Attendance

[fellahmuskie]

I've been to every game this season except for Miami. I think the attendance has been outstanding. The marketing team did a great job of selling tickets this summer and fall.

Looking at numbers through the first five games, Xavier is averaging 10,048. The Shootout will likely bump that over 10,100, especially with the SRO tickets going on sale.

That's a big jump over last season, when Xavier averaged 9,783 through the first five games.

If the team stays ranked all season, I think there's a very good chance X could sell out 8-9 of the remaining home games, maybe even all 10. Throw in SRO for Villanova and a few other teams, and there's a chance we could average 10,200 for the season.

The Cintas Center record is 10,224 from the 2001-2002 season.

If you go to this link http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/m_basketball_RB/Reports/attend/1978.pdf you can see Division I attendance stats dating back to 1978. Xavier ranked 208th that season with an avg. attendance of 1,965. To see other years, just replace "1978" in the url with the year you're interested in.

But to go back to this season: hosting the Crosstown Shootout is a tremendous opportunity. I think it really helped drive season ticket sales and coupled with an exciting, ranked team, there is some great synergy going on.

To compare: I went to about 20-25 Reds games this year. Leading up the All-Star game there was a lot of buzz at GABP. Attendance was great. Even though the team wasn't that good and everyone got injured, people were excited about Frazier and there was a little optimism that maybe the team could get hot and make a run. But once the ASG passed and the team went into free-fall, people stopped showing up. Attendance was horrible in August and September and rightfully so. It was unfortunate, though, because with a good team, the Reds could have destroyed their attendance records and generated a huge wave of excitement.

With Xavier, though, all the pieces are there for a breakout year in terms of attendance and excitement. We've already had more big mentions (Dickie V. and Bilas) on ESPN than any other year I can remember.

My older brother was 10 years old and lived in Springfield, OH when Xavier went to the Sweet 16 in 1990. Even though OSU and Dayton were closer, he became a Xavier fan and converted the rest of the family. I think this team could do the same for young kids in Cincinnati and the surrounding area. The players are fun, the buzz is very high and if the team stays ranked and has a deep run in the tourney, it could give Xavier a much higher profile than ever before.

[bjf123]

I wonder if they're reporting tickets sold vs. people through the turnstiles. It's looked to me that there have been more than 200 empty seats for the games so far.

One thing the crowd has forgotten is standing at the start of the second half until we score. We're good at the start of the game, but most people are staying seated to start the 2nd half.


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[fellahmuskie]

I wonder if they're reporting tickets sold vs. people through the turnstiles. It's looked to me that there have been more than 200 empty seats for the games so far.

One thing the crowd has forgotten is standing at the start of the second half until we score. We're good at the start of the game, but most people are staying seated to start the 2nd half.


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Definitely lots of empty seats still, but way less than last season, at least from my perspective. I think Cintas will be genuinely packed for most of the Big East games.

[MADXSTER]

Back in the day....Universities were using attendance by those filling seats....then Some universities started using tickets sold to bolster their attendance stats....now everyone uses tickets sold. Now everyone is on the same playing field when it comes to attendance.

[xeus]

One thing the crowd has forgotten is standing at the start of the second half until we score. We're good at the start of the game, but most people are staying seated to start the 2nd half.


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I've never supported the standing in the 2nd half, and I know it has been a point of contention for others too. I'm pleased to see it is a bad trend that is fading away.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I've never supported the standing in the 2nd half, and I know it has been a point of contention for others too. I'm pleased to see it is a bad trend that is fading away.

Just curious, why?

[MADXSTER]

I've never supported the standing in the 2nd half, and I know it has been a point of contention for others too. I'm pleased to see it is a bad trend that is fading away.

Agree

[XUOHTX]

I've never supported the standing in the 2nd half, and I know it has been a point of contention for others too. I'm pleased to see it is a bad trend that is fading away.

Ridiculous. We stand until we score the first points of each half. That's what we do.

[XUOHTX]

Agree


Just curious, why?

Because we shouldn't come out to the same intensity and crowd involvement in the second half?

[MADXSTER]

I'm not a fan of standing and clapping at the beginning of either half.

[Xavier]

Yeah, I agree. I do it just because it's something that's always been done but it's kind of dumb IMO. Especially because I feel over half the crowd is in the same boat. Maybe if everyone was going wild until the first bucket, but the way it is now its a mild, half hearted clap that has zero intensity.

[Lamont Sanford]

I've never supported the standing in the 2nd half, and I know it has been a point of contention for others too. I'm pleased to see it is a bad trend that is fading away.

Where do you stand on whiteouts????

[D-West & PO-Z]

Ridiculous. We stand until we score the first points of each half. That's what we do.

I'm with you. I like it. I dont think we should just stop because half the people are lazy.

[GoMuskies]

I prefer the way Wichita State does it, actually. You stand and clap until the opponent scores. The way Xavier does it, you kind of take the air out of the building when Xavier scores, which doesn't make much sense.

[American X]

but the way it is now its a mild, half hearted clap that has zero intensity.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-VorbXIypV9k/VacZqh7MwtI/AAAAAAAAMxA/JEFtcKUfhF4/s1600/favr.gif

[XUMIOH12]

I'm not a fan of standing and clapping at the beginning of either half.

I'm ok with the 1st half, but not the 2nd half standing

[XUMIOH12]

I'm ok with the 1st half, but not the 2nd half standing

but i also cheer throughout the entire game

[XUOHTX]

Thread hijacked.

[THRILLHOUSE]

Back in the day....Universities were using attendance by those filling seats....then Some universities started using tickets sold to bolster their attendance stats....now everyone uses tickets sold. Now everyone is on the same playing field when it comes to attendance.

Weren't they even allowed to just guess at what attendance was by eyesight and use that as an official attendance number?

[MADXSTER]

Weren't they even allowed to just guess at what attendance was by eyesight and use that as an official attendance number?

That was only at Butler where they guessed what time should be on the game clock as well.

