Conference carousel to start spinning again?

[LA Muskie]

Is that usual not to have specific dollar amounts if the contract is breached? What consequences would Wva have to face if they breach it, and the BE wants something in return?
They would face a lawsuit, both sides would hire expensive lawyers and damages experts (Ivy League economists), and a judge or jury would decide the damages suffered by the Big East as a result of WVU leaving early.

[GoMuskies]

The contract may contain a liquidated damages provision (very common because injunctive relief is so unlikely in breach of contract cases). Generally those would be litigated (legitimate liquidated damages amount or impermissible legal "penalty").

I guarantee that 27 month period does not have a liquidated damages provision. I can almost guarantee it has the opposite of a liquidated damages provision.

[paulxu]

2) given the BCS AQ situation, the Big East probably wants to keep WV around to strengthen its case over the next few years so they do not lose AQ status

That's hard to imagine. If the BE is at the table and says "see,we're worthy, we've got WVU"...and they aren't going to be in the conference the following year...that wouldn't seem to mean jack in the negotiations to remain an AQ.

ps. Go, why didn't you tell me Louisville was going to beat Syracuse? That cost me on the pick em's.

[GoMuskies]

I wish I'd have known. I thought about taking Cuse +3 but couldn't pull the trigger. Cuse was super flat after last weekend's performance against WV, and it's hard to see that coming.

[LA Muskie]

I guarantee that 27 month period does not have a liquidated damages provision. I can almost guarantee it has the opposite of a liquidated damages provision.
The opposite being a stipulated injunction? Maybe -- at the time of membership admission, the conference holds all the cards. But I don't think it would hold up. It would seem to be punitive in nature, injunctions are generally appropriate only where money damages would not suffice, and that just doesn't seem to be the case here.

[GoMuskies]

You may be right on whether the injunction would be allowed. I don't litigate, so I've got zero insight into how courts think. But I'm sure they wrote the contract to state that money damages would be insufficient and equitable remedies would be appropriate (because given the BCS AQ factor, damages do seem very difficult to calculate). Sort of like what you would see in a confidentiality agreement or a non-compete (which is what this is most akin to, really).

[LA Muskie]

You may be right on whether the injunction would be allowed. I don't litigate, so I've got zero insight into how courts think. But I'm sure they wrote the contract to state that money damages would be insufficient and equitable remedies would be appropriate (because given the BCS AQ factor, damages do seem very difficult to calculate). Sort of like what you would see in a confidentiality agreement or a non-compete (which is what this is most akin to, really).
Agreed. The problem is that this isn't a confidentiality issue, and non-competes are rarely enforced (they are, by their nature, anticompetitive). I agree about the BCS issues in a vacuum, but with everything else going on, it'd e tough to pin the blame on WVU.

[GoMuskies]

Are non-competes actually rarely enforced? I know that's true in California, but as long as they are narrowly tailored enough on scope of activity, tied to consideration (not sure what the consideration WV might have received here) and somewhat geographically limited, I think non-competes are generally enforced by most courts. I think a lot of them probably get tossed for being horribly drafted or the result of disproportionate bargaining power, and I'm not sure those issues are present here.

[LA Muskie]

Are non-competes actually rarely enforced? I know that's true in California, but as long as they are narrowly tailored enough on scope of activity, tied to consideration (not sure what the consideration WV might have received here) and somewhat geographically limited, I think non-competes are generally enforced by most courts. I think a lot of them probably get tossed for being horribly drafted or the result of disproportionate bargaining power, and I'm not sure those issues are present here.

Certainly in CA. Might be more palatable in other areas, but I still think they are generally disfavored in most contexts (again, because they are anticompetitive). The most obvious exceptions are for the sale of a business, or where the employee has significant confidential, commercially-sensitive information. Non-competes are enforced in those instances, even out here in the wild, wild west.

[Founding Father]

http://eye-on-collegefootball.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/24156338/33047734

[paulxu]

Well, that'll get Go's heart going.

[xubrew]

I think the only Big Twelve school that really wants to stay at ten teams is Texas. I have no idea why. Oklahoma wants to go back out to twelve.

eleven makes even less sense than ten. It is fewer OOC games, more people to share revenue with, and no championship game.

...and I seriously doubt BYU will be added. The article says the Big Twelve lost interest in BYU. That's one way of putting it, I guess.

So, after BYU said they didn't want to join, the Big Twelve lost interest in them.

[LA Muskie]

http://eye-on-collegefootball.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/24156338/33047734

Despite their public statements, I'd be shocked if Louisville doesn't end up in the Big XII. (Then again, very little of this has gone according to anyone's "plan" and I know even less than almost all of them...)

[GoMuskies]

Well, that'll get Go's heart going.

I'm immune at this point. When there's a Big XII logo on the field at Papa John's Cardinal Stadium, I'll believe it.

[pizza delivery]

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
by LanceMcAlister
West Virginia to file suit against Big East so it may join Big 12 next year, according to document obtained by @CBSSports


FTalk CollegeFootballTalk
by BearcatsBlog
WVU lawsuit states that Louisville/Rutgers/Cincinnati have been engaged in discussions with, among others, the Big Ten & SEC.
4 minutes ago

[LA Muskie]

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
by LanceMcAlister
West Virginia to file suit against Big East so it may join Big 12 next year, according to document obtained by @CBSSports


FTalk CollegeFootballTalk
by BearcatsBlog
WVU lawsuit states that Louisville/Rutgers/Cincinnati have been engaged in discussions with, among others, the Big Ten & SEC.
4 minutes ago
As a lawyer, I like it. Takes the quiver out of the Big East's arrow. And gives WVU the home court advantage.
EDIT: For your viewing pleasure, the complaint is here (http://www.wvmetronews.com/content/File/wvu_vs_be.pdf).
EDIT #2: Interesting read. If the complaint is to be believed (and keep in mind that it's only 1 side of a multi-faceted story), the BB schools are in fact flexing their muscles...

[pizza delivery]

Mengus22 Mark Ennis
by BearcatsBlog
Seems to the non-legal eye, if West Virginia is right, then the bylaws don't apply to anyone anymore. Everyone's free to go.

[LA Muskie]

Mengus22 Mark Ennis
by BearcatsBlog
Seems to the non-legal eye, if West Virginia is right, then the bylaws don't apply to anyone anymore. Everyone's free to go.

They are certainly the guinea pig, and if the Big East loses it will be tough for them to force any other schools to comply. That said, this is really just a negotiation strategy. Odds of this going to a determination by a court (preliminarily or conclusively) are pretty low. WVU is trying to create downside risk for the Big East.

In terms of the merits, I thought I had heard that the 27-month holding period did not apply to TCU because it had not formally "joined" the conference yet. But if it's true that the requirement technically applied to TCU as well, but the BE did not hold them to it, that's a pretty damning fact.

Also damning is the fact that the Big East is trying to force several of its members to stay on the sinking ship.

I'm much less persuaded by the technical breach arguments, and the breach of fiduciary duty positions seem very shallow.

[waggy]

And they want, no Demand, a trial by jury in Monongalia County, WV.

:D

[GoMuskies]

Removal to federal court coming.

[xudash]

As a lawyer, I like it. Takes the quiver out of the Big East's arrow. And gives WVU the home court advantage.
EDIT: For your viewing pleasure, the complaint is here (http://www.wvmetronews.com/content/File/wvu_vs_be.pdf).
EDIT #2: Interesting read. If the complaint is to be believed (and keep in mind that it's only 1 side of a multi-faceted story), the BB schools are in fact flexing their muscles...

You're probably right, in that the BE, given that it is the BE, would try to ram a quiver into an arrow, though most people keep their arrows in their quiver.

[X-band '01]

Good luck finding a neutral court for this case.


Sent from my iPhone

[LA Muskie]

You're probably right, in that the BE, given that it is the BE, would try to ram a quiver into an arrow, though most people keep their arrows in their quiver.
Ha! Touche!

[LA Muskie]

Removal to federal court coming.
True. But removal to federal court in West Virginia is still the home court -- albeit more like US Bank than Cintas.

[GoMuskies]

The complaint is incorrect at paragraph 11. Georgetown, Villanova and UConn all competed in NCAA Division I football in 2000.

[Muskie]

If we join the Big East eventually... will this marinatto guy be the commish? Some people make fun of A-10 leaders but ... it could be worse?

[GoMuskies]

Looks like a "Hail Mary" and pretty weak legal arguments to me. Their problem seems to be with Syracuse, Pitt and TCU, frankly. "Commercial impractibility" is unlikely here. Courts don't save you from a bad deal you signed up willingly for. It would be pretty hard for them to claim that in 2008 they didn't see this as a possibility, so circumstances haven't really changed. Plus, Pitt and the Cuse are sticking it out for the 27 months, so the situation during their 27 months will basically be the same as what they signed up for in '08. And not doing a good job is not the same as breach of fiduciary obligations.

If this is the best WV's got, I expect they're 27 months away from playing in the Big XII.

[Masterofreality]

If we join the Big East eventually... will this marinatto guy be the commish? Some people make fun of A-10 leaders but ... it could be worse?

This.

Marinatto is the illegitimate son of Linda Blutarsky.

Beware

[Muskie]

I kinda like their argument that they let TCU out for $5mill. I haven't read the complaint or anything, but if I'm a Federal Magistrate that's something I can sink my teeth into and possibly bully both sides with at a settlement conference (which for those of us that know the Federal Courts: realize that's exactly where this thing ends up).

[GoMuskies]

I kinda like their argument that they let TCU out for $5mill. I haven't read the complaint or anything, but if I'm a Federal Magistrate that's something I can sink my teeth into and possibly bully both sides with at a settlement conference (which for those of us that know the Federal Courts: realize that's exactly where this thing ends up).

TCU and WV aren't exactly similarly situated. It's pretty different to tell a team that has never joined your conference to pay their money and go away as opposed to a team that has been playing football in your conference for 15 years.

[waggy]

I saw mentioned somewhere that WVU gave the BE a check for $21M to leave right away, and that the BE took it. Maybe the BE had second thoughts after accepting it, which led to the suit. Filing suit like this seems pretty dickish to me, so I would hope that there was some sort of negotiations prior to it devolving to this.

[Muskie]

TCU and WV aren't exactly similarly situated. It's pretty different to tell a team that has never joined your conference to pay their money and go away as opposed to a team that has been playing football in your conference for 15 years.

True. But they can't say they hold everyone to their contract. Which is was their commish said.

[GoMuskies]

True. But they can't say they hold everyone to their contract. Which is was their commish said.

Not sure that holds much weight as a legal matter. I'm sure they have your standard "a waiver for one is not a waiver for all" clause in the bylaws, and it's very easy to distinguish the TCU situation from the WV situation.

[Muskie]

Not sure that holds much weight as a legal matter. I'm sure they have your standard "a waiver for one is not a waiver for all" clause in the bylaws, and it's very easy to distinguish the TCU situation from the WV situation.

It would definitely depend on what the by-laws say, agree.

[xudash]

No one in the mess that is the BE appears to have taken some time to consider the ill will that will exist between these various parties for the next 27 months.

Contractual issues and obligations aside, this is supposed to be a WORKING/WORKABLE affiliation. They appear to be getting to the point where they feel a need to fuss over the shape of the peace table before they'll sit down to discuss terms. Good luck with 27 months of people behaving like that.

Would someone please double the budget for security for this season's BE Tournament in MSG.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

"Let’s Convince Big East To Be a Hoops Conference"

http://www.beyondusports.com/convince-big-east-hoops-conference/

[xubrew]

The Big East has....

-considered inviting Boise State, which isn't even in eastern Idaho, much less the eastern part of the country.

-Invited TCU, which is neither big, nor east.

-Had TCU leave before ever really being a member.

-talked about going out to 24 full members

-Increased the exit fee to show solidarity, while at the same time all actively looking to join other conferences

-has been sued by one of its members (West Virginia) on the grounds that the conference now sucks, and therefore has failed to meet its obligations to WVU, so WVU should not have any obligations to the league in regards to exit fees and timetables (that's my personal favorite).

-Turned down a billion dollar offer from ESPN because Pitt encouraged them to. Pitt then left.

-Rick Pitino and Geno Auriemma have become the self appointed spokespersons, and have really done the league no favors.

-Now, they're talking about adding up to six new members.

I can't wait to see what happens next.

