mick to Illni?

[LutherRackleyRulez]

Per Chicago Tribune....




Weber should have kept quiet after loss

Illinois coach makes bad situation worse by being too honest for his own good


If Thomas indeed invests $3.9 million to buy out Weber and conduct the second coaching search of his first year, he should start ambitiously with Butler's Brad Stevens, still America's hottest young coach. Thomas' short list also should include Wichita State's Gregg Marshall, Duke assistant Chris Collins, Cincinnati's Mick Cronin, whom Thomas once hired, and Virginia Commonwealth's Shaka Smart.






http://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/columnists/ct-spt-0217-haugh-illinois-basketball-chicago--20120217,0,2488742.column

[X-Fan]

I can't imagine Thomas would make that mistake twice.

[GuyFawkes38]

I can't see it. His resume simply isn't good enough.

I think Weber is gone. It'll be interesting who takes the job. Illinois is a great job on the surface. But I'm familiar with the fanbase. It's a basketball school and they expect Final Fours. Lots of pressure. The Chicago/Champagne pipeline is undependable. I could see why some coaches might be a little hesitant to take the job.

I could see why some coaches envy Florida/OSU/Alabama/oregon type jobs where the football programs lessen expectations on the basketball programs.

[Xavgrad08]

I think Shaka Smart would be a great hire for Illinois.

[LadyMuskie]

Why on earth would anyone consider Mick Cronin for a job anywhere? What has he done at UC to warrant that kind of consideration? I have a couple of friends who are Illinois grads and they're freaking out that Cronin's name has even registered as a possibility.

[Xavier]

I think Shaka Smart would be a great hire for Illinois.

I don't think Shaka Smart will be a good coach. Illinois should look to hire an assistant, IMO.

As for Mick- I hope he stays at UC for a long time.

[X-band '01]

Why on earth would anyone consider Mick Cronin for a job anywhere? What has he done at UC to warrant that kind of consideration? I have a couple of friends who are Illinois grads and they're freaking out that Cronin's name has even registered as a possibility.

Clearly Illinois wants someone who's good at PR, undressing players publicly, and has yellow teeth.


I can't see it. His resume simply isn't good enough.

I think Weber is gone. It'll be interesting who takes the job. Illinois is a great job on the surface. But I'm familiar with the fanbase. It's a basketball school and they expect Final Fours. Lots of pressure. The Chicago/Champagne pipeline is undependable. I could see why some coaches might be a little hesitant to take the job.

They do have 2 Final 4s in their history, not to mention a couple of good coaches in Lou Henson and Bill Self. Self recruited a bunch of the players that would go on to the national title game in 2005. Bruce Weber ain't a bad coach, but just hasn't recruited as well to keep Illinois near the top of the Big 10.

[Juice]

Why on earth would anyone consider Mick Cronin for a job anywhere? What has he done at UC to warrant that kind of consideration? I have a couple of friends who are Illinois grads and they're freaking out that Cronin's name has even registered as a possibility.

I would agree with you but then I remember that Brian Gregory got a job in the ACC

[coasterville95]

What's bad, I can just see some people at the UC boards hoping this is true.

Otherwise they have that real long contract with him!

[Mrs. Garrett]

Clearly Illinois wants someone who's good at PR, undressing players publicly, and has yellow teeth.



They do have 2 Final 4s in their history, not to mention a couple of good coaches in Lou Henson and Bill Self. Self recruited a bunch of the players that would go on to the national title game in 2005. Bruce Weber ain't a bad coach, but just hasn't recruited as well to keep Illinois near the top of the Big 10.

Bruce Weber currently has 9 players on his roster from Illinois that were top 100 talent coming out of high school. The issue hasn't been recruiting. He can clearly recruit Illinois/Chicago.

[outsideobserver11]

It won't happen because Mick hates Mike Thomas and isn't shy about making that known. Mike Thomas is a big part of why Mick was looking around last year until he left for Illinois. Butch Jones didn't like Thomas either and same goes for most working in the UC athletic office.

[GuyFawkes38]

Bruce Weber currently has 9 players on his roster from Illinois that were top 100 talent coming out of high school. The issue hasn't been recruiting. He can clearly recruit Illinois/Chicago.

True. But Weber did have 4 meh recruiting classes from 2004-2008.

In the past 20 years, Ill has received some great recruits from Chicago. But many Illini fans expect the program to own Chicago and they haven't done that (a lot of Illinios' best talent comes from downstate, especially Peoria). I think some Illini fans are disappointed that Weber missed out on players like Sheron Collins, Rose, scheyer.

[Juice]

True. But Weber did have 4 meh recruiting classes from 2004-2008.

In the past 20 years, Ill has received some great recruits from Chicago. But many Illini fans expect the program to own Chicago and they haven't done that (a lot of Illinios' best talent comes from downstate, especially Peoria). I think some Illini fans are disappointed that Weber missed out on players like Sheron Collins, Rose, scheyer.

Eric Gordon was a huge miss for Webber too.

[LazelleDurden]

Why on earth would anyone consider Mick Cronin for a job anywhere? What has he done at UC to warrant that kind of consideration? I have a couple of friends who are Illinois grads and they're freaking out that Cronin's name has even registered as a possibility.

I know everyone hates Mick but please show some intelligence

2007 - 11 wins
2008 - 13 wins
2009 - 18 wins
2010 - 19 wins
2011 - 26 wins
2012 - on his way to another 20 win season

if you can't figure out why his name is always brought up based of that information, I don't know what else to tell you

[LadyMuskie]

Uh huh. Mick is the next John Wooden. :rolleyes:

How many of those glorious wins have come against quality opponents and not teams like Presbyterian (oh . . . wait) or Big East bottom feeders? If you can't recognize that UC plays a cupcake non-con schedule every year and then just manages to beat the fellow bottom dwellers of the Big East, then I don't know what to tell you.

[xavierj]

Uh huh. Mick is the next John Wooden. :rolleyes:

How many of those glorious wins have come against quality opponents and not teams like Presbyterian (oh . . . wait) or Big East bottom feeders? If you can't recognize that UC plays a cupcake non-con schedule every year and then just manages to beat the fellow bottom dwellers of the Big East, then I don't know what to tell you.

This post is fairly wise.

[LazelleDurden]

Uh huh. Mick is the next John Wooden. :rolleyes:

How many of those glorious wins have come against quality opponents and not teams like Presbyterian (oh . . . wait) or Big East bottom feeders? If you can't recognize that UC plays a cupcake non-con schedule every year and then just manages to beat the fellow bottom dwellers of the Big East, then I don't know what to tell you.


Yeah ND and Gtown are bottom feeders

Last year, Twice vs Gtown, Marquette, U of L sound like a bunch of traditional bottom feeders to me.

Keep playing the non-conference card, maybe shortly a UC fan will listen to you.

[LadyMuskie]

Yeah ND and Gtown are bottom feeders

Last year, Twice vs Gtown, Marquette, U of L sound like a bunch of traditional bottom feeders to me.

Keep playing the non-conference card, maybe shortly a UC fan will listen to you.

Seriously. This is the best you can do?

The Big East (or what will soon be known as the former Big East) is overrated year after year. The teams cannibalize each other and the conference records are bloated as a result (which is typically irrefutable by the fact that only a handful of the so-called "great" Big East teams get past the first weekend of the NCAA tourney.) So, yeah. I'm not buying what you're selling. But, even if you want to go there, even a broken clock is right twice a day. So UC is bound to beat a good team every once in awhile. Mostly, though, they just beat up on teams that are almost, but not quite, division I. Well, they try to in any event.

Your non-con schedule is so bad that your own fans don't even show up for your non-conference games. Yet, you think it's your rivals who have a problem? The greatest player ever to grace your court thinks your non-con schedule is a joke and you're going to defend it because you occasionally manage to beat Notre Dame (a well-known basketball powerhouse) during conference play. Give me a break. The UC fan base is as pathetic as its small-man-syndrome-suffering coach. Mick Cronin is still coaching at UC only because UC wants to be a football school now. No one cares enough anymore to fire him.

[GuyFawkes38]

Eric Gordon was a huge miss for Webber too.

Definitely. His reversal screwed Weber. Potential pg's wanted no part of being on a team with gordon.

I wonder if Archie might receive some attention for the job. Probably not enough on the resume. But who knows.

[LA Muskie]

Definitely. His reversal screwed Weber. Potential pg's wanted no part of being on a team with gordon.

I wonder if Archie might receive some attention for the job. Probably not enough on the resume. But who knows.

From what I've seen so far, Archie has a lot of potential. I don't think he'll put up Sean/XU-like numbers at Dayton, but I don't think anyone will expect him to. He's a rising star. I give it 2 more years.

[xavierj]

Yeah ND and Gtown are bottom feeders

Last year, Twice vs Gtown, Marquette, U of L sound like a bunch of traditional bottom feeders to me.