[Emp]

Wow, the one things X fans do together is under siege.

I wouldn't wager any dinero on this, but didn't Gillen ask for the fan gesture? We've been doing it for a quarter of a century at least. It's our gesture of solidarity with the Team. What would Chris say?

I've had hostile away fans screaming to sit down many times. I had a Cincinnati judge behind me at Notre Dame and we didn't score for 6 minutes. Or so it seemed. If the die yards on this site are going soft and wimpin out, the apocalypse is nigh.

[MauriceX]

I wouldn't wager any dinero on this, but didn't Gillen ask for the fan gesture? We've been doing it for a quarter of a century at least. It's our gesture of solidarity with the Team. What would Chris say?

#HistoryLesson

Get your butt out of that seat. Both halves.

[xubrew]

Weren't they even allowed to just guess at what attendance was by eyesight and use that as an official attendance number?

It still is.

Schools can either use a turnstile count, count the number of tickets that were sold, or guess. That's always been the rule as far as I know. It's stupid. Attendance is just that. It should be how many people actually attended the game.

[94GRAD]

Where do you stand on whiteouts????

I'm more into blackouts

[bobbiemcgee]

I'm more into blackouts

Maybe you should rewire the place.

[fellahmuskie]

Attendance is up to 10,224 per game. That ties the season record from 2001-2002.

Villanova is already sold out and only 11 tickets left for Creighton. When you add in SRO, those two games will likely average 10,400-10,500, bringing the season average up to ~10,250. Pretty sweet.

I'd expect a big jump for season tickets this offseason. No Crosstown Shootout at home next season, but we'll have a top Big Ten team coming to Cintas and could be ranked very high from the beginning of the season, which always helps drive demand.

[bleedXblue]

Speaking of attendance. Sat in the lower bowl last night for the first time in awhile and what I expected was very true. Lots and lots of fans that sit on their hands and don't get into the game. Now, for all of you in the lower bowl that do get into the game......kudos to you (but you're the vast minority).

[paulxu]

So that's what they mean by the silent majority.

[Kahns Krazy]

Ridiculous. We stand until we score the first points of each half. That's what we do.

I am quite certain that there was never 2nd half standing in the gardens. I'm pretty sure that started in the CINTAS. I remember being quite puzzled when in started.

[xudash]

It would be a hoot if they could finish the year averaging over 10,250, as our % capacity number would be reflected as >100%.

Of course, some dumbass fan of a school that doesn't like us would probably think they could call the fire marshall to report us.

Either way, a very nice "problem" to have, this matter of filling up the place to the brim.

[muskiefan82]

In defense of those around me, they are into the game; however, they would seriously hurt themselves if they stood for prolonged periods or jumped up (at the game or anywhere for that matter). Most of them spent MANY years at Schmidt and the Gardens being the raucous kind of fan we all want to see in the stands. They are now at a place where they can afford to sit where they are (some need to be close to see the game at all) and they have earned that. My area tends to agree that I do enough cheering and jumping and yelling to account for all of them. I actually enjoy some of the stories from the 40's and 50's. No one talks about the 60's and 70's. I do, and the people around me do too, take offense to those who leave 4 minutes before the end of the game no matter what the score is. That is ridiculous.

[THRILLHOUSE]

I am quite certain that there was never 2nd half standing in the gardens. I'm pretty sure that started in the CINTAS. I remember being quite puzzled when in started.

No, there was definitely standing at the beginning of the 2nd half at The Gardens as well.

[X-band '01]

It would be a hoot if they could finish the year averaging over 10,250, as our % capacity number would be reflected as >100%.

Of course, some dumbass fan of a school that doesn't like us would probably think they could call the fire marshall to report us.

Either way, a very nice "problem" to have, this matter of filling up the place to the brim.

PMThor has us covered - don't worry.

[zanesxu]

In defense of those around me, they are into the game; however, they would seriously hurt themselves if they stood for prolonged periods or jumped up (at the game or anywhere for that matter). Most of them spent MANY years at Schmidt and the Gardens being the raucous kind of fan we all want to see in the stands. They are now at a place where they can afford to sit where they are (some need to be close to see the game at all) and they have earned that. My area tends to agree that I do enough cheering and jumping and yelling to account for all of them. I actually enjoy some of the stories from the 40's and 50's. No one talks about the 60's and 70's. I do, and the people around me do too, take offense to those who leave 4 minutes before the end of the game no matter what the score is. That is ridiculous.

Great perspective here; agreed. It's incumbent on those of us who are lucky and healthy enough to go bananas in lieu of our longer tenured fans... it's not for lack of desire or passion.

That said, I get people have families and obligations... but the number of people strolling in after the first media timeout or leaving before 00:00 seems way too high...

[D-West & PO-Z]

Got to beat all that imaginary Cincy/Cintas traffic!

Cincy has literally the easiest exit ability from sports venues of any big city I have ever been to sporting events at. I find it hilarious when people leave early to beat the "traffic"

[muskiefan82]

Got to beat all that imaginary Cincy/Cintas traffic!

Cincy has literally the easiest exit ability from sports venues of any big city I have ever been to sporting events at. I find it hilarious when people leave early to beat the "traffic"

I agree with this completely. Yes, you might sit in the parking lot for a few more minutes if you wait, but SO WHAT? That is what the post game show is for.

[D-West & PO-Z]

As far as the upper bowl vs lower bowl rowdienss, as an upper bowl person I think thsi narrative of the lower bowl being silent is kind of a made up myth.

I, like probably most on here, am one of those rowdy, standing, clapping, yelling fans, and from my observations over the years at Cintas the upper bowl does no better at any of that than the lower bowl. I'd say more times than not I actually think the lower bowl stands and cheers more. This is coming from an upper bowl person

[muskiefan82]

Is it just me or does it seem like every time the crowd stands up to get the team going, the other team scores, gets a rebound, or steals the ball? maybe I just don't remember standing up and having X go on a big run. It always seems like standing up and cheering ends up going the other way and then we all sit down disgusted.