[Founding Father]

"Let’s Convince Big East To Be a Hoops Conference"

http://www.beyondusports.com/convince-big-east-hoops-conference/

I like where his head's at but listing Temple, UMASS, Memphis, Charlotte and South Florida in this new basketball focused league shows that this guys doesn't know much as all 5 play or will play DI football.

Also, assuming the bball only 7 stay together there is no reason to invite VCU, Richmond or Dayton.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

markcviera Mark Viera
Big East presidents voted to extend invitations to football and nonfootball members.

markcviera Mark Viera
Big East Commissioner John Marinatto declined to say what schools, or how many, would be added. The goal is to get to 12 football schools.

markcviera Mark Viera
Should have written: voted to add football-only and all-sports members. But could beef up basketball presence after reaching 12 in football.

[xudash]

markcviera Mark Viera
Big East presidents voted to extend invitations to football and nonfootball members.

markcviera Mark Viera
Big East Commissioner John Marinatto declined to say what schools, or how many, would be added. The goal is to get to 12 football schools.

markcviera Mark Viera
Should have written: voted to add football-only and all-sports members. But could beef up basketball presence after reaching 12 in football.

Well, if we're joining this time around, that would appear to be the pinhole that we'll go through to get there, assuming the conference tells UC to shut the f&*k up when our name comes up. So now for a little math:

12 Football

Providence
St. Johns
Seton Hall
Villanova
Georgetown
Marquette
DePaul
Notre Dame

8 Basketball

20 Sub-total (assuming ND sticks around)

Do you balance this madness and go to 24 with 4 added for hoops? Probably not, because the revenue numbers wouldn't work.

The hoops schools would be left to protect themselves in the new/modified BE agreement. Perhaps specific language that details voting and decisions from the point where programs like UConn, Rutgers and UL pack up and leave.


Ultimate football/all-sports departures anticipated:

UConn
Rutgers
UL

That would knock the football side down to 9 teams versus 7/8 (ND) for the hoops, which implies from one to two hoops additions now. In other words, the hoops schools would be saying that they'll tie themselves to this mast one more time in an effort to save BE football and its AQ status. However, if that fails, they'll be no worse off than an equal voting block for future moves, with their football counterparts in disarray at that point anyway.

[xnatic03]

Well, if we're joining this time around, that would appear to be the pinhole that we'll go through to get there, assuming the conference tells UC to shut the f&*k up when our name comes up. So now for a little math:

12 Football

Providence
St. Johns
Seton Hall
Villanova
Georgetown
Marquette
DePaul
Notre Dame

8 Basketball

20 Sub-total (assuming ND sticks around)

Do you balance this madness and go to 24 with 4 added for hoops? Probably not, because the revenue numbers wouldn't work.

The hoops schools would be left to protect themselves in the new/modified BE agreement. Perhaps specific language that details voting and decisions from the point where programs like UConn, Rutgers and UL pack up and leave.


Ultimate football/all-sports departures anticipated:

UConn
Rutgers
UL

That would knock the football side down to 9 teams versus 7/8 (ND) for the hoops, which implies from one to two hoops additions now. In other words, the hoops schools would be saying that they'll tie themselves to this mast one more time in an effort to save BE football and its AQ status. However, if that fails, they'll be no worse off than an equal voting block for future moves, with their football counterparts in disarray at that point anyway.

Dash, keep in mind that 3 of the 12 football schools will likely be football only, so that leaves you with 17 basketball (possibly 16 if Notre Dame takes their talents elsewhere). I'd bet that the schools they are inviting will have an easy out clause if schools like the current Big East football teams leave for greener pastures.

[xudash]

Dash, keep in mind that 3 of the 12 football schools will likely be football only, so that leaves you with 17 basketball (possibly 16 if Notre Dame takes their talents elsewhere). I'd bet that the schools they are inviting will have an easy out clause if schools like the current Big East football teams leave for greener pastures.

Great point. Forgot about that. So now I wonder what voting rights the football-only's would have.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Looks like Houston, SMU, and UCF will be the first to accept

schadjoe Joe Schad
Look for UCF, Houston and SMU to be the first group to walk through the door to the new Big East

[SixFig]

Looks like Houston, SMU, and UCF will be the first to accept

schadjoe Joe Schad
Look for UCF, Houston and SMU to be the first group to walk through the door to the new Big East

RIP conference USA?

[Muskie]

RIP conference USA?

Not very enticing basketball wise.

[Founding Father]

Not very enticing basketball wise.

Come on ACC, bail out UCONN!

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

PeteThamelNYT Pete Thamel

After Big East gets to 12, it will consider the 14/18 notion. Hoops schools have a huge say and want additions.

thebeatofsports the beat of sports
Still believe Temple/Memphis in play for all sports to Big East and bb only candidates will include Butler, Xavier, Dayton

Bearcats_Nation Chris Bains
Wait. Knowing the Big East, it will prolly be Xavier, Butler, Dayton, Temple as non-FB members.
3 hours ago Favorite Retweet Reply

BearcatsBlog
BearcatsBlog BearcatsBlog
The Big East is going to invite non-football members? This is getting out of control. Maybe Xavier joins the Big East.

[pizza delivery]

Obama needs to step and say "fuck this shit, I'm picking teams". Boehner can have a seat next to him. This is all getting too jacked up.

[xudash]

Many here adamantly believe that UC would always block us from joining the BE if they remained a part of it.

I've changed my mind on that completely now for two reasons:


UC won't have much of a voice in these present negotiations and it won't have enough allies to get vocal against us anyway; and
I don't think they'll block us anyway, because they know and the league knows that it needs enticing rivalries to remain relevant. Allegedly, the XU/UC rivalry is one of the best going.


Butler's recent success will make it a viable candidate, but Xavier has the best non-BCS program going, period. I would imagine we end up #1 in the que if they in fact invite non-football schools.

[waggy]

If Temple goes in for all sports, then I would think Villanova would get the nod to go all sports as well. They're running out of teams they can invite anyway, so might as well, and they probably aren't much worse than adding Memphis.

Edit: That being the case, I would expect at least 1 bball only school to be added.

[BMoreX]

Nationally ranked Boise State and Houston along with SMU and UCF could be added as Big East members by Friday, college football industry sources told CBSSports.com.

On Tuesday in Philadelphia, the Big East’s presidents and chancellors authorized league commissioner John Marinatto to issue invitations to those schools – along with Navy and Air Force – sources said.

However, Boise State, Houston, SMU and UCF prefer to be announced as league members together and must wait until Boise State’s board meeting on Thursday. There have been no “official invitations” extended to the schools, but Marinatto has been in constant contact and spoke to representatives of all six schools after Tuesday’s meeting.
Following Tuesday's Big East meeting in Philadelphia, representatives from those four schools – plus Navy – held a conference call. All four schools are “100 percent” on board in joining together with the only possible hang-up being Boise State finding a conference home for its Olympic sports – most likely the WAC or West Coast Conference.

Navy has told the other schools on Tuesday's call it “is definitely in” and Air Force is expected to join once Navy commits to the Big East, a source said.
http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssport...32522/33074577

[DC Muskie]

When can we start calling this group of schools The Big Conference USA of the East?

I think it's funny that Houston wants to be in a conference with Rutgers. And no shit they all want Boise State to come in, because they are by far the best team and will single handily keep the football side alive.

[Giacomazzi]

Once this all goes down, can we just start calling this conference what it really is?

Conference USA.

[bleedXblue]

Once this all goes down, can we just start calling this conference what it really is?

Conference USA.

Or better yet, how about the Big East Cluster _ _ _ _

[GoMuskies]

The Big East will actually be a better football league, but I can't see it being worth ruining the basketball league.

[DC Muskie]

The Big East will actually be a better football league, but I can't see it being worth ruining the basketball league.

See the ACC, minus the better football of course.

[GoMuskies]

The Big East will probably still be better than the ACC in football (as they have been in most years).

[bleedXblue]

The Big East isn't going to sit still and not address the loss of 3 quality basketball programs.

It may not happen right away b/c they have to "shore up" the football situation in a hurry.

[Founding Father]

I don't understand why the bball 7 and ND are okay with adding UCF, SMU and Houston for bball. If the league can invite football only teams in Air Force, Navy and Boise, why not invite the first three as football onlies as well.

[SM#24]

I don't understand why the bball 7 and ND are okay with adding UCF, SMU and Houston for bball. If the league can invite football only teams in Air Force, Navy and Boise, why not invite the first three as football onlies as well.

Dallas, Houston & Orlando TV markets

[GoMuskies]

Michael Jordan's kid plays for UCF. Thus, it all makes sense.

[Founding Father]

Dallas, Houston & Orlando TV markets

No one watches UCF and SMU.

Anyway, they can still add them for football only. Why do they need to be added for bball and why would the bball onlies want to add those three for bball. Just invite them as football onlies and you get those markets.

[SM#24]

No one watches UCF and SMU.

Anyway, they can still add them for football only. Why do they need to be added for bball and why would the bball onlies want to add those three for bball. Just invite them as football onlies and you get those markets.

My guess is the bball package is priced separate or a separate component of a bundle. The bb7 must feel they enhance the value of the bb portion to make it worth it.

I realize that SMU & Houston take a back seat to UT and A&M in their markets, but a small piece of a very large market, is pretty good.

[Founding Father]

My guess is the bball package is priced separate or a separate component of a bundle. The bb7 must feel they enhance the value of the bb portion to make it worth it.

I realize that SMU & Houston take a back seat to UT and A&M in their markets, but a small piece of a very large market, is pretty good.

I don't see how or any real upside to adding SMU and UCF as full members.

[BMoreX]

McMurphyCBSBrett McMurphy
Boise State's Board of Education gives Pres. Bob Kustra authorization to join Big East as football-only member

[xubrew]

Great point. Forgot about that. So now I wonder what voting rights the football-only's would have.

Probably none.


RIP conference USA?

I'm pretty sure CUSA will want to stay at a twelve team format, although personally I think they'd do just fine with eight or nine. Louisiana Tech, Troy, Western Kentucky and Middle Tennessee would join CUSA in a heartbeat. It's my understanding that in the past, even Temple has expressed interest. I have no idea why, but if it's true, I think Temple would be a major score for CUSA.


I don't see how or any real upside to adding SMU and UCF as full members.

I agree, but this is probably not even in the top twenty of the most insanely illogical things the Big East has done within the past year. UCF makes a little bit of sense. I think Donnie Jones is a good coach, and that they're trending up as a program. They also make a good rival and travle partner for USF. They have nice facilities and there is a growing buzz around their basketball program.

SMU, on hte other hand, is abysmal. They are a weak team that plays in front of small crowds. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if SMU averaged less fans over the course of an entire season than many Big East teams draw for just one game.

[STL_XUfan]

McMurphyCBSBrett McMurphy
Boise State's Board of Education gives Pres. Bob Kustra authorization to join Big East as football-only member

24 hours between posts in this thread.....This must mean basketball season is close. :logo:

[American X]

TCU and WV aren't exactly similarly situated. It's pretty different to tell a team that has never joined your conference to pay their money and go away as opposed to a team that has been playing football in your conference for 15 years.

Exactly, so West Virginia should just return to where they came from.

Think how awesome would it be for Xavier to play a Huggins squad every year!!!!

[LA Muskie]

I have to admit that while I generally am not anti-ESPN, their coverage of the Big East right now is a joke. They avoid reporting on almost anything negative -- and when there is something negative they try to concoct a "positive" to overshadow it. (For example, essentially reporting that WVU is leaving but Louisville is staying, and then taking the position that Louisville was really the lynchpin.)

Today they report that Boise State has been authorized by its board to pursue the Big East, and then claim that there's more money to be had in the Big East now -- and even a bigger pot in the future, given their upcoming contract renewal. As if anything the Big East made on media contracts in the past has any relevance now, without several of its stalwart members (and several others looking for an out).

[paulxu]

2,100 posts, mostly about football, on a basketball forum. Arrrrrrrrrgh.

[SM#24]

Interesting TV revenue numbers I plucked out of ESPN the Mag article on conference realignment (per school amounts).

Big 10 - $19.7m
Pac 12 - $18.9m
SEC - $17.1m
Big 12 - $15m
ACC - $13m
Big East (fb) - $3.2m
Mt West - $1.5m
CUSA - $1.2m

ND - $15m
Big East (bb) - $1.6m

[paulxu]

I've probably lost a team in the shuffle somewhere, but here's what I don't understand.

