Thirty Years

[Jesuit4Life]

Thursday, January 10th, 1980

What is the significance of this date?

Thirty years ago, the men's basketball teams from the University of Dayton and Xavier University participated in a basketball game at Riverfront Coliseum. The Dayton Flyers won the contest, 74-72 . It was the latest time their team departed the city of Cincinnati with a victory over the Xavier Musketeers.

How long is thirty years?

...............30 years............... 360 months
1,565 3/7th weeks
10,958 days
262,992 hours
15,779,520 minutes
946,771,200 seconds

What does thirty years mean to me?

I wasn't alive the last time Dayton won at Xavier... so, not having lived yet for thirty years, I cannot fully grasp how long it truly has been. However, I can compare it to something else I am familiar with. Being born and raised in Cleveland, I am a fan of anything Cavaliers, Indians, and yes, even Browns. I wasn't alive the last time any of these major professional sports teams won a championship - December 27th, 1964. But, having grown up as a Cleveland sports fan - suffering through the curses, the bad luck, the heartbreak, and inevitably, the montages depicting all of the above - I believe I have an understanding of just how long and how painful it has been for my fellow tortured brothers and sisters. It has been a damn long time, and a damn painful one too.

While thirty years is certainly not as long as forty-five and counting, I venture to say that it's been significantly and excruciatingly torturous for fans of the team up I-75. (If you encounter anyone who denies this fact, they are lying to you and to him-/herself.) They want to beat us. They want to be victorious over their hated rivals. And they want to do it within the Queen City. On Saturday, January 16th, 2010, their team, their coaches, their fans, and their community, will be fighting for what must feel like a perpetually unreachable goal... to hoist in celebration the Blackburn/McCafferty Trophy on Xavier's homecourt, for only the second time since the award's inception. They do not want to face yet another season of falling short. They do not want there to be a thirty-first anniversary. And they certainly do not want to be reminded of it with visages of the infamous Jimmy Carter.

Do not let them have the satisfaction. Do not let them be relieved from the anguish. May the streak continue.


What does thirty years mean to you?

[jcubspoe]

I've only been a UD fan for 12-13 years now so it's not excruciating to me but it is terribly frustrating to say the least. It's just one of those things that happen in sports. UD could literally be the #1 team in the country and not win down there. X gets way up for this game and from class to class it's being passed on....seriously, who wants to be on the X team that let's UD win down there again?????

BUT, and in no way am I predicting a UD win, far from it, if there was ever a year for it to happen, it's probably this year....on paper at least. We match up very very well with X for once. I don't see where X has a mismatch they can exploit against UD this year. Maybe Crawford. If Lyons can't go, that really hurts the depth that X can throw out there when UD will play at least 10 scholarship players and maybe 11 if Benson sees the court. I love Wright on Mclean and our bigs proved adequate last year against Love and Frease (Searcy didn't play at Cintas last year). X probably has a talent advantage at the PG spot but not an experience advantage and again if Lyons can't go then someone has to spell Holloway at times. I'll take CJ over DJ any day of the week and in a leap year.

Now, that being said, X could suit up the water boy and we'd still lose down there. Heck, Taylor probably goes off for 15 Saturday.

[SixFig]

GUARANTEE: There will be a pre-game piss match during warmups.

GUARANTEE: Dayton won't bust out those ugly black uni's again.

GUARANTEE: This will decide the A-10 crown.

GUARANTEE: Xavier will win

[boozehound]

I've only been a UD fan for 12-13 years now so it's not excruciating to me but it is terribly frustrating to say the least. It's just one of those things that happen in sports. UD could literally be the #1 team in the country and not win down there. X gets way up for this game and from class to class it's being passed on....seriously, who wants to be on the X team that let's UD win down there again?????

BUT, and in no way am I predicting a UD win, far from it, if there was ever a year for it to happen, it's probably this year....on paper at least. We match up very very well with X for once. I don't see where X has a mismatch they can exploit against UD this year. Maybe Crawford. If Lyons can't go, that really hurts the depth that X can throw out there when UD will play at least 10 scholarship players and maybe 11 if Benson sees the court. I love Wright on Mclean and our bigs proved adequate last year against Love and Frease (Searcy didn't play at Cintas last year). X probably has a talent advantage at the PG spot but not an experience advantage and again if Lyons can't go then someone has to spell Holloway at times. I'll take CJ over DJ any day of the week and in a leap year.

