Indiana Blows...

[GoMuskies]

First conference win for the Hawkeyes. Boy, it sure is sad watching Crean suck at IU.

[BBC 08]

Boy, it sure is sad watching Crean suck at IU.

No, not really.

[MADXSTER]

If IU really wanted to win they would have. Just ask any IU fan.

[MuskieMark]

Iowa needed this one badly. They very well might not win another big 10 game this year.

[GoMuskies]

No, not really.

Honestly, it just breaks my heart. What base did Crean wake up on?

[rhyno2110]

I can't wait to see all the Indiana fans get extremely restless, if they already aren't, when their top recruit, Zeller, can't lead this team to the NCAA's next year. It takes a team and a coach, something Indiana doesn't have.

[SixFig]

I'm looking forward to taking their transfers and recruits when Crean gets fired.

http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2008/07/31/images/drevil_lgl.jpg

[Benxman]

The heck with Indiana; every win by Iowa helps our RPI. Go Iowa! :D
Actually:

GO MUSKIES!

:logo:

[Xavgrad08]

Indiana basketball is like the women who was hot in highschool and has aged horribly. Yet she still thinks she is good looking, despite the obvious signs she is not.

[Masterofreality]

Honestly, it just breaks my heart. What base did Crean wake up on?

Travis "Steal" will just keep sucking the talent....and the life....out of Indiana.

[rhyno2110]

Apparently, Tom likes getting pounded so he can CREAM all over his players.

He thinks that'll teach 'em a lesson. Unfortunately, it hasn't, and the habitual poundage will continue throughout nights like these.

The legend of Tom Cream.

[X-Fan]

I'm looking forward to taking their transfers and recruits when Crean gets fired.

http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2008/07/31/images/drevil_lgl.jpg

LMAO!!!! Seriously one of my favorite replies EVER! If I could rep you I would.
Hilarious!

[MADXSTER]

Apparently, Tom likes getting pounded so he can CREAM all over his players.

He thinks that'll teach 'em a lesson. Unfortunately, it hasn't, and the habitual poundage will continue throughout nights like these.

The legend of Tom Cream.

With all that pounding, you'd think he'd be blind by now.

[AviatorX]

I go to IU, obviously more of a Xavier fan, but I have to say that there seems to be a lot of patience left for Tom Crean. I think everyone is willing to wait and see how the pieces fit together from the 2011 and 2012 classes before coming after the coach.

[X-band '01]

I'm looking forward to taking their transfers and recruits when Crean gets fired.

http://nymag.com/daily/entertainment/2008/07/31/images/drevil_lgl.jpg

I'd rep you too if it weren't for ObamaHood.

[golfitup]

IU fan is one of most arrogant in the country. Just because it says Indiana on their jerseys gives them a false sense of superiority.

[CinciX12]

Lets all take a moment out of our day to laugh at the pathetic excuse that Tom Crean is and why he doesn't deserve to coach a JV girls high school program. Are you ready for these numbers boys and girls? I really don't think you are. You need to get in the right mindset to comprehend this level of suck. Brian Gregory is going to coach in the Olympics (not the special ones) compared to this.

Since November 15th, 2008, Indiana has won 38 games. 38 games.

Since that time, they have the following marks:

6-38 in Big Ten play
4-44 against RPI top 100 teams

Let that sink in for a second. I am going to now go thank the lord Xavier will never be that pathetic. Even if a group of us on this board decided to take up coaching the team we could do better than that.

[smileyy]

Even with the complete evisceration done to that program by the Kelvin Sampson debacle, you might expect some glimmers of hope.

Which I think they're actually showing. I mean, I'm not saying they're good. They're above average. They just have no real non-con wins of note, and will get destroyed in the Big 10, because, well, the Big 10 is really good this year.

But seriously, they have a fairly good offense, and an average defense. They're a top-100 school. Not that that's a real high bar, but its progress over what was basically the death of their program.

[Masterofreality]

Except for the Duane Wade Final Four year, when everything broke right, Tom Crean never got out of the first weekend of the NCAA's- and only once past the opening game.

Ok, He's not a Steve Lappas, "Dr." Gianinni, or a Derek Kellogg, but he's no John Wooden either.