[CSS85]

Is it just me or does it seem like every time the crowd stands up to get the team going, the other team scores, gets a rebound, or steals the ball? maybe I just don't remember standing up and having X go on a big run. It always seems like standing up and cheering ends up going the other way and then we all sit down disgusted.

I agree with you on this. My wife actually regularly mentions this often.

[Newswired]

Got to beat all that imaginary Cincy/Cintas traffic!

Cincy has literally the easiest exit ability from sports venues of any big city I have ever been to sporting events at. I find it hilarious when people leave early to beat the "traffic"

Agreed on all accounts. I attribute this phenomenon to our largely Catholic fan base. Same as leaving mass immediately after receiving communion so as to beat the Sunday morning post-mass traffic jam. This was particularly bad when we played in the Gardens as many had to depart via the lower level well within the camera's eye when on television.

[muethibp]

It's a harmless thing to which I have no objection, but this thread has a real "same as it ever was" feel to it. People have been having the "the old people in the lower bowl don't cheer enough" vs. "oh yeah, we built the damn arena and were there in the 'bad old days'" debate for years and years.

[fellahmuskie]

I agree with you on this. My wife actually regularly mentions this often.

I think that's what made the Marquette game so exhilarating. There were several stretches where the crowd got on its feet and didn't sit down for 2-3 minutes because Xavier kept scoring and scoring.

I agree, though, usually people sit down as soon as they get up.

[Masterofreality]

I think that's what made the Marquette game so exhilarating. There were several stretches where the crowd got on its feet and didn't sit down for 2-3 minutes because Xavier kept scoring and scoring.

I agree, though, usually people sit down as soon as they get up.

You know, fans will react when there is an exciting game. The Marquette game was just a terrific basketball game. Both teams were scoring, there was some spectacular play, and it was close enough for tension. Of course anytime you play SucKS or a high level D1 team you'll get a great crowd, but not so much when you're playing Wright State and St. John's. I'm sure Doook fans don't react the same for Wofford as they do for North Carolina.

Hey, I'm lower bowl, whine and cheese, and I can't sit down or shut up...much to the chagrin of some around me. But sorry. X basketball is one of my passions, besides being my school. There are only so any chances to exhibit that school pride every year, and when I'm there, I'm not missing it.

[Xville]

The crowd and the atmosphere at cintas is fine. Better than some, worse than some. It's average. It isn't going to suddenly change, so better to just not worry about it.

I think it's great that we average about 10k for a still pretty small school and alumni base. I think that's all we can really ask for. Is it the most raucous crowd and best atmosphere no not even close, but at least it's pretty much full every game.

[bjf123]

I do, and the people around me do too, take offense to those who leave 4 minutes before the end of the game no matter what the score is. That is ridiculous.
There's an older gentleman who sits in front of me in the lower bowl. He and his son are always there before tipoff, but will get up to leave sometime between 2 and 3 minutes remaining. It takes him a little time to get up the steps and I don't think they want to hold up traffic at the end of the game. They watch the rest of the game from the back as they walk out. Doesn't bother me at all.



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[LadyMuskie]

Some of you must miss an awful lot of the game because of how concerned you are with when other people arrive and when they leave - and this is coming from someone who was raised to stay at the game until the bitter end. I just can't get all riled up about what people are doing during the game unless it effects me and my family directly (like being physically out of control or something).

[X-band '01]

We really need CinciX12 here so he can chastise people for not being in their seats for the National Anthem. It's very important for recruiting, you know.

[LadyMuskie]

We really need CinciX12 here so he can chastise people for not being in their seats for the National Anthem. It's very important for recruiting, you know.

It looks terrible on t.v. as well.

Maybe before you're allowed to buy tickets, you should have to fill out a questionnaire answering questions about how many minutes during the game your rear will be in your seat. It's a complicated formula because you have to stand and cheer too or you'll be in trouble for that.

[xu82]

What's the punishment for stepping out to get a beer? (I hear a pretzel is it's own punishment.)

[X-band '01]

You step out for a beer, you bring one for everyone in your row!

#SharingIsCaring

[xu82]

You step out for a beer, you bring one for everyone in your row!

#SharingIsCaring

That's how I usually do it, but I tend to knock back the first 19 before I get back to my seat. Best of intentions, but I get thirsty at those games!

[LadyMuskie]

What's the punishment for stepping out to get a beer? (I hear a pretzel is it's own punishment.)

The pretzels are deadly. You can either launch them at your enemies or eat one and suffer from some sort of bowel obstruction issue for the following three weeks.

As for the beer, if you arrive 90 minutes before tip, you should have plenty of time to get as many beers as possible to your seat so that you never have to leave again until they start turning the lights off in the arena. Potty breaks are verboten as well! Learn to hold it!

[xu82]

The pretzels are deadly. You can either launch them at your enemies or eat one and suffer from some sort of bowel obstruction issue for the following three weeks.

As for the beer, if you arrive 90 minutes before tip, you should have plenty of time to get as many beers as possible to your seat so that you never have to leave again until they start turning the lights off in the arena. Potty breaks are verboten as well! Learn to hold it!

Do they sell catheters in the book store? Tough crowd, that could be a hot item!

[muskiefan82]

There's an older gentleman who sits in front of me in the lower bowl. He and his son are always there before tipoff, but will get up to leave sometime between 2 and 3 minutes remaining. It takes him a little time to get up the steps and I don't think they want to hold up traffic at the end of the game. They watch the rest of the game from the back as they walk out. Doesn't bother me at all.



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That doesn't bother me either. They stay to watch. I am talking about those who leave altogether

[mid major]

What's the punishment for stepping out to get a beer? (I hear a pretzel is it's own punishment.)

I bring my flask and never run into a shortage problem. It works like a charm every time.

[STL_XUfan]

You step out for a beer, you bring one for everyone in your row!

