Lance Stephenson to UC?

[AviatorX]

This year's Brandon Jennings (only with criminal charges) is on a visit to UC right now.

http://www.zagsblog.com/2009/06/27/lance-stephenson-visiting-cincy/

Even Miller backed off this kid, along with tons of other elite schools. He's due in court Monday facing sexual assault charges.

[kdawg23]

Cronin is desperate. Funny though, I thought UC got rid of Huggins to clean up their image. I guess some things never change.

[GuyFawkes38]

I honestly almost feel bad for Cronin.

He was put in a crappy situation. Not to bash UC, which is a great institution (especially grad schools), but I think it's more difficult to recruit to an urban commuter school. Huggins did recruit some great talent. But it wasn't easy for him. He often had to seek JC players.

[muskienick]

Interesting article. I noticed that the Bearcats didn't get in the mix for him until some other schools dropped him like a hot potato after he was charged with groping a girl outside his school (Lincoln High School).

I also noticed that Arizona is also showing some interest in Stephenson. One wonders if its just some of the leftover effect from Book or if Coach Miller is taking advantage of the greater latitude he now has in the type of student-athlete he attracts to his program.

[gladdenguy]

Assuming everything goes ok, lance stephenson will sign with UC tomorrow.
Unbelievable. They just became a top 20 team.

[AviatorX]

Assuming everything goes ok, lance stephenson will sign with UC tomorrow.
Unbelievable. They just became a top 20 team.

There's your problem with Stephenson, no one knows. There's a reason that literally no one wanted this kid. A 5 star recruit should not have to desperately search for schools in late June.
Once (if) he gets on the court for UC, don't write them in the top 20 quite yet, Lance doesn't seem like he'd be the best teammate or do too much for team chemistry.

[Stonebreaker]

Playing in the BE in hoops is almost akin to playing in the SEC for football (almost). It's kill or be killed, and with so many teams in the darn league...you better be in the top 7 because a 20 win season may not even be enough to get into the NCAA tourney. I'm a big believer in having high standards, but coaches aren't judged by graduation (at least in terms of job security), future development in alternate careers, and the like...but by success on the court. Cronin almost has no choice, as his teams have been largely made up of players that, quite honestly, are not BE caliber. The natives are beginning to get restless, and he has to continue showing improvement AND get into the NCAA tourney. Otherwise, it won't matter if he has Rhode Scholars or thugs.
Also, if the admin and the AD sign off on the player, then he's not entirely at fault. I'm not defending him or the player in question...I am suggesting that his situation is tenuous, and if I were him, I'd take a flyer on the kid as well. UC needs talent, and they are in dire need. Major college football and basketball are no longer scholastic endeavors, but its own industries. I put the blame on the schools. If they took the high road and graded coaches more on graduation, personal (character) development, and conduct, and less on wins/losses and post-season accomplishments.....then the coaches wouldn't have to make questionable choices. If AD's weren't under the gun as well, then they wouldn't sign off on the players either. The problem is that it can't be just a handful of presidents who take a stand....as either they won't make a systemic dent, they move on, or even get fired by trustees or major donors who again, just want on the court success.
It's a bad formula.
I am thankful in knowing that neither X nor ND would consider taking the kid. They have achieved remarkable success even with the high academic/social standards placed (by choice) on themselves.

and hey, let's face it......it's just UC we're talking about. What would you expect them to do given the program exploding after Huggs left?
This was a spur of the moment post, so I can't say I put considerable forethought into this, so take it as such.

(sorry fellas and ladies, I just started typing and kept going)

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

In addition to the allegations of groping, Stephenson also has to worry about the NCAA investigating his amatuer status.

Apparently he visited under armor and had a reality TV show. So everything UC has done in the last 10 years will be investigated. They better hope nothing is swept under the rug...

[D-West & PO-Z]

Is there any chance this guy would stay more than one year? Why take the risk and trouble for one year?

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Is there any chance this guy would stay more than one year? Why take the risk and trouble for one year?

No. he's the all time leading scorer in NY state history. His options at this point are UC or Europe, unless another school comes out of the woodwork

He's gonna be a big time NBA player. Supposedly made OJ mayo look foolish a couple of times in a exhibition game after he challenged OJ as a freshman when they were both in high school. lit up the elite 24 at rucker park (was MVP 29 points - John Wall had 10).

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Now I've heard blogs are saying he'll sign Tuesday with UC. I can't find any but I guess we'll see.

[XU99deuce]

He's no OJ Mayo. He's not really progressed like a lot of the kids in 2009...

He's not overly athletic, but he's really tough. Reminds me of Ron Artest offensively. Defensively, he's no where close.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

He's no OJ Mayo. He's not really progressed like a lot of the kids in 2009...

He's not overly athletic, but he's really tough. Reminds me of Ron Artest offensively. Defensively, he's no where close.