Marquette (Conference USA) (1999–2005)
1999–2000 Marquette 15–14 8–8 4th (American) NIT 1st Round
2000–2001 Marquette 15–14 9–7 3rd (American)
2001–2002 Marquette 26–7 13–3 2nd (American) NCAA 1st Round
2002–2003 Marquette 27–6 14–2 1st (American) NCAA Final Four
2003–2004 Marquette 19–12 8–8 8th NIT Quarterfinals
2004–2005 Marquette 19–12 7–9 9th NIT 1st Round
Marquette (Big East Conference) (2005–2008)
2005–2006 Marquette 20–11 10–6 T–4th NCAA 1st Round
2006–2007 Marquette 24–10 10–6 T–5th NCAA 1st Round
2007–2008 Marquette 25–10 11–7 T–5th NCAA 2nd Round

Crean is getting his clock cleaned in recruiting by Travis "Steal", Matt Painter and Brad Stevens. Even Beaknose still gets a player or two out of Indiana. If Crean can't win his home state, and he can't, he'll be gone soon.

[Muskie]

Getting Zeller has bought him at least another two seasons IMHO. If they can't put things together after that...

[MADXSTER]

Except for the Duane Wade Final Four year, when everything broke right, Tom Crean never got out of the first weekend of the NCAA's- and only once past the opening game.

Ok, He's not a Steve Lappas, "Dr." Gianinni, or a Derek Kellogg, but he's no John Wooden either.

Marquette (Conference USA) (1999–2005)
1999–2000 Marquette 15–14 8–8 4th (American) NIT 1st Round
2000–2001 Marquette 15–14 9–7 3rd (American)
2001–2002 Marquette 26–7 13–3 2nd (American) NCAA 1st Round
2002–2003 Marquette 27–6 14–2 1st (American) NCAA Final Four
2003–2004 Marquette 19–12 8–8 8th NIT Quarterfinals
2004–2005 Marquette 19–12 7–9 9th NIT 1st Round
Marquette (Big East Conference) (2005–2008)
2005–2006 Marquette 20–11 10–6 T–4th NCAA 1st Round
2006–2007 Marquette 24–10 10–6 T–5th NCAA 1st Round
2007–2008 Marquette 25–10 11–7 T–5th NCAA 2nd Round

Crean is getting his clock cleaned in recruiting by Travis "Steal", Matt Painter and Brad Stevens. Even Beaknose still gets a player or two out of Indiana. If Crean can't win his home state, and he can't, he'll be gone soon.

Daaaammmmmnnnnnn

Just goes to show ya how much a Final Four can do for a coach or program.

[jonz04]

Except for the Duane Wade Final Four year, when everything broke right, Tom Crean never got out of the first weekend of the NCAA's- and only once past the opening game.

Ok, He's not a Steve Lappas, "Dr." Gianinni, or a Derek Kellogg, but he's no John Wooden either.

Marquette (Conference USA) (1999–2005)
1999–2000 Marquette 15–14 8–8 4th (American) NIT 1st Round
2000–2001 Marquette 15–14 9–7 3rd (American)
2001–2002 Marquette 26–7 13–3 2nd (American) NCAA 1st Round
2002–2003 Marquette 27–6 14–2 1st (American) NCAA Final Four
2003–2004 Marquette 19–12 8–8 8th NIT Quarterfinals
2004–2005 Marquette 19–12 7–9 9th NIT 1st Round
Marquette (Big East Conference) (2005–2008)
2005–2006 Marquette 20–11 10–6 T–4th NCAA 1st Round
2006–2007 Marquette 24–10 10–6 T–5th NCAA 1st Round
2007–2008 Marquette 25–10 11–7 T–5th NCAA 2nd Round

Crean is getting his clock cleaned in recruiting by Travis "Steal", Matt Painter and Brad Stevens. Even Beaknose still gets a player or two out of Indiana. If Crean can't win his home state, and he can't, he'll be gone soon.

Wow. Those stats are relatively surprising and something to think about.

[smileyy]

Indiana just isn't a good job. The program is in a hole, and the expectations are ridiculously high. Even if Crean can get Indiana back to the NCAA tournament, he'll be fired for not making the Sweet 16 every year.

[DoubleD86]

Crean is getting his clock cleaned in recruiting by Travis "Steal", Matt Painter and Brad Stevens. Even Beaknose still gets a player or two out of Indiana. If Crean can't win his home state, and he can't, he'll be gone soon.

With all due respect, this is just wrong. Look at the 2011 class, then look at the LOADED 2012 class IU has. And he even has some supposed studs for 2013 and 2014 if I am not mistaken. Crean has not done much at IU, but the thing that will keep the heat off is that he has demolished the recruiting trail the past 5-6 months.

[Masterofreality]

With all due respect, this is just wrong. Look at the 2011 class, then look at the LOADED 2012 class IU has. And he even has some supposed studs for 2013 and 2014 if I am not mistaken. Crean has not done much at IU, but the thing that will keep the heat off is that he has demolished the recruiting trail the past 5-6 months.

