X has fouling issues. Lucky that UC is not shooting well at the foul line, so far.

[Xville]

So tre has had a decent half....geezus way to be big fella!

[GreatWhiteNorth]

TB is carrying the team. He is shooting 100% with 21 pts.

[Xville]

Wow tre holy crap!

[paulxu]

I love that the ESPN halftime crew has to talk good about Xavier.

[nasdadjr]

Happy we are up but not happy 75% of our points are coming from behind the arc. That may win the game tonight but that is a recipe for disaster in march

[XU '11]

Happy we are up but not happy 75% of our points are coming from behind the arc. That may win the game tonight but that is a recipe for disaster in march

Jay Wright disagrees.

[American X]

Trevon Bluiett. 100% On Deem.

GREAT minutes from the freshman Quentin.

Just when you think the cracks have been exhausted, Mick Cronin & Co. show up in matching outfits looking like low-rent Russian mobsters as boy band. Are they the updated, edgy Lollipop Guild?

[nasdadjr]

When X gets a national championship then I'll play along. I'm not ripping I just want balance cause we all know this team isn't good enough behind the arc to not go inside

[novachap]

Holy shit... trevon on fire!

[Xville]

This is getting close to d west vs dayton territory...wow!

[American X]

Trevon Bluiett is chiseling his legend statue with every shot.

[Ray Foye Combo]

Whoaaaaaaaaaaa look at bluiett

[HenryMuto]

What an amazing game to go 10/10 from the field 8/8 from 3 and 4/4 from the line into the 2nd half is simply amazing. All that said only up 7 and would be a shame to lose a game with this kind of performance.

[letskeepitreal]

Am overseas and no tv coverage. How's Sumners shoulder? Man Bluiett is unconscious

[Masterofreality]

Unfortunately Rashid Gaston is horrific in this game. HAS to get better.

[Masterofreality]

And our rebounding in this game is abjectly pathetic

[paulxu]

Little Mick is a WATB

[paulxu]

Our block outs suck.

Come on Muskies

[Lloyd Braun]

I'm not so sure they are calling this game evenly. They call hand checks on us but UC arm bars every possession

[letskeepitreal]

Gotta get some rebounds

[nasdadjr]

Hate being right but we can't live behind the arc. Can't say it enough

[Lloyd Braun]

Hate being right but we can't live behind the arc. Can't say it enough

Shooting isn't the problem. It's rebounding... obvious to everyone except you apparently.

[Xville]

I'm not so sure they are calling this game evenly. They call hand checks on us but UC arm bars every possession

Probably not but thata what you get on the road...plua, if our poat players didnt suck so much, we wouldnt be getting worked over inside.

Say what you want about the gnome but he has worked the refs well this game.

[GreatWhiteNorth]

Someone besides TB has to do some scoring. We are in trouble!

[Lloyd Braun]

Wait... is UC worse at FTS than we are?

[Lloyd Braun]

Game plan: jack up a 3, get offensive rebound, miss layup, get offensive rebound, score.

[Xville]

Does gaston know the game started? I know hes not that good, but he couldnt play any worse...i mean geezus...offensive rebound after offensive rebound while hes been out there...grow a freaking pair and get this done.

[HenryMuto]

Zero chance to win this game allowing all those 2nd chance points. Can't get a freaking defensive rebound to save their lives.

[paulxu]

I'm sorry, but they have 17 fing offensive boards. Without those we'd be up by a dozen.

[Xville]

I'm sorry, but they have 17 fing offensive boards. Without those we'd be up by a dozen.

And if they could hit free throws, theyd be up 15

[Lloyd Braun]

lol jumpball!?

[Lloyd Braun]

What a joke

[HenryMuto]

I hate refs

[Xville]

Pretty good game that i hope the refs will let go now for the last 4 minutes...let them play a bit.

[mistabeecee41]

JP is getting cooked

[Lloyd Braun]

This is getting ridiculous

[Xville]

Geezus refs come on..fighting for a rebound foul? Geezus

[Xville]

Not sure who is more annoying the refs or the gnome..it is pretty damn close.

[Xville]

Absolutely stupid shot there by jp. Though if x loses this game, it will be because their toughness on rebounds was a joke.

[mohr5150]

19 offensive rebounds. Wuss U in the middle.

[letskeepitreal]

Refs were terrible but we just got outmuscled

[Xville]

Well we all have known this team's limitations all year. It was just most apparent tonight. X is in trouble if they dont develop some big men the next year or two. Hopefully Jones can be one.

[letskeepitreal]

Just not enough balance today

[mohr5150]

Puss central. Giving up 19 offensive rebounds makes you nothing but a bunch of pussies.

[mohr5150]

What a waste of an amazing performance by Bluiett.

[paulxu]

0 from Gaston and O'Mara

[XUFan09]

Xavier came into the game with the third best defensive rebounding rate in the country. I don't think that team showed up today.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

[Lloyd Braun]

What a waste of an amazing performance by Bluiett.

They went away from him during UCs run. Strange. He didn't touch the ball for 10 minutes.

[Porkopolis]

Tre was amazing. The rest of the team...

[Masterofreality]

So, in a close game with critical possessions Mack leaves 2 time outs in his pocket. That is bad coaching. WTF?

[Masterofreality]

Haven't seen a worse rebounding game from a Xavier team for 25 years. Horrific

[chico]

Well now Mick is 4-7 against us, which coincidentally matches his height.

[mistabeecee41]

Tre + Q = best games of the year
everybody else (including Mack - that zone? wtf) = horseshit

[paulxu]

I suppose there is someone else out there who whines to the refs more than Mick.

I just haven't seen them.

[Xville]

So, in a close game with critical possessions Mack leaves 2 time outs in his pocket. That is bad coaching. WTF?

Yet everyone around here thinks he is the best coach thats ever walked the earth. Sorry hes not...hes not even the best xavier has had, but hes a xavier guy so we all have to bow before him. Hes a good recruiter, decent x and o coach, nothing more nothing less in my opinion.

[BandAid]

At least I don't have to watch espn anymore

[XfansinKy]

No Alpha dogs anymore. Not since Tu Holloway. I miss those tough teams with guys like Tu, Mark, CJ, Sato, Chalmers, Frey, Anthony Myles and those guys. Bliuett finally got hot but too much softness.

[Backyard Champ]

Sorry, that's not on Mack at all. He can't go out there and rebound for the team. UC wanted it more, simple as that.

And I agree, the team is simply soft.

[XUBob]

Not to be negative but our bigs aren't very good, forces too many threes. Hope is Tyrique grows up and the juco can play. My one beef with Mack is he never calls a timeout to stop runs. I know he wants the kids to play through it but sometimes you have to try to stop the bleeding.

[drudy23]

No Alpha dogs anymore. Not since Tu Holloway. I miss those tough teams with guys like Tu, Mark, CJ, Sato, Chalmers, Frey, Anthony Myles and those guys. Bliuett finally got hot but too much softness.

We had an alpha dog tonight.

Everyone else's pussy hurt.

[XU 87]

So, in a close game with critical possessions Mack leaves 2 time outs in his pocket. That is bad coaching. WTF?

I thought the same thing, but did it matter? UC scored just about every time down the court since no one on X could get a rebound,

X got out toughed. Where were you Gastoni? Omara?

