College Bball TV Ratings

[casualfan]

For those wondering how ratings for Big East games turned out, it is not good. (http://www.sportsmediawatch.com/2014/03/college-basketball-tv-ratings-numbers-for-every-game-of-the-2013-14-season/)


From the article:

FS1 and Fox Sports 2 combined to air the ten least-viewed games of the season, each of which earned fewer than 10,000 viewers. In a three-way tie for dead last were Monmouth/Seton Hall on November 18, Houston Baptist/DePaul on December 18, and VCU/Boston College on December 28, which each earned just 1,000 viewers on FS2. Each of the ten least-viewed games involved a Big East team.

[nuts4xu]

The TV ratings will continue to increase as the league forges its identity. This is a long term process, and I have no doubt the Big East product will continue to improve over the years.

[GoMuskies]

I think (hope) that Major League baseball on FS1 will help the visibility of the channel such that people will have it on their radar by next basketball season. I would guess that a large majority of people with access to FS1 don't even know they have it.

[xsteve1]

VCU-BC wasn't a Big East game. Ratings will always suffer when people don't even know the channels exist.

[The_Mack_Pack]

They need to get some pro sports on there. Anything besides NASCAR practice and UFC whenever the BE isn't playing. MLB and NFL games should increase exposure.

[xu2002]

2,000 viewers for the Xavier/Moorehead St is a little rough! I did notice a trend of the numbers getting better as the season went along. Probably due to football season ending, conference season starting and people staring to realize FS1 existed.

I think anyone that was expecting FS1/2 to compete with ESPN from day 1 weren't thinking straight. It's going to take a few years to build up the station and viewership. Hopefully Fox can work to continue to bring in new programming when it becomes available. I'll start to judge the ratings after 5 years of our 10 year contract. For now we just need all the Big East teams to perform at a higher level to raise awareness. We're making 10 times what our A-10 TV contract paid and have all our games on national tv. Base on that I'm willing to be patient during the difficult growth process.

[XU 87]

Ratings will always suffer when people don't even know the channels exist.

Yep. This is going to take some time.

[casualfan]

Yep. This is going to take some time.

How much time though? At first the idea was that some of their higher profile college football games would raise the level of awareness about the channel and in turn the ratings.

When that didn't happen, it was wait for college basketball season, surely people will find the channel then.

Then it was, well, once conference season rolls around, people will surely be tuning in to the Big East!



I understand that launching a new channel will take time, but how much? 2 years? 5 years? 10 years? When is it realistic to start expecting real results here. I don't think anyone is crazy enough to expect us to compete with ESPN, but we aren't even in the same ballpark.

We played in one regular season game this year that drew higher than a 0.1 and it took us being on the main FOX channel to achieve that.

I am very concerned about this going forward.

[danaandvictory]

I am very concerned about this going forward.

I agree. Shut it down, beg the A-10 to readmit us. Everything is a lie. God is dead, and the Big East killed him.

[throwbackmuskie]

Gloom and doom!

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2014/03/03/Media/Fox-Sports-1.aspx

or not... Things are trending in the right direction, it will take some time, but it will get to where they want it to. Also remember FS1 does not have the amount of leagues that ESPN does, so their options are limited and the fanbases are not extended across the country so to speak.

[Masterofreality]

Here is what counts for right now..and this is before MLB arrives soon:

"“Our first goal was to do better with Fox Sports 1 than we were doing with Speed,” said Bill Wanger, Fox Sports Media Group’s executive vice president of programming, research and content strategy. “We achieved that.”

"Fox Sports 1 is averaging 292,000 viewers in prime time from its Aug. 17 launch through Feb. 23, a figure that’s up 70 percent versus Speed from a corresponding time period a year earlier. Fox Sports 1’s viewership in the 18-to-49 prime-time demo averages 98,000 viewers, up 96 percent over Speed. The channel’s median age in prime time has dropped by more than three years to 47.7. And the median income of its prime-time audience is up 9 percent over Speed to $60,800.

