Politics Thread

[Masterofreality]

I think this could bode well for the Republicans in two years. I fully expect the Democrats to raise taxes on businesses. What will they do? Cut costs to keep their bottom line the same. Easiest place to cut costs? Headcount. We’ll see an uptick in unemployment and a slowdown of the economy.

What I’m really anxious to see is if they raise personal income taxes to make the rich pay their still undefined “fair share”. That’s been a claim from the Left for a long time. Here’s your chance. You had a shot during Obama’s first two years and didn’t do it then. Maybe you have the intestinal fortitude this time?

I also won’t be surprised to see them try to get DC and Puerto Rica as states to get 4 more Democratic Senators in place. I don’t think they’ll try to pack the Supreme Court. That’s a rabbit hole no one wants to go down.

As someone else said, I don’t think Biden will try to go too far left and Joe Manchin will also be the voice of reason to keep them from going crazy. We’ll soon find out.

There are other taxes that they can levy to take money out of the working man's pocket, tho. My bet would be a huge gasoline tax raise because it accomplishes two things in the Dems mind- A) Raises revenue, B) Panders to the environmentalists. It will screw the car companies, lessening demand, however and really is a regressive tax on the average citizen. I'd be willing to bet we'll soon have $4-$4.50/gallon gas if not more, similar to Canada.
Capital gains tax increase, which screws all small and large investors is another almost certain. So when Biden says he's not raising taxes on anybody who doesn't make $400k, he's Lying through his teeth. Even if he restores the tax cuts that the Repubs put in place, that's a tax raise on the normal guy.
Get ready to have your wallet picked.

[paulxu]

Capitol on lockdown, and 2 office buildings evacuated. Not a good show.

[XU 23]

Instead of unifying against Biden and a left-wing agenda, Trump cast doubt on the Georgia election results over the past two months and caused lower than expected turnout in rural red counties. Perdue actually slightly outperformed his November results in many of the Atlanta suburbs (which is probably a lot of moderate Republicans and independents voting red to prevent one party-rule) but did much worse in rural red counties. That kind of makes sense; If you're part of the hardcore Trump base in GA, why go vote for the party of evil Brian Kemp and evil Raffensberger who obviously colluded with the Democrats to steal the election from Trump? Why give them your vote?

MAGA needs to go for the sake of the party, but I don't think it will.

[Masterofreality]

Capitol on lockdown, and 2 office buildings evacuated. Not a good show.

Sounds like Antifa in Seattle and Portland- except that went on for weeks and months.
Any body attacking diners as they try to have dinner or lunch at outdoor cafe's like Antifa and BLM did recently- in numerous cities at numerous times? I doubt it.

[Masterofreality]

Instead of unifying against Biden and a left-wing agenda, Trump cast doubt on the Georgia election results over the past two months and caused lower than expected turnout in rural red counties. Perdue actually slightly outperformed his November results in many of the Atlanta suburbs (which is probably a lot of moderate Republicans and independents voting red to prevent one party-rule) but did much worse in rural red counties. That kind of makes sense; If you're part of the hardcore Trump base in GA, why go vote for the party of evil Brian Kemp and evil Raffensberger who obviously colluded with the Democrats to steal the election from Trump? Why give them your vote?

MAGA needs to go for the sake of the party, but I don't think it will.

That's why Trump is done. No way party leadership goes that direction in 4 years after this garbage.

[paulxu]

Sounds like Antifa in Seattle and Portland- except that went on for weeks and months.
Any body attacking diners as they try to have dinner or lunch at outdoor cafe's like Antifa and BLM did recently- in numerous cities at numerous times? I doubt it.

None of that, which was wrong, makes what's happening going on OK. You had a problem with people and federal building violations, you should apply the same logic.
One representative has evacuated her office because of pipe bomb threat.
No responsible Democrats urged their supporters to violate the law. Unlike what Trump has done.

[paulxu]

Protesters inside the Capitol against the law, causing Senate proceedings to pause.

Where is our "law and order" president during this?

[bobbiemcgee]

trump encouraging anarchists to storm the Capitol. Not going to end well.

[STL_XUfan]

Capitol is literally being stormed and Trump is tweeting out his grievances with Pence. What the f*** is going on here.

[Masterofreality]

None of that, which was wrong, makes what's happening going on OK. You had a problem with people and federal building violations, you should apply the same logic.
One representative has evacuated her office because of pipe bomb threat.
No responsible Democrats urged their supporters to violate the law. Unlike what Trump has done.

No they (Kamala Harris) just formed and supported fundraising to get Antifa and BLM thugs out of jail via Bail after they were arrested for riots. And those thugs never returned for their trial. Pot meet kettle.

[Masterofreality]

Protesters inside the Capitol against the law, causing Senate proceedings to pause.

Where is our "law and order" president during this?

Just like Leftists "protesting" during a Supreme Court Senate hearing and trying to intimidate elected officials.

[Xville]

Just like Leftists "protesting" during a Supreme Court Senate hearing and trying to intimidate elected officials.

Dude just stop. Stop trying to " well the other side did this" rationalize abhorrent behavior. This is effing ridiculous that there are protestors inside the Capitol building, doesnt matter what side they are on.

[paulxu]

Words have consequences. Trumps words have the consequences we are watching.
The Vice President has been taken away, congressmen have gas masks on and are being evacuated.
If we had a real President, and not a bully, he would have never encouraged this, and he would be urging his people to stop.

[XU 23]

Trump has turned on Mike Pence over Twitter. Shocker

[GoMuskies]

Trump has turned on Mike Pence over Twitter. Shocker

Well, Trump was kind of the "burn it all down" candidate. It's all burning.

[XU 23]

Melania is the next person he will turn on. And then probably Baron.

[Caf]

It's been awhile but just wanted to stop by and congratulate you guys on the 350,000 dead Americans and the coup attempt. Special congratulations to MOR. A movement is really just a collection of individuals. They couldn't have done it without people like you! Now get out there and make this attempt a completion!

[xubrew]

Let this be the end of Trump! Seriously! If there was ever a time for the 25th Amendment, it's now. Congress can remove Trump TODAY, and they probably should. It's in no one's best interest for him to stay in power if he is going to continue to use the power of his office to help incite this kind of bullshit.

[paulxu]

Congress and Senate evacuated. Protestors on the floors of both chambers going through the desks/papers.
Sort of looks a lot like a third world dictatorship run amok.

[Caf]

DJT "I am asking for everyone at the U.S. Capitol to remain peaceful. No violence! Remember, WE are the Party of Law & Order – respect the Law and our great men and women in Blue. Thank you!"

This is the part where we find out if the coup is bigger than person who started it.

[GoMuskies]

It's been awhile but just wanted to stop by and congratulate you guys on the 350,000 dead Americans

You should probably go ahead and blame Trump for all Covid deaths throughout the world.

[paulxu]

DJT "I am asking for everyone at the U.S. Capitol to remain peaceful. No violence! Remember, WE are the Party of Law & Order – respect the Law and our great men and women in Blue. Thank you!"

This is the part where we find out if the coup is bigger than person who started it.

He might have asked them to leave the Capitol building...at the very least.

[drudy23]

Idiots.

[boozehound]

Dude just stop. Stop trying to " well the other side did this" rationalize abhorrent behavior. This is effing ridiculous that there are protestors inside the Capitol building, doesnt matter what side they are on.

Yeah. This is not good, and is a marked escalation from anything we have seen to date. Looks like now we have a report of someone being shot in the US Capital building. Four years ago this would have been unthinkable, not it's not surprising. Life comes at you fast.

Can we dispel with the fiction that this is anything but at attempted coup at this point?


It's been awhile but just wanted to stop by and congratulate you guys on the 350,000 dead Americans and the coup attempt. Special congratulations to MOR. A movement is really just a collection of individuals. They couldn't have done it without people like you! Now get out there and make this attempt a completion!

This is one of the most brutal burns I have seen in a long time. Damn.

[Smails]

Jesus christ..talk about leaving a vapor trail on your way out. What a bunch of morons. I've always wondered what it would be like to live in an unstable country.

[paulxu]

It occurs to me that Trump got what he wanted...stopping the electoral votes to be counted to certify the election.
Ask McConnell to stop it...he gives speech saying nation has spoken.
Ask Pence to stop it...he sends letter saying doesn't have this authority and will follow the constitution
Ask Cruz to object...everyone realizes this won't work.

Well, OK then. I'll just send my supporters up to Congress, take over the building, send our elected representatives onto evacuation, ....and that'll keep them from certifying the election results. Brilliant!

[bjf123]

I’ll say the same thing I said about the protesters in Seattle and Portland. Lock them all up. Criminal activity is criminal activity regardless of political leanings.


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[boozehound]

This is really the only way this whole Trump thing could have ended, the more you think about it. But still, I'm a little shocked.

[noteggs]

This is batshit crazy! Picked the wrong time to start watching Designated Survivor. Actually recommend

[94GRAD]

This is batshit crazy! Picked the wrong time to start watching Designated Survivor. Actually recommend

Before I say anything, how many episodes are you in?

[noteggs]

Before I say anything, how many episodes are you in?

Half way through season 2

[xavierj]

I am so done with politics and politicians, be it democrat or republican. We have zero leadership throughout. Trump got elected because how screwed up the government already was and because people were tired of politicians screwing us. We need a new party and get rid of all these clowns. We let cities burn for months and now we have this. Ridiculous and disgusting.

[Caf]

You should probably go ahead and blame Trump for all Covid deaths throughout the world.

I didn't blame Trump


It's been awhile but just wanted to stop by and congratulate you guys on the 350,000 dead Americans and the coup attempt. Special congratulations to MOR. A movement is really just a collection of individuals. They couldn't have done it without people like you! Now get out there and make this attempt a completion!

[94GRAD]

Half way through season 2

There will be a point sooner rather than later that you will no longer be able to suspend disbelief.

[xubrew]

I’ll say the same thing I said about the protesters in Seattle and Portland. Lock them all up. Criminal activity is criminal activity regardless of political leanings.


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Yes, I think federal prison is where anyone belongs who storms the capital and disrupts the business of our elected officials.

[GoMuskies]

I didn't blame Trump

Fair enough. Congratulations to you as well.

[paulxu]

Maybe more successful than I thought to stop the count:


Being evacuated and Capitol Police say the Senate won’t be in session in this building today or anytime soon – bc the building is “trashed.”

I wonder if any of the people who were raising objections to the electoral votes, will re-think after this.

[boozehound]

Maybe more successful than I thought to stop the count:



I wonder if any of the people who were raising objections to the electoral votes, will re-think after this.

My guess is no, but maybe I'll be presently surprised.

[Caf]

Fair enough. Congratulations to you as well.

Thanks stranger!

Good luck to the losers on becoming winners! No one should fret about this. We have massive inequality in this country and we need to sort it out. Be well.

“Democracy will never be supplanted by a republic of experts—and that is a very good thing.”

[Strange Brew]

Thanks stranger!

Good luck to the losers on becoming winners! No one should fret about this. We have massive inequality in this country and we need to sort it out. Be well.

“Democracy will never be supplanted by a republic of experts—and that is a very good thing.”

Haha, a Piketty quote. Perfect, talk about irony.

[paulxu]

The National Association of Manufacturers thinks Pence should invoke the 25th amendment and remove Trump from office:

https://twitter.com/rebeccaballhaus/status/1346928521667600384/photo/1

[xubrew]

The National Association of Manufacturers thinks Pence should invoke the 25th amendment and remove Trump from office:

https://twitter.com/rebeccaballhaus/status/1346928521667600384/photo/1

I agree with them.

[bobbiemcgee]

The National Association of Manufacturers thinks Pence should invoke the 25th amendment and remove Trump from office:

https://twitter.com/rebeccaballhaus/status/1346928521667600384/photo/1

yep. he's insane. Law and Order pres., my ass. he should resign immediately.

[bobbiemcgee]

This is batshit crazy! Picked the wrong time to start watching Designated Survivor.

