Matta vs Miller

[Jesuit4Life]

Sorry, no option for the atomic bomb.

[Muskie]

I picked Ohio State. Although truthfully I'd rather see Miller's squad win.

[mohr5150]

Sorry, no option for the atomic bomb.


Ditto.

[AZtoCA]

Since you guys know both coaches
-who is better?
-Any strengths/weakness of each coach?

I know X almost beat Ohio st. in 07'

[Masterofreality]

Over/Under.

How many times will the Ron Lewis 3 heave be shown this week?

The long nightmare that will never end.

[waggy]

Should be a great game. I like both guys.

I think advantage goes to OSU simply because defending the ball is OSU's strength, and Lyons has never been a great facilitator. Arizona has a lot of other weapons though, and could certainly win. In fact I think Arizona has the intangibles with the way their season ended and Miller getting fined.

[joe titan]

Frankly. Matta paved his way and Miller was around to hang onto the coattails and then grab the big offer as soon as he had the chance. Although previous Ohio St. teams under Matta had plenty of talent (Oden, Conley, Sullinger et al) this team is not talent laden. Miller should be able to figure out how to win the game and has much better troops to deploy. That said, Craft vs Lyons is the absolute key. If Lyons is overly selfish and Craft gets into his head, could be a lot of "I told you so" from this Board.

[X-band '01]

Thankfully the clip of Ron Lewis won't be played as ad nauseam now that Aaron Craft is in the permanent highlight reel.

[DC Muskie]

I think I'll go for Matta with Lyons going off for 45 points.

[LadyMuskie]

Since I was one of the few people who enjoyed Lyons, I'd like to see Arizona win. But, at this point, my brackets are such a mess, it doesn't matter. If there was a way they could both lose with Lyons playing well, I'd take that!

[UCGRAD4X]

I think I'll go for Matta with Lyons going off for 45 points.

You're kidding, right?

[BlueGuy]

Since I was one of the few people who enjoyed Lyons, I'd like to see Arizona win. But, at this point, my brackets are such a mess, it doesn't matter. If there was a way they could both lose with Lyons playing well, I'd take that!

I'm with you Lady. Lyons will always be a Musketeer in my book. I'm rooting hard for him, and whoever he's playing for.

[nuts4xu]

The 2 best coaches our program has ever had, it should be a great game.

[fellahmuskie]

I love watching Lyons play and hope AZ wins, even though I have OSU winning it all. I'd love to see Mark get drafted in June, though I have no idea if that's a possibility or not.

[DC Muskie]

You're kidding, right?

Nope. Someone has to win, I'd rather be it Matta. I always liked Mark, so it would be great if he had a huge game in a loss.

[xubball1993]

Mark was a huge pain in Mack's ass and bailed when Chris challenged him to be our point guard. I love Craft's blue collar defense so I'm rooting for him to shut down Mark. OSU.

[paulxu]

I'm thinking Mack wanted Lyons to play the 2.

[fellahmuskie]

I love watching Lyons play and hope AZ wins, even though I have OSU winning it all. I'd love to see Mark get drafted in June, though I have no idea if that's a possibility or not.

Actually, I realized I'm not that selfless when it comes to Mark, as much as I do like him. I'd rather he have a huge game in defeat. I'm sick of my brackets sucking every year.

[boozehound]

Matta wins. Lyons goes 0 for 23 punches Aaron Craft and gets ejected.

[ammtd34]

Mark was a huge pain in Mack's ass and bailed when Chris challenged him to be our point guard. I love Craft's blue collar defense so I'm rooting for him to shut down Mark. OSU.

Mack didn't want him to play PG.

[X-man]

Miller have better players, but Matta is a better coach. So I am going with Matta even though the game site gives Miller's team an advantage.

[ammtd34]

Go Wildcats. One of my best friends from Xavier is their DBO.

[danaandvictory]

Mack put in place certain parameters Lyons was expected to follow in the offseason to continue as part of the program. Mark initially agreed to those parameters (see his remarks after the Baylor game) but quickly his behavior regressed. His departure for Arizona was in everyone's best interest at that point. Had the Wells situation taken place before Mark's departure, maybe the parties would have been able to compromise and find a medium.