Well, we'll see. Everybody around IU is putting a lot of eggs in the Cody Zeller basket. I submit this from an ESPN analysis:

"Will Cody Zeller have the same immediate impact as John Wall, Derrick Rose, Demarcus Cousins, or Greg Oden? No. Is he a surefire pro? Maybe not."
Bottom line, he's no Jared Sullinger. It's more likely that he'll take a couple of years to develop like our Freaser.

As for 2012, Perea and Ferrell are impressive gets, but no more impressive to me than Dee Davis (Ferrell) and Justin Martin (Perea). DSR's final decision will be interesting, but he's not even considering IU. Other guys haven't committed verbally so time will tell how it shakes out.

The deal is that now that Crean's gotten a couple of recruits, the Hoosier patience will be tested. There'll be no more excuses and he'd better produce- and a lot more than NIT first round exits.

[Power]

Indiana is a great job. They were in a bad position. Just like Cincinnati. You don't fix those type of problems in 1,2, or even 3 years. It is a 5 year rebuilding process. Luckily those schools have solid tradition and major fanbases while the problems get worked out. IU still out recruits everyone else for a reason. They will be back.

[MADXSTER]

Personally I think Crean and IU are very lucky to have so many very good recruits in their own backyard. IMO it would be hard for Crean Not to get a good recruiting class.

[AviatorX]

Well, we'll see. Everybody around IU is putting a lot of eggs in the Cody Zeller basket.

I'd say it's more of a situation where the eggs are in the Cody Zeller, Austin Etherington, Hanner Parea, Yogi Ferrell, and Ron Patterson basket. Plus there is still a chance a guy like Gary Harris decides to play his college career in Bloomington.

Whether you like it or not, that's a huge infusion of talent to add to what is somewhat of a solid core of players in Christian Watford, Verdell Jones, Jordan Hulls, and a couple of contributing freshman in Oladipo and Will Sheehy.

If Crean can't start to win some games with that talent, he'll feel the heat, but something tells me he'll start to be pretty successful.

[Masterofreality]

I'd say it's more of a situation where the eggs are in the Cody Zeller, Austin Etherington, Hanner Parea, Yogi Ferrell, and Ron Patterson basket. If Crean can't start to win some games with that talent, he'll feel the heat, but something tells me he'll start to be pretty successful.

I know that we were looking at Etherington, but, again, time will tell. He has almost the same scout's grade as Griffin Mckenzie did in his senior year. Not to say that he will not become a good player, but Crean is putting a lot of hope in a 3 star player who is only noted for being a "spot up shooter." Etherington only weighs 185 about the same as when Jeff Robinson got to Xavier. To expect him to be a difference maker- at least in the first year or two is a stretch.

Again, I'm just relating things that people can relate to with our players. Many seem to slobber all over every player that signs somewhere else and think that they will have immediate impact while dissing the guys that come to Xavier when they don't immediately produce.

Both angles are inherently wrong.

[DoubleD86]

As for 2012, Perea and Ferrell are impressive gets, but no more impressive to me than Dee Davis (Ferrell) and Justin Martin (Perea). DSR's final decision will be interesting, but he's not even considering IU. Other guys haven't committed verbally so time will tell how it shakes out.

You may be right, but not a single recruiting service even comes close to agreeing with you. Yogi is ranked in the top 25 on both Rivals and ESPN. Perea is a close to consensus (maybe consensus) 5*. That doesn't include Patterson or Zeller. They also have an ESPN Super 25 2013 player committed.

You can hate IU and Crean all you want, but to try to claim they are getting out recruited in the state of Indiana by anyone in the next couple of years is ridiculous.

I think very highly of Justin Martin and Dee Davis, but just like you claim some posters get so excited about other teams' players and downplay X recruits, lots of X fans overplay X recruits and downplay those going to other schools.

But like you said, time will tell...

[GoMuskies]

More embarrassing: getting shellacked by Iowa? Or being Indiana and having your fans storm the court after beating a pretty good (but not close to great) Illinois team?

[GoMuskies]

0-2 against Iowa. Solid.

[bobbiemcgee]

Getting Zeller has bought him at least another two seasons IMHO. If they can't put things together after that...

Dee Davis played in the same tournament with Zeller in the 2010 Hall of Fame Classic:

MVP Award ? - Dee Davis

[SixFig]

Who are three of the worst BCS programs in college basketball every year?

Colorado
Penn State
Northwestern

Indiana has lost to all three of them. AT HOME.