You're watching the real thing.

[paulxu]

One hundred and fifty-five years later, in the halls of the Nation's Capitol:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ErFE3MYXcAILjj0?format=jpg&name=900x900

[Xville]

Thanks stranger!

Good luck to the losers on becoming winners! No one should fret about this. We have massive inequality in this country and we need to sort it out. Be well.

“Democracy will never be supplanted by a republic of experts—and that is a very good thing.”

Eff that...the losers are losers because they are either too lazy or have a victims mentality..there is opportunity beyond opportunity in this country, you just have to ta know work for it.

[GoMuskies]

25th makes sense. Trump has taught us a valuable lesson, something that we really should have known all along: the lame duck period following the election is too long!

[Strange Brew]

Nice of Paul to post the former battle flag of his home state.

[Masterofreality]

Dude just stop. Stop trying to " well the other side did this" rationalize abhorrent behavior. This is effing ridiculous that there are protestors inside the Capitol building, doesnt matter what side they are on.

I categorically condemn violence of any type. I do not condemn people protesting peacefully about anything.
I had the same exact opinion about protests last summer and fall whether they be by any group. But I also condemned those groups when they did violent destructive acts. Consistency counts.
If you did Not condemn violent riots by BLM or Antifa earlier this year, while standing for folks protesting peacefully, then you have no standing here. This is not “whataboutism”. This is standing for what is right and legal no matter what the cause and whether you agree with it or not.
There is no rationalization here. The protesters had valid frustrations. They saw media treat Antifa rioters as “Peaceful”. They saw BLM harass diners and destroy property and receive millions of dollars while their businesses were locked up, burned and destroyed. They saw women break into the halls of Congress to protest Bret Kavanaugh, harass Republican leaders and Dem Reps welcome them. If you don’t think that frustration was part and parcel of this scene today, you aren’t seeing the whole picture.
NO violence is acceptable, but if there were any “No Justice No Peace” signs carried around today, there certainly were in riots across the US earlier this year from others on the left.
DUDE!!!

[chico]

All I know is this is what happens when you let Dayton fans road trip after being locked down for 9 months.

[Xville]

I categorically condemn violence of any type. I do not condemn people protesting peacefully about anything.
I had the same exact opinion about protests last summer and fall whether they be by any group. But I also condemned those groups when they did violent destructive acts. Consistency counts.
If you did Not condemn violent riots by BLM or Antifa earlier this year, while standing for folks protesting peacefully, then you have no standing here. This is not “whataboutism”. This is standing for what is right and legal no matter what the cause and whether you agree with it or not.
There is no rationalization here. The protesters had valid frustrations. They saw media treat Antifa rioters as “Peaceful”. They saw BLM harass diners and destroy property and receive millions of dollars while their businesses were locked up, burned and destroyed. They saw women break into the halls of Congress to protest Bret Kavanaugh, harass Republican leaders and Dem Reps welcome them. If you don’t think that frustration was part and parcel of this scene today, you aren’t seeing the whole picture.
NO violence is acceptable, but if there were any “No Justice No Peace” signs carried around today, there certainly were in riots across the US earlier this year from others on the left.
DUDE!!!

Blah blah blah....there's no need to respond with the ridiculousness of what happened today with " well they did this" period. It is finger pointing and stupid. There is zero justification for what happened today none period and dont care why they did it, it is stupid, childish, and they should all be shot for all I care.

You're part of the problem that say " yeah but this side did this" just like the fucktards on the left said about the right in response to portland, blm dumb fucks etc. All that bulkshit needs to stop and we need to rally against all this stupid behavior when it happens, period

[xuwillie]

And there is no justification what happened the past year with BLM, antifa, and impeachment. You think 50% of the country is going to just sit back and be ok with it? None of its right

[Xville]

And there is no justification what happened the past year with BLM, antifa, and impeachment. You think 50% of the country is going to just sit back and be ok with it? None of its right

No none of it is right, but if we continue this cycle of "yeah but this side " did this then this cycle of stupidness is never going to stop. Shit needs to end, period. And yeah 50% of the country is sitting back because they arent extreme fucking idiots...this is the 1% extreme morons causing all this division

[bobbiemcgee]

And there is no justification what happened the past year with BLM, antifa, and impeachment.

This ain't no rife in Portland. It was an attempted coup on the government of the the United States. Lady was murdered inside the Capitol for chrissakes.

[noteggs]

There will be a point sooner rather than later that you will no longer be able to suspend disbelief.

Very intrigued! Thanks for the heads up.

[Xville]

This ain't no rife in Portland. It was an attempted coup on the government of the the United States. Lady was murdered inside the Capitol for chrissakes.

This is the kind of stupid shit I'm talking about...let's stop comparing which extreme side is dumber

[Strange Brew]

This is the kind of stupid shit I'm talking about...let's stop comparing which extreme side is dumber

We should probably close this thread then....:)

[Caf]

Haha, a Piketty quote. Perfect, talk about irony.

You have out-pretentious'ed posting a Piketty quote. Bravo to you. Hoping to see you debate your old econ professor on macro again sometime soon.

[Caf]

This is the kind of stupid shit I'm talking about...let's stop comparing which extreme side is dumber

The extreme sides are the same side. Disenfranchised Americans who have been disregarded by their representatives.

[Xville]

The extreme sides are the same side. Disenfranchised Americans who have been disregarded by their representatives.

Wrong...they are whiny ignorant psychos who blame all their problems on everyone else except the real problem, which is them

[Caf]

Wrong...they are whiny ignorant psychos who blame all their problems on everyone else except the real problem, which is them

At some point whether or not their view is true becomes irrelevant. I would say when people take over government buildings would be one of those points.

[Strange Brew]

You have out-pretentious'ed posting a Piketty quote. Bravo to you. Hoping to see you debate your old econ professor on macro again sometime soon.

Pretentious? I’m not the one who quoted the buffoon.

[Strange Brew]

At some point whether or not their view is true becomes irrelevant. I would say when people take over government buildings would be one of those points.

Agree. Is it only a problem for you when people with whom you diagram do it. Federal building in the PNW? The WI Capital?

[Muskie in dayton]

At some point whether or not their view is true becomes irrelevant. I would say when people take over government buildings would be one of those points.
How about now?
https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/2018/08/protesters_storm_portland_city.html

[bobbiemcgee]

yep, taking over a little city hall same as storming the US Senate representing 330 million people. Get a clue.

[Strange Brew]

yep, taking over a little city hall same as storming the US Senate representing 330 million people. Get a clue.

How many people live in WI?

[bobbiemcgee]

2%

[Strange Brew]

2%

NM then. You’re post makes total logical sense now....

[Muskie in dayton]

yep, taking over a little city hall same as storming the US Senate representing 330 million people. Get a clue.
Did I say it was the same? Let me look at my post. No, no I didn’t. What were you saying about a clue?

[Caf]

How about now?
https://www.oregonlive.com/portland/2018/08/protesters_storm_portland_city.html

Yes. Sorry if you thought that would be hard for me to say.

[noteggs]

Glad to have you back CAF! Missed your insight, wit and posts. Now back to the game.

[Xville]

At some point whether or not their view is true becomes irrelevant. I would say when people take over government buildings would be one of those points.

I was just refuting your ridiculous stance

[bjf123]

No none of it is right, but if we continue this cycle of "yeah but this side " did this then this cycle of stupidness is never going to stop. Shit needs to end, period. And yeah 50% of the country is sitting back because they arent extreme fucking idiots...this is the 1% extreme morons causing all this division

Politics today has become nothing but “yeah but this side”. The extremes of both sides are fucking nuts. The top people in both political parties only care about power and being re-elected, the good of the people be damned. Both sides are colossally hypocritical, turning a blind eye to what their side does while lambasting the side doing the same thing.


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[paulxu]

No one (I don't think) supports violence by any group; BLM, Proud Boys, Antifa, Boogaloo, etc.

If you don't understand that it's different when the president of our country encourages violence, calls the press the enemy of the people, and even today seems convinced there was a stolen election...then no one can help you.

[Caf]

I was just refuting your ridiculous stance

What is it you think you refuted? Are there not a massive number of disenfranchised people? Have their elected officials succeeded in promoting their interests?

[xavierj]

Not sure how old everyone is on here, but I think the problem with our country right now is that people are raised not to fail and get everything they want. Everyone gets a trophy and don’t hurt anyone’s feelings. Only makes sense that now when you don’t get what you want, you cry, blame others, burn cities and take over government buildings. Good times. Our country is in trouble.

[Muskie in dayton]

yep, taking over a little city hall same as storming the US Senate representing 330 million people. Get a clue.
How about now?
https://www.commondreams.org/news/2018/10/04/mass-arrests-thousands-descend-senate-office-building-demanding-lawmakers-reject

[STL_XUfan]

Not sure how old everyone is on here, but I think the problem with our country right now is that people are raised not to fail and get everything they want. Everyone gets a trophy and don’t hurt anyone’s feelings. Only makes sense that now when you don’t get what you want, you cry, blame others, burn cities and take over government buildings. Good times. Our country is in trouble.

I love this talking point, because it is the ultimate self own. Who the hell do you think gave that generation the participation trophies and encouraged that environment you now loathe? I don’t think the younger generation gave it to themselves.

[xavierj]

I love this talking point, because it is the ultimate self own. Who the hell do you think gave that generation the participation trophies and encouraged that environment you now loathe? I don’t think the younger generation gave it to themselves.

You are exactly right. It’s not the youth of today’s fault it’s the people who made decisions that everyone should be protected and babied. I don’t know where it came from but it’s a big part of the problem. Maybe a lot of it came when both parents started working and parents started feeling sorry for their kids. But yes it’s my generation that created the wussification of America. Never agreed with it.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Not sure how old everyone is on here, but I think the problem with our country right now is that people are raised not to fail and get everything they want. Everyone gets a trophy and don’t hurt anyone’s feelings. Only makes sense that now when you don’t get what you want, you cry, blame others, burn cities and take over government buildings. Good times. Our country is in trouble.

How old do you have to be? How old is Trump? Is that the number? Trump years old for this to apply?

[Caf]

Not sure how old everyone is on here, but I think the problem with our country right now is that people are raised not to fail and get everything they want. Everyone gets a trophy and don’t hurt anyone’s feelings. Only makes sense that now when you don’t get what you want, you cry, blame others, burn cities and take over government buildings. Good times. Our country is in trouble.

Hmm really interesting theory. Very nuanced. I'm going to go with the federal government using its financial power to support risk assets instead of people, the decimation of the ability to earn a living through elitist trade agreements and the decimation of Unions, decades of a Democratic party pushing elitist economic policy while offering inadequate handouts, decades of the GOP making insincere populist promises only to go on to hold minorities and the poorest among us in contempt.

I would really recommend anyone unsure of what's going on here to read "The People, No" by Thomas Frank. It's a history of anti-populism. The BLM crowd is not going anywhere. The MAGA crowd is not going anywhere. They are not just going to accept what they view as an unjust lot in life. Our government is going to start governing for the people or this is just the beginning. The takeaway today cannot be that a line was crossed and now we just need to wag our finger in the face of these people and beef up Congressional security. Lines have been being crossed for years, there are plenty more to be crossed.

[Muskie in dayton]

Yes. Sorry if you thought that would be hard for me to say.
Good, we’re on the same side. Lock them all up, I say. This is hard for Leftists to say, since they have been justifying for this type of crap (and worse) for the last 7 months. They’ll split every hair to condemn MAGA and condone Antifa for the same disgusting behavior.

[paulxu]

Good lord, he's such a baby. He can't constitutionally fire Pence, so he decides to ban Pence's chief of staff from the White House.

[Mrs. Garrett]

Not sure how old everyone is on here, but I think the problem with our country right now is that people are raised not to fail and get everything they want. Everyone gets a trophy and don’t hurt anyone’s feelings. Only makes sense that now when you don’t get what you want, you cry, blame others, burn cities and take over government buildings. Good times. Our country is in trouble.

but this is the attitude of a 75 year old President. Everyone likes to blame the younger generation, but this was incited by him.

