Balanced Scheduling

[MHettel]

By the way, all the people that defend the size of the BE based on the fact that "balanced scheduling" is so attractive should consider the evidence the selection committee just presented us.

We got 4 teams in. Barely. XU was one of the last 2 selected, and Providence gets and 11 seed. If Providence doesn't win the conf tournament, they would not have made it. The BE would be a 3 bid conference. If Marquette beat XU, then the BE was a 3 bid conference also. The way the BE toruney played out, was the best case scenario. If Marquette beats XU, and Nova beats Providence, is this a 2 bid conference?

Back to the topic. the balanced scheduling in the BE sucks. 2 really good teams in Nova and Creighton. 2 really bad teams in Butler and Depaul. Seaton Hall was by itself as barely out of contention to finish in the top half. Then 5 teams that all went 1-1 against each other. Just beating each otehr to a pulp, and 2 of those 5 teams just barely sqeaked in.

Too much inbreedinbg when it comes to balanced schedulng.

this is a really bad showing for the BE. 40% of the teams make it, with 2 just above the cut-line. A-10 did far better.

Time to reconsider this conference model.

I realize how much I 'll be told I'm worng already.

[Muskie]

in your hypothetical what would adding SLU and Richmond do for instance?

[PMI]

Maybe we should just go independent.

[THRILLHOUSE]

We should just go independent ;-)

argh, PMI beat me to it!

[vee4xu]

I have it from a pretty good XU source that the BE isn't expanding anytime soon. So, we all need to learn to love what we have.

[waggy]

No question the BE didn't get much respect. I don't know that I agree that it's because of balanced scheduling though. Mostly the conference put themselves in the position to be disrespected because they lost key games OOC. X losing to Iowa cannot be overstated. That one game has ramifications not just on X, but on X's opponents, and the B1G.

[Muskie]

No question the BE didn't get much respect. I don't know that I agree that it's because of balanced scheduling though. Mostly the conference put themselves in the position to be disrespected because they lost key games OOC. X losing to Iowa cannot be overstated. That one game has ramifications not just on X, but on X's opponents, and the B1G.

I blame the Atlantis Casino.

[GuyFawkes38]

Yeah, I'm thinking we should go independent.

[xubrew]

Balanced scheduling really bit the Big Twelve in the ass. Wow. Talk about a league that totally screwed itself!!

[GoMuskies]

Balanced scheduling really bit the Big Twelve in the ass. Wow. Talk about a league that totally screwed itself!!

TCU probably would have been in the Tournament with unbalanced scheduling.

[xubrew]

TCU probably would have been in the Tournament with unbalanced scheduling.

Good point. I never thought of it that way.

[RoseyMuskie]

I see the point of the initial post.

The A-10 lost arguably it's three best programs, and sent 6 dancing? The committee essentially admitted that the third best team in the BE is no better than the sixth in the A-10. That's laughable.

The A-10 "unbalance" played to the number of bids.

I'm firm believer that the A-10 put so many in because it didn't have the number of elite programs to control the conference. In turn, it had many inflated "decent" teams.

I know Butler was down, but is GW going on the road to Hinkle and count that as a win? Eh, I don't think so.

In all seriousness, losing X might have been the best thing for that conference as a whole. It's still a good league, but not 6 bid worthy IMO.

Regardless, Georgetown was a few choke jobs away from the tournament. That would have sent five dancing. And I think the conference as a whole should have a goal of 5 bids per year. So things are okay as is.

[MuskieFN]

The Atlantic 10 got 46% of its teams in. The Big East got 40% of its teams in. I'm not too concerned with the set up after 1 season.

[XUFan09]

No question the BE didn't get much respect. I don't know that I agree that it's because of balanced scheduling though. Mostly the conference put themselves in the position to be disrespected because they lost key games OOC. X losing to Iowa cannot be overstated. That one game has ramifications not just on X, but on X's opponents, and the B1G.