When he played OJ, he was in the 8th grade i believe...But You're right about his defense. Although he's shown he can do it when he wants with some bigtime blocks. but this kid will definitely be 1 and done. his resume is pretty impressive.

If he's eligible this year, which really could go either way, UC could be top 25.

However, the kid is a big time headcase from what i hear. Extremely selfish. Could be extremely detrimental to the team concept in college basketball. We'll see i guess

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

UC fans are already coming out of the woodwork with ridiculous predictions. I've heard everything even final four...

I hope Stephenson goes to Europe. Now that would be hilarious.

[AviatorX]

UC fans are already coming out of the woodwork with ridiculous predictions. I've heard everything even final four...

I hope Stephenson goes to Europe. Now that would be hilarious.

Wouldn't shock me at all. In the latest Zagsblog post, Stephenson Sr. said Lance was still going through the recruiting process, even though some are saying hell commit to UC after his court appearance and its fallout.

[kyxu]

Every major program has backed off of Stephenson...except UC. If Lance's character wasn't in question, UC wouldn't have been given a second glance.

But whatever, Cronin has to start winning soon, so it's time to hit the panic button to win at all costs.

[AviatorX]

The USC team that added Mayo a few years ago didn't exactly set the world on fire, and I'd say they were probably more talented than UC will be if Stephenson plays.

[LutherRackleyRulez]

Now I've heard blogs are saying he'll sign Tuesday with UC. I can't find any but I guess we'll see.

JTT,


Here's what Adam Zagoria is reporting.....


“Word is Lance is signing with Cincinnati,” one Big East assistant coach said. “I think he will on Tuesday from what I’m being told.”

It is unclear if this is an official visit, but if it is it would be Stephenson’s fourth. He has visited Kansas, Maryland and St. John’s and Lance Stephenson Sr. recently said his son would take two more.

Memphis and Arizona may still be involved, but no visits have been set, as far as we know.
Other potential schools in the mix include Missouri, Pittsburgh and UNC-Charlotte, according to a source.



http://www.zagsblog.com/2009/06/28/lance-stephenson-to-cincinnati/#more-18497

[Juice]

Most writers have said its an automatic NCAA investigation into this kid once he signs. Good idea UC.

[therick44]

He was there on an official and he signed scholarship papers today. What would the investigation be for? The Underarmour thing? That was in Maryland and has no effect on UC and him going to UC.

[therick44]

When he played OJ, he was in the 8th grade i believe...But You're right about his defense. Although he's shown he can do it when he wants with some bigtime blocks. but this kid will definitely be 1 and done. his resume is pretty impressive.

If he's eligible this year, which really could go either way, UC could be top 25.

However, the kid is a big time headcase from what i hear. Extremely selfish. Could be extremely detrimental to the team concept in college basketball. We'll see i guess

My question is how do you win 4 NYC city champs and 2 NY state champs if you are such a seflish player? You can't dominate NY by yourself no matter who you are.

[AviatorX]

He was there on an official and he signed scholarship papers today. What would the investigation be for? The Underarmour thing? That was in Maryland and has no effect on UC and him going to UC.

Documentary entitled "Born Ready." Confusion over whether the family was compensated. I'll believe Lance is going to UC when he checks into a game for the Bearcats (see: Riek, John).

[therick44]

Documentary entitled "Born Ready." Confusion over whether the family was compensated. I'll believe Lance is going to UC when he checks into a game for the Bearcats (see: Riek, John).

Oh yeah I understand the skepticism as to whether he'll play. I agree with that and feel the same way, but he did sign scholarship papers today. Mick was the only one that stayed aggressive when everyone else backed off. The trial is tomorrow I believe and will result in nothing but a slap on the wrist or it will get completely dismissed.

[bobbiemcgee]

You're right. EVERYONE backed off cuz he's TROUBLE!! get it?

[AviatorX]

Oh yeah I understand the skepticism as to whether he'll play. I agree with that and feel the same way, but he did sign scholarship papers today. Mick was the only one that stayed aggressive when everyone else backed off. The trial is tomorrow I believe and will result in nothing but a slap on the wrist or it will get completely dismissed.

What a great recruiting job. Even Moneybags backed off.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

My question is how do you win 4 NYC city champs and 2 NY state champs if you are such a seflish player? You can't dominate NY by yourself no matter who you are.

I'm not denying the kid is a big time player.... of course i've read all his talents as well...

Just be warned.

If, and its a big if, it pays off, Mick will have a great team on his hands and the cincy media will be in his lap again. It will be a possible top 25 team.

If it doesn't, which nearly every college and national media source believes will this to be the likely scenario, then Mick could find himself out of a job and setting the program back through sanctions and NCAA violations.

To be continued...