Keep playing the non-conference card, maybe shortly a UC fan will listen to you.

How come notre dame totally blew in the non conference and got their doors blown off by Georgia? But somehow they are now good. Is it possible that maybe the big east just really is just very average?

[Cheesehead]

Yeah ND and Gtown are bottom feeders

Last year, Twice vs Gtown, Marquette, U of L sound like a bunch of traditional bottom feeders to me.

Keep playing the non-conference card, maybe shortly a UC fan will listen to you.

We don't care if you listen to us. Go away.

[Smails]

Keep playing the non-conference card, maybe shortly a UC fan will listen to you.

UC has 18 wins and is 8-4 in the conference. After 3/4 of the conference season, and a full non-con slate, UC's SOS is...wait for it....131. So which is it? Does UC's conference suck or do they play patsies in the non-con?

131 says your schedule blows

[Juice]

http://rushthecourt.net/2012/02/17/debunking-the-myth-has-the-big-east-really-been-a-dominant-conference-recently/#more-61664

Article debunking the myth that the Big East is the best conference the last few years

[Cheesehead]

Just watch why the Big East does in the tourney. I am guessing several of them lose first week. I have actually been hearing the Big 10 is best conference this year.

[Xavgrad08]

John Groce could be a good candidate if a couple of other coaches pass on the job.

[danaandvictory]

Just watch why the Big East does in the tourney. I am guessing several of them lose first week. I have actually been hearing the Big 10 is best conference this year.

Illinois is probably not going to make it, but if they put together a few wins down the stretch the Big Ten could get 9 out of 12 teams in the tournament, which is better than anything the expanded Big East has produced.

[LazelleDurden]

Seriously. This is the best you can do?

The Big East (or what will soon be known as the former Big East) is overrated year after year. The teams cannibalize each other and the conference records are bloated as a result (which is typically irrefutable by the fact that only a handful of the so-called "great" Big East teams get past the first weekend of the NCAA tourney.) So, yeah. I'm not buying what you're selling. But, even if you want to go there, even a broken clock is right twice a day. So UC is bound to beat a good team every once in awhile. Mostly, though, they just beat up on teams that are almost, but not quite, division I. Well, they try to in any event.

Your non-con schedule is so bad that your own fans don't even show up for your non-conference games. Yet, you think it's your rivals who have a problem? The greatest player ever to grace your court thinks your non-con schedule is a joke and you're going to defend it because you occasionally manage to beat Notre Dame (a well-known basketball powerhouse) during conference play. Give me a break. The UC fan base is as pathetic as its small-man-syndrome-suffering coach. Mick Cronin is still coaching at UC only because UC wants to be a football school now. No one cares enough anymore to fire him.

So what you are saying is no Big East win is a good win...beat another bottom feeder tonight in U of L. You are so delusional its unreal a BE team won the Nat'l title last year. I believe the #9 seed in the conference tournament. So keep selling the BE is overrated, I'm not buying it. Mick is still the coach b/c they want to be a football conference????? He's the coach because he went from 1 scholarship player when he started back to relevance. Sorry he wasn't handed an almost elite 8 team and turn them into an NIT team in 2 years (agghhhhm Chis Mack). We are 10-5 in #2 rated conference you are 8-5 in the #7 rated conference. If they get in the tournament again this year, please keep talking about UC's non-conference schedule. I love hearing that broken record. Oh and maybe pay attention to college bball outside of Cintas Center

[LazelleDurden]

Just watch why the Big East does in the tourney. I am guessing several of them lose first week. I have actually been hearing the Big 10 is best conference this year.

You haven't heard, Big 10 is 1 BE is 2.

[LazelleDurden]

How come notre dame totally blew in the non conference and got their doors blown off by Georgia? But somehow they are now good. Is it possible that maybe the big east just really is just very average?

UCONN blew in the non-conference last year........what happened to them....delusional

Ever think ND had to adjust to playing without their best player at the beginning of the year?

[Juice]

So what you are saying is no Big East win is a good win...beat another bottom feeder tonight in U of L. You are so delusional its unreal a BE team won the Nat'l title last year. I believe the #9 seed in the conference tournament. So keep selling the BE is overrated, I'm not buying it. Mick is still the coach b/c they want to be a football conference????? He's the coach because he went from 1 scholarship player when he started back to relevance. Sorry he wasn't handed an almost elite 8 team and turn them into an NIT team in 2 years (agghhhhm Chis Mack). We are 10-5 in #2 rated conference you are 8-5 in the #7 rated conference. If they get in the tournament again this year, please keep talking about UC's non-conference schedule. I love hearing that broken record. Oh and maybe pay attention to college bball outside of Cintas Center

What does it mean when a team that is 8-5 in the #7 conference beats a 10-5 team in the #2 rated conference by 23 points?

[xavierj]

So what you are saying is no Big East win is a good win...beat another bottom feeder tonight in U of L. You are so delusional its unreal a BE team won the Nat'l title last year. I believe the #9 seed in the conference tournament. So keep selling the BE is overrated, I'm not buying it. Mick is still the coach b/c they want to be a football conference????? He's the coach because he went from 1 scholarship player when he started back to relevance. Sorry he wasn't handed an almost elite 8 team and turn them into an NIT team in 2 years (agghhhhm Chis Mack). We are 10-5 in #2 rated conference you are 8-5 in the #7 rated conference. If they get in the tournament again this year, please keep talking about UC's non-conference schedule. I love hearing that broken record. Oh and maybe pay attention to college bball outside of Cintas Center

You must think Xavier is pretty important to come over to their board and justify your existence at 12:30 in the morning. Shoot me if I ever become so shallow to do the same. One last thing. You and providence have a lot in common.

[boozehound]

So what you are saying is no Big East win is a good win...beat another bottom feeder tonight in U of L. You are so delusional its unreal a BE team won the Nat'l title last year. I believe the #9 seed in the conference tournament. So keep selling the BE is overrated, I'm not buying it. Mick is still the coach b/c they want to be a football conference????? He's the coach because he went from 1 scholarship player when he started back to relevance. Sorry he wasn't handed an almost elite 8 team and turn them into an NIT team in 2 years (agghhhhm Chis Mack). We are 10-5 in #2 rated conference you are 8-5 in the #7 rated conference. If they get in the tournament again this year, please keep talking about UC's non-conference schedule. I love hearing that broken record. Oh and maybe pay attention to college bball outside of Cintas Center

12:30am after a UC win and you are on our board posting? A lot of things must be going right in your life, huh?

UC fans have now seemingly become the ones with the inferiority complex. This is what it is like to be the big dog. When you have a down year haters can't wait to pile on.

[LadyMuskie]

So what you are saying is no Big East win is a good win...beat another bottom feeder tonight in U of L. You are so delusional its unreal a BE team won the Nat'l title last year. I believe the #9 seed in the conference tournament. So keep selling the BE is overrated, I'm not buying it. Mick is still the coach b/c they want to be a football conference????? He's the coach because he went from 1 scholarship player when he started back to relevance. Sorry he wasn't handed an almost elite 8 team and turn them into an NIT team in 2 years (agghhhhm Chis Mack). We are 10-5 in #2 rated conference you are 8-5 in the #7 rated conference. If they get in the tournament again this year, please keep talking about UC's non-conference schedule. I love hearing that broken record. Oh and maybe pay attention to college bball outside of Cintas Center

Awwww. Someone needs to feel validated! Someone needs a Stuart Smalley-type reaffirmation! I can't give it to you because, well, you're you. But, chances are someone cares and can help you out.



12:30am after a UC win and you are on our board posting? A lot of things must be going right in your life, huh?



On the other hand, booze makes a good point. The fact that you're posting on a rival's message board at midnight doesn't really bode well for you having anyone in your life that can reaffirm your existence. Bummer. Maybe call Mick Cronin since you're such a staunch supporter of his shortness. Or wait . . . are you . . . these posts do reek of inferiority. . .I think we may have discovered what Mick does after a UC game!!!

[XULucho27]

Oh, did uc end up winning that game last night? I was too busy not really giving a shit and not posting on uc boards, because, you know, I'm not a tool.

"Look we beat a ranked team, we're good now!! Seriously you guys, look!" reeks of a little brother tugging on his big brother's shirt and whining. Damn, I agree with booze, I thought UC fans said we're the ones with the complex.

[GoMuskies]

I'm glad UC fans are happy with Mick. I hope he's at UC for a long time.

[Newswired]

Johnny Cash's Mini Me!

Did anyone else think that about Mick last night?

[bearcatalyst]

Johnny Cash's Mini Me!

Did anyone else think that about Mick last night?

Ha, I could definitely see that. The all black was a bit much but I guess it went with the blackout theme. Thankfully, we don't do goldouts like at WVU.