Fox has a long term plan. Everyone should just back away from the ledge.

[RoseyMuskie]

My dad had the opportunity to speak with Jean Lenti Ponsetto (DePaul AD) and he asked about TV viewership. Despite what the numbers suggest, Fox execs told her that they are happy with the ratings (conversation was held about two weeks prior to the B.E.T.). The article that Throwback posted explains this feeling.

[MD Muskie]

this is the problem with TV and any new channel or tv show...they need immediate satisfaction. One year is not a trend. THey are going up against a juggernaut, so its going to take some time. David didn't slay Goliath on the first attempt.

[LA Muskie]

Two truths about the inaugural BE season on FS1 and its affiliates:

1. No one at Fox expected the ratings to be good.
2. No one at Fox expected the ratings to be this bad.

[Masterofreality]

Two truths about the inaugural BE season on FS1 and its affiliates:

1. No one at Fox expected the ratings to be good.
2. No one at Fox expected the ratings to be this bad.

Truth #3- No one honestly knew WHAT to expect.

[LA Muskie]

Truth #3- No one honestly knew WHAT to expect.
That is true as well. It applies to just about everything broadcast on TV. But people who are paid A LOT of money not to be too surprised really miscalculated this one.

[Masterofreality]

That is true as well. It applies to just about everything broadcast on TV. But people who are paid A LOT of money not to be too surprised really miscalculated this one.

I'm sure that Fox sold stuff as a package deal with stuff on multiple channel platforms- including the Big Network with ancillary Super Bowl benefit. Murdoch and his minions didn't get to where they are by being crappy businessmen.

Anybody remember how the Big Fox Network started? They were the newbie vs 3 REALLY established monoliths- CBS, NBC, ABC. They've done fine...and that will do fine with FS1/FS2.

[GoMuskies]

Anybody remember how the Big Fox Network started?

Yes, with the Tracy Ullman Show and the Gary Shandling Show. That Tracy Ullman show had some funny cartoons in it that I think became a relatively successful show of its own.

[nasdadjr]

Best Statement Number 1...... Who gives a Shit!!!! I could care less about Fox's viewership, ratings, profit margin etc... Newsflash if a player is being courted by Duke or Xavier they are probably going to choose Duke. That player will probably choose Xavier if early playing time is important to them. Also in todays day and age if players are good enough they will get the exposure and they know it. Also going through all the recruiting over the past few years I didn't see anyone choose Xavier because of a T.V. contract. I don't recall Trevon Blueitt choosing Xavier and citing the Fox T.V. deal as his reason. I can also safely say Jabari Parker goes to Duke still even if they don't have an ESPN contract, John Randle still goes to UK and so on. Get a life people.

[OTRMUSKIE]

Since so many people are cutting the cord to their cable FOX needs to be creative here and offer their Fox Sports Go App to everyone for a small fee. Eventually it's going to come to this so why not be the first. I would be willing to pay $5 a month to have access to all the content. Now once all the other channels start to do that the price will eventually drop. There must be a law against this because I would think it would have been done by now.

[XU 87]

Also in todays day and age if players are good enough they will get the exposure and they know it. Also going through all the recruiting over the past few years I didn't see anyone choose Xavier because of a T.V. contract. I don't recall Trevon Blueitt choosing Xavier and citing the Fox T.V. deal as his reason. I can also safely say Jabari Parker goes to Duke still even if they don't have an ESPN contract, John Randle still goes to UK and so on. Get a life people.

You don't think telling recruits, "You're going to be playing all of your games on national tv" is a recruiting selling point?

[GoMuskies]

You don't think telling recruits, "You're going to be playing all of your games on national tv" is a recruiting selling point?

C'mon '87, get a life. Completely unimportant to all recruits.

[LA Muskie]

I'm sure that Fox sold stuff as a package deal with stuff on multiple channel platforms- including the Big Network with ancillary Super Bowl benefit. Murdoch and his minions didn't get to where they are by being crappy businessmen.