8 football schools in BE. They turned down $1.2 billion from ESPN (9 year deal)
That's $19 million/year/school if they don't share with BB schools.

OK, Syr/Pitt/WVA are going soon. Conn/Rutg maybe close behind

Replace with UCF/SMU/Houston/AirForce/Navy
Their current average rankings in 120 Div 1 teams are: 79/45/13/70/92

Whatever ESPN's interest is from now on (I refuse to say go...forw...), I can't believe it's going to be $19 million/year/school. If you are Louisville/Cincinnati/USF...you should be really pissed off at the league (or yourselves if you voted the ESPN deal down).

[XUglow]

Interesting TV revenue numbers I plucked out of ESPN the Mag article on conference realignment (per school amounts).

Big 10 - $19.7m
Pac 12 - $18.9m
SEC - $17.1m
Big 12 - $15m
ACC - $13m
Big East (fb) - $3.2m
Mt West - $1.5m
CUSA - $1.2m

ND - $15m
Big East (bb) - $1.6m

SEC figures are going WAY up very soon. MO AD put it to their Board of Regents that it would be $12M to $13M over what they currently get to put it into the $25M range.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

SEC figures are going WAY up very soon. MO AD put it to their Board of Regents that it would be $12M to $13M over what they currently get to put it into the $25M range.

And they are getting a their own network deal soon that will follow in the Big 10's footsteps. SEC is going to rake in the dough

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Should Air Force not want to join with Boise State, the Big East has interest in BYU and....wait for it....

San Diego State

[bleedXblue]

No one watches Big East football unless your a direct fan of a program.

There can't be much money there with what they have left and the schools that are coming in are not very attractive either.

YAWN

[GoMuskies]

Boise's not attractive?

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Boise's not attractive?

Big East football

http://img2.timeinc.net/ew/dynamic/imgs/080929/Nude-Scenes/Kathy-Bates-Schmidt_l.jpg

[SM#24]

Interesting TV revenue numbers I plucked out of ESPN the Mag article on conference realignment (per school amounts).

Big 10 - $19.7m
Pac 12 - $18.9m
SEC - $17.1m
Big 12 - $15m
ACC - $13m
Big East (fb) - $3.2m
Mt West - $1.5m
CUSA - $1.2m

ND - $15m
Big East (bb) - $1.6m


SEC figures are going WAY up very soon. MO AD put it to their Board of Regents that it would be $12M to $13M over what they currently get to put it into the $25M range.

The article wasn't totally clear, but I believe these were either 2010 or projected 2011amounts.

[bleedXblue]

Boise's not attractive?

Not really and I can't watch them play at home on that blue field either. Totally annoying. I get a headache just thinking about it.

[GoMuskies]

What makes Boise unattractive in football? And if you find Boise unattractive in football (blue field aside), why do you think anyone not associated with Xavier should find Xavier attractive in basketball?

[xubrew]

Boise's ratings are quite good. Their game against Virginia Tech last year was the second most watched game. The national title game was the first. The game against Georgia this year actually had very good ratings, which is surprising since it was up against Oregon v LSU.

For whatever reason, people tune in when Bosie plays. That, along with the fact that Boise is going for their fifth top ten finish in six years in the BCS standings makes them EXTREMELY attractive. Given the choice, I'm sure the Fiesta Bowl would have loved to have Boise instead of UConn last year.

[GoMuskies]

Boise's the Gonzaga of college football (except that, unlike Gonzaga in basketball, Boise football has actually accomplished something).

[paulxu]

What makes Boise unattractive in football?


Boise's ratings are quite good. Their game against Virginia Tech last year was the second most watched game. The national title game was the first. The game against Georgia this year actually had very good ratings, which is surprising since it was up against Oregon v LSU.

Boise v. Georgia, VT, etc. = good

Boise v. USF, SMU, etc. = not so good

[bleedXblue]

Boise v. Georgia, VT, etc. = good

Boise v. USF, SMU, etc. = not so good

Exactly. I was trying to express that the "league" isn't very attractive.

Boise in a BCS championship game. Yes.

Boise vs. any other Big East team. Not at all.

[SM#24]

Who knows, Boise St-UC could surpass USC-ND as the #1 inter-sectional rivalry.
Or maybe it will be Rutgers-Houston.

[xavierj]

Does anyone know how many Big East conference football games the Big East will play? Right now Boise gets to kind of make their schedule and they have played Georgia, Oregon and VA Tech recently to get them exposure. I am not so sure now those teams will be all that interested in playing Boise and they will have to get their exposure playing across country against UC, South Florida, Central Florida, UCONN, SMU, Houston and Louisville. That screams unattractive in my opinion.

[GoMuskies]

They've been playing 7 or 8 conference games in recent years. That shouldn't change (maybe goes from 7 to 8). They've only been playing 1 or 2 "marquee" OOC games, so if it goes from 7 to 8 there should be little effect on their non-conference scheduling.

[X-band '01]

Big East football

http://img2.timeinc.net/ew/dynamic/imgs/080929/Nude-Scenes/Kathy-Bates-Schmidt_l.jpg

So the ACC would be...

http://photo.who2.com/photos/rosieodonnell/11_500.jpg

At least now we know who came up with the Bob Huggins suit.

[GoMuskies]

ESPN is reporting Mizzou to SEC, so apparently it's finally done. They "didn't want to upstage Bama/LSU" by announcing earlier. Pretty sure there was never much danger of friggin Mizzou upending LSU and Bama.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/7197599/missouri-move-sec-planned-week-source-says

[xudash]

"The Big 12 needs 10 schools to meet television agreements, but more importantly, to fill scheduling dates. The Big 12 already replaced Texas A&M with TCU for 2012."

So how does this work - how do they get to 10 with Mizzou out the door and WVU in court?

[paulxu]

Maybe WVU will pull a Carson, and just sit out next year's games if it doesn't get traded.

[SM#24]

It's quiet out there in conference re-alignment land.........almost, too quiet.

[xudash]

It's quiet out there in conference re-alignment land.........almost, too quiet.

I think we're all waiting to see if the "Western Division" of the "Big East" is going to come together or not.

I'm biased, but I see that as a role of the dice, as I am assuming that it puts all the marbles on Boise State as the program that helps the BE retain its AQ status. I'm not sure how the math works for determining the grade that keeps a conference in it or blows a conference out of it (AQ status).

What's to keep the B1G, SEC and Pac14 from changing the BCS rules anyway when the contract comes up for renewal.

Beyond all that, there have to be logistical issues with spreading out this much.

[X-band '01]

I think we're all waiting to see if the "Western Division" of the "Big East" is going to come together or not.

I'm biased, but I see that as a role of the dice, as I am assuming that it puts all the marbles on Boise State as the program that helps the BE retain its AQ status. I'm not sure how the math works for determining the grade that keeps a conference in it or blows a conference out of it (AQ status).

What's to keep the B1G, SEC and Pac14 from changing the BCS rules anyway when the contract comes up for renewal.

Beyond all that, there have to be logistical issues with spreading out this much.

Isn't pure luck the "role" that dice plays?

[GoMuskies]

I would like to point out that not a damned thing has happened on this front in over a week.

[GoMuskies]

The Big East ain't dying. BYU is apparently likely to join for football only now (according the Salt Lake Tribune tweets). With Boise and BYU coming in (and Houston), I think it's fairly certain that the Big East keeps its BCS bid.

Here's an Idaho Stateman link: http://voices.idahostatesman.com/2011/11/15/bmurphy/report_byu_big_east_close_agreement

[xavierj]

The Big East ain't dying. BYU is apparently likely to join for football only now (according the Salt Lake Tribune tweets). With Boise and BYU coming in (and Houston), I think it's fairly certain that the Big East keeps its BCS bid.

Here's an Idaho Stateman link: http://voices.idahostatesman.com/2011/11/15/bmurphy/report_byu_big_east_close_agreement

Yeah and logistically that is the dumbest league in the history of sports.

[GoMuskies]

Yeah and logistically that is the dumbest league in the history of sports.

Not even close. For one, it's football only, so not that big a deal. For two, the WAC had Hawaii and Louisiana Tech in the same league for all sports. Hands down, logistically the dumbest league in the history of sports.

[BandAid]

Utah and BYU totally screwed over the MWC. Imagine all of this going down with the Mountain West sitting with these ten teams:

Boise State
TCU
BYU
Utah
Air Force
New Mexico
UNLV
San Diego State
Colorado State
Wyoming

With those teams, they could've been looking to poach a C-USA or WAC team or two (think Houston, SMU, or Fresno St.) and be a serious force to be reckoned with. But no, the Utah schools left, TCU follows, and now the conference is hosed...again.




Of course growing up in Colorado Springs down the road from the Air Force Academy with a father in the service might have biased my opinions on the matter...

[GoMuskies]

http://www.news9.com/category/112033/sports

Oklahoma president David Boren says in an interview that he wants the Big XII to add Louisville.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

BYU to the Big East is NOT happening now...

Looks like San Diego State is the Big East next target

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7271078/byu-ends-negotiations-not-join-big-east-according-report

[xavierj]

BYU to the Big East is NOT happening now...

Looks like San Diego State is the Big East next target

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7271078/byu-ends-negotiations-not-join-big-east-according-report

Screw it they might as well add Hawaii and maybe a team from Japan.

[GoMuskies]

maybe a team from Japan.

The Big Far East?

I think it's time to give up.

[Masterofreality]

The Big Far East?

I think it's time to give up.

Yeah, they keep going west and they'll wind up East again. Is there a University of Vladivostok that plays football?

[SM#24]

At this point, they should just put up the Help Wanted sign and make it first come, first serve.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Looks like Boise State is getting cold feet now (Rightfully so)

@wilnerhotline
Jon Wilner
BE's uncertain future has Boise State unsure of its next move. If AQs are eliminated in next BCS cycle, no reason for BSU to be in BE


@wilnerhotline
Jon Wilner
Also told that ADs from FBS schools believe Rutgers & UConn could head to ACC and BE would cease to exist as fball conf

wilnerhotline Jon Wilner
Source: "The ACC will go to 16.''

[Masterofreality]

Looks like Boise State is getting cold feet now (Rightfully so)

@wilnerhotline
Jon Wilner
BE's uncertain future has Boise State unsure of its next move. If AQs are eliminated in next BCS cycle, no reason for BSU to be in BE


@wilnerhotline
Jon Wilner
Also told that ADs from FBS schools believe Rutgers & UConn could head to ACC and BE would cease to exist as fball conf

wilnerhotline Jon Wilner
Source: "The ACC will go to 16.''

Meanwhile, NO ONE is courting SucKS.

Sure helps it's case when they get 4,500 for basketball games and can't come close to selling out that garbage pit on campus for football. Conferences stand in line for that!

[xudash]

Looks like Boise State is getting cold feet now (Rightfully so)

@wilnerhotline
Jon Wilner
BE's uncertain future has Boise State unsure of its next move. If AQs are eliminated in next BCS cycle, no reason for BSU to be in BE


@wilnerhotline
Jon Wilner
Also told that ADs from FBS schools believe Rutgers & UConn could head to ACC and BE would cease to exist as fball conf

wilnerhotline Jon Wilner
Source: "The ACC will go to 16.''

This makes a great deal of sense to me. The reality of it is that the ACC remains very deficient in football, especially relative to its chief geographic rival - the SEC, which it will never be capable of fully competing against anyway.

In essence, the ACC CANNOT DO NOTHING. It has to take some form of action to improve its overall stature with respect to finding a more compelling grouping for television money. Basically, those additions would be about quantity in search of quality. Rutgers and UConn don't deliver quality in spades as programs go, but they deliver - by definition, if not literally - strong markets. They also probably provide BC the ability to reverse dying on the vine as it has in the ACC.

BC is wrong to block UConn in that regard, btw. Bring them in and allow a natural rival to develop. BC's recruiting probably would improve in the ACC if it had UConn, Pitt, Syracuse, and Rutgers hanging around with it.

Conference realignment always was about television money. It only became about AQ status for the BE after the Big XII stabilized. With AQ going away, it wouldn't be surprising for the ACC to make those additions to attempt to bolster its television package.

It certainly is not shocking that Boise State is cooling to the idea of envisioning Idaho as being proximate to the Atlantic Ocean.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

This makes a great deal of sense to me. The reality of it is that the ACC remains very deficient in football, especially relative to its chief geographic rival - the SEC, which it will never be capable of fully competing against anyway.