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

What a great recruiting job. Even Moneybags backed off.

Ya sean saw whatever everyone else saw. This screams desperation for Mick. Its all or nothing

[therick44]

What a great recruiting job. Even Moneybags backed off.

I'm not saying it was a great recruiting job necessarily... Just saying that's how he landed him. The media is blowing all this stuff out of proportion a bit. I'd say he comes with some baggage, but he really seems to be a pretty good kid. As far as violations from the TV show... we'll see but there really isn't anything else that he's going to be in trouble for and Mick might have put UC back in the national spotlight. If he puts on a UC uniform it's an instant boost to their recruiting.

[Eastside_J]

Ya sean saw whatever everyone else saw. This screams desperation for Mick. Its all or nothing

Well you would be contradicted by every report that has come out recently some of which are literally hours old.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/06/29/2009-06-29_lance_stephenson_to_court_as_cincy_looms.html

Miller is still heavily recruiting Lance as is Memphis. And if he is cleared, (which given the description of the case sounds very likely) there will a boatload of other teams making a last ditch effort.

Which is not to say he will definitely end up at UC. Although I certainly think that if he plays college ball that is probably the most likely scenario.

AZ and Memphis might be decent options. Although both would take him out of the NY market for TV. Maryland is out of the question now given that Under Armour tour by their CEO and board of MD trustee member (how stupid is that, I am sure Gary Williams wants to ring his neck). Sean's dad ruled out NY teams so St. Johns and others are out.

UC is a pretty logical choice because it allows him to get out of NY, while still having most all his games broadcast there through the BE network. It is also the only conf that would send him back home (to MSG) for their conference tournament.

He is friends with new UC member Sean Kilpatrick and I am sure is pretty familiar with fellow rucker park legend Kenny Satterfield.

If the case is resolved via acquital or reduced charges AND the Stephenson recruiting carousel stops on Tuesday with an announcement, I think the answer will be UC.

If the case isn't resolved favorably for Lance OR the Stephenson's elect to continue their recruiting journey via other schools or Europe (unlikely), UC's chances go down dramatically. All bets are off.

Oh and the assumption that UC just jumped in recruiting Lance is incorrect.

[danaandvictory]

I can't tell you how happy I am that UC is getting this kid. That program has been so pathetic the past few years I couldn't even hate them properly.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Arizona and Memphis, according to the Zags article, are still interested. However, no one else has offered the kid. Maryland was about to until the Under Armor trip.

From what i've read, Arizona (Book) has backed off completely. Memphis I don't know about but it is my understanding that UC is literally the only school that has offered him a scholarship.

[Eastside_J]

Arizona and Memphis, according to the Zags article, are still interested. However, no one else has offered the kid. Maryland was about to until the Under Armor trip.

From what i've read, Arizona (Book) has backed off completely. Memphis I don't know about but it is my understanding that UC is literally the only school that has offered him a scholarship.

Book and Miller have been trying unsuccessfully to get Lance in for a visit for months. They started recruiting him long after his charges were pending and all the info about him has been out there. Why would they drop him now unless they felt they their was little to no interest on Lance's part.

Top NY kids rarely go that far west.

Regarding AZ and Memphis and no other offers - do you really believe that? Think about it, Zagoria knew absolutely nothing of UC being a potential avenue until he as already on campus for an official visit and had signed scholarship papers.

The Stephenson's have been torched by the media (and much of it has been earned). But there are LOTS of interested schools who want the kid badly but don't want to risk getting caught up in the media frenzy that surrounds him unless there is a high probability they could actually get a commitment from Lance.

[XU 87]

Some things never change. UC is out there recruiting some guy with pending criminal charges and Eastside Jay is over here defending the recruitment.

Is the rule over at UC still the same- if the guy gets the charge reduced to a misdeamenor, then all is well?

P.S. I stand corrected. The Post article says he has been charged with a misdeamenor. So it looks like "all systems go" for UC.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

My question is how do you win 4 NYC city champs and 2 NY state champs if you are such a seflish player? You can't dominate NY by yourself no matter who you are.

He's definitely a talent...BUT

"On the court, it was much of the same: bad shots, selfish play, terrible body language, cheap shots to the opposition, plenty of turnovers, predictably followed by him visibly blaming others for his own mistakes"

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Lance-Stephenson-1287/

And apparently he was cut from the US under 18 team, not based solely on his talent, but on his attitude.

Then you factor in a pending sexual assault charge, Possible NCAA violations including possible improper contact with an agent and possibly accepting money for his documentary, and his dad is supposedly a class act...(NY Daily News article http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/06/21/2009-06-21_end_zone_who_wants_lance.html?page=0)

Sounds like a recipe for disaster

[AviatorX]

Arizona and Memphis, according to the Zags article, are still interested. However, no one else has offered the kid. Maryland was about to until the Under Armor trip.