Now, that being said, X could suit up the water boy and we'd still lose down there. Heck, Taylor probably goes off for 15 Saturday.


I agree with this, particularly if Lyons doesn't go. This certainly seems to be one of the best chances Dayton is going to have for the foreseeable future. It is very much a 'rebuilding' year for the Muskies, I believe. That doesn't mean that I don't think we can be successful this year, but with Brown leaving and no real quality PF coming in coupled with young guards we are a bit weak this year.

[bourbonman]

Carter
Reagan
Bush 1
Clinton
Bush 2
Will we get to add another president to this list?

[Snipe]

http://cdn.wn.com/ph/img/48/a7/cb60cc0b07ee8dc03c7845291c45-grande.jpg

JIMMY CARTER!!!!!

http://store.cstv.com/marketplace/store/Vendor393/fullscale/I-879-c.jpg

SWEATER VEST!!!!!

[RealDeal]

NM

[XUglow]

http://cdn.wn.com/ph/img/48/a7/cb60cc0b07ee8dc03c7845291c45-grande.jpg


Hey Dayton, pull my finger.

[bobbiemcgee]

Bill Gates licenses MS-DOS. The Word "Internet" is first used (Al Gore?). Britney Spears was born. Reagan and the Pope were shot. Mortgage rates 16 to 21%.

[AdamtheFlyer]

I agree with this, particularly if Lyons doesn't go. This certainly seems to be one of the best chances Dayton is going to have for the foreseeable future. It is very much a 'rebuilding' year for the Muskies, I believe. That doesn't mean that I don't think we can be successful this year, but with Brown leaving and no real quality PF coming in coupled with young guards we are a bit weak this year.

Xavier presents a favorable matchup for UD for the first time in many, many years. There's no way Love, Frease and Taylor can guard Wright, so McLean may be the most important player on defense for Xavier. Chris Johnson will also provide a serious mismatch for X on defense. On the flip side Crawford and Holloway with get their points, but UD's guards will make them work and probably hold them under their shooting percentages. As long as UD avoids putting Fabrizius on McLean, they match up well defensively with any lineup X will play.

At UD and on a neutral floor I favor UD. In the Cintas Center you have to give the edge to Xavier until UD actually wins a game down there. But if UD can just shoot fairly well from deep, say 8-20, they will have a great chance to win.

[bobbiemcgee]

I'm expecting a wf, butleresque finish, with a better outcome, of course, but can't look past Charlotte.

[jcubspoe]

Snipe, being the great American patriot that you are, wouldn't you love to see the ghost of Jimmy Carter exercised at this point? It's really the last remnant of that awful Presidency, the fact that UD can't win down at X is the only thing even keeping Carter relevant at this point.


But then again, I'd hate to see an Obama legacy started now too! it might be another 30 years if we win Sat and I don't know if I'd rather here CARTER or OBAMA yelled every year. :D

[dc_x]

Xavier presents a favorable matchup for UD for the first time in many, many years. There's no way Love, Frease and Taylor can guard Wright, so McLean may be the most important player on defense for Xavier. Chris Johnson will also provide a serious mismatch for X on defense. On the flip side Crawford and Holloway with get their points, but UD's guards will make them work and probably hold them under their shooting percentages. As long as UD avoids putting Fabrizius on McLean, they match up well defensively with any lineup X will play.

The same thought crossed my mind when Hollis put up 17 pts in the first half yesterday. X has struggled against mobile bug guys all year (Hayward from Marquette, Udoh from Baylor, Hayward from Butler, Aminu from Wake, Hollis from GW). Like you said, we don't have a Derrick Brown type player who can defend those guys.

But I did like the zone that X threw at GW in the 2nd half yesterday. It really took Hollis out of the game because it forced him into taking contested jump shots rather than getting to the rim. I would expect to see X use the same zone against UD.

[DC Muskie]

Has Dayton shot 40% from 3 during one game at all this season?

[GoMuskies]

1) Bears shit in the woods.

2) Xavier beats Dayton at home.

[AdamtheFlyer]

Has Dayton shot 40% from 3 during one game at all this season?

They've shot over 40% twice, once away from UD. 5 times over 38%. To me UD's 3 percentage is all about selection. Fabrizius and Chris Johnson shoot 45% and 40% respectively, so they're able to get good looks UD will shoot well from three. Fabrizius is the key, IMO. When he's healthy and taking threes UD is a much better shooting team from outside.