I am rooting for Ohio State primarily because I enjoy watching Thomas play. That dude is a big-time scorer.

[Masterofreality]

Mack didn't want him to play PG.

Mack already had 2 point guards.

[ammtd34]

Mack already had 2 point guards.

I know. Someone said that Mack wanted him to play point and that's why he left.

[GoMuskies]

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view3/1507273/metrodome-roof-collapse-o.gif

[Masterofreality]

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view3/1507273/metrodome-roof-collapse-o.gif

Really. Maybe the roof will cave in.

Want nobody to get hurt though.

[PMI]

Frankly. Matta paved his way and Miller was around to hang onto the coattails and then grab the big offer as soon as he had the chance.

I think that's a pretty ridiculous assertion.

[DC Muskie]

I think that's a pretty ridiculous assertion.

But it was funny. At least I hope it was joke.

Please let's no lose our sense of humor this week people!

[GoMuskies]

I think that's a pretty ridiculous assertion.

What?!? You weren't impressed by the loaded roster Matta left Miller? It wouldn't have been SO bad, I suppose, if Cole had stayed healthy. But it still wasn't very good.

[X-Fan]

In my bracket I have OSU beating Zona. However, now that I think about it, I completely forgot a key item: Matta can't coach his way out of a paper bag. Almost every time Matta goes up against an good coach, he loses. I feel that Miller is a WAY better coach than Matta. Matta beats teams with less talent, like he should, but will get out-coached any day. With that said, I feel OSU has more talent, but I would not be surprised if Zona won because of coaching.

[DC Muskie]

In my bracket I have OSU beating Zona. However, now that I think about it, I completely forgot a key item: Matta can't coach his way out of a paper bag. Almost every time Matta goes up against an good coach, he loses. I feel that Miller is a WAY better coach than Matta. Matta beats teams with less talent, like he should, but will get out-coached any day. With that said, I feel OSU has more talent, but I would not be surprised if Zona won because of coaching.

Thad Matta? The guy who coached Ohio State to two Final Fours, one of them was last year?

That Thad Matta? The guy who averages 27 wins a season?

Wow, you think that guy can't coach?

[BandAid]

I do tend to think of Miller as the better coach.

[Masterofreality]

What?!? You weren't impressed by the loaded roster Matta left Miller? It wouldn't have been SO bad, I suppose, if Cole had stayed healthy. But it still wasn't very good.

Churchill Odia!!!!!

[ammtd34]

Churchill Odia!!!!!

I sat between Church and Justin Cage at study tables my freshman year. All Churchill did was try to download videos of Michael Jordan.

[RealDeal]

Tough choice, both are great coaches who some idiots in our fanbase wanted fired when they were here. On the minor league forum that is. Ohio State is the better team this year I think. I think Craft handles Lyons. Should be fun to watch.

[Masterofreality]

And we could have had Kyle Lowrey!

[smileyy]

Thad Matta? The guy who coached Ohio State to two Final Fours, one of them was last year?

That Thad Matta? The guy who averages 27 wins a season?

Wow, you think that guy can't coach?

I think he's talking about in-game adjustments. Like getting Anthony Myles off the court before he picks up his 5th foul a minute later.

[SixFig]

Maybe Pete Gillen will be on radio and Skip Prosser will descend from on high and we can have an ex-XU coaches conference

[LadyMuskie]

I think he's talking about in-game adjustments. Like getting Anthony Myles off the court before he picks up his 5th foul a minute later.

Let's hope it hasn't taken Matta 9 years to learn that lesson.

[Masterofreality]

Arizona up 3 with 8 seconds left and OSU ball,

If the Desert Raccoon doesn't defend and refuse to foul he ain't got a hair on his ass.

[LA Muskie]

Arizona up 3 with 8 seconds left and OSU ball,

If the Desert Raccoon doesn't defend and refuse to foul he ain't got a hair on his ass.

Dude, seriously? No one needs that image in their head.

