Politics Thread

[XU_Lou]

Well, collections didn’t go down and taxes do have a direct affect on economic activity so believe whatever you want.

I’ll stick to the data.

Remember when summarized government reports were raw data?

[Xville]

Well, collections didn’t go down and taxes do have a direct affect on economic activity so believe whatever you want.

I’ll stick to the data.

The data that’s written by one economist? Because yeah economists never have biases

[XU_Lou]

SB - this is the point in the conversation where we're supposed to throw common sense out the window.

[Strange Brew]

The data that’s written by one economist? Because yeah economists never have biases

I’m talking about data from the Gov’t that goes back to the 18th Century.

[Xville]

I’m talking about data from the Gov’t that goes back to the 18th Century.

So, you want to cite any of this or am I just supposed to go on your word? Want to cite any kind of direct correlation or direct evidence of this?

There are economists who have said the exact opposite or at the least would be neutral.

How about looking at post ww2 for direct evidence that what you say is completely inaccurate

Tell me how tax cuts for the last fifty years have improved the lives of the middle class.

I mean are you a believer in trickle down economics?

[waggy]

The government doesn't generate a single thing. All of it comes at cost to the people.

[waggy]

Every fucking thing is taxed except air and water. Everything. Richest country in the world ran into Massive debt because of a corrupt government. Fuck these assholes. No wonder the left wants to take away guns.

[XU_Lou]

So, you want to cite any of this or am I just supposed to go on your word? Want to cite any kind of direct correlation or direct evidence of this?

There are economists who have said the exact opposite or at the least would be neutral.

How about looking at post ww2 for direct evidence that what you say is completely inaccurate

Tell me how tax cuts for the last fifty years have improved the lives of the middle class.

I mean are you a believer in trickle down economics?


I guess it all depends on which Ville we're talking to on any given day (or who he's arguing with, to be more precise):



Taxing the rich even more than they already are is pure crazy. They are doing enough and should not be "penalized" even more for being successful.

Let's instead take care of the real problem which is the immense amount of people living here for absolutely free and taking advantage of our systems.

[XU_Lou]

Every fucking thing is taxed except air and water. Everything. Richest country in the world ran into Massive debt because of a corrupt government. Fuck these assholes. No wonder the left wants to take away guns.

100%

[Muskie in dayton]

Every single Federal worker is a tax. A leech on the nuts of society. You better suck good.

[paulxu]

On behalf of the men and women in the Army, Navy, Marines, Air Force and Coast Guard...thank you for your support.

[94GRAD]

Every fucking thing is taxed except air and water. Everything. Richest country in the world ran into Massive debt because of a corrupt government. Fuck these assholes. No wonder the left wants to take away guns.

My dad's Oxygen tanks and bottled water are absolutely taxed. :drool:

[waggy]

My dad's Oxygen tanks and bottled water are absolutely taxed. :drool:

Yeah I actually went and looked after posting that and found there are water districts that tax too.

[hoopster68]

Every single Federal worker is a tax. A leech on the nuts of society. You better suck good.

Wow, MID. You must never have traveled to a National Park, driven on an Interstate Highway, flown (and landed safely) in a plane, listened to a weather report and taken shelter, received a vaccine, taken a prescription medicine and on and on and on. Statements like these make me wonder about your degree from XU! What happened to "critical thinking" skills? Oh, did I mention the Armed Services that protect us 24/7?

[GoMuskies]

I mean are you a believer in trickle down economics?

Surely everyone's a believer in trickle down economics to some extent. I mean, I want my boss to get richer, because that's the only time he's going to be incentivized to pay me more. For every rich dude buying a yacht or a private jet, there are dozens of highly paid union employees whose jobs depend on the ability of such fat cats to buys such toys. It's all about moderation. An overreliance on that theory will create problems.

But it's just as clearly true the other way. There's a right level to tax those hated rich. You can only take so much blood out of those turnips. From some people, it's always more, more, more! From some, it's always less, less, less. And both of those views are obviously wrong. Top individual rates could probably stand to go back up a tick or two. No noe is abadnoning their livelihood because top marginal rates go from 37% to 39.6%. But corporate rates could actually probably stand to go DOWN another point or two. We want to make American corporations competitive, and we want them to invest capital in America. The higher the corporate income tax rate, the higher the hurdle for greenlighting a project. It has a real world affect on investment. That's what we should worry about.

People who get wrapped around the axle about income/wealth inequality are generally jealous losers.Why should anyone care if wealth inequality rises so long as things improve for folks at the bottom as well? If shrinking the wealth gap is your ultimate goal, think about the Venezuelan model. They've done some great leveling of society there is recent decades. It's a shitty place for EVERYONE now.

[Xville]

Surely everyone's a believer in trickle down economics to some extent. I mean, I want my boss to get richer, because that's the only time he's going to be incentivized to pay me more. For every rich dude buying a yacht or a private jet, there are dozens of highly paid union employees whose jobs depend on the ability of such fat cats to buys such toys. It's all about moderation. An overreliance on that theory will create problems.

But it's just as clearly true the other way. There's a right level to tax those hated rich. You can only take so much blood out of those turnips. From some people, it's always more, more, more! From some, it's always less, less, less. And both of those views are obviously wrong. Top individual rates could probably stand to go back up a tick or two. No noe is abadnoning their livelihood because top marginal rates go from 37% to 39.6%. But corporate rates could actually probably stand to go DOWN another point or two. We want to make American corporations competitive, and we want them to invest capital in America. The higher the corporate income tax rate, the higher the hurdle for greenlighting a project. It has a real world affect on investment. That's what we should worry about.

People who get wrapped around the axle about income/wealth inequality are generally jealous losers.Why should anyone care if wealth inequality rises so long as things improve for folks at the bottom as well? If shrinking the wealth gap is your ultimate goal, think about the Venezuelan model. They've done some great leveling of society there is recent decades. It's a shitty place for EVERYONE now.

Here's why I care and it's certainly not because I'm jealous. America is at its best when the middle class is doing well, and there are opportunities for small business/entrepenuers to succeed. Period. I dunno if you've noticed, but the middle class hasn't been doing that well for quite some time now.

As far as union, that's bs. It's been proven over and over again that right to work is the way to go. Unions should have been abolished decades ago. They were useful at one time, that's no longer the case.

[GoMuskies]

Here's why I care and it's certainly not because I'm jealous. America is at its best when the middle class is doing well

OK, but that's not contradictory to what I wrote. If the rich got $10 more and the middle class got $7 more, some people (jealous losers) would be madder about that than a situation where the rich lost $2 and the middle class only lost $1. As long as everyone is better off, you shouldn't care that the rich guy's situation improved more than yours.

[Xville]

OK, but that's not contradictory to what I wrote. If the rich got $10 more and the middle class got $7 more, some people (jealous losers) would be madder about that than a situation where the rich lost $2 and the middle class only lost $1. As long as everyone is better off, you shouldn't care that the rich guy's situation improved more than yours.

Here's my point though. That hasn't been happening for decades. Do you think the lives of the typical middle class family has improved since i dunno the 60s?

It used to be that you had one parent working with a decent wage at a 9-5 job and they could afford a house, car, vacations etc etc. Now middle class families, it's typically both parents work, typically long ass hours....everything sure seems to cost a hell of a lot more and i could go on and on.

[GoMuskies]

Here's my point though. That hasn't been happening for decades.

OK, but you're still responding to a point I didn't make. Of course we want the lot of the middle class to improve. Luckily, it doesn't HAVE to come at any other group's expense. These things aren't zero sum.

