Xavier at Butler Game Thread

[American X]

https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSaAWo01WTf02AXpNha2nS3Clg6KxC6B agHNX_B5_DmoBsLjnkzhttp://www.petfinder.com/images/breeds/dog/1510.jpg

Xavier Musketeers (17-12, 9-6 A-10) vs. Butler Generic Mascots (23-7, 10-5 A-10)

Saturday March 9, 2013 6:30 PM ET

Hinkle Fieldhouse (10,000) - Indianapolis, Indiana

TV: CBS Sports Network

Radio: 55KRC (http://www.iheart.com/live/1709/?autoplay=true)

GoXavier Preview (http://www.goxavier.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/030813aaa.html)

Live Chat (http://zippychat.com/room/yhwjv)

[Masterofreality]

Are you sure about that time?

At Hinkle Outhouse the game may start at 6:35 by their clocks.

[paulxu]

I think Butler is in the A10. If it is, they should be using the Precision Time System now.

However, based on past experience with Butler, nothing is guaranteed. They could've flopped when faced with the requirement.

[BMoreX]

You can bet something will malfunction at Stinkle.

Whether it's the clock (2009) or the horn (2011), something will mess up.

[GIMMFD]

Boy this is huge... I'm getting amped for it!!

[XUglow]

Are you sure about that time?

At Hinkle Outhouse the game may start at 6:35 by their clocks.

Butler is like Vegas. They try to keep you playing until you lose.

[MJHoke]

For some reason the Pick the Score thread is closed so this is my prediction for the game. Hopefully SkyWalker sees this.

Xavier 68
Butler 64

[paulxu]

Skywalker closed the thread and went over to the uc campus to check out the picture display of Mick look-a-likes.

I'm staying with my original 68-65 (I think that was it.)

[bjf123]

Here's my score pick

Us - 63
Them - 67


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[XUglow]

I am going with X-66, B-65. That is at the end of 40 minutes. They might beat us in stoppage time.

[Jesuit4Life]

Stream:
Install Streamtorrent (http://www.softpedia.com/progDownload/Stream-Torrent-Download-129131.html) and add this channel (st://A1gCgpwEdVADUAaCoAHIgBaAN1L9Yocpd5lcYuKQ8ahMihcGND IwVFYzimEAikEHZGVmYXVsdIqiHlNwb3J0cywgV29ybGRXaWRl IEZ1biwgR2VuZXJhbA==).
http://www.firstrow1.eu/watch/173786/1/watch-xavier-vs-butler.html

[XUFan09]

Xavier 65
Butler 64

[OTRMUSKIE]

X 64
But 74

[paulxu]

OK, I gotta take my wife, two brothers and their wives out to dinner tonight.
Will miss most of the game (not happy alum).
Am leaving Snipe in charge at this point to bring this baby home for me.
If he's playing soft, somebody sub for him.

[American X]

Live Chat (http://zippychat.com/room/yhwjv) fired up more than Karen.

[MarvAlbert]

It's official...I hate CBS sports network and Patriot league basketball. Can't wait until next year.

[Muskeagle]

So what's the score? Listening online and they say it is 10-10. ESPN gamecast says 11-10.

[Muskeagle]

got it....internet feed slow. free throw good. 11-10

[drudy23]

So do we know our seed when we win this?

[D-West & PO-Z]

So do we know our seed when we win this?

No. Need to se what happens tomorrow. Will get the 4 if we win and VCU wins tomorrow.

[drudy23]

That XU recruiting commercial is awful.

[smileyy]

Dear Semaj,

Take the layup.

[BMoreX]

Not good

[xudash]

Not good

Yep. It's probably now or never in a game like this to turn the momentum around and get back in this thing.

[Pablo's Brother]

Steinger gets called for a foul 30 seconds after checking in - almost every time!

[drudy23]

Would be really nice to pull this mother effer out.

[paulxu]

This is the last time I leave Snipe in charge.

[xudash]

Literally down to about the last key possession, and we couldn't get the ball through the hoop.

Too bad, but I still love the fight in this bunch.

[paulxu]

I didn't get to watch the game, but the box score is a little disheartening. I think we must have left too much on the floor at the last home game.
Brad with only 2 shots?
Robinson with only 1 point?
Taylor 3 for 13, 6 pts?

This must have been one ugly, ugly game.

(If someone told me we shot 87% at the line, I would have bet a lot of money that we would have won that game...and lost)

On to the Barclays!

[Juice]

I didn't get to watch the game, but the box score is a little disheartening. I think we must have left too much on the floor at the last home game.
Brad with only 2 shots?
Robinson with only 1 point?
Taylor 3 for 13, 6 pts?

This must have been one ugly, ugly game.