Exactly. Using the seeding as "proof" of a theory for unbalanced schedule is laughable. Going into the conference season, a lot of people were worried about the poor performance by most teams in the non-conference schedule., especially over on HLOH where they discuss more conference-wide issues. No matter what, teams have to play tough non-conference games and win some of them, because rarely will the Selection Committee take a team solely on its conference merits only, Providence sans victory yesterday being a great example.

Teams in the conference need to schedule at least solid non-conference slates and include at least a couple of road games. Xavier and Georgetown were the only two teams on the Bubble who actually scheduled well in the non-conference and also the only ones that accomplished anything in the first half of the season, and Georgetown still had a chance at making it at 8-10 with a run in the conference tournament but blew their chance.


Balanced scheduling really bit the Big Twelve in the ass. Wow. Talk about a league that totally screwed itself!!

Lol yeah, what an implosion.

[GoMuskies]

I see the point of the initial post.

The A-10 lost arguably it's three best programs, and sent 6 dancing? The committee essentially admitted that the third best team in the BE is no better than the sixth in the A-10. That's laughable.

The A-10 "unbalance" played to the number of bids.


I would just point out that Joe Lunardi did a Bracketology on January 2nd basically before conference play had begun. He had 5 A-10 teams in solely based on what they did in the non-conference.

[XUFan09]

I see the point of the initial post.

The A-10 lost arguably it's three best programs, and sent 6 dancing? The committee essentially admitted that the third best team in the BE is no better than the sixth in the A-10. That's laughable.

The A-10 "unbalance" played to the number of bids.

I'm firm believer that the A-10 put so many in because it didn't have the number of elite programs to control the conference. In turn, it had many inflated "decent" teams.

I know Butler was down, but is GW going on the road to Hinkle and count that as a win? Eh, I don't think so.

In all seriousness, losing X might have been the best thing for that conference as a whole. It's still a good league, but not 6 bid worthy IMO.

Regardless, Georgetown was a few choke jobs away from the tournament. That would have sent five dancing. And I think the conference as a whole should have a goal of 5 bids per year. So things are okay as is.

The Atlantic 10 had great seniors simultaneously on a number of teams. It would have still been a really good year with Xavier there. Also, just as important, the Atlantic 10 as a whole scheduled appropriately the up the overall RPI. Most of the decent and good teams scheduled non-conference slates that were winnable but included quality games. Most of the mediocre and bad teams scheduled crappy teams against whom they could win a lot of games. Then when the conference schedule started, the teams improved each other's RPI significantly, just as the old Big East did.

[xubrew]

I think everything kind of lined up nicely for the A10 this year. A lot of teams were at the top of their talent cycles, and they all played schedules that weren't overwhelmingly tough, but were decent, and they did well against it. They also played and won a decent amount of games away from home. Having said that, a lot of what was lined up for them this year won't be in place for them next year.

If teams in the Big East would all collectively go out, pick up a couple of road wins, and pick up a couple of wins against tournament caliber teams, we would absolutely blow the committee's mind on Selection Sunday. If you look at Kansas, Baylor, Oklahoma State, Iowa State and Texas who all had establish solid elements of their profile before conference play even began, that's why the league managed to get seven teams in. The balanced schedule actually pushed the league forward because all of those teams played each other twice, and gave everyone in the league two shots at notable wins. Even Kansas State did a little something out of conference, albeit very little.

Nova and Creighton did the most out of conference. The committee seemed to respect them. If more teams did that, then we'd get more respect.

It's not rocket science. It's really not even algebra. If you want more bids, and you feel a conference with weaker teams got more respect than you did, then look at how they scheduled and copy it and do it better.

[RoseyMuskie]

The Atlantic 10 had great seniors simultaneously on a number of teams. It would have still been a really good year with Xavier there. Also, just as important, the Atlantic 10 as a whole scheduled appropriately the up the overall RPI. Most of the decent and good teams scheduled non-conference slates that were winnable but included quality games. Most of the mediocre and bad teams scheduled crappy teams against whom they could win a lot of games. Then when the conference schedule started, the teams improved each other's RPI significantly, just as the old Big East did.