I don't disagree that we coddle our youth now a days, but the attitude you mention above came directly from someone who is supposed to be anti the trophy generation.

[paulxu]

The President of the United States has yet to condemn the unlawful actions of the people who stormed our nation's Capitol.

[cutterX]

Watching the surreal events unfold yesterday all I kept thinking of was Nicholson's line from A Few Good Men. " All you did was weaken a country today"
Because really that's what happened.

[Mrs. Garrett]

Watching the surreal events unfold yesterday all I kept thinking of was Nicholson's line from A Few Good Men. " All you did was weaken a country today"
Because really that's what happened.

The Capitol police, basically stepped aside and let the domestic terrorists in. I saw video of an officer taking a selfie with some of them. Doesn't give me a lot of faith.

[boozehound]

but this is the attitude of a 75 year old President. Everyone likes to blame the younger generation, but this was incited by him.

I don't disagree that we coddle our youth now a days, but the attitude you mention above came directly from someone who is supposed to be anti the trophy generation.

I think that the baby boomers are a real shit generation. Their parents' generation won WW2 and basically handed them all good paying jobs on a silver platter during a period of unprecedented growth in the United States. WW2 devastated the productive capacity of the world, and created a huge need for rebuilding. The US was in a great position to take advantage of that because they were essentially the only developed Nation (at the time) that hadn't had to fight on their soil. We got 30 years of insane benefit from that. They walked right out of high school into factory jobs with great benefits and pensions. They worked those jobs for 30 years and retired with great pensions and retiree benefits. Those who went to college similarly presided over unprecedented prosperity. They all then assumed that it was just because they were so awesome, and not at all lucky.

What they also did was preside over a massive wealth transfer from workers to corporations. Elimination of pensions. Benefit reductions. It helped the investment portfolios, but certainly didn't help the next generation of workers. They allowed China to rise to power unchecked. That was great for people who had amassed some wealth - they got to buy stuff cheaper with the money they had accumulated.

They take full credit for the prosperity that they were largely gifted from their parents, but no blame for what they did with it our how they raised their children.

Obviously there is plenty wrong with millenials etc, but I think that the boomers deserve a healthy portion of blame for the predicament we are all in.

[boozehound]

The President of the United States has yet to condemn the unlawful actions of the people who stormed our nation's Capitol.

That's the big difference here.

People who are likening this to some assholes trashing buildings in Portland can fuck right off. Then they can fuck off again. Then a 3rd time.

Domestic terrorists stormed the Capitol building while legislation was in session confirming the election results. They did it because apparently millions of people are so incredibly stupid that they believe our sitting President and his sycophants claims that the election was somehow rigged, despite the fact that so far the only real evidence presented are allegations and the fact that 'lots of people believe the election was stolen'. Gee, I wonder how they got that idea?

So they stormed the Capitol. Not the state Capitol. The Nation's Capitol. The President then gave a speech telling them he 'loved them' but to go home. No condemnation. This isn't a political party, it's a cult.

If people can't see that this is on a very different level, I'm sorry but I just can't have any respect for their intellect or ability to process information.

[Xville]

I think that the baby boomers are a real shit generation. Their parents' generation won WW2 and basically handed them all good paying jobs on a silver platter during a period of unprecedented growth in the United States. WW2 devastated the productive capacity of the world, and created a huge need for rebuilding. The US was in a great position to take advantage of that because they were essentially the only developed Nation (at the time) that hadn't had to fight on their soil. We got 30 years of insane benefit from that. They walked right out of high school into factory jobs with great benefits and pensions. They worked those jobs for 30 years and retired with great pensions and retiree benefits. Those who went to college similarly presided over unprecedented prosperity. They all then assumed that it was just because they were so awesome, and not at all lucky.

What they also did was preside over a massive wealth transfer from workers to corporations. Elimination of pensions. Benefit reductions. It helped the investment portfolios, but certainly didn't help the next generation of workers. They allowed China to rise to power unchecked. That was great for people who had amassed some wealth - they got to buy stuff cheaper with the money they had accumulated.

They take full credit for the prosperity that they were largely gifted from their parents, but no blame for what they did with it our how they raised their children.

Obviously there is plenty wrong with millenials etc, but I think that the boomers deserve a healthy portion of blame for the predicament we are all in.

Kinda with you here, and they primarily raised the millenial generation so they get all of that blame.

[GoMuskies]

People who are likening this to some assholes trashing buildings in Portland can fuck right off. Then they can fuck off again. Then a 3rd time.


This was definitely a whole different level. But people who never said a word about the violence last year (there are pictures from last summer of DC basically on fire) and who are now apoplectic over what happened yesterday can also fuck right off.

[Xville]

And the people who are saying just imagine if they were black, can also fuck right off. I'm fucking tired of everyone just trying to put gasoline on a fire shit show every time something happens recently. Everyone that has some crazy agenda, has to post something on social media and bring it back to them, because we live in a what about me society

[boozehound]

This was definitely a whole different level. But people who never said a word about the violence last year (there are pictures from last summer of DC basically on fire) and who are now apoplectic over what happened yesterday can also fuck right off.

Fair, but I'd argue that right now is the time for an unequivocal condemnation of what we just saw. That message gets softened when you feel the need to look backward at what someone else did or said that was hypocritical. There's time for that later, but right now I think we should be united in our stance against what happened yesterday.

It gets softened a lot when the sitting President, who incited this, doesn't condemn it. Then his cult-worshippers follow his lead.

[noteggs]

The takeaway today cannot be that a line was crossed and now we just need to wag our finger in the face of these people and beef up Congressional security. Lines have been being crossed for years, there are plenty more to be crossed.

This is so true and yet so sad at the same time. Unfortunately, neither side will admit to this or accept their contribution to the problem. Only then things can improve.

[Masterofreality]

This was definitely a whole different level. But people who never said a word about the violence last year (there are pictures from last summer of DC basically on fire) and who are now apoplectic over what happened yesterday can also fuck right off.

Yup. There are people from “that side” yesterday who are being ignored by the media and powers that be who were frustrated and lashed out.
Not excusing their behavior in any way, however. The violence was uncalled for ridiculous and stupid and should be condemned, but all the ones who stayed silent (and in some cases celebrated) over the riots resulting from Criminals like Jakob Blake’s behavior last summer have no standing here.

[GoMuskies]

100% on board with unequivocal condemnation. I'm even pro-25th amendment to save us 13 days of Trump at this point.

Just sick of seeing people (mostly online, but also family) who were at least silently supportive of violent protest this summer acting like they're the good guys because of yesterday. Just because Trump and those assholes suck doesn't give different assholes their wings.

[paulxu]

And the people who are saying just imagine if they were black, can also fuck right off. I'm fucking tired of everyone just trying to put gasoline on a fire shit show every time something happens recently.

I agree people shouldn't put gasoline on the fire. But I'm also curious about something. Do you find it any different that the president authorized the DC National Guard to clear peaceful protesters so he could walk to the church for the bible-holding photo op...and the fact that he wouldn't authorize it yesterday as our Capitol was breached and they had to get Pence to do it (president later took credit) ? Things like that add to the narrative.

[Xville]

I agree people shouldn't put gasoline on the fire. But I'm also curious about something. Do you find it any different that the president authorized the DC National Guard to clear peaceful protesters so he could walk to the church for the bible-holding photo op...and the fact that he wouldn't authorize it yesterday as our Capitol was breached and they had to get Pence to do it (president later took credit) ? Things like that add to the narrative.

Dont care and it doesnt matter at this point. You just love to finger point.

[Masterofreality]

100% on board with unequivocal condemnation. I'm even pro-25th amendment to save us 13 days of Trump at this point.

Just sick of seeing people (mostly online, but also family) who were at least silently supportive of violent protest this summer acting like they're the good guys because of yesterday. Just because Trump and those assholes suck doesn't give different assholes their wings.

1000%

[Smails]

If you thought what happened yesterday was okay or justified, then you're an asshole

If you thought what went on in our cities this year was okay or justified, then you're an asshole

And I swear to god if if read the word 'enabled' one more time on social media I might puke. If my kids can take one thing away from the 10,000 life lessons I've tried to teach them it will be the concept of personal responsibility.

You are not a robot, you control your actions, inaction, and destiny. Your successes and failures are a direct result of the decisions you make. It's not Sean Hannity's fault if you decide to riot, enter a federal building and get yourself shot. It's not the police's fault if you decide to riot over what you perceive as injustice and you get yourself shot. This country is fucked 3 ways toward the weekend.

[Xville]

If you thought what happened yesterday was okay or justified, then you're an asshole

If you thought what went on in our cities this year was okay or justified, then you're an asshole

And I swear to god if if read the word 'enabled' one more time on social media I might puke. If my kids can take one thing away from the 10,000 life lessons I've tried to teach them it will be the concept of personal responsibility.

You are not a robot, you control your actions, inaction, and destiny. Your successes and failures are a direct result of the decisions you make. It's not Sean Hannity's fault if you decide to riot, enter a federal building and get yourself shot. It's not the police's fault if you decide to riot over what you perceive as injustice and you get yourself shot. This country is fucked 3 ways toward the weekend.

Excellent post. Personal responsibility is lost in our society...everything is everyone else's fault, or outside influences fault. I tell my kids every day, that actions have consequences and it is no one else's fault than their own if they get in trouble or don't get something. I don't know what other people are teaching their kids, but that type of thought process seems lost on millions of people in this country.

[boozehound]

I do think that the very direct role that the President played in this whole thing shouldn't get lost in the shuffle though.

This wasn't just a riot. The President of the United States attempted to orchestrate a coup. He lost the election and then attempted to have it overturned. Repeatedly and brazenly. During all this he kept telling his supporters, without credible evidence, that the election was 'stolen'. For the most part, only the truly stupid believed him, but a lot of other people went along with it. Then it escalated. A few more people spoke out, but mostly people went along with it.

I'm all for personal responsibility for the individuals directly involved, but let's not kid ourselves that this was 100% incited by the sitting President and enabled (sorry smails) by a whole lot of people who sat quietly and just kind of hoped it would go away. A lot of people listen to the President. It's why who the President is, and what he says, matters.

Do we honestly think this would have happened if he is just conceded the election?

There should be universal support to put him on trial for treason. There should be serious consequences for the people involved, but there should be even more serious consequences for the person at the top. When you are the leader, you are held to a higher standard of conduct because people look to you for cues on how to act. Anybody who has led a large organization knows that.

[Xville]

I do think that the very direct role that the President played in this whole thing shouldn't get lost in the shuffle though.

This wasn't just a riot. The President of the United States attempted to orchestrate a coup. He lost the election and then attempted to have it overturned. Repeatedly and brazenly. During all this he kept telling his supporters, without credible evidence, that the election was 'stolen'. For the most part, only the truly stupid believed him, but a lot of other people went along with it. Then it escalated. A few more people spoke out, but mostly people went along with it.

I'm all for personal responsibility for the individuals directly involved, but let's not kid ourselves that this was 100% incited by the sitting President and enabled (sorry smails) by a whole lot of people who sat quietly and just kind of hoped it would go away. A lot of people listen to the President. It's why who the President is, and what he says, matters.

Do we honestly think this would have happened if he is just conceded the election?

There should be universal support to put him on trial for treason. There should be serious consequences for the people involved, but there should be even more serious consequences for the person at the top. When you are the leader, you are held to a higher standard of conduct because people look to you for cues on how to act. Anybody who has led a large organization knows that.

that's all well and good but Trump never said, hey go storm the capitol building, and he certainly didn't hold people at gunpoint. Serious consequences for him? Meh. He didn't do anything to quell things, but that's not a crime. With that said, I'm all for the 25th amendment and just removing him at this point, because it doesn't do the country as a whole any good for him to be there any longer.