And really, in a single game we're talking about one or two extra makes being the difference between 37% or 42%. Anything can happen.

[Masterofreality]

Carter
Reagan
Bush 1
Clinton
Bush 2
Will we get to add another president to this list?

Already did. Obama. Last win at Cintas- March 5, 2009- post inauguration.

[Jesuit4Life]

I'm expecting a wf, butleresque finish, with a better outcome, of course, but can't look past Charlotte.
Completely agreed, and I'm not usually one to look past an opponent (yes, I know I'm not on the team). But I couldn't let the anniversary pass without at least a little recognition. I expect we'll all be back to full-on "hate Dayton" mode after Charlotte.


Already did. Obama. Last win at Cintas- March 5, 2009- post inauguration.
Was just about to point this out; thanks MOR.
http://img1.fansection.com/img/showpics/d3/21/l36e863740002_2_6055.jpg

[Snipe]

Obama has me worried. If any President could rival Jimmy Carter....

[X-band '01]

Obama has me worried. If any President could rival Jimmy Carter....

By that logic, Dayton won't be a threat to win at Cintas until 2013.

[bourbonman]

Already did. Obama. Last win at Cintas- March 5, 2009- post inauguration.

Oops! I stand (kneel and sit) corrected.

[DC Muskie]

They've shot over 40% twice, once away from UD. 5 times over 38%. To me UD's 3 percentage is all about selection. Fabrizius and Chris Johnson shoot 45% and 40% respectively, so they're able to get good looks UD will shoot well from three. Fabrizius is the key, IMO. When he's healthy and taking threes UD is a much better shooting team from outside.

And really, in a single game we're talking about one or two extra makes being the difference between 37% or 42%. Anything can happen.

I just figured out that Chris Wright is not in the top 15 scorers in the conference and not in the top ten in rebounding?

Pretty incredible for a guy who was preseason POY. What's the deal?

[jcubspoe]

I just figured out that Chris Wright is not in the top 15 scorers in the conference and not in the top ten in rebounding?

Pretty incredible for a guy who was preseason POY. What's the deal?

I'd be willing to bet that if you look at the 15 players ahead of CW in scoring (he's actually tied for 15th) that everyone of them has taken more shots then CW. I had an X fan tell me in the preseason that CW won't win the POY because of UD's offense.....he might be right.

Crawford alone has 100 more attempts the Wright...100!!! But Crawford has a PPS of 1.21 to CW's 1.57.

Scoring leaders and their attempts:

Crawford 239
Green 222
Anderson 243
Gaston 212
Harris 201
Spears 166
Cothran 182
Gurley 182
Mitchell 178
Butler 218
Hollis 175
Brooks 216
Nicholson 153
Saunders 178
Wright 137
Clark 185

Jason Love has 105 attempts and Holloway 118! CW is closer to them in attempts then he is to ANY of these scoring leaders I listed!

Big difference in shot attempts. I predicted 18 and 8 for CW this year. The rebounding is there, the points aren't but we just aren't running the offense through CW right now.

[DC Muskie]

Why aren't you running your offense through your best player?

If your argument is Chris Wright has a better percentage of scoring per shot attempted, it would only seem logical that you need to be getting the ball into his hands more.

Maybe the fact BG runs out 15 guys every three minutes that prevents him from getting into a flow, or maybe because he subs so many guys so often, guys on the floor forget that Wright is out there with them.

Also, why hasn't Searcy displaced Huelsman in the middle yet? It seems Benson and Kavanugh aren't giving you guys anything in their first year.

[AdamtheFlyer]

The offense Dayton runs is quite atrocious, really. Lots of standing around and set plays off a high ball screen. And for some odd reason they think they're a three point shooting team. Cost them the New Mexico game, imo. Half court is still their kryptonite, but they're a bit improved over last year in that regard thanks in large part to Wright's improved jumper and Chris Johnson's development into both a 40% perimeter shooter and overall offensive threat.

To be honest, I think Dayton would be a much better offensive team if Wright would play a post role in the offense. He's good off the dribble, but not good enough to make that the focal point of his game, which it is right now. Put him on the block and he'll see more scoring chances, and there should be more chances for open jumpers outside when the defense collapses on him. I also think they're not tapping into Chris Johnson's abilities like they should. He's getting points on his own pretty much, rarely is a play called for him specifically.