I suppose I have to give them credit for doing what the committee asks..but the committee's seeding is ultimately what confuses me, though. Haven't looked at the S Curve yet to see which was rated higher, but the committee looked at SLU or VCU as the best from the A10. Both were given 5 seeds. A good seed, but if your best is a 5 seed in a 6 bid league, that tells me that you had a bunch of decent teams, and then cellar dwellers. No "elite." And then resumes were just inflated as such.

[XUFan09]

I suppose I have to give them credit for doing what the committee asks..but the committee's seeding is ultimately what confuses me, though. Haven't looked at the S Curve yet to see which was rated higher, but the committee looked at SLU or VCU as the best from the A10. Both were given 5 seeds. A good seed, but if your best is a 5 seed in a 6 bid league, that tells me that you had a bunch of decent teams, and then cellar dwellers. No "elite." And then resumes were just inflated as such.

At its peaks, the A10 generally didn't have elite teams. That's actually why some would still call it a mid-major conference, because even if it fielded a lot of teams, it generally wasn't putting title contenders into the field except for here or there.

[Snipe]

The A-10 is a great league. We used to own it. I am happy for them. We barely made the dance. I watched every game. I agree with the selection committee. I am looking forward to the Big Dance. I am looking forward to the future.

I loved the A-10. It was the best thing that had ever happened to us at the time. I love the Big East, and I am a huge fan of the balanced schedule. I want Gtown and Nova and Marquette tickets in my package every year. This is an Elite league with a shot at the Title. We are going to be good next year too.

Thumbs up to the Beast of the East! I love the Big East.

[BandAid]

I'm happy with four Big East teams in. I know it's not a large quantity, but as others have mentioned it's 40% of the conference. The goal should probably be 5. 3 would be a disappointment.

[Masterofreality]

I disagree with that unless Providence won the Big East Tournament, that they were not making the field.

I believe now that what some of the pundits said happened...that Providence and Xavier just swapped spots.

Fact is, we have 4 in. That's all that counts. If we are all good enough, we will win games. Period.

[xu82]

I disagree with that unless Providence won the Big East Tournament, that they were not making the field.

I believe now that what some of the pundits said happened...that Providence and Xavier just swapped spots.

Fact is, we have 4 in. That's all that counts. If we are all good enough, we will win games. Period.

We swapped spots because they beat Creighton after we lost to them. If we can beat NC State and then move forward we can make up for that. I'd love a chance to play either of those teams again. Survive and advance.

[xu82]

I hope we can keep four in until it really counts. Hoping for good things.

[Kahns Krazy]

We barely made the dance. I watched every game. I agree with the selection committee. I am looking forward to the Big Dance. .

I think this is impossible to refute. Xavier is dancing with 51 RPI. This was impossible a few years back. I'm not sure what we are complaining about.

[gladdenguy]

I'm just complaining about Creighton playing like absolute shit on Saturday night. What a crock of shit. And Seton Hall screwed us AGAIN by beating Villanova and then getting Providence to the final game.

[paulxu]

I think this is impossible to refute. Xavier is dancing with 51 RPI. This was impossible a few years back. I'm not sure what we are complaining about.

47?

[xu82]

I'm just complaining about Creighton playing like absolute shit on Saturday night. What a crock of shit. And Seton Hall screwed us AGAIN by beating Villanova and then getting Providence to the final game.

While that pisses me off as well, I doubt it was a plot against X. It's an "any given night" kind of thing and shows just how close we all are. This was a perfect storm against us in the end, but we still have a chance to earn our way into the bigger bracket.

[Masterofreality]

I think this is impossible to refute. Xavier is dancing with 51 RPI. This was impossible a few years back. I'm not sure what we are complaining about.

Actually, we were 47 officially...but who's counting? KState was 51.

[Masterofreality]

I'm just complaining about Creighton playing like absolute shit on Saturday night. What a crock of shit. And Seton Hall screwed us AGAIN by beating Villanova and then getting Providence to the final game.