(If someone told me we shot 87% at the line, I would have bet a lot of money that we would have won that game...and lost)

On to the Barclays!

Taylor was right there with all of his shots. He just couldn't get anything to fall.

[kyxu]

Had the pleasure of attending the game last night, and I must say, Butler fans are hilarious. I mean, genuinely funny people.

It was absolutely impossible for a player from Butler to foul. Impossible. Every time a Bulldog was whistled even when Fromm smacked Taylor in the face as he was under the basket, you would have thought an official had walked up and shivved Brad Stevens. There was one play where Philmore grabbed the rebound, had his arm grabbed by a BU player and pulled three steps. The official correctly called a foul, but the entire place was screaming, nay, crying, violently protesting, for a travel. You could only laugh.

I bet if you spoke with any Butler fan after the game last night, they would say with complete and total sincerity that they won in spite of the officiating. That Xavier got every call in the book.

Also, Butler hand-checks on defense without conscience. The white guy on Butler, #3, could not guard Christon, but put his hands on him and then his forearm when Semaj would start to drive. No call ever. And really, if the officials don't call it, you can't really blame Butler.

But a fun game nonetheless. Great venue; super old and inadequate. And hot as shit. Not sure Hinkle has any ventilation. But it was a pretty cool scene. I thought I was in a really huge high school gym where the whole small town rallies around that one team. Like Dayton.

[MarvAlbert]

Had the pleasure of attending the game last night, and I must say, Butler fans are hilarious. I mean, genuinely funny people.

It was absolutely impossible for a player from Butler to foul. Impossible. Every time a Bulldog was whistled even when Fromm smacked Taylor in the face as he was under the basket, you would have thought an official had walked up and shivved Brad Stevens. There was one play where Philmore grabbed the rebound, had his arm grabbed by a BU player and pulled three steps. The official correctly called a foul, but the entire place was screaming, nay, crying, violently protesting, for a travel. You could only laugh.

I bet if you spoke with any Butler fan after the game last night, they would say with complete and total sincerity that they won in spite of the officiating. That Xavier got every call in the book.

Also, Butler hand-checks on defense without conscience. The white guy on Butler, #3, could not guard Christon, but put his hands on him and then his forearm when Semaj would start to drive. No call ever. And really, if the officials don't call it, you can't really blame Butler.

But a fun game nonetheless. Great venue; super old and inadequate. And hot as shit. Not sure Hinkle has any ventilation. But it was a pretty cool scene. I thought I was in a really huge high school gym where the whole small town rallies around that one team. Like Dayton.

Jeremiah Johnson ‏@JJFOX59SPORTS
Butler players getting mugged repeatedly going up for shots in the paint, no calls, Xavier follows with a very cheap and-one

I saw that tweet after Xavier got the block and then Stenger got slapped in the head on his 3 point play.

@thenameisolivia
butler didn't just beat Xavier we beat the refs with 30+ missed/horrible calls

I know this is just some high school girl, but I find it hilarious. Especially since she's a fan of a team that's former guard, Shelvin Mack, was quoted as saying "It's not like the ref is going to come down and call a foul every possession." in this article (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323978104578332540900800374.html?K EYWORDS=butler) about Butler being bullies.

[GoMuskies]

The only silver lining I can find in the game is that I watched it with my five year old son, and he thought Butler's name was disgusting, because it includes butt. It's actually kind of handy, because we have now replaced some of the cruder words he usually uses with Butler, he still thinks it's hilarious, and we don't get embarrassed in public quite so often. A win all around.

[SlimKibbles]

I was at the game last night as well. I echo kyxu's comments. Hot as hell inside Hinkle, BU fans thought their players never commit fouls, and it was a good game.

I happened to watch the game on DVR tonight just to see how it looked on tv and whether the refs were as bad as they looked in person. Well the officiating was terrible. Those guys had no clue what a travel is. None. Saw plenty of plays that should have been called a walk, both on X and Butler, that they called nothing. Saw plenty of plays that were called a travel and they weren't. If you keep your pivot foot, just because you move the rest of your body about to make a basketball move doesn't mean it's a walk. Erik Stenger got called for fouls he never committed, as usual. I swear that kid can't catch a break with the officials in conference play. Martin's 3rd foul when he was called for a charge was absolutely horrible. The Butler player tripped over his teammate's foot in the paint while moving backwards. Watched that replay a dozen times and have clue what the ref was thinking. Lastly that no travel call on the inbounds with 7 secs left. Pretty blatant. Ref was incompetent. Regardless of the officiating X missed too many shots from close range. They get some of those to go down and their fate would have been different. Oh well. On to Brooklyn.

[Cheesehead]

Refs were flat out horrible. I was laughing at times in disbelief. How can one crew be that bad and yes, Butler fans remind me of UD fans: delusional.

