Game Thread: Xavier v. Missouri (Tire Pros Invitational) November 17, 2016

[bobbiemcgee]

We shot the lights out last yr. in the same gym. Don't think we are going 2-22 tmrw. Silver lining for Bluiett is he should be well rested.

[sirthought]

For those saying it can't get much worse, it actually can.

They scored 70+ in regulation with terrible outside shooting. What if the inside shots didn't fall either?

I don't think that will be the case with this team, but anything is possible.

[bigdiggins]

O'Mara missed a couple of shots that were right there. He didn't work for position to take advantage of his size and skills on a couple other plays.

Despite this lack of good play, I think Sumner needs to continue to be looking at him for a first option on more possessions.

Firstly, he needs the touches to work it out and know that he's the one down there the team needs. Secondly, if we aren't going there more than is happening now, we're missing the opportunity to make the other team's defense work down low, opening up the outside.

I know we had a cold night shooting, but honestly our 3 point attempts weren't as open as they could have been always. That changes if we continue to feed the bigs.

O'Mara put the ball in the basket 73% of the times he shot it today between FTs and shots from the field. Guy had as much to do with X winning as anyone today.

[MuskieCinci]

Going 2/22 from 3 and still coming away with a win on a neutral court against a SEC team. Take what you can and move on.

I get what you're saying at face value, but really unless that SEC team is Kentucky is it really any different than a win against a mediocre MVC, A10, or AAC team?

[bigdiggins]

I get what you're saying at face value, but really unless that SEC team is Kentucky is it really any different than a win against a mediocre MVC, A10, or AAC team?

Yes, mediocre MVC, A10, or AAC teams are all better than Missouri.

[sirthought]

O'Mara put the ball in the basket 73% of the times he shot it today between FTs and shots from the field. Guy had as much to do with X winning as anyone today.

Read what I wrote again. I didn't say he wasn't a contributor. I said the guards need to make sure he's more of one.

His play overall hasn't been very polished, but he has contributed, and needs to do more so.

[X-ceptional]

We've won our last four games in these tournaments. STREEEEEEEEEEEAK.

No doubt, no doubt, no doubt.

Winning streaks are the best!


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DnVrSZHnvYY

[paulxu]

I'm guessing attendance today was about 52.

[MuskieCinci]

I do want to say thank you to O'Mara and Gaston for showing up today. 25 points on 8-11 from the field, 9-14 FT, 15 Boards (5 offensive), 1 Steal, 2 assists, and 5 blocks is alright AND needed today from them.

Which is why it was interesting to see some people in this thread being pretty critical about our bigs. They weren't All Americans or anything, but this team obviously needs much smarter play and better shooting from the perimeter. If we get today's stat lines from our big men every day out we are in really good shape.

Does anyone else hate the block/charge foul at the college level more than Edmond? He probably can't wait for the refs at the pro level and their interpretation of it. Between the Wisconsin game, end of Lehigh, picking up a foul today when he jumped up in the air and made a pass and then a Missouri guy slid under him, picking up a foul today when he was backpedaling out of the way of the Missouri PG but the kid put his shoulder down and fell into Ed, it was no wonder he played it so safe at the end of regulation and just tried to jack something up instead of driving.

[xu82]

Keep winning like that and we could be 12-0 while dropping how far in the polls? So very ugly.... No style points today, but I'll take the W.

[KFX]

He hasn't looked like he is ready to play in the NBA this year so far.

I know what you mean but that drive in the middle of the lane where he makes contact and then goes left and finishes off the board is an NBA worthy move and finish. Needs a lot more consistency l agree.

[Xville]

Yes, mediocre MVC, A10, or AAC teams are all better than Missouri.

Um no...prognosticators were wrong on missouri this year i believe. They arent a tourney team, but think they are an nit team...talent is there. Hughes was committed to louisville until his buddy willie jackson said to come there...he will win them some games thia year.

[X Factor]

Keep winning like that and we could be 12-0 while dropping how far in the polls? So very ugly.... No style points today, but I'll take the W.

Exactly. This team will be undefeated and unranked before long. Ha.