Also, losing Mick to Illinois would be a huge loss, IMO. Thankfully I can second, third and fourth the opinions of those that say he would never reconnect with Mike Thomas. He is a clown that no one was sad to see go. Mick must be thankful that the new kid on the block, Babcock, didn't can him after the shooutout debacle. Whit has done more in his short tenure for basketball than MT ever did. Mick probably knows it and must feel indebted to him in some way. Not to mention that UC is his dream job, people...

[xavierj]

Ha, I could definitely see that. The all black was a bit much but I guess it went with the blackout theme. Thankfully, we don't do goldouts like at WVU.

Also, losing Mick to Illinois would be a huge loss, IMO. Thankfully I can second, third and fourth the opinions of those that say he would never reconnect with Mike Thomas. He is a clown that no one was sad to see go. Mick must be thankful that the new kid on the block, Babcock, didn't can him after the shooutout debacle. Whit has done more in his short tenure for basketball than MT ever did. Mick probably knows it and must feel indebted to him in some way. Not to mention that UC is his dream job, people...

Babcock does seem like a pretty good guy. The only thing I wish for Mick was for him to be a little careful with his language when he knows the camera is on him. He threw out about 50 f-bombs last night that was evident to my 11 year old who was watching the game with me. To be honest Mick gets a bad rap as a coach. I don't really like the way he comes off or some of the things he says but he has done a pretty good job coaching this year. He adjusted to what he had and it will pay off in an NCAA bid.

I think it is pretty shocking though that more teams do not go to a 3-2 zone against them though to take away the dribble penetration and wide open looks around the top of the key and wings.

[xsteve1]

I'll say this he is a much better coach than I ever thought he would be. Besides Gates does he even have a top 100 kid on the roster.

[xavierj]

I'll say this he is a much better coach than I ever thought he would be. Besides Gates does he even have a top 100 kid on the roster.

I believe Wright was.

[bearcatalyst]

Babcock does seem like a pretty good guy. The only thing I wish for Mick was for him to be a little careful with his language when he knows the camera is on him. He threw out about 50 f-bombs last night that was evident to my 11 year old who was watching the game with me. To be honest Mick gets a bad rap as a coach. I don't really like the way he comes off or some of the things he says but he has done a pretty good job coaching this year. He adjusted to what he had and it will pay off in an NCAA bid.

I think it is pretty shocking though that more teams do not go to a 3-2 zone against them though to take away the dribble penetration and wide open looks around the top of the key and wings.

I don't disagree with anything you said.

Coaches cursing on national TV is a big gripe of mine. I didn't notice it last night but I am sure it happened. I am just so stressed during UC games that I am normally using timeouts to pace around the house and throw things. However, when a game is on ESPN you have to know that there are going to be about 4 cameras targeted on you, the coach, at any one time. It bothers me too though that coaches for every basketball and football team cant get a point across without profanity. Eh, that's life though. Happens at the high school level too.

I know Mick gets a bum rap here, and thats fine and 100% understandable (who likes being "that guy" about a rival). However, I think his reputation nationally is positive. Those that pay attention can see he started with one scholarship player and has turned them into an above average group. If this is his ceiling than I would be worried but I can see improvements year to year in his coaching ability. What he has done post shootout is astounding to me, personally. It would have been very easy to fall hard on their aces. I am anxious to see the type of student athletes he can recruit now that the program isn't up against it.

I also think Mick can get himself in trouble with the media too. I honestly think the issue is that he is stunningly honest. You don't get a lot of coach speak from him. People here have selective hearing for his quotes (again, understandable) but I think he says the right things more often than not. I can live with his honesty. After a couple of seasons of listening to Butch (who I really like) talk about "holding the rope" and "representing the c" leaves me more open to some plain old "we suck right now" or "we looked like crap tonight from the top down" comments from a coach.

I also 100% agree with the 3-2 zone. Why any ever plays us man to man is beyond me. I am also surprised more teams done press us. I know we typically play a 4 guard offense but we are very turnover prone when you can ratchet up the full court pressure (see Marq).

[bearcatalyst]

I believe Wright was.

Correct. Ranked by most just outside the top 10 for his position and around 90th overall.

[LazelleDurden]

You must think Xavier is pretty important to come over to their board and justify your existence at 12:30 in the morning. Shoot me if I ever become so shallow to do the same. One last thing. You and providence have a lot in common.

2,263 message board posts

Originally Posted by boozehound
12:30am after a UC win and you are on our board posting? A lot of things must be going right in your life, huh?

3,668 message board posts

I'm not the one who should be worried about not having a life. It be nice if you could find some friends in to talk about your mid major team with. But, apparently you have to resort to the message boards to find friends.

[DC Muskie]

It be nice if you could find some friends in to talk about your mid major team with.

I'm willing to give you another shot at this.

[xavierj]

2,263 message board posts

Originally Posted by boozehound
12:30am after a UC win and you are on our board posting? A lot of things must be going right in your life, huh?

3,668 message board posts

I'm not the one who should be worried about not having a life. It be nice if you could find some friends in to talk about your mid major team with. But, apparently you have to resort to the message boards to find friends.

A mid major team that beat your team by 23 Points. That sounds about right.

[bearcatalyst]

A mid major team that beat your team by 23 Points. That sounds about right.

How did this end up in this thread? This one was actually about Mick and relatively peaceful. I always liked this board because it sparks good discussion. Was this stuff copied and pasted over from the smack forum? Good grief.

I'm not calling out whoever I quoted either but all of the posts immediately preceding it. Durden, gtfo. You're an embarrassment to UC fans. Come here and post something worthwhile or lurk and enjoy others anguish privately. Both are perfectly acceptable. Many here get their rocks off perusing UDPride, no? But when you join a rivals site just to kick dirt on them it is just plain stupid.

[boozehound]

How did this end up in this thread? This one was actually about Mick and relatively peaceful. I always liked this board because it sparks good discussion. Was this stuff copied and pasted over from the smack forum? Good grief.

I'm not calling out whoever I quoted either but all of the posts immediately preceding it. Durden, gtfo. You're an embarrassment to UC fans. Come here and post something worthwhile or lurk and enjoy others anguish privately. Both are perfectly acceptable. Many here get their rocks off perusing UDPride, no? But when you join a rivals site just to kick dirt on them it is just plain stupid.

Lazelle Durden happened to this thread.

Back on topic: Cronin has done a decent job in the last few years. I don't particularly like him, and his mannerisms rub me the wrong way, but he has looked like a pretty decent coach for the last 2 seasons after an abyssmal start.

I don't know if I see Croning taking UC to Final Fours and what not but I think he will be a decent coach.

[LazelleDurden]

How did this end up in this thread? This one was actually about Mick and relatively peaceful. I always liked this board because it sparks good discussion. Was this stuff copied and pasted over from the smack forum? Good grief.

I'm not calling out whoever I quoted either but all of the posts immediately preceding it. Durden, gtfo. You're an embarrassment to UC fans. Come here and post something worthwhile or lurk and enjoy others anguish privately. Both are perfectly acceptable. Many here get their rocks off perusing UDPride, no? But when you join a rivals site just to kick dirt on them it is just plain stupid.

I did post something worth while then I get attacked because they can't understand UC has gotten better under Cronin. They are blinded by their hate of UC. UC goes from 1 scholarship player to a double bye in the BE in they are wondering why other universities are interested in the coach.

[bleedXblue]

A year ago, I thought Mick was a lousy coach.

He's proving a lot of people wrong right now.

I still dont care for his demeanor and I think he is a little full of himself at times.

He's going to get some looks. If I'm him and knowing what he shoud know about the instability of the Big East (football mainly) and that UL is likley leaving as well, I may take a look at a job if it's a good one in the Big Ten, ACC or SEC.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

A year ago, I thought Mick was a lousy coach.

He's proving a lot of people wrong right now.

I still dont care for his demeanor and I think he is a little full of himself at times.

He's going to get some looks. If I'm him and knowing what he shoud know about the instability of the Big East (football mainly) and that UL is likley leaving as well, I may take a look at a job if it's a good one in the Big Ten, ACC or SEC.

Dont forget UConn and Rutgers will likely be gone in the next couple years as well

[DC Muskie]

If Georgia Tech can hire Brian Gregory, then somone will hire Mick Cronin. I would guess though that none of the players will lsiten to him when they lose, a remarkable trait under Cronin's coaching.

[SpectorJersey]

I did post something worth while then I get attacked because they can't understand UC has gotten better under Cronin. They are blinded by their hate of UC. UC goes from 1 scholarship player to a double bye in the BE in they are wondering why other universities are interested in the coach.

Wow, a double bye? Thats basically a national championship right? I liked it better when UC had Huggins.

[tjb]

i dont know if this has been mentioned but didnt he just get divorced? i would think that his ex wife lives here in cincy and i wouldnt think he would leave town while his kids are in cincinnati. his job is safe here and i think he is comfortable.