From what i've read, Arizona (Book) has backed off completely. Memphis I don't know about but it is my understanding that UC is literally the only school that has offered him a scholarship.

I think Memphis used up their last open scholarship accepting the transfer from Elliott Williams. Not sure if Pastner wants to go the Calipari rout of cutting players but I doubt it.

Eastside, There are already two signed recruits for this class on the Arizona roster hailing from New York. Book connection or not, that does nothing to support you're argument that Lance wasn't interested.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Book and Miller have been trying unsuccessfully to get Lance in for a visit for months. They started recruiting him long after his charges were pending and all the info about him has been out there. Why would they drop him now unless they felt they their was little to no interest on Lance's part.

Top NY kids rarely go that far west.

Regarding AZ and Memphis and no other offers - do you really believe that? Think about it, Zagoria knew absolutely nothing of UC being a potential avenue until he as already on campus for an official visit and had signed scholarship papers.

The Stephenson's have been torched by the media (and much of it has been earned). But there are LOTS of interested schools who want the kid badly but don't want to risk getting caught up in the media frenzy that surrounds him unless there is a high probability they could actually get a commitment from Lance.

I've heard from the Arizona crowd that it was Arizona, not stephenson, that ended the recruitment. Same with Maryland/ND/Kansas (Although Kansas was mostly because of the Xavier Henry situation). I've definitely heard that since Maryland has dropped out, Cincinnati is literally the only school that has offered him (But you're right cincy has been there the whole time, but they were far down on stephenson's list up until recently). FIU and Memphis are showing interest, but, to my knowledge, neither has offered him a scholarship.

[bobbiemcgee]

Mick could be the new Jerry Tarkanian with this pick. It's the classic "Risk vs. Reward". Lotta risk vs. possible one yr. reward.

[drudy23]

I hope they sign him. Seems like someone I'd like to dislike.

[XU 87]

I hope they sign him. Seems like someone I'd like to dislike.

I kind of agree. Sometimes I miss the Huggins years, particularly in the off season.

[Eastside_J]

He's definitely a talent...BUT

"On the court, it was much of the same: bad shots, selfish play, terrible body language, cheap shots to the opposition, plenty of turnovers, predictably followed by him visibly blaming others for his own mistakes"

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Lance-Stephenson-1287/

And apparently he was cut from the US under 18 team, not based solely on his talent, but on his attitude.

Then you factor in a pending sexual assault charge, Possible NCAA violations including possible improper contact with an agent and possibly accepting money for his documentary, and his dad is supposedly a class act...(NY Daily News article http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/06/21/2009-06-21_end_zone_who_wants_lance.html?page=0)

Sounds like a recipe for disaster

Trust me I have thought about that a lot.

Although he wouldn't be the first massively hyped kid with an ego to match. And it might be a tad tough to keep things in perspective if you have been a household name in the largest city in the country since the 8th grade.

On the other hand most headcases and "chemistry killers" don't lead their HS teams to a record 4 straight city championships and 2 state titles. His play style may be "me first" but the evidence suggests not at the cost of the "win".

And truthfully he is not incredibly fast, he isn't a great leaper and he isn't a deadly outside shooter. But watch him play and it doesn't take long to figure out that he has body control, strength and scoring versatiltiy that you really only see at the NBA level.

Book Richardson knows him better than nearly all the college coaches who are or have been pursuing him, why would he try so hard to get him on AZ's campus if he thought he were bad news?

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

I believe Book and Arizona bowed out officially 3 days ago

[Eastside_J]

Lance signed scholarship papers in Cincinnati on Friday. Coincidence?

Caveat: none of this means is meant to imply that I think Lance is a "done deal". His recruiting has had more twists and turns than an oil drilling rig. It might be over and then again it might not. Regardless his case has been adjourned until july 15th.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Lance signed scholarship papers in Cincinnati on Friday. Coincidence?

Caveat: none of this means is meant to imply that I think Lance is a "done deal". His recruiting has had more twists and turns than an oil drilling rig. It might be over and then again it might not. Regardless his case has been adjourned until july 15th.

Good point.

The case has been adjourned? Is he allowed to sign a LOI with this case pending?

[Eastside_J]

Good point.

The case has been adjourned? Is he allowed to sign a LOI with this case pending?

The LOI signing period is over. Any player committing to a team now just signs scholarship papers. They are non-binding however, so there really is no "signing" at this point whatsoever.

[AviatorX]

The LOI signing period is over. Any player committing to a team now just signs scholarship papers. They are non-binding however, so there really is no "signing" at this point whatsoever.

So you're saying he has signed the scholarship papers, and thus is as committed as one can be at this point?