#SharingIsCaring

...but I can only buy 2 beers per transaction #ThanksObama

[Snipe]

I'm more into blackouts

racist

[Snipe]

I prefer the way Wichita State does it, actually. You stand and clap until the opponent scores. The way Xavier does it, you kind of take the air out of the building when Xavier scores, which doesn't make much sense.

I think I would like this better. We go crazy until the opponent scores!

Imagine being 4 minutes in against a great opponent and they haven't scored. At that point the fan participation would be at a pandemonium. After a couple of minutes the crowd would actually think that they controlled the game and can determine the outcome. After 4 minutes it would be epic.

I love that idea.

Skip hated the stand and clap. Thought it put to much pressure on the team to score and really was lame if we didn't score for a bit. While he wanted people to really make noise on defense

WSU has it spot on. We need to change that tradition. I am not sure any coach likes it.

[Snipe]

I am quite certain that there was never 2nd half standing in the gardens. I'm pretty sure that started in the CINTAS. I remember being quite puzzled when in started.

That is simply not true.

I hate the standing, and always have. I am not a hater, but we need to be more clever.

When we played Georgetown in the NCAA in Florida with Prosser in the 90s, we were on the road and standing in the second half and we didn't score early in that half. I was in the Xavier section and I thought it sucked. I really hate that we lost that game, and I still am bitter about that gay ass standing when your team hasn't hit a bucket. I would rather go with WSU and the GoMuskie strategy of standing until THEY score. It is so much better.

[Snipe]

As far as the upper bowl vs lower bowl rowdienss, as an upper bowl person I think thsi narrative of the lower bowl being silent is kind of a made up myth.

I, like probably most on here, am one of those rowdy, standing, clapping, yelling fans, and from my observations over the years at Cintas the upper bowl does no better at any of that than the lower bowl. I'd say more times than not I actually think the lower bowl stands and cheers more. This is coming from an upper bowl person

I don't agree. Upper Bowl held the upper hand for every year until we got a legitimate Student Section that cared and went balls in.

I think our Student Section is one of the best and brightest in college hoops. It has developed over time. At the start of the Cintas, I wouldn't insult it and say it sucked Moose caulk, but to compare that student section to the student section of today is not even in the same ballpark. The most invigorating aspect of the Cintas in my opinion has been the development of the Student Section and their lead in getting the fans all riled up.

Seriously I have been to all of those games. The lower pit sucked ox balz for a century before the Student Section taught them how to dance. We were always rowdy up top. Now the Student Section meets and exceeds all expectations of Greatness. It has truly been a paradigm shift in the evolution of the Cintas. And judging by the news reports of over 10 times the applicants to Xavier than are accepted, we surely have a better class of student that attends our University right now. These kids are coming in part for the madness, and they are better and brighter and ready to let it all hang out. Our student section is truly ELITE! I really believe this.

THE BEST THING I CAN SITE ABOUE BEING A SEASON TICKET HOLDER FROM A FAN PERSPECTIVE SINCE WE INITIALLY OPENED THE DOORS IS THE EVOLUTION OF OUR STUDENT SECTION!

They are off the hook.

And they finally got those crusty old rich farts down low off of their seats! Good for them! But don't credit the crusty old farts. Credit the best Student Section if not in the nation, at least the best in Xavier history. I have watched Xavier my entire life, and I am starting to get old and blind and fading away, but nothing in our history compares to our student section right now. It simply is not an issue. You might have been a rabid fan that got student seats. I was too! It was great. But it doesn't compare to right now.

I am telling you. It is contagious. They get it going and they get the whole lower bowl going. That never used to happen. It does now every game.

We uptop in the cheap seats have a lot of pride. We have always been there for our Muskies. We would like to thank those of you in the lower bowl for joining the parade. It is truly a unique college environment. Skip Prosser built this damn house for Christ's sake, and even he was non-plussed and said it would take a few years and seasoning to get it to the right level. He wasn't that impressed compared to the Gardens, and fans complained about you piece of shat donors who sat and politely clapped. Thank God that Student Section saved you.

For years people talked about missing The Gardens and missing the games. You don't get much talk about that anymore. The Gardens did rock, that is a fact. But the Cintas rocks now. It ROCKS!

It wasn't always this thing. So spare me this "myth". D-West.

A few years ago they jacked ticket prices up on the relative poor among us in the upper seats. When seats went unsold, the then gave people deep discounts to sell tickets. I live up there, it is my world.

Season ticket holders a few years ago were paying more per ticket than other people that bought single tickets to the game because of the specials they had. I complained about it because it was stupid. We had some crew members that just dropped out. The packages were cheaper. They drove away fans.

They have since switched that formula. It is much more advantageous to buy season tickets now. But in that process they alienated and drove out hundreds of fans. Why be a sucker? That also helped diminish the power of the upper bowl, they screwed us. I wasn't giving up my tickets, but people did for good reason. People could easily buy tickets in the cheap seats for a lower price than season ticket holders. What a mess. They thankfully changed that, and it is better now. Now they shaft you for single game seats, and I am fine with that. It encourages people to buy the season tickets. But we lost people up top because of that strategy, and we lost some of our power up top, where we always reigned.

Lets say your season ticket is $20 a ticket up top. You are proud and you think that is a great price. Then lets say they run discounts and let people buy $10 tickets. After awhile people wise up and they don't buy the season tickets. It is cheaper, and you don't have to buy the games you would have no interest in going too. Many people would pass on our buy games if they could get the 4x$20=$80 plus concessions if they didn't have to take their family to Fairmount. It is a no brainer. They made a disincentive to buy the tickets, and season ticketholders felt like suckers.

We also changed the way we account for attendance, and the firm that manages the Xavier brand.

Lets talk about the firm that manages the Xavier brand.

To segue to Skip Prosser, The Man Who Built The Cintas, consider this: I remember the first time in our history that we sold out an entire season. We sold out the entire

[Snipe]

The post was getting to long and I was getting too drunk to risk passing out and deleing it .

So I will continue below.

[Snipe]

Learfield Sports!

Who are these people?

Don't they do some sort of advertisement that Xavier Basketball is a property of Learfield Sports?