Makes me smile

[Xavier]

Didnt penn state have a shot at the NCAA tournament pretty deep into last season?

[SixFig]

Didnt penn state have a shot at the NCAA tournament pretty deep into last season?

I don't let facts get in the way of a good point.

[Xavier]

I don't let facts get in the way of a good point.

reps.

[xufan02]

I love watching Indiana lose; it must be because I hate Tom Crean.

[MADXSTER]

Who are three of the worst BCS programs in college basketball every year?

Colorado
Penn State
Northwestern

Indiana has lost to all three of them. AT HOME.

Makes me smile

Dude, this needs to be brought back to the top. Huge statement.

[Masterofreality]

...and getting blown out at Oh-ho-ho State.

With what Steve Lavin has done at St. Johns, think Hoosier fan is a little pissed that they turned Lavin, an Indiana native, down as a candidate a few years ago and hired Crean?

[X-band '01]

The Dispatch wrote an article about OSU's supposed "rivalry" with Indiana back when Knight was coaching the Hoosiers. I love how deluded columnist Bob Hunter is in claiming that OSU is the Big 10 flagship.

I'm sure people in East Lansing will have something to say about that remark.

[Juice]

...and getting blown out at Oh-ho-ho State.

With what Steve Lavin has done at St. Johns, think Hoosier fan is a little pissed that they turned Lavin, an Indiana native, down as a candidate a few years ago and hired Crean?

I hate Tom Crean but it also doesn't help that Maurice Creek got hurt once again this season. They still aren't a good team with him but they are better.

[golfitup]

Yes they do. And I'm loving every second of it. You oughta hear the IU fans around here. All they talk about is how good they'll be in two years. And they've been saying that for two years.

[MADXSTER]

Yes they do. And I'm loving every second of it. You oughta hear the IU fans around here. All they talk about is how good they'll be in two years. And they've been saying that for two years.

Dayton = Indiana ???

Red and White.....Red and White???

Delusional = Delusional???

Just sayin

[Muskie]

...and getting blown out at Oh-ho-ho State.

With what Steve Lavin has done at St. Johns, think Hoosier fan is a little pissed that they turned Lavin, an Indiana native, down as a candidate a few years ago and hired Crean?

Since Lavin coached at Purdue under Gene Keady (who is now a Lavin special assistant) I don't think IU was every really interested in him.

[GoMuskies]

Indiana will be back, but I'm loving every minute of the suck!

[vee4xu]

Hmm, wonder what kind of term they'd have if #52 wore red and white instead of blue and white? Guess Hoosier fans will never know. :D

[Masterofreality]

Since Lavin coached at Purdue under Gene Keady (who is now a Lavin special assistant) I don't think IU was every really interested in him.

I remember him being on the original list.

Bottom line is, by comparison Lavin made no excuses and just came in to turn St. Johns around in a short time. Crean just keeps making excuses.

[DoubleD86]

I remember him being on the original list.

Bottom line is, by comparison Lavin made no excuses and just came in to turn St. Johns around in a short time. Crean just keeps making excuses.

I know people love to hate Crean, but lets use a little bit of reason here. The St. Johns and IU situations were NOTHING alike. IU was decimated and left with very little. St. Johns has 9 seniors and some good talent. They were predicted to be a top 50 team by at least one prediction site.

Lavin has done a good job, no doubt. But the attention/hype he is getting for this "turnaround" is being blown way out of proportion. He took an experienced, talented, but underachieving team and brought the energy and excitement back into the program.

[Masterofreality]

I know people love to hate Crean, but lets use a little bit of reason here. The St. Johns and IU situations were NOTHING alike. IU was decimated and left with very little. St. Johns has 9 seniors and some good talent. They were predicted to be a top 50 team by at least one prediction site.

Lavin has done a good job, no doubt. But the attention/hype he is getting for this "turnaround" is being blown way out of proportion. He took an experienced, talented, but underachieving team and brought the energy and excitement back into the program.

Let us not forget that some of the "decimation" was caused by Crean himself, because he wanted to allegedly start with a clean slate. He also worked that into an extra 2 years on his contract.

Hey, either programs are "elite" Lexus or not. I thought that if you are an "elite" program, players would want to just fall all over getting to your school. This is Crean's 3rd year. Where are his "elite" level sophs and juniors? Errr, I don't see any.

I'm not sayng that Indiana should be at the same level as St. Johns, but by now they should be one helluva lot better than they are. Crean has basically u-dump level white stiffs playing in Bloomington. That won't get it done.