[boozehound]

That's a super specific low bar you are using. So as long as the President doesn't explicitly tell people to commit acts of violence?

What about the last two months of trying to overthrow the results of the election, including harassing state and local officials to 'find' votes for him?

[bobbiemcgee]

I think that the baby boomers are a real shit generation. Their parents' generation won WW2 and basically handed them all good paying jobs on a silver platter during a period of unprecedented growth in the United States. WW2 devastated the productive capacity of the world, and created a huge need for rebuilding. The US was in a great position to take advantage of that because they were essentially the only developed Nation (at the time) that hadn't had to fight on their soil. We got 30 years of insane benefit from that. They walked right out of high school into factory jobs with great benefits and pensions. They worked those jobs for 30 years and retired with great pensions and retiree benefits. Those who went to college similarly presided over unprecedented prosperity. They all then assumed that it was just because they were so awesome, and not at all lucky.

What they also did was preside over a massive wealth transfer from workers to corporations. Elimination of pensions. Benefit reductions. It helped the investment portfolios, but certainly didn't help the next generation of workers. They allowed China to rise to power unchecked. That was great for people who had amassed some wealth - they got to buy stuff cheaper with the money they had accumulated.

They take full credit for the prosperity that they were largely gifted from their parents, but no blame for what they did with it our how they raised their children.

Obviously there is plenty wrong with millenials etc, but I think that the boomers deserve a healthy portion of blame for the predicament we are all in.

Total BULLSHIT! Two of my roommates and many classmates died in Vietnam. They're dead 50 yrs. Never got to realize their potential like the millenial assholes. We spent our entire 4 years at X with the draft hanging over us and then eventually had to join the military when we finished (those without invented bone spurs). We tried to stay employed thru the recessions of 69-70, 73-75, 80-82, 90-91, 01 and the big one 07-09. I'm sure I am not the only one to lose a job during these recessions and had to scramble to keep going for my family. Typical of a bunch of pussies would never had to put on a uniform and had everything given to them by Mommy and Daddy. Suck it up!!! You got it so easy. Go back and play with your GI Joe and Barbie dolls.
Maybe we should bring back the draft for your kids so they can go get blown up somewhere. I'm sure you would be for that.

[Smails]

I do think that the very direct role that the President played in this whole thing shouldn't get lost in the shuffle though.



There should be universal support to put him on trial for treason.

What about the lawmakers who went on record last night and voted to have the election overturned...should they be put on trial as well? They actually did something tangible to try to overturn the election. No rhetoric, but an actual recorded vote. Should they go to the gallows as well?

[Smails]

Total BULLSHIT! Two of my roommates and many classmates died in Vietnam. They're dead 50 yrs. Never got to realize their potential like the millenial assholes. We spent our entire 4 years at X with the draft hanging over us and then eventually had to join the military when we finished (those without invented bone spurs). We tried to stay employed thru the recessions of 69-70, 73-75, 80-82, 90-91, 01 and the big one 07-09. I'm sure I am not the only one to lose a job during these recessions and had to scramble to keep going for my family. Typical of a bunch of pussies would never had to put on a uniform and had everything given to them by Mommy and Daddy. Suck it up!!! You got it so easy. Go back and play with your GI Joe and Barbie dolls.
Maybe we should bring back the draft for your kids so they can go get blown up somewhere. I'm sure you would be for that.

This is one of the most brutal burns I have seen in a long time. Damn. (couldn't resist :))

[paulxu]

What about the lawmakers who went on record last night and voted to have the election overturned...should they be put on trial as well? They actually did something tangible to try to overturn the election. No rhetoric, but an actual recorded vote. Should they go to the gallows as well?

They had a statutory right to bring objections.
They didn't try to "overturn the election" merely objected to some states' procedures.
That's a far cry from the chief law enforcement officer telling his supporters the winner is illegitimate and urging them to march on the Capitol.

50 years from now, children will read about yesterday in their history books. It will be recorded as a day that a president urged his followers to go to the Capitol and stop an election "steal" (in his mind) and something he convinced them of.
A first in American history...and hopefully the last.

[Masterofreality]

Total BULLSHIT! Two of my roommates and many classmates died in Vietnam. They're dead 50 yrs. Never got to realize their potential like the millenial assholes. We spent our entire 4 years at X with the draft hanging over us and then eventually had to join the military when we finished (those without invented bone spurs). We tried to stay employed thru the recessions of 69-70, 73-75, 80-82, 90-91, 01 and the big one 07-09. I'm sure I am not the only one to lose a job during these recessions and had to scramble to keep going for my family. Typical of a bunch of pussies would never had to put on a uniform and had everything given to them by Mommy and Daddy. Suck it up!!! You got it so easy. Go back and play with your GI Joe and Barbie dolls.
Maybe we should bring back the draft for your kids so they can go get blown up somewhere. I'm sure you would be for that.

On this we agree Bobbie. That is a fucked up take Booze.
We were the generation that demonstrated and caused the passage of the Civil Rights Act plus demonstrated in the streets for real change.
We were the generation that had the smarts to come up with technology that put a man on the moon, gave us computers and many of the products that make life easier today.
We were the generation that actually defeated Russian dominance over much of Europe via smarts not war.
We were the generation that were cut from teams, that had to earn everything we got, that worked our asses off to give the next generation a better life.
Now all the entitled cool kids with their participation trophies want to dump on their predecessors. Screw that.

[paulxu]

Well said Bobbie.

[Xville]

On this we agree Bobbie. That is a fucked up take Booze.
We were the generation that demonstrated and caused the passage of the Civil Rights Act plus demonstrated in the streets for real change.
We were the generation that had the smarts to come up with technology that put a man on the moon, gave us computers and many of the products that make life easier today.
We were the generation that actually defeated Russian dominance over much of Europe via smarts not war.
We were the generation that were cut from teams, that had to earn everything we got, that worked our asses off to give the next generation a better life.
Now all the entitled cool kids with their participation trophies want to dump on their predecessors. Screw that.

You are the generation that raised those kids with their participation trophies, that was booze's point

[Strange Brew]

The Capitol police, basically stepped aside and let the domestic terrorists in. I saw video of an officer taking a selfie with some of them. Doesn't give me a lot of faith.

Not really. They shot and killed an unarmed AF veteran. What’s her name?

[Caf]

This generational discussion is stupid. There are plenty of these people in each generation.

[paulxu]

That was sad that anyone lost their life. Her name was Ashli Babbitt.


Ashli Babbitt was a decorated Air Force veteran addicted to Fox News, InfoWars, and QAnon. She was killed while rioting at the Capitol yesterday. What did she get for her service to Q? Fellow travelers are calling her death a "false flag," of course.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/woman-killed-capitol-was-trump-supporter-who-embraced-conspiracy-theories-n1253285

[noteggs]

Fair, but I'd argue that right now is the time for an unequivocal condemnation of what we just saw. That message gets softened when you feel the need to look backward at what someone else did or said that was hypocritical. There's time for that later, but right now I think we should be united in our stance against what happened yesterday.

It gets softened a lot when the sitting President, who incited this, doesn't condemn it. Then his cult-worshippers follow his lead.

Correct, it is time for an unequivocal condemnation. Sounds like we are united on this one from what I’ve read. However, if you wait to long to see if this type of behavior has occurred before, the sense of urgency to fix it gets lost. Or why in the hell didn’t we learn something from the last time this happened.

As for MID’s link, protesters stormed the Capital during the Kavanaugh hearing. Some even confronted a GOP Senator in an elevator so he would vote to tie in a FBI investigation. Also, you had Kamala Harris address the protesters that day in front of Supreme Court building, “we will not be bullied” and Blumenthal saying, “I truly appreciate all of you being here” and “It means a lot and inspires us.” Obviously not a call for violence, but does add fuel to the fire and not exactly a condemnation either.

Those protests too should’ve been unequivocally condemned as well and held our leaders accountable for their words. Wrong is wrong no matter what side you stand on. Does it mean this should soften Trump’s or the protesters abhorrent behavior? Not in the least!

[boozehound]

You are the generation that raised those kids with their participation trophies, that was booze's point

Exactly. Thank you. And in the several posts from (presumably) our Elder Statesmen here I didn't see anyone accept a shred of responsibility for the generation that their generation created. They act like Aliens abducted their kids and made them soft.

I expected strong responses to that post, because I was essentially telling a generation that has convinced themselves that they are the greatest thing ever while their kids are basically entitled monsters, that they should consider the world they were born into vs. the one that they created for their children.

It's not that black and white. It never is.

I'm glad that I was able to bring Bobbie and MOR together on something though. Maybe our bridge to unity is all just complaining about what a bunch of losers are kids are all day long?

[bobbiemcgee]

You are the generation that raised those kids with their participation trophies, that was booze's point

Sorry, that was not his point. My kids never got a participation trophy, we didn't even know what that was. Never heard the term until the 90's or later. At best, we gave out team pictures and pins. We used LL uniforms that were passed down from the other teams for years. And why belittle someone who busted their ass for thirty years in a plant or in front of a blast furnace? Did you have bullets whizzing over your head at anytime in your existence or at your cush job? Don't think so. I worked at the Fisher Body plant in school in temps over a 100 degrees. No a/c back in the day. A real cake walk. I provided a great education for my kids at no small expense and it paid off in spades. That's was what I was supposed to do. No they were not spoiled brats. They were both working p/t at 16 and all thru college just like me. They both developed a great work ethic. If they wanted something, it was understood they needed to work for it.

[xavierj]

This got me thinking. If it was that easy to gain access to the Capitol building, why haven’t terrorist just destroyed the place
before. I mean is there any security there. This was pretty funny.

https://mobile.twitter.com/YousefMunayyer/status/1347026407294201863

[boozehound]

Sorry, that was not his point. My kids never got a participation trophy, we didn't even know what that was. Never heard the term until the 90's or later. At best, we gave out team pictures and pins. We used LL uniforms that were passed down from the other teams for years. And why belittle someone who busted their ass for thirty years in a plant or in front of a blast furnace? Did you have bullets whizzing over your head at anytime in your existence or at your cush job? Don't think so. I worked at the Fisher Body plant in school in temps over a 100 degrees. No a/c back in the day. A real cake walk. I provided a great education for my kids at no small expense and it paid off in spades. That's was what I was supposed to do. No they were not spoiled brats. They were both working p/t at 16 and all thru college just like me. They both developed a great work ethic. If they wanted something, it was understood they needed to work for it.

This is perfect. Thank you. You even worked in a version of the 'I used to walk to school in the snow uphill both ways' analogy. Bonus points for the 'my kids are fine, it's the other people's kids' implication.

I'm making a generalization about a group of people for effect, because someone (not you) started in on the whole 'these damn kids are ruining America' trope.

You (and several others) took that as an immediate personal assault for some reason.

[bobbiemcgee]

Probably because you made it personal.

[Strange Brew]

That was sad that anyone lost their life. Her name was Ashli Babbitt.



https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/woman-killed-capitol-was-trump-supporter-who-embraced-conspiracy-theories-n1253285

Are you saying she deserved it but it’s sad?

[Xville]

Sorry, that was not his point. My kids never got a participation trophy, we didn't even know what that was. Never heard the term until the 90's or later. At best, we gave out team pictures and pins. We used LL uniforms that were passed down from the other teams for years. And why belittle someone who busted their ass for thirty years in a plant or in front of a blast furnace? Did you have bullets whizzing over your head at anytime in your existence or at your cush job? Don't think so. I worked at the Fisher Body plant in school in temps over a 100 degrees. No a/c back in the day. A real cake walk. I provided a great education for my kids at no small expense and it paid off in spades. That's was what I was supposed to do. No they were not spoiled brats. They were both working p/t at 16 and all thru college just like me. They both developed a great work ethic. If they wanted something, it was understood they needed to work for it.

yeah actually that was exactly his point, whether you choose to accept it or not. He also wasn't directly speaking to you but in generalities about a generation, and the proof is in the generation of kids that are now in their 20s and 30s. And don't see how being in the military have anything to do with what he is talking about, that doesn't have anything to do with anything. Again, he isn't speaking about you. He also never insulted people that worked in a factory, he actually mentioned how lucky those people are because they graduated high school, got a factory job, worked thirty years and then got to live off their pension (this is exactly what my father in law did), which basically bankrupted a lot of companies here in the us, because a company shouldn't have to be paying you out for thirty years after you retire from there.