[kyxu]

Jeremiah Johnson ‏@JJFOX59SPORTS
Butler players getting mugged repeatedly going up for shots in the paint, no calls, Xavier follows with a very cheap and-one

I saw that tweet after Xavier got the block and then Stenger got slapped in the head on his 3 point play.

@thenameisolivia
butler didn't just beat Xavier we beat the refs with 30+ missed/horrible calls

I know this is just some high school girl, but I find it hilarious. Especially since she's a fan of a team that's former guard, Shelvin Mack, was quoted as saying "It's not like the ref is going to come down and call a foul every possession." in this article (http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323978104578332540900800374.html?K EYWORDS=butler) about Butler being bullies.

Exactly. And these comments are made with such conviction, no doubt. They honestly believe these things.

[XU-PA]

bottom line, end of the game. Philmore hacked as he's going up for a shot, clear contact on arm while the ball is leaving his hand, play and a half later butler inbounding blatant travel on receiving the ball, really obvious, no call.
Make either of those right and we're back.

real bottom line, hell of a game by X, fought, didn't give up, Mack has brought this team to heights no one,,, really, no one though possible. time for a "run".

Bring Lionel in for a speech

[GuyFawkes38]

Can't say enough positives about the effort Mack, the rest of the coaching staff, and the players put into this year. Just awesome.

I attended the Indy Final Four 3 years ago and noticed the lack of bball IQ from Butler fans around me. It was brutal. But I think it's somewhat excusable. With their recent surge in success, they seem to have a lot of new fans to the sport.

[Masterofreality]

That Martin "charge" also cost us a very valuable basket that would have made a huge difference later.

Should have been a no-call and an XU bucket.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

That Martin "charge" also cost us a very valuable basket that would have made a huge difference later.

Should have been a no-call and an XU bucket.

As well as Semaj's steal then missed layup. Still wondering what happened on that

[jhelmes37]

Oh my God, the Martin charge was atrocious. The defender had one foot on the ground, the other was moving and he wasn't even square. An insane call.

[GoMuskies]

As well as Semaj's steal then missed layup. Still wondering what happened on that

I don't think Semaj could decide whether to lay it in or dunk it, so he did neither.

[boozehound]

Can't say enough positives about the effort Mack, the rest of the coaching staff, and the players put into this year. Just awesome.

I attended the Indy Final Four 3 years ago and noticed the lack of bball IQ from Butler fans around me. It was brutal. But I think it's somewhat excusable. With their recent surge in success, they seem to have a lot of new fans to the sport.

It's a little bit interesting how different fanbases have different identities to a degree. For example we all know Dayton fans are horrible. SLU fans are pretty bad, and Butler fans are apparently pretty bad as well. VCU, Richmond, Temple, all seem to have pretty good fanbases. They are generally somewhat knowledgable and don't act like total morons.

[PMI]

Butler fans have no business bitching about the refs. Once again, they sucked just as bad for us as they did for them, and they won.

Overall, I thought we played pretty well. I really think we will win most of the games against A10 teams on a neutral floor playing that way. Phillmore is now a legitimate offensive option, that third scorer that we've lacked this year other than some inconsistent performances here and there. Taylor definitely had a frustrating offensive game. Woods was a good matchup for him form Butler's perspective. And as we all know by now, Semaj is a stud and will pretty much always be the best player on the floor in our games. We DO have a chance in Brooklyn. We're going to need some luck and have some bigger balls down the stretch, but it could happen.

[Masterofreality]

Would help if we had another guard (Myles Davis) or two.

[xufan02]

Even on TV you could hear the audiable whining of the Butler fans, sad.

[smileyy]

I don't think Semaj could decide whether to lay it in or dunk it, so he did neither.

Yeah -- that's the first real mistake I've seen him make in the open court like that (maybe a few dubious charges). He may have forgotten his other choice -- get the foul drawn.

[smileyy]

Oh my God, the Martin charge was atrocious. The defender had one foot on the ground, the other was moving and he wasn't even square. An insane call.

I hate that the referees treat D-I basketball players like fragile little vases that might break if someone bumps into them.

[Irishdawg]

Yes, the refs were pretty awful both ways (I don't feel their inadequacy favored one team over the other in the grand scheme of things) and yeah, that was definitely a travel on Woods with about 7 seconds left and Xavier down 3. I do think it's somewhat funny though that at least one poster bases the F4 run in Indy as the barometer for the intelligence of Butler fans. I hope you can realize that about 3/4 of the "Butler fans" there were actually Indiana fans that were just looking for someone to cheer for while their team was coming back from the doldrums of the Kelvin Sampson.