Is Xavier basketball a property of Learfield Sports? Isn't that weird? Did they buy us out? Were we not Jesuit educated men for others? Who is Learfield sports?

Property? Owned?

Xavier Basketball is owned? And we are owned by Learfield Sports?

Why do they say that? It is kind of gross. They should stop that now. Even if they own my beloved, don't constantly remind me of it.

Maybe "Xavier Basketbal Is Executively Managed By Learfield Sports". That could work. "Property" is problematic. Especially when they do things that piss off fans.

Learfield Sports originally had no smoking area. We used to have one, but they said no. Learfield Sports doesn't like smokers. I am a smoker, a low rent white trash smoker, who was warned that they can't be readmitted if they leave the game.

That pissed smokers off, obviously.

And not only that, it pissed people off waiting for the family bathroom. I know this from experience. I remember one time when I had a cigarette in the family bathroom, which is an natural acculturation to that current curriculum. The guy next in line was an ANTISMOKER!
He went in behind me and then ran out pointing at me yelling, HE IS A SMOKER! THAT GUY IS A SMOKER!. I shit you not, that actually happened under the smoking ban. He acted like he wanted to punch me. Luckily, nobody in line cared. They wanted him to get back in line so they could get in line to go to the potty (AND PERHAPS SMOKE).

Peanuts were also banned. Maybe because of the allergies? NO! They were banned like contraband, and under Learfield Sports you were not allowed to bring peanuts into the game, at least for awhile. Why is that? I can't buy my peanuts from the guy outside of the game? Guess what? Look today, they have already eliminated that guy. He no longer sells because of Learfield Sports. I loved the "Cheaper on the outside" guy, and haggling with him was part of tradition. Speaking of haggling with him, Google 'Learfield Sports Jewish' and you get 12 million hits on the Google. Google 'Learfield Sports Christian' only yields 130,000 results. It is a ratio of 88 to 1 on the Google. Who knows what that means? I am too simple to comprehend it, and I think it is great! To clarify this, I was only doing the Google, and I have come to no official conclusion as to what my results of doing the Google means. I would also like to add that both the Republican Party and the Democratic Party both support the Independent Democratic State of Israel. More after these messages.

The pissed off everyone. Well, actually not everyone, but a lot of people. You could not bring in peanuts and had no more peanut vendors. You couldn't smoke. They charged you more if you were a season ticket holder with their new specials and "dynamic pricing".

Season ticket holding plummeted, and some in my crew dropped out. It was cheaper to stay away and just get the specials. Leaving me to pay full price to the buy games against shit teams. And guess what attendance was for those shit teams? I will tell you! We used to sell out, at least according to Learfield Sports! We sold out all the time! I used to have a section that was packed, and now it had huge vacant spots. Those spots in my section represented over a hundred seats, and this was only one section of many. They did a good bit of driving the fans away. They were a huge pain in the ass. To give them credit, they have changed their game and their attitude, but their initially burst was both insulting and degrading to traditional Xavier fans in the upper bowl. It really was and they left in droves. And nobody has ever attributed any of the blame to them or their "property"

[Snipe]

The JEDI!

Now lets talk about THE JEDI!

I love THE JEDI! Skip Prosser is one of the Greatest Americans that ever lived in my book. I am acutally not even a homosexual, but I still love calling another grown man (albeit a dead one) THE JEDI!.

LONG LIVE THE JEDI!!

You see I came from an era where Xavier was not a "Property" of 'Learing at Gentile Women Sports' and charging you sky top prices while banning peanuts..

I came from an era of Skip Prosser, who actually built the CINTAS CENTER.

Diss the man all you like. He never made a Sweet 16. He did sell out the season though, and he was the first to do that. We had never sold out a season, and he did it in flying colors.

Think about this excitement:

Xavier Basketball announced the every game was sold out before the team had actually played it's first game. What year was that? I remember it. We sold out the season and we hadn't even played a game. That is some serious fan excitement. Every single game was sold out before we ever played a game. To you short timers, this actually happened, and this was part of the great process when Xavier Basketball was made. We have never done that post Prosser, though we have reported many sell outs.

Under "Xavier Basketball, a property of Learfield Sports", we have had many sellouts. Sitting uptop like I do, standing behind the last row of seats I have seen the deceit. We haven't really sold out all of those games that we claim, and even non-sellouts had some bare attendance. DWEST talks about how overrated the uptop is, and he has no idea of the decimation of the uptop. We didn't always have the empty seats until we were a "Property of Learfield Sports", and then they became legion. Do they ever get credit for driving our best fans away? At least their margin on Peanuts is much better now! Why not cut off your nose to spite your face?

If Learfield is still in charge, they are doing a much better job now. That doesn't discount the damage that they did uptop for a micro-generation of Xavier Hoops. I go to all the games and I have seen how it plays out.

[Snipe]

To sum it up:

The Gardens Rocked beyond belief.

Early on the Cintas was lacking

The Upper Bowl of the Cintas rocked much better than the paid pansies of the effeminate lower bowl.

Making Xavier Basketball a wholly owned "Property"of some sleek marketing firm didn't do all that well, until we became a Top 5 team. And it is probably despite it.

Learfield Sports desiccated the upper bowl and tore it up, causing unrest. They had incredible price hikes for season ticket holders, followed by ridiculous discount tickets for the proles and then they inflated the crowd counts once they knew their strategy had failed. They never apologized or admitted failure to long time fans.

The Cintas was bailed out by Chris Mack's brigade of Students, who have been the best Student Section in the history of Xavier Basketball. They have for the first time made the lower bowl an interesting place, and much more of a place to be. In fact with the desiccation of the upper bowl the Student Section has in fact saved the Cintas Center Xavier Basketball Experience, and even added more so that when we pack it now it is more than it ever has been.

So now we are packing the upper bowl. It again has actual patrons in the seats without creative accounting. We are actually finally selling out all of these games. And we have the best student section in Xavier history. The lower bowl to their credit has been spurred into action and has come into form. It is no longer a sin for a fan down there to get rowdy, and they are not longer asked to sit down.