Anybody remember how the Big Fox Network started? They were the newbie vs 3 REALLY established monoliths- CBS, NBC, ABC. They've done fine...and that will do fine with FS1/FS2.
MOR, Fox is full of very smart business people. Even smart business people make mistakes. I work and live in LA. Fox is my biggest client. My best friend used to work at Fox Sports. I have several friends who currently work at Fox, a few in the executive ranks. I know a guy (we share a very good mutual friend) who has been at FS1 from the beginning (leaving a D-1 basketball program to join the network). I agree FS1 will do fine, so please don't take any of this as an affront to our network. But at the same time, don't fool yourself -- it has not remotely met even the low expectations that were set for it. Even Chase Carey has conceded this.

[LA Muskie]

Since so many people are cutting the cord to their cable FOX needs to be creative here and offer their Fox Sports Go App to everyone for a small fee. Eventually it's going to come to this so why not be the first. I would be willing to pay $5 a month to have access to all the content. Now once all the other channels start to do that the price will eventually drop. There must be a law against this because I would think it would have been done by now.
The cable operators would not be very happy (at all) with that. There's a reason the apps are tied to cable subscriptions. And while the future may be online, the present is controlled by the cable operators. Especially since they pretty much control broadband (and have successfully fought net neutrality rulemaking).

[Caveat]

FS1 & FS2 have no identity as channels. What they offer to the viewer (outside of a specific game here or a specific game there) is indistinguishable from ESPN -- and just mimicking some other network isn't going to shift viewing habits.

I don't know what the answer is, though.

[LA Muskie]

FS1 & FS2 have no identity as channels. What they offer to the viewer (outside of a specific game here or a specific game there) is indistinguishable from ESPN -- and just mimicking some other network isn't going to shift viewing habits.

I don't know what the answer is, though.
The answer is product. It will take some time as media rights are sold on long-term deals. But over time, FS1 will lure programming from ESPN. And as it does, it will grow market share. On the downside, as their inventory increases, we will see fewer of our games on FS1. I suspect down the road we'll be seeing mostly FS2 and regional FS networks.

[JTG]

I think (hope) that Major League baseball on FS1 will help the visibility of the channel such that people will have it on their radar by next basketball season. I would guess that a large majority of people with access to FS1 don't even know they have it.

Probably not because no one watches MLB either. NFL & NCAA football is what will help.

[Masterofreality]

Probably not because no one watches MLB either. NFL & NCAA football is what will help.

Well, Fox already has both of those products available to be shown. It is up to the network to decide when and where.

People, patience. I love our TV partner. They will be fine, as will we.

[xudash]

Best Statement Number 1...... Who gives a Shit!!!! I could care less about Fox's viewership, ratings, profit margin etc... Newsflash if a player is being courted by Duke or Xavier they are probably going to choose Duke. That player will probably choose Xavier if early playing time is important to them. Also in todays day and age if players are good enough they will get the exposure and they know it. Also going through all the recruiting over the past few years I didn't see anyone choose Xavier because of a T.V. contract. I don't recall Trevon Blueitt choosing Xavier and citing the Fox T.V. deal as his reason. I can also safely say Jabari Parker goes to Duke still even if they don't have an ESPN contract, John Randle still goes to UK and so on. Get a life people.

Greg Christopher, Father Graham and Xavier's bank account gives a shit.

[casualfan]

Greg Christopher, Father Graham and Xavier's bank account gives a shit.

You can add Chris Mack and all the assistant coaches to that list as well.

[nasdadjr]

The number one recruit this year chose smu and duke UNC Kentucky were all on way more than smu so no I think it isn't as important as fit, playing time and coach. Also father Grahams bank account can take a nose dive for all I care and you shouldn't care about it either.

[MHettel]

Truth #3- No one honestly knew WHAT to expect.

Truth #4- Any business endeavor has been operationally and financially modeled beforehand, providing the company with financial expectation which align to required "return" on the investment.

Truth #5- Investments that do not meet required returns are often folded / aborted / modified.....