They win games through defense, rebounding, and mismatches in transition. Not many teams can stop Wright, the Johnsons, and Warren on the run, so when they're forcing misses and turnovers on defense they tend to score in bunches. It's hard to deny that strategy is anything but successful the last couple of years, but I think there's a middle ground to be had. Maybe it's BG just maximizing the output from the talent on hand. We'll see next year, because the incoming players combined with the returnees will give BG his best offensive team talent by far, and the team should be weaker on defense.

As far as Huelsman, like I said above defense comes first, and Kurt is a very good defensive center. Very good. Searcy is playing a bigger role this year and is playing better, but still inconsistent.

Benson will be a stud in the A10. He is very skilled offensively with quick post moves, the ability to score with both hands, and a jumper out to 17 feet. He just lacks the muscle to play on defense right now. His redshirt year almost didn't count because of the shoulder injury. He only had a couple weeks of actual practice and couldn't add muscle. As a freshman, I'm very happy with him. Kavanaugh is a guy that has all the abilities to be a good player, and I am firmly on his bandwagon. But with BG's love of Huelsman he wasn't ever going to get minutes this year. It's hard to blame BG on that, because Kurt is having his best year. He's finishing his scoring chances better, playing great defense, and is actively rebounding instead of only getting boards when they fall in his hands. Shooting FTs around 70% at last glance, too.

[MADXSTER]

Adam, agree with most of what you said and will give you the benefit of the doubt regarding Kurt.

[jcubspoe]

Why aren't you running your offense through your best player?

If your argument is Chris Wright has a better percentage of scoring per shot attempted, it would only seem logical that you need to be getting the ball into his hands more.

Maybe the fact BG runs out 15 guys every three minutes that prevents him from getting into a flow, or maybe because he subs so many guys so often, guys on the floor forget that Wright is out there with them.

Also, why hasn't Searcy displaced Huelsman in the middle yet? It seems Benson and Kavanugh aren't giving you guys anything in their first year.

You don't watch a lot of UD basketball do you?

Kavs has given us zero, Benson has given us quite a bit when asked to. His min will go down again with Luke back and rightfully so. It seems Robinson hasn't given you guys much this year in his first year and it seems like Walsh in his second year is giving you much less then Benson is giving us.

Searcy brings offense to the team, Kurt defense but KH is having a pleasant senior season. Is he a dominant center? No. But when is Frease going to turn into the player everyone thought you were getting. Go look at Huelsman and Frease's numbers on the year...not a whole lot of difference.

Huelsman plays less then 2 min more per game and avg. 4.1 and 3.3 while shooting 54% from the field compared to a mid 30% last year and is shooting 65% from the line. Frease is avg about 6 and 5 while shooting 49% and 56% and turning it over slightly more then Huelsman, and he was a boarderline 5 star player coming out of high school and is on every single night, the tallest player on the floor.

Quite frankly, UD fans are very happy with our center position. Between three players we're avg. 12 PPG and 9 rebounds. Not bad when you can rotate three players in and get decent numbers, especially from our most maligned position on the team. Between your two players you're avg. 16 and 14.5. Better then UD? Yes, but then I could bring up what UD is getting from the 3/4 spot as far as rebounds go....15 between 2 players.

As far as getting the ball into CW hands more, I'll be the first to admit, Wright cannot create his own shot nearly as well as Crawford or many of the guys on that scoring list.

[BandAid]

You don't watch a lot of UD basketball do you?

Kavs has given us zero, Benson has given us quite a bit when asked to. His min will go down again with Luke back and rightfully so. It seems Robinson hasn't given you guys much this year in his first year and it seems like Walsh in his second year is giving you much less then Benson is giving us.

Searcy brings offense to the team, Kurt defense but KH is having a pleasant senior season. Is he a dominant center? No. But when is Frease going to turn into the player everyone thought you were getting. Go look at Huelsman and Frease's numbers on the year...not a whole lot of difference.

Huelsman plays less then 2 min more per game and avg. 4.1 and 3.3 while shooting 54% from the field compared to a mid 30% last year and is shooting 65% from the line. Frease is avg about 6 and 5 while shooting 49% and 56% and turning it over slightly more then Huelsman, and he was a boarderline 5 star player coming out of high school and is on every single night, the tallest player on the floor.

Quite frankly, UD fans are very happy with our center position. Between three players we're avg. 12 PPG and 9 rebounds. Not bad when you can rotate three players in and get decent numbers, especially from our most maligned position on the team. Between your two players you're avg. 16 and 14.5. Better then UD? Yes, but then I could bring up what UD is getting from the 3/4 spot as far as rebounds go....15 between 2 players.

