Florida going after Mack?

[Drew's Crew]

With the Florida job available, unsurprisingly Mack and Archie are rumored to be the top two targets.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out....

Thoughts?

[bobbiemcgee]

Keep an eye on Foley's plane:

http://flightaware.com/photos/view/53567-38afb42874717145bec837c531867079b13ff8f0/aircrafttype/C680

[Emp]

With the Florida job available, unsurprisingly Mack and Archie are rumored to be the top two targets.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out....

Thoughts?. Rumored by.....whom? You? Sources please.

[Xavier]

Id be shocked if Mack ends up at Florida. But if he does I'd hope Archie is on the short list and I don't think X would miss a beat.

[LA Muskie]

. Rumored by.....whom? You? Sources please.
Among others: Jeff Goodman, Jeff Borzello, Pete Thamel, and Gary Parrish.

[Masterofreality]

Who cares?

I'm tired of this stuff. Whatever happens, happens.

[Milhouse]

Id be shocked if Mack ends up at Florida. But if he does I'd hope Archie is on the short list and I don't think X would miss a beat.

I just don't understand how people think it's remotely possible that Archie would come to X....why would he want to be in his brothers shadows?

Archie would likely have to turn Florida down for Mack to go there.

I don't see either of them turning Florida down.

[GoMuskies]

Who cares?

I'm tired of this stuff. Whatever happens, happens.

I'm definitely less emotionally invested than I was when this was going on with Matta and Miller. I'm not sure if it's that I don't like Mack as much as I liked those two, or if it's because I feel like Xavier as a program is in a better place to handle losing a coach.

Either way, I'm not at all worried no matter what happens.

[Cheesehead]

Anyone live near Lunken Airport?

[casualfan]

Who cares?

I'm tired of this stuff. Whatever happens, happens.

There are 9 (now 10) posts in this thread so obviously some do...

[throwbackmuskie]

Mack is not leaving.

[XU 87]

Mack is not leaving.

And you know this how?

[throwbackmuskie]

And you know this how?

Well since it is a MB, and if I say how I know, people will just attack, so, let's just say he's not leaving.

[Always Learning]

With the Florida job available, unsurprisingly Mack and Archie are rumored to be the top two targets.

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out....

Thoughts?

Relax UF will will make John Pelphrey. Head coaching experience at South Alabama and Arkansas and two stints as UF assistant.

[DC Muskie]

Well since it is a MB, and if I say how I know, people will just attack, so, let's just say he's not leaving.

May I attack you for not sharing how you know?

[GoMuskies]

John Pelphrey has about as much chance of getting the job as I do.

[GoMuskies]

May I attack you for not sharing how you know?

Of course you can.

[DC Muskie]

of course you can.

great!

[throwbackmuskie]

May I attack you for not sharing how you know?

Sure why not, that is what MBs are about anymore.

[DC Muskie]

Sure why not, that is what MBs are about anymore.

Why don't you tell how you know then? I mean COME ON, blibby, blah, blah, blip, grumble, grumble, blah, blip, blah.

We should know your resources!

/slams keyboard
//feels satisfied

[XU 87]

Well since it is a MB, and if I say how I know, people will just attack, so, let's just say he's not leaving.

Just tell us something generically, without naming names or identifying people, as to how or why you know Mack's not leaving.

And I 'm not attacking you. I just want to know.

P.S. are you saying this because of the rumor that Archie is their first choice?

[Masterofreality]

Mack is not leaving.

I endorse this statement.

[throwbackmuskie]

Just tell us something generically, without naming names or identifying people, as to how or why you know Mack's not leaving.

And I 'm not attacking you. I just want to know.

P.S. are you saying this because of the rumor that Archie is their first choice?

No.

From things I have been told in the past, I feel confident that Mack will not be leaving anytime soon.

[XU 87]

No.

From things I have been told in the past, I feel confident that Mack will not be leaving anytime soon.

I hope you're right. But if you're wrong, you will be attacked mercilessly. :)

[RealDeal]

Thom Brennaman last night in the 3rd (I think) inning on a Votto double "and the Reds will plate their first run." Cozart was held at third and never scored.

Thom back when he started out used to call home runs on warning track shots. Used to drive me nuts.

Moral of the story, don't be a Thom Brenneman. ;)

Hope you're right.

[LA Muskie]

No.

From things I have been told in the past, I feel confident that Mack will not be leaving anytime soon.

If Mack does not leave it's because he was not offered. If Foley wants him he's gone. You can take that to the bank.

[throwbackmuskie]

If Mack does not leave it's because he was not offered. If Foley wants him he's gone. You can take that to the bank.

what is your source on this one?

[ballyhoohoo]

what is your source on this one?

Florid as bank statement

[muskiefan82]

I believe that if Florida offers and Mack accepts, he will leave.
I believe that if Florida offers and Mack does not accept the offer, he will not go to Florida next year
I believe that if Florida doesn't offer it to Mack at all, that he will not be going to Florida next year.

I feel very confident in my assertions.

[throwbackmuskie]

Florid as bank statement

Which a lot of it is tied up right now. Football coaches money/buyouts and facilities upgrades. UF have some of the worse facilities for a power 5 school.

[casualfan]

Which a lot of it is tied up right now. Football coaches money/buyouts and facilites upgrades. UF have some of the worse facilities for a power 5 school.

Not for long
(http://www.onlygators.com/02/10/2015/while-team-falters-florida-gators-making-commitment-to-stephen-c-oconnell-center-basketball-facilities/)

Their arena is getting a $60 million facelift and they are also updating the weight room and probably adding athletic dorms.

To put the $60 million in perspective that's about what it would cost to build Cintas from scratch in today's dollars.

[LA Muskie]

what is your source on this one?

1. Some personal knowledge and relationships (but not specific to this possible opportunity).

2. Opinions of those I trust with even more knowledge and closer relationships (both generally in regards to Mack and specifically with respect to this particular possibility).

3. My experience as a sports fan in general.

4. Common sense.

[throwbackmuskie]

Not for long
(http://www.onlygators.com/02/10/2015/while-team-falters-florida-gators-making-commitment-to-stephen-c-oconnell-center-basketball-facilities/)

Their arena is getting a $60 million facelift and they are also updating the weight room and probably adding athletic dorms.

To put the $60 million in perspective that's about what it would cost to build Cintas from scratch in today's dollars.

only took them 3 years to finally start to do it. They are way behind when it comes to facilities.

[Masterofreality]

Why is "bank" always the deciding criteria?

For many, yes. For some, maybe even many, no.

I've had a very comfortable life with fine income. I have been offered other jobs in other areas with much higher pay, yet the overall quality of life where I am and stability for my family have always outweighed the move- especially since extended family is close by. There is no amount of money that outweighs that. I am proud that my kids had a stable upbringing with friends that they made in kindergarten and will be their friends for life. I have a happy trophy wife in a place that she wants to be. I have a job with a company that has been very good and fair to me over the long term. More cash can't buy that.

Both CMack and his wife have their families close by. Mack is making enough money now to secure both his and his kids' futures. He's at a place that he has loved for years. Why the hell would Gainesville be a step up? Unless you're an NFL football player, your life isn't long enough to spend the jack you make and when you move your job working conditions may not be as good as you have left.

Is there really a chance that Florida can get to a Final Four faster than Xavier? I don't think so. Why go, unless you are a carpetbagger like Beaknose and the Raccoon.

And with that, I am sick of these discussions.

[throwbackmuskie]

1. Some personal knowledge and relationships (but not specific to this possible opportunity).

2. Opinions of those I trust with even more knowledge and closer relationships (both generally in regards to Mack and specifically with respect to this particular possibility).

3. My experience as a sports fan in general.

4. Common sense.

I guess we will see who is right.

[casualfan]

Why is "bank" always the deciding criteria?

For many, yes. For some, maybe even many, no.

I've had a very comfortable life with fine income. I have been offered other jobs in other areas with much higher pay, yet the overall quality of life where I am and stability for my family have always outweighed the move- especially since extended family is close by. There is no amount of money that outweighs that. I am proud that my kids had a stable upbringing with friends that they made in kindergarten and will be their friends for life. I have a happy trophy wife in a place that she wants to be. I have a job with a company that has been very good and fair to me over the long term. More cash can't buy that.

Both CMack and his wife have their families close by. Mack is making enough money now to secure both his and his kids' futures. He's at a place that he has loved for years. Why the hell would Gainesville be a step up? Unless you're an NFL football player, your life isn't long enough to spend the jack you make and when you move your job working conditions may not be as good as you have left.

Is there really a chance that Florida can get to a Final Four faster than Xavier? I don't think so. Why go, unless you are a carpetbagger like Beaknose and the Raccoon.

And with that, I am sick of these discussions.

They've already been to 5...

[Masterofreality]

They've already been to 5...

Four under the guy who just left, and one under a guy who 3 years later resigned in disgrace after a losing season.

No guarantee of a future. (See Crean, Tom....Indiana)

[casualfan]

Four under the guy who just left, and one under a guy who 3 years later resigned in disgrace after a losing season.

No guarantee of a future. (See Crean, Tom....Indiana)

Your question was can Florida get to a FF faster than Xavier.

My response is that given they have done it 5 times to our 0 I think you'd be hard-pressed to answer that question with a no.

[LA Muskie]

MOR, I think money is more the result than the goal. Like elite players, elite coaches are RIDICULOUSLY competitive. Far, far more than most of us ordinary people. It often is what drives them more than anything else. To say it generally defines them, that their identities are inextricably intertwined with them, would not be exaggeration.

Because of that, the vast majority of coaches are looking to reach the pinnacle of their chosen careers. Those jobs often come with big pay checks. But I tend to doubt that's the reason coaches want to go there. They go because they want to win, win big, win big for a long time, and become a legend. They want to be the Coach K, Izzo, Calipari, Pitino, Boeheim, Calhoun. And yes, Donovan. Being those people -- or as successful as them -- makes you rich. Not vice-versa.

And coaches perceive that the best way to get there -- to be discussed in the same breath as those legends -- is to emulate them. To work at their schools, or schools like them. You don't see too many of them at small, non-P5 schools. Even exceptionally good non-P5 basketball schools like ours.

Sure you have your Mark Fews. But they are few and far between. And I'm not sure there are many coaches who want to be him. He'll be forgotten almost immediately after he retires, except in the upper northwest. And that's fine. He'll be happy just being a legend in his hometown.

But most coaches aspire to more than that. And I believe that, when push comes to shove, Chris is one of them.

[LA Muskie]

Four under the guy who just left, and one under a guy who 3 years later resigned in disgrace after a losing season.

No guarantee of a future. (See Crean, Tom....Indiana)

True. There are no guarantees in sport. And very few in life.

But the best predictor of future performance is past performance. So I'd still take their odds given their 5-0 advantage to this point.