[nasdadjr]

So using that example let's compare...my kid can go to smu and be coached by Larry brown who can show my kid how to get to and succeed in the nba or he can go to xavier and possibly get expelled for no reason by the czar mr. Graham and not be coached by an nba legend but hey he is on national tv every game. Smu wins that 99 out of 100 times so like I said who gives a shit about ratings

[MHettel]

Best Statement Number 1...... Who gives a Shit!!!! I could care less about Fox's viewership, ratings, profit margin etc... Newsflash if a player is being courted by Duke or Xavier they are probably going to choose Duke. That player will probably choose Xavier if early playing time is important to them. Also in todays day and age if players are good enough they will get the exposure and they know it. Also going through all the recruiting over the past few years I didn't see anyone choose Xavier because of a T.V. contract. I don't recall Trevon Blueitt choosing Xavier and citing the Fox T.V. deal as his reason. I can also safely say Jabari Parker goes to Duke still even if they don't have an ESPN contract, John Randle still goes to UK and so on. Get a life people.

How about this scenario. 1-2 more years of poor ratings, and Fox decides to pull the plug on the network. The Big East is now left to negotiate with ESPN to salvage whatever deal they can. ESPN waves them off and offers the Tuesday evening late game slot, also know as purgatory.

ESPN makes an example out of the Big East, which serves as a warning to others.

I brought this up a year ago when everyone was still enamored by the Big East. At one point, I asked if other saw any downside to this new conference, and one smug response was "none."

This is possible. I 'm not hoping for it, and certainly not betting on it. But this first year performance did not go well, and this is the worst case scenario.

[MHettel]

How about this scenario. 1-2 more years of poor ratings, and Fox decides to pull the plug on the network. The Big East is now left to negotiate with ESPN to salvage whatever deal they can. ESPN waves them off and offers the Tuesday evening late game slot, also know as purgatory.

ESPN makes an example out of the Big East, which serves as a warning to others.

I brought this up a year ago when everyone was still enamored by the Big East. At one point, I asked if other saw any downside to this new conference, and one smug response was "none."

This is possible. I 'm not hoping for it, and certainly not betting on it. But this first year performance did not go well, and this is the worst case scenario.

And, the lack of bids and absolutely lackluster performance in the dance doesnt exactly pump me up either....

[GoMuskies]

There is still no potential downside in leaving the A-10 for the Big East. None.

[XU 87]

The number one recruit this year chose smu and duke UNC Kentucky were all on way more than smu so no I think it isn't as important as fit, playing time and coach. Also father Grahams bank account can take a nose dive for all I care and you shouldn't care about it either.

I will ask again- do you really think that 17 and 18 year old recruits don't care whether or not they will be playing on national tv?

[casualfan]

How about this scenario. 1-2 more years of poor ratings, and Fox decides to pull the plug on the network. The Big East is now left to negotiate with ESPN to salvage whatever deal they can. ESPN waves them off and offers the Tuesday evening late game slot, also know as purgatory.

ESPN makes an example out of the Big East, which serves as a warning to others.

I brought this up a year ago when everyone was still enamored by the Big East. At one point, I asked if other saw any downside to this new conference, and one smug response was "none."

This is possible. I 'm not hoping for it, and certainly not betting on it. But this first year performance did not go well, and this is the worst case scenario.

I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure the MWC was already made an example of for leaving the ESPN family.

They left and then came crawling back after whatever deal they signed ended up sucking for all the member schools.

[casualfan]

I will ask again- do you really think that 17 and 18 year old recruits don't care whether or not they will be playing on national tv?

In my conversations with aau and college coaches it's the question they get asked the most.

Kids also typically don't ask about national TV. From what I've been told most times it is "How many times will I play on ESPN".

[casualfan]

There is still no potential downside in leaving the A-10 for the Big East. None.

Agreed.

[Caveat]

How about this scenario. 1-2 more years of poor ratings, and Fox decides to pull the plug on the network. The Big East is now left to negotiate with ESPN to salvage whatever deal they can. ESPN waves them off and offers the Tuesday evening late game slot, also know as purgatory.