[Xville]

OK, but you're still responding to a point I didn't make. Of course we want the lot of the middle class to improve. Luckily, it doesn't HAVE to come at any other group's expense. These things aren't zero sum.

Then I guess I don't understand your initial post so that's my bad. You seemed to imply that trickle down economics was a thing that existed at least to a certain extent. To me, it's fairy tale land like a lot of left-wing things. I.E. sound good in theory but in reality don't work or would make things a lot worse.

[GoMuskies]

I mean, in my mind it's pretty obvious that trickle down economics is a real thing in many respects. Companies have to exist and make money to hire employees. That's trickle down. People buy luxury goods that people have good jobs to make. That's trickle down.

If you take that to an extreme and assume the best way to help the poor is always to make the rich more wealthy, then yeah, that's not going to work out great. Same if your theory is to always tax the rich MORE MORE MORE. Also going to end poorly. You have to find the right balance.

[GoMuskies]

Wealth inequality is taking a big step towards being resolved today!

[paulxu]

Key findings. From 1978–2023, top CEO compensation shot up 1,085%, compared with a 24% increase in a typical worker's compensation. In 2023, CEOs were paid 290 times as much as a typical worker—in contrast to 1965, when they were paid 21 times as much as a typical worker.

https://www.epi.org/publication/ceo-pay-in-2023

It's hard to keep up with inflation when over 45 years your pay goes up 24%.
Not so hard if it goes up 1,085%.
(Ergo the two family earners mentioned above. Just to keep up.)

[Xville]

Key findings. From 1978–2023, top CEO compensation shot up 1,085%, compared with a 24% increase in a typical worker's compensation. In 2023, CEOs were paid 290 times as much as a typical worker—in contrast to 1965, when they were paid 21 times as much as a typical worker.

https://www.epi.org/publication/ceo-pay-in-2023

It's hard to keep up with inflation when over 45 years your pay goes up 24%.
Not so hard if it goes up 1,085%.
(Ergo the two family earners mentioned above. Just to keep up.)

Thanks Paul, this is more of what I'm speaking to. It's more like CEOs are getting 1,000 more, and workers are getting a dollar while not keeping up with inflation numbers.

With that said, is taxing the hell out of those CEOs the way to get the gap closer? Probably not, but something needs to be done, and I think the marginal tax rate could stand to go up some points for the uber rich.

[waggy]

Middle class wages went down because middle class manufacturing jobs were moved out of the country.

[GoMuskies]

Ok XVille. Still trying to figure out where you fundamentally disagree with me, though.

[Xville]

Ok XVille. Still trying to figure out where you fundamentally disagree with me, though.

I don’t think I necessarily do. My main point is just that trickle down economics doesn’t work. Lots of republicans have argued otherwise. I thought l that’s what you were trying to say and I think I misunderstood

[Xville]

Middle class wages went down because middle class manufacturing jobs were moved out of the country.

I think that’s part of it, but I think that’s an oversimplification

[noteggs]

First of all, we have to cut spending before we ask for more taxes. If not, does anyone actually believe we would still get out of this mess?
We get all this new revenue and suddenly Washington is going to stop spending like drunken sailors? Both sides will see more dollar signs for their pet projects.

If cut first and see the results and there is no way for solvency, then do what you have to do to make up the difference. Of course I just don’t see why the rich have to make up for the problem DC has created to begin with. You don’t get into this whole mess with tax cuts only.

[paulxu]

2000 = balanced budget with surplus (that could have been used to pay down the debt)

What's changed?

2 giant tax cuts and some unfunded wars. Just imagine if we had left well enough alone.
Just left that tax rates for everybody exactly where they were.
Everybody was doing OK, but we were irresponsible and gave up the golden opportunity to actually reduce the national debt.
Great legacy to leave our grandchildren.

[paulxu]

Don't be stupid enough to think these people running things now actually care about waste and fraud.
If they really did, they wouldn't be cutting IRS who actually increases revenue and goes after fraud.


Unlike with other federal agencies, cutting the IRS means the government collects less money and finds fewer tax abuses. Economic studies have shown that for every dollar spent by the IRS, the agency returns between $5 and $12, depending on how much income the taxpayer declared. A 2024 report by the nonpartisan Government Accountability Office found that the IRS found savings of $13,000 for every additional hour spent auditing the tax returns of very wealthy taxpayers — a return on investment that “would leave Wall Street hedge fund managers drooling,” in the words of the Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy.

https://www.propublica.org/article/how-doge-irs-cuts-will-cost-more-than-savings-trump-musk-deficit

[XU_Lou]

And now for a dose of reality:

Total US debt = 36T

Afghan War cost = 2.3T

Iraq War = 2 to 3T

Ukraine War 0.3T

Covid response - depending on who you ask and how the numbers are calculated: 4.6T to 16T


GAO says 4.6T https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-23-106647

The USC Schaeffer Institute says up to 14T: https://schaeffer.usc.edu/research/covid-19s-total-cost-to-the-economy-in-us-will-reach-14-trillion-by-end-of-2023-new-research/

Cutler and Larry Summers study says: 16T: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7604733/#:~:text=The%20total%20cost%20is%20estimated,GDP%2 0of%20the%20United%20States.

This says 11T: https://www.covidmoneytracker.org/


Yes, all three wars were MAJOR mistakes - but can the libs please now admit so was the Covid response!!

[XU_Lou]

Paul said he wants to go back to 2000. I'm wondering if he's willing to have the bottom 75% wage earners to begin ponying up the amount of taxes they were paying back then? Share of taxes paid by the bottom 50% has decreased from 5% to 2.3%. Share of taxes paid by wage earners between 25% and 50% has dropped from ~14% to 8.4% of all taxes collected.

Shouldn't everyone have some skin in the game?


https://taxfoundation.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/03/FedData_3-2048x1638.png




https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/federal/latest-federal-income-tax-data-2024/

[noteggs]

Okay, I’m going to mark Paul down as a revenue problem vs spending? Well except for unnecessary wars.

So tax cuts and the wars are why we’re 31T in debt? But has nothing to do with other unnecessary spending? I’m starting to think democrats really don’t want to reduce fraud and waste with the bloated federal government. Except with the inefficient IRS.

[XU_Lou]

To put another way, the average tax rate paid by the bottom 50% has dropped from 4.92% in 2001 to 3.11% in 2020.

Bottom 75% has dropped from 7.47% in 2001 to 5.35% in 2020.

The top 1% also dropped in that same period. Going from an avg tax rate of 27.6% to 25.99%. However, as you see in the graph above, the share of taxes paid by the top 1% has increased from ~34% to 45.8%. This appears to be mostly driven by the top 0.001% / 0.01% of wage earners. Both groups grew by about 40% in that time period.

Lots of moving parts, but there's obviously a concentration of wealth effect. But how much of that has been driven by tech, and by increased economic activity due to lower tax rates, and increased stock trading resulting from lower cap gains tax rates?


https://www.irs.gov/statistics/soi-tax-stats-individual-income-tax-rates-and-tax-shares

[hoopster68]

To put another way, the average tax rate paid by the bottom 50% has dropped from 4.92% in 2001 to 3.11% in 2020.

Bottom 75% has dropped from 7.47% in 2001 to 5.35% in 2020.

The top 1% also dropped in that same period. Going from an avg tax rate of 27.6% to 25.99%. However, as you see in the graph above, the share of taxes paid by the top 1% has increased from ~34% to 45.8%. This appears to be mostly driven by the top 0.001% / 0.01% of wage earners. Both groups grew by about 40% in that time period.