[Mrs. Garrett]

MOR, I think money is more the result than the goal. Like elite players, elite coaches are RIDICULOUSLY competitive. Far, far more than most of us ordinary people. It often is what drives them more than anything else. To say it generally defines them, that their identities are inextricably intertwined with them, would not be exaggeration.

Because of that, the vast majority of coaches are looking to reach the pinnacle of their chosen careers. Those jobs often come with big pay checks. But I tend to doubt that's the reason coaches want to go there. They go because they want to win, win big, win big for a long time, and become a legend. They want to be the Coach K, Izzo, Calipari, Pitino, Boeheim, Calhoun. And yes, Donovan. Being those people -- or as successful as them -- makes you rich. Not vice-versa.

And coaches perceive that the best way to get there -- to be discussed in the same breath as those legends -- is to emulate them. To work at their schools, or schools like them. You don't see too many of them at small, non-P5 schools. Even exceptionally good non-P5 basketball schools like ours.

Sure you have your Mark Fews. But they are few and far between. And I'm not sure there are many coaches who want to be him. He'll be forgotten almost immediately after he retires, except in the upper northwest. And that's fine. He'll be happy just being a legend in his hometown.

But most coaches aspire to more than that. And I believe that, when push comes to shove, Chris is one of them.

I wouldn't want to be the guy who follows any of the coaches listed above. I think you wind up with very little room for error. Would X ever consider firing Mack if he consistently makes the Sweet 16, but he never gets us past that point? Possibly, but probably not. How long will it be before Florida expects another Final 4? Guys like Howland found out how being pretty damn good without a championship works out.

[LA Muskie]

I wouldn't want to be the guy who follows any of the coaches listed above. I think you wind up with very little room for error. Would X ever consider firing Mack if he consistently makes the Sweet 16, but he never gets us past that point? Possibly, but probably not. How long will it be before Florida expects another Final 4? Guys like Howland found out how being pretty damn good without a championship works out.
I don't necessarily disagree with your premise. But I think it misses the point on the psychology of most coaches. Your premise is rooted in the downside ("If I don't win big like Donovan, I'll get fired."). But especially going into new jobs, coaches are far more motivated by the upside. Particularly given the long-term contract that helps mitigate the downside risk.

[blobfan]

I don't necessarily disagree with your premise. But I think it misses the point on the psychology of most coaches. Your premise is rooted in the downside ("If I don't win big like Donovan, I'll get fired."). But especially going into new jobs, coaches are far more motivated by the upside. Particularly given the long-term contract that helps mitigate the downside risk.

Unless Chris truly believes he can take X to the Final Four and beyond, in which case his competitive side may lead him to stay here rather than leave to do something that's been done before. He's a young guy and can spend 5 years getting us there then 10-years at another school if that's what he wants. The only other point of concern in my mind is does he get along with Christopher.

[bjf123]

I believe that if Florida offers and Mack accepts, he will leave.
I believe that if Florida offers and Mack does not accept the offer, he will not go to Florida next year
I believe that if Florida doesn't offer it to Mack at all, that he will not be going to Florida next year.

I feel very confident in my assertions.

No argument from me!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[LA Muskie]

Unless Chris truly believes he can take X to the Final Four and beyond, in which case his competitive side may lead him to stay here rather than leave to do something that's been done before. He's a young guy and can spend 5 years getting us there then 10-years at another school if that's what he wants. The only other point of concern in my mind is does he get along with Christopher.
I think you are engaging in wishful thinking if you think that's the way Mack (or the vast majority of coaches) would approach the question. But I will grant you it is a theoretical possibility.

If Mack leaves it will not have anything to do, whatsoever, with the relationship he has with Greg Christopher.

[blobfan]

I think you are engaging in wishful thinking if you think that's the way Mack (or the vast majority of coaches) would approach the question. But I will grant you it is a theoretical possibility.

If Mack leaves it will not have anything to do, whatsoever, with the relationship he has with Greg Christopher.

You don't think a coach is more likely to leave for another job if he doesn't get along with the Athletic Director‽

[MADXSTER]

Think LA was stating that Chris and Greg get along just fine.

[LA Muskie]

Correct Madxtser.

[Masterofreality]

Your question was can Florida get to a FF faster than Xavier.

My response is that given they have done it 5 times to our 0 I think you'd be hard-pressed to answer that question with a no.

From today forward, I'd say NO!

[muethibp]

Anyone that thinks Chris Mack is turning down an offer to be the basketball coach at Florida so as to remain the basketball coach at Xavier...is delusional. Only question is whether it is offered to him.

[The Coz]

1. Some personal knowledge and relationships (but not specific to this possible opportunity).

2. Opinions of those I trust with even more knowledge and closer relationships (both generally in regards to Mack and specifically with respect to this particular possibility).

3. My experience as a sports fan in general.

4. Common sense.

Ha ha. The vainglorious one strikes again. You'll notice LA guilty of the exact same hubris for which he ran Crawford off. Hypocrite.

LA to be the new host of The Insider.

[Masterofreality]

Your question was can Florida get to a FF faster than Xavier.

My response is that given they have done it 5 times to our 0 I think you'd be hard-pressed to answer that question with a no.


True. There are no guarantees in sport. And very few in life.

But the best predictor of future performance is past performance. So I'd still take their odds given their 5-0 advantage to this point.


Anyone that thinks Chris Mack is turning down an offer to be the basketball coach at Florida so as to remain the basketball coach at Xavier...is delusional. Only question is whether it is offered to him.

Sporting News CBB writer Mike DeCoursey disagrees as to the quality of the Florida job.

"@tsnmike: Florida is not a top-10 job. Not a chance. Might be safe to say top 20, but I'm sure there would be arguments."

[GoMuskies]

Kentucky, Indiana, Duke, Louisville, UCLA, North Carolina, Michigan State, Ohio State, Kansas, Texas

There are 10 better in less than 60 seconds.

[LA Muskie]

Ha ha. The vainglorious one strikes again. You'll notice LA guilty of the exact same hubris for which he ran Crawford off. Hypocrite.
Huh? I honestly have no idea what this means. Someone asked me the basis for my OPINION (as that's all it is), and I answered it.

[waggy]

kentucky, xavier, duke, louisville, ucla, north carolina, michigan state, ohio state, kansas, texas

there are 10 better in less than 60 seconds.

ftfy

[bobbiemcgee]

2 NC's, 4 FF's, 8 Elite 8's in the last 20 or so yrs. yeah, definitely top 10.

[GoMuskies]

2 NC's, 4 FF's, 8 Elite 8's in the last 20 or so yrs. yeah, definitely top 10.

Donovan is a top 10 coach. Florida is not a top 10 program.

[muethibp]

I don't know if it's top 10 nor does it really matter. It's a materially more desirable job than Xavier - which is fine, nothing to be ashamed of - and that's all that really matters right now.

[LA Muskie]

Sporting News CBB writer Mike DeCoursey disagrees as to the quality of the Florida job.

"@tsnmike: Florida is not a top-10 job. Not a chance. Might be safe to say top 20, but I'm sure there would be arguments."
MOR, you have conflated two distinct issues. I, for one, never said Florida was a Top 10 job. Nor do I recall anyone else saying so. I said that after about the Top 5 (Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, North Carolina, and Michigan State if you ask me) they'd at least have to be in the discussion. And I think that discussion would involve about 10-15 schools (depending on the metrics chosen to rank them), so they could be anywhere from 6 to 20. But I don't think they'd crack the Top 10 under most metrics.

[GoMuskies]

It's a materially more desirable job than Xavier

I don't know. Maybe. If Mack decides that it is, I guess. I certainly don't think of Florida as some powerhouse program that coaches would be falling all over themselves to be a part of.

[LA Muskie]

Donovan is a top 10 coach. Florida is not a top 10 program.
By that logic where do you place Duke, Michigan State, and Louisville?

[GoMuskies]

Louisville is MILES ahead of Florida by any standard.

[GoMuskies]

By that logic where do you place Duke, Michigan State, and Louisville?

So, here are how these three stack up to Florida when you exclude their current coaches (and remember that K has been at Duke since 1980):

Florida - 5 NCAA Tournaments, 1 Final Four, 0 championships

Duke - 8 NCAA Tournaments, 4 Final Fours, 0 championships

MSU - 11 NCAA Tournaments, 2 Final Fours, 1 championship

Louisville - 28 NCAA Tournaments, 7 Final Fours, 2 championships

So to answer your question, I would rate those programs WAY, WAY, WAY (WAY) above Florida.

[bobbiemcgee]

Huh? So you're excluding 72 yrs. of coaching?

[GoMuskies]

Huh? So you're excluding 68 yrs. of coaching?

If you include the current coaches, Florida is a complete joke compared to the others. If LA's theory was that all three other schools were "one coach wonders" like Florida, well, he's wrong.

[JTG]

Yes Donovan has had lots of success at Florida. But very few care. Aside from UK, basketball is an afterthought at most Southern schools. You ask 90% of the people on the street about Florida and they would say football. For all that success Billy has had, only basketball junkies would be knowledgeable of all the Final Four and Elite 8s etc. Other than the times we played them, I never think of Fla. Now that doesn't mean that if they pull a Brinks truck up to Mack's door that he won't take it. Basketball is important @ Xavier, and there is something to be said for being the big fish.

[LA Muskie]

So, here are how these three stack up to Florida when you exclude their current coaches (and remember that K has been at Duke since 1980):

Florida - 5 NCAA Tournaments, 1 Final Four, 0 championships

Duke - 8 NCAA Tournaments, 4 Final Fours, 0 championships

MSU - 11 NCAA Tournaments, 2 Final Fours, 1 championship

Louisville - 28 NCAA Tournaments, 7 Final Fours, 2 championships

So to answer your question, I would rate those programs WAY, WAY, WAY (WAY) above Florida.
I don't disagree with your rankings (although I might remove a "WAY" or two). And I will acknowledge that I undervalued the Denny Crum years at Louisville. But I don't understand the purpose of this side debate. Whether it's the 10th best program or the 17th best program in the country is largely irrelevant. It's still a program with broad institutional (and fan) support, with a history of success -- albeit mostly in the last 25 years (19 of which were under the same coach).

[LA Muskie]

If you include the current coaches, Florida is a complete joke compared to the others. If LA's theory was that all three other schools were "one coach wonders" like Florida, well, he's wrong.
That wasn't my point (I know most of their histories). My point was that they are certainly DEFINED today by their current coaches. That said, like I mentioned in my other response, I admittedly underestimated/undervalued the Denny Crum era at Louisville. I will own that.

[LA Muskie]

Yes Donovan has had lots of success at Florida. But very few care. Aside from UK, basketball is an afterthought at most Southern schools. You ask 90% of the people on the street about Florida and they would say football. For all that success Billy has had, only basketball junkies would be knowledgeable of all the Final Four and Elite 8s etc. Other than the times we played them, I never think of Fla. Now that doesn't mean that if they pull a Brinks truck up to Mack's door that he won't take it. Basketball is important @ Xavier, and there is something to be said for being the big fish.
Supporting football and supporting basketball aren't mutually exclusive. Obviously "football schools" are defined more by their football programs. There's a reason NCAA football generates so much more money. And certainly that means the support of their basketball programs APPEARS to pale by comparison. But don't mistake that for a lack of support.