And if Macura puts up another bad shot on an important possession, my head is going to explode.

[Lloyd Braun]

Tre had 40 points on 15 shots... how did he not get 25 shots tonight? He was en fuego.

[American X]

Simple, rebounding and J.P. Macura killed us.

I would add more, but I have to go get ready for Kansas vs. Kentucky. Did you know they are playing on ESPN on Saturday?

[Backyard Champ]

Really don't think JP killed us tonight. Did think there was some really bad calls that helped UC, but tough to complain about that when we got destroyed on the glass. Did we give up 20 offensive rebounds? Yikes. This loss is all on our bigs, can't put blame on anyone else.

Heck we fed the ball to the post and they missed all their shots.

[XfansinKy]

Tre had 40 points on 15 shots... how did he not get 25 shots tonight? He was en fuego.

Coach Mack has always said his players have to find their own shots. He's said that since the media asked him why he didn't draw plays to get Crawford shots.

[drudy23]

Ed was terrible...again. He's gotta be better than that.

[XfansinKy]

Ed was terrible...again. He's gotta be better than that.

He's hurt...obviously.

[drudy23]

Coach Mack has always said his players have to find their own shots. He's said that since the media asked him why he didn't draw plays to get Crawford shots.

That's because Crawford didn't need plays to get shots.

[Xville]

Simple, rebounding and J.P. Macura killed us.

I would add more, but I have to go get ready for Kansas vs. Kentucky. Did you know they are playing on ESPN on Saturday?

Ha...i know they have to pump that game for college basketball ratings stake but youbare right that game has been way overblown. Personally i think kansas is outrageously overrated. They won against a bunch of awful teams and a duke team with half their roster out and because they are kansas everyone thinks they are good. They arent

[X-ceptional]

Nothing really to say about it. Just a couple thoughts after having too many beers during the game...

No leaders on the team. Where's Tu Holloway?

Asked on Live Chat, but Jalen leaving worse for this year's team than D Brown leaving after 2009? Agree with what AmX said that the '10 team with Brown was legit final 4 contender... but, if we have one legitimate inside presence this year, does that not completely change the dynamics of this team?

Idk, probably not. Like I said, no Tu Holloway on this team, and certainly no Jordan Crawford like would have been paired with D Brown on 2010.

No point to this post, please ignore... too many beers. Not enough wins.

[XfansinKy]

That's because Crawford didn't need plays to get shots.

Funny the media asked him that. They should've asked you.

[Xville]

Coach Mack has always said his players have to find their own shots. He's said that since the media asked him why he didn't draw plays to get Crawford shots.

Sorry but thats a stupid statement by mack.

[drudy23]

Ask anyone...Crawford had no conscience and everyone knew it. Wasn't that hard to see.

[X-ceptional]

Guess I should go take the dogs for a walk. I'd rather pick up shit than think about this game anymore.

[slysyl]

Give Jones more minutes leave the other two guys watch.

[AviatorX]

Yet everyone around here thinks he is the best coach thats ever walked the earth. Sorry hes not...hes not even the best xavier has had, but hes a xavier guy so we all have to bow before him. Hes a good recruiter, decent x and o coach, nothing more nothing less in my opinion.

Cool. Who's on your short list?

Honestly, do you enjoy following Xavier basketball?

[mirabilelectu]

It seems it's time to start considering this team might not be built to seize a tournament bid.

[XfansinKy]

Sorry but thats a stupid statement by mack.

I never understood that philosophy either.

[KabeX]

Second half meltdowns ... Sigh

[drudy23]

It seems it's time to start considering this team might not be built to seize a tournament bid.

We're not quite there yet, but there's certainly the possibility of this team losing road games at DePaul and St Johns...if that happens, you may be right.

[AviatorX]

Xavier is worse than Nova, Butler, and UC (and Creighton if Watson weren't out) this season. Xavier can still have a good season with that last sentence being true. It sucks that Xavier had to play all of those teams in such a tight stretch.

[mirabilelectu]

We're not quite there yet, but there's certainly the possibility of this team losing road games at DePaul and St Johns...if that happens, you may be right.

If that is a possibility, then we are already there IMO.

[Xavier]

It seems it's time to start considering this team might not be built to seize a tournament bid.

I'm not concerned about that at all. Usually a better rebounding team than tonight but still, we need production from bigs. And the defense has to get better. I have no doubt the guard play can win a game or two in March. Defense/bigs need to improve drastically if we want to make a real run and I don't see that happening.

Making the tournament is a no brainer though.

[XfansinKy]

Ask anyone...Crawford had no conscience and everyone knew it. Wasn't that hard to see.

What does that have to do with running a play for a good shot?

[Xville]

Cool. Who's on your short list?

Honestly, do you enjoy following Xavier basketball?

Havent enjoyed it much this year truth be told.

As far as your other question...once they ask for me to be on the search committee, ill let you know. I expect a call any day now.

But you keep on accepting this round of 32 sweet 16 regime...sue me but i want a final four and i dont think mack can get x there quite frankly.

[mirabilelectu]

Cool. Who's on your short list?

Honestly, do you enjoy following Xavier basketball?

I want Mack for the long haul, it still doesn't mean we can't be realistic about some of his present shortcomings.

[drudy23]

What does that have to do with running a play for a good shot?

Nothing...but asking that question about Crawford is a stupid question. Crawford did his own thing. Still does.

[mirabilelectu]

I'm not concerned about that at all. Usually a better rebounding team than tonight but still, we need production from bigs. And the defense has to get better. I have no doubt the guard play can win a game or two in March. Defense/bigs need to improve drastically if we want to make a real run and I don't see that happening.

Making the tournament is a no brainer though.

Man, I need what you are drinking. A no brainer? You are so sure that we are going to go at least 6-5 in our last 11?

[drudy23]

Not a no brainer at this point. We're not on the bubble yet, but we have plenty of work left to do.

[XU 23]

I mean... at this point, I just don't think we're that good. Our best player drops 40, we make every shot in sight, we have an 8 point halftime lead, we finally shoot well from the freethrow line, they shoot horrendously from the line, and we still lose by 8 points.

[D-West & PO-Z]

We shot 53.6% from 3, 82.6% from the FT line, got 40 points from Tre, and "only" had 12 turnovers and we lost. Cant believe it. Never thought rebounds would have been the problem. 2nd chance points killed us.

[Xavier]

"Every shot in sight"--X shot 25% from 2. Missed a ton of bunnies. Also giving up 30 second chance points didn't help.

[AviatorX]

Havent enjoyed it much this year truth be told.

As far as your other question...once they ask for me to be on the search committee, ill let you know. I expect a call any day now.

But you keep on accepting this round of 32 sweet 16 regime...sue me but i want a final four and i dont think mack can get x there quite frankly.

I am of the opinion that getting to the second weekend any season is a huge accomplishment for Xavier. Obviously, I want that Final Four, but I just cannot imagine how you seem to be setting the bar for the staff's success that high. The biggest impediment to X getting there is talent level, and even you readily admit that is where Mack has things trending in the right direction the most.

[GoMuskies]

We took a man sized ass kicking in the second half. They're just better.

[AviatorX]

We took a man sized ass kicking in the second half. They're just better.

I think UC is really good this year, but I just can't shake the thought of them losing a 4-13 game in Sacramento or wherever the worst west coast tourney location is this year. Would be great.