Lots of moving parts, but there's obviously a concentration of wealth effect. But how much of that has been driven by tech, and by increased economic activity due to lower tax rates, and increased stock trading resulting from lower cap gains tax rates?


https://www.irs.gov/statistics/soi-tax-stats-individual-income-tax-rates-and-tax-shares

Lou: What is your solution(s) to the $36T debt problem? As an example use a 40 year span for debt reduction or whatever # of years you choose.

[bjf123]

This column was written a number of years ago, but I’m guessing the math relationship is still there. We can’t tax our way out of our fiscal crisis. Serious spending cuts are needed.

http://walterewilliams.com/eat-the-rich/


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[Xville]

This column was written a number of years ago, but IÂ’m guessing the math relationship is still there. We canÂ’t tax our way out of our fiscal crisis. Serious spending cuts are needed.

http://walterewilliams.com/eat-the-rich/


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Makes sense and I donÂ’t think anyone is advocating for that. IÂ’d like both, and prudent cutting not just cutting things “we don’t like.”

[waggy]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T6DiMIJIvYw

[XU_Lou]

Lou: What is your solution(s) to the $36T debt problem? As an example use a 40 year span for debt reduction or whatever # of years you choose.

this:


This column was written a number of years ago, but I’m guessing the math relationship is still there. We can’t tax our way out of our fiscal crisis. Serious spending cuts are needed.

http://walterewilliams.com/eat-the-rich/


How many different ways does this have to be said?? Why aren't you listening?

[waggy]

Like I've stated before we have a crime syndicate in our country going by the name democratic national party. This group is responsible for death, sickness and suffering on a massive scale. Not only in this country but worldwide. Including innocent children. The virus may have originated in china, but it's obvious given the response that they actually orchestrated it. TDS. It was their nuclear button.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KrRzKxgrZo

[paulxu]

Do you think Trump actually believes tariffs are paid by a foreign country and not the consumer? Weird.

[GoMuskies]

Do you think Trump actually believes tariffs are paid by a foreign country and not the consumer? Weird.

Now do corporate taxes.

[Xville]

Musk suggests that ss and Medicare are entitlements? Is he brain dead? We have all paid into it from the moment we started our first job. How is that an entitlement? For someone so intelligent in a lot of aspects, he’s really ignorant in others.

I’m sure there is some fraud going on in both and the way it’s set up isn’t sustainable but can we stop with the umbrella propaganda?

[hoopster68]

Musk suggests that ss and Medicare are entitlements? Is he brain dead? We have all paid into it from the moment we started our first job. How is that an entitlement? For someone so intelligent in a lot of aspects, he’s really ignorant in others.

I’m sure there is some fraud going on in both and the way it’s set up isn’t sustainable but can we stop with the umbrella propaganda?

This "entitlement" BS is just more of the Big Lie. Trump & Musk have both used this technique before: Trump on the 2020 election, Musk on Twitter. They will continue to use it as long as no one stops them. One commentator said of Trump he is lucky with his enemies; I agree. However, every bully goes too far. The Trumpster will too. Musk will reek havoc for a few months, ensure his federal largesse (contracts for billions), and then go away. Unfortunately, the two of them may ruin the economy, do untold damage to ordinary citizens and non-profits while destroying the social safety net for millions. What a legacy!

[bjf123]

In government speak, they are entitlements. Quick Google search returned this. Social Security is considered an entitlement because it is a government program that automatically provides benefits to individuals who meet specific eligibility criteria, such as age or work credits, without needing annual funding approval from Congress. This means that as long as individuals qualify, they are entitled to receive their benefits.


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[Xville]

In government speak, they are entitlements. Quick Google search returned this. Social Security is considered an entitlement because it is a government program that automatically provides benefits to individuals who meet specific eligibility criteria, such as age or work credits, without needing annual funding approval from Congress. This means that as long as individuals qualify, they are entitled to receive their benefits.


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you 100% need annual funding approval from congress for these programs. I mean it's kind of getting into semantics here, kind of like the word "entitlements" because they are "mandatory spending" but they still have to be approved.

[paulxu]

In government speak, they are entitlements. Quick Google search returned this. Social Security is considered an entitlement because it is a government program that automatically provides benefits to individuals who meet specific eligibility criteria, such as age or work credits, without needing annual funding approval from Congress. This means that as long as individuals qualify, they are entitled to receive their benefits.


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Typical R nonsense. Take what you correctly describe (people paying into an insurance plan which they are entitled to receive later) and turn it into something bad and somehow nefarious that must end.

[paulxu]

you 100% need annual funding approval from congress for these programs.

Funding comes annually from people who pay into it.

[paulxu]

Mar-a-Lago comes to Washington.

https://cdn.bsky.app/img/feed_thumbnail/plain/did:plc:ey2ngl4l3fymyibjzhjx4dcy/bafkreiec6juobbykpl6lhwqkuvemrdaukd5vaj2a2j3h4ezo7 p47x5vmku@jpeg

[Xville]

Funding comes annually from people who pay into it.

Some of it yes. The problem is that the money that goes out is way more than what is brought in on a yearly basis. I'm all for tweaking this, heck I'm even all for getting rid of it completely for those who aren't of legal working age and doing something else, but I'm seeing stupid shit like eliminating it for those born in the 70s.

[paulxu]

The markets appear to be reflecting this sentiment:

David Kelly of @JPMorganAM
"The trouble with tariffs, to be succinct, is that they raise prices, slow economic growth, cut profits, increase unemployment, worsen inequality, diminish productivity and increase global tensions. Other than that, they’re fine."

[GoMuskies]

I'm seeing stupid shit like eliminating it for those born in the 70s.


I was born in the '70s. I've always operated under the assumption I'll get no SS. So I'm okay not getting it. I treat it like any other tax. Medicare is a differnt ball of wax for sure.

[paulxu]

In the House CR, they surrender their power over tariffs. Every day for the next almost 2 years, is "shall not constitute a calendar day."
(not sure exactly what the day becomes; twilight zone?)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GlxG0WkWAAA3sHc?format=png&name=900x900

[Xville]

S&P close to correction

Dow closes the lowest it’s been in six months. But yeah, nothing to worry about.

[GoMuskies]

You need to go read that Stock Market Predictions thread start to finish. LOL

[paulxu]

Today's "Alternative Fact" from the WH press briefing:

"Tariffs are a tax cut for the American people, and the president is a staunch advocate of tax cuts."

(I'm not sure these people know what they are doing.)

[xubrew]

I am turning into an example of how George Orwell was ultimately correct.

I can't fucking take it anymore!! Just give me my bread and circuses!!!

[bobbiemcgee]

So Hannity and Trump hate Ev's
so they are buying Tesla

[bjf123]

So Hannity and Trump hate Ev's
so they are buying Tesla

And the Left love EVs, so they’re vandalizing them. It’s a strange world.


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[Xville]

Dow now lower than it was in September… approaching correction.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Trump is playing a dangerous game of brinkmanship with these tariffs. He needs the other side to flinch. I am hoping these are all the eggs that need breaking to make this amazing omelet. He is going to certainly hurt a lot of people doing it.

I agree with Xville's earlier post about the single job household of 50+ years ago vs. the two job household of today. Mine is a single job, we make it work but my austerity of the past before I was married led me to a point today where my house will be paid off in two months. Many didn't do what I did, didn't get lucky, or just can't due to circumstances they can't control.

Edit: Not humblebragging at all, also debt free of cars. That helps with two five year old kids. I worked hard, but got very lucky with some timely buying and a small amount of knowledge of cars to keep them running for less.