[markchal]

Whoa, there are some who really think there's no question he's gone if offered? Am I missing something about the Florida job? You're way behind football in relevance, and the program isn't THAT great. Donovan has done a phenomenal job, but it's still SEC basketball. It's a good job, but I agree with those who have said Florida's success has been more Donovan than the program.

Didn't Mack turn down Tennessee a few years ago? How much worse is that job than Florida?

If he wanted the Florida job, I wouldn't begrudge him for it, but if he really wanted to coach somewhere besides X, he could probably wait two years and get a much better offer (after the Reynolds/Myles senior season, with Trevon, JP and the rest as juniors).

[GoMuskies]

I think it's pretty relevant. Xavier is also a program with broad institutional and fan support. If Florida is the 17th best program, then it's really not all that different than Xavier other than the money. And the money might well be enough to make Chris go.

But there's a huge difference between being offered the head job at one of the very top programs in college basketball (the true blue bloods) and being offered the head job at Florida.

[Caveat]

You can split hairs about where Florida is as a program -- fact of the matter is that they're a great program, backed by a bottomless war chest of SEC money. If they make an offer to Mack, I have no problem accepting that he's gone. That's the way of life in college athletics at a school that doesn't play in a power-football conference.

I also have no problem accepting that, should Mack go, that there will be no shortage of incredibly qualified people who will be ready to take the team and continue moving forward.

[GoMuskies]

I don't think it's just splitting hairs. If money is the issue, and he gets an offer he's gone. If it's not about money, there's definitely a chance he wouldn't want to uproot his family for a program like Florida.

[waggy]

The Xavier job and the Florida job are different in many ways. All things considered I think the X job is just as good. But whatever floats your boat.

[waggy]

Also remember that as awesome as the Florida job is, Donovan is quitting it.

[LA Muskie]

Whoa, there are some who really think there's no question he's gone if offered? Am I missing something about the Florida job? You're way behind football in relevance, and the program isn't THAT great. Donovan has done a phenomenal job, but it's still SEC basketball. It's a good job, but I agree with those who have said Florida's success has been more Donovan than the program.

Didn't Mack turn down Tennessee a few years ago? How much worse is that job than Florida?

If he wanted the Florida job, I wouldn't begrudge him for it, but if he really wanted to coach somewhere besides X, he could probably wait two years and get a much better offer (after the Reynolds/Myles senior season, with Trevon, JP and the rest as juniors).
I think there's a few things to consider.

One is that Mack is willing to entertain a move. He's not Mark Few. He takes meetings and interviews, and his agent works the phones. In 5 years he has considered at least the following jobs: Tennessee (twice), Wake Forest, and Cal. Yes, Cal.

Second is that Florida is not Tennessee. It is better. It may not be Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, UNC, Michigan St., Louisville, Texas or UCLA. But news flash -- those jobs aren't coming available any time soon, and even if they did he wouldn't be near the top of any of their lists. It's true that Ohio State and Indiana could open up in the near future, but it's far from a certainty. And in the meantime, with every passing year there's a new, hot young coach. There's always the next Archie Miller... At some point, if you keep saying no, you may stop being a candidate altogether.

[markchal]

I don't think it's just splitting hairs. If money is the issue, and he gets an offer he's gone. If it's not about money, there's definitely a chance he wouldn't want to uproot his family for a program like Florida.

I agree completely with this.

[LA Muskie]

I don't think it's just splitting hairs. If money is the issue, and he gets an offer he's gone. If it's not about money, there's definitely a chance he wouldn't want to uproot his family for a program like Florida.
He was willing to uproot his family for CAL. Or at least he was willing to STRONGLY consider it.

[GoMuskies]

He was willing to uproot his family for CAL. Or at least he was willing to STRONGLY consider it.

Maybe he's kind of dumb. I don't know.

[LA Muskie]

Also remember that as awesome as the Florida job is, Donovan is quitting it.
By all accounts (and I have no insider information at FL whatsoever), this was about leaving college coaching, not FL -- and it was leaving FL that was the only difficulty in the decision.

[waggy]

He was willing to uproot his family for CAL. Or at least he was willing to STRONGLY consider it.

Matt Painter was willing to strongly consider Mizzou, or not. The list is endless.

[waggy]

By all accounts (and I have no insider information at FL whatsoever), this was about leaving college coaching, not FL -- and it was leaving FL that was the only difficulty in the decision.

Calipari.

[LA Muskie]

Calipari.
As in he was sick of recruiting against Calipari?

[waggy]

As in he was sick of recruiting against Calipari?


As in he knows he can't beat him.

[xavierj]

He was willing to uproot his family for CAL. Or at least he was willing to STRONGLY consider it.

I have heard that he really never considered Cal and it was more of leverage that he even had his name involved.

[LA Muskie]

Matt Painter was willing to strongly consider Mizzou, or not. The list is endless.
If your point is that he used Cal to get a raise at Xavier, then you have significantly underestimated the degree to which he had interest in Cal. I have heard from several people who know him well, that we should all be very thankful to Christi...

[LA Muskie]

I have heard that he really never considered Cal and it was more of leverage that he even had his name involved.
Very, very, very much not true. At all. By the end it was about 50/50. And Christi tipped the scales in our favor.

But that's certainly what people like to think.

[waggy]

If your point is that he used Cal to get a raise at Xavier, then you have significantly underestimated the degree to which he had interest in Cal. I have heard from several people who know him well, that we should all be very thankful to Christi...


Whatever. He's still at X.

Thanks Christi!

[LA Muskie]

As in he knows he can't beat him.
I have a hard time believing that. He's too competitive to give up that easily. But I do think he was sick of the college recrutiing process -- both the time and effort required, and the "lengths" to which one now needs to go to get elite talent.

[LA Muskie]

Whatever. He's still at X.

Thanks Christi!
I don't disagree one bit. To be very clear, just because I think Mack would take the FL job doesn't mean I want him to.

[waggy]

I have a hard time believing that. He's too competitive to give up that easily. But I do think he was sick of the college recrutiing process -- both the time and effort required, and the "lengths" to which one now needs to go to get elite talent.

Believe what you want. Just stop wording your opinions as definitive statements.

[GoMuskies]

Just stop wording your opinions as definitive statements.

It's so vainglorious. :) I kid, I kid. I've never heard that word before. I plan to use it regularly.

[LA Muskie]

Believe what you want. Just stop wording your opinions as definitive statements.
Example? I think I'm pretty clear about when I'm expressing opinions (look for the words "believe" and "think" or even "opinion"). And to the extent I am conveying things more akin to facts, I try to be good about noting generally my source for that information.

[LA Muskie]

It's so vainglorious. :) I kid, I kid. I've never heard that word before. I plan to use it regularly.
I never heard it before, but I love it as well. Definitely going to find a way to work that into the repertoire.

[LA Muskie]

For what it's worth, I think (that's a clue for you, Waggy) that this is all for naught because Florida will probably (that's another clue for you, Waggy) look to Archie first. I think (clue...) that would be a mistake because I believe (hint, hint...) Mack is a better coach, a better recruiter, and is more seasoned than Archie. But I suspect (ahem...) Archie's light is shining a bit brighter right now, and combined with his name and lineage he is probably (again...) considered the sexier, spashier hire.

[GoMuskies]

I've heard Florida is dispensing with all the chaff and is headed straight for the wheat: Jim Les.

[xudash]

Re Florida:

1. Donovan coached there for almost two decades. He loves the University of Florida. He leaves UF with two NC's and an overall resume that most coaches would love to have accomplished.

2. He has long wanted a shot at the NBA, having once taken the Orlando job, then immediately unwinding his decision to do so at that time for his reasons. It's really about new goals and fresh direction. He, too, is a competitive individual with plenty of life left in his chosen career, and he's decided that it's time to take his shot at the NBA.

3. Football and basketball fandom aren't mutually exclusive. Florida absolutely is a football school. But it's not that UF fans don't like basketball: as has been noted, they average 5 digits in attendance, ranking in the top 40 in that regard. UF's problem, or one of its main basketball problems has been the ever aging O'Connell Center. Foley is taking care of that problem right now.

4. I don't get some of the comparisons that have been going on here. Anyone who tries to go down the road of FL being about Donovan and not about a program that has all the necessary program attributes required for success at the highest level is blind. It pays to live in the present when coaching changes occur. UF has the ability to offer substantial money, a P5 Conference affiliation (regardless of its football bias), a soon-to-be fully renovated facility, a campus with palm trees on it, and, in Florida's case, THE main flagship university in the state. It also has some telling banners hanging from its facility's rafters.

Re Chris Mack:

1. Again, the here and now are more relevant than what Chris's disposition may have been when the other opportunities came up. Specifically, I'm thinking of the brawl and of the Wells incident. Things have since settled down very nicely. Where once there may have existed a bad taste in his mouth about his alma mater, those days have since melted along the way.

2. If its about money, UF will double him up and he may go.

3. If its about family and other considerations, it isn't a given that he's going anywhere anytime soon.


Questions:

What is Mack's buyout at Xavier?

What is Archie's buyout at Dayton (in reality; I suspect UD fans probably think its a billion dollars because its UD)?

[LA Muskie]

Very good summary, Dash. I don't have much to add to that. Other than to say it's my understanding the buyouts won't be a material impediment to either Miller or Matta leaving, should they be asked to do so, and should they choose to do so.

[GoMuskies]

Without Donovan, Florida still has a lot of nice things going for it. It's a nice job that pays a whole lot of money. It's just not one of the top jobs in the country that is a "no-brainer" like a Kentucky, North Carolina, Duke, etc. That's not an insult to Florida. It's just not in that class.

[LA Muskie]

Without Donovan, Florida still has a lot of nice things going for it. It's a nice job that pays a whole lot of money. It's just not one of the top jobs in the country that is a "no-brainer" like a Kentucky, North Carolina, Duke, etc. That's not an insult to Florida. It's just not in that class.
I don't disagree. And I don't think anyone else is, either. Even the Florida boards appear to accept they are not a "blue blood" program. They seem to think they are in the 2nd tier behind the blue bloods, and at least for the last 20 or so years I think that's accurate.

[markchal]

Florida is a solid program, for sure. I think my surprise that they would be such a contender has been affected by my lack of respect for the SEC (outside of UK) in basketball and the fact that we lost our last two coaches to two very good jobs, and I don't think Florida is on Arizona's level (maybe closer to OSU). I guess I just assumed because our program is in much better shape than it was when we lost those two, that if we lost Mack, it would be to another top-tier program.

But I need to remember that Chris Mack is not Sean Miller.

[Milhouse]

I will say this:

Mack wouldn't need to put up with the large amount of bullshit from the fans this season if he was at Florida.