[drudy23]

Just listened to Mack's presser:

* Big guys are in the dog house. He says they got punked. He's not wrong.
* Difference in the game was "asses getting kicked on the boards" - nothing else
* Asked about Kaiser's first start - he deflected and moved to the next question - mostly because I'm sure he wanted to speak his mind on how much of a ghost Kaiser was
* "Tyrique played great...maybe he should play more"
* "That's the way Mick's teams play...you either get punked or you don't...and we got punked"

[THRILLHOUSE]

I think UC is really good this year, but I just can't shake the thought of them losing a 4-13 game in Sacramento or wherever the worst west coast tourney location is this year. Would be great.

If they are a 4 seed it would be pretty unlikely that they would be shipped out west for the first round.

[Classof1985]

It seems it's time to start considering this team might not be built to seize a tournament bid.

I think thats a little extreme. Probably more than a little. But its tough to make a deep run without an inside game. UC owned the paint tonight.

The 1-3-1 does not work if the opposition has active, offensive-minded post players like Clark and Washington.

[AviatorX]

If they are a 4 seed it would be pretty unlikely that they would be shipped out west for the first round.

Not if they're the last 4, like X in Boise. We can hope.

[drudy23]

I think thats a little extreme. Probably more than a little. But its tough to make a deep run without an inside game. UC owned the paint tonight.

The 1-3-1 does not work if the opposition has active, offensive-minded players like Clark and Washington.

The 1-3-1 doesn't work without Farr and Reynolds...scrap it.

[Xville]

I am of the opinion that getting to the second weekend any season is a huge accomplishment for Xavier. Obviously, I want that Final Four, but I just cannot imagine how you seem to be setting the bar for the staff's success that high. The biggest impediment to X getting there is talent level, and even you readily admit that is where Mack has things trending in the right direction the most.

And yet with all the talent that mack had last year, he couldnt get the team out of the first weekend. You are helping to prove my point. My expectations are that high because that is where the expectations should be, this isnt 10 or 20 years ago. Im not asking for a final four every year, but mack to me hasnt moved the program forward a step as almost all other xavier coaches had since Staak and he has had a.long tenure already.

[mirabilelectu]

I am of the opinion that getting to the second weekend any season is a huge accomplishment for Xavier. Obviously, I want that Final Four, but I just cannot imagine how you seem to be setting the bar for the staff's success that high. The biggest impediment to X getting there is talent level, and even you readily admit that is where Mack has things trending in the right direction the most.

I think if Mack sticks around he could take us to the summit. But XVille is saying he doesn't think Mack can do that, and while I disagree, I think we those should be the expectations for our program in the coming years.

[drudy23]

It sucks to lose to UC.

But man, the Crosstown Shootout is a treasure. I literally have a freaking pulsating headache from 2.5 hours of intensity. And I was in my living room.

[Backyard Champ]

Eh, I thought it worked well in the second half. They were forced into a ton of bad shots.. Just couldn't finish and rebound. They played better in zone than they did in man to man, couldn't rebound with either defensive style, but at least 1-3-1 made it more difficult for UC to get shots. They killed us when we played straight up

[D-West & PO-Z]

Xavier is worse than Nova, Butler, and UC (and Creighton if Watson weren't out) this season. Xavier can still have a good season with that last sentence being true. It sucks that Xavier had to play all of those teams in such a tight stretch.

Yeah I mean we just arent an elite team this year.

We arent half the team we were last year.

It isnt bad coaching (not saying Mack has done his best job but not bad) we just dont have the players this year to live up to what most fans expectations were.

We have a complete lack of consistent low post presence. Even our good players are wildly inconsistent. We unexpectedly lost one of our top 3 players (and leader of the team) when already unexpectedly losing our 2 best low post guys.

We are an above average team who will make the tourney but we just dont have the personel to be a top 4 seed and make a super deep run in the tourney. IT just is what it is, the team is what it is. We are a top half BE team who will get probably a 6-10 seed depending on rest of season. To get mad and blame Mack is just not realizing what the team is.

[drudy23]

Eh, I thought it worked well in the second half. They were forced into a ton of bad shots.

Taking bad shots and being forced into them are 2 completely different things. They took some stupid shots...but we didn't force them too.

[AviatorX]

And yet with all the talent that mack had last year, he couldnt get the team out of the first weekend. You are helping to prove my point. My expectations are that high because that is where the expectations should be, this isnt 10 or 20 years ago. Im not asking for a final four every year, but mack to me hasnt moved the program forward a step as almost all other xavier coaches had since Staak and he has had a.long tenure already.


I think if Mack sticks around he could take us to the summit. But XVille is saying he doesn't think Mack can do that, and while I disagree, I think we those should be the expectations for our program in the coming years.

Fair enough, fellas. We're just going to have to agree to disagree as far as expectations. Call me pessimistic, but I really think if you're going to be a Xavier fan and have the bar set that high, you're going to be disappointed a lot, whether Mack is the coach or someone else. I don't think by virtue of getting to the Elite 8 twice the only way to move the program forward is to get past that.

I mean, Xavier has a great program, but they have literally never signed a McDonalds AA and don't consistently put guys in the league, until that's happening, I'm not going to adjust my expectations. I think Mack can make that happen.

[GoMuskies]

They killed us

Could have stopped here. Absolute domination.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Havent enjoyed it much this year truth be told.

As far as your other question...once they ask for me to be on the search committee, ill let you know. I expect a call any day now.

But you keep on accepting this round of 32 sweet 16 regime...sue me but i want a final four and i dont think mack can get x there quite frankly.

How much of the game did you decide to watch tonight?

[mirabilelectu]

I think thats a little extreme. Probably more than a little. But its tough to make a deep run without an inside game. UC owned the paint tonight.

The 1-3-1 does not work if the opposition has active, offensive-minded post players like Clark and Washington.

I mean we are still in the driver's seat, but what have they shown you to make you think they are going to ensure that bid?

[Xavier]

Meh, tournament was no doubt disappointing. Still, he led X to arguably best regular season in X history and highest seed ever. I have concerns but to say he hasn't shown the ability is silly. He has moved program forward, IMO.

[drudy23]

Our guards are very good. They're that much better with even a little low post credibility.

We had a great complement of players last year. That doesn't exist this year. Our guards don't get enough credit for being very good even under these circumstances. Big guys need to grow a pair.

[AviatorX]

Meh, tournament was no doubt disappointing. Still, he led X to arguably best regular season in X history and highest seed ever. I have concerns but to say he hasn't shown the ability is silly. He has moved program forward, IMO.

Not to mention Koenig hit two incredible incredible shots in the last minute. X wasn't great in the tournament, but they got beat by a great player making great plays. It happens. How do you think Miss St fans felt when Lionel Chalmers ate them alive in 2004? Luckily for us, XU has been on the good side of that more than the bad in this current run.

[mohr5150]

What Mack really wanted to say..."Our big guys are pussies. They will be wearing pink skirts at practice tomorrow."

[mirabilelectu]

Fair enough, fellas. We're just going to have to agree to disagree as far as expectations. Call me pessimistic, but I really think if you're going to be a Xavier fan and have the bar set that high, you're going to be disappointed a lot, whether Mack is the coach or someone else. I don't think by virtue of getting to the Elite 8 twice the only way to move the program forward is to get past that.