[Cheesehead]

"And ah....." vs. The Cough

[waggy]

No you're right!

I always loved that one.

[Mel Cooley XU'81]

I know X almost beat Ohio st. in 07'

Negative reps.

[kyxu]

If Lyons goes to the league, will his college be listed as Xavier or Arizona?

[gladdenguy]

If Lyons goes to the league, will his college be listed as Xavier or Arizona?

The "D" league? There is no way he'll make it in THE league.

As for the game. Go Beaknose and Aaron Craft. I want Lyons career to be over.

[Retire33]

The "D" league? There is no way he'll make it in THE league.

As for the game. Go Beaknose and Aaron Craft. I want Lyons career to be over.

Just about as much as your posting career needs to be over. You bring 100% negativity all the while bringing nothing with any substance.

This guy is the Paul Daughtery of XH

[bobbiemcgee]

http://azstarnet.com/sports/basketball/college/wildcats/arizona-basketball-friends-miller-matta-turn-enemies-for-day/article_3f13f082-d9ab-5c9e-afcf-4440ec1f728e.html

Somehow I think Mark Lyons will do whatever he needs to do to win this game. I know many hate him here, but he will be in his element.

[smileyy]

I want Lyons career to be over.

That's kinda uncool.

[gladdenguy]

Just about as much as your posting career needs to be over. You bring 100% negativity all the while bringing nothing with any substance.

This guy is the Paul Daughtery of XH

He is good basketball player and a flat out punk and I want him done. I don't care if you like it or not. I don't see how its being negative. You don't have players or coaches in sports you hate? If not, good for you.....go admire a rainbow. Until then....ignore me. I don't give a f--k.

[Retire33]

He is good basketball player and a flat out punk and I want him done. I don't care if you like it or not. I don't see how its being negative. You don't have players or coaches in sports you hate? If not, good for you.....go admire a rainbow. Until then....ignore me. I don't give a f--k.

Do I have people in sports I hate? No I do not. I do not know them personally so it would be naive if me to have that opinion and stance.

On the other hand, do I have players/people I root against for different reasons; sure.

But to railroad a kid who never got in trouble with law, graduated from the university, and played his heart out on the court (albeit with some shorty decision making in flow of game). I'm sure you have better places to direct anger and negativity then a 23-yr old young man with a college degree trying to do make a positive impact for him and his family.

[BandAid]

He is good basketball player and a flat out punk and I want him done. I don't care if you like it or not. I don't see how its being negative. You don't have players or coaches in sports you hate? If not, good for you.....go admire a rainbow. Until then....ignore me. I don't give a f--k.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQSNhk5ICTI

You know a lot of people make fun of this dude. But when was the last time any of us were so happy over something so simple? Maybe our culture needs to regain a little of its sense of wonder...

Like I wonder how many drugs this guy has taken...

[Muskie]

As a result of how that game unfolded, it’s one of the few subjects neither Miller nor Matta bring up with one-another. In addition to the heartbreak of wasting a late nine-point lead for Xavier, the outcome was controversial because referees opted not to call an apparent intentional foul on Greg Oden for shoving a Musketeers player out of bounds with 10 seconds left in regulation.
“That was as big a heartbreaker as I can remember,” said Xavier director of basketball administration Mario Mercurio, who worked under both Matta and Miller as well. “I’ve never watched a tape of that game. I’ve never seen Ron Lewis’ shot except for when it was live. I would say that not many people at Xavier acknowledge that game’s existence. I don’t know if Sean and Thad talk about that game much, but I know this. I never talk to Sean about it.”

[Muskie]

As a result of how that game unfolded, it’s one of the few subjects neither Miller nor Matta bring up with one-another. In addition to the heartbreak of wasting a late nine-point lead for Xavier, the outcome was controversial because referees opted not to call an apparent intentional foul on Greg Oden for shoving a Musketeers player out of bounds with 10 seconds left in regulation.
“That was as big a heartbreaker as I can remember,” said Xavier director of basketball administration Mario Mercurio, who worked under both Matta and Miller as well. “I’ve never watched a tape of that game. I’ve never seen Ron Lewis’ shot except for when it was live. I would say that not many people at Xavier acknowledge that game’s existence. I don’t know if Sean and Thad talk about that game much, but I know this. I never talk to Sean about it.”