Take that as a negative or a positive. The fans will never be as loud and supportive (vocally/traveling/showing up) but they also likely won't be calling for his head mid season....like some on this board after a few road losses.

Fans everywhere are largely the same. But you'll always be second fiddle at a football school. And like I said negatives and positives go with that. Sometimes it works out great for coaches others not so much.

[X-band '01]

I will say this:

Mack wouldn't need to put up with the large amount of bullshit from the fans this season if he was at Florida.



Two titles or not, Donovan had to be feeling some heat after a preseason Top 10 and missing the NCAA Tournament. He can't reload as quickly as Calipari can at Kentucky.

[LA Muskie]

Two titles or not, Donovan had to be feeling some heat after a preseason Top 10 and missing the NCAA Tournament. He can't reload as quickly as Calipari can at Kentucky.
I honestly don't think Donovan was feeling any heat at all. My understanding is he is beloved down there -- and 19 years, 2 championships, and several more Final Fours buys a lot of rope. I believe he was much more disenchanted with the state of college basketball (and Waggy, to your point, that very well may have applied in particular to Calipari) than the state of FL basketball.

[GoMuskies]

If Mack was feeling any heat at Xavier he's probably too thin-skinned to coach college basketball. Because things have been pretty tame here, and his seat has never even been warm.

[Milhouse]

Two titles or not, Donovan had to be feeling some heat after a preseason Top 10 and missing the NCAA Tournament. He can't reload as quickly as Calipari can at Kentucky.

Are you serious?

His seat was absolutely Frozen.

They went to a final four in 2014! The year before that? Elite Eight. The year before that? Elite eight.

Pre-season means nothing time and time again. If his seat was warm then I don't know what to think.

Not to mention Florida fans were more concerned with Will Muschamp's successor than anything else this past season. Which is my entire point. There would be no controversy or second guessing after EVERY game (See this season and various Mack threads). at a football school like there is at a basketball school.

Mack's been here for 6 years. 5 Tournaments. 3 Sweet 16s. He still hasn't won over a lot of the fanbase. What else does he need to do?

Archie is there 4 seasons. 2 Tournaments. 1 elite eight. And he is beloved.

It's maddening that some don't realize how good we have it.

[DC Muskie]

Everyone on this thread is writing about SEC like it's 2013. Since then:

Auburn hired Bruce Pearl
Mississippit State hired Ben Howland

Both are landing major recruiting classes.

This idea that SEC is going to compete in college basketball hasn't been paying attention. And if you think Florida is simply going to go away because Donovan left, then you must be kidding yourself.

[X-band '01]

I honestly don't think Donovan was feeling any heat at all. My understanding is he is beloved down there -- and 19 years, 2 championships, and several more Final Fours buys a lot of rope. I believe he was much more disenchanted with the state of college basketball (and Waggy, to your point, that very well may have applied in particular to Calipari) than the state of FL basketball.

I'm not saying there was heat to the point his job would be at stake (far from it), merely some displeasure over a season below expectations.

[markchal]

I will say this:

Mack wouldn't need to put up with the large amount of bullshit from the fans this season if he was at Florida.

.

This is ludicrous. There may have been dissenters on a message board, but you will have that anywhere you have a message board. If anything, Chris gets a much longer leash here because he's an alum. Florida is a good program with good support, yeah, its way behind football, but how easy is it going to be following the face of the program for the last few decades? You think they will be content to sit around while Mack rebuilds the program?

[GoMuskies]

Everyone on this thread is writing about SEC like it's 2013. Since then:

Auburn hired Bruce Pearl
Mississippit State hired Ben Howland
.

Good point. Now that the SEC has hired three guys who got fired from their last gig (adding Avery Johnson), things are totally gonna explode in the Southeast. Someone might even notice there's a game going on every now and then.

But probably not.

[Milhouse]

LSU will be very good next year too Should be a top 20 team. I think SEC will be top 3 conference consistently down the line. They've all been told to put a bigger emphasis on bball.

[Milhouse]

This is ludicrous. There may have been dissenters on a message board, but you will have that anywhere you have a message board. If anything, Chris gets a much longer leash here because he's an alum. Florida is a good program with good support, yeah, its way behind football, but how easy is it going to be following the face of the program for the last few decades? You think they will be content to sit around while Mack rebuilds the program?

This is true. But it won't be as big of a focus at Florida. They'll turn to basketball once national signing day is over.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Those two are two of the biggest recruiting cheats in all of college hoops. Not only that, but the SEC is the biggest cheat at least in football of any other conference. I wouldn't really put a lot of weight into those two getting massive classes.

To LA Muskie, I have a few connections to AAU who have told me that Mack (which I don't know after your post) likes it at XU. However, would consider Florida if the price were right.

Nothing new I know, but the fact that LA has some inside info is pretty cool.


Everyone on this thread is writing about SEC like it's 2013. Since then:

Auburn hired Bruce Pearl
Mississippit State hired Ben Howland

Both are landing major recruiting classes.

This idea that SEC is going to compete in college basketball hasn't been paying attention. And if you think Florida is simply going to go away because Donovan left, then you must be kidding yourself.

[DC Muskie]

Good point. Now that the SEC has hired three guys who got fired from their last gig (adding Avery Johnson), things are totally gonna explode in the Southeast. Someone might even notice there's a game going on every now and then.

But probably not.

That's a good point as well. Ben Howland was fired from his last job right after he won the PAC 12, and after he went to three straight Final Fours. He's followed up with that terrible record by landing a five start recruit to Starksville, MS a month into the job.

Avery Johnson coached in the NBA Finals and was NBA coach of the Year and Bruce Pearl was fired for having a cookout with a recruit, but has 3 Sweet 16's from his last time in the league and has won 75% of his games.

Not one potential NCAA tournament threat there.

[GoMuskies]

And yet, still fired. One of them may catch lightening in the bottle here and there, but none of those has-beens are going to change the culture of SEC basketball.

[DC Muskie]

And yet, still fired. One of them may catch lightening in the bottle here and there, but none of those has-beens are going to change the culture of SEC basketball.

Well I hope Chris Mack becomes a has been at some point, because maybe that means he's won a few awards, taken us to Final Fours and landed five star recruits.

[DC Muskie]

Bruce Pearl has four 4 Star recruits coming in next year.

[GoMuskies]

Well I hope Chris Mack becomes a has been at some point, because maybe that means he's won a few awards, taken us to Final Fours and landed five star recruits.

I know I wouldn't trade Chris Mack today for any of those clowns (sorry Avery, you're not a clown; you haven't had a chance to prove if you're good or bad at this yet).

[GoMuskies]

Bruce Pearl has four 4 Star recruits coming in next year.

Perhaps his will someday match the glorious Cliff Ellis regime in Auburn.

[MADXSTER]

If it was BYU then I would be worried because everyone knows that BYU is such a fun program and team to watch.

[X-band '01]

That's a good point as well. Ben Howland was fired from his last job right after he won the PAC 12, and after he went to three straight Final Fours. He's followed up with that terrible record by landing a five start recruit to Starksville, MS a month into the job.

Avery Johnson coached in the NBA Finals and was NBA coach of the Year and Bruce Pearl was fired for having a cookout with a recruit, but has 3 Sweet 16's from his last time in the league and has won 75% of his games.

Not one potential NCAA tournament threat there.

Come on DC, you're better than that. He was fired for lying about the cookout. The cookout in and of itself might have netted probation and at worst a loss of a scholarship or other recruiting sanctions.

[DC Muskie]

I know I wouldn't trade Chris Mack today for any of those clowns (sorry Avery, you're not a clown; you haven't had a chance to prove if you're good or bad at this yet).

I'm not talking about trading Mack, I'm talking about firing him after he has success, and changes the culture around here.

[DC Muskie]

Perhaps his will someday match the glorious Cliff Ellis regime in Auburn.

I'm pretty sure he surpassed it already. I did mention the four 4 star recruits coming in.

To Auburn. Once coached by Cliff Eillis.

[LA Muskie]

To LA Muskie, I have a few connections to AAU who have told me that Mack (which I don't know after your post) likes it at XU. However, would consider Florida if the price were right.

Nothing new I know, but the fact that LA has some inside info is pretty cool.
I never said he didn't like it at XU. He certainly does.

If he leaves for FL I'm not going to say the money won't be a factor. How can a raise not be? I'm just saying it won't be the only one. Or perhaps even the primary one.

[GoMuskies]

Yes, I hope he gets us in trouble with the NCAA, has a history of allowing star players to abuse others within the program and/or lets our program go to shit like those other guys.

[LA Muskie]

And yet, still fired. One of them may catch lightening in the bottle here and there, but none of those has-beens are going to change the culture of SEC basketball.

There's not a lot of job security in the coaching profession. People get hired and fired all the time. I think you're putting too much weight on the fact they got fired in the past.

That said, I hate Pearl and Howland. They are elite assholes in a profession filled with assholes. It takes a special person to be at the top of that list.

[Nigel Tufnel]

Dear Mr. Foley,

Please make this a quick hire.

Sincerely,

X Hoops Message Board

[spursy]

Dear Mr. Foley,

Please make this a quick hire.

Sincerely,

X Hoops Message Board
Andy Katz just tweeted it could be 2-3 weeks. Please no...

[xu82]

Andy Katz just tweeted it could be 2-3 weeks. Please no...

It takes a while to shovel that much cash into the truck.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

Alright, just heard that Chris Mack/Archie Miller are the top guys on Florida's list. That is all I heard. Nothing regarding the interest from either candidate and nothing about who is higher.

Edit: never thought anyone could gossip more that waiters/waitresses at the restaurant I worked at in College, but I think AAU coaches are the worst.

[gladdenguy]

Anyone that thinks Chris Mack is turning down an offer to be the basketball coach at Florida so as to remain the basketball coach at Xavier...is delusional. Only question is whether it is offered to him.

With most coaches I would agree......but I don't think its true of Mack. Now, does that mean he will automatically say no? I don't think so. But I think Chris Mack would struggle with that decision. I also wouldn't be surprised if he did turn it down.....even for lets say 2.5 million. Just my opinion.

[Xavgrad08]

I think there's a few things to consider.



Second is that Florida is not Tennessee. It is better. It may not be Duke, Kentucky, Kansas, UNC, Michigan St., Louisville, Texas or UCLA. But news flash -- those jobs aren't coming available any time soon, and even if they did he wouldn't be near the top of any of their lists. It's true that Ohio State and Indiana could open up in the near future, but it's far from a certainty. And in the meantime, with every passing year there's a new, hot young coach. There's always the next Archie Miller... At some point, if you keep saying no, you may stop being a candidate altogether.


I think LA nailed it with this post. Florida is not a top ten program, but it is a really good opportunity for the right guy. Florida is better than any of the schools that have shown interest in Mack so far. Krzyzewski, Roy Williams, Pitino and Izzo will likely have a say in their replacements and I don't think Mack will be on those lists currently. I would rank Florida above Oklahoma State and Georgia Tech which are two other jobs that will likely become available next year with Mack as a candidate.