[D-West & PO-Z]

I've heard from the Arizona crowd that it was Arizona, not stephenson, that ended the recruitment. Same with Maryland/ND/Kansas (Although Kansas was mostly because of the Xavier Henry situation). I've definitely heard that since Maryland has dropped out, Cincinnati is literally the only school that has offered him (But you're right cincy has been there the whole time, but they were far down on stephenson's list up until recently). FIU and Memphis are showing interest, but, to my knowledge, neither has offered him a scholarship.

I had heard Isiah and FIU wanted nothing to do with him.

[_LH]

If there were other offers from decent to good teams, top 25 caliber, there is no way he picks UC. Mick is rolling the dice on this kid and he knows he will not be around in 2011 if UC fails to make the NCAA's this season.

Lance will only play one year so Mick is hoping to ride him to a #12 seed and to save his job in the process, no matter what the risks are.

[therick44]

So you're saying he has signed the scholarship papers, and thus is as committed as one can be at this point?

Yes technically he is as committed to UC at this point as he could possibly be... The problem is it is non-binding for him, so he could end up doing this with 3 or 4 schools which I think is worrying UC right now.

[AviatorX]

Yes technically he is as committed to UC at this point as he could possibly be... The problem is it is non-binding for him, so he could end up doing this with 3 or 4 schools which I think is worrying UC right now.

I'm just curious as to why there's been no media report or whatever that he has indeed signed these papers, and is virtually committed.

[therick44]

He's definitely a talent...BUT

"On the court, it was much of the same: bad shots, selfish play, terrible body language, cheap shots to the opposition, plenty of turnovers, predictably followed by him visibly blaming others for his own mistakes"

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Lance-Stephenson-1287/

And apparently he was cut from the US under 18 team, not based solely on his talent, but on his attitude.

Then you factor in a pending sexual assault charge, Possible NCAA violations including possible improper contact with an agent and possibly accepting money for his documentary, and his dad is supposedly a class act...(NY Daily News article http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/06/21/2009-06-21_end_zone_who_wants_lance.html?page=0)

Sounds like a recipe for disaster

This is where the majority of his bad rep comes from. All the media types were at that tryout and saw him being a malcontent, and it has just snowballed ever since. The Stephenson's didn't do anything to help change that image either, and a lot of this reputation is their fault.

However, Stephenson was extremely friendly at the Deveroes league and is already friends with a few of the UC guys and also a couple of our X guys. He seemed to already "fit in" and apparently he dominated in UC's closed open gym Saturday.

[therick44]

I'm just curious as to why there's been no media report or whatever that he has indeed signed these papers, and is virtually committed.

Read my above post.

It is nonbinding for him and I'm sure that worries UC.

[AviatorX]

Read my above post.

It is nonbinding for him and I'm sure that worries UC.

So if he's so committed (as much as he can be), why is UC so worried? Just seems off to me. After talking to him on the visit, you'd think Mick would know that he was either solid or he wasn't.

[therick44]

So if he's so committed (as much as he can be), why is UC so worried? Just seems off to me. After talking to him on the visit, you'd think Mick would know that he was either solid or he wasn't.

Well actually I think one big part of that was they were hoping to announce it after his court case was settled today to try to avoid the media hoopla. Of course that just got adjourned again so who knows what will happen now.

... and really do you think UC is confident about anything with a recruit like this. I mean as much as Stephenson's recruitment has changed and with the Riek situation they are probably holding their breath.

[AviatorX]

Well actually I think one big part of that was they were hoping to announce it after his court case was settled today to try to avoid the media hoopla. Of course that just got adjourned again so who knows what will happen now.

... and really do you think UC is confident about anything with a recruit like this. I mean as much as Stephenson's recruitment has changed and with the Riek situation they are probably holding their breath.

True, true.

I'll say it now: I'll react to the Lance Stephenson era at UC when he actually checks into a game for the Bearcats.

[therick44]

True, true.

I'll say it now: I'll react to the Lance Stephenson era at UC when he actually checks into a game for the Bearcats.

I'm with you 100%. I would not at all say this is a sure thing. I'm just trying to pass along what I know.

[Eastside_J]

True, true.

I'll say it now: I'll react to the Lance Stephenson era at UC when he actually checks into a game for the Bearcats.

Exactly.

Right now they have the best chance of any program, with the emphasis on "right now".

My take on it is this: UC will be incrementally better again next year with the number of returning players and new guys with some real promise. How much better remains to be seen.

I do think they would benefit from an exceptional scoring talent like Stephenson even if for a single year. But if he doesn't come, he doesn't come. You can't miss what you never had.

[Xman95]

I do think they would benefit from an exceptional scoring talent like Stephenson even if for a single year. But if he doesn't come, he doesn't come. You can't miss what you never had.