[bobbiemcgee]

Hope you dom:t like French wine

[XU_Lou]

Hope you dom:t like French wine

Our farmers are clearly getting ripped off by Can, Mex and EU: https://www.wto.org/english/res_e/statis_e/tariff_profiles_list_e.htm



This may be helpful: https://www.wto.org/english/res_e/statis_e/daily_update_e/tariff_profiles/TariffProfileTechnicalNotes_E.htm

[paulxu]

If we're getting ripped off by Canada and Mexico, I know who signed the current trade deal.

MAGA!

[XU_Lou]

If we're getting ripped off by Canada and Mexico, I know who signed the current trade deal.

MAGA!

Wrong again!!

I guess you didn't notice the dates those rates went into effect!!

[bobbiemcgee]

Sooooooo we are blaming Biden for a great trade agreement? Trump wants to renege on his own deal.

[Strange Brew]

On the bright side. It looks like a deal is happening on Ukraine, we’re realizing energy literally drives the World and Go was correct on markets.

That said, Let’s Go X!

I’ll be sweating it out with the rest of us on Sun.

Oh, and the Federal Gov’t spends too much money. Glad Chuck caved and AOC can get another round round for the people who earn their money.

[xuphan]

Hope you dom:t like French wine

What’s wrong with French wine?

[paulxu]

Voice of America is silent.

Remember in the Cold War when the Soviet Union wanted nothing more than to silence the Voice of America.

Today's the day it happened.

[xuphan]

Voice of America is silent.

Remember in the Cold War when the Soviet Union wanted nothing more than to silence the Voice of America.

Today's the day it happened.

What are you talking about?

[paulxu]

You may be too young to know what the Voice of America is.

[XU_Lou]

Gee, I sure hope the BBC is still sending out coded messages to the resistance.

[bjf123]

You may be too young to know what the Voice of America is.

Had no idea it was still running.


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[Muskie in dayton]

Voice of America is silent.

Remember in the Cold War when the Soviet Union wanted nothing more than to silence the Voice of America.

Today's the day it happened.
Remember when the Cold War ended 35 years ago?

Don’t worry Paul. It will be back after it’s cleansed of the batshit crazy ultra liberal propagandists.

[Muskie in dayton]

A CNN poll has the Democrat party at 29% approval. CNN! So you can guarantee actual approval is in the 20-25% range.

The Dems solution? Let’s double-down on bullshit propaganda and refuse to work on any way with the landslide-elected Administration. Sheesh.

At least Paul still supports them.

[Xville]

Remember when the Cold War ended 35 years ago?

Don’t worry Paul. It will be back after it’s cleansed of the batshit crazy ultra liberal propagandists.

Remember when history repeats itself?

[noteggs]

For those who live in the West Chester, Oh area, should be very familiar with VOA relay stations and its history. Pretty cool (albeit small) museum at the old location.

Funny story. Best friend from HS moved across the street from the relay station after graduating from college. One night we were recording albums to cassettes (yes that was a thing). After recording and playing them back, you could hear the VOA transmission in the background. Apparently his electricity picked up the transmitters. Wild stuff.

If you want to look up some interesting VOA history, google search Tokyo rose.

[paulxu]

I'm not sure how to answer someone who actually thinks 49.8% is a "landslide."
It makes me wonder what they are teaching in math/statistics at Xavier these days.

Meanwhile, in the real world:

Travel to the US is expected to slide by 5%, contributing to a $64 billion shortfall for the travel industry, according to Tourism Economics which had originally forecast a 9% increase in foreign travel, but revised its estimate to reflect “polarizing Trump Administration policies and rhetoric.”

MAGA !

[xubrew]

Thanks, but this is your own supposition of how specifically Trump and Roberts would respond and not an answer to the question. I'll phrase it a different way...

If the Executive Branch ignores a court ruling, is there an actual procedure in place to enforce that ruling? If so, then what is it?


Thank you! If you sign up you get one free article, so I was able to read it. And, it did answer the question.

The answer is that there is no recourse. There are only a few instances in history where a President has not complied with a court's ruling, and each time nothing was done to make them obey it. It really hasn't happened since the Civil War, but if it were to happen, there is no mechanism to enforce the ruling. It would result in a Constitutional Crisis.

That's the answer.

....and here we go....

https://www.newsweek.com/donald-trump-ignoring-court-order-doomsday-scenario-legal-analyst-2045892

[GoMuskies]

Trump kept another campaign promise. He released the 30,000 pages of the Kennedy assasination files. Most of the other 80,000 are promised to be released as well. I'm guessing it will turn out to be a bit of a nothing, but a number of people have a lot of reading to do. I'll take the Cliff's Notes version, please.

[xuphan]

Trump kept another campaign promise. He released the 30,000 pages of the Kennedy assasination files. Most of the other 80,000 are promised to be released as well. I'm guessing it will turn out to be a bit of a nothing, but a number of people have a lot of reading to do. I'll take the Cliff's Notes version, please.

Still waiting for the full Epstein files to be released.

[GoMuskies]

Around 2085, probably, based on the Kennedy timeline.

[XU_Lou]

Eh hem...


Sadly, Trump is right on Ukraine

I rarely agree with President Trump, but his latest controversial statements about Ukraine are mostly true. They seem preposterous only because western audiences have been fed a steady diet of disinformation about Ukraine for more than a decade. It is time to set the record straight on three key points that illuminate why Ukrainians and former President Joe Biden — not merely Russian President Vladimir Putin — bear significant responsibility for the outbreak and perpetuation of war in Ukraine.

https://thehill.com/opinion/5198022-ukraine-conflict-disinformation/

[bobbiemcgee]

Putin invaded a sovereign nation. No difference if Mexico invaded US. He's killed thousands of innocents, tortured and kidnapped 6000 kids, so you have be kidding or do you love commies now

[GoMuskies]

WSJ has an editorial titled: "The Race for Second-Worst Party". So true.

We've probably talked about it here already since it's 11 days old, but the polling data mentioned in the editorial is pretty dire: A March 9 CNN survey gave the Democratic Party a 29% favorable, 54% unfavorable rating, the lowest approval rating the party has gotten from CNN this century. The Republican Party was at 36% favorable, 48% unfavorable.

This line is also gold: Therein lies the GOP’s challenge. Americans think the Democrats are terrible, but it’s still a horse race.

By the way, Democrats would easily be my second least favorite party if they did this (but I'm not holding my breath): Resistance sings to the souls of left-wing Democrats. But it’s a dead end. Wiser Democrats know their party must pivot in word, deed and tone to a more centrist, constructive approach. Their values must align more with those of ordinary Americans, tired of being lectured and bullied by insufferable progressives.

Everyone's political chant should be "We're #2!".

[paulxu]

Hey, my senator is the leader of the "servile sycophants" according to the WSJ.

So there.

[hoopster68]

Eh hem...


Sadly, Trump is right on Ukraine

I rarely agree with President Trump, but his latest controversial statements about Ukraine are mostly true. They seem preposterous only because western audiences have been fed a steady diet of disinformation about Ukraine for more than a decade. It is time to set the record straight on three key points that illuminate why Ukrainians and former President Joe Biden — not merely Russian President Vladimir Putin — bear significant responsibility for the outbreak and perpetuation of war in Ukraine.

https://thehill.com/opinion/5198022-ukraine-conflict-disinformation/

Lou: What prescription "rose colored glasses" do you wear? Are they "commie red" or "china pink"? Russia invaded Ukraine. Full stop, no blathering, misrepresentations, lies, obfuscations are required. Either you support the Ukrainians or you support the invasion of a sovereign nation. You, the Trumpster, JD -Boy, and other lackeys a/k/a "fellow travelers" are on the wrong side of history. What don't you see?