I mean, Xavier has a great program, but they have literally never signed a McDonalds AA and don't consistently put guys in the league, until that's happening, I'm not going to adjust my expectations. I think Mack can make that happen.

I agree with you that Mack can take us there, and I'm willing to wait. I was just saying that if I really thought Mack couldn't, then I would also support finding a new coach. Also, teams have made FFs, NCs with much less than X is getting, so IMO that should be the level to which X aspires.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I am of the opinion that getting to the second weekend any season is a huge accomplishment for Xavier. Obviously, I want that Final Four, but I just cannot imagine how you seem to be setting the bar for the staff's success that high. The biggest impediment to X getting there is talent level, and even you readily admit that is where Mack has things trending in the right direction the most.

Ha right?

We should defintely get rid of our coach who just won national coach of the year last year. Clearly he isnt the guy to get us over the hump.

I mean what a freaking joke???

Mack isnt perfect obviously and he has things he could be better on but to pput the bar for Xavier as a program as final 4 or bust and snub your nose at 2nd weekend appearances like xville is doing is so stupid.

What makes him think Mack cant get X there I would love to hear. I would love to know specifically what Mack lacks in coaching to get X to the Final 4 one day.

Talent and luck are what he needs. Talent level is going up.

I dont get it.

[xu82]

I went to a viewing event in ATL. Nice people, no sound, no win. I'll stay home in the future. Ugh.....

[AviatorX]

I agree with you that Mack can take us there, and I'm willing to wait. I was just saying that if I really thought Mack couldn't, then I would also support finding a new coach. Also, teams have made FFs, NCs with much less than X is getting, so IMO that should be the level to which X aspires.

I see what you're saying now. Got it. True that teams have made it with less, but from the general perspective of what you need to build a typical Final Four team, I think any of us who are somewhat reasonable can agree X is still a bit shy of that in the talent department, but appears to be trending in the right direction.

XVille is lucky he isn't a Gonzaga fan. Few would make him sick.

[vee4xu]

My two cents:

1. X down by 1 w/3:40 left and don't make another FG.
2. Inside game still non-existent. Missed bunnies, no rebounding. Generally poor.
3. Two guys showed up for X, Tre and JP. Rest were no shows, pretty much.
4. All due respect, can see why Bernard went to Florida A&M. He isn't good.
5. Good thing UC can't shoot FTs or score would have been much worse.
6. Can't give up 30+ second change points and 20+ points off turnovers on the road and expect to win.
7. That was the last chance for X to beat a ranked team on the road. Creighton will not be ranked when X goes to Omaha.

Get 'em next year, I guess.

[Backyard Champ]

What Mack really wanted to say..."Our big guys are pussies. They will be wearing pink skirts at practice tomorrow."

What's crazy is, hasn't Gaston had the gold jersey a couple of times? Not sure why it isn't translating.

[D-West & PO-Z]

It sucks to lose to UC.

But man, the Crosstown Shootout is a treasure. I literally have a freaking pulsating headache from 2.5 hours of intensity. And I was in my living room.

Agreed. I love it. Nothing like it in this city.

[drudy23]

What's crazy is, hasn't Gaston had the gold jersey a couple of times? Not sure why it isn't translating.

Because he's playing against our other big guys.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Meh, tournament was no doubt disappointing. Still, he led X to arguably best regular season in X history and highest seed ever. I have concerns but to say he hasn't shown the ability is silly. He has moved program forward, IMO.

Yes

[mirabilelectu]

Ha right?

We should defintely get rid of our coach who just won national coach of the year last year. Clearly he isnt the guy to get us over the hump.

I mean what a freaking joke???

Mack isnt perfect obviously and he has things he could be better on but to pput the bar for Xavier as a program as final 4 or bust and snub your nose at 2nd weekend appearances like xville is doing is so stupid.

What makes him think Mack cant get X there I would love to hear. I would love to know specifically what Mack lacks in coaching to get X to the Final 4 one day.

Talent and luck are what he needs. Talent level is going up.

I dont get it.

I think some people are down because they feel like we have talented players that aren't being utilized in the right ways. I'm as critical of Mack's in game coaching as anyone, but Mack will get better with those things, not to mention the recruits he will continue to pull in. I really think he gives our program the best chance at success (partially because I don't want to reset with a new coach), but I think there are some objectively questionable decisions he has made in some games that have compromised our chances at a W. Hindsight is 20/20 I know, but IMO some of the in game coaching could be better.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I agree with you that Mack can take us there, and I'm willing to wait. I was just saying that if I really thought Mack couldn't, then I would also support finding a new coach. Also, teams have made FFs, NCs with much less than X is getting, so IMO that should be the level to which X aspires.

I mean maybe a few. Who are these teams? George Mason and VCU are recents I guess.

Even Butler had 2 NBA players on their teams.

[AviatorX]

I think some people are down because they feel like we have talented players that aren't being utilized in the right ways. I'm as critical of Mack's in game coaching as anyone, but Mack will get better with those things, not to mention the recruits he will continue to pull in. I really think he gives our program the best chance at success (partially because I don't want to reset with a new coach), but I think there are some objectively questionable decisions he has made in some games that have compromised our chances at a W. Hindsight is 20/20 I know, but IMO some of the in game coaching could be better.

Definitely fair. Mack has frustrated me a few times this season to be certain. The 1-3-1 should be thrown in the garbage can ASAP, at least for this group.

I also follow IU so maybe watching Crean has thrown off my perspective...

I am usually as pessimistic of a fan as you will find anywhere, but even I'm blown away by some of the stuff on here this season.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Because he's playing against our other big guys.

HA, good point

[X-Fan]

Like others have said, can't win getting killed on the boards like that. Hate losing to UC, but I'm hoping this will be the game that sparks this team. Besides the rebounding I saw many positives.

Obviously Trev. OMG! Hell of a game. Hope that permanently ends his shooting slump.

The Frosh! Great first Shootiut for them. Q really stepped up and in many ways the offense was better when he was out there. Jones played tough and poised.

I think this team is learning and will grow from tough loses like this. Once they figure out a way to avoid long scoring droughts they'll be tough to beat.

Keep on trucking fellas. It'll start to pay off soon.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I think some people are down because they feel like we have talented players that aren't being utilized in the right ways. I'm as critical of Mack's in game coaching as anyone, but Mack will get better with those things, not to mention the recruits he will continue to pull in. I really think he gives our program the best chance at success (partially because I don't want to reset with a new coach), but I think there are some objectively questionable decisions he has made in some games that have compromised our chances at a W. Hindsight is 20/20 I know, but IMO some of the in game coaching could be better.

I see this and Mack has defintely not been perfect and makes you scratch your head at times. But I dont think it is fair to say he hasnt moved the program forward or met expectations we should have as a program.

To say he isnt the answer bc he hasnt got X to a final 4 yet is silly imo. Also I am not sure why one would think he couldnt get us there. We just dont have the horses this year, it is that simple.

Last year sucked. It was a legit shot at getting to that Final 4 but sometimes crazy things happen in the tourney and we got beat by a ridiculous shot. Sucks but I dont think that is a reason to say our coach cant get us to a final 4.

[mirabilelectu]

I mean maybe a few. Who are these teams? George Mason and VCU are recents I guess.

