Recruiting

[GIMMFD]

Does anybody else find it interesting how much the recruiting game has changed, just a few years ago I wouldn't think that Duke would be taking so many one and done players, however after Kyrie, and the loaded class the Blue Devils have for last year the recruiting spectrum seems to be changing drastically. I think teams have to start competing with the likes of Kentucky in signing one and done players to compete. Any thoughts?

[GoMuskies]

I'm not sure how much they need to compete with Kentucky. Sure, UK had a steallar team that won a title and had another that reached a Final Four, but they haven't been more successful under Calipari than Louisville has been under Pitino during the same time. And Pitino has not been landing one and dones at Louisville (I'm certain he's been recruiting them). Some coaches may THINK they have to change philosophies to deal with Kentucky, but there is still more than one way to skin a cat.

[chico]

I don't think signing one and dones are done so much as to compete with Kentucky. I think there are just more kids now looking to make the jump sooner, so if you want the really good players you have to assume they're not staying too long.

I know it's not the case but it seems like the last 4-year player that was a lottery pick was David West.

[Juice]

Does anybody else find it interesting how much the recruiting game has changed, just a few years ago I wouldn't think that Duke would be taking so many one and done players, however after Kyrie, and the loaded class the Blue Devils have for last year the recruiting spectrum seems to be changing drastically. I think teams have to start competing with the likes of Kentucky in signing one and done players to compete. Any thoughts?

As Brian Snow said on twitter, it's not just UK that is recruiting one and done players, everyone is. It's just UK that was landing most of them. Duke isn't a great place for one and dones because Coach K will play a 3-4 year guy over a freshman. Plus Coach K has had two off the top off my head in the last few years with Irving and Rivers.

[Xman95]

I don't think signing one and dones are done so much as to compete with Kentucky. I think there are just more kids now looking to make the jump sooner, so if you want the really good players you have to assume they're not staying too long.

I know it's not the case but it seems like the last 4-year player that was a lottery pick was David West.

And West wasn't even a lottery pick (stupid NBA GMs!!).

[Muskie]

I'm most interested to see how UK does next season. When these 5-6 kids all leave after this year, what does UK have coming in next year. From what I've read, it's somewhat of a downgrade to what they are used too. Does Cal stick it out? Or does he had to the Knicks (as has been rumored).

[MADXSTER]

Coach K use to only give one offer out to a player. If that player would decline, then he would give an offer to another kid. He wouldn't hand out 4 offers and take the first one to commit. That part of his recruiting changed several years back.

[SpectorJersey]

As Brian Snow said on twitter, it's not just UK that is recruiting one and done players, everyone is. It's just UK that was landing most of them. Duke isn't a great place for one and dones because Coach K will play a 3-4 year guy over a freshman. Plus Coach K has had two off the top off my head in the last few years with Irving and Rivers.

Coach K will play the best players that give him the best chance to win regardless of age. That goes for any coach out there. Like any coach, I'm sure he trusts upperclassmen more esp on defense, but he isnt bringing in top 10 players to ride pine. College coaches want the best talent, regardless of one and done. Any coach who would pass on a NBA talent bc its only for one year isnt doing their job. Remember Jcraw? 2 years and playing plus a redshirt year....in one year at X he put us on his back to the S16, any coach would take that whether is he a junior or a frosh.

[Titanxman04]

Coach K will play the best players that give him the best chance to win regardless of age. That goes for any coach out there. Like any coach, I'm sure he trusts upperclassmen more esp on defense, but he isnt bringing in top 10 players to ride pine. College coaches want the best talent, regardless of one and done. Any coach who would pass on a NBA talent bc its only for one year isnt doing their job. Remember Jcraw? 2 years and playing plus a redshirt year....in one year at X he put us on his back to the S16, any coach would take that whether is he a junior or a frosh.

I think that players are sort of finding an appeal to stay at college for a couple of years before heading to the pros right away. While Wiggins has certainly made it clear he's going to go, guys like Smart and Harrison Barnes, and Sullinger, have all stuck it out for an extra season or so. It's not the case across board, but don't be surprised if a few of those guys stick around for a couple of seasons.

[Xman95]

I think that players are sort of finding an appeal to stay at college for a couple of years before heading to the pros right away. While Wiggins has certainly made it clear he's going to go, guys like Smart and Harrison Barnes, and Sullinger, have all stuck it out for an extra season or so. It's not the case across board, but don't be surprised if a few of those guys stick around for a couple of seasons.

From my perspective there seems to be a difference between some of the one-and-dones. If you're a potential one-and-done that decides to go to Duke, chances are you have done will with academics and have no problems with the student side of student-athlete. If you're a one-and-done heading to a place like Kentucky, chances are you're not interested in the academic side and may not value that student part of the equation. You're only goal is to play bball, do the absolute minimum to get through classes to stay eligible, and bolt to the NBA. This wont be the case for everyone, but it seems it would probably cover the majority.

[bobbiemcgee]

We have 3 Mickey Dee's nominees, and 5 guys averaging about a 150 pts. a game. Holy shit!