As far as getting the ball into CW hands more, I'll be the first to admit, Wright cannot create his own shot nearly as well as Crawford or many of the guys on that scoring list.

Wow! those are impressive stats...

Especially against the stellar competition on your schedule.

[Filthy Chilean]

[QUOTE=jcubspoe;164590]I've only been a UD fan for 12-13 years now so it's not excruciating to me but it is terribly frustrating to say the least. It's just one of those things that happen in sports. UD could literally be the #1 team in the country and not win down there. X gets way up for this game and from class to class it's being passed on....seriously, who wants to be on the X team that let's UD win down there again?????[QUOTE]

Now now, lets not get crazy here. The dream of winning in Cincinnati is one thing but learning to fly superman style is another. There are limits my friend. Limits that even the mighty dayton will never obtain.

[DC Muskie]

You don't watch a lot of UD basketball do you?

I watch zero Dayton basketball. Mostly because I don't want to, but even if I did, where in the world would I catch a game?



Kavs has given us zero, Benson has given us quite a bit when asked to. His min will go down again with Luke back and rightfully so. It seems Robinson hasn't given you guys much this year in his first year and it seems like Walsh in his second year is giving you much less then Benson is giving us.

This is the beginning of what I like about Dayton fans. They spend the entire season telling you how the next guy coming in next season is going to be a real help, and then when he actually steps on campus and doesn't produce you like to point out that the 12th and 13th guy in Xavier's rotation is giving you less.

My response to this paragraph is this...Robinson came to the team in the summer. He wasn't in our plans for this season. Unfortunately we couldn't redshirt him.

Walsh is the 6th best guard we have on the team. Are you seriously telling me that Xavier should be concerned that Walsh isn't playing more? who's minutes does he replace?



Searcy brings offense to the team, Kurt defense but KH is having a pleasant senior season. Is he a dominant center? No. But when is Frease going to turn into the player everyone thought you were getting. Go look at Huelsman and Frease's numbers on the year...not a whole lot of difference.

This is my favorite part of the reply. You compare your senior center to our sophomore center. And yet you completely ignore our 3 time A-10 champion Jason Love.

Are you actually bragging that your senior center is producing the same as our sophomore center who is still developing? Am I reading that correctly?



Huelsman plays less then 2 min more per game and avg. 4.1 and 3.3 while shooting 54% from the field compared to a mid 30% last year and is shooting 65% from the line. Frease is avg about 6 and 5 while shooting 49% and 56% and turning it over slightly more then Huelsman, and he was a boarderline 5 star player coming out of high school and is on every single night, the tallest player on the floor.

While all of this may be true, do you forget the fact that we have a 3 time A-10 champ down low who produces? You're arguing that your best big man is the same as our second best big man, and then try and tell me that your third best big man and two guys who five months ago were going to produce haven't yet.

Interesting.

[jcubspoe]

Wow....so who's minutes is Kavs and Benson supposed to replace????

I didn't forget about Love. I completely included his stats when comparing the center position. And yes you read it correctly, I did compare your sophomore 4/5 star center to Huelsman. Sad that we have to do it isn't it? Even sadder for Frease really. I understand he's still developing but I have seen absolutely nothing that tells me he's a 4 star player out of high school. Nothing.

I'm not the one who took shots at your players first. You decided to get on here and blast Benson and Kavs when the EXACT same argument can be said for them. Who is Benson going to take minutes from this year?? Huelsman? Searcy? Fab? Wright?

[X Factor]

Wow....so who's minutes is Kavs and Benson supposed to replace????

I didn't forget about Love. I completely included his stats when comparing the center position. And yes you read it correctly, I did compare your sophomore 4/5 star center to Huelsman. Sad that we have to do it isn't it? Even sadder for Frease really. I understand he's still developing but I have seen absolutely nothing that tells me he's a 4 star player out of high school. Nothing.

I'm not the one who took shots at your players first. You decided to get on here and blast Benson and Kavs when the EXACT same argument can be said for them. Who is Benson going to take minutes from this year?? Huelsman? Searcy? Fab? Wright?

A sensitive Dayton fan, go figure. Nobody blasted Benson and Kavanaugh. It was said they weren't giving you anything this year, and everyone heard how those two guys would both have a big impact on your team this year. It hasn't happened.