Even Butler had 2 NBA players on their teams.

I hear ya, although I don't really understand the NBA players thing. But yea, it's hard to make a FF and it's not my bar for success, but if I didn't think that a FF appearance was something that I should expect over the course of the next decade or so, then I wouldn't bother watching the tournament.

[GoMuskies]

Even Wichita State had three NBA players when they went to the Final Four.

[mirabilelectu]

I see this and Mack has defintely not been perfect and makes you scratch your head at times. But I dont think it is fair to say he hasnt moved the program forward or met expectations we should have as a program.

To say he isnt the answer bc he hasnt got X to a final 4 yet is silly imo. Also I am not sure why one would think he couldnt get us there. We just dont have the horses this year, it is that simple.

Last year sucked. It was a legit shot at getting to that Final 4 but sometimes crazy things happen in the tourney and we got beat by a ridiculous shot. Sucks but I dont think that is a reason to say our coach cant get us to a final 4.

Completely agree, Mack has given me much more to be hopeful about IMO. Just pointing out that if someone were to rebut your point about WISKY, they could say we had that game in the bag, shouldn't even have come down to a last shot if we had made some different decisions in the last 4 minutes of that game.

[markchal]

What a disappointment Gates was tonight. Really had high hopes for him but he seems to be a shooter and nothing else. Got owned on some easy o-boards and gave up some dumb fouls.

O'Mara. Man. I really thought he was gonna be a contributor this year but he seems to be not much more of a contributor than he was last year.

Really sucks to ruin such a great effort from Tre but man, UC just wanted it more and really outplayed us. I thought the Shootout was supposed to be tough for freshmen? Their frosh DESTROYED Jp in the second half.

How serious is Ed's shoulder? IMO that will tell us how far we can go. We really could've used a healthy Ed tonight. Not enough playmakers.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I hear ya, although I don't really understand the NBA players thing. But yea, it's hard to make a FF and it's not my bar for success, but if I didn't think that a FF appearance was something that I should expect over the course of the next decade or so, then I wouldn't bother watching the tournament.

Yeah I expect it to come eventually but I wouldnt say bc it hasnt happened Mack hasnt advanced the program. That is just stupid.

And what do u mean you dont get the NBA players thing? I was just referencing even teams who have got to the final 4 who arent traditionally looked at as a powers or getting great recruits still has really great players those years. Butler has 2 who are current NBA players, like Go said Wichita had 3 that year. I guess VCU and George Mason didnt but those are the only teams I can thing of who would match your statement of even teams with less than XU are getting to the final 4 and getting NCs.

[Xville]

Ha right?

We should defintely get rid of our coach who just won national coach of the year last year. Clearly he isnt the guy to get us over the hump.

I mean what a freaking joke???

Mack isnt perfect obviously and he has things he could be better on but to pput the bar for Xavier as a program as final 4 or bust and snub your nose at 2nd weekend appearances like xville is doing is so stupid.

What makes him think Mack cant get X there I would love to hear. I would love to know specifically what Mack lacks in coaching to get X to the Final 4 one day.

Talent and luck are what he needs. Talent level is going up.

I dont get it.

Worst wining percentage of a xavier cosch since Staak
Continuous use of 1 3 1 even though he doesnt have the personnel
Stupid comments such as "players have to get thier own shots"
As.much talent as anyone last year and couldnt get out of the first weekend
Been here 8 years and sorry havent seen the program being moved forward..awesome regular season last year...we have had a lot of those. Sorry dont see that as moving the program forward.

I could go on but you are going to keep your rosey opinion no matter what so it doesnt really matter.

[RetireFiftyTu]

Before I get to what I really want to say, Trevon Bluiett had a hell of a game. 40 points on 15 shots. Gaston and O'Mara let him down big time. Also Q played really well as a freshman in that game in that atmosphere.

In the last 6 season Xavier had gone 5-1 against UC. In the 5 games they won they held UC under their season average for OR%. In the one game they lost UC went well over their season average. I tweeted this before the game and mentioned that controlling the defensive glass would be key. UC sure as hell topped their season average for OR%. That's why Xavier lost. They gave up 30 second chance points.

[AviatorX]

What a disappointment Gates was tonight. Really had high hopes for him but he seems to be a shooter and nothing else. Got owned on some easy o-boards and gave up some dumb fouls.

O'Mara. Man. I really thought he was gonna be a contributor this year but he seems to be not much more of a contributor than he was last year.

Really sucks to ruin such a great effort from Tre but man, UC just wanted it more and really outplayed us. I thought the Shootout was supposed to be tough for freshmen? Their frosh DESTROYED Jp in the second half.

How serious is Ed's shoulder? IMO that will tell us how far we can go. We really could've used a healthy Ed tonight. Not enough playmakers.

Really good points here. Gates has been a huge letdown for me this season, I'm hoping he just got off on the wrong foot with the injury in the preseason, but it's looking less and less likely every game. Maybe next year.

Cumberland can play. He was a big time local recruit. Mick is starting to get things going in the recruiting department instead of focusing on highly ranked Shaq Thomas type guys. They are going to be very very good next season also.

[KabeX]

Guys I get the disappointment. I mean my family really gets that I'm disappointed (and I'm probably on the couch tonight). BUT - would you rather be a Bearcat fan or a Xavier fan going forward. Which program has the bigger upside? You can say Mack has the worst winning percentage since Staak but that's really not a fair comparison. Big East vs. MCC? I mean we can argue the numbers till we're blue in the face (see what I did there?). But really - who are you going to buy stock in? It's not March ... YET. We'll see. I'm buying low here.

[mirabilelectu]

Yeah I expect it to come eventually but I wouldnt say bc it hasnt happened Mack hasnt advanced the program. That is just stupid.

And what do u mean you dont get the NBA players thing? I was just referencing even teams who have got to the final 4 who arent traditionally looked at as a powers or getting great recruits still has really great players those years. Butler has 2 who are current NBA players, like Go said Wichita had 3 that year. I guess VCU and George Mason didnt but those are the only teams I can thing of who would match your statement of even teams with less than XU are getting to the final 4 and getting NCs.

I guess I was saying that it wasn't like those guys were 5 star recruits when they decided on those smaller programs, they were developed by good coaching. Just saying you could claim that logic cuts both ways because those coached molded those players into NBA players (partially luck, I know). Also, we have had NBA players on a few of our teams, if that is such an integral criterion for a deep run it would be legit to ask why we haven't made one with some of our guys. Again, just playing devil's advocate, it takes a lot more than future NBA players, but IMO those "circumstances" are partially created.

[AviatorX]

Worst wining percentage of a xavier cosch since Staak
Continuous use of 1 3 1 even though he doesnt have the personnel
Stupid comments such as "players have to get thier own shots"
As.much talent as anyone last year and couldnt get out of the first round.
Been here 8 years and sorry havent seen the program being moved forward..awesome regular season last year...we have had a lot of those. Sorry dont see that as moving the program forward.

I could go on but you are going to keep your rosey opinion no matter what so it doesnt really matter.

Just an idea, but any chance this has something to do with a humongous step up in conference competition? I mean, you're trolling with that. Also X did get out of the first round last season, but I'm hoping you meant to say weekend.