[AviatorX]

Um no...prognosticators were wrong on missouri this year i believe. They arent a tourney team, but think they are an nit team...talent is there. Hughes was committed to louisville until his buddy willie jackson said to come there...he will win them some games thia year.

Gotta question that decision making by Hughes. Anderson must have a better recruiting pitch than end of game set.

[Emp]

I was wondering what Mack was doing with three timeouts in OT.

WELL. Used the last two perfectly. Saw their defensive set, drew up a great play, and we got the W in a day when nothing was going right but the effort.

Which is why in the end I like this team. They never quit, and that's tough when the shots won't fall. Mack tough. Give em some credit for grit.

[TUclutch]

For those saying it can't get much worse, it actually can.

They scored 70+ in regulation with terrible outside shooting. What if the inside shots didn't fall either?

I don't think that will be the case with this team, but anything is possible.

No it really can't get any worse. They didn't make a single jumpshot in the second half or overtime according to multiple stats I just saw. Every FG in the second half was inside 5 feet. You really can't get any worse

[MauriceX]

No it really can't get any worse. They didn't make a single jumpshot in the second half or overtime according to multiple stats I just saw. Every FG in the second half was inside 5 feet. You really can't get any worse

I just checked out the ESPN shot chart. That is truly awful shooting! Same thing in the first half with the exception of the two made threes. Everything else was in the lane & close to the basket.

We just won a game with only two made shots beyond five feet... wow.

[bigdiggins]

Read what I wrote again. I didn't say he wasn't a contributor. I said the guards need to make sure he's more of one.

His play overall hasn't been very polished, but he has contributed, and needs to do more so.

Missed a couple shots that were right there, did not work for position and lack of good play is not exactly a positive critique of his performance.

Hence my confusion.

[letskeepitreal]

On a positive note, a workmanlike double double for Gaston

[D-West & PO-Z]

I was wondering what Mack was doing with three timeouts in OT.

WELL. Used the last two perfectly. Saw their defensive set, drew up a great play, and we got the W in a day when nothing was going right but the effort.

Which is why in the end I like this team. They never quit, and that's tough when the shots won't fall. Mack tough. Give em some credit for grit.

Yes this, I just finished the game a couple hours ago after work and I was so mad he was holding onto those TO's. There was so many instances where they could have been used. He used them very effectively at the end. Glad he had them.

[XUGRAD80]

5 players in double figure points....good

3 players on the opposition with 20+ points....bad

X wins rebounding battle 52-39

X wins blocks, fouls, free throws

S shoots terrible % in all phases....overall, 3-point, free throws....and still finds a way to win

Not every victory is going to easy or pretty.

Tomorrow is another day, and another game.

[Olsingledigit]

No it really can't get any worse. They didn't make a single jumpshot in the second half or overtime according to multiple stats I just saw. Every FG in the second half was inside 5 feet. You really can't get any worse
Some games the shots simply don't fall.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I do want to say thank you to O'Mara and Gaston for showing up today. 25 points on 8-11 from the field, 9-14 FT, 15 Boards (5 offensive), 1 Steal, 2 assists, and 5 blocks is alright AND needed today from them.

O'Mara was huge in OT.

[D-West & PO-Z]

O'Mara missed a couple of shots that were right there. He didn't work for position to take advantage of his size and skills on a couple other plays.

Despite this lack of good play, I think Sumner needs to continue to be looking at him for a first option on more possessions.

Firstly, he needs the touches to work it out and know that he's the one down there the team needs. Secondly, if we aren't going there more than is happening now, we're missing the opportunity to make the other team's defense work down low, opening up the outside.

I know we had a cold night shooting, but honestly our 3 point attempts weren't as open as they could have been always. That changes if we continue to feed the bigs.

He was huge on a couple plays at the end though. And the offensive board in OT and put back to tie. Big time.

[xu82]

O'Mara was huge in OT.

Good thing too, he was the only big left! Has anyone mentioned we miss Kaiser and Myles?