In essence, the ACC CANNOT DO NOTHING. It has to take some form of action to improve its overall stature with respect to finding a more compelling grouping for television money. Basically, those additions would be about quantity in search of quality. Rutgers and UConn don't deliver quality in spades as programs go, but they deliver - by definition, if not literally - strong markets. They also probably provide BC the ability to reverse dying on the vine as it has in the ACC.

BC is wrong to block UConn in that regard, btw. Bring them in and allow a natural rival to develop. BC's recruiting probably would improve in the ACC if it had UConn, Pitt, Syracuse, and Rutgers hanging around with it.

Conference realignment always was about television money. It only became about AQ status for the BE after the Big XII stabilized. With AQ going away, it wouldn't be surprising for the ACC to make those additions to attempt to bolster its television package.

It certainly is not shocking that Boise State is cooling to the idea of envisioning Idaho as being proximate to the Atlantic Ocean.

If the ACC does indeed go to 16, and the SEC & Big12 follow suit, the biggest loser after the Big East would be the Pac 12.

Larry Scott had a chance to bring in Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, Texas, and Texas Tech. He declined. I'm sure he will regret that decision if/when the above scenario plays out

[xudash]

Jimmy,

I have to wonder about the SEC at this point. It pretty much has it nutted, having grabbed a little of Texas and Missouri. The question remains what it's been since this latest realignment activity cranked up earlier this year: what can we do as a conference to improve our product for television? Any additions now would have to be absolutely accretive to the contract. Texas (Longhorns) may be able to provide that. Who knows from there.

The SEC certainly doesn't have to worry about getting to post-season money, in whatever form it comes in the BCS's future, so it isn't about a disappearing AQ format for it.

[xubrew]

I've been away from this thread for over a month, but thought it was worth mentioning that the Big East is after San Diego State, and the Aztecs are in "no hurry."

SDSU isn't even in eastern California. They also have no football tradition to speak of, and they're telling the Big East they'll think it over. Wow.

This isn't even grasping at straws. The picture has shattered and they're using Elmer's glue to try and put it back together.

The most recent count for the football lineup is

Louisville - wants out. Would go to B12 if they go to a twelve team format
UConn - wants out
South Florida
Rutgers - would go to the ACC
Cincinnati - would go to the B12
UCF - all kinds of probation
Houston
SMU - despite their history, they're the clean program in this whole mix

Boise may also join if another western team joins

San Diego State, who prior to last season had not had a winning record since 1998, is thinking it over.


Are ya ready for some football!!!!


http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/29532522/33577375

[X-band '01]

Did Houston, UCF and SMU formally accept Big East bids? It's hard to keep track of who's still where and who's in court at this stage.

[xudash]

Did Houston, UCF and SMU formally accept Big East bids? It's hard to keep track of who's still where and who's in court at this stage.

There was an article in the Orlando paper not too long ago, complaining about how the UCF administration hadn't buttoned things up with the BE as of yet. I don't believe anything has happened since the BCS meetings in Chicago, where the big leak about the elimination of AQ status for conferences was let out.

[GoMuskies]

According to at least one football prospect, the Louisville football coaches are telling recruits that if they come to Louisville they will play in the Big XII.

http://www.bigeastcoastbias.com/2011/11/29/2596316/louisville-coaches-telling-recruits-theyre-headed-for-the-big-12

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Here you go Dash.





"One interesting rumor that I’ve heard more than once is that Xavier is quietly trying to enter the Big East through the back door for basketball. If that were to happen it would be fascinating to see how the Mid-Major Plus dominoes would fall were X to leave the A-10 for a league with St. John’s, Seton Hall, Marquette etc. Would Butler then try to make a move to the A-10? One things for sure if X were to move — Cincinnati would not be happy at all! not sure how solid the rumor is but it’s definitely out there in the coaching/basketball community."


http://www.nbebasketball.com/w3/2011-1126/mernagh-nuggets-from-weekend-so-far/

[xudash]

Here you go Dash.





"One interesting rumor that I’ve heard more than once is that Xavier is quietly trying to enter the Big East through the back door for basketball. If that were to happen it would be fascinating to see how the Mid-Major Plus dominoes would fall were X to leave the A-10 for a league with St. John’s, Seton Hall, Marquette etc. Would Butler then try to make a move to the A-10? One things for sure if X were to move — Cincinnati would not be happy at all! not sure how solid the rumor is but it’s definitely out there in the coaching/basketball community."


http://www.nbebasketball.com/w3/2011-1126/mernagh-nuggets-from-weekend-so-far/

I wonder how that works. How do you start that process? Is that a Jesuit to Jesuit thing initially - Georgetown and Marquette? Either way, how do you make that approach with the existing basketball schools being so focused on wanting football to survive (hybrid model)? Then again, with AQS for conferences going away, the hoops schools are probably refocusing at this point anyway, regardless of what the Commissioner is still trying to concoct.

Otherwise, UC is one decreasingly relevant vote in the scheme of things. Were football still driving this, they would have influence. I don't see them carrying much weight in any meetings, involving a vote on Xavier, should such a vote materialize. Their basketball coach and team certainly don't generate much respect.

[xnatic03]

I wonder how that works. How do you start that process? Is that a Jesuit to Jesuit thing initially - Georgetown and Marquette? Either way, how do you make that approach with the existing basketball schools being so focused on wanting football to survive (hybrid model)? Then again, with AQS for conferences going away, the hoops schools are probably refocusing at this point anyway, regardless of what the Commissioner is still trying to concoct.

Otherwise, UC is one decreasingly relevant vote in the scheme of things. Were football still driving this, they would have influence. I don't see them carrying much weight in any meetings, involving a vote on Xavier, should such a vote materialize. Their basketball coach and team certainly don't generate much respect.

He doesn't generate much respect because he hasn't been eating his vegetables. Are you telling me the Jolly Green Giant wouldn't win the A10?

[BMoreX]

Not to sound ignorant, but is this guy credible/has good sources?

[Muskie]

I wonder how that works. How do you start that process? Is that a Jesuit to Jesuit thing initially - Georgetown and Marquette? Either way, how do you make that approach with the existing basketball schools being so focused on wanting football to survive (hybrid model)? Then again, with AQS for conferences going away, the hoops schools are probably refocusing at this point anyway, regardless of what the Commissioner is still trying to concoct.

Otherwise, UC is one decreasingly relevant vote in the scheme of things. Were football still driving this, they would have influence. I don't see them carrying much weight in any meetings, involving a vote on Xavier, should such a vote materialize. Their basketball coach and team certainly don't generate much respect.

I don't get the impression the basketball schools necessarily want more football in the conference.

[MHettel]

[QUOTE=xudash;299926] Either way, how do you make that approach with the existing basketball schools being so focused on wanting football to survive (hybrid model)? /QUOTE]

I think you should check your assumptions. The BE BBall teams dont want football to survive. They want UConn and UofL in their Basketball league. Previously I'm sure they wanted to keep WVU and frankly UC is an asset to their basketball league too. They only care about football to the extent that it serves their basketball objectives.

BE BBall schools are now in control. Their primary goal is to keep UConn etc and they attempted to do this by enacting the huge increase in the exit fees. AND they coupled that with a willingess to allow football only expansion that wouldn't dilute basketball. BUT, "Plan B" was always that the NCAA units would be left behind by the departing football schools. Thats not a bad Plan B.

At this point, there are just a couple variables. UofL is still in limbo with the B12 as a possibility, as is UConn with their eye toward the ACC.

In my mind the BE BBall schools needs to act qucikly to try to get everyone left in the BE to realize they are not going to be invited to the football party and should focus on Basketball primarily.

There are a number of very good BBall teams out there that can be added to a solid mix already.

Sure, the BE lost Syracuse, Pitt and WVU. Those teams were all in the top half of the conference. But, they still could add XU, Butler, Temple and Memphis. Combined with the remaining teams (GTown, UConn, UofL, SJU, Nova,) this would stack up as a top basketball conference.

My guess is that a deal for XU to join the BE is done, aside from some final deal structuring. In other words, what is the entry price and what would be their "share" as a new member? Since the football piece is unsettled (and might settle any number of ways) it's simply impossible to agree to an entry arrangement without this detail. I'd bet we have positioned all the required votes behind closed doors already. BBall has voting power and could accept XU right now. They will wait until a final football arrangement is ironed out and throw in adding XU as a condition for the basketball teams to vote to accept the football expansion.

[xu95]

I for one do not want to enter through anyones backdoor.

Sinners.

[pizza delivery]

I'm not even thrilled about the likes of Boeheim, Calhoun, Huggins, Calapari, Pitino coming through the Cintas every year. That's a who's who of college basketball goons. I'd rather pick them off in the NCAA and keep moving.

[LA Muskie]

[QUOTE=xudash;299926] Either way, how do you make that approach with the existing basketball schools being so focused on wanting football to survive (hybrid model)? /QUOTE]

I think you should check your assumptions. The BE BBall teams dont want football to survive. They want UConn and UofL in their Basketball league. Previously I'm sure they wanted to keep WVU and frankly UC is an asset to their basketball league too. They only care about football to the extent that it serves their basketball objectives.

BE BBall schools are now in control. Their primary goal is to keep UConn etc and they attempted to do this by enacting the huge increase in the exit fees. AND they coupled that with a willingess to allow football only expansion that wouldn't dilute basketball. BUT, "Plan B" was always that the NCAA units would be left behind by the departing football schools. Thats not a bad Plan B.

At this point, there are just a couple variables. UofL is still in limbo with the B12 as a possibility, as is UConn with their eye toward the ACC.

In my mind the BE BBall schools needs to act qucikly to try to get everyone left in the BE to realize they are not going to be invited to the football party and should focus on Basketball primarily.

There are a number of very good BBall teams out there that can be added to a solid mix already.

Sure, the BE lost Syracuse, Pitt and WVU. Those teams were all in the top half of the conference. But, they still could add XU, Butler, Temple and Memphis. Combined with the remaining teams (GTown, UConn, UofL, SJU, Nova,) this would stack up as a top basketball conference.

My guess is that a deal for XU to join the BE is done, aside from some final deal structuring. In other words, what is the entry price and what would be their "share" as a new member? Since the football piece is unsettled (and might settle any number of ways) it's simply impossible to agree to an entry arrangement without this detail. I'd bet we have positioned all the required votes behind closed doors already. BBall has voting power and could accept XU right now. They will wait until a final football arrangement is ironed out and throw in adding XU as a condition for the basketball teams to vote to accept the football expansion.
I don't think this is entirely correct. I think BE Basketball wants FBS money without fielding FBS teams, and hence is willing to allow the conference to add FBS-only paying (Freudian slip..."playing") members so long as they don't dilute the basketball product -- which, aside from $$$, is their top priority.

[ballyhoohoo]

I'm not even thrilled about the likes of Boeheim, Calhoun, Huggins, Calapari, Pitino coming through the Cintas every year. That's a who's who of college basketball goons. I'd rather pick them off in the NCAA and keep moving.

Boeheim - Syracuse- going to the ACC
Calapari - Kentucky - not in the Big East
Huggins - WVU - goin to Big IX

Only have to worry about Calhoun and Pitino at worst

[smileyy]

I can't see any of the football schools ending up in a conference with Xavier. All of those coaches you mentioned are at a school with football.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Boeheim - Syracuse- going to the ACC
Calapari - Kentucky - not in the Big East
Huggins - WVU - goin to Big IX

Only have to worry about Calhoun and Pitino at worst

And if everything goes to plan for UConn and UL, Calhoun will be in the ACC and Pitino in the Big 12

XuBrew summed it up perfectly a couple pages back.

The Big East zombie that is football must be stopped.

Marquette
ND
Depaul
St Johns
Seton Hall
Georgetown
X
UD
Butler
SLU
Providence
Nova

That's a pretty solid Bball conference.

[_LH]

And if everything goes to plan for UConn and UL, Calhoun will be in the ACC and Pitino in the Big 12

XuBrew summed it up perfectly a couple pages back.

The Big East zombie that is football must be stopped.

Marquette
ND
Depaul
St Johns
Seton Hall
Georgetown
X
UD
Butler
SLU
Providence
Nova

That's a pretty solid Bball conference.

^ This minus UD, Butler and SLU is ideal. No need to invite UD, Butler and SLU. They will always come running if you want them down the road.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

^ This minus UD, Butler and SLU is ideal. No need to invite UD, Butler and SLU. They will always come running if you want them down the road.