I'm curious, is there anything other than going to a Final Four that would indicate to you that Mack is moving the program forward? I don't think Mack is the best coach in America by any stretch, I just think holding anyone at Xavier (or 99% of other schools) to that standard is moronic and unrealistic.

Again, I'm legitimately curious in your answer to that question. Also, do you think Sean Miller hasn't been good at Arizona? No Final Fours there.

Also X hasn't really had any regular seasons as awesome as last year, but it's hard to keep track of it all when you bring up so many ridiculous points.

[paulxu]

There have been a lot of complaints about us starting slow, and having to catch up.
We started, for the most part, on fire with an 8 pt half time lead...in their house.

We lost this with Gaston and OMara scoring 0 points. And Sumner was way off his game with 1 FG.
We most of all lost it where we have excelled all year...preventing offensive boards. They killed us with those, and the easy put backs.

I'm not giving up on this group. Ed can't afford to play for the scouts, and the young guys need to keep developing.
We'll see what the rest of the year brings.

Kudos to Tre for one great ass game.

[LadyMuskie]

Am I the only one who honestly thought we weren't going to win tonight? The Shootout deviates from the norm almost every season. It doesn't matter who's better or who's supposed to win. It usually boils down to luck and emotion. It did tonight as well. We've still won 3 of the last 4, 4 of the last 6 and 11 of the 17 this century. Fire Mack? Seriously? Based on this game? That's nonsense.

We're bound to have some bumpy seasons. This is one of them. Have some faith. At the end of the day, we're still Xavier.

[X Factor]

That was the worst performance by Xavier bigs I have ever witnessed. Gaston and O'Mara got abused so bad I can't even believe it. Tyrique couldn't finish either, but at least he banged and got the FT line, and then made his FT's.

Tre's performance was one for the ages, but now it won't go down in Xavier history like it should have.

We need a SERIOUS upgrade in big men.

Sumner still isn't able to take over a game. He's still way too easy to slow down on offense or completely shut down.

Quentin was really good tonight. 6 assists and 1 turnover. He ran the offense very good tonight. I thought the offense ran the best with him at the point.

At this point, I would start Quentin, Sumner, JP, Trevon, and either Gates or Tyrique.

[Xville]

Just an idea, but any chance this has something to do with a humongous step up in conference competition? I mean, you're trolling with that. Also X did get out of the first round last season, but I'm hoping you meant to say weekend.

I'm curious, is there anything other than going to a Final Four that would indicate to you that Mack is moving the program forward? I don't think Mack is the best coach in America by any stretch, I just think holding anyone at Xavier (or 99% of other schools) to that standard is moronic and unrealistic.

Again, I'm legitimately curious in your answer to that question.

Yeah there is a step up in competition, but with that comes a step up in the kind of talent you can get. All things being equal, it is coaching ability that makes the difference. Doesnt matter if you are in the mcc or the big east or the A10 where after millers recruits were gone, he also wasnt great.

As far as steps forward...a big east championship or a couple, an elite eight would be nice. Id also like to see some progress in in game coaching from Mack and quite frankly i have not seen much in the eight seasons he has been here.

[LadyMuskie]

I mean, we could have Troy Caupain representing our team and being excited just because he FINALLY won one game versus a team in 4 years. Perspective, people. Perspective.

[paulxu]

Worst wining percentage of a xavier cosch since Staak

You realize we went from the 7th best conference to the 3rd best a couple years ago?

[AviatorX]

Yeah there is a step up in competition, but with that comes a step up in the kind of talent you can get. All things being equal, it is coaching ability that makes the difference. Doesnt matter if you are in the mcc or the big east or the A10 where after millers recruits were gone, he also wasnt great.

As far as steps forward...a big east championship or a couple, an elite eight would be nice. Id also like to see some progress in in game coaching from Mack and quite frankly i have not seen much in the eight seasons he has been here.

Fair enough. I'm not trying to attack you, we are all frustrated after losses. Especially to UC.

I think your list of steps forward there is on point. I'm hopeful that as the rosters somewhat reset after this season (at least Hart and Jenkins will finally be gone, and obviously X seems to be likely to undergo some significant turnover), X is starting to build toward the same talent level as Nova, at least more than anyone else in the conference I think.

[D-West & PO-Z]

That was the worst performance by Xavier bigs I have ever witnessed. Gaston and O'Mara got abused so bad I can't even believe it. Tyrique couldn't finish either, but at least he banged and got the FT line, and then made his FT's.

Tre's performance was one for the ages, but now it won't go down in Xavier history like it should have.

We need a SERIOUS upgrade in big men.

Sumner still isn't able to take over a game. He's still way too easy to slow down on offense or completely shut down.

Quentin was really good tonight. 6 assists and 1 turnover. He ran the offense very good tonight. I thought the offense ran the best with him at the point.

At this point, I would start Quentin, Sumner, JP, Trevon, and either Gates or Tyrique.

Q's best game by far tonight. I think that is the most promising thing to take from this game.

Jones showed some flashes but he is a fouling machine. Cant play him more if he cant stay on the court due to foul trouble.

[KabeX]

Q was really good. Remember this game a year from now when Ed and Tre are gone. And please, can we all just back away from the cliff? Numbers, stats, Mack sucks. We don't have shit inside (well that might be somewhat accurate). It's one freakin game. A game that UC was hungrier for. Concern? Absolutely. Is the sky falling? C'Mon Man. Let it play out and enjoy the ride. Now, all that said - I'm still pissed.

[scoscox]

the fact that mack wasn't consistently laying into them for getting out toughed in every aspect of the game... someone needed to chew them out

[mirabilelectu]

Q was really good. Remember this game a year from now when Ed and Tre are gone. And please, can we all just back away from the cliff? Numbers, stats, Mack sucks. We don't have shit inside (well that might be somewhat accurate). It's one freakin game. A game that UC was hungrier for. Concern? Absolutely. Is the sky falling? C'Mon Man. Let it play out and enjoy the ride. Now, all that said - I'm still pissed.

The program is in a great place, but I think most people are taking about this season. It hasn't been one game, this is the exact script in all of our losses.

[Harryfe]

Tyrique played ok but he is a fouling machine. He commits 1 foul every 4 minutes of play. Hard to start him and play many minutes. Our bigs as a group are not good. Sean is to me the biggest disappointment on the team. Still waiting for Gates to recover from injury�� Obviously great game by Tre that Mick was able to make some adjustments for

[mirabilelectu]

In how many of our 14 wins have we been trailing after halftime? Does anyone have numbers on that?

[KabeX]

Yes it has been. The second half meltdowns are cause for great concern. I think we'll know a lot about this team's near future after Saturday's game. I guess my point was it aint March yet. And I know we have work to do but that's been our M-O in seasons past - work to March. Didn't work out last year but there's still time to get better.


The program is in a great place, but I think most people are taking about this season. It hasn't been one game, this is the exact script in all of our losses.

[XfansinKy]

Coach Mack basically said Sean and Rashid are a couple of softies but big Tyrique grew up tonight and needs to get more minutes. I agree.

[IM4X]

the fact that mack wasn't consistently laying into them for getting out toughed in every aspect of the game... someone needed to chew them out

Yeah- Mack called out two of his bigs for being soft... and they were... but the same could have been said about him during the game. The bigs were struggling all game and apparently the generic "hey, box out" comment from the sidelines wasn't cutting it. Sit the whole team down and bark a little while showing them exactly what they are doing wrong individually and as a team and how to correct it. Often bigs were out of position and other times there would be one X player (a big) rebounding against 3 or 4 UC players who were crashing the boards hard.