And it all adds up to this. All Hell Is Gonna Break Loose When We Play #1 Villanova. It is going to be standing room only and off the cuff. Do what you can to get a ticket, because past complaints aside, this is going to be the biggest game in Xavier History. And if you do have a ticket, I hope you don't expect to sit down much. The House is gonna rock!

[Masterofreality]

I love me some Snipe, but two things are not true in the above endless rants:

A) Skip Prosser most assuredly did not build Cintas. Cintas was built under the expansive leadership of one Top Jimmy Hoff, and money from the (primarily) lower bowl "whine and cheese" crowd that dug deep in the pockets to shell out $44 million, plus a great contribution from the Cintas Corporation.
B) Us whine and cheesers..yeah, those of us in the lower bowl end zone count too....Me,Musketeer Grad Daughter & Husband, , Muskie and wife, Nuts4XU, GladdenGuy, Pimp in the Box plus family and numerous others....don't just sit on our freaking hands. We get after it. Unless someone has a way to pay back the fat cats that paid huge bucks..and still pay big seat license fees every year to sit low sideline between the baselines and move students in there, the crowd will be as it is...and as it should be anyway.

While the proletariat may wail away, Cintas is the finest private school funded basketball facility in history...funded on the backs and butts of the Moneyed Elite. Without them, we'd still be toiling away in a rotting Cincinnati Gardens or in some lousy little Cintas wanna be like the "Kennel" at Gone-zaga.
Stop screaming about the 1%ers.....and make your best efforts to join the Lower Bowl Army!!:jumpforjoy:

[LadyMuskie]

Stop screaming about the 1%ers.....and make your best efforts to join the Lower Bowl Army!!:jumpforjoy:

Exactly!

I think the lower bowl moaning and groaning is nonsense anyway. I know that where my parents sit (second row from the court by the bench), it's loud and can be obnoxious thanks to the drinks flowing from The Joseph Club. My parents (both in their 60s) certainly don't shy away from cheering, standing, yelling, and the players have certainly indicated their appreciation for the support post many a game.

Bottom line - why doesn't everyone just go to the game and cheer as hard as possible and not worry about what other people are doing unless it somehow puts you in harm's way? No one died and made any of us Mr. or Mrs. Cheer Captain.

[fellahmuskie]

I enjoyed Snipe's ramblings. It made me realize how lucky my wife and I got two years when we bought season tickets for the first time. I love my row F seats in 201, especially since they've been so affordable for the last two seasons. But I'm starting to worry about the future. With kids on the way, I'm going to need at least 2 more - I hope I can find a decent group of 4 in 201 this summer. It might be my last chance, given the direction this program is headed.

[X-man]

I love me some Snipe, but two things are not true in the above endless rants:

A) Skip Prosser most assuredly did not build Cintas. Cintas was built under the expansive leadership of one Top Jimmy Hoff, and money from the (primarily) lower bowl "whine and cheese" crowd that dug deep in the pockets to shell out $44 million, plus a great contribution from the Cintas Corporation.
B) Us whine and cheesers..yeah, those of us in the lower bowl end zone count too....Me,Musketeer Grad Daughter & Husband, , Muskie and wife, Nuts4XU, GladdenGuy, Pimp in the Box plus family and numerous others....don't just sit on our freaking hands. We get after it. Unless someone has a way to pay back the fat cats that paid huge bucks..and still pay big seat license fees every year to sit low sideline between the baselines and move students in there, the crowd will be as it is...and as it should be anyway.

While the proletariat may wail away, Cintas is the finest private school funded basketball facility in history...funded on the backs and butts of the Moneyed Elite. Without them, we'd still be toiling away in a rotting Cincinnati Gardens or in some lousy little Cintas wanna be like the "Kennel" at Gone-zaga.
Stop screaming about the 1%ers.....and make your best efforts to join the Lower Bowl Army!!:jumpforjoy:

Amen, from another Lower Bowler who (1) pays through the nose for his two seats in Section 104 (I could have 2 free ones as an XU faculty member, but choose instead to support the program and get great seats surrounded by friends), and (2) is hoarse after most games from cheering and ragging on the ref's.

[bleedXblue]

I love me some Snipe, but two things are not true in the above endless rants:

A) Skip Prosser most assuredly did not build Cintas. Cintas was built under the expansive leadership of one Top Jimmy Hoff, and money from the (primarily) lower bowl "whine and cheese" crowd that dug deep in the pockets to shell out $44 million, plus a great contribution from the Cintas Corporation.
B) Us whine and cheesers..yeah, those of us in the lower bowl end zone count too....Me,Musketeer Grad Daughter & Husband, , Muskie and wife, Nuts4XU, GladdenGuy, Pimp in the Box plus family and numerous others....don't just sit on our freaking hands. We get after it. Unless someone has a way to pay back the fat cats that paid huge bucks..and still pay big seat license fees every year to sit low sideline between the baselines and move students in there, the crowd will be as it is...and as it should be anyway.

While the proletariat may wail away, Cintas is the finest private school funded basketball facility in history...funded on the backs and butts of the Moneyed Elite. Without them, we'd still be toiling away in a rotting Cincinnati Gardens or in some lousy little Cintas wanna be like the "Kennel" at Gone-zaga.
Stop screaming about the 1%ers.....and make your best efforts to join the Lower Bowl Army!!:jumpforjoy:

you actually read ALL of that?

[Fireball]

Xavier basketball is a product, and I have very little issue with how people consume that product. There are people who LOVE Xavier basketball that can't go to many or any games. That doesn't mean that they are lesser fans than those of us who have season tickets. If people show up late and/or leave early, that's what they do.

Me, I'm there at least a half hour early (mainly to ensure I get a good parking spot) and don't leave until 0:00.0. That's what *I* do.