[XU_Lou]

Eh hem...


Sadly, Trump is right on Ukraine

I rarely agree with President Trump, but his latest controversial statements about Ukraine are mostly true. They seem preposterous only because western audiences have been fed a steady diet of disinformation about Ukraine for more than a decade. It is time to set the record straight on three key points that illuminate why Ukrainians and former President Joe Biden — not merely Russian President Vladimir Putin — bear significant responsibility for the outbreak and perpetuation of war in Ukraine.

https://thehill.com/opinion/5198022-ukraine-conflict-disinformation/


Putin invaded a sovereign nation. No difference if Mexico invaded US. He's killed thousands of innocents, tortured and kidnapped 6000 kids, so you have be kidding or do you love commies now


Lou: What prescription "rose colored glasses" do you wear? Are they "commie red" or "china pink"? Russia invaded Ukraine. Full stop, no blathering, misrepresentations, lies, obfuscations are required. Either you support the Ukrainians or you support the invasion of a sovereign nation. You, the Trumpster, JD -Boy, and other lackeys a/k/a "fellow travelers" are on the wrong side of history. What don't you see?

Seriously, do you guys ever read anything?

[XU_Lou]

"One of the 7 federal agencies shuttered by DOGE on Friday is the most DOGE-able agency of all time. FMCS (before the pandemic!) had a 9-story K Street tower for 60 employees. Its halls were lined with oil paintings of those employees, and other art purchased from the boss's wife"

This is precisely why DOGE needs to clean house. How can anyone be opposed to this?

Inside The Now-Shuttered Federal Agency Where Employees Lived ‘Like Reigning Kings’: https://www.dailywire.com/news/fmcs-slush-fund-abolished-by-trump



Luke Rosiak
@lukerosiak
In response to my writing about how FMCS wastes taxpayer money, it paid a company to "issue a press release" attacking me and "condemning" my reporting instead of just putting it on its website for free. Which is one of the exact examples in my articles!

https://x.com/lukerosiak/status/1902592677767446939

[XU_Lou]

Meet one of the DOGE employees!

This guy was on the Laura Ingraham show last night. He's looking into the IRS right now. He claims the IRS handles the same amount of transactions as a mid-size bank.

* A mid-size bank typically has 100-200 IT employees, and a budget of ~ $20 million.

* The IRS has 8000 IT employees and a budget of 3.5 billion!

We are clearly being ripped off by grifters in government and the parasitic contractors. This segment starts at ~ 12;50:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHSdAcydhlo

[bobbiemcgee]

Did the bank service 73 million accounts

[XU_Lou]

Did the bank service 73 million accounts

You really don't understand IT, do you...

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Are we all over talking about Pitino that nobody mentioned the Houthi attack that was mistakenly planned with the Atlantic's editor on the discussion chain?

[waggy]

I'm sure the Houthis have us right where they want us now. Gotta brush up on my Arabic.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

So when the opposition party eventually gets power back, including the editor on a discussion chat involving top secret battle plans is perfectly ok. Got it.

[GoMuskies]

Someone surely will get fired. Presumably that Waltz guy.

[waggy]

The guy was obviously included by mistake (by whomever), and the Atlantic decides it's then perfectly fine to release info that may or not be classified? WTF?

[hoopster68]

The guy was obviously included by mistake (by whomever), and the Atlantic decides it's then perfectly fine to release info that may or not be classified? WTF?

The Trumpster said none of it was classified, so that is when the Atlantic decided to post it. I doubt any heads will roll, remember these are "all the best people."

[paulxu]

You've got 19 of our country's top intelligence officials on a chat (that automatically erases) talking about bombing another country....and not one of them stops to say:
1 - hey! Shouldn't we be on the secured government messaging service with our government provided phones or in a SCIF room talking about this?
2 - and don't these communications need to be preserved under the various records acts for the country, not erased?

Children let loose in our government. Maybe somebody will wake up and decided Fox News Hosts don't have the experience for these types of jobs.
Looking at you Republican Senators.

[xuphan]

Someone surely will get fired. Presumably that Waltz guy.

You would think but then again the rules don’t apply to public officials in Washington for some reason. Wouldn’t be surprised one bit if they all kept their job.

[waggy]

I think waltz is probably involved in too much important stuff to get rid of. They might have to blame someone else.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

The guilty party has to be the one who created the chain right? I am sure Musk will get to the bottom of this.

[BandAid]

Unfortunately, the recent precedence is classified materials/conversations/etc. don't mean anything if you are high enough on the food chain. From Hilary's private server to Trump's, Biden's, and Pence's documents to this - mutual destruction is the deterrent. It'll be an opportunity for the democrats to make political hay, but that's about it.

Gratefully, the mission went well and no American service members got hurt.

I was actually pleasantly surprised at the level of discourse revealed by those in the chat - except the emojis.

[XU_Lou]

Alex Wong - you guys might want to do a deep dive on him....

[hoopster68]

You've got 19 of our country's top intelligence officials on a chat (that automatically erases) talking about bombing another country....and not one of them stops to say:
1 - hey! Shouldn't we be on the secured government messaging service with our government provided phones or in a SCIF room talking about this?
2 - and don't these communications need to be preserved under the various records acts for the country, not erased?

Children let loose in our government. Maybe somebody will wake up and decided Fox News Hosts don't have the experience for these types of jobs.
Looking at you Republican Senators.

Sen. Joni Ernst (R, IA, veteran) and Sen. Thom Tillis (R, NC) are responsible for Hegseth. They knew his despicable record as a manager and as a human being and voted to confirm him anyway. "Only the best people" may become the mantra of the Trump administration.

[Smails]

Children let loose in our government..

Are you saying that poor handling of information means that children are in our government? Does that apply to all cases or just this one?

[ArizonaXUGrad]

It was a mistake, doesn't make the person who did it despicable. It makes him/them careless, maybe that particular government position isn't for them. This would have been a four alarm meltdown if Biden's people did it.

[hoopster68]

It was a mistake, doesn't make the person who did it despicable. It makes him/them careless, maybe that particular government position isn't for them. This would have been a four alarm meltdown if Biden's people did it.

Despicable is when you've abused alcohol in public numerous times, been forced out of leadership positions at two non-profit organizations, been accused of sexual abuse and then put the lives of our service members at risk. Heggie should go!

[Smails]

Despicable is when you've abused alcohol in public numerous times

Have you ever been drunk in public? Are you despicable?

Quit clutching your pearls

[noteggs]

There is no defense for the indefensible. They screwed up bigly. One thing I don’t understand, why on earth the one person in the world who dislikes Trump more than Paul end up on the chain?

As to it happening on the other side, who’s to say it hasn’t happened? Does anyone have confidence the legacy media would report it. I mean, they covered up for Biden’s mental decline for years.

As for punishment, normally I would say yes someone should be let go. However if no one got disciplined for Abbey Gate, this will give me pause. You know, the one where servicemen actually lost their lives. Both were done with incompetence.

[XU_Lou]

To those of you who are up in arms about DOGE, please explain to me why and what you're against after watching this:

Bret Baier interviewed several DOGE execs tonight:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSQTZXzichk

[paulxu]

If you pardon and let criminals out of prison who have beat up cops, why would you think any of these people who so blatantly ignored the security requirements of their office would be punished.