Whether you choose to believe it or not, your generation fucked a lot of things up...but it started with socialist FDR and his bs policies that gave your generation a great life, but it wasn't sustainable and fucked a lot of shit up.

[Caf]

Are you saying she deserved it but it’s sad?

He's saying it's sad that anyone lost their life.

[Strange Brew]

He's saying it's sad that anyone lost their life.

Should we defund the police for shooting an unarmed person?

[paulxu]

You asked her name, and I wanted to let you know who she was.
And it was sad she lost her life.
I certainly don't want to defund the police.
But I'd like to hold the people responsible who put her in that position.
She was a fellow decorated veteran who served multiple tours overseas, and obviously lost her way in the far-right echo chamber.

[Caf]

Should we defund the police for shooting an unarmed person?

No

[Strange Brew]

You asked her name, and I wanted to let you know who she was.
And it was sad she lost her life.
I certainly don't want to defund the police.
But I'd like to hold the people responsible who put her in that position.
She was a fellow decorated veteran who served multiple tours overseas, and obviously lost her way in the far-right echo chamber.

She has the same rights as anyone regardless of her politics. Notice the lack of outrage from those who have lost their way in the left echo chamber.

[Smails]

But I'd like to hold the people responsible who put her in that position.
.

What exactly does this mean?

[Caf]

She has the same rights as anyone regardless of her politics. Notice the lack of outrage from those who have lost their way in the left echo chamber.

She was killed for her politics?

[Xville]

You asked her name, and I wanted to let you know who she was.
And it was sad she lost her life.
I certainly don't want to defund the police.
But I'd like to hold the people responsible who put her in that position.
She was a fellow decorated veteran who served multiple tours overseas, and obviously lost her way in the far-right echo chamber.

no one put a gun to her head and said hey go be a fucking moron and storm the capitol...instead, she dealt with the consequences of being a fucking moron, just like any idiot who does not comply with a cop.

[Strange Brew]

no one put a gun to her head and said hey go be a fucking moron and storm the capitol...instead, she dealt with the consequences of being a fucking moron, just like any idiot who does not comply with a cop.

Sure, agree. Just like many others who have failed to comply with police but we know no one will blame the police this time.

[Strange Brew]

She was killed for her politics?

Not unless you believe anyone entering a Federal building unarmed should be shot.

[bobbiemcgee]

yeah actually that was exactly his point, whether you choose to accept it or not. He also wasn't directly speaking to you but in generalities about a generation, and the proof is in the generation of kids that are now in their 20s and 30s. And don't see how being in the military have anything to do with what he is talking about, that doesn't have anything to do with anything. Again, he isn't speaking about you. He also never insulted people that worked in a factory, he actually mentioned how lucky those people are because they graduated high school, got a factory job, worked thirty years and then got to live off their pension (this is exactly what my father in law did), which basically bankrupted a lot of companies here in the us, because a company shouldn't have to be paying you out for thirty years after you retire from there.

Whether you choose to believe it or not, your generation fucked a lot of things up...but it started with socialist FDR and his bs policies that gave your generation a great life, but it wasn't sustainable and fucked a lot of shit up.

So your father-in-law is a moron for busting his butt for 30 yrs and taking a pension ? I'm sure corporate greed had nothing to do with it. Did you ever ask him how he feels about your stupid stance? Did you serve in the military?

[Strange Brew]

So your father-in-law is a moron for busting his butt for 30 yrs and taking a pension ? I'm sure corporate greed had nothing to do with it. Did you ever ask him how he feels about your stupid stance? Did you serve in the military?

Why did companies start offering pensions and health insurance? Answer: FDR. Period.

[Caf]

Not unless you believe anyone entering a Federal building unarmed should be shot.

Oh so she was killed because she entered the federal building as a Trump supporter.

[Strange Brew]

Oh so she was killed because she entered the federal building as a Trump supporter.

What did she do that warranted lethal force? Did she have a Molotov cocktail? Did she burn a police car? Or a church?

[GoMuskies]

I think both this woman and Jacob Blake earned the lead that came their way.

[Caf]

What did she do that warranted lethal force? Did she have a Molotov cocktail? Did she burn a police car? Or a church?

I don't have the slightest fucking idea. All I know is hundreds of other Trump supporters entered the building and weren't killed and even more people didn't enter the building and were also not killed. If there's guilt to be had, let's hear it and ring em up.

The best account we're ever going to get (https://twitter.com/shaunking/status/1347257804244082695?s=20)

[Strange Brew]

I think both this woman and Jacob Blake earned the lead that came their way.

Not sure either deserved to be shot. But everyone involved should be alive to make their case in court unless they are armed.

[Strange Brew]

I don't have the slightest fucking idea. All I know is hundreds of other Trump supporters entered the building and weren't killed and even more people didn't enter the building and were also not killed. If there's guilt to be had, let's hear it and ring em up.

The best account we're ever going to get (https://twitter.com/shaunking/status/1347257804244082695?s=20)

The best account is from some dude on King’s Twitter feed? You’re just messing with me now right?

[Caf]

Capitol Police ‘didn’t have a choice’ in shooting Ashli Babbitt, GOP lawmaker says (https://nypost.com/2021/01/07/capitol-police-didnt-have-a-choice-in-shooting-pro-trump-rioter-lawmaker-says/?utm_medium=SocialFlow&utm_source=NYPTwitter&utm_campaign=SocialFlow)

Sounds like she got pretty close to some Congressmen.


“They were trying to come through the front door, which is where I was at in the chamber, and in the back they were trying to come through the speaker’s lobby, and that’s problematic when you’re trying to defend two fronts,” Mullin said.

“When they broke the glass in the back, the [Capitol Police] lieutenant that was there — him and I already had multiple conversations prior to this — and he didn’t have a choice at the time.

“The mob was going to come through the door, and there was a lot of [House] members and staff that were in danger at the time,” he added.

[Caf]

The best account is from some dude on King’s Twitter feed? You’re just messing with me now right?

Post better bud. Would love to see it if it's out there.

[GoMuskies]

Not sure either deserved to be shot.

I didn't say they necessarily deserved to be shot. Just that they had earned it. Mostly through their idiocy.

[Strange Brew]

Capitol Police ‘didn’t have a choice’ in shooting Ashli Babbitt, GOP lawmaker says (https://nypost.com/2021/01/07/capitol-police-didnt-have-a-choice-in-shooting-pro-trump-rioter-lawmaker-says/?utm_medium=SocialFlow&utm_source=NYPTwitter&utm_campaign=SocialFlow)

Sounds like she got pretty close to some Congressmen.

So we have the officer’s statement.

He shot her at point blank range. It wasn’t a random shot at people bursting through a door.

Was she a member of AFSOC? Jeez, post better.

[Caf]

So we have the officer’s statement.

He shot her at point blank range. It wasn’t a random shot at people bursting through a door.

Was she a member of AFSOC or? Jeez, post better.

Nah I'm good. You're trying to get people to say someone deserved to die. It's not gonna happen.

[GoMuskies]

Biden goes the race card route. Awesome sign for the next four years.

[Strange Brew]

Nah I'm good. You're trying to get people to say someone deserved to die. It's not gonna happen.

Not at all, pointing out the hypocrisy from you and others.

It’s becoming hard to distinguish the men from the pigs these days.

[Strange Brew]

Biden goes the race card route. Awesome sign for the next four years.

As did PTI. Rambling on about no resistance by the police due to race. Ignoring the police shot someone.

[Caf]

Not at all, pointing out the hypocrisy from you and others.

It’s becoming hard to distinguish the men from the pigs these days.

Damn, beat me again!

[Caf]

As did PTI. Rambling on about no resistance by the police due to race. Ignoring the police shot someone.

Wilbon and Kornheiser? You’re just messing with me now right?

[Strange Brew]

Wilbon and Kornheiser? You’re just messing with me now right?

No worries. Just fast forwarded through it. I like their show.

[xu82]

I just know it’s a bad idea to storm the Capital. I would not have been shot or arrested. I’m NOT saying lethal force was right, but if you want to be an idiot you run that risk.

[Xville]

So your father-in-law is a moron for busting his butt for 30 yrs and taking a pension ? I'm sure corporate greed had nothing to do with it. Did you ever ask him how he feels about your stupid stance? Did you serve in the military?

Never said he was a moron, he was actually a genius.. started working right out of high school and retired at 55 living the good life..you are just putting words in my mouth, and again serving in the military has nothing to do with what we are talking about. You are getting mighty defensive about general statements which I'm not sure where that is coming from. Must be some kind of complex.

And trust me he knows my stance on pensions and my stance on unions of which he was a leader. Still love him.

[Caf]

No surprise on the race bit. Our overlords have us right where they want us, squabbling over issues that are not mutually exclusive.

[bobbiemcgee]

Never said he was a moron, he was actually a genius.. started working right out of high school and retired at 55 living the good life..you are just putting words in my mouth, and again serving in the military has nothing to do with what we are talking about. You are getting mighty defensive about general statements which I'm not sure where that is coming from. Must be some kind of complex.

And trust me he knows my stance on pensions and my stance on unions of which he was a leader. Still love him.

Guess you and the wife will be donating his tainted pension proceeds when he dies. Good for you.

[Strange Brew]

I just know it’s a bad idea to storm the Capital. I would not have been shot or arrested. I’m NOT saying lethal force was right, but if you want to be an idiot you run that risk.

I agree 100%. I’m shocked by how easily they gained entry. The video showing an officer making sure walkways were clear for a group of morons is alarming.

My reason for even bringing it up was the opinion that nothing was done to stop them. Which is mostly true (minus you know, someone’s dead) and alarming regardless of who’s trying to get in.

[bjf123]

They had a statutory right to bring objections.
They didn't try to "overturn the election" merely objected to some states' procedures.

Yep. In 2005, I think either 25 or 32 Democratic Senators objected to Ohio’s electoral votes. I don’t seem to remember everyone going bat crap crazy over that. If today’s media was truly objective, they’d report how this is not that unusual and that it has happened during other Presidential elections.


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[boozehound]

Yep. In 2005, I think either 25 or 32 Democratic Senators objected to Ohio’s electoral votes. I don’t seem to remember everyone going bat crap crazy over that. If today’s media was truly objective, they’d report how this is not that unusual and that it has happened during other Presidential elections.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

It is unusual and it’s only happened once before - in 2005. I believe it was one Senator and a bunch of Reps. Representatives have objected a few more times, but have never gotten a Senator to sign on. Much less multiple.

I’m not really sure what the point of objecting on 2005 was, but it was stupid then too. Extra stupidity points for the fact that it happened long after Kerry had conceded and was not supported by the candidate himself. It didn’t really hit anyone’s radar because we didn’t have a sitting US President fanning the flames for two months.

This wouldn’t have been a big deal either if Trump had shut up after the election. He didn’t really even have to concede, probably. Just shut the fuck up. That would have been enough.

[bobbiemcgee]

It is unusual and it’s only happened once before - in 2005. I believe it was one Senator and a bunch of Reps. Representatives have objected a few more times, but have never gotten a Senator to sign on. Much less multiple.

I’m not really sure what the point of objecting on 2005 was, but it was stupid then too. Extra stupidity points for the fact that it happened long after Kerry had conceded and was not supported by the candidate himself. It didn’t really hit anyone’s radar because we didn’t have a sitting US President fanning the flames for two months.

This wouldn’t have been a big deal either if Trump had shut up after the election. He didn’t really even have to concede, probably. Just shut the fuck up. That would have been enough.