[larkinforever]

If Georgia Tech can hire Brian Gregory, then somone will hire Mick Cronin. I would guess though that none of the players will lsiten to him when they lose, a remarkable trait under Cronin's coaching.

It's not a matter of whether or not someone would hire Cronin. It's whether or not he would leave. Unlike Gregory at Dayton, Cronin is at a destination job. You don't see too many coaches giving up a big east job to go elsewhere. Crean, Howland, and Beilein are the only ones I can think of in recent memory. Who am I missing?

[bleedXblue]

It's not a matter of whether or not someone would hire Cronin. It's whether or not he would leave. Unlike Gregory at Dayton, Cronin is at a destination job. You don't see too many coaches giving up a big east job to go elsewhere. Crean, Howland, and Beilein are the only ones I can think of in recent memory. Who am I missing?

The Big East is no longer a destination conference IMHO.

You have Syracuse, WVU and Pitt all leaving.

You bacsically have a bunch of mediocre football teams coming in that wont improve
the quality of football. Memphis and Temple help on the b-ball side but it's clear that football rules the roost.

UL, UCONN and Rutgers are just waiting for the the right opportunity to leave.

Thats why someone would look at a nice offer from a conference that has a better football base thats more stable long term.

I really dont see Cronin leaving, but things have changed considerably in the last 12 months.

[xavierj]

Gillen, Pitino, Carliesemo, Amaker, Rick Barnes, Dr. Tom Davis (going back aways), Leonard Hamilton. Not sure if that's the whole list.

Ben Howland.

[gladdenguy]

It's not a matter of whether or not someone would hire Cronin. It's whether or not he would leave. Unlike Gregory at Dayton, Cronin is at a destination job. You don't see too many coaches giving up a big east job to go elsewhere. Crean, Howland, and Beilein are the only ones I can think of in recent memory. Who am I missing?

Mickey Mouse also has to think what he has back next year as well as comin in.

Kirkpatrick is back.....but Dixon and Nancy are gone. sUCks will be terrible down low next year. Also, Mickey has nobody comin in th 12 class.
Couple this with the fact that sUCks averages maybe 6,000 fans a game.
Illinois would be a major step up if they wanted him.

[boozehound]

Mickey Mouse also has to think what he has back next year as well as comin in.

Kirkpatrick is back.....but Dixon and Nancy are gone. sUCks will be terrible down low next year. Also, Mickey has nobody comin in th 12 class.
Couple this with the fact that sUCks averages maybe 6,000 fans a game.
Illinois would be a major step up if they wanted him.

Tough to argue with any of this.

I still am not sure why UC's attendance is so horrible. I know that their arena sucks but with the amount of alums in the Cincinnati area you would think they would be able to sell out, particularly this season when they were actually pretty good in the last half of the season. They made the tournament last year and won a game. If you are Mick Cronin you have to be wondering what it is going to take to get the 'fans' to show up to the games. You are also probably wondering who took your lucky charms if you are Mick Cronin.

[bleedXblue]

Mickey Mouse also has to think what he has back next year as well as comin in.

Kirkpatrick is back.....but Dixon and Nancy are gone. sUCks will be terrible down low next year. Also, Mickey has nobody comin in th 12 class.
Couple this with the fact that sUCks averages maybe 6,000 fans a game.
Illinois would be a major step up if they wanted him.


GG,

Sorry, but they have Kilpatrick, Wright and Parker all back next year. Justin jackson is improving as well. They also get the Shaquille kid back. I think they will be just as good next year. Hell, they played better with Gates out on suspension and Dixon is an average to slightly above average player. They will be fine.

[bearcatalyst]

Yeah, I am not sure where people are getting the whole notion that UC is returning nobody next year idea...

Cashmere, SK and Parker are a very solid returning group. Shaq Thomas was a projected starter coming into this season and Justin Jackson has been HUGE down the stretch. Plus, a couple of freshman in Guyn and Davis III have seen close to 10 minutes per contest. Yancy is obviously a tough loss but with the 4 guard offense that has become a more manageable loss. Plus, these guys are playing strong defense and you believe that with the loss of just two key players that the defense will continue to be strong.

Touching on attendance--you guys are blowing it out of proportion as it relates to this year. People here are pretending like no one is showing up late in the year. They averaged 10,907 in conference. Everyone knows why they didn't have bigger numbers in the non-conference:

1) The cats were bad
2) The opponents were for the most part even worse
3) Season ticket sales were low (which is a big deal when you play nobodies in the non-conference slate)

I would expect back to back trips to the NCAA tournament and a new athletic director to fix numbers 2 and 3. Cronin has already fixed issue number 1. For those wondering, they averaged 7,878 in total. They also didn't have their automatic sell out games in WVU and X. I consider the fan support this year to be a HUGE step forward.

I don't see Cronin going anywhere. The conference is unstable. Who cares. This is NCAA BASKETBALL. It really doesn't matter what conference you are in. He has his program rebuilt and this is his dream job. I don't lose a lick of sleep about him taking another job. I don't believe that the prestige of the Illinois job can match UC or lure him away from his home. Without delving too deeply, there is something to the notion that he wouldn't leave town post-divorce, either. Samantha, his daughter, is the love of his life. The only job I realistically worry about him taking is the Ville job. When that rumor starts swirling, I'll take notice. Until then, I am quite confident he is a Bearcat for the long haul--and this pleases me.

[bleedXblue]

Yeah, I am not sure where people are getting the whole notion that UC is returning nobody next year idea...

Cashmere, SK and Parker are a very solid returning group. Shaq Thomas was a projected starter coming into this season and Justin Jackson has been HUGE down the stretch. Plus, a couple of freshman in Guyn and Davis III have seen close to 10 minutes per contest. Yancy is obviously a tough loss but with the 4 guard offense that has become a more manageable loss. Plus, these guys are playing strong defense and you believe that with the loss of just two key players that the defense will continue to be strong.

Touching on attendance--you guys are blowing it out of proportion as it relates to this year. People here are pretending like no one is showing up late in the year. They averaged 10,907 in conference. Everyone knows why they didn't have bigger numbers in the non-conference:

1) The cats were bad
2) The opponents were for the most part even worse
3) Season ticket sales were low (which is a big deal when you play nobodies in the non-conference slate)

I would expect back to back trips to the NCAA tournament and a new athletic director to fix numbers 2 and 3. Cronin has already fixed issue number 1. For those wondering, they averaged 7,878 in total. They also didn't have their automatic sell out games in WVU and X. I consider the fan support this year to be a HUGE step forward.

I don't see Cronin going anywhere. The conference is unstable. Who cares. This is NCAA BASKETBALL. It really doesn't matter what conference you are in. He has his program rebuilt and this is his dream job. I don't lose a lick of sleep about him taking another job. I don't believe that the prestige of the Illinois job can match UC or lure him away from his home. Without delving too deeply, there is something to the notion that he wouldn't leave town post-divorce, either. Samantha, his daughter, is the love of his life. The only job I realistically worry about him taking is the Ville job. When that rumor starts swirling, I'll take notice. Until then, I am quite confident he is a Bearcat for the long haul--and this pleases me.

If someone offers him stupid money like Miller and Matta got, I think he'll have a really tough decision. UC cant pay their b-ball coach 2 mil a year. Plus, he seems to e the kind of guy that likes the attention and notoriety.

[larkinforever]

Mickey Mouse also has to think what he has back next year as well as comin in.

Kirkpatrick is back.....but Dixon and Nancy are gone. sUCks will be terrible down low next year. Also, Mickey has nobody comin in th 12 class.
Couple this with the fact that sUCks averages maybe 6,000 fans a game.
Illinois would be a major step up if they wanted him.

wow seriously?
1) not at all accurate regarding next year's team
2) as others have already corrected you, the season attendance average with a joke non-conference was between 7-8k with over 10k averaged in conference play
3) Illinois is not even close to a step up. The only thing they can offer is more money.

[xavierj]

wow seriously?
1) not at all accurate regarding next year's team
2) as others have already corrected you, the season attendance average with a joke non-conference was between 7-8k with over 10k averaged in conference play
3) Illinois is not even close to a step up. The only thing they can offer is more money.

That is usually pretty important. But Mick won't got there and they won't go after him. Mick's pretty much stuck here with his personal situation because is ex is not exactly going to be following him around the country.

[PMI]

3) Illinois is not even close to a step up.

Not close? OK.

[bleedXblue]

wow seriously?
1) not at all accurate regarding next year's team
2) as others have already corrected you, the season attendance average with a joke non-conference was between 7-8k with over 10k averaged in conference play
3) Illinois is not even close to a step up. The only thing they can offer is more money.

Sorry, but Illinois is in the Big 10 and has a pretty respectable track record of success.

They're in Champaign, IL, which hurts them.

But if I try to take and objective look at it I would say they're pretty much on par with UC.

With that being said, if I'm Cronin I wait for a better offer.