[bjf123]

To those of you who are up in arms about DOGE, please explain to me why and what you're against after watching this:

Bret Baier interviewed several DOGE execs tonight:


I watched it on Twitter (still call it that). Great interview with members of the DOGE team. Some of the things that really urinate me off were the number of SBA loans to kids 11 and under, including a 9 month old, about 2 federal credit cards for every 1 federal employee, and the fact that the treasury issue billions in payments without any proper coding and reporting as to why the payment was made. How the #$*&! does that happen?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[paulxu]

That's all well and good, and I hope they recover more.
The Paycheck Protection Program was established under Trump and gave businesses loans that could be forgiven during Covid.
Last year the IG estimated $64 billion (and perhaps $200 billion) of fraud. Far more than this few million noted.
That IG was fired as they were pursuing this fraud by the new administration.

[waggy]

Last year the IG estimated $64 billion (and perhaps $200 billion) of fraud. Far more than this few million noted.
That IG was fired as they were pursuing this fraud by the new administration.

So the old IG found fraud and did nothing?

[paulxu]

So the old IG found fraud and did nothing?

Nope; they had recovered a whole lot, just like the additional IRS people recovered millions from tax cheats.
The DOGE boys decided to cut all these efforts and fire the people. Stupid.
But Elon can brag about a few million in fraud he supposedly found. Wouldn't surprise me if he was using someone else's numbers.

[GoMuskies]

Minnesota could end up with two guys named Jeff Johnson in the Republican primary for governor. That would be fun!

[hoopster68]

Nope; they had recovered a whole lot, just like the additional IRS people recovered millions from tax cheats.
The DOGE boys decided to cut all these efforts and fire the people. Stupid.
But Elon can brag about a few million in fraud he supposedly found. Wouldn't surprise me if he was using someone else's numbers.

Who is going to audit Musk's billion dollar contracts?

[waggy]

Nope; they had recovered a whole lot, just like the additional IRS people recovered millions from tax cheats.
The DOGE boys decided to cut all these efforts and fire the people. Stupid.
But Elon can brag about a few million in fraud he supposedly found. Wouldn't surprise me if he was using someone else's numbers.

You got a link for that?

[paulxu]

You got a link for that?

Sure;

https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/us-department-of-the-treasury-irs-announce-1-point-3-billion-recovered-from-high-income-high-wealth-individuals-under-inflation-reduction-act-initiatives

https://www.taf.org/fbtn2024-covidfraud/

[paulxu]

I'm sure this will help us in the next few years:


Operation Warp Seed was the single best thing Trump did in his first term.

Now, RFK Jr ousted one of the people who made it happened.
‪Dan Diamond‬ ‪@ddiamond.bsky.social‬
·
1h
Breaking: RFK Jr. has forced out PETER MARKS, the nation’s top vaccine regulator.

In his resignation letter, obtained by the Post, Marks said he was willing to work with RFK Jr on his vaccine concerns — but said Kennedy wishes “subservient confirmation of his misinformation and lies.”

https://bsky.app/profile/emptywheel.bsky.social

[waggy]

Sure;

https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/us-department-of-the-treasury-irs-announce-1-point-3-billion-recovered-from-high-income-high-wealth-individuals-under-inflation-reduction-act-initiatives

https://www.taf.org/fbtn2024-covidfraud/

Doge has not started an official audit of the IRS I don't think. It's still an open question on the doge tracker website, and no actions for the IRS are listed on the tracker.

[Strange Brew]

I'm sure this will help us in the next few years:



https://bsky.app/profile/emptywheel.bsky.social

Hmm, don’t know how to form my opinion yet. Please tell me what Mr. Goldberg from “The Atlantic” thinks about it.

Paul, what is the opinion of you and your “college educated” friends?

That “college educated” line is still one of the most most pompous things ever said on this board.

[hoopster68]

Hmm, don’t know how to form my opinion yet. Please tell me what Mr. Goldberg from “The Atlantic” thinks about it.

Paul, what is the opinion of you and your “college educated” friends?

That “college educated” line is still one of the most most pompous things ever said on this board.

SB: You raise a very good point. Dems need to (re)attract blue collar, rural, non-college educated, male and female voters. For too long the party has been driven by Washington based consultants who have not listened to the interests, desires, needs of working class folks. The election of '24 was a result of such policies. Having said that I'd point to the loss by Sen. Sherrod Brown of OH as a reflection on these same voting types: given a choice between a candidate that supports their interests (Brown) vs. a candidate that supports their nativist instincts (Bernie Moreno) they chose Moreno. The Trump/Moreno policies of anti-immigration, tax cuts for the richest among us, tariffs, and a general lack of understanding of what government actually provides contributed to the "throw the bums out" prevalent among these same voters. Dems have a long slog ahead. I predict Dems will prevail in '26 for two reasons: the Trumpster can't control himself and will "overreach" in many spheres causing voters to rebel against Rethuglicans, and the economy will turn sour by the end of this year. Dems will benefit from both. However, mid to long term this does little to solve the problem of (re)attracting these voters. Until Dems find solutions, the country will continue to slide to the right.

[paulxu]

Doge has not started an official audit of the IRS I don't think. It's still an open question on the doge tracker website, and no actions for the IRS are listed on the tracker.

Maybe gutting the workforce doesn't make it to the "tracker." These are "savings" but rather we're losing lots of money from taxpayers who don't even bother to file.


“It’s a lucky day for some taxpayers who owe hundreds of thousands or millions to the government.”
https://www.icij.org/news/2025/03/the-irs-unit-that-audits-billionaires-has-lost-38-percent-of-its-employees-since-january-new-data-shows/

[waggy]

I think what the Doge team is doing is upgrading the tech so that the IRS employees who are searching for taxpayer fraud can do it more efficiently and effectively. The IRS has an outside contractor that it's been working on such an upgrade for over a decade and it's still estimated to be 5 years from completion. All they do is collect a check with no incentive to actually solve the problem. In fact they don't want to solve the problem. Hospitals have a similar scam. Drive by the service entrance and note how many times you see a honeywell or other controls contractor van. The building controls are so complicated (intentionally) that the employees can't even operate it. The controls contractor just collects a check perpetually.

[Strange Brew]

Maybe gutting the workforce doesn't make it to the "tracker." These are "savings" but rather we're losing lots of money from taxpayers who don't even bother to file.

https://www.icij.org/news/2025/03/the-irs-unit-that-audits-billionaires-has-lost-38-percent-of-its-employees-since-january-new-data-shows/

Paul, please post the economic formula for GDP. And then we can talk about taxes.

[paulxu]

I'm interested in the high dollar people who pay no taxes. I'm interested in having them pay their taxes.
I think Republicans are aware of this problem, and that's why they didn't like the last administration adding people to go after the tax cheats
And it was working.
Now of course this administration has let go of a lot of these workers, and as a result we'll lose a lot of taxes that should be paid.
If you're interested in GDP, I have no idea why that bears on this particular IRS topic.
So, perhaps engage someone on the board who wants to discuss GDP.

[bjf123]

So is it your contention that the high income people are not paying taxes by cheating, or by taking advantage of the tax law as written? Most of their income is through investments, partnerships, business ownership, etc. Most of that income is reported to the IRS on various tax forms, so they can’t really hide that. I guess they’re making up deductions and expenses to reduce their taxable income?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[paulxu]

None of the above.
I'm talking about people that just decide not to file at all.
https://tax.thomsonreuters.com/blog/the-irs-cracks-down-on-non-filers/

[paulxu]

On Tuesday, news broke that Kennedy has tapped anti-vaccine activist David Geier to lead a study looking to link autism to vaccines, although that alleged link has been heavily studied and thoroughly debunked. Infectious disease journalist Helen Branswell notes that Geier does not have a medical degree and was disciplined in Maryland for practicing medicine without a license.