Sorry, i was watching the season finale of the the United States.

[Xville]

Biden goes the race card route. Awesome sign for the next four years.

Shocked, shocked I tell ya....page 1 of the democratic playbook, make every single thing about race. So fucking sick of politicans... seriously just burn it all down...I'd be shocked if there was one decent human being in congress.

[Masterofreality]

You are the generation that raised those kids with their participation trophies, that was booze's point

I know of no one that did that in “my Generation”
My kids got cut from teams. My kids had to earn their own spending money and spots. Kids of friends of ours did too.
Maybe in the really rich neighborhoods that happened, but that has happened for every Generation. No change.
Boomer slander is Trash.

[xuwillie]

As long as the liberals continue to attack what happened at the capital and say nothing about what happened all summer then we will continue to have the same issues. It’s all so hypocritical that it’s becoming amusing. But you’ll have people on here say they draw the line when it’s our nation’s capital. Biden and Harris response isn’t helping the issue so get used to another 4 years of hell.

[bobbiemcgee]

So, I assume, you and the wife are still very happy with your vote up there in your Steamboat bubble? TRUMP '24!!!!! Boebert for VP!!

[Strange Brew]

So, I assume, you and the wife are still very happy with your vote up there in your Steamboat bubble? TRUMP '24!!!!! Boebert for VP!!

What’s your beef with Routt County?

[paulxu]

There is a large rally going on now in DC, and the president is going to speak to them. Rather than help a good transition, he continues to spew false narratives after 60+ courts have thrown out the bogus challenges. He is making us look like a tinpot dictatorship that doesn't respect its own rules. I suspect they'll march to the Capital and try to disrupt the proceedings. Hopefully he won't encourage violence since the crowd doesn't seem to be grounded in the reality of our election results.

Well, one can hope I guess.

[bjf123]

It is unusual and it’s only happened once before - in 2005. I believe it was one Senator and a bunch of Reps. Representatives have objected a few more times, but have never gotten a Senator to sign on. Much less multiple times.

Could be it was more representatives than senators. It has happened 3 times before, all by Democrats, both times after George W Bush won and again after Trump won. I’ll bet if you polled 1,000 people, less than a handful would know that. I’ll bet the rest think the Republican objections are the first time it’s ever happened and that’s it’s terrible that it’s even allowed to occur.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Caf]

As long as the liberals continue to attack what happened at the capital and say nothing about what happened all summer then we will continue to have the same issues.

"The deadly violence we saw overnight in Portland is unacceptable... I condemn this violence unequivocally. I condemn violence of every kind by anyone, whether on the left or the right. And I challenge Donald Trump to do the same." - Joe Biden

Sorry but if you think this is more about what liberals have said than Trump you are living in a fiction.

[boozehound]

Could be it was more representatives than senators. It has happened 3 times before, all by Democrats, both times after George W Bush won and again after Trump won. I’ll bet if you polled 1,000 people, less than a handful would know that. I’ll bet the rest think the Republican objections are the first time it’s ever happened and that’s it’s terrible that it’s even allowed to occur.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I'm sorry, but that's not at all the same thing. First of all - 'this' hasn't happened 3 times before. You can argue it kind of happened once (2005) but it was a lot different in that they weren't part of a coup attempt orchestrated by the sitting President. As I previously stated the election had been conceded and the candidate did not support their stunt.

I get that a lot of people (presumably including yourself) voted for Donald Trump. Probably twice, and once very recently. Now that he has attempted a coup you have to either (1) admit you were completely wrong for supporting this individual's candidacy or (2) half-heartedly condemn the actual violent part of the coup attempt while reaching back through the annals of history to find slightly similar events to explain how 'this really isn't that different from what the Democrats have tried before'. It is.

There do not appear to be a lot of people in the world who believe those situations are analogous, and I'll bet 100% of those who do are Trump supporters trying to rationalize their support.



"The deadly violence we saw overnight in Portland is unacceptable... I condemn this violence unequivocally. I condemn violence of every kind by anyone, whether on the left or the right. And I challenge Donald Trump to do the same." - Joe Biden

Sorry but if you think this is more about what liberals have said than Trump you are living in a fiction.

A lot of people have spent the last four years practicing living in a fictional environment. A bunch of them just stormed the capital dressed up in paramilitary costumes.

[Caf]

A lot of people have spent the last four years practicing living in a fictional environment. A bunch of them just stormed the capital dressed up in paramilitary costumes.

Fingers crossed the two parties break into at least four after this. Seems like the GOP is well on its way to becoming two. Rough guesses of the lines to me would be the parties of Bernie&AOC, Biden, Romney&Sasse, and Trump.

[boozehound]

Fingers crossed the two parties break into at least four after this. Seems like the GOP is well on its way to becoming two. Rough guesses of the lines to me would be the parties of Bernie&AOC, Biden, Romney&Sasse, and Trump.

I think that would be phenomenal. Probably unlikely due to funding challenges etc, but phenomenal.

[Caf]

I think that would be phenomenal. Probably unlikely due to funding challenges etc, but phenomenal.

I think it's all but a done deal for the Trump faction. They can certainly fundraise effectively without the rest of the GOP and their now seems to be no tolerance for having them back under the GOP tent. I could see the latter changing before the former.

[Smails]

But I'd like to hold the people responsible who put her in that position.


Paul- I'll ask again, what do you mean by this statement? It's confusing to me. Who are the people that put this woman in this position? Was she in a wheelchair and wheeled into the Capital? How are you going to hold them accountable?

[paulxu]

Paul- I'll ask again, what do you mean by this statement? It's confusing to me. Who are the people that put this woman in this position? Was she in a wheelchair and wheeled into the Capital? How are you going to hold them accountable?

Sorry, guess I thought it was easy to see. People who incite others to violence can be held responsible. The actions of the president, Giuliani and otthers at the rally preceding the storming of the Capitol would seem to be inciting:


The First Amendment to the United States Constitution guarantees free speech, and the degree to which incitement is protected speech is determined by the imminent lawless action test introduced by the 1969 Supreme Court decision in the case Brandenburg v. Ohio. The court ruled that incitement of events in the indefinite future was protected, but encouragement of "imminent" illegal acts was not protected. This "view reflects longstanding law and is shared by the Federalist Society, the ACLU, the Foundation for Individual Rights in Education, and the vast majority of Americans, including most staunch free-speech advocates."[23]

Incitement to riot is illegal under U.S. federal law.

[MADXSTER]

Will Trump run again in 2024?

[Xville]

Sorry, guess I thought it was easy to see. People who incite others to violence can be held responsible. The actions of the president, Giuliani and otthers at the rally preceding the storming of the Capitol would seem to be inciting:

Such a liberal playbook take, everyone else's fault but her own.

[xubrew]

Will Trump run again in 2024?

The mere question makes me want the Justice Dept. to take action.

In all seriousness, if he's guilty of all the shit a lot of the Dems say he's guilty of, then I want him prosecuted and put away. If he's not guilty of any of it, then I want The Left to shut the hell up about it. There are now other more important things to focus on. I felt the same way four years ago about Hillary. Prosecute or don't prosecute, but don't say someone with that kind of influence is a criminal and then do nothing about it.

[paulxu]

Such a liberal playbook take, everyone else's fault but her own.

Indeed. Me and the White House counsel to the President:


Trump did not want to make the speech at first and was only convinced to do it after White House Counsel Pat Cipollone warned him on Wednesday night that he could face a criminal investigation for actively encouraging his supporters to storm the Capitol in a clash that left at least five people dead.

Only then did the President reluctantly agree to tape a video condemning his supporters’ attack even though he had privately enjoyed it, according to the Times. He had previously issued a statement praising the insurrections as “very special” and telling them “We love you.”

[GoMuskies]

It will probably be Donald Trump, Jr running in 2024.

[Caf]

Indeed. Me and the White House counsel to the President:

The President has not even mentioned her. They might think he's just saving face, but there has to be some in the group who are upset about how swiftly he has condemned them and backed away.

Ready for the hypocrisy criers to mention that the Blue Lives Matter crowd killed a cop.

[boozehound]

Such a liberal playbook take, everyone else's fault but her own.

I'm all for personal responsibility, but I don't think you can follow it off a cliff.

Do you hold historical Dictators responsible for what they did? In Nazi Germany was Hitler responsible, or was every German who participated individually responsible. Both? How does that blame get split?

A lot of the people who stormed the Capitol appear to be people that aren't of the highest intelligence, and are probably susceptible to being misled. What does holding them accountable look like?

Here's an extreme example: If I convince a mentally retarded person to kill someone, is it my fault or theirs? How does the blame work in that situation.

I think there is a place to blame both the individuals who participated and the public figures who misled and incited them. Legal precedent would agree with that, since you can be charged with inciting someone to commit a crime.

[paulxu]

Was searching around for something humorous in all this turmoil...and I found it !

Release the Kraken !!


Dominion Voting Systems on Friday filed a defamation lawsuit against lawyer Sidney Powell, demanding more than $1.3 billion in damages for havoc it says Powell has caused by spreading “wild” and “demonstrably false” allegations, including that Dominion played a central role in a fantastical scheme to steal the 2020 election from President Trump.

[bobbiemcgee]

"The deadly violence we saw overnight in Portland is unacceptable... I condemn this violence unequivocally. I condemn violence of every kind by anyone, whether on the left or the right. And I challenge Donald Trump to do the same." - Joe Biden

Sorry but if you think this is more about what liberals have said than Trump you are living in a fiction.

Riots vs. Riot/Insurrection/Sedition/Attack on Democracy = same things?

[bobbiemcgee]

It will probably be Donald Trump, Jr running in 2024.

I think they stuck a fork in him after his DC speech.

[Xville]

I'm all for personal responsibility, but I don't think you can follow it off a cliff.

Do you hold historical Dictators responsible for what they did? In Nazi Germany was Hitler responsible, or was every German who participated individually responsible. Both? How does that blame get split?

A lot of the people who stormed the Capitol appear to be people that aren't of the highest intelligence, and are probably susceptible to being misled. What does holding them accountable look like?

Here's an extreme example: If I convince a mentally retarded person to kill someone, is it my fault or theirs? How does the blame work in that situation.

I think there is a place to blame both the individuals who participated and the public figures who misled and incited them. Legal precedent would agree with that, since you can be charged with inciting someone to commit a crime.

We are talking about two different things. I was referencing the girl who got shot. There were plenty of people that stormed the Capitol that didnt get shot. Though that action was stupid enough, she took further steps to get herself shot. that is no one's fault but her own.

[GoMuskies]

I think they stuck a fork in him after his DC speech.

I doubt he thinks so. And an alarming number of people would vote for him, too, just given his last name.

[Caf]

Riots vs. Riot/Insurrection/Sedition/Attack on Democracy = same things?

Don't forget cop killing.

[bobbiemcgee]

I doubt he thinks so. And an alarming number of people would vote for him, too, just given his last name.

Yeah, we want Kim in the WH as 1st ho.

Adam Kinzinger seems likes a reasonable dude.

[noteggs]

Well he will be gone in two weeks and we can start to blame other people. Never mind. If history repeats itself, Biden will say it’s still Trump’s fault just like Trump said it was Obama’s. Before that everything was still blamed on Bush. Of course this thread for the most part will follow suit.

[GoMuskies]

Of course this thread for the most part will follow suit.

I blame that on PMI and DC Muskie.

[Xville]

Well he will be gone in two weeks and we can start to blame other people. Never mind. If history repeats itself, Biden will say it’s still Trump’s fault just like Trump said it was Obama’s. Before that everything was still blamed on Bush. Of course this thread for the most part will follow suit.

Nah remember now is the time we are being told to unify and everything is going to be sunshine and rainbows during this administration. Pay no attention to biden and harris race baiting even before entering the white house.

[GoMuskies]

Hilary threatened to deport people? Hilary is awful and said some terrible things, but come on, apples and oranges.

