View Full Version : This season's/program's ultimate goal is?
XUOHTX
11-14-2014, 01:32 PM
I've heard on multiple occasions from Mack and players that the ultimate goal for the team is to "Make the tournament."
Xavier Press Conference (http://youtu.be/OY8u-ZvZHn4)
Aren't we passed this goal now? I mean come on, it's not like we're Dayton. Shouldn't we be setting our sites at least on the final four? Do you think Kentucky, Duke, Kansas, etc. say there goal is to make the tournament? No, they want to win it.
We consistently make it in. It's time for the philosophy and the expectations to change.
I expect this program to be making final fours.
Titanxman04
11-14-2014, 01:43 PM
I think that with so many new faces, making the tournament is a good "goal". If Mack came out and said "Sweet 16" with this young of a team, he could be setting the bar too high. Who knows how well these freshmen truly will adapt to the speed of college ball?
Every year it seems people have these high standards for freshman, expecting them to all lead the team in some stat and be game changers. When they flounder or struggle to catch up, our fan base has members who turn on them. This board has several guilty parties. About every year I post something about how it's a young guy that has three more years and to give them time to develop like BJ Raymond.
Point is, if I'm a coach who came off a couple of years like Xavier just did, I'd temper expectations publicly. In the locker room, I'm sure there's a different goal.
Also...we are NOT Duke, Kentucky, and Kansas. I would love to have their success, but lets not fool ourselves into thinking we're on their level...yet.
Xville
11-14-2014, 01:45 PM
Not to sound like an ass but I am sure you realize we are not Kentucky, Duke or Kansas, nor will we ever be. I know what you are saying, and in many ways I feel the exact same that you do. However, we also have to be realistic as fans. For 5-10 teams every year, their goal is to make the final four or win the whole thing.
For a program like Xavier, the goal I believe every year is to get a decent seed in the tournament and see what happens. Many teams have the talent to get to the final four every single year...sometimes they achieve it and sometimes they don't. Xavier will never have the talent on a consistent basis to get to a final four every year..some years, yes they will and some years, they won't. However, to even be able to say that Xavier will have that kind of talent every once in a while is pretty staggering to think about from even 15-20 years ago. We are never going to be an elite program like a Duke, Kentucky etc....just never going to happen, but im ok with that.
XUOHTX
11-14-2014, 01:48 PM
Yes, this team may not be able to make a deep run, or maybe they don't even make the NCAA's. But, as a program haven't we grown past the "We just wanna make the tourney" goal?
When we were in the MCC, getting ranked and making the tourney was huge. When we were in the A10, making the tourney started to become a regular thing. Now we are in the Big East, we have proven that we can consistently get in the NCAA's. If you always "temper" expectations, you will never attain higher goals.
bleedXblue
11-14-2014, 01:49 PM
Not to sound like an ass but I am sure you realize we are not Kentucky, Duke or Kansas, nor will we ever be. I know what you are saying, and in many ways I feel the exact same that you do. However, we also have to be realistic as fans. For 5-10 teams every year, their goal is to make the final four or win the whole thing.
For a program like Xavier, the goal I believe every year is to get a decent seed in the tournament and see what happens. Many teams have the talent to get to the final four every single year...sometimes they achieve it and sometimes they don't. Xavier will never have the talent on a consistent basis to get to a final four every year..some years, yes they will and some years, they won't.
I think this program can do more. I think every 4-5 years we should have enough talent to make a Final 4. In a normal year, I think this program can get anywhere from a 5-8 seed and make it to the second weekend.
XUOHTX
11-14-2014, 01:53 PM
Not to sound like an ass but I am sure you realize we are not Kentucky, Duke or Kansas, nor will we ever be. I know what you are saying, and in many ways I feel the exact same that you do. However, we also have to be realistic as fans. For 5-10 teams every year, their goal is to make the final four or win the whole thing.
For a program like Xavier, the goal I believe every year is to get a decent seed in the tournament and see what happens. Many teams have the talent to get to the final four every single year...sometimes they achieve it and sometimes they don't. Xavier will never have the talent on a consistent basis to get to a final four every year..some years, yes they will and some years, they won't. However, to even be able to say that Xavier will have that kind of talent every once in a while is pretty staggering to think about from even 15-20 years ago. We are never going to be an elite program like a Duke, Kentucky etc....just never going to happen, but im ok with that.
Maybe I should have said Georgetown. Do you think their goal is to just make the tourney each year?