[DC Muskie]

Wow....so who's minutes is Kavs and Benson supposed to replace????

I didn't forget about Love. I completely included his stats when comparing the center position. And yes you read it correctly, I did compare your sophomore 4/5 star center to Huelsman. Sad that we have to do it isn't it? Even sadder for Frease really. I understand he's still developing but I have seen absolutely nothing that tells me he's a 4 star player out of high school. Nothing.

I'm not the one who took shots at your players first. You decided to get on here and blast Benson and Kavs when the EXACT same argument can be said for them. Who is Benson going to take minutes from this year?? Huelsman? Searcy? Fab? Wright?

Hey cubbie, you're a Dayton fan coming on to a Xavier board, in the Smack forum. Grow a pair please.

Seriously, Kavs and Benson can't get minutes from Huelsman and Searcy? Seriously? Wasn't Like hurt for awhile? Doesn't Wright play more of a three anyway? BG runs out 10 players at a time, and Kavs and Benson can't crack more time from a guy who can't play defense and another one who is now just shooting over 50% from the floor?

All the talk about how "deep" Dayton is down low, and you can't find one guy who can get more minutes? UD is happy that a kid who has been on campus for four years is barely averaging what a kid two years younger at Xavier is producing? And you are PROUD of this?

[jcubspoe]

Muskie, yes, Luke was out and during that time Benson got some very good minutes....very good minutes and contributed quite nicely, every bit as much as Luke did but in a different way.

Benson had a 10 and 7 game which is probably more then Robinson has totaled all season. He added a 7 and 2 and a 4 and 8 game. His minutes will go down now though with Luke back because we desperately need the outside shooting more then we need Benson right now.

Now you tell me if CW plays the 3 or 4 in these lineups:

Starting lineup;
Warren, MJ, CJ, CW, KH

or this one:
Lowery, Williams, CJ, CW, Searcy

In fact the only time I've seen CW actually play a 3 spot this year is if the lineup is something like:

Searcy, Benson, Wright, MJ, Warren and this lineup has been rare. CW is playing the 4 for us most of the time.

As far as depth goes, I've explained numerous times to people that depth does not mean that you have 11 guys that all avg 16 points a game. It means that no matter who we bring in, we aren't seeing a drastic, if any, drop in production other then that from Wright or Chris Johnson. We lose nothing when we have to bring in Benson or Luke. X loses a ton if Robinson or Walsh get off the bench. Dayton can play 5 guys at the 4/5 spot and other then Wright, not allot changes. X can play 3 and after that it changes quite a bit with Taylor and certainly Robinson. Does that equal more wins for UD??? Maybe, maybe not....but it does mean UD has more depth.

I am one that you could hardly call a Huelsman fan at this point but we were stuck with him this year. And the fact is he has improved since last year. He's shooting almost 20% better from the field and 10% from the FT line. Huelsman was a nobody out of high school while Frease, yes he's only a sophomore, but a highly highly rated one at that. Do you think he's even close at this point to being what Aldrich was at this point last year for KU??? I didn't think so. As a 7 footer, Frease SHOULD be dominating out there. There's no one on the floor on a given night that his physical size, not Huelsman, Searcy, or anyone in the A10 for that matter. Quite frankly, and you will never agree with this, if Frease were only 6'10" instead of 7'0", you'd have a Huelsman on your hands.

What I'm PROUD of is that KH has improved and is helping this team out. You also make it sound like age matters when talking about a kid as highly rated as Frease. He wasn't supposed to be a project coming in. He's the highest rated player that either X or UD has had in the last 10 years or more. Has age mattered for the two star CJ??? Did age matter for the contributions you got from Sato in his first two years??? Frease may turn out to be a total stud in a year or two but so far he hasn't produced in comparison to what the expectations were.

[powerofX]

Now you tell me if CW plays the 3 or 4 in these lineups:

Starting lineup;
Warren, MJ, CJ, CW, KH

or this one:
Lowery, Williams, CJ, CW, Searcy



No can do...I don't speak in abbreviations. Or maybe I can....

DILLIGAF about Dayton?

A4114A...GO X

[jcubspoe]

No can do...I don't speak in abbreviations. Or maybe I can....

DILLIGAF about Dayton?

A4114A...GO X

DIAUIUGAFA Dayton?????

But apparently you do since you decided to waste your time and post in the thread.