I love that people are shocked at protests. Part of Trump's appeal was that he pissed these people off and didn't care what the mainstream thought about it. You don't get to have your cake and eat it too.


There is a difference between protests and what is going on with destruction of property, beatings etc.

Not sure why I was back in the first few pages of this thread...but an interesting exchange given what just happened.

[GoMuskies]

If Republicans had lost two of the last five elections after winning the popular vote, they would be equally as upset about the result.


Maybe...but there wouldn't be violent protests and destroying of their city's property

I think this is actually the exchange I was going for.

[Xville]

I think this is actually the exchange I was going for.

I wasnt technically wrong...they didnt try to destroy their own coty... just dc lol. Anyways, yeah I have now come to the realization that both sides equally have their complete whackjobs

[GoMuskies]

I wasnt technically wrong...they didnt try to destroy their own coty... just dc lol. Anyways, yeah I have now come to the realization that both sides equally have their complete whackjobs

Yeah, I was surprised too. People were saying Wednesday was going to be stupid, but I never dreamed they would get THAT stupid and get people killed.

[boozehound]

I doubt he thinks so. And an alarming number of people would vote for him, too, just given his last name.

Donald Trump and the Trump family potentially building a political empire on the backs of rural America is not nothing that I saw coming. If the Duck Dynasty guys or Ted Nugent had pulled it off I would be able to wrap my head around that, but Trump? Dude is a born-rich East Coast elitist who shits in golden toilets.

[X-band '01]

So, to recap this week:

- Dow hits record territory

- Joe Biden is formally announced as President after goons invaded the Capitol

- Donald Trump announces his IRS audit is over and finally releases his taxes to Congress and the state of New York

- Fordham beats Dayton in men's basketball









Nah, there's one thing wrong here, Fordham couldn't possibly beat the Flyers.

[Caf]

Yeah, I was surprised too. People were saying Wednesday was going to be stupid, but I never dreamed they would get THAT stupid and get people killed.

I'm walking on ice here, but I would bet the majority of the people there, let's say 51% for no reason, went to listen to a speech and yell then got swept up in the moment. I'm sure many resisted that urge. There were definitely many others who went there wanting to take law makers hostage and worse.

[GoMuskies]

Can we all stipulate that Donald Trump is a horrible President and complete asshole? OK, he's treated a certain way by mainstream media. Most of that is probably fair, though I think at times it has certainly been over the top.

But how on earth does Gov. Cuomo get such fawning media treatment? The guy is just absolutely awful, but he wrote a best-selling book and gets fellated by his brother regularly on national TV. He is the shining example of how a biased mainstream media pisses people off. His latest idiocy at work below.

https://twitter.com/jorgearangure/status/1347583732451061767

[bjf123]

But how on earth does Gov. Cuomo get such fawning media treatment? The guy is just absolutely awful, but he wrote a best-selling book and gets fellated by his brother regularly on national TV. He is the shining example of how a biased mainstream media pisses people off.

I’m assuming your question about Cuomo is rhetorical. The answer is too easy. He’s a Democrat and they get a pass from the MSM.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[paulxu]

That's crazy to throw away vaccines. But it does sound like by reading the article that they are going after Cuomo for mishandling it with his guidelines.

[bjf123]

"The deadly violence we saw overnight in Portland is unacceptable... I condemn this violence unequivocally. I condemn violence of every kind by anyone, whether on the left or the right. And I challenge Donald Trump to do the same." - Joe Biden

Sorry but if you think this is more about what liberals have said than Trump you are living in a fiction.

The Left only started speaking out against the riots throughout the summer when they saw it was hurting them in the polls. Prior to that, crickets. Even when they did speak out, they wanted the “peaceful protesters” released without charges. Now, they want them locked up. They should all be locked up and prosecuted to the fullest extent the law.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[paulxu]

Follow long tradition of inviting former president and spouse to unveil official portrait? Nope
Follow long tradition of inviting incoming president/spouse to White House for meeting to discuss transition? Nope
Follow long tradition of attending inauguration of successor? Nope
Set new standard of having Speaker of the House call Chairman of the Joint Chiefs about keeping unstable President from accessing nuclear codes? Yep

[STL_XUfan]

That's crazy to throw away vaccines. But it does sound like by reading the article that they are going after Cuomo for mishandling it with his guidelines.

Throwing away any of the vaccine is absolutely insane. I understand that you don't want to see those in the know to pull strings to get in front of the line, but if you have some left, find the nearest arm to shove it into.

I have a few friends that are on the logistics side of distributing the vaccine, and I keep joking with them that I can be anywhere in Cincinnati in 20 minutes if they need a live arm for a dose that would be otherwise wasted.

[Lloyd Braun]

Can we all stipulate that Donald Trump is a horrible President and complete asshole? OK, he's treated a certain way by mainstream media. Most of that is probably fair, though I think at times it has certainly been over the top.

But how on earth does Gov. Cuomo get such fawning media treatment? The guy is just absolutely awful, but he wrote a best-selling book and gets fellated by his brother regularly on national TV. He is the shining example of how a biased mainstream media pisses people off. His latest idiocy at work below.

https://twitter.com/jorgearangure/status/1347583732451061767

Unfortunately this is happening in probably most states to some degree. For example, let’s say a hospital system is immunizing their employees and has extra vaccine that must be given that day. They may make an announcement that there is vaccine for anyone who wants it, or start peddling to various departments. There’s a good chance it gets thrown out as there are still too many people that refuse the vaccine.

Regarding the article referenced, Ohio currently has very similar guidelines as New York. They are loosening the restrictions on who can have the vaccine in the next couple weeks but it is slowing the rollout immensely. Florida I believe (would defer to GIMMFD) has looser restrictions on who can get the vaccine and likely wouldn’t encounter this issue as frequently, but perhaps would run into a shortage easier. Happy medium is tough...

[Caf]

The Left only started speaking out against the riots throughout the summer when they saw it was hurting them in the polls. Prior to that, crickets. Even when they did speak out, they wanted the “peaceful protesters” released without charges. Now, they want them locked up. They should all be locked up and prosecuted to the fullest extent the law.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

No disagreement here. Take a look at what I was responding to. I'm not going to re-contextualize it for you.

[Smails]

Throwing away any of the vaccine is absolutely insane. I understand that you don't want to see those in the know to pull strings to get in front of the line, but if you have some left, find the nearest arm to shove it into.

I have a few friends that are on the logistics side of distributing the vaccine, and I keep joking with them that I can be anywhere in Cincinnati in 20 minutes if they need a live arm for a dose that would be otherwise wasted.

I told my wife the exact same thing. She works for a medical office that just got approved for administering the vaccine. I said if you see a tainted bottle that doesn't pass inspection because the seal is cracked or something, just pocket it and you can vax me later that night in the kitchen. She thought I was joking...I was not

[noteggs]

Nah remember now is the time we are being told to unify and everything is going to be sunshine and rainbows during this administration. Pay no attention to biden and harris race baiting even before entering the white house.

Yeah what the hell was that! Democrats are going to be Democrats when it comes to race baiting, but you couldn’t pick a worst time to do it. Talk about lack of judgment from the two who are next in line and like you said “uniters”. Talk about potentially instigating some of your base.

This article gives us a glimpse of the next four years and shows how some have responded.

https://www.kcra.com/article/blm-activists-say-pro-trump-riot-dc-highlights-double-standard/35156345

Yes, Trump still sucks for what he did this week. Trying to head off the “what about Trump” people.

[Caf]

Video shows fatal shooting of Ashli Babbitt in the Capitol - Washington Post (https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/2021/01/08/ashli-babbitt-shooting-video-capitol/)

Not for the faint of heart.

[boozehound]

I told my wife the exact same thing. She works for a medical office that just got approved for administering the vaccine. I said if you see a tainted bottle that doesn't pass inspection because the seal is cracked or something, just pocket it and you can vax me later that night in the kitchen. She thought I was joking...I was not

I'm just going to start hanging out at my local CVS once they start vaxing. Just in case.

[Masterofreality]

Donald Trump and the Trump family potentially building a political empire on the backs of rural America is not nothing that I saw coming. If the Duck Dynasty guys or Ted Nugent had pulled it off I would be able to wrap my head around that, but Trump? Dude is a born-rich East Coast elitist who shits in golden toilets.

That is absolutely not happening.
Trump or a family member may run as a Third party candidate in 2024, but there is no place for him in a future Republican Party.
Those bridges have been burned. He's on his own. Dude torched any remaining goodwill that he had with Republicans.
2024 will be very interesting- especially after Biden/Dems screw things up over the next two years and lose the House. It's every man/woman for themselves.

But here’s the point. I am convinced that Republicans feel they had the correct policies in place. They did better on Foreign Policy, ISIS, Trade deals and the economy than Obama’s years did factually. They didn’t start any new wars. The problem in their minds was that they had to enact those policies through a narcissistic spokesman. They can’t wait for Biden to get in there now and piss off the working guy with his garbage and race card rhetoric. They ain’t going back to Trump but have a roster full of solid ready candidates that can appeal to the middle and they secretly are overjoyed at Trumps latest antics. It gives them the final cover to break away and move on.

[Masterofreality]

I blame that on PMI and DC Muskie.

We have a text chain at every Xavier game. Fred Garvin, Snipe, Nuts and Thor are on there too. It's hilarious.

[Strange Brew]

I remember when storming the Capital was cool during the BK hearings in 2018....

[STL_XUfan]

I remember when storming the Capital was cool during the BK hearings in 2018....

A little bit of a difference between being a loud asshole after going through security and using force to break into the building.

Something that scares the hell out of me is that we have a 2 hour period where large parts of the Capitol that likely have intelligence and computers with access to intelligence was completely unguarded. Who knows what could have slipped in with the mob.

[XU88]

Indeed. Me and the White House counsel to the President:

Interesting side note: I heard during the impeachment hearings that Cipollone is a local guy (CovCath grad). Also just read that he’s now considering resigning from his position as White House Counsel.

[Caf]

Video shows fatal shooting of Ashli Babbitt in the Capitol - Washington Post (https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/2021/01/08/ashli-babbitt-shooting-video-capitol/)

Not for the faint of heart.

I can't believe this isn't getting more buzz here and on twitter. Just an unbelievable scene. The people clearly thinking they have the right to get to lawmakers, saying they wouldn't hurt them. How disconnected from reality could you be? Then the Capitol police stepping aside from the door seemed ordered to, with gun drawn people behind them. Seems like they shot her to just stop a wave coming through, but man that's tough. Some really stupid people. Clearly thought they could do whatever they wanted.

[bigdiggins]

I can't believe this isn't getting more buzz here and on twitter. Just an unbelievable scene. The people clearly thinking they have the right to get to lawmakers, saying they wouldn't hurt them. How disconnected from reality could you be? Then the Capitol police stepping aside from the door seemed ordered to, with gun drawn people behind them. Seems like they shot her to just stop a wave coming through, but man that's tough. Some really stupid people. Clearly thought they could do whatever they wanted.

If that was their plan it did in fact work well. They backed off that door quick. She may have saved quite a few lives.

Edit - Read the artice too. States she was shot when she went to actually step through the broken glass.

[Caf]

If that was their plan it did in fact work well. They backed off that door quick. She may have saved quite a few lives.

Edit - Read the artice too. States she was shot when she went to actually step through the broken glass.

Yeah you can see at the end they get rid of the glass then lift her through the frame.

[paulxu]

Godwin's Law finally caught up to Peggy Noonan:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/bring-the-insurrectionists-to-justice-11610065179?st=hamirbbo5irauqx&reflink=article_email_share

[boozehound]

That is absolutely not happening.
Trump or a family member may run as a Third party candidate in 2024, but there is no place for him in a future Republican Party.
Those bridges have been burned. He's on his own. Dude torched any remaining goodwill that he had with Republicans.
2024 will be very interesting- especially after Biden/Dems screw things up over the next two years and lose the House. It's every man/woman for themselves.