There will be multiple great opportunities in the next 2-3 years for young up and comers to grab some really good jobs.

UCLA, UCONN, UL (I dont see Pitino going more than 2-3 more years), Illinois

[SpectorJersey]

Illinois is one of the most overrated jobs in the country. Its in the middle of nowhere and they arent attracting Chicago talent like they once were.

[Kahns Krazy]

wow seriously?
2) as others have already corrected you, the season attendance average with a joke non-conference was between 7-8k with over 10k averaged in conference play
.

I'm confused. Your tone sounds like you are defending UC, but your facts don't support that tone.

Are you really bragging about a school with a current enrollment of 40,000+ and 125,000+ alums living in the greater Cincinnati area leaving on average 5,000 empty seats per game? I don't care how you spin the rest of Mick's performance. Those numbers tell you not everyone thinks UC is getting better under Cronin.

[larkinforever]

I'm confused. Your tone sounds like you are defending UC, but your facts don't support that tone.

Are you really bragging about a school with a current enrollment of 40,000+ and 125,000+ alums living in the greater Cincinnati area leaving on average 5,000 empty seats per game? I don't care how you spin the rest of Mick's performance. Those numbers tell you not everyone thinks UC is getting better under Cronin.

Definitely not defending the poor fan support. Just pointing out that the "barely averaging 6k per night" comment is not accurate. UC has way too many alumni and casual fans who root for them because of the name on the front to not be able to consistently sell out in both football and basketball. That said, as has been mentioned prior, I think we will see the numbers that turned out for conference play (average 10k) become more of the norm if the new AD improves the quality of the non-conference opponents coming into town.
The orginal poster cited the poor attendance as a reason Mick would leave. I think Mick knows why the attendance has been poor. A coach would leave because of poor support if it was due to a lack of interest (see Marlins baseball, Pitt football, Miami basketball, etc.). That is not the case and I would guess Mick sees the correlation in attendance and quality of opponent.

[Kahns Krazy]

The "barely averaging 6k per night" was accurate at some point during the season, so don't act all offended by it. I personally know a number of former UC season ticket holders who will tell you that Mick Cronin is the #1 reason they no longer have tickets. Even Oscar Robinson finally had enough.

They obviously aren't alone. I don't know as many people as there are empty seats.

Even your conference play numbers are flat out pathetic. The Shoe holds 13,000+. Averaging an 82% full arena in a supposedly "premier" conference is sad, especially when you are getting away fan support for games and you host the #1 team in the country. 11,316 for Senior Night?

Mick Cronin is a deservedly hated, and those empty seats are on his shoulders.

Also, you got neg repped for using "Larkinforever" when you are an obvious UC fan.

[larkinforever]

The "barely averaging 6k per night" was accurate at some point during the season, so don't act all offended by it. I personally know a number of former UC season ticket holders who will tell you that Mick Cronin is the #1 reason they no longer have tickets. Even Oscar Robinson finally had enough.

They obviously aren't alone. I don't know as many people as there are empty seats.

Even your conference play numbers are flat out pathetic. The Shoe holds 13,000+. Averaging an 82% full arena in a supposedly "premier" conference is sad, especially when you are getting away fan support for games and you host the #1 team in the country. 11,316 for Senior Night?

Mick Cronin is a deservedly hated, and those empty seats are on his shoulders.

Also, you got neg repped for using "Larkinforever" when you are an obvious UC fan.

1) not sure how I came accross as "all offended"? Sorry if you took it that way?
2) there are definitely some fans that are still living in the past and can't get over the coaching change. Those people are still upset that they were cut from their junior high baseball team too. Fortunately, they are the vocal minority.
3) Oscar made it clear that he wasn't coming due to the non-conference schedule. In his words "i'll be there when they play someone". Oh, and he's also been battling cancer so coming to games is a luxury he hasn't been able to enjoy.
4) not sure what "neg repped" means but the larkin my screename references is the only Larkin anyone outside of cincy has ever heard of. Number 11

[LadyMuskie]

I think Mick knows why the attendance has been poor. A coach would leave because of poor support if it was due to a lack of interest (see Marlins baseball, Pitt football, Miami basketball, etc.). That is not the case and I would guess Mick sees the correlation in attendance and quality of opponent.

You're giving Mick Cronin far more credit for being intelligent than he deserves.

If he knows the reason why fans aren't attending games, then he doesn't care to change it because UC has been scheduling worse and worse non-conference teams each and every year under his tenure. This year they managed to schedule (and subsequently lose to) a team that isn't even fully Division I yet.

I don't think Mick does understand the correlation between attendance and quality of opponent. His quotes to the Enquirer would suggest that he doesn't even understand what the word correlation means, but for sure they state that he doesn't understand why people don't want to come out and watch the bearsloths regardless of whom they are playing. Mick cares about one thing and one thing only: how he appears to everyone else. He schedules pitiful non-conference teams because he thinks he can beat them (which is why he doesn't want to play X anymore) and then he will APPEAR to be a great coach to the outside world. While in reality anyone with a brain or a 2nd grade education can deduce that great coaches don't need to pad their schedule with pathetic teams in order to appear great. Great coaches don't fear playing real teams and they don't make idiot excuses for why they don't play real teams or for why they lose to the pathetic teams they do schedule.

[gladdenguy]

GG,

Sorry, but they have Kilpatrick, Wright and Parker all back next year. Justin jackson is improving as well. They also get the Shaquille kid back. I think they will be just as good next year. Hell, they played better with Gates out on suspension and Dixon is an average to slightly above average player. They will be fine.

Kirkpatrick, Wright and Parker.......I said down low they will suck. Also, Shaquille Thomas is a 3-star who has not played a college basketball game.
They will have nobody down low. Nancy has actually played well enough for them to win in conference. I repeat, they will have NOBODY down low.

And, did you say they played better with Nancy out????? They played Little Sisters of the Poor, a terrible Oklahoma team, and an average over 100 RPI Pitt Team who is obviously NIT bound. How did they play better without Nancy???

If you think UC will be a lock for the tournament earlier than they were this year I will have to disagree. This program in the Big Least, even with Syracuse and West Virginia leaving is a hinge tournament team every year.

[bleedXblue]

Kirkpatrick, Wright and Parker.......I said down low they will suck. Also, Shaquille Thomas is a 3-star who has not played a college basketball game.
They will have nobody down low. Nancy has actually played well enough for them to win in conference. I repeat, they will have NOBODY down low.

And, did you say they played better with Nancy out????? They played Little Sisters of the Poor, a terrible Oklahoma team, and an average over 100 RPI Pitt Team who is obviously NIT bound. How did they play better without Nancy???

If you think UC will be a lock for the tournament earlier than they were this year I will have to disagree. This program in the Big Least, even with Syracuse and West Virginia leaving is a hinge tournament team every year.

The point I was trying to make is that UC is winning this year with their guard play. They will play the same style next year and I'm sure some of their post players wil get better and improve.

Trust me, I hope they lose every game, but to say that they are going to struggle b/c they lose Gates is not accurate IMHO.

[Cheesehead]

2011 NCAA Men's Basketball Attendance:

#44 Xavier 10,098
#71 UC 7,344

FYI:011 DIVISION I BASKETBALL ATTENDANCE TEAM LEADERS
Rank School G Attendance Average
27. Dayton 28. Iowa St.
19 238,778 19 230,097
12,567 12,110
1. Kentucky 15 354,046
2. Syracuse 19 423,924
3. Louisville 21 458,463
4. North Carolina 15 287,155
5. Tennessee 18 341,130
6. BYU 14 261,989
7. Wisconsin 16 275,680
8. Memphis 19 318,601
9. Kansas 18 295,856
10. Illinois 16 253,623
11. Marquette 18 280,545
12. Indiana 18 274,663
13. Ohio St. 20 302,498
14. Maryland 18 268,380
15. Michigan St. 15 221,955
16. New Mexico 17 247,689
17. Purdue 16 222,659
18. V anderbilt 17 234,632
19. North Carolina St. 16 220,457
20. Arizona 17 232,561
21. Texas 18 246,044
22. Creighton 22 297,161
23. UNLV 17 225,301
24. Minnesota 17 225,105
25. Georgetown 14 177,448
26. Kansas St. 18 227,738
23,603 22,312 21,832 19,144 18,952 18,714 17,230 16,768 16,436 15,851 15,586 15,259 15,125 14,910 14,797 14,570 13,916 13,802 13,779 13,680 13,669 13,507 13,253 13,241 12,675 12,652

[larkinforever]

2011 NCAA Men's Basketball Attendance:

#44 Xavier 10,098
#71 UC 7,344



Your point?

[LadyMuskie]

Your point?

Here we go again. Are you a graduate of UC's engineering program by any chance?

[larkinforever]

Kirkpatrick, Wright and Parker.......I said down low they will suck. Also, Shaquille Thomas is a 3-star who has not played a college basketball game.
They will have nobody down low. Nancy has actually played well enough for them to win in conference. I repeat, they will have NOBODY down low.