True. I was just thinking in terms of travel partners.

[SixFig]

True. I was just thinking in terms of travel partners.

Traveling with Butler would be a bitch...they would never be on time due to non-functioning clocks.

[Masterofreality]

Pitino will be Big 12.

Calhoun will be retiring soon- before the grim reaper/probation/misded henchman gets his ass like it did with JoePa and maybe Boeheim. I give him 1-2 more years at most.

[pizza delivery]

Good. I'm not following this stuff too closely. I'm more into fake baseball trades these days than fake cbb conferences.

[xubrew]

And if everything goes to plan for UConn and UL, Calhoun will be in the ACC and Pitino in the Big 12

XuBrew summed it up perfectly a couple pages back.

The Big East zombie that is football must be stopped.

Marquette
ND
Depaul
St Johns
Seton Hall
Georgetown
X
UD
Butler
SLU
Providence
Nova

That's a pretty solid Bball conference.

There is the matter of South Florida. I think I forgot about them. They are a full member and really can't be made to leave.

I wouldn't be surprised to see a smattering of schools who can't get into other BCS football conferences join up with the CUSA/MWC for football only (since that arrangement is only for football in the first place) and remain full BE members in everything else. It is my understanding that it is being explored

The conference you listed would be a hell of a conference, but if you replace XU, UD, Butler and SLU with Louisville, UC, USF, Rutgers and UConn it is equally as compelling. Not to mention, those teams are already there. Anywhere between one and four of them could become full members somewhere else, but I don't think they leave unless it is for another major conference such as the B12 or ACC.

[JTG]

Here you go Dash.





"One interesting rumor that I’ve heard more than once is that Xavier is quietly trying to enter the Big East through the back door for basketball. If that were to happen it would be fascinating to see how the Mid-Major Plus dominoes would fall were X to leave the A-10 for a league with St. John’s, Seton Hall, Marquette etc. Would Butler then try to make a move to the A-10? One things for sure if X were to move — Cincinnati would not be happy at all! not sure how solid the rumor is but it’s definitely out there in the coaching/basketball community."


http://www.nbebasketball.com/w3/2011-1126/mernagh-nuggets-from-weekend-so-far/

I'm surprised this story is not getting more play on this message board. Or do most think it is just a wild rumor by some no name blogger. Kudos to Bobo if he is actively pursuing membership in the BIG EAST. Sounds as though it's a one school deal, and we are not concerned with what the rest of the A10 does. Good for us, hope it all works out.

[Masterofreality]

I'm surprised this story is not getting more play on this message board. Or do most think it is just a wild rumor by some no name blogger. Kudos to Bobo if he is actively pursuing membership in the BIG EAST. Sounds as though it's a one school deal, and we are not concerned with what the rest of the A10 does. Good for us, hope it all works out.

It's not getting more play because no one knows how much cred this guy has....

..........it might be about as much as TuXu.

I believe by now, everyone knows where Xavier is....and what the phone number would be.

[muskienick]

I'm surprised this story is not getting more play on this message board. Or do most think it is just a wild rumor by some no name blogger. Kudos to Bobo if he is actively pursuing membership in the BIG EAST. Sounds as though it's a one school deal, and we are not concerned with what the rest of the A10 does. Good for us, hope it all works out.

I know I have worked out 492 scenarios for new Xavier leagues over the last 6-7 years but I firmly believe that we could be really happy in a 9- or 10-team A-10 (or A-9). This is our league (in more ways than one) and we should try to work hard to maximize its potential from the inside. If AD Bobinski has tried hard and failed at that attempt, then I think he would be wise to search out ways to enhance Xavier's Conference status. If the Big East eventually falls apart along FB and BB lines (or the FB half just dematerializes!), then let nature take its course.

[SM#24]

Here you go Dash.

"One interesting rumor that I’ve heard more than once is that Xavier is quietly trying to enter the Big East through the back door for basketball. If that were to happen it would be fascinating to see how the Mid-Major Plus dominoes would fall were X to leave the A-10 for a league with St. John’s, Seton Hall, Marquette etc. Would Butler then try to make a move to the A-10? One things for sure if X were to move — Cincinnati would not be happy at all! not sure how solid the rumor is but it’s definitely out there in the coaching/basketball community."

http://www.nbebasketball.com/w3/2011-1126/mernagh-nuggets-from-weekend-so-far/


I'm surprised this story is not getting more play on this message board. Or do most think it is just a wild rumor by some no name blogger. Kudos to Bobo if he is actively pursuing membership in the BIG EAST. Sounds as though it's a one school deal, and we are not concerned with what the rest of the A10 does. Good for us, hope it all works out.

I think it's a post from some random blogger but I've also assumed that's what Bobinski has been doing for the past 5 years or so.

[xudash]

If anyone is close to Tampa this evening, there appear to be a few available seats for the USF v WVA game. I know they're in the second half at this point, but it wasn't any fuller than it is now when the game started.

Of course, teams like USF and UCF can really help elevate teams located in the Northeast and Midwest.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Big East expansion update

http://espn.go.com/blog/bigeast/post/_/id/27202/big-east-expansion-update

"I hope I didn't fool anybody with this headline. There is no real news on the Big East expansion front..."

Great Article Andrea Adelson...

http://theuniblog.evilspacerobot.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/nicolas-cage_o_GIFSoup.com2_.gif

[GoMuskies]

If anyone is close to Tampa this evening, there appear to be a few available seats for the USF v WVA game. I know they're in the second half at this point, but it wasn't any fuller than it is now when the game started.

Of course, teams like USF and UCF can really help elevate teams located in the Northeast and Midwest.

USF doesn't really draw much worse than Miami.

[xavierj]

USF doesn't really draw much worse than Miami.

Point? Miami is a smaller private school and still has a ton of more national interest than usf will ever have.

[GoMuskies]

Point is that USF doesn't draw much worse than Miami.

[xavierj]

Point is that USF doesn't draw much worse than Miami.

what does that mean? Dayton draws better than 80% of all college basketball programs but no one is going to confuse them with a top 20 basketball program.

[GoMuskies]

It means that USF draws about as well as Miami.

[xavierj]

It means that USF draws about as well as Miami.

so that means pretty much nothing. Thanks.

[GoMuskies]

Well, actually is means that USF draws....

Just kidding. Don't want to take this to _LH territory. But nice try.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

TomPenders Tom Penders

Does anybody, including the Big East Commish, have any idea what's going on in terms of expansion.My sources say that all new teams R out

[XUmeat]

I guess Big Least is growing afterall:

GaryParrishCBS Gary Parrish
Memphis got passed over for SDSU. RT @McMurphyCBS: BREAKING: Sources tell @CBSSports Big East adding Boise, San Diego St, Houston, UCF, SMU.

[X-band '01]

The Big 4 Corners?

[BlueGuy]

Over 2,000 replies to this thread. Impressive.

[Muskie]

That's just insane.

[GoMuskies]

When Louisville and UConn inevitably bolt, the Big East basketball playing members are going to be pissed to be stuck with UCF, SMU and Houston basketball.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Big East Map. Also Navy set to join soon

http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg864/scaled.php?tn=0&server=864&filename=w0zkn.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640

San Diego to Boise(closest team) - 954 miles or a 16 hour drive

San Diego to Connecticut - 2927 miles

[Muskie]

I hear Chaminade and Alaska-Anchorage could be next?

[Masterofreality]

Man, that will be some great basketball league when everything shakes out.....


NOT!

[GoMuskies]

Man, that will be some great basketball league when everything shakes out.....


NOT!

Yeah, they've managed to destroy the football AND basketball leagues now. Well done.

[Muskied]

"So you're saying Navy and Boise wouldn't win the A10?"

"um, yes, that's what I'm saying...in fact no one from your conference would anymore"

"Shit...you're right....the failure of our plan was a complete success."

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

And the Big East is still not letting West Virginia leave

[GoMuskies]

And the Big East is still not letting West Virginia leave

Why should they?

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Why should they?

Aren't they going to have like 19 teams now for Basketball?

Houston
SMU
UCF
St Johns
Seton Hall
Providence
GTown
Nova
Conn
Syracuse
WVU
UL
Cincy
USF
Marquette
Pitt
Depaul
ND
Rutgers

SethDavisHoops Seth davis
FB schools will bolt, Bkb schools will form their own conference RT @russtache: What's ultimately going to happen to the Big East?

[GoMuskies]

For one or two years, they could have 13 or 14 for football and 19 for basketball. It would still be better/more valuable to have Syracuse, Pitt and WV for those two extra years.

[muskiefan82]

Aren't they going to have like 19 teams now for Basketball?

Houston
SMU
UCF
St Johns
Seton Hall
Providence
GTown
Nova
Conn
Syracuse
WVU
UL
Cincy
USF
Marquette
Pitt
Depaul
ND
Rutgers

SethDavisHoops Seth davis
FB schools will bolt, Bkb schools will form their own conference RT @russtache: What's ultimately going to happen to the Big East?

I can't lie....if ever the conference name "Conference USA" fit a group of teams, this is it.

[whiteyxu]

I can't lie....if ever the conference name "Conference USA" fit a group of teams, this is it.

That's the truth. They can no longer be called the Big EAST anymore. Man, they really reached to get some of these schools.

With how things are going, 6 or so of these teams will decide to either back out or change conferences even after this.

What a clusterf&#*...

[xubrew]

I don't think it goes into effect until the 2013-2014 season, so they should remain at a sixteen team format.

[X-band '01]

And the Big East is still not letting West Virginia leave

The Big East could have let West Virginia leave on the condition that they NOT be allowed to participate in any bowls for the upcoming season. The only problem is if a team like UC were to get a BCS berth by default and wind up stabbing the Big East in the back and wind up leaving the conference themselves.

There would be no chance in hell of such a thing happening, but it's fun to watch the last acts of a desperate conference.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

http://cincinnati.com/blogs/uc/2011/12/07/cronin-keep-big-east-at-16-basketball-schools/

Cronin: Keep Big East at 16 basketball schools

[danaandvictory]

http://cincinnati.com/blogs/uc/2011/12/07/cronin-keep-big-east-at-16-basketball-schools/

Cronin: Keep Big East at 16 basketball schools

Big East to Cronin: Who are you, again?

[X-band '01]

From a basketball standpoint, the Big East should strongly consider barring West Virginia from the tournament in NYC this year if they follow through with their intentions to leave the conference this year. They likely would have done the same for their football team had it not jeopardized the conference's AQ status.

Pitt and Syracuse are still on track themselves to follow through with the 27-month notice, although depending on how West Virginia's situation goes they too may decide to just go ahead and bolt early to the ACC.

Richmond had the same thing happen to them back in 2000-01 when they were barred from the CAA Tournament after declaring their intentions to leave for the A-10.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7327447/athletic-directors-say-college-football-playoff-inevitable

ADs think football playoff 'inevitable'




Hopefully the BCS ends sooner rather than later

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/29532522/33754694

AQ's likely gone by 2014.

Nice move Boise

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
Big Ten's Delany on conference realignment: "I don't think all of them will stand." Predicts some will crumble

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
Only if it gets NDame RT @smoot1918: @McMurphyCBS Do you believe the ACC will add any more schools? UCONN, ND Rutgers or USF

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
Banowsky: "I want to create a more happy BCS without these class systems."

@Andy_Staples: Of the things discussed the past few days, I think the obvious takeaway is that AQ status is dead.

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
ACC's Swofford said he's proponent of a plus-one model

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
Asked why playoff won't work in FBS when it works in FCS - silence follows from Delany, Swofford, Thompson, Banowsky

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
Delany says players beat up after 12, 13, 14 games. Yet, they all had no problem adding 12th regular season game

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
MWC's Thompson on a playoff: "I think we have my work cut out for me."

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
B1G's Delany on BCS AQ status: "I'm not wed to it. I'm wed to 1-2 game & I'm wed to Rose Bowl. I'm not wed to (BCS AQ status)"

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
ND's Swarbrick: "We're thrilled with the announcement, we feel it delivers on the stability (of the Big East)."

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
ND's Swarbrick also said stability of the new Big East allows Irish to maintain independence in football

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
NBC would love to have discusion of plus-one. "We would love to be part of that discussion."