ESPN makes an example out of the Big East, which serves as a warning to others.

I brought this up a year ago when everyone was still enamored by the Big East. At one point, I asked if other saw any downside to this new conference, and one smug response was "none."

This is possible. I 'm not hoping for it, and certainly not betting on it. But this first year performance did not go well, and this is the worst case scenario.

Or they could go to NBCSN -- tip times on Saturday afternoon right after the EPL matches finish, big games to NBC national on select weekends.

It's all speculation and nonsense at this point. The future is unwritten, and it usually isn't as bad as you think it's going to be.

[paulxu]

I don't know what the answer is, though.

More women

LA, since you know all the Fox muckety mucks, would you do me a favor and ask them if the league is expanding, when and who's coming aboard? Thanks.

[LA Muskie]

How about this scenario. 1-2 more years of poor ratings, and Fox decides to pull the plug on the network. The Big East is now left to negotiate with ESPN to salvage whatever deal they can. ESPN waves them off and offers the Tuesday evening late game slot, also know as purgatory.

ESPN makes an example out of the Big East, which serves as a warning to others.

I brought this up a year ago when everyone was still enamored by the Big East. At one point, I asked if other saw any downside to this new conference, and one smug response was "none."

This is possible. I 'm not hoping for it, and certainly not betting on it. But this first year performance did not go well, and this is the worst case scenario.

Is it possible? Sure. Almost anything is. Is it likely? No, not even remotely.

Fox is not jettisoning the channel within anything close to 2-3 years. This was a long play for them and they would be the first to tell you that. (Indeed that's exactly what Chase Carey has said in industry and investor messages).

Moving from the A10 to the Big East was a no brainer. Period.

[LA Muskie]

More women

LA, since you know all the Fox muckety mucks, would you do me a favor and ask them if the league is expanding, when and who's coming aboard? Thanks.

Let me see what I can find out. But I'm pretty sure we won't be seeing expansion in the next few years. And I'm pretty sure even even Val Ackerman said that very recently.

[MHettel]

Is it possible? Sure. Almost anything is. Is it likely? No, not even remotely.

Fox is not jettisoning the channel within anything close to 2-3 years. This was a long play for them and they would be the first to tell you that. (Indeed that's exactly what Chase Carey has said in industry and investor messages).

Moving from the A10 to the Big East was a no brainer. Period.

I'm not saying it wasnt a no brainer. The upside is greater for sure.

But this insistence that there is no downside, even if remote, is just asinine.

And I dont care who you know (in spite of the fact that you love to remind us all the time), if a business endeavor underperforms, it will be considered for closure. The degree and extent of underperformance can certainly be debated, but it's ALWAYS a possibility.

[waggy]

But even if it were a complete failure it would still be better than the A10.

[GoMuskies]

But even if it were a complete failure it would still be better than the A10.

+1 million

[nasdadjr]

Yes I am saying that. If a kid has a choice between great coach or tv a majority will choose coach. I hear of kids transferring and leaving schools all the time because a coach left or got fired but I have yet to hear of a kid transfer or sign cause a school changed their tv deal

[LA Muskie]

I'm not saying it wasnt a no brainer. The upside is greater for sure.

But this insistence that there is no downside, even if remote, is just asinine.

And I dont care who you know (in spite of the fact that you love to remind us all the time), if a business endeavor underperforms, it will be considered for closure. The degree and extent of underperformance can certainly be debated, but it's ALWAYS a possibility.
Sorry if it comes across that way; it certainly is not my intent. I'm just trying to distinguish between when I am talking out of my ass (often) and when I actually have some knowledge/context on the issue.

At any rate, I still don't think there is any downside because even any theoretical downside was greater than any potential upside in remaining in the A10. In other words, the Big East was a guaranteed net positive for us. The question is only one of degree. (And bear in mind I'm in the camp that believes this is a vastly different Big East than its predecessors.)