[DoubleD86]

Let us not forget that some of the "decimation" was caused by Crean himself, because he wanted to allegedly start with a clean slate. He also worked that into an extra 2 years on his contract.

Hey, either programs are "elite" Lexus or not. I thought that if you are an "elite" program, players would want to just fall all over getting to your school. This is Crean's 3rd year. Where are his "elite" level sophs and juniors? Errr, I don't see any.

I'm not sayng that Indiana should be at the same level as St. Johns, but by now they should be one helluva lot better than they are. Crean has basically u-dump level white stiffs playing in Bloomington. That won't get it done.

While I understand your point, I am not fully on board with it.

IU has had some bad luck (a couple key injuries the last two years). Without those injuries, these teams are not good, but they are better than what has occurred. Also, the first couple of years he didn't get the key recruits, but there are a mix of reasons for that. First, the kids were going to want to see some sort of stability or how things played out before committing to IU. Second, it didn't help that the last couple of years have been rather down years for Indiana high school. Unfortunately for Crean/IU, the good ones that did come out left the state or just didn't choose IU. But those recruits are coming, and coming fast.

I don't really like Crean, but I don't hate him or the IU program (some of my best friends are IU fans). However, the next two-three years should see IU return to a relevant, competant program on a national scale. If Crean does not get it done with the kids he has coming in, then he can be considered a failure.

People on here seem to harp on the fact that power/elite programs should instantly become better (IU and Arizona are often cited) and then mock when that doesn't happen. That is not how it works, however, it is MUCH easier to turn those types of programs around. If a lesser program than IU or Arizona had gone through those phases, it would be much harder to build them back up. That is the power of an elite program, not that they should instantly becomoe better. Just look at the recruiting classes Crean has locked up in 2011 and 2012. Then look at the record he has had in the last three years and explain to me why those kids want to play for that program? The answer is simple, they want to play for IU. That is what a "Lexus" program provides, not instant success.

[Masterofreality]

While I understand your point, I am not fully on board with it.

IU has had some bad luck (a couple key injuries the last two years). Without those injuries, these teams are not good, but they are better than what has occurred. Also, the first couple of years he didn't get the key recruits, but there are a mix of reasons for that. First, the kids were going to want to see some sort of stability or how things played out before committing to IU. Second, it didn't help that the last couple of years have been rather down years for Indiana high school. Unfortunately for Crean/IU, the good ones that did come out left the state or just didn't choose IU. But those recruits are coming, and coming fast.

I don't really like Crean, but I don't hate him or the IU program (some of my best friends are IU fans). However, the next two-three years should see IU return to a relevant, competant program on a national scale. If Crean does not get it done with the kids he has coming in, then he can be considered a failure.

People on here seem to harp on the fact that power/elite programs should instantly become better (IU and Arizona are often cited) and then mock when that doesn't happen. That is not how it works, however, it is MUCH easier to turn those types of programs around. If a lesser program than IU or Arizona had gone through those phases, it would be much harder to build them back up. That is the power of an elite program, not that they should instantly becomoe better. Just look at the recruiting classes Crean has locked up in 2011 and 2012. Then look at the record he has had in the last three years and explain to me why those kids want to play for that program? The answer is simple, they want to play for IU. That is what a "Lexus" program provides, not instant success.

Double, We'll just agree to disagree. Ohio State beat IU yesterday with a freshman kid from Indiana absloutely schooling them. Why didn't he go to IU?

As for "stability". IU gave Crean a 7 year contract for Gawd's sake. How much stability do you need to see? His contract length is still longer than any recruit will be at IU- even if they show up this year. Recently, he's publicly bitched about how his state is being raided.

As a more apt comparison. Our friend the raccoon HAS turned Arizona back around in one year with mostly frosh and sophs. Why can't Crean?

[MADXSTER]

Indiana = http://cdn.wn.com/pd/51/e4/66193dfe0db2875065b2d12baf3f_grande.jpg

[SixFig]

Indiana: 3-15 in Big 10 play

Dead last.

Good luck with your recruits Crean. You just put together a disgraceful season.

[Juice]

Indiana: 3-15 in Big 10 play

Dead last.

Good luck with your recruits Crean. You just put together a disgraceful season.

Finishing behind Iowa is inexcusable

[MADXSTER]

You mean Indiana wouldn't win the A10??

[GoMuskies]

Finishing behind Iowa is inexcusable

Getting swept by Iowa in unfathomable.

[MADXSTER]

Indiana couldn't beat themselves........I mean.........ugh...never mind.

[Masterofreality]

Indiana couldn't beat themselves........I mean.........ugh...never mind.

Public reps. I'm locked in Stalag.