Only the best people. MAGA !

[waggy]

Only the best people. MAGA !

Neither you nor I are doctors. Do birds have Covid? How do you know? Because someone else tells you?

[Strange Brew]

So is it your contention that the high income people are not paying taxes by cheating, or by taking advantage of the tax law as written? Most of their income is through investments, partnerships, business ownership, etc. Most of that income is reported to the IRS on various tax forms, so they can’t really hide that. I guess they’re making up deductions and expenses to reduce their taxable income?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Word.

Paul, still waiting on the GDP formula and your analysis.

[Strange Brew]

SB: You raise a very good point. Dems need to (re)attract blue collar, rural, non-college educated, male and female voters. For too long the party has been driven by Washington based consultants who have not listened to the interests, desires, needs of working class folks. The election of '24 was a result of such policies. Having said that I'd point to the loss by Sen. Sherrod Brown of OH as a reflection on these same voting types: given a choice between a candidate that supports their interests (Brown) vs. a candidate that supports their nativist instincts (Bernie Moreno) they chose Moreno. The Trump/Moreno policies of anti-immigration, tax cuts for the richest among us, tariffs, and a general lack of understanding of what government actually provides contributed to the "throw the bums out" prevalent among these same voters. Dems have a long slog ahead. I predict Dems will prevail in '26 for two reasons: the Trumpster can't control himself and will "overreach" in many spheres causing voters to rebel against Rethuglicans, and the economy will turn sour by the end of this year. Dems will benefit from both. However, mid to long term this does little to solve the problem of (re)attracting these voters. Until Dems find solutions, the country will continue to slide to the right.

Bro, I read your first sentence and stopped.

BTDubs, I have two degrees from X.

Who is John Galt?

[paulxu]

Neither you nor I are doctors. Do birds have Covid? How do you know? Because someone else tells you?

But do you really want someone in charge of anything medical who is not a doctor but played one without a license?
Maybe he stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

[hoopster68]

Bro, I read your first sentence and stopped.

BTDubs, I have two degrees from X.

Who is John Galt?

SB: Why did you stop after two sentences?

[paulxu]

Then:
“Starting the day I take the oath of office, I will rapidly drive prices down and we will make America affordable again. We’re going to make it affordable again.”

Now:
"Couldn’t Care Less' If Automakers Raise Prices Over Tariffs"

[waggy]

But do you really want someone in charge of anything medical who is not a doctor but played one without a license?
Maybe he stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

Given the Covid scam? The medical field is just a bunch of lying, thieving scum just like the left party.

Which btw, you might want to stop using the term vaccine. It doesn't mean what it used to.

[paulxu]

Well, if Covid was a scam, I expect 1,200,000 people any day now to arise from the dead.

[hoopster68]

Given the Covid scam? The medical field is just a bunch of lying, thieving scum just like the left party.

Which btw, you might want to stop using the term vaccine. It doesn't mean what it used to.

Waggy: Given the remarkable advances in medical research, treatment and help for millions would you like to reconsider your statement that "the medical field is just a bunch of lying, thieving scum"? Or, was your comment meant as sarcasm?

[Xville]

Man these tariffs are effing great. Hope no one is doing any kind of construction on their home or buying a car any time soon.

[waggy]

Waggy: Given the remarkable advances in medical research, treatment and help for millions would you like to reconsider your statement that "the medical field is just a bunch of lying, thieving scum"? Or, was your comment meant as sarcasm?

Covid shots? Basically like a dealer selling crack except they're in lab coats and scrubs. And they're "official". Obviously there are many many many wonderful people in medicine, but their is also something definitely seriously wrong.

[hoopster68]

Covid shots? Basically like a dealer selling crack except they're in lab coats and scrubs. And they're "official". Obviously there are many many many wonderful people in medicine, but their is also something definitely seriously wrong.

Waggy: How would you have handled COVID? Please be specific.

[waggy]

Waggy: How would you have handled COVID? Please be specific.

Like the flu.

[xuphan]

Man these tariffs are effing great. Hope no one is doing any kind of construction on their home or buying a car any time soon.

It’s Biden’s fault!

[94GRAD]

Like the flu.

So giving people shots to help them from getting the flu or mitigate the severity if they get it?

[paulxu]

I'm guessing not since he seems to support this guy:

What RFK has done just this week to NOT support vaccines:
-fired FDA's top vaccine scientist
-buried CDC's measles forecast
-shut down agency that runs the NATIONAL VACCINE PROGRAM (OIDP)
-Hired anti-vaxxer to probe phony autism/vax links
-Made Texas kids sick with his vitamin A measles 'cure'

[bjf123]

So giving people shots to help them from getting the flu or mitigate the severity if they get it?

One difference. With few exceptions, no is forced to get a flu shot. People were forced to get a Covid “vaccine”, even though it’s not a vaccine. No one calls a flu shot a flu vaccine.

[hoopster68]

One difference. With few exceptions, no is forced to get a flu shot. People were forced to get a Covid “vaccine”, even though it’s not a vaccine. No one calls a flu shot a flu vaccine.

BJF: If not a vaccine what were the shots? Please cite references. Thanks!

[bjf123]

BJF: If not a vaccine what were the shots? Please cite references. Thanks!

Per Wikipedia “A vaccine is a biological preparation that provides active acquired immunity to a particular infectious or malignant disease.” Other sites say essentially the same thing. That’s also the definition I’ve always used. The keyword here is immunity, i.e. you won’t get the disease. The Covid shots did not provide immunity, even though that’s what was being touted at first. You could still get Covid, albeit with reduced symptoms.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Strange Brew]

SB: Why did you stop after two sentences?

Fair. I read two sentences. ;)

[Strange Brew]

So giving people shots to help them from getting the flu or mitigate the severity if they get it?

Not a Dr. however I am smart enough to know the difference between a vaccine and an mRNA treatment

[waggy]

Anyone who travels to various foreign countries knows not to drink the water. However, are if you are in country long enough the immune system will develop the anti bodies naturally to be able to drink the water without getting ill. A flu shot works essentially the same way. That's good medicine.

People die from the flu annually, and maybe the C19 virus would have killed more than usual. Our medical industries response to C19 made the problem worse, probably killed more people than if they had done nothing, and may have harmed people long term. I feel sorry for any young person who took the shot.

The medical industry harmed their own reputation. They might as well not use the term vaccine anymore. They ruined it.

[Strange Brew]

Anyone who travels to various foreign countries knows not to drink the water. However, are if you are in country long enough the immune system will develop the anti bodies naturally to be able to drink the water without getting ill. A flu shot works essentially the same way. That's good medicine.

People die from the flu annually, and maybe the C19 virus would have killed more than usual. Our medical industries response to C19 made the problem worse, probably killed more people than if they had done nothing, and may have harmed people long term. I feel sorry for any young person who took the shot.

The medical industry harmed their own reputation. They might as well not use the term vaccine anymore. They ruined it.

Word. Part of me thinks we as a society lost our damn minds 5 years ago.

Let’s not do that again.

[paulxu]

I suppose this might happen.
Big tariffs announced - forecasted to raise trillions - will be used as an excuse to extend big tax cuts for the very wealthy.
And MAGAts will believe that foreign countries are paying for it.

[xubrew]

Bro, I read your first sentence and stopped.

BTDubs, I have two degrees from X.

Who is John Galt?

Although it was just a mere footnote, I believe John Galt also has two degrees from X.