Mack's done a heck of a job in developing your team this year and no matter what league he's in, Christon is going to be a stud, especially once he starts hitting his threes with consistency. I know Coach Stevens has a ton of respect for you guys and even went out of his way to compliment your team before he got into the Senior Day festivities.

[danaandvictory]

The problem with the way the game is called now is that everything inside and off the ball is Thunderdome, and then even the most minimal contact on a drive results in a charge. It's lunacy. The problem is, as Jay Bilas I think said eloquently on the Slate sports podcast this week, is that there's no controlling authority to fix it. When the NBA went uber-ugly with the Ewing Knicks in the late 90s, Stern eventually put the hammer down and brought the officials to heel, changing some rules and ordering them to call the game tighter to cut down on the physical play and it worked. In the NCAAs, there's no commissioner. As Bilas said, if the Big 10 gets pissed and suspends some officials, they just go work an SEC or Big East game. I'm not sure how the problem gets fixed, but it has to get fixed.

[UCGRAD4X]

The biggest issue is consistency. One ref calls a little shoulder an offensive charge and the next lets a guy back his man under the basket brutally, and calls nothing. As in most cases - just let us know how you're going to call it and keep it that way. So, keeping it that way within one game is asking a lot - some consistency from game to game, conference to conference, is pretty close to impossible.

[GoMuskies]

I think the complaining about officiating is way overblown. It's fine. Certainly not perfect, not even great, but fine. It all evens out.

But it does give fans of losing teams something to complain about.

[danaandvictory]

Go, I have to disagree with you, I don't think it's fine. I think as a general rule the way the game is called now promotes ugly, slow-paced, low-scoring basketball. It stifles creativity and flow and allows the coaches to micromanage everything. I really think it's a big problem. Maybe not from a financial sense, because college sports has never been so lucrative (free labor helps), but from an aesthetic sense the game is at a low ebb since the shot clock was introduced. I watched a couple of those old mid-80s Louisville videos you posted and it was remarkable how superior the flow of the games was in those days. Now it's a time out, foul shots, or a five-minute video review between every possession at the end of games.

[paulxu]

24 second clock.

[xuwin]

Go, I have to disagree with you, I don't think it's fine. I think as a general rule the way the game is called now promotes ugly, slow-paced, low-scoring basketball. It stifles creativity and flow and allows the coaches to micromanage everything. I really think it's a big problem. Maybe not from a financial sense, because college sports has never been so lucrative (free labor helps), but from an aesthetic sense the game is at a low ebb since the shot clock was introduced. I watched a couple of those old mid-80s Louisville videos you posted and it was remarkable how superior the flow of the games was in those days. Now it's a time out, foul shots, or a five-minute video review between every possession at the end of games.

I agree with you. Eliminate the shot clock and the three point goal and the mid range game would return and the big men will play a significant role on offense again. You would see a more diversified array of offenses and defenses. Stop the physical play and officiate the game according to the rulebook. A lot of fouls would be called at first but teams would have to adjust. I think you would see more teams running the floor and less physical play with these half court offenses that everybody runs now.

[danaandvictory]

I don't agree with either of you. Getting rid of the shot clock is a non-starter for me having watched plenty of GCL basketball. The 24-second clock is too short for college teams and it would be absolute chaos on offense.

30 seconds (like the women's game) would be fine, I think, but I don't see a pressing need to change it. The issues with officiating and stoppages are more problematic.

[paulxu]

College basketball is the minor league for the NBA.
Might as well use the same clock. We've got havoc, bring on the chaos.
Hell, back up the 3 pt line and play ball.

[smileyy]

24 second clock.

This. For God's sake, at least lower it to 30.



30 seconds (like the women's game) would be fine, I think, but I don't see a pressing need to change it. The issues with officiating and stoppages are more problematic.

What I see now is that the offense has time to run a sequence looking for a layup or open 3, reset, run another sequence, and then still have time for a bad shot when they haven't found anything in the previous 30 seconds. When that goes bad, it turns into really ugly basketball, c.f. XU 2013's offense.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I agree with GO for the most part. I think fans, especially Xavier fans, love to complain about the refs. I do think the charge/block call is the most inconsistent call and can be a problem.

I also think the shot clock needs to be shortened. 35 is too long, 24 may be too short for college but 28-30 would be better.

[smileyy]

So...if a team doesn't have shooters to space the floor, there's little incentive for a team to not pack the lane as much as possible (while still defending reasonable 3-point shots). I wonder if the NBA isn't on to something with the notion of a defensive 3-second call and a wider lane to open up the painted area more.

[UCGRAD4X]

How about 30 second throughout the game and then a 20 second clock for the last two minutes.

[D-West & PO-Z]

How about 30 second throughout the game and then a 20 second clock for the last two minutes.

Too confusing and I think it would cause more problems than it would solve.