Goodbye St Joes

[Masterofreality]

Big East partner St. Johns knocks them off.

St. Joes got to play one postseason game. Congratulations.....and goodbye.

[Westbrook36]

Never, ever underestimate St. Joe's(PA) ability to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory. They've turned choking a game away into an art form. I hope Phil stays there forever.

[DC Muskie]

Another flame out by Martelli. Later Hawks.

[Cheesehead]

Yep, they pissed that one away at home, up double digits.

[coasterville95]

Wait, they told me the Hawk would never die!

[XU 87]

Since going to the elite 8, St. Joe has been to the NCAA once in the last 9 years. I would think that Martelli is on the hot seat a bit. That said, it must be tough to convince good recruits to play in that tiny old gym.

[Retire33]

Since going to the elite 8, St. Joe has been to the NCAA once in the last 9 years. I would think that Martelli is on the hot seat a bit. That said, it must be tough to convince good recruits to play in that tiny old gym.

The same old gym they put lipstick on by dropping equal money to X's charter flights. OH the humanity

[xubrew]

Another flame out by Martelli. Later Hawks.

A flame out?? I was unaware that they even flamed up.

Their biggest accomplishment was being voted the preseason favorite to win the league.

[OTRMUSKIE]

I don't know Phil but I have always liked him. How many Philly teams have actually done that well? Temple always sneaks into the dance and fails. Nova hasn't really dominated since when? Penn, LaSalle have not been world beaters. It's tough to win in Philly and Martelli could have left a long time ago but decided to stay. I wish him the best of luck in whatever he does. Why the hate for him? Did he do something that I am not aware of?

[X-band '01]

Villanova at least has a Final 4 appearance going back to 2009.

[DC Muskie]

Why the hate for him? Did he do something that I am not aware of?

For me, he preaches too much. Back in the Matta era where people booed when we lost to SJU, he got up in press conference and lectured the fans about booing. Like booing is the worst thing that people do at sporting events.

The following year, I sat in Hawk Hill where we made a tremendous comeback and won. Hawk fans started tossing water bottles on the court. Matta removed the team off the court. What did Phil say after that game? Nothing.

He will tell you how to act, but keep his loud mouth shut when his fans do something that is 100 times more egregious.

Xavier fans love him because he kisses our collective ass. I've never seen anyone joke so much about getting his ass handed to him. "When does Stanley Burrell graduate?" Ha! That's hilarious. Hammer is a Champion, something you are not Phil.

He has had talent, and since 2004, he hasn't produced squat. He had Ahmad Nivins, easily one of the best big men in the conference for years, became A10 player of the year, and Phil led that team to a 9-7 finish. Built nothing off the following year when they crapped out in the first year of the Dance.

Since the Hawks went to the NIT finals in 2005, here's how they have finished in the A10:

9-7
9-7
9-7
9-7
5-11
4-12
9-7

He never has finished better than 5th. This season the Hawks were picked to win the conference. We saw how they ended.

Oh and then there is the Todd O'Brien incident. The lovable, highly overrated coach decided that Todd O'Brien couldn't transfer as a graduate student because...well who the hell knows. O'Brien averaged like 3 minutes a game while the Hawks raced to a 5-11 A10 season in 2010. O'Brien wanted to go to UAB so he could sit the bench there and get his advanced degree, but Good 'Ole Phil would have none of it. He denied the transfer then hid behind privacy laws that "he couldn't about the issue."

Basically he's a fraud. His coaches who helped him in that six year stretch when the Hawks were actual contenders have left, and Phil has replaced them with crap.

I like St. Joe's I really do. They deserve better than Martelli.

[boozehound]

I was going to say that I liked Phil Martelli, but DC made a pretty compelling case against it.

I did think it was nice that his first comments after they beat us in the A-10 tournament was about how bad he felt for Philmore for missing that bunny.

His coaching resume definitely sucks though.