The only thing that drives me nuts is when people are going in and out during game action. I don't care if you come late, leave early, and go in and out to get 10 beers. It is enormously rude to get up and to expect people to get up and allow you to pass through when they are trying to watch the game. Wait until a timeout or play has at least stopped before you move in and out of your seats. Other people are trying to watch the game.

[ammtd34]

The only thing that drives me nuts is when people are going in and out during game action. I don't care if you come late, leave early, and go in and out to get 10 beers. It is enormously rude to get up and to expect people to get up and allow you to pass through when they are trying to watch the game. Wait until a timeout or play has at least stopped before you move in and out of your seats. Other people are trying to watch the game.

My wife's grandparents have had season tickets at UD forever. We go to 3 or 4 games a year there. This year, they make an announcement before the game that you may only enter or exit your seat during a stoppage in play. When the ball is in play, ushers stand at the top of each aisle and people using the restroom or concessions have to wait until a whistle to get back to their seat.

[paulxu]

The building blocks of Xavier's program are many, as are the people who put them in place.
It goes back years, and each is important. Hoff, the big ticket donors, Skip and all the coaches who have helped create our place in basketball.
When I went, there were only 2 of us from Tennessee. It was primarily a commuter school, with dorm people from the Midwest and some Mid-Atlantic. And Schmidt...where I could always get in.

For those of us who can't experience the lower bowl, let alone Snipe's perch on the balcony, we are left with AFO contributions and TV.
So I am thankful that we've moved to a conference which negotiated a deal which allows me many more chances to see the team.
The periodic, long distance visit to the Cintas is just icing on the cake.

Just look at the Top 10. All big state schools...except for Xavier and Villanova.

Break the damn door down.

[X-man]

My wife's grandparents have had season tickets at UD forever. We go to 3 or 4 games a year there. This year, they make an announcement before the game that you may only enter or exit your seat during a stoppage in play. When the ball is in play, ushers stand at the top of each aisle and people using the restroom or concessions have to wait until a whistle to get back to their seat.

Yet another reason to never play the cryers again....damn Nazi ushers!

[muethibp]

My wife's grandparents have had season tickets at UD forever. We go to 3 or 4 games a year there. This year, they make an announcement before the game that you may only enter or exit your seat during a stoppage in play. When the ball is in play, ushers stand at the top of each aisle and people using the restroom or concessions have to wait until a whistle to get back to their seat.

Trump is right. Our freedom really is under attack.

[Masterofreality]

you actually read ALL of that?

Speed reading. :rolleyes:

[Muskie1000]

Ok I'm all about cheering and such but what do you think about over the top cheering. Cheering to such a point where it makes everyone else around you miserable. That's the problem I'm having now. Screaming (and I mean roller coaster type screaming) at the top of their lungs FOR THE ENTIRE GAME - even when there is not reason to be screaming. I've brought many friends this year and I keep getting the same question - what is wrong with that guy? We are at the point we are thinking of moving our seats its becoming so distracting.

[LA Muskie]

Xavier basketball is a product, and I have very little issue with how people consume that product. There are people who LOVE Xavier basketball that can't go to many or any games. That doesn't mean that they are lesser fans than those of us who have season tickets. If people show up late and/or leave early, that's what they do.

Me, I'm there at least a half hour early (mainly to ensure I get a good parking spot) and don't leave until 0:00.0. That's what *I* do.

The only thing that drives me nuts is when people are going in and out during game action. I don't care if you come late, leave early, and go in and out to get 10 beers. It is enormously rude to get up and to expect people to get up and allow you to pass through when they are trying to watch the game. Wait until a timeout or play has at least stopped before you move in and out of your seats. Other people are trying to watch the game.

At NBA games there's not in/out except during stoppages. Seems like XU could adopt that policy. Although it requires stewards at every concourse exit/entrance.

Edit: I just saw they do this at UD too. So there must be something wrong with it.


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[LA Muskie]

Ok I'm all about cheering and such but what do you think about over the top cheering. Cheering to such a point where it makes everyone else around you miserable. That's the problem I'm having now. Screaming (and I mean roller coaster type screaming) at the top of their lungs FOR THE ENTIRE GAME - even when there is not reason to be screaming. I've brought many friends this year and I keep getting the same question - what is wrong with that guy? We are at the point we are thinking of moving our seats its becoming so distracting.

If one doesn't want to deal with "excessive cheering" there's always the sofa at home.


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[D-West & PO-Z]

Ok I'm all about cheering and such but what do you think about over the top cheering. Cheering to such a point where it makes everyone else around you miserable. That's the problem I'm having now. Screaming (and I mean roller coaster type screaming) at the top of their lungs FOR THE ENTIRE GAME - even when there is not reason to be screaming. I've brought many friends this year and I keep getting the same question - what is wrong with that guy? We are at the point we are thinking of moving our seats its becoming so distracting.

Please tell me you are in section 202. There is a guy there that is unbearable!

[Lamont Sanford]

Ok I'm all about cheering and such but what do you think about over the top cheering. Cheering to such a point where it makes everyone else around you miserable. That's the problem I'm having now. Screaming (and I mean roller coaster type screaming) at the top of their lungs FOR THE ENTIRE GAME - even when there is not reason to be screaming. I've brought many friends this year and I keep getting the same question - what is wrong with that guy? We are at the point we are thinking of moving our seats its becoming so distracting.

What section are you in? Snipe usually just stands at the top of 208 and scream/rants.

[D-West & PO-Z]

If one doesn't want to deal with "excessive cheering" there's always the sofa at home.


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I'm pretty vocal and enthusiastic cheerer but I get what he is saying, I have experienced some people who are constant and not in a good cheering way but a complaining about every single call way, a complaining about our own players way, a cussing excessively way, and the likes. There can be obnoxious, over the top, time ruining "cheerers". I have had that problem in Cintas before with the exact same guy every time and have had numerous friends who havent been to games with me in years remember and reference that guy.