[wkrq59]

From one who can remember when the only recruits who would consider Xavier were nthe sons of old friends of the Xavier headcoach, to kids rated among the top 100 in the nation to four and five-star recruits. yes, Xavier has come a long long way.

[ArizonaXUGrad]

On David West, his draft year was the Lebron year. That is a tough year but here are the players taken ahead of him.

Zarko Cabarkapa
Troy Bell
Reece Gaines
Good old Donnie Darko

Good lord, can you imagine how good the Pistons could have been if they had David West as a rookie to a 2 year guy when Rashweed Wallace was imploding?

[BBC 08]

Love DWest but his first two years in the league were not that great so the Pistons probably wouldn't have been that much better.

[MHettel]

On David West, his draft year was the Lebron year. That is a tough year but here are the players taken ahead of him.

Zarko Cabarkapa
Troy Bell
Reece Gaines
Good old Donnie Darko

Good lord, can you imagine how good the Pistons could have been if they had David West as a rookie to a 2 year guy when Rashweed Wallace was imploding?

I called the Seattle SportsTalk Radio station and tried to lobby for the Sonics to Draft DWest with either the 12th pick or the 14th pick. They said "WHO?". The sportstalk guys were convinced Michael Sweetney was the right pick (he went to Chicago somewhere higher than where West went).

The Sonics took Luke Ridnour and Nick Collison. Maybe if they listened to me, I'd still be rooting for the Sonics instead of hating the Thunder.

[MHettel]

Love DWest but his first two years in the league were not that great so the Pistons probably wouldn't have been that much better.

That was alot more about getting an opportunity to get on the court than anything else. That team was pretty decent, and he was playing behind PJ Brown who was a solid veteran (much like DWest is today). Go back and look at his game stats for his 3rd year. I think Brown got a minor injury and in his second game starting, West dropped like 32 pts. Soon after, PJ Brown was traded and West became an all-star for New Orleans.

[LA Muskie]

We have 3 Mickey Dee's nominees, and 5 guys averaging about a 150 pts. a game. Holy shit!
It's better than a swift kick in the ass, but HS stats are just a smidge above meaningless.

[XUFan09]

I called the Seattle SportsTalk Radio station and tried to lobby for the Sonics to Draft DWest with either the 12th pick or the 14th pick. They said "WHO?". The sportstalk guys were convinced Michael Sweetney was the right pick (he went to Chicago somewhere higher than where West went).

The Sonics took Luke Ridnour and Nick Collison. Maybe if they listened to me, I'd still be rooting for the Sonics instead of hating the Thunder.

They only covered sports and they didn't know who the National Player of the Year was? How did they have jobs?

[Burrcats]

On David West, his draft year was the Lebron year. That is a tough year but here are the players taken ahead of him.

Zarko Cabarkapa
Troy Bell
Reece Gaines
Good old Donnie Darko

Good lord, can you imagine how good the Pistons could have been if they had David West as a rookie to a 2 year guy when Rashweed Wallace was imploding?

Forget David West, think how many titles they would have won with Carmelo Anthony.

[nuts4xu]

That was alot more about getting an opportunity to get on the court than anything else.

Agreed. The other issue West had to fight through was the fact Byron Scott was his coach. B Scott was known for being tough on rookies and West didn't get much of a chance to play before Brown was hurt. It is also interesting to note, David West was drafter 18th the year he graduated. Of the 58 players drafted that year, only 8 of them have made an all star team (LeBron, Bosh, D Wade, Melo, D West, Chris Kaman, Josh Howard, and Mo Williams) only 4 of those players made an All NBA team, and 11 people never played a single minute in the NBA. That class was top loaded with Melo, Wade, LeBron, and Bosh but the class over all was fairly crappy.

[GoMuskies]

As I understand it, West played lousy defense and thus was able to collect a lot of weakside rebounds.

[DC Muskie]

They only covered sports and they didn't know who the National Player of the Year was? How did they have jobs?

They work in sports radio. The only industry where people like MH call in tell guys who don't actually work for the team, who they should draft, then sit back years later and tell the tale of how he called idiots who don't actually work for the team how wrong they were. "If those sports talk guys had only listened to me, the Sonics still wouldn't have drafted West!"

Seriously MH brings this story up every time someone talks about West's draft position. I still can't figure out what he is proud of. I told my barber that the Wizards should have drafted David West. He didn't agree. What an idiot that guy was. If only he had listened, agreed, and somehow someone in the Wizards had actually drafted West, then I'd look like a genius! Well, I'm actually a genius either way. High Five everybody!

[Juice]

I called the Seattle SportsTalk Radio station and tried to lobby for the Sonics to Draft DWest with either the 12th pick or the 14th pick. They said "WHO?". The sportstalk guys were convinced Michael Sweetney was the right pick (he went to Chicago somewhere higher than where West went).

The Sonics took Luke Ridnour and Nick Collison. Maybe if they listened to me, I'd still be rooting for the Sonics instead of hating the Thunder.

Sweetney!

http://sportzandstuff.files.wordpress.com/2012/02/sweetneylarge0212d.jpg

[Masterofreality]

Back to recruiting.

The GCL's Griffin Mackenzie is now at Denver...and having nightly visits with Mr.Pine.