Mack is a competitive guy and wants to win a national championship. Does he believe he can win a national championship at Xavier? I don't know the answer to that question, but I think it is significant. Every program has a ceiling. What does Mack think Xavier's ceiling is? Florida's ceiling is a national title. Recruiting to nice weather and good looking women on campus would not be that hard of a sell. Combine that with the money, great AD and I think it would be very hard to turn down Florida. Hopefully, the search starts and ends with Archie.

[Nigel Tufnel]

I hope he doesn't go...but I think Mack would eventually kill it at UF. I'm glad the attention is on the shooting star with a name (think he's a great coach though). But if Mack can recruit like he does at X....put him at UF. He'd kill it.

[Masterofreality]

He was willing to uproot his family for CAL. Or at least he was willing to STRONGLY consider it.

No he wasn't. He didn't move. He played that leverage into a pay raise...as he should do. I doubt he ever seriously considered moving, but he played it that way and made people wake the hell up to PAY THE MAN!

[paulxu]

All Mack needs is one FF like Shaka and he'd be in the running for any of the really blue chip jobs when they finally come open.
That one thing (let alone an E8 like Archie Miller) is worth its weight in gold.

[LA Muskie]

No he wasn't. He didn't move. He played that leverage into a pay raise...as he should do. I doubt he ever seriously considered moving, but he played it that way and made people wake the hell up to PAY THE MAN!
Look, I'm obviously not going to convince you. And in the immortal words of Willy Wonka, "I don't really want to try." Life's too short.

But people who know Chris Mack VERY well believe he was absolutely ready, willing, and able to take the Cal job and move his family to Berkeley last year. And they DO NOT believe it was remotely just a play for a raise. Mind you, these are almost certainly people you would know and trust yourself if I told you who they were. I'm not just pulling this out of my ass.

Now are things better this year than last? Absolutely. If the Cal opportunity presented itself this year would he have even entertained it? Probably not. And part of that is the money. But it's much more than just that.

[LA Muskie]

All Mack needs is one FF like Shaka and he'd be in the running for any of the really blue chip jobs when they finally come open.
That one thing (let alone an E8 like Archie Miller) is worth its weight in gold.
I'm not sure that's so true for the Blue Blood programs. But it's probably true for just about every other job.

[xavierj]

Look, I'm obviously not going to convince you. And in the immortal words of Willy Wonka, "I don't really want to try." Life's too short.

But people who know Chris Mack VERY well believe he was absolutely ready, willing, and able to take the Cal job and move his family to Berkeley last year. And they DO NOT believe it was remotely just a play for a raise. Mind you, these are almost certainly people you would know and trust yourself if I told you who they were. I'm not just pulling this out of my ass.

Now are things better this year than last? Absolutely. If the Cal opportunity presented itself this year would he have even entertained it? Probably not. And part of that is the money. But it's much more than just that.

I don't know who you are talking to but the people I have heard from who know him believe Cal was never an option. He used it as leverage. He wasn't going to Cal, why would he? Cost of living is crazy and you really cant win big there. I am sorry but think who ever told you he would take the Cal job is clueless.

[markchal]

Now are things better this year than last? Absolutely. If the Cal opportunity presented itself this year would he have even entertained it? Probably not. And part of that is the money. But it's much more than just that.

I'm not quite sure I understand this part. What's so different in a year that he'd go from strongly considering to not even entertaining?

And, if he wants to go, I wish him the best. I'd rather not lose Mack because I think he's our best shot at a long term coach but we've been through this before and will go through it again. If he does go, I wouldn't mind taking Archie for a few years and I'm sure Sean would have plenty of good things to say about X. Of course, there was that whole issue of X refusing to let Sean hire Archie, so that could hurt us with him potentially.

[throwbackmuskie]

Lol so many views. Macks not leaving.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[xubrew]

"Second fiddle to football" is kind of silly. It's the same people. Florida can sell its basketball program to a stadium full of 80,000 people at every home football game. It's not like people will like one and go against the other.

Florida is the biggest basketball program in the state of Florida. It's also the biggest basketball program in all of the surrounding states like Georgia, South Carolina, Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana. Ohio State, Louisville, Kentucky and Indiana are all bigger programs within about a hundred mile radius of Xavier. Butler is also near by, and if you don't feel they're as big as Xavier, they're at least much closer to Xavier than any program that's located in a state that even borders the state of Florida is to Florida. If it's somehow a detriment that Florida plays "second fiddle" to it's own football team, then Xavier plays third fiddle to the Reds and Bengals which do not even belong to them. In Florida, if you're a sports fan, the months of January, February and March are pretty much owned by the Gators' basketball program.

Florida will pay more than twice what Xavier pays. They're pumping over $60 million into their basketball facilities. That's not something that schools do if they don't care about a sport.

On top of that, most jobs open because things are in the shitter. That's why Ohio State opened when Matta left. That's why Arizona opened when Miller left. That's why nearly every major job opens. Something is wrong and a change has to be made. Nothing is wrong at Florida. That's rare. When it comes to opportunities, they really don't get much better than this that often.

I'm not saying Mack will leave. In fact, I don't think he will, but that's largely because I don't think he's their first target. Call it a hunch. But, no sane person could blame him if he did leave.

You know what's funny?? Earlier this season a lot of people were saying he needed to be fired.

[xavierj]

Speaking of the Cal job. chris is making as much at Xavier as Cuonzo Martin at Cal. That's like making about $200K more when you compare. Again Cal was not an option.

[xavierj]

I will be clear. I think Chris would possibly take the Florida job but he wasn't going to take the Cal job. But him taking the Florida job if offered is not a slam dunk that people think it would be.

[waggy]

You know what's funny?? Earlier this season a lot of people were saying he needed to be fired.

No one said that.

[LA Muskie]

I'm not quite sure I understand this part. What's so different in a year that he'd go from strongly considering to not even entertaining?

And, if he wants to go, I wish him the best. I'd rather not lose Mack because I think he's our best shot at a long term coach but we've been through this before and will go through it again. If he does go, I wouldn't mind taking Archie for a few years and I'm sure Sean would have plenty of good things to say about X. Of course, there was that whole issue of X refusing to let Sean hire Archie, so that could hurt us with him potentially.

1. Just about everything has changed in the span of a year. He is paid more. His assistants are paid more. There is a sense of renewed support for the program, both within and without (i.e.; the "endowed" coaching position). And he has had an opportunity to foster a relationship with Greg Christopher, who was an outstanding hire and has shown that unlike many AD's he didn't come in with a preconceived agenda and a desire to install his own people.

2. I think it would be fun to recruit Archie away from Dayton if Chris leaves. And I'd be mostly happy because he's a great coach (although he would be a short-timer). But the chances of that happening are practically nil. It wouldn't be for the money -- Dayton would pay him as much if not more than we would pay him -- and it's not the step he's looking to make.

[LA Muskie]

Again Cal was not an option.

He didn't go. So it's easy to say that. It doesn't make it true. But it's easy.

Anyway I think we've probably exhausted this one. He didn't go. It's in the past. And like I said, I don't even think he'd entertain it this year. I only mentioned it to point out that unlike Few he has at least shown interest (real or feigned) in other jobs.

As for FL who knows. It's all hypothetical for now. And hopefully it stays that way. I'd rather him stay.

[JEHARDI]

What a bunch of mindless blather, those that might be close enough to know his intent on past or future opportunities are not posting on this board. I hope he stays and think he will but only time will tell.

[drudy23]

If he goes, he goes.

January in SEC country sounds kinda tempting.

[gladdenguy]

Chris Mack going to a league to coach against his other mentor besides Skip (Sean Miller at least once a year.....maybe more).

Nope. Wasn't happening.

[xu82]

January in SEC country sounds kinda tempting.

I dearly miss living in Florida. But Gainesville?

[LA Muskie]

Chris Mack going to a league to coach against his other mentor besides Skip (Sean Miller at least once a year.....maybe more).

Nope. Wasn't happening.

There are 5 P5 conferences. Do you really think any coach is completely disqualifying 20% of the job market because they are friends with coaches in the conference?

[LA Muskie]

What a bunch of mindless blather, those that might be close enough to know his intent on past or future opportunities are not posting on this board. I hope he stays and think he will but only time will tell.

Don't assume that just because this is a semi-anonymous message board that people don't know what they are talking about. I know for a fact that's not the case (and I'm not referring to myself). XU is a small school...

[94GRAD]

No he wasn't. He didn't move. He played that leverage into a pay raise...as he should do. I doubt he ever seriously considered moving, but he played it that way and made people wake the hell up to PAY THE MAN!

You really underestimate how close to leaving he was

[94GRAD]

I don't know who you are talking to but the people I have heard from who know him believe Cal was never an option. He used it as leverage. He wasn't going to Cal, why would he? Cost of living is crazy and you really cant win big there. I am sorry but think who ever told you he would take the Cal job is clueless.

Yes it was

[xu82]

We were in Florida for 18 years, and learned to hate UF fans. Half the state has some UF gear in the closet somewhere that they bring out only if they're winning. About 40% has some FSU stuff and the rest is split. UF fans are the worst. Our friends who went to both UF and FSU unanimously prefer FSU. A buddy has gone to a bunch of UF football games the last couple years. Not very well attended and a lot of complaints that they don't get good cell reception at the stadium. It bothers some enough that they come late and leave early. Or stay home. It's just not that great unless they're in the hunt and winning games, and lately that's not been the case. What does that have to do with Mack? Well, nothing but I hate those onboxious fair weather Gator fans.

Having said that, we know some folks whose daughter got declined at UF and accepted at Stanford. A good education at a very reasonable cost is in high demand.... even if you have to go to Gainesville to get it. Several trips to Gainesville and I'm still wondering where they hide anything nice, other that one decent Mexican restaurant.

Full Disclosure: I'm in Tallahassee for FSU graduation weekend. ::jumpforjoy::

[xavierj]

Yes it was

Sorry you are just wrong here. Maybe he would have stood his ground but he really didn't want to go to Cal. He wasn't moving his pregnant wife with two young girls all the way across the country for a little bump in salary. He got what he wanted out of the leverage though. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

[xavierj]

Chris Mack has been contacted by Florida. If he turns it down this would say a lot. Wouldn't surprise me either way.

[LA Muskie]

Sorry you are just wrong here. Maybe he would have stood his ground but he really didn't want to go to Cal. He wasn't moving his pregnant wife with two young girls all the way across the country for a little bump in salary. He got what he wanted out of the leverage though. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

Let's put it this way. If you are right, then Chris has a career waiting for him in Hollywood when his coaching career has run its course. Because he convinced some people who are very close to him and know him very well -- personally and professionally -- that he was really struggling with the decision (and LOVED Berkeley).

But I do agree with you that Christi -- and particularly her early-stage pregnancy at the time -- played a HUGE role in his decision to stay.