I was worried about fatigue in this tourney, but as someone mentioned Trevon should be fresh. All this point of emphasis whistle blowing has taken some of the fun out of watching. I was hoping to rest starters late, not send them into OT!

[XUFan09]

For those saying it can't get much worse, it actually can.

They scored 70+ in regulation with terrible outside shooting. What if the inside shots didn't fall either?

I don't think that will be the case with this team, but anything is possible.

So you're saying let's take a highly improbable occurrence (the outside shooting today) and tack on another even more highly improbable occurence (the inside shooting being really bad too). Yes, TECHNICALLY it could happen, but saying, "Anything is possible," is a lazy way to cover up the fact that you are imagining possibly the least likely combo of occurrences in recent Xavier history and then acting like it's something to even minorly worry about. No, things can't really get much worse from shooting standpoint in all but the most improbable universes.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

[xudash]

I would just like to point out that it is a damn relief to be able to watch the ESPN scroll move across the screen with a Xavier "W" this evening.

[scoscox]

Sumner is a great weapon, but needs to understand how to facilitate offense and use the fear he creates against defenses. Honestly I thought he played selfishly today to the detriment of the team. He's got to learn to kick when the d collapses. It's frustrating to watch the offense not take advantage of the open shooters he creates. Once that happens, the lane opens up for him even more and it'll help his game as well. It probably would help to run the offense inside out as well. The ball has to move.

This is another area where Myles will help. Myles generally has a good feel for the penetrate and kick and even finishing around the rim and is obviously a dead-eye from deep which we need. Kaiser is obviously another, which can only help. Still, the offense scored 83 and we had 4 or 5 guys in double figures, even going 2-22 from deep and not hitting a single jump shot in the second half.

The defense is the problem. It was downright embarrassing at times today and needs to get more aggressive period. They stepped it up in the second half when we started to pull away and took control of the game, but the D is the biggest issue. We can't let Mizzou put up 82. They had three guys score 20+ you just can't have that.

Lastly, the bigs were a bright spot. They were monsters despite tyrique taking on the will caudle role. Had he not fouled out, he was starting to assert his will down low. In general we dominated missouri down low like we dominated teams last year and that was pretty surprising. So there were ups and downs to the game. In general, I doubt we shoot that poorly from deep or really from everywhere again. We hit any shots and we would've buried Mizzou by 15+ in the second half. We'll see what happens with the rest of the games in the tournament. Hopefully, we'll hit our stride and put a dayton-like beatdown on someone like last year.

[Juice]

Sumner is a great weapon, but needs to understand how to facilitate offense and use the fear he creates against defenses. Honestly I thought he played selfishly today to the detriment of the team. He's got to learn to kick when the d collapses. It's frustrating to watch the offense not take advantage of the open shooters he creates. Once that happens, the lane opens up for him even more and it'll help his game as well. It probably would help to run the offense inside out as well. The ball has to move.

This is another area where Myles will help. Myles generally has a good feel for the penetrate and kick and even finishing around the rim and is obviously a dead-eye from deep which we need. Kaiser is obviously another, which can only help. Still, the offense scored 83 and we had 4 or 5 guys in double figures, even going 2-22 from deep and not hitting a single jump shot in the second half.

The defense is the problem. It was downright embarrassing at times today and needs to get more aggressive period. They stepped it up in the second half when we started to pull away and took control of the game, but the D is the biggest issue. We can't let Mizzou put up 82. They had three guys score 20+ you just can't have that.

Lastly, the bigs were a bright spot. They were monsters despite tyrique taking on the will caudle role. Had he not fouled out, he was starting to assert his will down low. In general we dominated missouri down low like we dominated teams last year and that was pretty surprising. So there were ups and downs to the game. In general, I doubt we shoot that poorly from deep or really from everywhere again. We hit any shots and we would've buried Mizzou by 15+ in the second half. We'll see what happens with the rest of the games in the tournament. Hopefully, we'll hit our stride and put a dayton-like beatdown on someone like last year.

We held Mizzou to under 1 point per possession, which means the defense was above average today. They had some guys go off that shouldn't have, but overall the defense wasn't as bad as you make it seem.