[powerofX]

DIAUIUGAFA Dayton?????

But apparently you do since you decided to waste your time and post in the thread.

I will repeat a quote from above...this is the XAVIER smack board.

[DC Muskie]

Cubbie-

I'm a Xavier fan. I have no idea what CW, MJ, CJ, MF, CPMD, RUN-DC, or NWA, or whatever those initials mean.

Also I could have scored 10 points and pulled seven rebounds against Presbyterian. Oh and probably 7 and 2 and 4 and 8 against Boston U and App St. Sorry, Robinson hasn't yet been able to see the floor against Wake Forest or Butler. Benson played the same amount as Robinson in the KSU games. Benson played 2 minutes against Villanova. It looks like he got all of his minutes in the meat grinding portion of your non con schedule.

[DC Muskie]

What I'm PROUD of is that KH has improved and is helping this team out. You also make it sound like age matters when talking about a kid as highly rated as Frease. He wasn't supposed to be a project coming in. He's the highest rated player that either X or UD has had in the last 10 years or more. Has age mattered for the two star CJ??? Did age matter for the contributions you got from Sato in his first two years??? Frease may turn out to be a total stud in a year or two but so far he hasn't produced in comparison to what the expectations were.

Did you even watch basketball? Do you remember how in the Fake Chris Wright freshmen and sophomore years, that kid would fall for every pump fake and hack the crap out of the shooter? Does he do that now? I doubt it. Think age might come into play from someone who has such great talent as the Fake Chris Wright has?

Did you notice how Xavier redshirted Derrick Brown? Did you notice that Derrick went from a guy who grabbed 16 rebounds in a tournament game, to becoming a three point threat by his junior year? Do you think that age and time and development helped that along?

What do you expect from Kenny Frease? Double double? Should he have been a one and done?

You do realize you are criticizing a kid who is in a program that has consistently proven that players will be much better by the time they are done then when they arrived?

See BJ Raymond
See Stanley Burrell
See Kevin Frey
See David Freakin West

Kenny Frease is no Jimmie Binnie.

[jcubspoe]

Cubbie-

I'm a Xavier fan. I have no idea what CW, MJ, CJ, MF, CPMD, RUN-DC, or NWA, or whatever those initials mean.

Also I could have scored 10 points and pulled seven rebounds against Presbyterian. Oh and probably 7 and 2 and 4 and 8 against Boston U and App St. Sorry, Robinson hasn't yet been able to see the floor against Wake Forest or Butler. Benson played the same amount as Robinson in the KSU games. Benson played 2 minutes against Villanova. It looks like he got all of his minutes in the meat grinding portion of your non con schedule.

Any reason why Robinson has barely sniffed the floor then in at least 4 of your home blow outs then????

[jcubspoe]

Did you even watch basketball? Do you remember how in the Fake Chris Wright freshmen and sophomore years, that kid would fall for every pump fake and hack the crap out of the shooter? Does he do that now? I doubt it. Think age might come into play from someone who has such great talent as the Fake Chris Wright has?

Did you notice how Xavier redshirted Derrick Brown? Did you notice that Derrick went from a guy who grabbed 16 rebounds in a tournament game, to becoming a three point threat by his junior year? Do you think that age and time and development helped that along?

What do you expect from Kenny Frease? Double double? Should he have been a one and done?

You do realize you are criticizing a kid who is in a program that has consistently proven that players will be much better by the time they are done then when they arrived?

See BJ Raymond
See Stanley Burrell
See Kevin Frey
See David Freakin West

Kenny Frease is no Jimmie Binnie.

NONE of those players were as highly rated as Frease coming out of high school. Frease was a TOP 50 player. Yes, X has done a tremendous job of developing players, I can admit that. My point is, Frease shouldn't have needed the development of a 170 pound D. Brown, or a 3 star barely Top 150 Burrell or Raymond, ect, ect. Either Frease will develop and turn out to be a stud or the ranking out of high school was just flat out wrong on him.

[Masterofreality]

NONE of those players were as highly rated as Frease coming out of high school.

And the next dump player that is that highly rated will be the first.

[DC Muskie]

Any reason why Robinson has barely sniffed the floor then in at least 4 of your home blow outs then????

He came onto campus in July.

[DC Muskie]

Either Frease will develop and turn out to be a stud or the ranking out of high school was just flat out wrong on him.

Exactly. And he is developing. I'm not sure how this isn't like any other player ever recruited.