McMurphyCBS Brett McMurphy
Notre Dame football to ACC? Big Ten? Big 12? SEC? Ain't gonna happen says AD Jack Swarbrick bit.ly/u7GFSC

[X-band '01]

Yeah, I'm sure this is just a coincidence we're hearing this 24 hours after the schools officially jumped ship.

[xavierj]

What ND is not joining a conference? That is shocking. What happens to the Big East football if Boise and San Diego St. suck in a couple of years? How good will flying to Idaho seem to the other Big East teams if that were to happen?

[GoMuskies]

Boise is 151-27 in the last 13 years. I think it's pretty unlikely that they will suck in the near future.

San Diego State? I think it's HIGHLY likely they will suck out loud very soon.

[xudash]

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/29532522/33754694

AQ's likely gone by 2014.

Nice move Boise

The only reason they could be moving forward with it is that they believe the television money will be better with the new BE configuration versus what they have now.

Goo luck with that.

[muskienick]

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry/29532522/33754694

AQ's likely gone by 2014.
Nice move Boise

If Boise and San Diego State joined the Big East without an "out clause" cheaper than TCU's, they are crazy. If the AQ's disappear by 2014, what benefit does Boise and SDS have in aligning with the Big East?

[GoMuskies]

If Boise and San Diego State joined the Big East without an "out clause" cheaper than TCU's, they are crazy. If the AQ's disappear by 2014, what benefit does Boise and SDS have in aligning with the Big East?

It will still be stronger than the MWC (which is brutal now that Utah, BYU and TCU have abandoned it). And if you have to get as high as possible in the rankings to get a major bowl bid, then being in a stronger conference will help.

[xudash]

If Boise and San Diego State joined the Big East without an "out clause" cheaper than TCU's, they are crazy. If the AQ's disappear by 2014, what benefit does Boise and SDS have in aligning with the Big East?

Take Two: The only reason they could be moving forward with it is that they believe the television money will be better with the new BE configuration versus what they have now in their existing conference.

[GoMuskies]

And you'd have to think the Big East is going to have a lot better contract than the Mtn. West. Even if not great by the standards of ACC, SEC, etc.

[xudash]

And you'd have to think the Big East is going to have a lot better contract than the Mtn. West. Even if not great by the standards of ACC, SEC, etc.

Therein lies the entertainment value in all this: the reaction the BE's front office will have when they receive their television offer, finding it to be a fraction of what the ACC is getting.

We're going back to pre-BCS days, gentlemen. The true power players, mainly the key programs in the SEC, B1G, Texas, USC, etc. are going to win. They'll soak up the major bowls and the major money most years.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Conference dominos still may fall

By Andy Katz
ESPN.com
Archive
The fallout from the Big East's shakeup in football and basketball this week will continue for weeks, if not months or years, according to multiple sources at the conference commissioner level.

The Mountain West and Conference USA merger, which appears imminent, can't be consummated until both conferences learn what the Big East will do. It is attempting to get to 12 schools that play football. The Big East is awaiting a decision from Navy, which it wants as a football-only member.

That could lead the Big East to poach C-USA members Memphis or East Carolina. Temple of the Atlantic 10 (in all sports) and the MAC (for football) is a viable candidate as well.

The MWC-C-USA merger would create a solid basketball league -- if the membership were to stay as it is right now. It would feature headline teams Memphis, UNLV, New Mexico, Tulsa, UTEP and UAB.

The two conferences are also debating the current eight-year waiting period for an automatic berth into the NCAA basketball tournament, according to sources. The Great West Conference, a hodge-podge of former provisional and Division I schools, is currently in that process. The combined C-USA-MWC would have to consider whether it would get at-large berths to the tournament in the interim.

No one associated with the Big East will publicly say that losing West Virginia, Syracuse and Pitt in what amounted to a trade for Houston, SMU and Central Florida in men's basketball is equal on any level. Syracuse and Pitt are perennial powers, and West Virginia has been an NCAA bid contenders in recent years. Houston, SMU and Central Florida haven't been relevant in recent times on a national level.

Getting Memphis would soften the blow for the Big East, but sources say there is no traction for the Tigers to join the Big East at present.

Another issue for the Big East: the Big 12 could ask Louisville to join at any moment if it wants to get to 12 schools, while the ACC would love to get Notre Dame in all sports and then take Connecticut as the 16th member, according to high-level conference sources. One Notre Dame source has said the Irish want to be in a neighborhood of schools it considers similar -- that means schools like Duke, North Carolina and Virginia, all of which are established academic institutions.

Meanwhile, Boise State's addition to the WAC in men's basketball doesn't upgrade the league in the sport -- yet. Second-year coach Leon Rice has helped ensure the Broncos are competitive, and the Broncos may have a legitimate shot of competing for a league title in a conference where Utah State and New Mexico State set the standard, and Denver is a rising title contender.

San Diego State isn't officially in the Big West yet for all sports other than football. A source said the conference board of directors said a vote on that should come in the next week and added that it would be a surprise if the Aztecs were rejected. There was some concern among SDSU officials last week and the school contacted the WAC as a safety net just in case something fell through with the Big West. But no one associated with this deal expects it to fall through.

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/7336587/fallout-big-east-expansion-reverberating-conference-commissioners-say


--------

Also, UL AD seems to really want in Big 12 (8:30 mark).
http://www.courier-journal.com/videonetwork/1279525911001/UofL-Athletics-Jurich

"We've worked very hard to be attractive to many conferences, in particular the Big 12 conference..." "I've been up in the forefront but I want to be very aggresive as we look to other conferences"

[BMoreX]

Just to keep the carousel turning...


At least two Big East members have had conversations about leaving the conference to start a new league built around traditional basketball powers, several sources told The Chronicle.

The conversations, which are preliminary and may not lead to any departures, have happened within the past month as the league worked to stabilize itself following the announcements this year that Pittsburgh, Syracuse, and West Virginia planned to leave. This month the Big East added five new

That's all that the article gives for non-subscribers. I wonder who the two are.

http://chronicle.com/article/2-Big-East-Members-Have/130139/

[GoMuskies]

More (Xavier mention), but still not revealing of the two schools.

http://chronicle.com/blogs/players/2-big-east-members-have-discussed-starting-basketball-only-league/29335

[bobbiemcgee]

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-basketball/2011/12/21/2653048/big-east-realignment-two-schools-discuss-leaving-basketball-league

[GoMuskies]

If it's a PC and a Seton Hall, I would expect them to join the A-10. No way those two are going to lure us away to start a new league with them. Only Villanova and Georgetown have the juice to get that done.

[bobbiemcgee]

I think the "Super BB Conference" will happen. Who knows when.

[DC Muskie]

Georgetown is going to play a lot less games at the Verizon center soon. There would be plenty of empty seats when SMU rolls into town.

[xudash]

If it's a PC and a Seton Hall, I would expect them to join the A-10. No way those two are going to lure us away to start a new league with them. Only Villanova and Georgetown have the juice to get that done.

I agree, but would add Marquette to that mix.

[bobbiemcgee]

http://www.nunesmagician.com/2011/12/21/2652943/big-east-basketball-only-schools-super-conference-marinatto

[HuskyMuskie]

Another piece to the puzzle?

http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-basketball/2011/12/21/2653048/big-east-realignment-two-schools-discuss-leaving-basketball-league

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

BigTime TV/Radio @GSwaim 13h
"@Smitty40484: @GSwaim if wvu is allowed to make jump next yr how soon does UofL follow?" // 2013

BigTime TV/Radio @GSwaim 15h
"@mwphoenix71: @GSwaim UConn and Rutgers to Big 12???" // Among those being considered. #ACC doesn't want #UConn

BigTime TV/Radio @GSwaim 16h
"@HHICHRIS: @GSwaim is #wvu still wait till summer before cleared?" // it'll be rectified within 6-8 weeks, possibly even sooner....Quick buyout. Neither party can afford to have it drag on.

Partnership between Big 10 and Pac 12?
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7393687/partnership-pac-12-big-ten-benefits-expansion-legal-mess

[GoMuskies]

BigTime TV/Radio @GSwaim 13h
"@Smitty40484: @GSwaim if wvu is allowed to make jump next yr how soon does UofL follow?" // 2013

BigTime TV/Radio @GSwaim 15h
"@mwphoenix71: @GSwaim UConn and Rutgers to Big 12???" // Among those being considered. #ACC doesn't want #UConn

BigTime TV/Radio @GSwaim 16h
"@HHICHRIS: @GSwaim is #wvu still wait till summer before cleared?" // it'll be rectified within 6-8 weeks, possibly even sooner....Quick buyout. Neither party can afford to have it drag on.


Now that we have Greg Swaim's imput, at least we know what's NOT going to happen.

Based on Swaim's tweets, I'll assume:

WV will play two more Big East seasons
UConn will be invited to the ACC tomorrow
Louisville will sign a blood oath committing itself to the Big East for the next 100 years

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Navy to join the Big East by 2015 for football only

http://news.cincinnati.com/article/20120124/SPT0101/301240056/Navy-join-Big-East?odyssey=tab|topnews|text|FRONTPAGE

Also, there's a completely unsubstantiated rumor going around of UL and Rutgers to the Big 12(but hey that's how this thread started anyways)
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=159&f=4582&t=8559412

'More on possible Big 12 expansion'
http://www.eerinsider.com/2012-articles/january/more-on-possible-big-12-expansion.html

'Longwood joins Big South Conference'
http://www2.timesdispatch.com/sports/2012/jan/23/7/longwood-joins-big-south-conference-ar-1633202/

'Big 12 to Target Acc in Expansion'
http://www.eerinsider.com/2012-articles/january/big-12-to-target-acc.html

Looks like the Big 12 is trying to make some big time moves

[GoMuskies]

Big 12 expansion committee is meeting today.

http://chronicle.com/blogs/players/big-12-conference-reopens-expansion-talk/29477

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Good find Go....

Clemson, FSU, BYU, UL, Cincy all should be in the mix. UL should be a shoe in should they decide to expand.

Here we go again

Wonder what Dash thinks of all this?

[muskienick]

Good find Go....

Clemson, FSU, BYU, UL, Cincy all should be in the mix. UL should be a shoe in should they decide to expand.

Here we go again

Wonder what Dash thinks of all this?

I also hope Dash weighs in on this topic.

From my perspective, as much as I like what the A-10 has done for Xavier's status, I can't help but think that the weakening of the Big East by the departure of a couple of more of their stronger FB/BB members would benefit the Muskies down the road. Should the ACC panic at the suggestion that it might be raided by the Big 12, that Conference could attempt to strengthen its numbers by the addition of Rutgers and maybe even UC (whose Academics are not as bad as you would think just of the top of your head --- Bob Huggins isn't the Dean or Provost of UC after all, and the Bearcats have seen their fortunes rise quite nicely in both FB and BB, despite Mick's presence). I know little about South and Central Florida's academics, but their FB programs are roughly on a par with the ACC and their BB programs would certainly be at least the equal of the current brand of BB played at Wake Forest (CFU is actually having a pretty nice season this year). Heck, the ACC might even be able to convince ND to join. The Irish aren't going to be any more excited about playing in the new Big East without Pitt, WVU, Syracuse, etc. And because the BCS will likely be altered drastically over the next couple of years (or abolished completely in favor of a real playoff for the NC), ND might listen to a Conference with great basketball and a FB Conference that it could use to impress the pollsters and a future football Selection Committee that it seemingly can't do now playing the schedules we've seen them play recently (a mix of crappy teams, service academies down on their luck, and USC that consistently beats them up even in Trojan "down years"!

How long wil the likes of Villanova, Georgetown, Marquette, St. John's, etc. be satisfied playing a steady stream of CUSA-level competition (minus Memphis!)? That is especially true when traditionally much better programs such as Creighton, Butler, Xavier, etc. would probably be willing to talk about the formation of a basketball-driven conference with them.

The fun is starting again!

[xudash]

"He added, however, that there is no rush to decide: “It’s a very strong conference, and we’re very comfortable with the new members,” he said. “Whether we go beyond that is a big and important question that requires a very deliberative approach.”"

In my opinion, Hargis's statement is pure babble-speak. With the other major conferences at 10+, they fundamentally know they need more teams, especially given the markets in which they play. They have candidates that will fit the program, fanbase, and academic bill for them. The question is whether or not the network partners like the proposed additions; the deal has to be accretive.