And, did you say they played better with Nancy out????? They played Little Sisters of the Poor, a terrible Oklahoma team, and an average over 100 RPI Pitt Team who is obviously NIT bound. How did they play better without Nancy???

If you think UC will be a lock for the tournament earlier than they were this year I will have to disagree. This program in the Big Least, even with Syracuse and West Virginia leaving is a hinge tournament team every year.

Sophmore Justin Jackson seems to be developing into quite a force down low especially on the defensive end no?
Xavier fanboy Jeff Goodman said earlier this year after visiiting a UC practice that Shaq Thomas was the "best player on the floor".
Shot blocker Kelvin Gaines will be a sophmore (who knows if he'll help or not)..

Point is, it's not a dire as you're making it sound. I find it a bit odd that you guys have talked for 4 years about how bad Yancy is but now that's he's leaving he will supposedly be leaving an enourmous void that no one can fill. Which is it? Does he suck or will be a big loss?

[Cheesehead]

Your point?

just reporting the facts but since you asked....

that a tiny school in a "mid-major" conference out draws a Big East school with a much larger alumni base but I forget UC is a football school now.

[Cheesehead]

Sophmore Justin Jackson seems to be developing into quite a force down low especially on the defensive end no?
Xavier fanboy Jeff Goodman said earlier this year after visiiting a UC practice that Shaq Thomas was the "best player on the floor".
Shot blocker Kelvin Gaines will be a sophmore (who knows if he'll help or not)..

Point is, it's not a dire as you're making it sound. I find it a bit odd that you guys have talked for 4 years about how bad Yancy is but now that's he's leaving he will supposedly be leaving an enourmous void that no one can fill. Which is it? Does he suck or will be a big loss?

I would say Yancy never quite lived up to his billing, much like Frease

[larkinforever]

just reporting the facts but since you asked....

that a tiny school in a "mid-major" conference out draws a Big East school with a much larger alumni base but I forget UC is a football school now.

I guess I just didn't see the relevance to the discussion. Did someone on here say UC has higher attendance than X?
Congrats on the good attendance by the way!

[LadyMuskie]

No way. 10 posts in and no salary history.

That's true. I just don't want to believe there's more than one.

[Cheesehead]

I guess I just didn't see the relevance to the discussion. Did someone on here say UC has higher attendance than X?
Congrats on the good attendance by the way!

THANKS!

Cranky because WVU lost today, are we?

[XU 87]

I guess I just didn't see the relevance to the discussion. Did someone on here say UC has higher attendance than X?
Congrats on the good attendance by the way!

I suspect the point being made, which is lost on you, is that we have great fans who go to the games, year in and year out. You have lousy fans who only attend games if 1) UC is on a winning streak and 2) the opponent is a top team.

[larkinforever]

I suspect the point being made, which is lost on you, is that we have great fans who go to the games, year in and year out. You have lousy fans who only attend games if 1) UC is on a winning streak and 2) the opponent is a top team.

When was that fact ever challenged? I didn't realize this thread was about comparing UC and Xavier attendance. I thought it was about whether or not Mick would leave for Illinois.
You guys are way too touchy over here! Relax, everyone's not out to get you all the time!

[larkinforever]

THANKS!

Cranky because WVU lost today, are we?

haha hardly! loved seeing them go out of the Big East conference with a loss! Hope they miss the tourney because of it too! It would serve their classless fanbase right

[XUOFM]

Point is, it's not a dire as you're making it sound. I find it a bit odd that you guys have talked for 4 years about how bad Yancy is but now that's he's leaving he will supposedly be leaving an enourmous void that no one can fill. Which is it? Does he suck or will be a big loss?

I think it could be a both and situation here. Nancy has been a disappointment, which I think you would agree with, no?

Yet, if you replace an under performing, out of shape, bad attitude player who throws sucker punches and averages 9.4 rebs and 11.8 points with a player who averages less than these numbers, then you have a player who sucks and is leaving a void.

And in terms of guys who have never seen a minute of playing time being the best player in the gym. Goodman, i think it was him, said the same thing about Travis Taylor last year. Unfortunately, this apparent domination in practice has not translated to game time situations.

I don't pretend to know anything about uc athletics or who has been recruited. But, I do not think it is absurd to claim that a void will be created by nancy graduating.

[gladdenguy]

Regarding shaq thomas as the best player on the floor.....jeff goodman also said travis taylor was a big time transfer.....jeff goodman knows nothing.

[bearcat65]

Kirkpatrick, Wright and Parker.......I said down low they will suck. Also, Shaquille Thomas is a 3-star who has not played a college basketball game.
They will have nobody down low. Nancy has actually played well enough for them to win in conference. I repeat, they will have NOBODY down low.

And, did you say they played better with Nancy out????? They played Little Sisters of the Poor, a terrible Oklahoma team, and an average over 100 RPI Pitt Team who is obviously NIT bound. How did they play better without Nancy???

If you think UC will be a lock for the tournament earlier than they were this year I will have to disagree. This program in the Big Least, even with Syracuse and West Virginia leaving is a hinge tournament team every year.

Thomas was a 4 star per Scout along with Sanders who played well at times this season. Not that rankings really mean that much. Kilpatrick was a 3 star and Parker was not ranked, both have had pretty good seasons.
I would agree that post play could be questionable next year however they have 4 post players who will return, Ellis, Gaines, Jackson, and Mbodj. Given who they have returning at the other positions I don't think they will need a consistent post scorer which is good since they don't have any coming back. Whoever mans the post will be counted on to rebound and play defense.
Count me among those who will miss Yancy Gates. Aside from what happened during the last shoot out I think he has been a good player for UC. I think UC fans expected too much from him when he came in. I think the same could be said for Kenny Frease. I think both were expected to be superstars rather than the solid players they have been.

[muskienick]

Thomas was a 4 star per Scout along with Sanders who played well at times this season. Not that rankings really mean that much. Kilpatrick was a 3 star and Parker was not ranked, both have had pretty good seasons.
I would agree that post play could be questionable next year however they have 4 post players who will return, Ellis, Gaines, Jackson, and Mbodj. Given who they have returning at the other positions I don't think they will need a consistent post scorer which is good since they don't have any coming back. Whoever mans the post will be counted on to rebound and play defense.
Count me among those who will miss Yancy Gates. Aside from what happened during the last shoot out I think he has been a good player for UC. I think UC fans expected too much from him when he came in. I think the same could be said for Kenny Frease. I think both were expected to be superstars rather than the solid players they have been.

I could not agree more with your post, above. As relatively solid as Gates was this year for Cincy, the Bearcats did quite well without him during his suspension. Despite playing a less-than-stellar OOC schedule, UC fans should be very encouraged with the Bearcats success while playing without some of their key guys.

On the XU side of the ledger, the Muskies have two good perimeter players coming in as well as two 6'9" post players that are supposed to be pretty decent. However, none of the four have played a single game at the college D-1 level yet. The same can be said for the incoming players for the Bearcats. Let's just sit back and let both clubs develop and see what happens. In the long run, I believe both fan bases will be pleased.

[outsideobserver11]

ESPN insider article naming Mack as a potential suitor for the Illinois job as many believe Smart will turn it down.

[XULucho27]

ESPN insider article naming Mack as a potential suitor for the Illinois job as many believe Smart will turn it down.

I saw that as well. At this point it comes with the territory with our coaches; we know they will be given offers by bigger schools.

IMO, going to Illinois would be a step back.

[xavierj]

ESPN insider article naming Mack as a potential suitor for the Illinois job as many believe Smart will turn it down.

Yeah ok.

[Cheesehead]

Chris Mack will not take the Illinois job. Mark it down.

[Cheesehead]

I don't know about that. Illinois is a great job. I'm not getting caught up in all that this year, though.

"great job" ????? No way. It's like taking the IU football job.

[GoMuskies]

"great job" ????? No way. It's like taking the IU football job.

Wow, IU playing in the BCS national title game in the last 10 years must have totally slipped my mind.

[boozehound]

Here we go again...

[Cheesehead]

Fine, you are right, the Illinois job is the best Big 10 job out there.


Mack could do a lot better if he real wants to move on.

Why do folks like Lon Kruger and Bill Self leave if it's so great?

[GoMuskies]

So you don't think Xavier is a great job?!?

[paulxu]

This does bring up an interesting question though. In the same way that Matta developed Miller, and Miller developed Mack (as assistants), who is Mack developing?

[GoMuskies]

This does bring up an interesting question though. In the same way that Matta developed Miller, and Miller developed Mack (as assistants), who is Mack developing?

Mack

[paulxu]

I see what you did there.

[boozehound]

I would be beyond shocked if Chris went to Illinois.