[xu82]

Will someone please mention to Ed that he has to start before there's 3 seconds on the clock when he's 22 feet from the basket? Please?

[scoscox]

Okay, I would say that we were also playing Missouri, so maybe we should be outperforming that efficiency average. Shooting a respectable percentage from the field, three, and line would also have helped tremendously.

[Emp]

Will someone please mention to Ed that he has to start before there's 3 seconds on the clock when he's 22 feet from the basket? Please?

He was waiving and waiting for a screen that never came.

That said, I would like to see something a bit more organized than gimme the ball. Mack had plenty of TOs in his pocket and 12 seconds. Redemption at the end of OT, but still.......

[IM4X]

Will someone please mention to Ed that he has to start before there's 3 seconds on the clock when he's 22 feet from the basket? Please?

Good. I wasn't the only one screaming at the tv, "WTF are you waiting for?"

[IM4X]

I would just like to point out that it is a damn relief to be able to watch the ESPN scroll move across the screen with a Xavier "W" this evening.

I'll second that.

[XUMIOH12]

Good. I wasn't the only one screaming at the tv, "WTF are you waiting for?"

yeah gotta start a few seconds before that, but at least the other team didnt get the ball back, perhaps a little on the cautious side

[XUMIOH12]

Okay, I would say that we were also playing Missouri, so maybe we should be outperforming that efficiency average. Shooting a respectable percentage from the field, three, and line would also have helped tremendously.

the defense was average today, it definitely wasn't bad.

[IM4X]

yeah gotta start a few seconds before that, but at least the other team didnt get the ball back, perhaps a little on the cautious side

Yes. Start a few seconds earlier and actually have some idea what you might want to do other than wait around so long that you are forced to make a very bad decision like taking a low percentage 3 pt shot without drawing a foul.

[flagship]

I think we are quickly forgetting that this game never should of went into overtime. How the refs missed that travel and then called the foul blows my mind. The game ends right there with a proper travel call.

[bleedXblue]

I think Gaston just needed a little confidence to help him confirm that he can play at this level. He looks like a different player than he did in game one. If he can give us solid production in the post...nothing crazy......like 10 PT and 7 RPG that will be huge. Add 8 and 6 from O'Mara.

Again, we need both Gates and Davis to return in order to have a special year.

[xu82]

yeah gotta start a few seconds before that, but at least the other team didnt get the ball back, perhaps a little on the cautious side

That happened a bunch last year too. Maddening!

[xufan2434]

I do like that Mack let them play and didn't call the timeout. It's early in the year and the team needs experience in close games. They didn't have any close games throughout the entire season last year and then Wisco happened. Not saying the inexperience is why they lost by any means, but it definitely doesn't hurt in the long run. Having said that, if Ed is going to be the go-to guy then they have to figure something out or have 1-3 specific options down the stretch. My ideal situation when he comes back, is a P&R with Kaiser cause he can at least pop out. And then just spread it with shooters.

But yes, have to start earlier in case his first drive gets cut off and we're not throwing up an absolute prayer

[muskiefan82]

I always though J.P. was the go-to guy because he:
A. Wants the ball; and
B. Delivers a great deal of the time when he does have the ball.

Dude has steel ones and an attitude to go with it.

[bleedXblue]

I always though J.P. was the go-to guy because he:
A. Wants the ball; and
B. Delivers a great deal of the time when he does have the ball.

Dude has steel ones and an attitude to go with it.

He has played really well the first 3 games. Consistency has been great.

[xufan2434]

I always though J.P. was the go-to guy because he:
A. Wants the ball; and
B. Delivers a great deal of the time when he does have the ball.

Dude has steel ones and an attitude to go with it.

I'd 100% be fine with that as well. Dude already did it @ Providence last year. He would probably need more a play drawn up for him though to get open rather than taking someone off the dribble

[Caf]

He has played really well the first 3 games. Consistency has been great.

I would love to see JP drive more vs pulling up from 3. He's only 2-14 from 3 so far, plus he hasn't missed a FT yet.