Also, accept some more of the blame tonight. He acted as if the only problem with the team was the poor performance from the bigs... but the truth is he too could have coached better in that second half... and let's be honest... if Trevon didn't shoot at such a ridiculously high precentage- Say he shots at 50% - UC still would likely have won by by eight or more (even if the bigs played better).

Tre's hustle and incredible shooting was very encouraging, but others are simply not stepping up at times (in addition to O'Mara and Gaston) including Gates and JP and Sumner.

[nasdadjr]

Shooting isn't the problem. It's rebounding... obvious to everyone except you apparently.

Funny thing is you think one player having a career night means we are shooting well. Box score and season statistics tell a different tale. This is not an NCAA tournament team. That isn't a bad thing though this team seems entitled like they are supposed to just step on the court and win. Maybe the NIT will be good for them this year. Knock that ego down a few rings then maybe they will do little things like box out and get a rebound

[nasdadjr]

Yeah- Mack called out two of his bigs for being soft... and they were... but the same could be said for him during the game. The bigs were struggling all game and a generic "hey box out" comment form the sidelines doesn't cut it. Sit the whole team down and bark at them while showing them exactly what they are doing wrong individually and as a team and how to correct it. Often there was one X player rebounding and 4 UC players crashing the boards and at times.

Also, accept some more of the blame tonight. He acted like the only problem was the bigs... but the truth is he could have coached better at times and let's be honest... if Trevon didn't shoot at such a ridiculously high precentage- Say he shots at 50% - UC still would likely have won by more than 10 (even if the bigs played better).

Tre was incredible and that was very encouraging, but others are not stepping up at times (in addition to O'Mara and Gaston) including Gates and JP and Sumner.

Gates can't step up when he refuses to go inside the arc. He is nothing but an absolute waste of 6-9 or 6-10. There is no reason a guy his size should only be getting 1-2 boards a game. He needs to be forced inside to man up cause what he is doing now ain't cutting it

[nasdadjr]

That was the worst performance by Xavier bigs I have ever witnessed. Gaston and O'Mara got abused so bad I can't even believe it. Tyrique couldn't finish either, but at least he banged and got the FT line, and then made his FT's.

Tre's performance was one for the ages, but now it won't go down in Xavier history like it should have.

We need a SERIOUS upgrade in big men.

Sumner still isn't able to take over a game. He's still way too easy to slow down on offense or completely shut down.

Quentin was really good tonight. 6 assists and 1 turnover. He ran the offense very good tonight. I thought the offense ran the best with him at the point.

At this point, I would start Quentin, Sumner, JP, Trevon, and either Gates or Tyrique.

1. Definitely not Gates he is softer than Gaston and Omara.

2. For Sumner to get better he needs to develop a jumper opponents respect. Guys can play off him cause he either can't or won't shoot. It is unquestionable Sumner has the speed to blow by anyone but if they play back cause he can't shoot then that negates his speed. He can't take the next step until he learns to shoot.

[nasdadjr]

Last thing I'll say though is that I find it funny how last year the team was the epitome of what a basketball team should be. This year it's a 180. I blame Chris Mack for that much. Xavier's mindset this year is the epitome of what is wrong with basketball. Everyone wants to play the Warriors uptempo guard oriented offense. Problem is they can only do that cause they had one specific guy... steph curry. He is the only reason that style works for them. I hope Mack gets back to getting a good traditional big to run through cause it is apparent that the lack of one this year is hurting the entire team.

[Masterofreality]

Out efforted in a rivalry game? Unacceptable.

The absolute core of what is wrong with this team this year. They ABSOLUTELY are not Too 25 caliber.

And effort is on the Players....not the coach.

REBOUND THE F-ING BALL. EMBARRASSING

[xukeith]

Funny thing is you think one player having a career night means we are shooting well. Box score and season statistics tell a different tale. This is not an NCAA tournament team. That isn't a bad thing though this team seems entitled like they are supposed to just step on the court and win. Maybe the NIT will be good for them this year. Knock that ego down a few rings then maybe they will do little things like box out and get a rebound

It is a 8-9 seed right now. Only lose 2-3 more BE h=games and X will be in tip top shape. X has an injured pg too.

[xukeith]

Well OSU is not great this year. Blame Matta?

[boozehound]

Out efforted in a rivalry game? Unacceptable.

The absolute core of what is wrong with this team this year. They ABSOLUTELY are not Too 25 caliber.

And effort is on the Players....not the coach.

REBOUND THE F-ING BALL. EMBARRASSING

Hard to disagree with any of this. Here are the three main flaws I have noticed from this team:

1. They are soft - Bigs get out toughed and can't be counted on to get a tough basket. Nobody gets and holds position very well. Team overall lacks a 'killer instinct'. Macura is the closest to that we have, but he spends too much of the the game flopping and lobbying for calls instead of getting out there and banging for position.

2. They lack a leader - Sumner is too quiet and hasn't been on the floor enough. Trevon is too quiet. Macura is too inconsistent and makes poor decisions far too often. None of these guys seem to be a calm, confident leader. Blueitt might be the closest.

3. They play their worst ball when it matter most - We don't make the big shots when we need them, and our late game play has been terrible. Sumner seems to 'brain fart' when the game is on the line and forgets to pass the ball, preferring to drive to the hoop completely out of control. This was an issue last year too (see: Wisconsin game).

Unfortunately these are some pretty big flaws for a team that is hoping to make a run in the tourney.

[American X]

Asked on Live Chat, but Jalen leaving worse for this year's team than D Brown leaving after 2009? Agree with what AmX said that the '10 team with Brown was legit final 4 contender... but, if we have one legitimate inside presence this year, does that not completely change the dynamics of this team?

Just a Jamel McLean or Travis Taylor would do wonders for this team.

[bjf123]

This team is starting to remind me of the Bengals. Good, or even great, in the first half. Falls apart after halftime.

Also, we won't be ranked on Monday, justifiably so.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GoMuskies]

Well OSU is not great this year. Blame Matta?

If I'm a betting man, Matta is not back at OSU next year.

[Lloyd Braun]

Funny thing is you think one player having a career night means we are shooting well. Box score and season statistics tell a different tale. This is not an NCAA tournament team. That isn't a bad thing though this team seems entitled like they are supposed to just step on the court and win. Maybe the NIT will be good for them this year. Knock that ego down a few rings then maybe they will do little things like box out and get a rebound

I never said they were shooting well. Just said shooting wasn't the problem last night. After they lost you said "can't live beyond the arc". So it may be true that they can't live beyond the arc but it was completely irrelevant to last nights game. They gave up almost 30 second chance points. That is why they lost.

[paulxu]

If I'm a betting man, Matta is not back at OSU next year.

Well, you are a betting man. So if he goes, do they go with Miller?
Or do they go all Urban Meyer and bring in a big gun?

[American X]

3. Two guys showed up for X, Tre and JP. Rest were no shows, pretty much.


I would say three guys showed up - Trevon, Quentin and Tyrique. Not a fan of J.P.'s performance.