However, if Mick is trying to build a program that sustains itself, those are usually built on the concept of "team" so that players can come and go from year to year and things still gel. If you have a player like Stephenson, he'll probably be looking out for himself and he could kill the "team" mentality all by himself. He might try to be a one-man show and that would mean another crappy season. And, quite honestly, I don't think Mick would have the balls to keep him in check.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Did not know that stephenson got suspended for a fight with his teammate in high school over a girl.

Also, if Mick can't handle Mitchell, how in the world is he gonna handle stephenson

[LutherRackleyRulez]

Per Adam Zagoria......SNY.tv


Source: Stephenson picks Cincinnati
Highly touted Lincon High School forward goes to Big East

By Adam Zagoria / SNY.tv


Lance Stephenson's stay at Cincinnati may be a one-and-done situation to wait out the NBA's age minimum. (AP)

NEW YORK -- At long last, the Lance Stephenson sweepstakes is over and the talented Lincoln High School player is going to the Big East.

"They've decided. He's off to Cincinnati," said a source close to the family with direct knowledge of the decision. "It's a done deal. I am certain of this."


For full article.....





http://web.sny.tv/news/article.jsp?ymd=20090630&content_id=5614770&oid=2&vkey=21

[DC Muskie]

This is going to be awesome to watch. Best of luck!

[xunorm]

This is probably Cronin's last ditch effort to try to get UC back to the tourney because he knows this is his 4th year, and he needs to have good results. He just better hope it doesn't backfire.

[XU 87]

This is probably Cronin's last ditch effort to try to get UC back to the tourney because he knows this is his 4th year, and he needs to have good results. He just better hope it doesn't backfire.


They just gave him a two year extension. I doubt they did that if they had any thoughts of firing him at the end of the year.

[MuskieCinci]

They just gave him a two year extension. I doubt they did that if they had any thoughts of firing him at the end of the year.

The extension was just given to help with recruiting. Other coaches were telling kids that were being recruited by UC that Cronin was going to be gone in a year or two so UC gave him an extension so that he could refute those allegations. He isn't making any more money because of the extension and I'm pretty sure everyone knows that college coaches' contract extensions aren't worth the paper they are written on.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

This is unbelievable. Does anyone know anything about the chances of him actually being eligible? I would guess its around 50/50

[bobbiemcgee]

I thought the "Huggs for Thugs" era was over at UC.....guess not.

[PMI]

I can't wait to whoop his ass in the Shootout next year! This is great for all of us though. Bringing in not only a super-talented baller, but also a Hugginsesque thuggish-image player to the Bearcats should help add a little fire to a rivalry that has been perceived to have fizzled a bit under Sippin' Mick's tenure. The rivalry was at its strongest when it was Catholics vs. Convicts, and regardless of the fact that the underdog role has reversed, I think the rivalry will be better when there is a distinct disparity between the perceived images of the two teams.

I'm really looking forward to hating UC more like I did 10 years ago than the last few years.

[XU05and07]

I thought the "Huggs for Thugs" era was over at UC.....guess not.

This wouldn't happen if Nancy was still there

[Mark 3 Pointer]

It must be official... A turd UC fan I work with just went running to every office telling people the news.

They may be very good next year... but they'll probably lose Stephenson and Gates after next year and they definately lose Vaughn. Then it's back to the drawing board for Mick and Company.

[bobbiemcgee]

http://nkysportsworld.blogspot.com/2009/06/is-lance-stephenson-worth-it.html

[kyxu]

It must be official... A turd UC fan I work with just went running to every office telling people the news.

They may be very good next year... but they'll probably loose Stephenson and Gates after next year and they definately loose Vaughn. Then it's back to the drawing board for Mick and Company.

Stephenson may not play a minute of college basketball

[bobbiemcgee]

SI reporting he had 2 offers......New York Penal and UC...

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

I've already heard "UC is going to the final four" comments.

[SixFig]

Maybe a win over UC this year will actually give us an RPI boost

[XU 87]

The extension was just given to help with recruiting. Other coaches were telling kids that were being recruited by UC that Cronin was going to be gone in a year or two so UC gave him an extension so that he could refute those allegations. He isn't making any more money because of the extension and I'm pretty sure everyone knows that college coaches' contract extensions aren't worth the paper they are written on.

I don't doubt the extension was given to help with recruiting. But I do doubt that UC gives him an extension if this was a make or break year.

As for your comment that contracts are meaningless, that's true to to the extent they are meaningless when a coach wants to break them. They are not meaningless when the school fires the coach and the coach still has a few years left. When that occurs, the school has to pay the coach for the additional years. So if UC fires Cronin at the end of this year, they still owe him for 4 more years at about 900k per year.

[Masterofreality]

This is going to be awesome to watch.


......or horrible to behold!

[mohr5150]

I guess Mick learned that he just couldn't be loved at UC without going to the thug well.

[Masterofreality]

Well, well, well....