In Denver's blowout win ( by 14) tonight in the always gargantuan Summit League, Griff logged zero..that's nil, none, nacho...minutes vs Nebraska Omaha.

I somehow found the game on Fox College Sports Atlantic/South Pacific of the North on Channel 30,564 on Uverse. It wasn't close.

[XUFan09]

And Jordan Latham is averaging 6 points and 4 rebounds...as a senior...for Loyola-Maryland. I think it's safe to say that Latham and McKenzie were busts while Jay Canty was a talented player that got recruited over.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk

[GIMMFD]

And Jordan Latham is averaging 6 points and 4 rebounds...as a senior...for Loyola-Maryland. I think it's safe to say that Latham and McKenzie were busts while Jay Canty was a talented player that got recruited over.

Sent from my DROID RAZR HD using Tapatalk

App State is 6-13, with Canty not really playing against good competition as he missed the first 9 games. I'll take Justin Martin over him any day. He may have been a decent player at X, but I just think the talent we have now is much better.

[MHettel]

They work in sports radio. The only industry where people like MH call in tell guys who don't actually work for the team, who they should draft, then sit back years later and tell the tale of how he called idiots who don't actually work for the team how wrong they were. "If those sports talk guys had only listened to me, the Sonics still wouldn't have drafted West!"

Seriously MH brings this story up every time someone talks about West's draft position. I still can't figure out what he is proud of. I told my barber that the Wizards should have drafted David West. He didn't agree. What an idiot that guy was. If only he had listened, agreed, and somehow someone in the Wizards had actually drafted West, then I'd look like a genius! Well, I'm actually a genius either way. High Five everybody!

Hey DC, someday I'm going to meet you in person.

[DC Muskie]

Hey DC, someday I'm going to meet you in person.

Awesome! Maybe we can play pinball and you can retell the story of how you once saved a pinball company. I love that one.

Make it happen!

[Masterofreality]

Wow...this is some serious East Coast - West Coast.

Gangstas.

[XUFan09]

App State is 6-13, with Canty not really playing against good competition as he missed the first 9 games. I'll take Justin Martin over him any day. He may have been a decent player at X, but I just think the talent we have now is much better.

Hence the "recruited over" part. And bad team/competition or not, he's putting up some big numbers at an efficient rate and probably would have been have been a nice role player at X. Martin and Dez Wells, on the other hand, are impact players, and they both committed after him.

I always said that if you combined Canty's ability with Latham's position, you had a player that wouldn't have transferred.

[xavierj]

App State is 6-13, with Canty not really playing against good competition as he missed the first 9 games. I'll take Justin Martin over him any day. He may have been a decent player at X, but I just think the talent we have now is much better.

Jay Canty has not played a minute this year. He was suspended earlier but never came back. I wonder what happened? He averaged 17 a game last year and 14 the year before.

[GIMMFD]

Hence the "recruited over" part. And bad team/competition or not, he's putting up some big numbers at an efficient rate and probably would have been have been a nice role player at X. Martin and Dez Wells, on the other hand, are impact players, and they both committed after him.

I always said that if you combined Canty's ability with Latham's position, you had a player that wouldn't have transferred.

I read that wrong, my apologies. I thought you were saying Canty should have stayed.



Jay Canty has not played a minute this year. He was suspended earlier but never came back. I wonder what happened? He averaged 17 a game last year and 14 the year before.

He's played 5 games this season: http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/player/gamelog/_/id/51077/jay-canty

[Chalmers0]

Canty broke his hand last week and is out 4-6 weeks.

Before getting injured he was putting up really solid numbers, ORating of over 118 on KenPom. He is a really good player, just saw JMart and Dez playing the same position.

[paulxu]

Yesterday we had the #6 recruiting class in the US per ESPN.
Today we have the #17 class. We dropped 11 spots and Georgetown gained 8 to take over our slot.

Would one of you recruiting gurus explain to me what happened between yesterday and today to our class. Did 2 of them become ineligible?

http://insider.espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/classrankings

[The_Mack_Pack]

Yesterday we had the #6 recruiting class in the US per ESPN.
Today we have the #17 class. We dropped 11 spots and Georgetown gained 8 to take over our slot.

Would one of you recruiting gurus explain to me what happened between yesterday and today to our class. Did 2 of them become ineligible?

http://insider.espn.go.com/college-sports/basketball/recruiting/classrankings

ESPN updated their rankings.. Each recruit for next season are having great senior seasons but ESPN wisdom says to drop a recruit in the rankings as soon as they commit to Xavier. This literally happens every year.

As a side note, I still don't understand why Paul Biancardi of all people is ESPN's lead recruiting expert. That's the same guy who gave money to recruits while he coached under O'Brien at OSU.

[paulxu]

Nope, that doesn't work. All those people were committed to X before when we earned the #6 ranking.

[waggy]

global warming, god or gays.

[danaandvictory]

Nope, that doesn't work. All those people were committed to X before when we earned the #6 ranking.

My guess would be that a number of uncommitted Top 50 types committed to big schools, thus pushing them ahead of X.

Or it's a conspiracy.