[danaandvictory]

I think he's talking about in-game adjustments. Like getting Anthony Myles off the court before he picks up his 5th foul a minute later.

Well, if we're going to criticize Thad for that maybe we want to inquire as to why Sean didn't foul at the end of the Ohio State game.

[danaandvictory]

I'm sure you have better places to direct anger and negativity then a 23-yr old young man with a college degree trying to do make a positive impact for him and his family.

Oh, I think he's got plenty to go around.

[xubball1993]

It kills me, but here's a nice article on Thad and Sean. My dream for X winning the National Championship includes a national revenge tour going through Gonzaga, OSU and AZ. Hell, I'll throw in UCLA too.
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/friendship-between-sean-miller-thad-matta-featured-plenty-035335643--ncaab.html

[BMoreX]

"Xavier of Ohio" really?

[SM#24]

Deja vu Sean ?

[D-West & PO-Z]

OSU gets it done again with another late 3 with the game tied.

[gladdenguy]

Suck it Lyons

[Xavier]

He is good basketball player and a flat out punk and I want him done. I don't care if you like it or not. I don't see how its being negative. You don't have players or coaches in sports you hate? If not, good for you.....go admire a rainbow. Until then....ignore me. I don't give a f--k.

You clearly do, or else you wouldn't have even responded...

I like Lyons, without him X wouldn't have made the tournament last year.

[Retire33]

Suck it Lyons

Way to keep it classy!

[gladdenguy]

You clearly do, or else you wouldn't have even responded...

I like Lyons, without him X wouldn't have made the tournament last year.

You think I care what another poster thinks? Not even close.

I care about Lyons losing that game. He did and I'm elated.

[Muskie in dayton]

OK so I have little respect for GG and his relentless Xavier bashing, but I agree wholeheartedly on this one. Lyons ruined our team in several ways. I took great joy watching as he hung his head while the OSU players celebrated around him. Lyons wanted a ride in the Cadillac, but it got him no further than the Chevy. Good riddance.

[bobbiemcgee]

Lyons ruined our team in several ways.

Yeah he went to 4 S16's, 3 with X and avg'd 24 ppg in the Dance this yr. Just awful.

[GuyFawkes38]

Lyons inspires a lot of frustration. Arizona fans are apparently glad to see him leave:

http://forum.goazcats.com/showthread.php?t=125345

And I thought X fans were tough on him.

[XU 87]

Lyons scored Arizona's last 7 points of the game. I bet they like him a lot more tonight.

[Muskie in dayton]

Yeah he went to 4 S16's, 3 with X and avg'd 24 ppg in the Dance this yr. Just awful.

I agree, imagine what those teams would have done without his selfish ass.

[bobbiemcgee]

Played in the nit I guess

[bobbiemcgee]

Lyons inspires a lot of frustration. Arizona fans are apparently glad to see him leave:

http://forum.goazcats.com/showthread.php?t=125345

And I thought X fans were tough on him.

Funny - quotes from 3 weeks ago - try the current ones

[XUFan09]

Played in the nit I guess

Yep. Except his freshman year. At least then we would have still made the tournament, but we would have probably been a couple seeds lower.

[Xavier]

You think I care what another poster thinks? Not even close.

I care about Lyons losing that game. He did and I'm elated.

Judging by your actions, its obvious you do. Sorry it bothers you I think that.

[bobbiemcgee]

I agree, imagine what those teams would have done without his selfish ass.


You do realize the coach had the option to never play him ever but for some reason chose to do so. So go kick the staff.

[GuyFawkes38]

Funny - quotes from 3 weeks ago - try the current ones

Most of the current, post game posts, are far from complementary. It just surprised me.

" Glad the Lyons experience is over. TJ come on down."

"I like him... But I am STOKED for TJ"

" I appreciate his time here but honestly will not miss him..."