Which highlights that the two freshmen had quality games in the Crosstown Shootout, but the rest of the team, sans Trevon, were abysmal.

[muskieindent]

Hard to disagree with any of this. Here are the three main flaws I have noticed from this team:

1. They are soft - Bigs get out toughed and can't be counted on to get a tough basket. Nobody gets and holds position very well. Team overall lacks a 'killer instinct'. Macura is the closest to that we have, but he spends too much of the the game flopping and lobbying for calls instead of getting out there and banging for position.

2. They lack a leader - Sumner is too quiet and hasn't been on the floor enough. Trevon is too quiet. Macura is too inconsistent and makes poor decisions far too often. None of these guys seem to be a calm, confident leader. Blueitt might be the closest.

3. They play their worst ball when it matter most - We don't make the big shots when we need them, and our late game play has been terrible. Sumner seems to 'brain fart' when the game is on the line and forgets to pass the ball, preferring to drive to the hoop completely out of control. This was an issue last year too (see: Wisconsin game).

Unfortunately these are some pretty big flaws for a team that is hoping to make a run in the tourney.

Hopefully we make the tourney.Even at half last night I didn't fell too good about winning based on our previous second half collapses this year.How many games have we given up 50+ points in the second half? I think Ed could be the leader we need,but he's got to be on the floor.Gets in foul trouble too much.I think this is wwhere the loss of Myles is felt the most.

[drudy23]

Yeah- Mack called out two of his bigs for being soft... and they were... but the same could have been said about him during the game. The bigs were struggling all game and apparently the generic "hey, box out" comment from the sidelines wasn't cutting it. Sit the whole team down and bark a little while showing them exactly what they are doing wrong

.

Rebounding is a matter of want to, not how to.

[drudy23]

the fact that mack wasn't consistently laying into them for getting out toughed in every aspect of the game... someone needed to chew them out

As Mack said, UC's offensive rebounding prowess and toughness were addressed in every conversation in practice leading up to the game, and in every huddle during the game. No excuse for that level of softness.

I have NO doubt that Mack made this a point of emphasis the entire week.

[sgarcia]

As Mack said, UC's offensive rebounding prowess and toughness were addressed in every conversation in practice leading up to the game, and in every huddle during the game. No excuse for that level of softness.

I have NO doubt that Mack made this a point of emphasis the entire week.

Agree with what you said regarding Mack. I have 2 quick defensive points.
1) Can we please start to front the post or 3/4 the post man? I'm tired of watching teams passing it to their big man with relative ease.
2) Rebounding is about positioning and angles of the shot. Once you get in the right spot you need to go after the ball and get your ass in front of an offensive player. You can't hope the ball just falls in your lap. UC was basically jumping over our players grabbing rebounds while we stood flat footed on the ground.

[Harryfe]

With regards to Sumner. I have to think his shoulder is holding him back. I'm not a doctor but suspect he needs suurgery ( Oh wait, I am a doctor)

[Emp]

I've been astounded at our rebounding margin this season, esp given the lack of rebounds from the 5 position. Except for Ed and the occasional hops from Tyrique, we don't play above the rim at all. When we do run into more athletic front courts (Baylor), the result is similar to last night.

If there is one fly in the recruiting ointment, it's the inability to find, recruit and nourish a dominant big. Mack landed Jalen, but I'm not sure he nourished him. Mack has done a reasonably good job making lemonade from the likes of Frease, Farr. But we're never going to run four games in the dance and get to the final four without some natural front court talent.

[IM4X]

Rebounding is a matter of want to, not how to.

See this is not completely true. Yes this is partly effort... But it's partly taking proper angles and getting help from teammates. If Mack is just telling his one big to box out... and that one guy is trying to do it against 3 UC players who are crashing the boards (with little help from additional X players), odds are always going to be in favor of the three guys getting the rebound. Add to that our bigs (other than Jones) are less athletic than the most of the BE completion they play against. Then let's remember Gaston is 6'7" (at best) playing against players who are 6'9" or bigger. Next, add that when Gates was helping out with rebounds (which wasn't often) he was usiually out of position.

I remember hearing (before the season began) that Mack thought his bigs this swason were capable of being just as good as last year's bigs. A comment that was quite surprising to me (and to probably most others on this board).

And for for the record... I don't buy the notion that effort isn't coachable. I know Mack likes to mention it at times, but You absolutely can get better effort through coaching. All a quick time out and really Crack the whip when the effort wanes and you will very likely get some better effort. Great coaches can get their kids to give a little more. Just watch Villanova play. Do people really think every player Jay Wright recruited just happens to have better effort every game than other teams? Or is it more likely that Jay has certain expectations and he demands fhat during practice and in games that they have to give it everything they've got every second they are on the court.

That's not to say Mack is a bad coach. He is a good coach. But I think it's also fair to suggest he has flaws too (all coaches do) that he needs to be better about owning and continue to work on (as all smart coaches do in order to get better as a coach and to achieve better results). The problem on the court starts with the coach- Period. Whether that problem is a lack of talent, a lack of discipline, a lack of execution (in some cases), poor adjustments, and even poor effort (if that poor effort last more than a few minutes in a game). You know the coach is coaching his best when his the players are playing are giving their best.

[IM4X]

Agree with what you said regarding Mack. I have 2 quick defensive points.
1) Can we please start to front the post or 3/4 the post man? I'm tired of watching teams passing it to their big man with relative ease.
2) Rebounding is about positioning and angles of the shot. Once you get in the right spot you need to go after the ball and get your ass in front of an offensive player. You can't hope the ball just falls in your lap. UC was basically jumping over our players grabbing rebounds while we stood flat footed on the ground.


Yes.

[IM4X]

I've been astounded at our rebounding margin this season, esp given the lack of rebounds from the 5 position. Except for Ed and the occasional hops from Tyrique, we don't play above the rim at all. When we do run into more athletic front courts (Baylor), the result is similar to last night.

If there is one fly in the recruiting ointment, it's the inability to find, recruit and nourish a dominant big. Mack landed Jalen, but I'm not sure he nourished him. Mack has done a reasonably good job making lemonade from the likes of Frease, Farr. But we're never going to run four games in the dance and get to the final four without some natural front court talent.

Agreed.

Though, to be fair, Frease came in as a highly rated recruit and played beneath his expectations until the NCAA tournament during his final year. Farr, on the other hand, was a 2 star -work in progress- who may possibly have had the most impressive transformation of any big at X. He went from, "Why did we even recruit this stiff who doesn't move well and can't make a bunny" to "Wow, James is such a monster rebounder and a good scorer and one of the key reasons the team is one of the best in college basketball... and why the team has a realistic shot of making it to the final four."

[nasdadjr]

Q was really good. Remember this game a year from now when Ed and Tre are gone. And please, can we all just back away from the cliff? Numbers, stats, Mack sucks. We don't have shit inside (well that might be somewhat accurate). It's one freakin game. A game that UC was hungrier for. Concern? Absolutely. Is the sky falling? C'Mon Man. Let it play out and enjoy the ride. Now, all that said - I'm still pissed.

If they leave then Europe will be getting 2 good project players

[nasdadjr]

It is a 8-9 seed right now. Only lose 2-3 more BE h=games and X will be in tip top shape. X has an injured pg too.

No shot... however I won't be able to prove it till march