[casualfan]

Let's put it this way. If you are right, then Chris has a career waiting for him in Hollywood when his coaching career has run its course. Because he convinced some people who are very close to him and know him very well -- personally and professionally -- that he was really struggling with the decision (and LOVED Berkeley).

But I do agree with you that Christi -- and particularly her early-stage pregnancy at the time -- played a HUGE role in his decision to stay.

Huge might be an understatement. From what I've been told if it wasn't for her he'd be there right now.

[LA Muskie]

Chris Mack has been contacted by Florida. If he turns it down this would say a lot. Wouldn't surprise me either way.

Looks like Xavier's Rivals writer and UF's Scout writer are reporting the contact. But no mainstream reporters yet. Should be an interesting weekend.

No reports of any Archie Miller contact at all yet. But the UD tweets about how he can and should turn Florida down because Dayton is a better job are hilarious.

[X Factor]

I REALLY, REALLY hope Mack stays at Xavier for a long time, but IF he were to leave, I would hope Travis Steele gets the HC job.

Let the waiting game begin...

[drudy23]

He has a big X on a ceiling in his house...how can u leave that?

[casualfan]

Looks like Xavier's Rivals writer and UF's Scout writer are reporting the contact. But no mainstream reporters yet. Should be an interesting weekend.

No reports of any Archie Miller contact at all yet. But the UD tweets about how he can and should turn Florida down because Dayton is a better job are hilarious.

I think all things equal Florida would maybe prefer Miller, BUT he is paid very well by UD (i've read 2-2.5 mil per year) and he his buyout is supposedly in the 3-4 million range.

Mack is paid very well, but he's not at that level and I don't know for a fact, but i doubt his buyout is anywhere near that.

Going back to the Florida football search one of the things Foley took into account was the buyout of the coaches he was going after. Mcelwain is actually paying about 40% of the buyout himself because Florida was unwilling to pay all of it.

EDIT: Having looked further those numbers seem a bit high for Millers salary/buyout, but they are the ones being tossed around on the Florida message boards.

[casualfan]

Russ Wood ‏@RussHoops 23m23 minutes ago

Received a couple Chris Mack to Florida texts this morning. Not sure if I trust the info yet...sources not close enough to Florida AD Foley

[xsteve1]

The difference between X and Dump is X would be fine if Mack left. UDump knows if Miller leaves they are in big trouble especially for program that wants in the BE more than anything in the world.

[xudash]

The difference between X and Dump is X would be fine if Mack left. UDump knows if Miller leaves they are in big trouble especially for program that wants in the BE more than anything in the world.

We would suffer the "continuity" bump again, but I hope we would be fine.

I'm still curious about the buyouts.

[LA Muskie]

The amount of misinformation on the Internet is staggering. I don't have any personal knowledge about Miller's deal and yet I am confident to a near certainly that his buyout is nowhere near $3-4mm. That doesn't even make sense. Bear in mind that after 2 years (and 2 extensions) he had ALL the negotiating leverage. He may have a buyout for this year (because no school wants to announce an extension only to be left at the alter anyway) but if there is one I can't fathom it would exceed $1mm. And I would expect it's more like $500k. Which I don't think would disqualify him.

While I'm less confident about it, I would be shocked if his annual comp is at the $2mm level.

As for Mack, his buyout absolutely would not be an impediment to him leaving. There's a reason an extension -- but not a raise -- was announced. It's not that he didn't get a raise, but it wasn't enough to justify him agreeing to a prohibitive buyout.

[LA Muskie]

The difference between X and Dump is X would be fine if Mack left. UDump knows if Miller leaves they are in big trouble especially for program that wants in the BE more than anything in the world.

Both schools would be fine. Dayton has always and will always support its basketball program, and hence they will attract coaching talent. But they should probably dispose of those pipe dreams. The Big Easy ship has sailed. It may come back to port some day, but there's almost nothing Dayton itself could do to drive that.

[Xavgrad08]

Anyone find it interesting that Morgan Miller tweeted from Florida yesterday? She mentions being in the beautiful sunshine state. There is a beach in the background so it is not Gainesville. Maybe this means nothing or maybe something.

[LA Muskie]

Maybe this means nothing or maybe something.
I think you're right.

[GoMuskies]

If Mack is ever going to leave, the year when he has a one man class signed would be the best year for him to do it (from Xavier's perspective).

[LA Muskie]

If Mack is ever going to leave, the year when he has a one man class signed would be the best year for him to do it (from Xavier's perspective).

This is true. And I think you're right. But it wouldn't be without its bumps. Our staff would be decimated, throwing 2016 into upheaval.

[GoMuskies]

Sure, but you'd be bringing in a new staff that surely has it's own 2016 contacts/targets. And our huge 2014 class gives us a bit a room for error with the 16 class. You can always bolster it later with a transfer, too.

[xudash]

The amount of misinformation on the Internet is staggering. I don't have any personal knowledge about Miller's deal and yet I am confident to a near certainly that his buyout is nowhere near $3-4mm. That doesn't even make sense. Bear in mind that after 2 years (and 2 extensions) he had ALL the negotiating leverage. He may have a buyout for this year (because no school wants to announce an extension only to be left at the alter anyway) but if there is one I can't fathom it would exceed $1mm. And I would expect it's more like $500k. Which I don't think would disqualify him.

While I'm less confident about it, I would be shocked if his annual comp is at the $2mm level.

As for Mack, his buyout absolutely would not be an impediment to him leaving. There's a reason an extension -- but not a raise -- was announced. It's not that he didn't get a raise, but it wasn't enough to justify him agreeing to a prohibitive buyout.

+1.

I can't imagine Archie agreeing to a 7-digit buyout, let alone fathom UD thinking it's in any kind of position to demand/negotiate one.

I also agree about his comp. Of course, I suspect that most of the UD fan base believes his buyout is $20 million, and that UD's AD is assembling a counter offer that will take Archie's comp package to $4 million per year with an S550, membership to Augusta, and $10 million lump sum at the end of 10 years thrown in as sweeteners.

My gut feel only, but, assuming the UF job is offered to Chris, he agonizes over it and decides to stay with navy and white versus going with crap blue and orange.

He will not "GET UP AND GO."

[bobbiemcgee]

If Mack is ever going to leave, the year when he has a one man class signed would be the best year for him to do it (from Xavier's perspective).

Plus if Steele gets the job, not much attrition I would think.

[LA Muskie]

Complete radio silence from the Xavier beat. Personally I think that's a bad sign. But I recognize it could be taken multiple ways.

[94GRAD]

Sorry you are just wrong here. Maybe he would have stood his ground but he really didn't want to go to Cal. He wasn't moving his pregnant wife with two young girls all the way across the country for a little bump in salary. He got what he wanted out of the leverage though. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

We've obviously talked to different people

[94GRAD]

Yes it was


Sorry you are just wrong here. Maybe he would have stood his ground but he really didn't want to go to Cal. He wasn't moving his pregnant wife with two young girls all the way across the country for a little bump in salary. He got what he wanted out of the leverage though. But everyone is entitled to their opinion.

I am not

[XU 87]

I was under the impression that Mack was ready to leave for Cal last year and then the administration stepped up and raised his salary and his assistants' salaries. After that happened, he decided to stay.

[LA Muskie]

I was under the impression that Mack was ready to leave for Cal last year and then the administration stepped up and raised his salary and his assistants' salaries. After that happened, he decided to stay.

That is a portion of the sequence of events. But it's not the whole story.

[X-man]

The amount of misinformation on the Internet is staggering. I don't have any personal knowledge about Miller's deal and yet I am confident to a near certainly that his buyout is nowhere near $3-4mm. That doesn't even make sense. Bear in mind that after 2 years (and 2 extensions) he had ALL the negotiating leverage. He may have a buyout for this year (because no school wants to announce an extension only to be left at the alter anyway) but if there is one I can't fathom it would exceed $1mm. And I would expect it's more like $500k. Which I don't think would disqualify him.

While I'm less confident about it, I would be shocked if his annual comp is at the $2mm level.

As for Mack, his buyout absolutely would not be an impediment to him leaving. There's a reason an extension -- but not a raise -- was announced. It's not that he didn't get a raise, but it wasn't enough to justify him agreeing to a prohibitive buyout.

This link (http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/) from USAToday lists 2015 salaries for all coaches in the NCAA tournament this year. It states that Mack makes about $1.1 million, and Miller at $652 thousand. I have no idea where the numbers posted elsewhere on this thread came from, but it is tempting to believe these numbers especially given that both Mack's and Miller's numbers are consistent with those most recently available on both schools' IRS-990 filings.

[xavierj]

Complete radio silence from the Xavier beat. Personally I think that's a bad sign. But I recognize it could be taken multiple ways.

If they had anything they would post. That's what they do. They obviously have nothing. They Also do not think Chris was serious about Cal but think he would be serious about Florida.

[casualfan]

This link (http://sports.usatoday.com/ncaa/salaries/mens-basketball/coach/) from USAToday lists 2015 salaries for all coaches in the NCAA tournament this year. It states that Mack makes about $1.1 million, and Miller at $652 thousand. I have no idea where the numbers posted elsewhere on this thread came from, but it is tempting to believe these numbers especially given that both Mack's and Miller's numbers are consistent with those most recently available on both schools' IRS-990 filings.

That's from before archie signed his extension this offseason.

[LA Muskie]

If they had anything they would post. That's what they do. They obviously have nothing. They Also do not think Chris was serious about Cal but think he would be serious about Florida.

That's just not true. Brian and Rick both confirmed it was real interest and felt people were underestimating the risk.

And I disagree that them being quiet is typical. In a situation like this they would usually say something, even if (like last year) just to say that Mack is hunkered down and not responding.

[Xavier]

If they had anything they would post. That's what they do. They obviously have nothing. They Also do not think Chris was serious about Cal but think he would be serious about Florida.

Huh? You say:
1) If they had anything they would post it
2)They obviously have nothing
3)They think he would be serious about Florida.

So they have nothing at all but think he would be serious about Florida? Isn't that something?

[X-man]

That's from before archie signed his extension this offseason.

Uh, and you're going to stick with the $2-2.5 mill number for Miller? Nice increase from $650,000. Troll.

[casualfan]

Uh, and you're going to stick with the $2-2.5 mill number for Miller? Nice increase from $650,000. Troll.


What are you talking about? I edited that post immediately and said I thought those numbers were off after thinking about it.

I'm simply pointing out the numbers on that usa today article are not up to date.

[LA Muskie]

Casual speaks the truth. He never said he believed Miller was making that much or that his buyout was that high.

And the USA Today article is suspect. At least with regard to 2016 comp (Miller signed an extension following this season).

[XUFan09]

That's just not true. Brian and Rick both confirmed it was real interest and felt people were underestimating the risk.

And I disagree that them being quiet is typical. In a situation like this they would usually say something, even if (like last year) just to say that Mack is hunkered down and not responding.