Overall, I still see the demise of the BE Hybrid coming, because at some point, the football side of it will be too diluted to continue as a credible package for television.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

"He added, however, that there is no rush to decide: “It’s a very strong conference, and we’re very comfortable with the new members,” he said. “Whether we go beyond that is a big and important question that requires a very deliberative approach.”"

In my opinion, Hargis's statement is pure babble-speak. With the other major conferences at 10+, they fundamentally know they need more teams, especially given the markets in which they play. They have candidates that will fit the program, fanbase, and academic bill for them. The question is whether or not the network partners like the proposed additions; the deal has to be accretive.

Overall, I still see the demise of the BE Hybrid coming, because at some point, the football side of it will be too diluted to continue as a credible package for television.

I will unleash a fury of Giggities, the likes this world has never seen, should the BE hybrid come tumbling down and X ends up in a conference with Marquette, GTown, Nova, St Johns, etc

[X-band '01]

This is where GoMuskies comments that the Big 12 will be adding mediocre football programs to a BCS-caliber conference while modestly making them better in basketball.

[GoMuskies]

This is where GoMuskies comments that the Big 12 will be adding mediocre football programs to a BCS-caliber conference while modestly making them better in basketball.

It is?

[pizza delivery]

I think UC to the Big 12 would be a really great fit for them. If nothing else, Cincinnati wants to feel important. Having fbs royalty like Oklahoma, Texas and whoever's 3rd that year come to PBS would be a boon for UC because people in the area will respond to that. Likewise in basketball - UT, KU, KSU, Baylor, etc. They don't have real rivalries with anyone in the BE but Louisville. If the Big 12 wanted to go with a UC, UL package, that would look good from my perspective, not knowing the TV side at all.

For XU, if it shakes out that they stay in the A10 but add Butler, Creighton, or another decent bball program, I'm fine with that. Going to the BE basketball side would be nice as well.

[GoMuskies]

Creighton's not leaving the MVC for the A-10.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Creighton's not leaving the MVC for the A-10.

This has been covered

[GoMuskies]

This has been covered

In 224 pages most everything has been covered!

[X-band '01]

I'm seeing 56 pages (although the max number of posts per page allowed is 40).

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

http://www.eerinsider.com/2012-articles/january/more-on-big-12-expansion.html

"Big 12 expansion is a hot topic. Rumors everywhere including talk Clemson and Florida State are actively courting the Big 12.

Louisville, BYU, Rutgers, Maryland, Boston College and USF are also popular names in the expansion discussion.

All I know for sure is that Clemson and FSU are talking to the Big 12. I’ve been able to verify from five independent sources from that the discussions are ongoing and that the Clemson Board of Trustees discussed Big 12 membership January 24th.

Both are extremely unhappy in the ACC and extremely unhappy that John Swofford and the bluebloods at UNC seem to care only about basketball and both are scared to death that the SEC is about to pluck Virginia Tech and North Carolina State from the ACC.

I’m told that the fortunes of Clemson and FSU are linked and that the two are joined at the hip. Their fear of an ACC depleted of football prowess and the prospect of losing ground in the recruiting war to their neighbors in the SEC have them motivated to force the issue. So they made contact with the Big 12 early last fall and the discussions have been ongoing since.

As my good friend Yancey Stubbs likes to say “there is a good bit of ground between hither and yither” and a lot has to happen before Clemson and FSU serve notice on the ACC and it all could fall apart at anytime.

One potential holdup seems to be that Clemson wants the Big 12 to help pay the exit fee.

Other ACC teams in the mix are Maryland and Boston College.

WVU has a close relationship with Maryland and are lobbying hard to make sure the Terrapins are kept in the discussion. The question is can Maryland afford the ACC buyout.

Boston College wants out of the ACC so badly they were talking to the old Big East about leaving and rejoining their old mates. They would also be good Norte Dame bait.

Aside from the ACC teams the other options are decidedly less attractive and become even more so if the Big 12 decides to expand to 14.

Louisville has an unofficial invitation but has to be on the chopping block if Clemson and FSU want onboard and the league decides to limit expansion to 12. The television network executives love the idea of an instant heated rivalry with West Virginia and Louisville in the Big 12 East.

BYU is back in the picture but seems to be the least attractive option for the Big 12 East. The Cougars have traveling limitations that would make scheduling difficult and Norte Dame like demands they must give up to be a serious candidate. They seem to have came to the same conclusion that Navy recently reached in that the future of independents isn’t very bright. If BYU is added Louisville is on deck with Clemson & FSU possibly 13 & 14.

Cincinnati would be a logical and convenient addition if only for their proximity to Morgantown.

All you need to know about Rutgers is that Greg Schiano left the program partly due to his pessimism about the new Big East. If Rutgers were a legitimate candidate for Big 12 expansion Schiano would have stayed.

Notes:

Don’t believe talk coming out of the Big 12 about expansion. We’ve heard similar from Mike Slive and the SEC just before adding both Texas A&M and Missouri.

Texas has acquiesced to expanding to at least 12."

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Memphis to the Big East could be/probably will be announced Friday

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/view/29532522

[GoMuskies]

Memphis to the Big East could be/probably will be announced Friday

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/view/29532522

If they can get USM, Tulane and ECU, they will have rebuilt C-USA (UAB is too awful to even jokingly discuss...sorry 'brew).

[SixFig]

Not really relevant, just really cool college football map

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/430080_10150670608363828_367033813827_10836198_245 467878_n.jpg

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Not really relevant, just really cool college football map

https://fbcdn-sphotos-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/430080_10150670608363828_367033813827_10836198_245 467878_n.jpg

Big East map

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e4/HubbleUltraDeepFieldwithScaleComparison.jpg/290px-HubbleUltraDeepFieldwithScaleComparison.jpg

[GoMuskies]

[GoMuskies shares hopefully]

@Matt_HayesSN Matt Hayes
Here's what Memphis to Big East tells me: Louisville to B12 is happening. Big East moves to Memphis to secure that secondary area.

http://twitter.com/#!/Matt_HayesSN

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

@Matt_HayesSN Matt Hayes

Looks like former XHoops members Bballfan and TuXu2011 are heading to the UDPride board while AdamtheFlyer is in negotiations to leave UDPride to come to XHoops. No word on _LH yet

This conference carousel is taking its toll on everyone

[bleedXblue]

@Matt_HayesSN Matt Hayes

Looks like former XHoops members Bballfan and TuXu2011 are heading to the UDPride board while AdamtheFlyer is in negotiations to leave UDPride to come to XHoops. No word on _LH yet

This conference carousel is taking its toll on everyone

If this goes down, Big East loses Pitt, Syracuse, WVU and Louisville.

Ouch !

Adds Memphis.....which is good for Bbball and that's it.

Mick's getting what he wanted. A significantly depleted conference where UC can actually compete for a conference championship.

[Nocalmuskie]

This is not good for xavier ... you need a strong core of non BCS hoops schools, X now left in the dark

[xavierj]

This is not good for xavier ... you need a strong core of non BCS hoops schools, X now left in the dark

Memphis has never had anything to do with the success of Xavier. I also did not know Gonzaga and Butler were going with them. Oh and you can bet that Big East basketball schools are not going to sit around forever. Xavier will be fine whatever happens. I used to think differenty but Xavier is a basketball school and they don't need to go to a conference with 18 members or whatever the big east is up to now, 10 of which are football schools. And its not like the basketball only schools in the Big East are hanging a bunch of final 4 banners.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

@PeteThamelNYT Rick Pitino on Memphis to Big East: "It’s a much needed move. I would imagine we’ve got one more move to go."

Looks like the Temple to the Big East rumors are gaining support again

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/7551260/memphis-tigers-joining-big-east-2013-14-season

Memphis will join in 2013. Your move Big 12

Also looks like Temple is being approached to join the MWC/CUSA. Not good if Temple goes

[waggy]

MWC/CUSA seems like a lateral move at best for Temple. And I think they could've gone there any time. I think they like the A10 for BBall.

Whatever happens, I hope we can keep a series with them.

[xudash]

Memphis to the Big East could be/probably will be announced Friday

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/view/29532522

I wonder if Fred Smith had anything to do with it.

Talk about coming out of left field. Then again, as we've all hit the couch - the psychiatrist's couch, not the one in our man caves - over the proceedings of this Xavier hoops season, you have to know that a lot of stuff is going down quietly with the Big XII, BE and possibly even the ACC.

How about West Virginia! "Uh, um, no....no, I don't think I'll honor that agreement after all; I'm gone when I want to be gone."

Some, if not many here are okay with the A10, regardless of what keeps transpiring elsewhere. I would feel better about the A10 if it could get rid of LaSalle, in particular, and perhaps SBU (too small and remote for the long-term). I know that hasn't and won't happen proactively. So all I can offer here is that we will have a major problem if we lose Temple. The A10 without Temple isn't worthless, but it would be severely damaged; it can't afford such a hit.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

I wonder if Fred Smith had anything to do with it.

Talk about coming out of left field. Then again, as we've all hit the couch - the psychiatrist's couch, not the one in our man caves - over the proceedings of this Xavier hoops season, you have to know that a lot of stuff is going down quietly with the Big XII, BE and possibly even the ACC.

How about West Virginia! "Uh, um, no....no, I don't think I'll honor that agreement after all; I'm gone when I want to be gone."

Some, if not many here are okay with the A10, regardless of what keeps transpiring elsewhere. I would feel better about the A10 if it could get rid of LaSalle, in particular, and perhaps SBU (too small and remote for the long-term). I know that hasn't and won't happen proactively. So all I can offer here is that we will have a major problem if we lose Temple. The A10 without Temple isn't worthless, but it would be severely damaged; it can't afford such a hit.

What do you think the most likely option is for X at this point if Temple leaves?

Stay in the A10 and invite a team like Butler in? Hope some Big East Bball schools leave and start a Bball only conference?

[waggy]

Fans are the backbone of any program. As long as X has great fans they'll have a great program. Losing Temple isn't great, but not that big a deal. The conference would still have Philly covered.

[xudash]

Fans are the backbone of any program. As long as X has great fans they'll have a great program. Losing Temple isn't great, but not that big a deal. The conference would still have Philly covered.

Philly covered with LaSalle and St. Joe's versus having lost a major, large, expanding public university is not having Philly "covered." The A10 would have a "presence" in Philly, but it would be severely weakened coverage. We would be left with a piece-of-sh!t LaSalle program who lacks funding for improvements and a St. Joe's program that is wobbling and otherwise put its funding into a questionable facilities solution.

It would be a big deal for Xavier were the A10 to lose one of its premier teams, in that the conference would weaken in perception and its RPI rating would go down, leaving X in a position of really having to work that much harder to achieve solid seeding in the NCAA Tournament.

JTT37, I doubt Xavier will have many options at that point. We'll be sitting in a weaker conference, still waiting for football related matters to work themselves out, including whether or not Louisville ultimately gets the official call from the Big XII. If the 'ville leaves the BE, I really have to begin wondering what kind of television contract the new BE mess is going to attract.

Otherwise, I doubt that Butler would come to the A10. Be weary of Butler anyway. Give them their two great runs, and like Hinkle as much as some of you may like it for historical reasons, but Butler is a small-time basketball program. They have a weak fan base, especially for what they've accomplished. Dayton has withstood bad coaching choices because those idiots will show up for anything, for the most part. Otherwise, the elasticity in the Butler fan base is alarming. If they lose Stevens and fail to replace him with a solid solution, they're toast. They just don't generate the kind of revenue that will really allow them to sustain an elite level of performance, causing them to depend upon a continued domination of the Horizon League. Even that looks like it is becoming harder to do, with Cleveland State and Detroit beginning to make more noise.

[paulxu]

Maybe that's good for us. As the BE starts to look more and more a mess, stretching from coast to coast...maybe the football schools (assuming they hold on to BCS slot) won't want to share the $ with the BBall only schools. Maybe they break away and we can get in a nice conference with them and some others with similar situations (Butler, Creighton, etc.)

[bleedXblue]

Fans are the backbone of any program. As long as X has great fans they'll have a great program. Losing Temple isn't great, but not that big a deal. The conference would still have Philly covered.

Losing Temple would be like the Big Ten losing Michigan.

They're a staple A-10 team and probably the most successful program the A-10 has had since its inception.

Huge loss IMHO.

It discredits the conference and leaves huge void.

But, hey if you look at it like Mick Cronin does, it gives us that much better of a chance to win the league every year.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Philly covered with LaSalle and St. Joe's versus having lost a major, large, expanding public university is not having Philly "covered." The A10 would have a "presence" in Philly, but it would be severely weakened coverage.