BMoreX
11-14-2014, 01:59 PM
I think these "goals" aren't really something to get worked up about. It's not like once this team makes the tournament they're going to go "welp good job guys, doesn't really matter what we do next. Let's just have fun in the first round." They're going to compete and try to win no matter what. It's just not a person's mentality to think like that.
Frankly, making the tournament with 1/2 of your team new to the program is a fine goal to "publicize." But it's not like that is the end-all, be-all.
bobbiemcgee
11-14-2014, 01:59 PM
FF. We've already been to the Elite 8.
Xville
11-14-2014, 02:05 PM
Maybe I should have said Georgetown. Do you think their goal is to just make the tourney each year?
i hear what you are saying, and I do agree that yes our goals should be higher than to just reach the tournament every year. However, where is the line supposed to be drawn? Does Mack really want to say "Well i'd like to make it to the second weekend" or "I'd like to win the whole thing." I mean really what is he supposed to say? You say publically every year that "our goal is to reach the final four" I think you may be doing a disservice to the kids that are currently here. Are these guys going to think "well..made it to the elite eight but didn't make it to the final four...guess we failed."
I think at the beginning of the year you say "our goal is to make the tournament." Then once you are there, the goals can change based on just what kind of team Mack thinks he has. We aren't an elite program and the goal shouldn't be to make a final four every year...we will never have that kind of talent year in and year out...Georgetown certainly doesn't.
XUOHTX
11-14-2014, 02:07 PM
I think these "goals" aren't really something to get worked up about. It's not like once this team makes the tournament they're going to go "welp good job guys, doesn't really matter what we do next. Let's just have fun in the first round." They're going to compete and try to win no matter what. It's just not a person's mentality to think like that.
Frankly, making the tournament with 1/2 of your team new to the program is a fine goal to "publicize." But it's not like that is the end-all, be-all.
Yes, I don't expect the team to just shut down when they reach their "goal."
But I'm looking at this as more of an overall philosophy for the program. I want to hear guys say things like "For us, just making the tournament isn't good enough anymore." or "We have a history of winning. We've been to multiple sweet 16's and Elite 8's, our program is aiming to take the next step."
Things like that. If I'm a recruit, I want to go to a school that expects to make deep runs and hang banners.
sirthought
11-14-2014, 02:10 PM
I do think publicly saying your goal every year is to make a final four is a bit too cocky. Not that such an attitude isn't helpful, but in this case it isn't necessary.
If the team's goal is win and dominate in their conference, chances are by achieving that they will have a strong team that has a chance to make noise in the final tournament.
Saying we expect to be at top of the Big East and make the tournament seems like great goals to me, no matter what your program is.
BMoreX
11-14-2014, 02:11 PM
Yes, I don't expect the team to just shut down when they reach their "goal."
But I'm looking at this as more of an overall philosophy for the program. I want to hear guys say things like "For us, just making the tournament isn't good enough anymore." or "We have a history of winning. We've been to multiple sweet 16's and Elite 8's, our program is aiming to take the next step."
Things like that. If I'm a recruit, I want to go to a school that expects to make deep runs and hang banners.
I get what you're saying. But really, I don't think that is the philosophy of the program. Hell, every time Jalen gets in front of a mic he says he came to X to lead us to our first Final Four. Like someone said previously, with the young team this year, setting a realistic goal of making the tournament is OK by me. Saying "we have to go to the Elite 8 or Sweet 16" is a lot of pressure.There's no doubt that they should do even better than making the tourney and I don't think the team will be celebrating like crazy if they just make it.
For me, if they win a game or two in the tournament, I'd be pretty damn happy. 5 of 13 guys are still freshmen. I see the next few years being very bright for Xavier Basketball.
vee4xu
11-14-2014, 02:18 PM
Actually, making the tournament is a pretty good standard, since most coaches and players say things like, "we want to win our conference and then take it from there." Also, it isn't like X has been on the cusp of greatness, really since the Crosstown Fight. Sure, X has had its moments since that game, but really only know have turned over its roster and did so with really high caliber players. So, really, to suggest making the tournament given all of this actually sounds pretty good.
GoMuskies
11-14-2014, 02:21 PM
Maybe I should have said Georgetown. Do you think their goal is to just make the tourney each year?
This year? Yes.
UCGRAD4X
11-14-2014, 08:15 PM
Go undefeated - win a national championship - that's the goal. Is it a reasonable goal, of course not. But that is still the goal. I guarantee, if we make it to the S16, most people will be a little bit disappointed we didn't make that next step and finally get to the FF. If we make the FF - it will be - you don't get there that often - you're going to want the final…and so on.
You want to end the season with a win - and NOT in the NIT.