[nuts4xu]

The refs called 52 fouls yesterday. The way they were calling every touch foul that happened, it is criminal that Ed didn't drive to the basket on the last possession of regulation. They had to have a better play drawn up. Tie score, with the ball, and 22 seconds left in the game...you have to come away from that possession with points...and no time left on the clock. Need to learn from that situation, and NOT repeat it.

[Juice]

I would love to see JP drive more vs pulling up from 3. He's only 2-14 from 3 so far, plus he hasn't missed a FT yet.

My only issue with JP has been his 3 point shooting. It's not that he's missing, because slumps happen, but he's missing because he's taking a lot of deep threes that he doesn't need to take. His shot selection beyond the arc could improve.

[MuskieXU]

My only issue with JP has been his 3 point shooting. It's not that he's missing, because slumps happen, but he's missing because he's taking a lot of deep threes that he doesn't need to take. His shot selection beyond the arc could improve.

Agreed, I have a bit of an issue with a lot of the 3s and deep 2s XU is taking. When you have a top 15 offense a 25 foot three 5 seconds into the shot clock should not be an ideal shot, even more so when the refs refuse to go 30 seconds without calling a foul.

[Caf]

My only issue with JP has been his 3 point shooting. It's not that he's missing, because slumps happen, but he's missing because he's taking a lot of deep threes that he doesn't need to take. His shot selection beyond the arc could improve.

Agreed. It's too early to concretely say he's taking too many 3s because half of his attempts are from 1 game+OT.

[Caf]

Agreed, I have a bit of an issue with a lot of the 3s and deep 2s XU is taking. When you have a top 15 offense a 25 foot three 5 seconds into the shot clock should not be an ideal shot, even more so when the refs refuse to go 30 seconds without calling a foul.

Exactly. It will be interesting to see the role 3pt shots play in the absence of Myles.

[XMuskieFTW]

Mizzou getting lit up by Davidson early. 23-9.

[Xville]

Terrible start by missouri today...maybe i was too hopeful for them...they may completely suck again...or maybe its just the hangover from their close loss yesterday.

[GoMuskies]

Davidson is 5-9 from 3 early. Our game yesterday would have looked a lot different if we were shooting like that. I don't think Mizzou did anything in particular to force us into 9% three point shooting.

[Juice]

Davidson is 5-9 from 3 early. Our game yesterday would have looked a lot different if we were shooting like that. I don't think Mizzou did anything in particular to force us into 9% three point shooting.

Hell, even if we shot 20% and not our 9% it would have a lot different game.

[Xville]

Davidson's shooting has come back down to earth and mizzou is taking advantage..was down by 17 at one point, now just 5

[GoMuskies]

Davidson misses four threes in a row....and all of a sudden it's a 5 point game. Sometimes the game isn't that hard to figure out!

[Xville]

Back to 10 now....this is the same missouri team i have seen the past two years unfortunately...get down big...crawl back, but then not have enough in the end. Hope things change because X could always use a good non conference win, though there should be plenty of opportunities.

[GoMuskies]

Davidson is 3 for their last 16 from three and are still pulling away....

[Xville]

hughes and phillipps a combined 1-19 today...Missouri can't win without those guys playing well...

[muskiefan82]

This is going to look like a large missed opportunity for Mizzou if there season goes completely south from here.

[XUFan09]

Terrible start by missouri today...maybe i was too hopeful for them...they may completely suck again...or maybe its just the hangover from their close loss yesterday.
The psychological effect in soul-crushing losses is very real. Usually teams get a few days to recover, but exempt tournaments are not that kind.

Sent from my SM-N920V using Tapatalk

[Juice]

My only issue with JP has been his 3 point shooting. It's not that he's missing, because slumps happen, but he's missing because he's taking a lot of deep threes that he doesn't need to take. His shot selection beyond the arc could improve.

I'll shut up now.

[AviatorX]

Agreed, let's remember the debacle at Creighton last year with a similar performance from deep. JP is wayyyy overdue to hit 5 or 6 tomorrow.

Well, not one to quote myself but I wish I were always this accurate. Didn't think he'd do it all in the first half.