This guy has already had an assault charge against him. Perfect.

He follows in the long line of ucrap recruits like BJ Grove, Donald Little and Robert Whaley. Nice that Mick is trying to "Restore the Roar" by going back to getting quality student-athletes.

Remember Whaley? Stephenson is a carbon copy of that guy. Allegedly talented, but a character mess. Every major college passed on Whaley until bloated bobby thuggs came riding in on his drunk bus to pick him up and chauffer him to Borecat land.

Whaley proved to be a huge bust. Lazy, unmotivated and stupid. Me thinks that Mr. Stephenson is cut from the same cloth.

[Eastside_J]

8 pages?

Take it easy fellas the guy isn't even official. No need to start the reflexive anti-uc jabbering. And no need circle the wagons and break into cold sweats at this point. The guy who may never come.

Its like someone rang the pavlovian bell over here.

[bobbiemcgee]

well, UC was mentioned.........

[D-West & PO-Z]

well, UC was mentioned.........

Ya, this kid isnt even on the team for sure yet and he is already helping the rivalry. Hope he ends up playing.

[Ensenberger]

Lance is charged with groping a female student outside of school with no (zero) witnesses, he is a future lottery pick, not shocked someone would try and get something out of him. IDK if he did it or not, but our players have done worse things in the past 5 years than this! As far as his reality online show, I know nothing about it, or if it effects anything. I'm not gonna lie, i'm jealous UC landed such a talented player. This kid is fine academically, has a minor misdemeanor charge that will likely get thrown out, and eligibility issues that don't sound like they will amount to anything either. If X signed this kid we would all be singing his praises. Props to UC, and props to Mick. Now, lets beat them and show them how much this signing really doesn't matter to us, because they are still number 2 in the city

[kyxu]

Lance is charged with groping a female student outside of school with no (zero) witnesses, he is a future lottery pick, not shocked someone would try and get something out of him. IDK if he did it or not, but our players have done worse things in the past 5 years than this! As far as his reality online show, I know nothing about it, or if it effects anything. I'm not gonna lie, i'm jealous UC landed such a talented player. This kid is fine academically, has a minor misdemeanor charge that will likely get thrown out, and eligibility issues that don't sound like they will amount to anything either. If X signed this kid we would all be singing his praises. Props to UC, and props to Mick. Now, lets beat them and show them how much this signing really doesn't matter to us, because they are still number 2 in the city

I think you're severely understating some of his eligibility issues.

And I'm fairly confident I would not be singing praises if he decided to come to Xavier, which is a silly proposition considering Xavier would never be interested in this type of player and vice versa.

[Ensenberger]

what about Lavendar, and finn? lol Granted their problems were after they were here. But I really don't think his eligibility issue are all that bad. Does UC really have anything to lose? Its not like LS was getting paid by UC, he had an internet tv show... could be worse.

[xavierj]

I think Mick is taking a huge gamble. Good luck to the kid. My guess is in 9 months this kid either makes Mick look good or makes Mick look for another job. Kid is a 6 month rent a player and will not attend a single class after Christmas. I have a feeling Deonta will be a little upset by mid-year watching this kid never pass the ball. It should be fun to watch one way or the other if they can get him on the floor which will be a very tall task and the odds are about 20% he ever plays a minute in Clifton.

[AviatorX]

I think Mick is taking a huge gamble. Good luck to the kid. My guess is in 9 months this kid either makes Mick look good or makes Mick look for another job. Kid is a 6 month rent a player and will not attend a single class after Christmas. I have a feeling Deonta will be a little upset by mid-year watching this kid never pass the ball. It should be fun to watch one way or the other if they can get him on the floor which will be a very tall task and the odds are about 20% he ever plays a minute in Clifton.

Yeah, I'm not really expecting him to play, at all. Therefore, I'm not worried about losing to UC.

[kyxu]

what about Lavendar, and finn? lol Granted their problems were after they were here. But I really don't think his eligibility issue are all that bad. Does UC really have anything to lose? Its not like LS was getting paid by UC, he had an internet tv show... could be worse.

What issues did Lavender and Finn have before coming to Xavier other than a misdemeanor on which Lavender was never charged? But like you conceded...it's a silly comparison.

And I'm not talking as much about Stephenson's criminal charge as much as the challenges to his amateur status. I think it goes beyond his internet TV show. It's definitely a concern toward his eligibility.

[kellernr]

Xavier Henry is now thinking of jumpin from KU to UK. If he does that Kansas will be all over Stephenson again. If Lance is smart he would take KU up on the offer if it plays out like that. He would get more nationally televised games with Kansas then he would with uc and I really dont want to play against uc if this guy is there. They instantly become a better team with him.

[bobbiemcgee]

If Lavender was caught in Denver, he would have got a $55.00 ticket or maybe no ticket, just a warning, as small amounts of grass are legal here.