[BBC 08]

I forgot about that O'Brien case. Yeah, that was complete horse shit on Martelli's part.

[waggy]

O'Brien never could keep a commitment. How many schools again? He lets Martelli know so late that there's no way of replacing him? I wouldn't blame Martelli if he did block his transfer. And there really are privacy laws. "Hiding behind" them is kinda part of the deal.

[SlimKibbles]

O'Brien never could keep a commitment. How many schools again? He lets Martelli know so late that there's no way of replacing him? I wouldn't blame Martelli if he did block his transfer. And there really are privacy laws. "Hiding behind" them is kinda part of the deal.

This. After all I read on the case, I don't blame Martelli or SJU at all. Didn't somebody here post the NCAA rule that prevents a kid from doing what O'Brien was trying to do? Seemed pretty cut and dry to me.

[DC Muskie]

O'Brien never could keep a commitment. How many schools again? He lets Martelli know so late that there's no way of replacing him? I wouldn't blame Martelli if he did block his transfer. And there really are privacy laws. "Hiding behind" them is kinda part of the deal.


This. After all I read on the case, I don't blame Martelli or SJU at all. Didn't somebody here post the NCAA rule that prevents a kid from doing what O'Brien was trying to do? Seemed pretty cut and dry to me.

You can't be serious.

How exactly could O'Brien never keep a commitment? He was on the team and told the AD that he was going to transfer, the AD said fine and Martelli said not fine. He told Martelli before the summer classes that THEY enrolled him in. Did Martelli really have no way of filling those three minutes of each game so his team would finish 4-12? Martelli wanted to screw a terrible bench player. He was pretty good at screwing up really good players, so maybe he wanted a new challenge.

Nothing O'Brien did was against NCAA rules. SJU had to approve the transfer and they didn't. He was gone anyway, and what exactly did Martelli and SJU prove by denying this kid a chance to sit the bench at UAB? Nothing. Who wants to play for a guy who would deny you a chance to transfer if you wanted to?

As for the privacy laws, O'Brien's lawyers signed a waiver that allowed SJU to talk about the situation. Martelli chose not to talk about it, so the entire premise of "is kinda part of the deal" doesn't apply here.

[ammtd34]

O'Brien transferred from Bucknell to St. Joe's.

"The student-athlete may not have transferred previously from another four-year institution unless he or she transferred previously and received an exception to the transfer residence requirement because his or her institution either discontinued the sport or did not sponsor the sport in which the student-athlete is a participant."

[DC Muskie]

O'Brien transferred from Bucknell to St. Joe's.

"The student-athlete may not have transferred previously from another four-year institution unless he or she transferred previously and received an exception to the transfer residence requirement because his or her institution either discontinued the sport or did not sponsor the sport in which the student-athlete is a participant."

Yes, so O'Brien did nothing wrong. He sought the transfer and didn't get it.

Also, need I remind everyone that scholarships are one year commitments, and O'Brien fulfilled it when he went to SJU. Seriously this kid is 7 foot tall and terrible and wanted to go somewhere else and sit the bench. Martelli had no plans to use him, even though he is an incredible mediocre coach. He didn't grant the transfer, because Phil likes to make sure you understand how ethical he is.

[ammtd34]

Yes, so O'Brien did nothing wrong. He sought the transfer and didn't get it.

Also, need I remind everyone that scholarships are one year commitments, and O'Brien fulfilled it when he went to SJU. Seriously this kid is 7 foot tall and terrible and wanted to go somewhere else and sit the bench. Martelli had no plans to use him, even though he is an incredible mediocre coach. He didn't grant the transfer, because Phil likes to make sure you understand how ethical he is.

If I'm interpreting the rule I posted correctly, he couldn't have received the transfer anyway because Bucknell still plays basketball. I don't care one way or the other, but that's the way the rule reads to me.

[DC Muskie]

If I'm interpreting the rule I posted correctly, he couldn't have received the transfer anyway because Bucknell still plays basketball. I don't care one way or the other, but that's the way the rule reads to me.