Chris and his wife love Cincinnati. They just built a house here and have a strong base of friends that they have known for years and family in the area. Chris went to Xavier. Champaign Illinois is absolutely in the middle of nowhere. There is a big difference in quality of life between living in the city where you grew up with all your friends and family and living in Champaign Illinois.

I would bet he listens if Illinois calls (who wouldn't) and, if anything, uses the interest to get a bit more out of Xavier, but I really don't see Mack leaving for Illinois. I would worry a bit about Louisville though, if they fire Pitino or Kentucky when Calipari leaves (depending on the severity of sanctions) should either school decide to go after Chris.

[STL_XUfan]

Mack

Or more correctly Macks:

http://a0.twimg.com/profile_images/1907994746/IMG957963.jpg


The two headed monster of basketball knowledge will rule the NCAA with an Iron first from 2040-2075.

[SM#24]

Illinois is a top 20 coaching job.
Chris Mack is not going there.

[GuyFawkes38]

I can't see Mack leaving for Ill. My only concern is that the next couple years will likely be tough for us (and could possibly be brutal). It wouldn't be bad timing to bolt. But again, Mack seems genuinely commited to Cincy and the X program.

[xavierj]

I can't see Mack leaving for Ill. My only concern is that the next couple years will likely be tough for us (and could possibly be brutal). It wouldn't be bad timing to bolt. But again, Mack seems genuinely commited to Cincy and the X program.

You have no faith in the program if you think they will be brutal the next couple of years. Xavier has its best recruiting class coming in and they already have a stud in the making with Dez. Dee Davis, Justin Martin and Jeff Robinson have also shown they can be serviceable and Xavier will bring in at least one more guy for next year. And Mark Lyons if he comes back will be very good next season. Xavier will be fine, they always are.

[boozehound]

You have no faith in the program if you think they will be brutal the next couple of years. Xavier has its best recruiting class coming in and they already have a stud in the making with Dez. Dee Davis, Justin Martin and Jeff Robinson have also shown they can be serviceable and Xavier will bring in at least one more guy for next year. And Mark Lyons if he comes back will be very good next season. Xavier will be fine, they always are.

Yeah. We'll be fine. Next year could be a little tough by Xavier standards - Maybe no Sweet 16 and we have to settle for just making the tournament and possibly winning one game - but we will be fine by the following year. We always are.

[Masterofreality]

Chris Mack turned down the Tennessee job last year even when they threw millions of jack at him.

Relax. He's going no where.

[Juice]

Yeah. We'll be fine. Next year could be a little tough by Xavier standards - Maybe no Sweet 16 and we have to settle for just making the tournament and possibly winning one game - but we will be fine by the following year. We always are.

Last year would be a comparable year as far as results. It still amazes me how that team got a 6 seed.

[DC Muskie]

(and could possibly be brutal).

Please describe "Brutal."

Winning 18 games?

[MD Muskie]

considering all the talk that had been posted on this message board from December 10th until the A10 tournament, one would have thought that this season would be considered brutal. Yet look where we are. We will be fine, and we will be an A10 force. Players will have to step up next year and they will because they KNOW who they play for.

[LadyMuskie]

I don't want Mack to leave. I like him as a person and as a coach so much more than I ever did with Miller. However, if he chooses to leave like those before him, then so be it. If he wants to move to so-called greener pastures, then he will do so regardless of what we all think, want or feel.

Having said that, at some point I would think that some of these men have to start recognizing the difficulties that their predecessors have had and are having at sustaining success at the levels these BCS schools have come to expect. Prosser wasn't exactly forging powerhouse teams at Wake, Matta is hearing grumbling from OSU fans who want a National Championship, Miller can't even make the tournament, and Gillen didn't set the world afire at Providence or Virginia. At some point, I would think, that the millions of dollars become less attractive when you factor in the fact that success is counted by how many National Championships you win, and not whether you make the Sweet Sixteen or not. If they think Xavier's fan base is demanding, they must be shocked by what fans of the BCS schools demand.

In any event, having lost Matta and Miller in the fashions in which we lost them, I refuse to get worked up one way or the other about Mack potentially leaving. I have zero control over whether he does stay or doesn't stay and it's futile either way to worry about it.

My hope is that Mack is here for the long haul and he sees the value of staying at X long term. However, if he leaves after this season I would not be surprised and I would not be overly worried about Xavier. I trust the administration, including Bobinski, to, once again, fill the spot of head coach with the right guy for the job.

Xavier might not be as attractive a position as Duke, Kansas or UNC, but there aren't many schools beyond those 3 that are that attractive. Still, Xavier is an attractive basketball school and I have confidence that if Mack chooses to depart, we will continue to be a basketball force in the nation.

[bleedXblue]

I don't want Mack to leave. I like him as a person and as a coach so much more than I ever did with Miller. However, if he chooses to leave like those before him, then so be it. If he wants to move to so-called greener pastures, then he will do so regardless of what we all think, want or feel.

Having said that, at some point I would think that some of these men have to start recognizing the difficulties that their predecessors have had and are having at sustaining success at the levels these BCS schools have come to expect. Prosser wasn't exactly forging powerhouse teams at Wake, Matta is hearing grumbling from OSU fans who want a National Championship, Miller can't even make the tournament, and Gillen didn't set the world afire at Providence or Virginia. At some point, I would think, that the millions of dollars become less attractive when you factor in the fact that success is counted by how many National Championships you win, and not whether you make the Sweet Sixteen or not. If they think Xavier's fan base is demanding, they must be shocked by what fans of the BCS schools demand.

In any event, having lost Matta and Miller in the fashions in which we lost them, I refuse to get worked up one way or the other about Mack potentially leaving. I have zero control over whether he does stay or doesn't stay and it's futile either way to worry about it.

My hope is that Mack is here for the long haul and he sees the value of staying at X long term. However, if he leaves after this season I would not be surprised and I would not be overly worried about Xavier. I trust the administration, including Bobinski, to, once again, fill the spot of head coach with the right guy for the job.

Xavier might not be as attractive a position as Duke, Kansas or UNC, but there aren't many schools beyond those 3 that are that attractive. Still, Xavier is an attractive basketball school and I have confidence that if Mack chooses to depart, we will continue to be a basketball force in the nation.

Gillen left and made a bunch of money, but I bet he wished he would have stayed knowing what X did after he left. Wins, Cintas , A-10 etc

Matta and Miller are set for life financially.

The only way we keep coaches for an extended period of time is........pay them the $$. If we're the 17th most profitable program in the country, then pay the man if you want to keep him.

[paulxu]

I could see Mack going to Duke when K decides to retire.
(assuming he sustains the success here that he has had so far)

[Masterofreality]

I could see Mack going to Duke when K decides to retire.
(assuming he sustains the success here that he has had so far)

Really? And be the guy to K that Gene Bartow was to John Wooden?

Bartow's hair started falling out in chunks. You don't want to be the guy immediately following the legend.

CMack has a beautiful, newly built house in Northern KY. His wife's family is just down the road in Louisville and they can see the Granddaughters whenever they want. CMack is a Cincy guy. There are a few differences from the prior guys, not the least of which that Coach is an X guy through and through.

[smileyy]

I could see Mack going to Duke when K decides to retire.
(assuming he sustains the success here that he has had so far)

I'm sure one of those rat-faced Duke players who couldn't cut it in the NBA is in line for that job.

[smileyy]

Anyone at OSU griping about Matta's lack of success is more spoiled and feels more entitled than half this board. And that's pretty goddamn spoiled. Be happy with national prominence. There's no guarantees in college basketball.

[MFurey]

I could see Mack going to Duke when K decides to retire.
(assuming he sustains the success here that he has had so far)

I would imagine Coach K will hand pick his successor or if he decided to step down quickly they would name someone who has ties to the program. Certainly Duke is Duke, they're on tv more than leave it to beaver reruns. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cjGRqUuIQs

[Masterofreality]

Sounds like Shaka Smart is staying put. as per Twitter.

[muskienick]

Really? And be the guy to K that Gene Bartow was to John Wooden?

Bartow's hair started falling out in chunks. You don't want to be the guy immediately following the legend.

CMack has a beautiful, newly built house in Northern KY. His wife's family is just down the road in Louisville and they can see the Granddaughters whenever they want. CMack is a Cincy guy. There are a few differences from the prior guys, not the least of which that Coach is an X guy through and through.

I sincerely doubt that Chris' hair would "start falling out in chunks." (In order for that to happen, he'd first have to grow some chuncks of hair!)

Mea culpa, mea culpa, mea maxima culpa, Chris!

[LA Muskie]

I would imagine Coach K will hand pick his successor or if he decided to step down quickly they would name someone who has ties to the program. Certainly Duke is Duke, they're on tv more than leave it to beaver reruns. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cjGRqUuIQs
I suspect that much like Boeheim/Hopkins, they will eventually announce a head-coach-in-waiting for Coach K. I don't think Duke wants the media circus of a coaching search.