It would be a very big deal for Xavier, in that the conference would weaken and its RPI rating would go down and it would leave X in a position of really having to work that much harder to achieve solid seeding in the NCAA Tournament.

JTT37, I doubt Xavier will have many options at that point. We'll be sitting in a weaker conference, still waiting for football related matters to work themselves out, including whether or not Louisville ultimately gets the official call from the Big XII. If the 'ville leaves the BE, I really have to begin wondering what kind of television contract the new BE mess is going to attract.

I doubt that Butler would come to the A10. Be weary of Butler anyway. Give them their two great runs and like Hinkle as much of you may like it for historical reasons, but Butler is a small-time basketball program. They have a weak fan base, especially for what they've accomplished. Dayton has withstood bad coaching choices because those idiots will show up for anything, for the most part. Otherwise, the elasticity in the Butler fan base is alarming. If they lose Stevens and fail to replace him with a solid solution, they're toast. Either way, they're still recruiting into the Horizon League - no thanks.

Ya X may be in stuck in limbo if the Big East doesn't implode. I wonder what Bobinski is doing behind the scenes


Maybe that's good for us. As the BE starts to look more and more a mess, stretching from coast to coast...maybe the football schools (assuming they hold on to BCS slot) won't want to share the $ with the BBall only schools. Maybe they break away and we can get in a nice conference with them and some others with similar situations (Butler, Creighton, etc.)

Great non football schools are out there to form a great conference. There's no doubt about that. The problem is getting them all together


Losing Temple would be like the Big Ten losing Michigan.

They're a staple A-10 team and probably the most successful program the A-10 has had since its inception.

Huge loss IMHO.

It discredits the conference and leaves huge void.

But, hey if you look at it like Mick Cronin does, it gives us that much better of a chance to win the league every year.

Huge loss is right. This would not be good news at all. From a Temple standpoint, I think it makes more sense.

I'm sure Nove is still blocking Temple from joining the Big East(their obvious first choice) and they may feel this is their 2nd best option for football. Realistically though, The MWC/CUsa merge isn't that much better than the MAC without Boise, Utah, BYU, and TCU

[bleedXblue]

[QUOTE=JimmyTwoTimes37;322017]Ya X may be in stuck in limbo if the Big East doesn't implode. I wonder what Bobinski is doing behind the scenes



I think the logical thing to do is wait to see how this all shakes out.

That may mean X is in a bit of limbo for 2-3 years.

When it's clear where everyone is going to end up......make your move.

I dont see X jumping the gun and getting out in front of this for a simple reason.....they can't b/c the football $$ is controllig this whole thing. We don't have a dog in the fight right now. It sucks, but what are you gonna do ?

[xudash]

Maybe that's good for us. As the BE starts to look more and more a mess, stretching from coast to coast...maybe the football schools (assuming they hold on to BCS slot) won't want to share the $ with the BBall only schools. Maybe they break away and we can get in a nice conference with them and some others with similar situations (Butler, Creighton, etc.)

Paul, recall that the BCS as we know it may be headed for the exit by the BCS itself. Those Chicago meetings that took place late last year involved a publicly announced possibility of the BCS eliminating so-called BCS conferences so that the BCS could fully focus itself on the championship process and game.

That would leave the major bowls to gravitate to what they did before the BCS was formed in 1998: creating preferred conference alliances and pivoting on making invitations from there. As an example, the Rose Bowl - the Granddaddy of Them All - would continue to lock into a Big Ten and PAC 12 alliance, in general, but subject to participation in the NC game on the part of one or two of its desired teams, unless a plus 2 or plus 4 arrangement comes along to replace what's there now.

Overall, it really becomes a game of haves and have nots, because not only will the disparity continue in television contracts between the Big Ten, SEC and PAC 12, in particular as compared to the other existing BCS conferences and the other non-BCS conferences, but the major bowls will typically find the Ohio State's, Michigans, Whisky's, etc.; the top half of the SEC, Texas and Oklahoma, and USC, etc. positioning for their invites. UC to a major bowl 3 to 5 years from now? Sure, that'll happen.

Why? Because Delaney and Slive, among others, are pissed and embarrassed that a UConn could make a BCS level bowl and stink it up so badly on and off the field.

I can't wait to see what the BE negotiates as its new TV contract. The irony is that it will probably get some lift in the deal just because of the value of content at this time.

[GoMuskies]

Why? Because Delaney and Slive, among others, are pissed and embarrassed that a UConn could make a BCS level bowl and stink it up so badly on and off the field.

They're embarrassed by UConn and not (70-33) Clemson?!?

[chico]

The ACC and Big East are both awful in BCS games. Outside of Miami (gone) and West Virginia (about to be gone) the Big East has won one BCS game. The ACC is not much better with only 2 wins. However, I think with the current alignment of teams the ACC is still considered a better conference with traditional programs like Va. Tech and Miami. But that's still not saying much.

[GoMuskies]

Boise State is coming in with two BCS wins. That will put it back ahead of the ACC, which for some reason continues to get a pass in all this BCS discussion. And the ACC will get worse (and the Big East better) when Pitt and Syracuse flip to the ACC (whenever that happens).

[danaandvictory]

They're embarrassed by UConn and not (70-33) Clemson?!?

Clemson probably sold more than eight tickets.

[xudash]

They're embarrassed by UConn and not (70-33) Clemson?!?

I doubt Delaney and Slive see much difference between the ACC and BE at this point, especially from the business side of things. danaandvictory is absolutely right: losing the game badly was bad enough, but UConn choked on their ticket sales, losing money on a BCS bowl experience.

Clemson is much better at travelling than UConn.

[GoMuskies]

Clemson probably sold more than eight tickets.

Good point. The ACC is known for packing in the fans.

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/772099/acc_championship_game_crowd_view_2007_empty_stadiu m_jacksonville_altel_acc_sucks_sux.jpg

[xudash]

The ACC and Big East are both awful in BCS games. Outside of Miami (gone) and West Virginia (about to be gone) the Big East has won one BCS game. The ACC is not much better with only 2 wins. However, I think with the current alignment of teams the ACC is still considered a better conference with traditional programs like Va. Tech and Miami. But that's still not saying much.

You can throw Florida State into the traditional programs mix with Miami and VTech.

I agree with you: the ACC has the better looking roster of programs overall, as compared to whatever the BE is becoming.

[xudash]

Good point. The ACC is known for packing in the fans.

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/772099/acc_championship_game_crowd_view_2007_empty_stadiu m_jacksonville_altel_acc_sucks_sux.jpg

I was at that game. Too funny.

One year involved massive Wake Forest Not-So-State University with its 2,567 travelling fans against Boston College and its 2,568 travelling fans. Seating options were plentiful.

[chico]

Good point. The ACC is known for packing in the fans.

http://cdn3.sbnation.com/imported_assets/772099/acc_championship_game_crowd_view_2007_empty_stadiu m_jacksonville_altel_acc_sucks_sux.jpg

The low attendance was very surprising considering what a great football town Jacksonville (the city, not the college) is.

[danaandvictory]

Good point. The ACC is known for packing in the fans.


I'm not sure I understand the boner you have for defending Big East football, especially given that your beloved Cardinals are headed west any day now.

Clemson probably at least justified their existence in Miami, even if Holgo crushed them like a case of Bud Extra. Does anyone remember Bud Extra?

https://encrypted-tbn1.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQnRVSfxfPhfiRHSQxwJfgseRW9eqWZ3 gW4e1wFEtOVhaFOergO

That stuff tasted like Satan's piss.

[GoMuskies]

Hey, if you want to attack Big East football, have at it. Just make sure you attack the worst BCS football conference in on field performance (the ACC) just as strongly.

[PMI]

Hey, if you want to attack Big East football, have at it. Just make sure you attack the worst BCS football conference in on field performance (the ACC) just as strongly.

How can you back this up? Clemson's embarrassment against WV aside, it is hard to argue that the Big East wasn't the most pathetic BCS conference in football this year. The Big East had one team in the BCS top 25, at 23rd. I would argue that the CUSA was better. The ACC sucks in football, but the Big East was easily the least deserving of a BCS bid.

[GoMuskies]

How can you back this up?

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/sagarin/fbc11.htm

Through the years, BTW:

2010: ACC #4, Big East #7
2009: ACC #4, Big East #2
2008: ACC #3, Big East #5
2007: ACC #5, Big East #4
2006: ACC #4, Big East #2

[BBC 08]

How can you back this up? Clemson's embarrassment against WV aside, it is hard to argue that the Big East wasn't the most pathetic BCS conference in football this year. The Big East had one team in the BCS top 25, at 23rd. I would argue that the CUSA was better. The ACC sucks in football, but the Big East was easily the least deserving of a BCS bid.

Go isn't just arguing for this year.

[xavierj]

Hey, if you want to attack Big East football, have at it. Just make sure you attack the worst BCS football conference in on field performance (the ACC) just as strongly.

Your conference sucks more than mine. Nana, nana, boo, boo. Why don't you guys argue the patriot and the ivy league?

[GoMuskies]

Your conference sucks more than mine. Nana, nana, boo, boo. Why don't you guys argue the patriot and the ivy league?

Or the A-10 vs. the MVC.

[xubrew]

Offering up an objective assessment is not the same as mindlessly defending the Big East.

The perception of the Big East is worse than the reality. I don't know why, but I'm guessing it's because the name brand of the programs in the Big East aren't that good.

People continue to talk about how UConn was embarrassed. Perhaps they were, but Virginia Tech was embarrassed far more by Stanford that same year. Not only did Virginia Tech lose in a bigger blowout, it came to a team that isn't traditionally a football power.

Again, that's not defending the Big East. It's pointing out that the ACC is oftentimes as bad or worse, but is not scrutinized nearly as much.

[xavierj]

Or the A-10 vs. the MVC.

Knock yourself out if you want. Just seems like you get your panties in a bunch anyone says the Big East football is mediocre. You seem to then go and take shots at another bad league to prove your point. Maybe you can debate the merits of Tab v.s. Big K.

[GoMuskies]

Being the worst BCS conference vs. being the second-worst BCS conference is a pretty important distinction. At least so long as the BCS continues.

[xavierj]

Being the worst BCS conference vs. being the second-worst BCS conference is a pretty important distinction. At least so long as the BCS continues.

You've got a point. But I would imagine something happens to this BCS soon anyway. Or maybe the SEC, Big 10, PAC 12 and Big 12 form their own little championship.

[xudash]

Being the worst BCS conference vs. being the second-worst BCS conference is a pretty important distinction. At least so long as the BCS continues.

As I already posted above somewhere, the BCS may not continue as configured; the BCS may eliminate so-called BCS conferences. The BCS will focus its efforts on the championship and let the major bowls decide their invitations, unless they somehow tie them into a limited play-off process.

We could be going back to college football, circa pre-1998. That means the truly huge and powerful name brands win. It's a matter of program generated revenue, (stadium size, attendance, seat licensing, merchandising, etc.), television payouts via conference affiliations, and participating in these big payout bowls.

The Big Ten, SEC and PAC XII have created true economic separation from the others. The BIG XII is trying to find a way to stabilize and do what it can, riding mostly Texas television sets into the math for their TV contract. The ACC tried to fashion itself after the SEC and came out of all that looking like the SEC's red-headed step child in football, while sitting back in their chairs in the winter, fuming about having lost a clear, strong image as the premier basketball brand. The BE is hard to explain if for no other reason that it remains a hybrid with heavy turnover, trying to still keep itself alive by relocating the Rocky Mountains closer to the Allegheny Mountains.

I have to believe that fans of schools like 'bama, Florida, Texas, Ohio State, USC, etc. chuckle when they read about fans of BE schools debating with fans of ACC schools about which conference has better football. Such a debate may matter to those fans, but they would be the only ones.

[BMoreX]

West Virginia and the Big East Conference are nearing agreement on a settlement worth at least $20 million that would resolve all issues between both parties, college football industry sources told CBSSports.com.

The Mountaineers will join the Big 12 for the 2012-13 school year. However, in a bizarre twist, sources told CBSSports.com that West Virginia officials have contacted future Big East members to see if one could join in 2012 instead of 2013.

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.co...a_txt_0001

[xudash]

http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports.co...a_txt_0001

Nice find, thanks.

However, the author should know better than to use the term "bizarre" when it comes to college football realignment.