Yup, and I didn't just hear that from Rick and Brian. I know everyone likes their own (sometimes conflicting) sources, but none of them are infallible and none of them are anywhere near neutral. Consequently, they'll give their own biased perspective, even if they are close to the situation in question. A majority of those close to a coach hiring situation will be biased toward the belief that he is staying if they are affiliated with the current school. On the other side, a majority will be biased toward him leaving if they are affiliated with the school courting him. Because of that, when it comes to sources at the curent school, I'd wager that error is more likely to occur on the side of underestimating the risk than on the side of overestimating the risk, even with sources who are to a degree in the know.

[xavierj]

That's just not true. Brian and Rick both confirmed it was real interest and felt people were underestimating the risk.

And I disagree that them being quiet is typical. In a situation like this they would usually say something, even if (like last year) just to say that Mack is hunkered down and not responding.

Rick said recently that he never felt that Chris was serious with Cal. Look it up if you are on scout.

[XU 87]

That is a portion of the sequence of events. But it's not the whole story.

Ok, then please fill in the missing parts.

[LA Muskie]

Ok, then please fill in the missing parts.

They're already in this thread. He loved Cal. He was ready to go. Christi (newly pregnant) said no.

Your post implies he stayed because of the raise. He did get a raise, but that's probably not why he stayed.

[Masterofreality]

They're already in this thread. He loved Cal. He was ready to go. Christi (newly pregnant) said no.

Your post implies he stayed because of the raise. He did get a raise, but that's probably not why he stayed.

Christi is not going to Florida either.

Ser, CMack cares about what his wife says and feels, unlike the Desert Raccoon who had his wife in tears when he took the Arizona job.

[LA Muskie]

Christi may not feel as strongly about FL (a short flight away) as she did the San Fran area. And she's not pregnant anymore. And she's an athlete who knows the difference between the prospects at UF vs Cal (notwithstanding the fact Cuonzo just landed Jaylen Brown).

I wouldn't be so sure she would exercise her veto power here.

[XU 87]

Christi is not going to Florida either.

Ser, CMack cares about what his wife says and feels, unlike the Desert Raccoon who had his wife in tears when he took the Arizona job.

Skip's wife didn't want to go Wake. I don't think Skip was a bad husband.

[xavierj]

Christi may not feel as strongly about FL (a short flight away) as she did the San Fran area. And she's not pregnant anymore. And she's an athlete who knows the difference between the prospects at UF vs Cal (notwithstanding the fact Cuonzo just landed Jaylen Brown).

I wouldn't be so sure she would exercise her veto power here.

Yeah but do they really want to raise kids in Gainesville? Maybe they do but I wouldn't want to live there. It's not exactly paradise. Kind of country. I get its just a couple of hours from some nice areas though if you are ready to retire.

[DC Muskie]

Yeah but do they really want to raise kids in Gainesville? Maybe they do but I wouldn't want to live there. It's not exactly paradise. Kind of country. I get its just a couple of hours from some nice areas though if you are ready to retire.

I'm sorry this sort idea cracks me up. The Macks are millionaires. There are plenty of places where millionaires live and raise kids near Gainesville.

[GoMuskies]

I'm sorry this sort idea cracks me up. The Macks are millionaires. There are plenty of places where millionaires live and raise kids near Gainesville.

Agree. Consider that the hottest coach in the last few cycles has elected to remain in Wichita. With money, life can be pretty damned good just about anywhere.

[markchal]

I would have no ill will if he wanted to leave, but if we can't keep an alum in the job even in a big conference now, I don't think we could ever expect to have someone here for longer than 5-6 seasons.

[X-man]

What are you talking about? I edited that post immediately and said I thought those numbers were off after thinking about it.

I'm simply pointing out the numbers on that usa today article are not up to date.

The USAToday article was for the start of the 2014-2015 season. Both Miller and Mack were extended. I just want to know, are you really taking the position that Mack earns less than Miller? Troll.

[HuskyMuskie]

I would have no ill will if he wanted to leave, but if we can't keep an alum in the job even in a big conference now, I don't think we could ever expect to have someone here for longer than 5-6 seasons.

This is where I am at. If not Mack--who can prove that X is a destination job and not just a stepping stone?

[xavierj]

I'm sorry this sort idea cracks me up. The Macks are millionaires. There are plenty of places where millionaires live and raise kids near Gainesville.

I am far from a millionaire so I get that but if I was I can think of a million places I would rather live than Gainesville. But if I was basketball coach maybe. I wouldn't be shocked either way. We will see.

[LA Muskie]

I think geography is a luxury in the world of college athletics. It's not that you can't end up somewhere awesome, it's just that some of the best jobs are in places that may not be the most desirable. Syracuse, NY and Columbus, OH immediately come to mind. I'm sure there's even worse.

[DC Muskie]

I think geography is a luxury in the world of college athletics. It's not that you can't end up somewhere awesome, it's just that some of the best jobs are in places that may not be the most desirable. Syracuse, NY and Columbus, OH immediately come to mind. I'm sure there's even worse.

Now we are just getting crazy. Columbus Ohio is not a desirable place to live? Come on.

[xu82]

Now we are just getting crazy. Columbus Ohio is not a desirable place to live? Come on.

He said "may not be", so we have some leeway. Apparently it MAY be the most desireable place to be.

[Masterofreality]

Now we are just getting crazy. Columbus Ohio is not a desirable place to live? Come on.

Columbus is desirable to Gainesville, IMO.

[spursy]

Columbus is desirable to Gainesville, IMO.
Almost any city is a more desirable city than Gainesville.

[xudash]

This is where I am at. If not Mack--who can prove that X is a destination job and not just a stepping stone?

Fair point.

By the way, I presume that most of you do not live in Florida.

While the comment about Gainesville may or may not be true, let's consider that the downside of living there is not all that much, considering that they could pop into a very nice vehicle and drive to the Atlantic Ocean or to the Gulf Coast to a number of wonderful locations and not miss a beat. They could do that while perhaps having a Lakehouse in the Northeast or something like that to get out of the summer's heat.

I hope like hell that Chris stays Xavier. But let's not pretend that life in Florida and Gainesville, in particular, would be all that bad, especially given the education that would be available to their children.

[paulxu]

This is where I am at. If not Mack--who can prove that X is a destination job and not just a stepping stone?

There are 350 or so Division 1 programs. Relative to about 95% of them, Xavier is a destination job.
There are 10-12 programs that might be a further destination. Not a lot anyone can do about that until we get to a FF and win the big one.
Even then you'd have to duplicate Duke's history to prevent Duke from always being a better job.
Every one of those few programs are P5 football schools.
No shame in any of that.

[paulxu]

Goodman has gone from this

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CD4Vm7VWYAAKWq2.png:large

to this, over the weekend.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CECealOVEAA2JXi.png:large

Maybe Mack and Miller turned them down.

[Muskie1000]

Now we are just getting crazy. Columbus Ohio is not a desirable place to live? Come on.

No, no it isn't. Now if you love the Buckeyes more than life itself - maybe. But the fans there live/breathe/die football, that's all they talk about. Plus, if you think Cincinnati drivers are bad - you haven't been to Columbus. In Columbus they think they know how to drive which makes it worse. And the traffic, don't even start. Whoever designed the traffic should be taken out and shot. I have to drive through Columbus at least 3-4 times a year and its awful, awful, awful.

[DC Muskie]

No, no it isn't. Now if you love the Buckeyes more than life itself - maybe. But the fans there live/breathe/die football, that's all they talk about. Plus, if you think Cincinnati drivers are bad - you haven't been to Columbus. In Columbus they think they know how to drive which makes it worse. And the traffic, don't even start. Whoever designed the traffic should be taken out and shot. I have to drive through Columbus at least 3-4 times a year and its awful, awful, awful.

I actually grew up in Columbus and get back at least once a year.

People from the Midwest who complain about traffic absolutely crack me up. You don't have traffic. You have no idea what traffic is. I remember landing in Columbus, renting a car and driving down to Cincinnati on a Friday during rush hour. It was a breeze compared to what I'm used to. I will say the people in Ohio at least know how to move to the right. I've down here in North Carolina for the past month and everyone drives at the same pace and space from each other. But there is zero traffic, unless you listen to the natives who think it's the worst.

Columbus is a perfectly fine place to live. There's plenty to do, even outside of the loving the Buckeyes.

[bleedXblue]

Mack obviously is in a pretty good situation at X. I'd be disappointed if he left, but if they make the offer and double his pay, can you blame him?

Would X counter offer anything at this point? I can't imagine we are maxed out on his pay.

[LA Muskie]

DC, you like Columbus because you grew up there. I get it. It's human nature. Like me and Rochester, NY.

But Columbus is not a destination. Nobody grows up thinking "I want to live in Columbus someday."

[WCWIII]

I happen to be going to Gainesville this evening for work. I'll make sure I'll be wearing a Xavier shirt with an X over my heart ...

[XUPhilly04]

Back to the key topic of the thread, is there anything other than speculation?

[LA Muskie]

Nope. Not yet. Just speculation. And crickets.

[bobbiemcgee]

Maybe Mack and Miller turned them down.


and Goodman just said on ESPN that Miller and Mack were the frontrunners. Can't make up his mind.

[paulxu]

It's your fault Bobbie. You should have never left Florida for pot-legal Colorado.

[vee4xu]

Why is "bank" always the deciding criteria?

For many, yes. For some, maybe even many, no.

I've had a very comfortable life with fine income. I have been offered other jobs in other areas with much higher pay, yet the overall quality of life where I am and stability for my family have always outweighed the move- especially since extended family is close by. There is no amount of money that outweighs that. I am proud that my kids had a stable upbringing with friends that they made in kindergarten and will be their friends for life. I have a happy trophy wife in a place that she wants to be. I have a job with a company that has been very good and fair to me over the long term. More cash can't buy that.

Both CMack and his wife have their families close by. Mack is making enough money now to secure both his and his kids' futures. He's at a place that he has loved for years. Why the hell would Gainesville be a step up? Unless you're an NFL football player, your life isn't long enough to spend the jack you make and when you move your job working conditions may not be as good as you have left.

Is there really a chance that Florida can get to a Final Four faster than Xavier? I don't think so. Why go, unless you are a carpetbagger like Beaknose and the Raccoon.

And with that, I am sick of these discussions.

I have been off the board since February 11 and came back today just to see what others had to say about this thread. Starting at the very beginning, i intended to read each one just for the heck of it. However, MOR nailed it. This reflects my own very fortunate life and thoughts about Coach Mack leaving. So, I will simply rep my good buddy, MOR and stop reading this thread any further.

[bobbiemcgee]

It's your fault Bobbie. You should have never left Florida for pot-legal Colorado.

Yes, the population around here has gone up to 300 million in a few months.

[LadyMuskie]

But Columbus is not a destination. Nobody grows up thinking "I want to live in Columbus someday."

Kids from Dayton, if they're smart, grow up wanting to live anywhere but Dayton - even Columbus.