[XMuskieFTW]

Ok I'm all about cheering and such but what do you think about over the top cheering. Cheering to such a point where it makes everyone else around you miserable. That's the problem I'm having now. Screaming (and I mean roller coaster type screaming) at the top of their lungs FOR THE ENTIRE GAME - even when there is not reason to be screaming. I've brought many friends this year and I keep getting the same question - what is wrong with that guy? We are at the point we are thinking of moving our seats its becoming so distracting.

You wouldn't be as miserable if you joined him!

[LA Muskie]

I'm pretty vocal and enthusiastic cheerer but I get what he is saying, I have experienced some people who are constant and not in a good cheering way but a complaining about every single call way, a complaining about our own players way, a cussing excessively way, and the likes. There can be obnoxious, over the top, time ruining "cheerers". I have had that problem in Cintas before with the exact same guy every time and have had numerous friends who havent been to games with me in years remember and reference that guy.

Yeah, I'm not sure why I posted that. It was unnecessarily (and wrongly) dismissive. There are certainly obnoxious fans at just about every arena. That said, I'm not sure there's much you can do but move to a different section.


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[XMuskieFTW]

I'll be the first to admit I can be over the top at times, but it's not in a horrible way. I never swear or just scream randomly, but I will badgers the refs through a tv timeout after a horrible call, I will yell in excitement after just about every basket we score, block we get, etc, hell at the DePaul game I was yelling at Billy Garrett every time he touched the ball. I'm never vulgar about it and there's definitely a limit, but since I'm younger I feel I have more free reign to be ridiculous. I'm sure I'll dial it back a bit at some point. Also I've never had a Xavier fan tell me to be quiet, only the opposing team's fans, so I feel like I'm doing my job.

[Muskie1000]

No I don't sit in 202 but 201. And the obnoxious sit on the couch remark was uncalled for. Cheering for your team is to be expected but this is excessive to the point of being obnoxious. Yelling about every call, and when I'm saying yelling I'm being kind. I yell and scream and cheer and applaud. I already had to contact someone because of his yelling cuss words. I know he thinks that they can hear him on the floor and I'm here to tell him that they can not as I've sat in the below deck for a game and I couldn't hear him AT ALL. Someone should not be so loud that they ruin the experience for everyone else there. Maybe they need to go sit on their couch and yell to their hearts content.

[D-West & PO-Z]

That said, I'm not sure there's much you can do but move to a different section.


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Yeah unfortunately people have to do this. I guess the only time something could be done is if the excessive yelling is always profanity. I'm sure there is some kind of clause against that.

[Cheesehead]

"I already had to contact someone because of his yelling cuss words"

and You actually contacted the wrong person on that one. As I told you before, I don't swear at the games. This thread got hijacked.

For the record I am not the person you are talking about either.

[D-West & PO-Z]

"I already had to contact someone because of his yelling cuss words"

and You actually contacted the wrong person on that one. As I told you before, I don't swear at the games. This thread got hijacked.

For the record I am not the person you are talking about either.

Huh?

[Cheesehead]

Huh?

Muskie 1000 is talking about a person who sits near me that I know. I am done with this.

[Muskie1000]

"I already had to contact someone because of his yelling cuss words"

and You actually contacted the wrong person on that one. As I told you before, I don't swear at the games. This thread got hijacked.

For the record I am not the person you are talking about either.

Not you, your buddy - I swear he is getting worse every game. Now the person we sit next too wants to move to a different section and I've been in 201 since the place opened. I'm just frustrated because there is no need for him to act like that.

[xubrew]

There is not an unfiltered stream of consciousness anywhere in the world that is better than Snipe!! It just isn't possible!! You don't even have to read it to know it's great!! THAT'S HOW GREAT IT IS!!!

We've got Snipe!! That's all we need. Kids brag about how their dad can beat up your dad. In the message board world, we win the equivalent of that argument every single time!! We've got Snipe!! We win!! Game over!!!

[waggy]

Excessive yelling is lame.

I would throw him off the balcony.

[Milhouse]

Not you, your buddy - I swear he is getting worse every game. Now the person we sit next too wants to move to a different section and I've been in 201 since the place opened. I'm just frustrated because there is no need for him to act like that.

Oh I definitely want to hear more about this now.

Also what I'd like to see: UC does a happy hour at their football games- its the first hour their stadium is open- so if they open 90 mins early for a 1 p.m. game it would be a happy hour from 11:30a-12:30p. And it is half priced beer at that point.

I'd love to see X adopt that, I'm usually walking in at the national anthem/starting lineups as I prefer to grab food/drinks somewhere close before the game and not spend $7 per bud light.

[zanesxu]

"I already had to contact someone because of his yelling cuss words"

and You actually contacted the wrong person on that one. As I told you before, I don't swear at the games. This thread got hijacked.

For the record I am not the person you are talking about either.

Think I need to invest in the company that runs 321-JERK

[GoMuskies]

Think I need to invest in the company that runs 321-JERK

Yeah, well the Jerk Store called, and it's running out of you.

[zanesxu]

I'll be the first to admit I can be over the top at times, but it's not in a horrible way. I never swear or just scream randomly, but I will badgers the refs through a tv timeout after a horrible call, I will yell in excitement after just about every basket we score, block we get, etc, hell at the DePaul game I was yelling at Billy Garrett every time he touched the ball. I'm never vulgar about it and there's definitely a limit, but since I'm younger I feel I have more free reign to be ridiculous. I'm sure I'll dial it back a bit at some point. Also I've never had a Xavier fan tell me to be quiet, only the opposing team's fans, so I feel like I'm doing my job.

This is just great fandom... Along with reminder "Airball" chants, "Sit Down Bentil", "Left-Right-Left-Right" when someone fouls out, "Welcome Fellow Scholars", etc...

[zanesxu]

Yeah, well the Jerk Store called, and it's running out of you.

What's the difference, you're their all-time best seller?!

[GoMuskies]

What's the difference, you're their all-time best seller?

Oh yeah, well I had SEX with YOUR WIFE!

[zanesxu]

Oh yeah, well I had SEX with YOUR WIFE!

His wife... she's in a coma...