But here’s the point. I am convinced that Republicans feel they had the correct policies in place. They did better on Foreign Policy, ISIS, Trade deals and the economy than Obama’s years did factually. They didn’t start any new wars. The problem in their minds was that they had to enact those policies through a narcissistic spokesman. They can’t wait for Biden to get in there now and piss off the working guy with his garbage and race card rhetoric. They ain’t going back to Trump but have a roster full of solid ready candidates that can appeal to the middle and they secretly are overjoyed at Trumps latest antics. It gives them the final cover to break away and move on.

That all sounds great, but doesn't it kind of come apart if Trump takes a big chunk of the base with him to whatever pseudo-party he forms? I think he's definitely going to do that. There's too much money in it for him not to at least try.

If the Dems split somehow too, they could be OK, but if they hold together and somehow Trump peels of 10MM Republicans that could be a problem, no? I assume that the fear of that happening has been a big part of why they have put up with Trump's antics up until this point.

[Masterofreality]

That all sounds great, but doesn't it kind of come apart if Trump takes a big chunk of the base with him to whatever pseudo-party he forms? I think he's definitely going to do that. There's too much money in it for him not to at least try.

If the Dems split somehow too, they could be OK, but if they hold together and somehow Trump peels of 10MM Republicans that could be a problem, no? I assume that the fear of that happening has been a big part of why they have put up with Trump's antics up until this point.

Maybe? But Ross Perot thought he had a pile of supporters and goodwill behind him too. 4 years is a long time and Trump’s gonna fade in lots of minds. When Biden/Dems piss off enough people, and. They. Will. The road to redemption for the public will be through the time honored channels. Some may hold their noses, but Trump2 ain’t gonna happen after these antics. By the way, Pelosi and Schumer are already screwing up any early goodwill they may have generated in the general public. It won’t be long until they burn it up too.

[boozehound]

Maybe? But Ross Perot thought he had a pile of supporters and goodwill behind him too. 4 years is a long time and Trump’s gonna fade in lots of minds. When Biden/Dems piss off enough people, and. They. Will. The road to redemption for the public will be through the time honored channels. Some may hold their noses, but Trump2 ain’t gonna happen after these antics. By the way, Pelosi and Schumer are already screwing up any early goodwill they may have generated in the general public. It won’t be long until they burn it up too.

Ross Perot essentially got Clinton elected, didn't he? I seem to recall the sentiment being that he pulled more from Bush's voter pool than Clinton's. I was 10 years old though, so I don't have a vivid memory of that.

That would seem to be the risk for the Republicans with Trump, particularly if they actually field a candidate in 2024 that gets on the ballot in enough states to peel some of the far right voters off. Maybe they can pull in enough centrists over to the right to offset, but that didn't exactly happen in 2012 after what I can only assume you believe to be 4 disastrous years of Obama.

I'm not sure how feasible that really is though, because as I think more about it I'm not sure how much actual 'Trump money' there is to be had if you remove all the normal Republican donor channels. I know he raised a lot of money between the election and the coup, but I'm not sure if he sustain that.

Still, it would seem to be a risk at this point.

[Smails]

Video shows fatal shooting of Ashli Babbitt in the Capitol - Washington Post (https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/2021/01/08/ashli-babbitt-shooting-video-capitol/)

Not for the faint of heart.

That made my stomach turn..literally. Just to watch the life get snatched out of someone in an instant gives me the chills. Just horrific. Make me wonder if that crowd would have breached the door as a collective, would they have opened fire on them?

[Caf]

That made my stomach turn..literally. Just to watch the life get snatched out of someone in an instant gives me the chills. Just horrific. Make me wonder if that crowd would have breached the door as a collective, would they have opened fire on them?

Agreed. Life is very delicate. They definitely did not appreciate the level of danger they were putting themselves in.

[paulxu]

The Red Hats have turned on my Senator. Fortunately he had a lot of police protection.

https://twitter.com/iheartmindy/status/1347616155394043904

[bobbiemcgee]

Follow long tradition of inviting former president and spouse to unveil official portrait? Nope

They'll use it as a dart board.

[bobbiemcgee]

FBI arrested guy sitting in Pelosi's seat and another one who had 11 molotov cocktails and 2 guns.

[bobbiemcgee]

Trump will live on in Paul and Bobbie's minds rent free forever.

It's gonna be amazing 5 years from now when they are still on here railing with their crazy conspiracies about how Orange Man Bad ruined the country. .

Didn't have to wait the 5 yrs. Just a couple weeks.

[bobbiemcgee]

Bobbies only argument is calling trump a bad person. Maybe he is .....

Yep.

[bobbiemcgee]

No more tweets forever for the trumpster. Permanently banned.

[xu82]

No more tweets forever for the trumpster. Permanently banned.

THAT is quite a legacy.

[Strange Brew]

No more tweets forever for the trumpster. Permanently banned.

Who again are the Fascists?

[paulxu]

Those far left guys at the National Manufactures Association calling for his resignation.

In free market news, Parler is ecstatic about the potential for a growing market.

[X-band '01]

The Red Hats have turned on my Senator. Fortunately he had a lot of police protection.

https://twitter.com/iheartmindy/status/1347616155394043904

They're also turning on Nick Sandmann too.

[bobbiemcgee]

Those far left guys at the National Manufactures Association calling for his resignation.

In free market news, Parler is ecstatic about the potential for a growing market.

Ha. Google suspended them. Impeachment dos next week.

[paulxu]

This is a good recap in trying to understand the social media actions regarding Twitter bans, etc.


Plans for future armed protests have already begun proliferating on and off-Twitter, including a proposed secondary attack on the US Capitol and state capitol buildings on January 17, 2021.

https://www.emptywheel.net/2021/01/09/once-again-trumps-self-victimhood-distracts-from-his-negligence/

[Xville]

This is a good recap in trying to understand the social media actions regarding Twitter bans, etc.



https://www.emptywheel.net/2021/01/09/once-again-trumps-self-victimhood-distracts-from-his-negligence/

I’m more of a let’s ban all of social media kind of guy. Like, let’s close Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, snap stupid and any other ridiculous social media platform that has caused the decay of society

[paulxu]

I’m more of a let’s ban all of social media kind of guy. Like, let’s close Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, snap stupid and any other ridiculous social media platform that has caused the decay of society

Hah! Wait...that doesn't include XavierHoops does it?

[Xville]

Hah! Wait...that doesn't include XavierHoops does it?

Nah chatboards id keep. I’m pretty serious about social media platforms though. They have contributed to absolutely horrible things in society.

[xavierj]

The thing with social media is that it can be a real divider of people and I am sure other powerful country’s know that. All you have to do is put out posts, true, or not, to incite and let it rip. We are a country divided and when the incoming president uses the race card, that isn’t going to make it get better. We better all buckle up and decide what is best for our country and remove all these clowns on both sides of the aisle. We need people for the people and not just certain groups. Not sure that will ever happen.

[xavierj]

Nah chatboards id keep. I’m pretty serious about social media platforms though. They have contributed to absolutely horrible things in society.

I agree. Social media can be used for some good things, but too often it is used to fuel hate. This thread is similar. 9,500 posts of bashing and no real agreement. No one has changed anyone’s minds and a lot of angry posts. And Donald Trump seems to live rent free in a lot of people’s minds. Good times.

[Lloyd Braun]

You don’t have to change anyone’s mind to have a successful conversation. Sometimes just gaining perspective, even in a disagreement, is productive. I don’t agree with a lot of opinions on this thread but I admit I have gained some perspective even in disagreement. That’s not to say there’s still garbage in this thread, because there is that too.

[paulxu]

I think competing dialogue is good, and enjoy reading the other side, despite obvious disagreements with many of the positions.

Apparently it was a short term rental (4 yrs) not the longer 8 year rental period.
And it hasn't been rent free. He collected $200 million+ from his grift about using the $ for fighting election returns, and put it in his pocket...I guess for his personal lawsuits or golf. I do wonder how long he can go on with those particulars con games. I'm guessing the fundraising emails may still be going out.

[xavierj]

I think competing dialogue is good, and enjoy reading the other side, despite obvious disagreements with many of the positions.

Apparently it was a short term rental (4 yrs) not the longer 8 year rental period.
And it hasn't been rent free. He collected $200 million+ from his grift about using the $ for fighting election returns, and put it in his pocket...I guess for his personal lawsuits or golf. I do wonder how long he can go on with those particulars con games. I'm guessing the fundraising emails may still be going out.

Trump seems to consume your thoughts quite a bit, free or not. Look the guys a bozo. He was elected to try to rid the country of its problem people in government that needed to go. Those people got pissed and waged war and found a way to get him out of office. Trump was too much of an egotistical idiot not to let his childish behavior get in the way and allowed himself to get beat by probably the weakest candidate ever. So we move on and buckle up. We still have most of the idiots in office that have done nothing for 20, 30 and even 40 years so nothing will change and we will continue to see the buffoonery in DC.

[paulxu]

You know that's all well and good to think like that, but we still are in a difficult time.
There are credible sources reporting that social media is full of calls to have further violence.
Some on the 17th (I guess it matches the letter Q's place in the alphabet) and on Inauguration Day.
The President may be blocked from social media, but he damn sure could call a press conference.
He could actually condemn the violence unleashed on the Capitol in strong terms (not I love you, you're patriots) the same way he condemned the violence that sprung out of the protests this summer. Then they were scum and thugs, etc. Now their patriots.

Maybe, just maybe, he'd help calm down the rhetoric and help prevent further violence.
Then again, maybe they'd turn on him like they did on Lindsey Graham. I don't know.

But he's still got the bully pulpit, and could actually use it to help the country for a change.

[bobbiemcgee]

Problem people? He just added to the pile and then fired them all because he thinks he knows everything. Did you vote for Mitch for his 7th term? People bitch about the old fogies in Congress and then continue to elect the circular firing squad.

[X-band '01]

I’m more of a let’s ban all of social media kind of guy. Like, let’s close Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, snap stupid and any other ridiculous social media platform that has caused the decay of society

I'm also going to make an exception for Discord. You know, since we need at least one Among Us night a week and all.

[Xville]

You know that's all well and good to think like that, but we still are in a difficult time.
There are credible sources reporting that social media is full of calls to have further violence.
Some on the 17th (I guess it matches the letter Q's place in the alphabet) and on Inauguration Day.
The President may be blocked from social media, but he damn sure could call a press conference.
He could actually condemn the violence unleashed on the Capitol in strong terms (not I love you, you're patriots) the same way he condemned the violence that sprung out of the protests this summer. Then they were scum and thugs, etc. Now their patriots.

Maybe, just maybe, he'd help calm down the rhetoric and help prevent further violence.
Then again, maybe they'd turn on him like they did on Lindsey Graham. I don't know.

But he's still got the bully pulpit, and could actually use it to help the country for a change.

He did condemn it a day later. I know that wasn’t reported on cnn so I understand how you missed it

[xavierj]

Problem people? He just added to the pile and then fired them all because he thinks he knows everything. Did you vote for Mitch for his 7th term? People bitch about the old fogies in Congress and then continue to elect the circular firing squad.

Mitch needs to go too. Need term limits, background tests and drug tests too. More criminals running our country than in most penitentiaries.

[bobbiemcgee]

He did condemn it a day later. I know that wasn’t reported on cnn so I understand how you missed it

Somebody wrote him a nice speech. So what? Horse had left the barn. Reminds me of the Queen song...."Mama, just killed a man....

[paulxu]

He did condemn it a day later. I know that wasn’t reported on cnn so I understand how you missed it

I saw his second video. They removed his first video, which I also saw, because instead of condemning the violence, it was praising the rioters as patriots.
So no, I didn't miss it.
But now he regrets making the video and says he's not resigning.

https://www.businessinsider.com/trump-regrets-video-vowing-smooth-transfer-of-power-resign-nyt-2021-1

Someday all people will figure out this guy only cares for himself, not for America.

It's still not too late for him to try and help the country by holding a press conference and maybe preventing further violence between now and the 20th.