"4 or 5 times in crucial moments he drove in to a 3 man trap, I have no idea what he was thinking, turned it over each time too. I like Mark, appreciate him being here, he carried us some games and lost us a few too."

[LadyMuskie]

OK so I have little respect for GG and his relentless Xavier bashing, but I agree wholeheartedly on this one. Lyons ruined our team in several ways. I took great joy watching as he hung his head while the OSU players celebrated around him. Lyons wanted a ride in the Cadillac, but it got him no further than the Chevy. Good riddance.

I don't believe that Lyons wanted to leave Xavier. So, I don't think he wanted a ride in a Cadillac (and additionally if you want that to be funny and work it should be a Lexus not a Cadillac). Check his twitter page. He still considers himself a part of Xavier Nation forever. I have a lot more respect for him than I do some of the so-called adults on here who have done nothing but trash him and his reputation from the moment he removed his Xavier jersey. The man kept his nose clean and won games here. He's shown Xavier a hell of a lot more respect and class than many posters here have shown when it comes to him or just in general. Some of our posters could take lessons from Lyons in how to be an adult.

[Muskie in dayton]

I don't believe that Lyons wanted to leave Xavier. So, I don't think he wanted a ride in a Cadillac (and additionally if you want that to be funny and work it should be a Lexus not a Cadillac). Check his twitter page. He still considers himself a part of Xavier Nation forever. I have a lot more respect for him than I do some of the so-called adults on here who have done nothing but trash him and his reputation from the moment he removed his Xavier jersey. The man kept his nose clean and won games here. He's shown Xavier a hell of a lot more respect and class than many posters here have shown when it comes to him or just in general. Some of our posters could take lessons from Lyons in how to be an adult.

Yes it was a subtle bash on Millers stupid quote - Cadillac, BMW, Lexus,whatever. Right?

So do you mean by "nose clean" he didn't get arrested? You will recall he had a huge role in that little fracas on 12/10/12. if one really thinks we'd have been in the nit without him, fine. BUT recognizing that its a team game, i feel we grossly underachieved in '11-'12 because of his selfish ass.

[coasterville95]

I thought I had moved on and had resigned myself to the fact that Lyons and Wells are no longer on the team and to enjoy the players that are.

Last night ripped that wound right open again!

[paulxu]

Can I have the Delyham on rye with lettuce, tomato and mustard.

[Muskie]

I enjoyed the game last night. I noted on twitter that it didn't matter that Ariz got an "extra" timeout (I understand they wanted the clock to be right) because Miller is not great at drawing up inbounds plays.

[DC Muskie]

I will never understand the hate for Mark.

[GoMuskies]

nm

[Masterofreality]

I enjoyed the game last night. I noted on twitter that it didn't matter that Ariz got an "extra" timeout (I understand they wanted the clock to be right) because Miller is not great at drawing up inbounds plays.

And he still is not.

It will be interesting to see what happens in the desert next year. Solomon Hill and Cheekz are gone and Parrom probably is, although they are petitioning for a fifth year. There will be a leadership void at AZ, although McConnell is transferring in to play point.

[Xavier]

Yes it was a subtle bash on Millers stupid quote - Cadillac, BMW, Lexus,whatever. Right?

So do you mean by "nose clean" he didn't get arrested? You will recall he had a huge role in that little fracas on 12/10/12. if one really thinks we'd have been in the nit without him, fine. BUT recognizing that its a team game, i feel we grossly underachieved in '11-'12 because of his selfish ass.

Did he? He was apart of it, no doubt. It was started because of Tu- and Tu was the one talking at the press conference, which really was the thing that made X look worse. He was pretty selfish himself, last year. It has been discussed, but its obvious Tu did more damage to X than Lyons over his lifetime. (Just to be clear, I love both players, just don't see how one would hate Lyons and like Tu)

I would take a player like Lyons every year if it meant sweet 16 or heading to the NIT.