[xubrew]

Trump is saying the quiet parts out loud again. It may actually surprise me if he DOESN’T try to run for a third term.

https://www.npr.org/2025/03/31/nx-s1-5191889/is-trump-running-for-a-third-term?utm_term=nprnews&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR1Ss3rCkkmMl0H9pX4ixnR2n FLe_Yz2ZX13MYV2TSPN-6vZVeT5AYIB8Gg_aem_DU73tRkDthnWu0OobQdBuQ

[GoMuskies]

Trump is saying the quiet parts out loud again. It may actually surprise me if he DOESN’T try to run for a third term.

https://www.npr.org/2025/03/31/nx-s1-5191889/is-trump-running-for-a-third-term?utm_term=nprnews&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=npr&utm_medium=social&fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR1Ss3rCkkmMl0H9pX4ixnR2n FLe_Yz2ZX13MYV2TSPN-6vZVeT5AYIB8Gg_aem_DU73tRkDthnWu0OobQdBuQ

Vance/Trump vs. Walz/Obama in 2028

[paulxu]

MAGA and business:

https://paulkrugman.substack.com/p/autocracy-is-bad-for-business?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=277517&post_id=160238176&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=2s89hz&triedRedirect=true&utm_medium=email

[waggy]

Trump had 96 rallies in 2024. Apparently CNN only aired one live. Butler, PA.

[paulxu]

Maybe don't spend time on X ?
https://www.aol.com/fact-check-cnn-aired-several-142354369.html

(Also, why listen to the same lies, over and over again?)

[hoopster68]

Maybe don't spend time on X ?
https://www.aol.com/fact-check-cnn-aired-several-142354369.html

(Also, why listen to the same lies, over and over again?)

When will Trump supporters say "enough is enough"? Is there a "red line" for them, or are they willing to see the Constitution be destroyed, our international alliances destroyed, our economy trashed, social services/VA services destroyed, and on and on and on? I find it difficult to believe that so many XU grads, as represented on this board, are OK with the Trumpster's actions. Have the terms "social justice" and "options for the poor" been trashed too? Or, is our only considerations to be the size of our retirement accounts, our real estate holdings, and getting ready for the next vacation?
I truly understand the legitimate concerns about the national debt, and I share such concerns. However, giving add'l tax breaks for the wealthiest among us, as the Trumpster wants to do, is no solution for the debt crisis. His actions each day make me afraid for the future! Anybody with me?

[Xville]

Two Concerns I had regarding the Presidency are starting to come to fruition:

1.) RFK's nutty side regarding immunizations is starting to rear its ugly head. Covid is one thing...spreading misinformation based on hunches and zero scientific evidence on well established protocols is another.

2.) Tariffs are going to cripple the individual consumer and send us into a recession if not pulled back.

[GoMuskies]

Two Concerns I had regarding the Presidency are starting to come to fruition:

It's almost like if you're presented with two terrible candidates, no matter which one you pick bad things are going to happen.

[Xville]

It's almost like if you're presented with two terrible candidates, no matter which one you pick bad things are going to happen.

Fair....will we ever see decent candidates again in our life time?

[GoMuskies]

Fair....will we ever see decent candidates again in our life time?

Of course not. I've been assured that by electing Trump we've eliminated the concept of elections, and we'll never have one again.

[waggy]

Maybe don't spend time on X ?
https://www.aol.com/fact-check-cnn-aired-several-142354369.html

(Also, why listen to the same lies, over and over again?)

That's why I stated "apparently" because I had no way of knowing for sure.

It was still an assassination attempt orchestrated by the demoncratic crime syndicate.

[xubrew]

That's why I stated "apparently" because I had no way of knowing for sure.

It was still an assassination attempt orchestrated by the demoncratic crime syndicate.

You certainly don't know that for sure either. It was most likely an assassination attempt orchestrated by the single person that tried to assassinate him.

[waggy]

You certainly don't know that for sure either. It was most likely an assassination attempt orchestrated by the single person that tried to assassinate him.

lol

[paulxu]

Google can often keep you from posting things that are wrong, especially if they are made up by people just to stir up hate.

[paulxu]

FORTY MILLION DOLLARS to detain 400 migrants at Gitmo. That's $100,000 a person just to hold them for a few days — when they could far more easily be held in the United States!

Just a couple weeks ago it was reported to have cost $16 million. So the price tag is skyrocketing.
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/31/us/politics/migrants-guantanamo-costs.html

Wouldn't it be great if we had a department of government efficiency? They could root out this obvious waste of our taxpayer dollars.
We'd call it DOGE...and get some billionaire to run it with a bunch of kids. What could possibly go wrong?l

[ArizonaXUGrad]

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/31/us/politics/migrants-guantanamo-costs.html

Wouldn't it be great if we had a department of government efficiency? They could root out this obvious waste of our taxpayer dollars.
We'd call it DOGE...and get some billionaire to run it with a bunch of kids. What could possibly go wrong?l

How do they even come up with that number? Read this and decide for yourself....

Gitmo has been in Cuba for a really long time. Surely the facility is either close to fully depreciated or fully depreciated. That would mean the only facility cost is the maintenance.
The costs then would have to be clothes, utilities, food, healthcare, combined salaries of the staff on site.
If you assign a reasonable number for each, I have zero idea how they even get up to 16M much less 40M.

Perhaps those numbers are a tad inflated.

[paulxu]

Maybe this is part of the costs:

https://jacobin.com/2025/03/deportation-flights-profits-ice-trump

[paulxu]

https://cdn.bsky.app/img/feed_thumbnail/plain/did:plc:q3glmp5enr5gkuu2uaosjker/bafkreihg2gedhrc7hygmozrrmmwfapp5jiwjrarsr4a3vj3zb 3a4efrt3y@jpeg

Who wants to tell JD that Biden wasn't in office in 2019? Anyone?

[waggy]

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/31/us/politics/migrants-guantanamo-costs.html

Wouldn't it be great if we had a department of government efficiency? They could root out this obvious waste of our taxpayer dollars.
We'd call it DOGE...and get some billionaire to run it with a bunch of kids. What could possibly go wrong?l


How do they even come up with that number? Read this and decide for yourself....

Gitmo has been in Cuba for a really long time. Surely the facility is either close to fully depreciated or fully depreciated. That would mean the only facility cost is the maintenance.
The costs then would have to be clothes, utilities, food, healthcare, combined salaries of the staff on site.
If you assign a reasonable number for each, I have zero idea how they even get up to 16M much less 40M.

Perhaps those numbers are a tad inflated.

I was starting get worried, but thankfully Stacey Abrams has this covered with over 1B to spare. :smile:

[Smails]

Great to see the Corey Booker show taking place in DC. Speaking non-stop on the floor for 20+ hours now..that's the beauty of the fillibus.....oh wait...he's not trying to speak against any particular piece of legislation. He's just complaining about Trump non-stop without offering solutions or what he sees as a path forward. Amazing times...

[xuwillie]

Great to see the Corey Booker show taking place in DC. Speaking non-stop on the floor for 20+ hours now..that's the beauty of the fillibus.....oh wait...he's not trying to speak against any particular piece of legislation. He's just complaining about Trump non-stop without offering solutions or what he sees as a path forward. Amazing times...

Dude has lost it

[xubrew]

So earlier this week Donald Trump, Kid Rock, Bill Maher, and Dana White all had dinner together at the White House. I think this might be the most unique guest list for any dinner in the history of the White House!!!

I will say this for Donald Trump! He has had some AMAZING dinners!! The Clemson football team banquet is the greatest banquet in the history of all of sports!

[bobbiemcgee]

I was starting get worried, but thankfully Stacey Abrams has this covered with over 1B to spare. :smile:

How much could ragtops cost?