You can transfer a billion times if you want. This is America. You just have to get a waiver the second time around.

[ammtd34]

You can transfer a billion times if you want. This is America. You just have to get a waiver the second time around.

Perhaps the rules are different for post-graduate transfers.

[DC Muskie]

Perhaps the rules are different for post-graduate transfers.

Possibly. But the hold up was Martelli not granting the waiver for no reason.

[waggy]

He signed a waiver? St. Joes gave him a waiver to sign, or he just had a make believe one drafted? And he did this for what purpose? So he could sit the bench?

[DC Muskie]

He signed a waiver? St. Joes gave him a waiver to sign, or he just had a make believe one drafted? And he did this for what purpose? So he could sit the bench?

The privacy protection is for the student. The student can waive that protection.

O'Brien did it to show he wasn't afraid of their side of the story, which is what SJU claimed at first, then turned around and claimed privacy protection.

And in the end, the kid was just going to sit on the bench. From one bench to another. Martelli didn't like that apparently. He wants all of his players to sit on the bench during a 4-12 A10 season. Except O'Brien didn't sit the bench at SJU, because he left.

[waggy]

What was the date of the waiver signing?

[nuts4xu]

I like Phil Martelli, but he hasn't been a good coach in a long time. I think he was good for St Joes at some point in time, but that time has passed. I met him in an airport once, and we had a good conversation.

I am not sure who was right or wrong in the O'Brien case, but the fact is, St Joes can suck it.....along with the rest of the A-10.

[DC Muskie]

What was the date of the waiver signing?

I have no idea.

[waggy]

Maybe since O'Brien was really not an actual player, he was just looking for an opportunity to sue.

[Muskie]

"Is there anybody here from the Xavier administration? Do you know when graduation is? That goddamn Burrell, every year, every goddam game makes a shot against us. He was averaging 7.5 points coming into the game in seven league games – or eight games. Doesn’t look like the same player, playing great defense. Dagger. I want to be here to make sure that sonofabitch gets out of here to be honest with you.”

Graduation day is today Coach (3-20-13).

[DC Muskie]

Maybe since O'Brien was really not an actual player, he was just looking for an opportunity to sue.

They did give him a uniform.

Also, SJU gave him permission to talk to other schools over the summer.

There is absolutely no way you can look at this situation and take SJU side. Unless you are Phil Martelli.

[waggy]

Was Martelli vindictive? Probably, but I argue it wasn't unwarranted. The school puts resources into players. Relationships are built. Maybe the guy's role is just a big practice player. Whatever. Last minute he wants to bolt. School feels screwed. Rules don't require them to release him. Maybe the kid learned a lesson.

[DC Muskie]

Was Martelli vindictive? Probably, but I argue it wasn't unwarranted. The school puts resources into players. Relationships are built. Maybe the guy's role is just a big practice player. Whatever. Last minute he wants to bolt. School feels screwed. Rules don't require them to release him. Maybe the kid learned a lesson.

It was completely unwarranted. Martelli is a child.

[smileyy]

"Is there anybody here from the Xavier administration? Do you know when graduation is? That goddamn Burrell, every year, every goddam game makes a shot against us. He was averaging 7.5 points coming into the game in seven league games – or eight games. Doesn’t look like the same player, playing great defense. Dagger. I want to be here to make sure that sonofabitch gets out of here to be honest with you.”


Yeah, its been kinda downhill for him since that highlight.

[waggy]

It was completely unwarranted. Martelli is a child.

Hahaha. I think there was a photo of Martelli in baby garb at one time. It was on the internet. Everything is on the internet.

[muskiefan82]

Hahaha. I think there was a photo of Martelli in baby garb at one time. It was on the internet. Everything is on the internet.

..and it's all true!!

[DC Muskie]

Reps.

[xu95]

F St. Joes. I hope we never play them again.