As for Mack, I think he'll stick around. But can we please dispense with all the "He just built a beautiful house, and his family loves it here" talk? These are serious decisions that every successful coach has to confront at some point. And while geography may play a role, personal ambition and pride typically predominate.

I get the sense he loved his time at Wake Forest, and it seems CP3 is still his closest former player. Call me an idiot (others do all the time), but I could see that job tempting him, if for no other reason than to build on Skip's legacy.

[xavierj]

I suspect that much like Boeheim/Hopkins, they will eventually announce a head-coach-in-waiting for Coach K. I don't think Duke wants the media circus of a coaching search.

As for Mack, I think he'll stick around. But can we please dispense with all the "He just built a beautiful house, and his family loves it here" talk? These are serious decisions that every successful coach has to confront at some point. And while geography may play a role, personal ambition and pride typically predominate.

You want to live in champaign? Chris isn't going anywhere. People from Cincinnati never leave. Especially when you make about a million a year. Hell people in cincy rarely leave the little area where they are from. I.e east side - west side.

[LA Muskie]

You want to live in champaign? Chris isn't going anywhere. People from Cincinnati never leave. Especially when you make about a million a year. Hell people in cincy rarely leave the little area where they are from. I.e east side - west side.

No, I don't think he's going to Champaign. But I don't think it's because he won't consider offers. I think it's because, all things considered, it's not enough of an improvement.

Like I said, I think he'll stay for a while. But I'm also not going to pretend that I know what makes him tick, personally and professionally. If he has aspirations and ambitions that can't be met at Xavier -- be them money, competition, or stature -- then he has every right to pursue them. This is, after all, his career.

[xudash]

Chris Mack turned down the Tennessee job last year even when they threw millions of jack at him.

Relax. He's going no where.

If I recall correctly, the deal they worked out with Sean was for a five year commitment from Sean. If I also recall correctly, the IU job came up and the idea of Sean Miller jumping from Xavier to IU was squashed about as fast as it took for someone to consider the possibility. The IU job wasn't the only one that year, but I can't remember the other juicy job that hit the radar screen then.

I would have to believe that Bobinski provided Chris a similar agreement, in terms of commitment to stay, during their most recent contractual review/adjustment.

Beyond that, it's more than fair that some of us have these thoughts about the possibility of him leaving, especially given our experience with coaching turnover, but it just strikes me as an insane idea at this point for him to leave Xavier. He truly is a Xavier guy and I believe that matters. Just behind that is the fact that he is a Cincinnati guy.

Beyond all that is the obvious reality that there are risks in chasing more money.

Personally, I am comfortably certain that Chris Mack will be at Xavier for years, and that we'll love most of that time, even while we have our micro-bitches about this and that along the way.

[Masterofreality]

Wake Forest? No.

I believe that he was at Wake once...and he left as soon as he could to get back to Cincinnati.

He ain't goin back down there- especially after how they stuck it to his buddy Dino.

[LA Muskie]

I believe that he was at Wake once...and he left as soon as he could to get back to Cincinnati.

He ain't goin back down there- especially after how they stuck it to his buddy Dino.
I think that's sugar-coating it a bit. He was there for 3 years and left when he was promoted up to top assistant at XU (for Miller). And by all accounts I've heard, he very much enjoyed his experience there.

The Gaudio angle is interesting, but more interesting would be the opportunity to take over your mentor's program. I will tell you that my brother (a coach) once had the opportunity to take over his mentor's program and chose not to actively pursue it. I think it would be fair to say he has regretted it ever since.

I still tend to think Mack sticks for a while (more than his immediate predecessors who did not have the connections to the university or the community that he has). But that doesn't mean there won't be temptations along the way.

[boozehound]

Why do so many people think Wake Forest is a good job?

[LA Muskie]

Why do so many people think Wake Forest is a good job?
Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying it is. I'm just saying it could be a dark-horse.

[DC Muskie]

I could totally see Mack going to Wake.

[Xavgrad08]

I am not worried about losing Chris to Illinois. I think Chris will stay for a while and see how far he can take Xavier. However, at some point coaches always leave. Guys like Boheim, K and Izzo are the exception, not the norm.

I am a little worried about losing Travis Steele. If Groce ends up at Illinois I could see him wanting his step brother Travis on staff.

[KabeX]

If I recall correctly, the deal they worked out with Sean was for a five year commitment from Sean. If I also recall correctly, the IU job came up and the idea of Sean Miller jumping from Xavier to IU was squashed about as fast as it took for someone to consider the possibility. The IU job wasn't the only one that year, but I can't remember the other juicy job that hit the radar screen then.

I would have to believe that Bobinski provided Chris a similar agreement, in terms of commitment to stay, during their most recent contractual review/adjustment.

Beyond that, it's more than fair that some of us have these thoughts about the possibility of him leaving, especially given our experience with coaching turnover, but it just strikes me as an insane idea at this point for him to leave Xavier. He truly is a Xavier guy and I believe that matters. Just behind that is the fact that he is a Cincinnati guy.

Beyond all that is the obvious reality that there are risks in chasing more money.

Personally, I am comfortably certain that Chris Mack will be at Xavier for years, and that we'll love most of that time, even while we have our micro-bitches about this and that along the way.
This.
Permission to steal and use that term repeatedly even when not discussing anything hoops related.

[LadyMuskie]

I must be a bit confused. Hasn't Mack already done that?

Yes. But why let that fact get in the way of a good story?

In fact, you could make the argument that he took over the program that helped to mold two of his mentors/friends. But, again, that doesn't make as interesting a story.

[smileyy]

Mack is the Kwisatz Haderach, uniting the Gillen/Prosser legacy with the Matta/Miller lineage.

[Juice]

Gary Parrish ‏ @GaryParrishCBS
I can report that Shaka Smart has turned down Illinois for a final time and will stay at VCU.

[zanesxu]

mothership confirms...

http://espn.go.com/chicago/ncb/story/_/id/7718478/vcu-coach-shaka-smart-reportedly-turns-illinois

[xavierj]

mothership confirms...

http://espn.go.com/chicago/ncb/story/_/id/7718478/vcu-coach-shaka-smart-reportedly-turns-illinois

Sounds like their next coach will be an African American or at least is sounds like they are under pressure to make that happen.

[Muskie]

I really hope Mike Thomas pulls the trigger on the other candidate mentioned in the article:

Simeon Career Academy coach Robert Smith

Yeah... caught that in the article. That would be EPIC.

[DC Muskie]

I really hope Mike Thomas pulls the trigger on the other candidate mentioned in the article:

Simeon Career Academy coach Robert Smith

I love how he would only be the head coach.

Sure buddy. You want millions too? No problem.

Oh wait you suck at coaching in college, you can just go back to coaching high school.

Man that sounds like a great gig if you can get it.

[STL_XUfan]

I am starting to think Illinois's problem is in the front office. This is a terribly ran coaching search. Don't you have third parties discuss all of these coaching changes behind closed doors so that whoever you offer the job to actually says yes.

Illinois has now been publicly turned down by Shaka Smart. The search firm releases to the press that they were quietly turned down by Brad Stevens. And now it is out there that they are going after John Groce. If they don't get John Groce they will have been turned down by 3 "mid major" coaches. They are completely destroying the aura that they are a destination job. Not to mention whoever gets the job will deal with that the whole fan base knows they were the 3rd or 4th choice.

Thank god we have Mike Bobinski running our program.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketball/blog/eye-on-college-basketball/18047475/illinois-considering-ohio-universitys-john-groce

[smileyy]

Yeah, the IL administration and fans really need to hit the "objective pipe" and get an idea of who really wants to coach their program, and how much prestige their program has at this point. IL thinks they're a first rate program, but you're not, if you can't make those kinds of hires.

[boozehound]

Yeah, the IL administration and fans really need to hit the "objective pipe" and get an idea of who really wants to coach their program, and how much prestige their program has at this point. IL thinks they're a first rate program, but you're not, if you can't make those kinds of hires.

One has to wonder if the gap is closing between 'mid-major' coaching jobs and 'big time' jobs. Many non power conference schools are offering very nice salaries, possibly with more freedom and control than many 'power conference' programs. There seems to be more overall parity than ever before, witness Butler and VCU's recent runs, Xavier's sustained success, and Lehigh and Ohio University this year.

[smileyy]

I think so -- mostly in terms of coaches turning down the less desirable Big 6 jobs, rather than jumping at them as they had in the past.

Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me if Stevens and Smart are waiting for a job like Connecticut to open up. UCLA will also be wanting to make a huge splash with a hire should they decide to fire Howland.

If you look at other programs, how many of them that will have job openings will be anything but a lateral move for a Xavier coach?

[Cheesehead]

As I have said before in this thread and some blasted me. Illinois is not that great of a job, as evident by their top 2 choices saying thanks, but no thanks.