While that pisses me off as well, I doubt it was a plot against X. It's an "any given night" kind of thing and shows just how close we all are. This was a perfect storm against us in the end, but we still have a chance to earn our way into the bigger bracket.

Well, next year, let's avoid losing to a crappy Seton Hall-esque team at home after a week off, and then to that same crap team on the road. Problem solved.

[chico]

It's been one year. Good grief, can we give it a little time before making outrageous declarations.

But maybe everyone else is right. Maybe we should take a walk and become an independent.

[xufan2434]

The A-10 has a lot of mediocre teams that beat up on each other and it just happened to work out for em. I don't remember what year it was, but when X was still in the league a couple years ago, there was talk all season of the A-10 getting as many as 6 teams in. I think 4 actually made it just because of who beat who and who lost when they needed a win. It's just the way the cards fall.

Also if GTown didn't lose Smith for basically the whole season, they're dancing. X will be better next year, and Butler, GTown, and Marquette all had down years. I think next year there is definitely a good shot to get 4-5 in. The A-10 won't have 6 in for a while after Chazz Williams and basically everyone on SLU finally graduates. VCU is gonna start flagshipping that conference real soon. Langston Galloway was starting as a freshman against X with basically all young guys around him. They are just now making the tournament. SO it's probably going to take them another good recruiting class and 4 years to make it back as well.

[xsteve1]

The fact is Xavier is just not very good away from Cintas. If X wants to get back to being considered a lock for the tourney they just need to be better away from home. Losing 3 straight in the Bahamas pretty much set the tone. If X wins 2 of those they are comfortably in as probably a 6 or 7.

[bleedXblue]

Lets give it a few years. The Big East has some really good recruiting classes coming in next year.

The league has to stand on its own and prove its a high level league. I have no doubt that it will.

[xubrew]

Lets give it a few years. The Big East has some really good recruiting classes coming in next year.

The league has to stand on its own and prove its a high level league. I have no doubt that it will.

I agree completely.

There are areas where the Big East needs to improve. The conference schedule is not one of them. To suggest that playing a balanced schedule is what held the league back is like saying that all the teams need to change the colors of their uniforms. It is so far off point that it's just silly.

[GoMuskies]

I think it would help Xavier to change uniform colors. At least anytime they consider wearing grey.

[Masterofreality]

I think it would help Xavier to change uniform colors. At least anytime they consider wearing grey.

Well, Black is Back next year!

[XUFan09]

The fact is Xavier is just not very good away from Cintas. If X wants to get back to being considered a lock for the tourney they just need to be better away from home. Losing 3 straight in the Bahamas pretty much set the tone. If X wins 2 of those they are comfortably in as probably a 6 or 7.

Now that's just crazy talk!

[MHettel]

I agree completely.

There are areas where the Big East needs to improve. The conference schedule is not one of them. To suggest that playing a balanced schedule is what held the league back is like saying that all the teams need to change the colors of their uniforms. It is so far off point that it's just silly.

Actually, an 18 game conference schedule has an impact. it's not silly at all. But I know the type of things you like to comment on, so I could see where this is over your head.

[smileyy]

Double round robin is pure conference basketball.

[Xman95]

Great thread...MHettel is right. The balanced schedule is a problem. The Big East needs to figure out a way that the can go back in time. They can then know who the three or four best teams are and just let them play about 15-18 games among themselves, while the scrubs get to go play intramural racquetball or something. Heck, maybe they can go play softball and accumulate some high walk totals.

[Kahns Krazy]

Actually, we were 47 officially...but who's counting? KState was 51.

I don't know if what I looked at was dated or just wrong, but the point remains the same. We appear to have gotten credit from the committee for our schedule, so I'm not sure what the issue is. As far as any other team "screwing us", the only team that screwed us is us. We survived to play another game. Now it's time to win and prove that we belong there.

[Kahns Krazy]

Actually, an 18 game conference schedule has an impact. it's not silly at all. But I know the type of things you like to comment on, so I could see where this is over your head.

If we are bringing up subjects that are over people's head, I submit "making your point without being an ass*ole".