Art Vandelay
11-14-2014, 08:30 PM
you can not get to the final 4, final 8, or sweet 16 unless you first make the tournament....nothing at all wrong with keeping things simple.
Simple.... you have to be in it to win it. Get hot at the right time with a senior guard and some great big guys. (OK - hope i didn't lose you with the guard comment, but we have a lot of new guys for depth too.)
Snipe
11-14-2014, 08:50 PM
I say we go undefeated, win the National Championship, and then Challenge the NBA title holder. After that I want them to strap on the pads and win the Super Bowl. Later, much later, I expect them to defeat ISIS, convert all Muslims to Christianity, lower my taxes, torture Pally Shore and Adam Sandler together, and then cure Joey Votto's health problem.
I admit it is a bit of a stretch, because I think Votto is done. That is what you get from Canadians.
Also, I would like this team to eventually secure the border and cure Ebola.
We have really big borders. There's only about a dozen of them.... so that may be a bit of a stretch. Other than that.....sounds good to me.
Snipe
11-14-2014, 08:58 PM
I am a firm believer in setting expectations high 82. This is Xavier.
That's Super Hero stuff, but they looked like all of that tonight. I'm in!
(Until I sober up, maybe.)
STL_XUfan
11-14-2014, 09:38 PM
Go undefeated - win a national championship - that's the goal. Is it a reasonable goal, of course not. But that is still the goal. I guarantee, if we make it to the S16, most people will be a little bit disappointed we didn't make that next step and finally get to the FF. If we make the FF - it will be - you don't get there that often - you're going to want the final…and so on.
You want to end the season with a win - and NOT in the NIT.
This. Reminds me of the quote (I think from Skip, but I'm sure I'm butchering it), "My Mom told me that you can't win'em all; Dad said it doesn't say that in the rule book"
Whats the point of lacing them up if the goal isn't to win.
I think the program's goal (best described as a long term vision) is to bring a National Championship to Victory Parkway.
I think this season's goal is appropriately set at "make the NCAA tournament, NOT as a play-in team".
I'm not sure what you mean by "philosophy and expectations need to change". Do you really think the program, coaches, and/or players have become complacent? I disagree. I think we are as hungry as ever, and that we'll have a great year. We have a remarkably talented but YOUNG team. Let's set our goals accordingly.
If we don't make the Final Four this year, I won't say we failed. And I certainly won't say it's because our "philosophy and expectations" weren't what they should have been.
In Mack I trust. Amen.
[QUOTE=xeus;
In Mack I trust. Amen.[/QUOTE]
With you on that. Amen indeed.
drudy23
11-15-2014, 09:08 AM
In order to make the Final Four, you have to be in the field...so that's always the FIRST goal.
I, unlike others, think the ceiling for this program could be a "mini Duke"...with most of athletic funding going to hoops and such concentration of fans simply on basketball, you get a class (this one) that takes you on a 2-3 year run, and who knows what can happen. Duke wasn't Duke until things like this started to happen.
Smaller odds, I know, but it's certainly possible. Dream big...it can happen here.
GoMuskies
11-15-2014, 10:44 AM
As long as we're nothing like Duke, that's good by me.
XUOHTX
11-15-2014, 12:53 PM
I say we go undefeated, win the National Championship, and then Challenge the NBA title holder. After that I want them to strap on the pads and win the Super Bowl. Later, much later, I expect them to defeat ISIS, convert all Muslims to Christianity, lower my taxes, torture Pally Shore and Adam Sandler together, and then cure Joey Votto's health problem.
I admit it is a bit of a stretch, because I think Votto is done. That is what you get from Canadians.
Also, I would like this team to eventually secure the border and cure Ebola.
And... Close thread.
Three Point Pete
11-16-2014, 10:41 AM
win win win is the goal like the pot of gold is at the end of the rainbow. I think if you focus too much on the gold you will miss a beautiful rainbow. Enjoy the moment, play the game as it should be played the best you can and you will be a winner!
win win win is the goal like the pot of gold is at the end of the rainbow. I think if you focus too much on the gold you will miss a beautiful rainbow.
I want da gold! I want da gold!
Kahns Krazy
11-19-2014, 12:33 PM
Yes, I don't expect the team to just shut down when they reach their "goal."
But I'm looking at this as more of an overall philosophy for the program. I want to hear guys say things like "For us, just making the tournament isn't good enough anymore." or "We have a history of winning. We've been to multiple sweet 16's and Elite 8's, our program is aiming to take the next step."
Things like that. If I'm a recruit, I want to go to a school that expects to make deep runs and hang banners.