[LA Muskie]

Ha! Touche. Would rep you if I knew how to do that via TapaTalk.

[gladdenguy]

There are 5 P5 conferences. Do you really think any coach is completely disqualifying 20% of the job market because they are friends with coaches in the conference?

At Cal.....absolutely. Somewhere else.....no big deal. It's Cal. Cal sucks.

[LA Muskie]

Tell that to the #2 recruit in the country.

[gladdenguy]

Back to the thread. I heard Mack was contacted yesterday. We will find out more tomorrow.

Very good chance we could be looking for a new coach in the next couple weeks. Another good returning team might have a coach bolt on them. Story of the Xavier basketball program for the last 15 years.


Cal got one top 5 recruit. SMU can do the same thing. Both still have shitty programs with no history of success.

[xsteve1]

Still think they'll contact Miller and he's there guy. Maybe casual udump fan can enlighten us more on Miller's contract.

[Backyard Champ]

Back to the thread. I heard Mack was contacted yesterday. We will find out more tomorrow.

Very good chance we could be looking for a new coach in the next couple weeks. Another good returning team might have a coach bolt on them. Story of the Xavier basketball program for the last 15 years.


Cal got one top 5 recruit. SMU can do the same thing. Both still have shitty programs with no history of success.

I could be confusing you with another poster, but didn't you want Mack gone for most of the season??

[DC Muskie]

DC, you like Columbus because you grew up there. I get it. It's human nature. Like me and Rochester, NY.

But Columbus is not a destination. Nobody grows up thinking "I want to live in Columbus someday."

Okay, so really there's like 3 places people grow up thinking, "I want to live there someday."

Everyplace else is the same. Rochester and Columbus. Equal.

Makes perfect sense.

[GoMuskies]

I think the slogan for the whole state of Ohio should be "Meh, it's not that bad."

[DC Muskie]

I think the slogan for the whole state of Ohio should be "Meh, it's not that bad."

Goes along with the one that would work with New Jersey. "You got a problem with that?"

[LA Muskie]

Okay, so really there's like 3 places people grow up thinking, "I want to live there someday."

Everyplace else is the same. Rochester and Columbus. Equal.

Makes perfect sense.

I didn't say that. But I do think Columbus sucks. Its only redeeming qualities are OSU (the school) and OSU athletics (if you're into that sorta thing). Otherwise the downtown area sucks and there's little to nothing else to do. Sure there are a few nice neighborhoods but you can find those anywhere. Hell I'm sure even Dayton has a few. But outside OSU its only redeeming quality is convenience to other places.

PS: I admit that objectively viewed Rochester could be worse. I don't think so, but like I said before we tend to look back fondly on the places in which we grew up.

[LA Muskie]

I think the slogan for the whole state of Ohio should be "Meh, it's not that bad."

No offense to my friends in Cincy (which I absolutely love and readily would move back to) and Cleveland (it's underrated, but no Cincy):

Ohio Cities Fail the Well-Being Test
http://www.well-beingindex.com/2014-community-rankings?utm_campaign=Well-Being+Index+2013&utm_source=hs_email&utm_medium=email&utm_content=16940062&_hsenc=p2ANqtz-9BjNYzyZVQiPofiXAL0ovJ0X1yFpvWr_TtoAQj95BeZbVGobyE 0Iy1XMSqmbUWOTaLCm5AzwWWWC4leDnJ988QXUWhHBDKJ9QE48 hFsFe-WTcwtOM&_hsmi=16940062

[DC Muskie]

I didn't say that. But I do think Columbus sucks. Its only redeeming qualities are OSU (the school) and OSU athletics (if you're into that sorta thing). Otherwise the downtown area sucks and there's little to nothing else to do. Sure there are a few nice neighborhoods but you can find those anywhere. Hell I'm sure even Dayton has a few. But outside OSU its only redeeming quality is convenience to other places.

PS: I admit that objectively viewed Rochester could be worse. I don't think so, but like I said before we tend to look back fondly on the places in which we grew up.

That's exactly what you said. You used Rochester and Columbus as examples of places that are not destinations that immediately came to your head.

Let's be clear about something.

Columbus was a fine place for me to grow up. But I always wanted to live out on here, and had zero intention of living there as an adult. I'm more of the exception than the rule in that regard compared with the people that I grew up with.

Let me ask you something...when's the last time you ventured from LA to visit Columbus? Because every time I'm there I've come away impressed with what they done, including downtown. Columbus is a completely different town than when I left over 20 years ago.

Columbus is the largest city in Ohio. They just bid and came in second in hosting a presidential convention. New Belgium brewery set up their distribution base for Ohio in Columbus, and a Scotland based craft beer company just announced their US base will be in Columbus, largely because of their excellent craft beer scene.

Columbus is home for the US National team when we beat Mexico year after year. I mean sure Rochester has the Rhinos, must be the same.

Recently I have seen advertising in DC promoting the idea of living in Columbus. http://lifeincbus.com/#!/

So while I don't have overly fond memories of growing up there, I'm glad that I did. But I definitely feel confident that Columbus and Rochester, NY are absolutely, positively, nothing alike whatsoever.

[xudash]

Seriously, this is becoming a wonderful diversion.

I propose covering a city each day for the next two to three weeks to keep our minds off things.

[LA Muskie]

DC,

C'mon man. You've gotta know I'm playing you in that situation. I may be a pain in the ass sometimes but I'm not a rude asshole.

To be clear, USMNT >>> Columbus Crew >>> Rochester Rhinos

OSU >>> all Rochester area colleges and universities (at least overall athletically).

New Belgium and I imagine all Columbus locally brewed craft beers >>> Genny Cream Ale.

Columbus weather >>>>>>>>>> Rochester weather. (I presume, and can't fathom otherwise.)

How the cities otherwise rank I have no idea.

PS: I'm sure Columbus has a great craft beer culture. As does just about every mid-size or smaller city in the country. Apparently Portland, OR hosts a lot of conventions and everyone goes home to copy them.

[GoMuskies]

Seriously, this is becoming a wonderful diversion.

I propose covering a city each day

I've got kind of a busy day tomorrow, so can we schedule tomorrow as the day to talk about all the positive aspects of Dayton?

[LA Muskie]

I don't think we need a day for that. I'd be hard pressed to consume more than a minute. Let's see... Dayton Children's Hospital.

That's all I got.

[xudash]

I don't think we need a day for that. I'd be hard pressed to consume more than a minute. Let's see... Dayton Children's Hospital.

That's all I got.

Actually, to be fair, let's toss in Wright-Pat as well. Now we can button up Dayton and allow GOMUSKIES a full, productive day.

[LA Muskie]

Actually, to be fair, let's toss in Wright-Pat as well. Now we can button up Dayton and allow GOMUSKIES a full, productive day.

Good point. Now THAT does it.

[XU Cowbell Kid]

Good point. Now THAT does it.

Assuming of course that you include the Air Force Museum when talking about the base. That place is exponentially better than the Smithsonian Air and Space Museum. (Except the Smithsonian got a space shuttle... that is pretty cool)

[XU Cowbell Kid]

People from the Midwest who complain about traffic absolutely crack me up. You don't have traffic. You have no idea what traffic is. I remember landing in Columbus, renting a car and driving down to Cincinnati on a Friday during rush hour. It was a breeze compared to what I'm used to. I will say the people in Ohio at least know how to move to the right. I've down here in North Carolina for the past month and everyone drives at the same pace and space from each other. But there is zero traffic, unless you listen to the natives who think it's the worst.


As a fellow DC-ian (??? DC-ite? San Diegon?), I definitely agree that traffic in Ohio is usually on the tame side. However, the worst designed traffic pattern I've ever seen is if you are trying to pass through Columbus going west on I-70. Taking an entire interstate down to one lane in a metro area? Every single time I've gone through there, I've ended up sitting still for almost an hour.

[PM Thor]

I don't really mind if Mack leaves. We have an Associate Coach just waiting in the wings. A guy who is on the verge, and everyone knows it.

[Backyard Champ]

I don't really mind if Mack leaves. We have an Associate Coach just waiting in the wings. A guy who is on the verge, and everyone knows it.

Love the optimism...but it would be terrible news for Xavier's future if he left right now. If we can't keep an alum, we are destined to being a stepping stone. Having said that, I don't see Mack leaving.

[Pete Delkus]

I don't really mind if Mack leaves. We have an Associate Coach just waiting in the wings. A guy who is on the verge, and everyone knows it.

I think Steele's trajectory is heading the right direction, but to hand the job over to him isn't the same as going from Thad to Sean, or Sean to Chris. Sean and Chris had a different type of 'seasoning' coming up through major programs, let alone playing major D1 ball.

Steele's path, in my opinion, would be better served to gain D1 Head coaching experience outside a Big 6 bball conference, before coming in as head coach, especially to one with the tournament success associated with Xavier.

I would favor looking at a guy like Kelsey, who has head coaching experience and has either coached or had been the lead recruit to guys like Chris Paul, James Johnson, Josh Howard, Songaila, Jeff Teague, Al-Farouq Aminu and Ish Smith.

[Milhouse]

I'd actually take Steele over Kelsey right now. I think Steele could be a guy that sticks around a lot too. Who knows though?

[Cheesehead]

So I came across this morning taken from www.worthly.com from 12/2/14: Top 20 highest paid BB Coaches (salary-wise)

20) Mark Gottfried 2.0 mil
19) Scott Drew 2.13 mil
18) Lon Kruger 2.2 mil
17) Tony Bennett 2.29
16) Bo Ryan 2.41
15) Jamie Dixon 2.44
14) Travis Ford 2.45
13) Jay Wright 2.48
12) John Beilein 2.49
11) Rick Barnes 2.55
10) Sean Miller 2.62
9) Josh Pastner 2.65
8) Thad Matta 3.28
7) Steve Alford 3.47
6) Tom Izzo 3.89
5) Billy Donovan 3.9
4) Bill Self 4.96
3) John Calipari 5.51
2) Rick Pitino 6.75
1) Coach K 9.68

Notables missing: Roy Williams, Tom Crean, Shaka Smart

These number may not be entirely accurate as I think Bennet got a raise and it doesn't accouny for some changes but it gives one some prespective. If XU thinks it is a top 20 program, then we certainly are not paying our coaches that way. By not paying market value, X risks always being a stepping stone.

It gets old having to worry about this every few years.

[GoMuskies]

Lol at Memphis

[xsteve1]

I don't really mind if Mack leaves. We have an Associate Coach just waiting in the wings. A guy who is on the verge, and everyone knows it.

I'm in this camp as well. Steele has to be the guy if Mack eventually goes. Plus Steele has an in with most of the guys were currently recruiting and relationships with the players currently on the team. I think he's going to make a really good head coach.

[xeus]

I may be a pain in the ass sometimes but I'm not a rude asshole.

That would be an excellent signature.

I think (and hope) that Archie's their guy. We'll see.