[Muskie]

Did he? He was apart of it, no doubt. It was started because of Tu- and Tu was the one talking at the press conference, which really was the thing that made X look worse. He was pretty selfish himself, last year. It has been discussed, but its obvious Tu did more damage to X than Lyons over his lifetime. (Just to be clear, I love both players, just don't see how one would hate Lyons and like Tu)

I would take a player like Lyons every year if it meant sweet 16 or heading to the NIT.

If you think Lyons incessant talking up and down the court (basically his whole career and especially against UC), did nothing to fuel that ending then I don't know what to say. I don't hate Mark Lyons but neither he nor Tu are up for Sainthood with respect to the brawl.

[GoMuskies]

Lyons got into it with the UC bench jockey at halftime. That was a big part of the lead-up. He was also throwing punches during the brawl and was a big part of the press conference. So yes, Lyons was a big part of that whole incident.

[LadyMuskie]

I'm not going to rehash the damn brawl again. But, there was enough blame for that to go around Cintas eight or nine times. Tu, Mark and Dez all played a part and so did Coach Mack and Mike Bobinski. That kind of swagger and chest thumping was perfectly acceptable, if not encouraged by the two men in charge prior to that game.

But, I digress.

Mark Lyons is a Xavier graduate. He's a fellow alum. I may not like every single thing about him, but that's true of just about every Xavier alum or current student I've ever met - save maybe the one I married, but even he has his days. In any event, to act as though Mark Lyons was personally and wholly responsible for the events of December 10, 2011, a day that can't help but live in infamy, is ignorant, silly and just downright wrong. There have been men who have worn that basketball jersey who have done more harm to, worked less, and cared less about Xavier than Mark Lyons. Just because you don't care for his style doesn't mean he's a bad person or a blight on Xavier's record.

[fellahmuskie]

I don't believe that Lyons wanted to leave Xavier. So, I don't think he wanted a ride in a Cadillac (and additionally if you want that to be funny and work it should be a Lexus not a Cadillac). Check his twitter page. He still considers himself a part of Xavier Nation forever. I have a lot more respect for him than I do some of the so-called adults on here who have done nothing but trash him and his reputation from the moment he removed his Xavier jersey. The man kept his nose clean and won games here. He's shown Xavier a hell of a lot more respect and class than many posters here have shown when it comes to him or just in general. Some of our posters could take lessons from Lyons in how to be an adult.

Couldn't agree more!

[paulxu]

Mark Lyons is a Xavier graduate. He's a fellow alum. I may not like every single thing about him, but that's true of just about every Xavier alum or current student I've ever met - save maybe the one I married, but even he has his days.

Somehow I'm thinking that MrLM already understands Rule #1. Just a guess.

[Xavier]

Lyons got into it with the UC bench jockey at halftime. That was a big part of the lead-up. He was also throwing punches during the brawl and was a big part of the press conference. So yes, Lyons was a big part of that whole incident.

What did Lyons say in the press conference? Tu brought up the zip em up thing and the thug/gangsta thing. Can't remember what Lyons said that everyone was talking about? Not saying it didn't happen, I just can't remember the nation talking about what Lyons said in the press conference.

[GoMuskies]

Here's the video of the press conference:

http://www.youtube.com/embed/5gpS7PSYWcM

[Xavier]

In other words, nothing you can remember off the top of your head.

[GoMuskies]

Sorry for providing a primary source.

[bobbiemcgee]

He grew up in the ghetto. His father died fleeing from a robbery. His aunt was killed while he was in the house @ 12. Grew up around people going to prison. He was never projected to even play D-1 ball. He got a degree from my Alma Mater. So, yeah, I cut him a little slack. Anyway, Goodbye and Good Luck. Hope some EuroLeague picks 'ya up. Mack was right, he ain't no PG, just a helluva playmaker.

[Masterofreality]

He grew up in the ghetto. His father died fleeing from a robbery. His aunt was killed while he was in the house @ 12. Grew up around people going to prison. He was never projected to even play D-1 ball. He got a degree from my Alma Mater. So, yeah, I cut him a little slack. Anyway, Goodbye and Good Luck. Hope some EuroLeague picks 'ya up. Mack was right, he ain't no PG, just a helluva playmaker.

Gotta agree....Bobbie McGee.