I've never been a college recruit. My guess is they go much more by actual banners hung than what the coach says the expectation is for next year. We can say we expect to go to the final four every year, but it doesn't change the fact that we never have.
XU 87
11-19-2014, 12:35 PM
win win win is the goal like the pot of gold is at the end of the rainbow. I think if you focus too much on the gold you will miss a beautiful rainbow. Enjoy the moment, play the game as it should be played the best you can and you will be a winner!
I think we should not keep score and just enjoy the beauty of the game.
I think we should not keep score and just enjoy the beauty of the game.
Will there be Participation Trophies?
XUGRAD80
11-19-2014, 04:43 PM
I'm pretty sure the coach's and players go into every game with the goal being to win that game.
I don't think that it's really necessary for the coach to come out and say they have a goal of winning a national championship. I think that when they talk with a kid about coming to X, they are more likely to say that the goal for that kid is to develop themselves to their fullest potential on the court, in the classroom, and as a person. I think they feel that if they are able to recruit the kids they want, this will happen. How much time do y'all think X spends recruiting top 20 rated players? I'm going to bet, not much. Pretty sure the schools mentioned above spend most of their time (and money) on those players, and they talk to them about winning national championships first and getting into the NBA.
I'm happy with the X way. I'm more proud of the graduation record that X has, then I ever would be of the national championships UK has. I'm more proud of my X diploma than I am of my college athletic awards and records. I'm very happy that X has STUDENT-athletes and not just players marking time before they go pro. It's my guess that 99% of the people that have actually been in the arena feel the same way.
After the first two games, my expectations are higher than they were before those two games. I need to remain realistic.... and I'm working on it very hard.
ballyhoohoo
11-19-2014, 05:23 PM
I say we go undefeated, win the National Championship, and then Challenge the NBA title holder. After that I want them to strap on the pads and win the Super Bowl. Later, much later, I expect them to defeat ISIS, convert all Muslims to Christianity, lower my taxes, torture Pally Shore and Adam Sandler together, and then cure Joey Votto's health problem.
I admit it is a bit of a stretch, because I think Votto is done. That is what you get from Canadians.
Also, I would like this team to eventually secure the border and cure Ebola.
Think they can cute Canada of being Canadians?
Can they jump off one foot?
UCGRAD4X
11-19-2014, 08:16 PM
I don't think that it's really necessary for the coach to come out and say they have a goal of winning a national championship.
Yeah! That's what we're here for. That's our job!
XUOHTX
03-22-2015, 08:48 AM
It felt like a good time to bring up this thread again.
I think a Sweet 16 is achievable.
BandAid
03-22-2015, 09:05 AM
I think a Sweet 16 is achievable.
I dunno, byu is fun to watch
Shoot like they did yesterday and we could very well see the most satisfying win ever for this program. Yes, ever! Beat the Lexus driver for a return trip to the Elite 8 with our Uber driver.
Masterofreality
03-22-2015, 09:19 AM
Shoot like they did yesterday and we could very well see the most satisfying win ever for this program. Yes, ever! Beat the Lexus driver for a return trip to the Elite 8 with our Uber driver.
Right now, the most satisfying win ever was beating BeelzeBob in the Sweet 16. Would love to see another one, and yes, Thursday would probably eclipse WVA.
By the way. We probably cannot realistically hope that we can shoot as well as yesterday. That was 1986 Villanova esque, although there was not a bad shot in the bunch, and many were close in.
ammtd34
03-22-2015, 09:32 AM
Shoot like they did yesterday and we could very well see the most satisfying win ever for this program. Yes, ever! Beat the Lexus driver for a return trip to the Elite 8 with our Uber driver.
Come to think of it, Stainbrook drives a Buick.
waggy
03-22-2015, 09:34 AM
And Buick is the official partner of the NCAA tournament. All the TV in-game graphics are by Buick.
MADXSTER
03-22-2015, 09:52 AM
Buick is made in the USA. Basketball was made in the USA. All signs are pointing towards Buick over Lexis.
MADXSTER
03-22-2015, 11:02 AM
The Ultimate goal is to beat BYU and become a fun team to watch
ArizonaXUGrad
03-23-2015, 11:31 AM
I was at that game at US Air here in Phoenix. I would have to drop probably $300 to get an all session in LA but I am currently considering it.
Right now, the most satisfying win ever was beating BeelzeBob in the Sweet 16. Would love to see another one, and yes, Thursday would probably eclipse WVA.
By the way. We probably cannot realistically hope that we can shoot as well as yesterday. That was 1986 Villanova esque, although there was not a bad shot in the bunch, and many were close in.
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