[Stonebreaker]

This guy was the number one player in the class before he got into some trouble. For UC, it's HUGE news. He may never play, but if he does...UC just became relevent again.
and yeah, the Xtown Shootout would be pretty dang exciting.

[AviatorX]

Would UC + Stevenson be any better than USC + Mayo a few years ago? They barely got in to the dance and got beat down by Beasley and co. in round 1.

[Eastside_J]

Xavier Henry is now thinking of jumpin from KU to UK. If he does that Kansas will be all over Stephenson again. If Lance is smart he would take KU up on the offer if it plays out like that. He would get more nationally televised games with Kansas then he would with uc and I really dont want to play against uc if this guy is there. They instantly become a better team with him.

According to Zagsblog, X Henry is most likely gone and Kansas has already contacted LS to try to sell him back.

It was definitely his first choice back when they first recruited him but now I don't know whether that option looks so good.

[AviatorX]

According to Zagsblog, X Henry is most likely gone and Kansas has already contacted LS to try to sell him back.

It was definitely his first choice back when they first recruited him but now I don't know whether that option looks so good.

As much as I dislike UC, I have to admit that situation would be pretty shitty.

EDIT: Quick check of catspause.com (always quality entertainment) and there are a few posts saying that the Henrys are staying with the Jayhawks.

[xsteve1]

Henry is staying at KU for now.

[Xman95]

According to Yahoo, Stephenson to UC is official. Here's a post from Eamonn Brennan and I HIGHLY RECOMMEND it. It's definitely worth the couple minutes it takes to read it. Enjoyment is guaranteed (ie - he basically rips on UC and Huggs).

Stephenson to UC (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/blog/the_dagger/post/Lance-Stephenson-Cincinnati-it-is?urn=ncaab,174046)

[AviatorX]

Born Ready for Big East mediocrity and jumping ship to get drafted by the Warriors/Clippers/Kings next year.

[xubball93]

According to Yahoo, Stephenson to UC is official. Here's a post from Eamonn Brennan and I HIGHLY RECOMMEND it. It's definitely worth the couple minutes it takes to read it. Enjoyment is guaranteed (ie - he basically rips on UC and Huggs).

Stephenson to UC (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/blog/the_dagger/post/Lance-Stephenson-Cincinnati-it-is?urn=ncaab,174046)
You beat me to it. I loved the closing line of Brennan's post.

[Juice]

I wonder if this would have happened if Nancy was still at UC (Sorry if this has been brough up in the 90 something earlier posts). I want to say no.

This is a desperate move by a desperate coach/program.

[danaandvictory]

I see Daugherty is still a card-carrying member of the UC Political Machine with his dross today. Kind of funny how Mike Brown is a civic embarassment when he takes on character problems but Sippin' Mick is just "competin'".

[xu2013]

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/07/02/2009-07-02_university_of_cincinnati_doesnt_see_problem_wit h_lance_stephensons_eligibility.html

Man this kid just looks like a choir boy. Am I the only one wondering why his eyes are bloodshot in the photo?

[bobbiemcgee]

I hope they enjoy the 8 month ride. It's gonna get ugly.

[xunorm]

I love reading the reader comments in the Enquirer. X signs Robinson, and people are all over Mack and how he has lowered his standards. Mic signs Stevenson, and they have found the savior for the program. Let's see how they feel about their roster in a year after Stevenson leaves, Vaughn graduates, and Gates never develops. They might enjoy this year, but in the long run, they still won't have anybody that can score consistently.



I love the one headline on the site: "Lance settles for Cincinnati"

[bearcat65]

I love reading the reader comments in the Enquirer. X signs Robinson, and people are all over Mack and how he has lowered his standards. Mic signs Stevenson, and they have found the savior for the program. Let's see how they feel about their roster in a year after Stevenson leaves, Vaughn graduates, and Gates never develops. They might enjoy this year, but in the long run, they still won't have anybody that can score consistently.



I love the one headline on the site: "Lance settles for Cincinnati"

While I'm concerned about some of what has been written about Stephenson I really don't see how this is that much of a gamble. If he doesn't suit up then UC is no worse off than they would have been had they not signed him. But if he does suit up and is the player that most think he is then it could result in a lot of good things for UC.

[West is Best]

This could make the shootout tough. There's absolutely nobody on our roster who's capable of guarding him. I've got my fingers crossed that this is John Riek #2.

[AviatorX]

This could make the shootout tough. There's absolutely nobody on our roster who's capable of guarding him. I've got my fingers crossed that this is John Riek #2.

There was no one that could guard Beasley either...oh wait.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

UC has had some great players (Fortson, Kenyon Martin, DeMarr, Kenny Saterfield, Ruben Patterson, etc) , and we've more than held our own. College basketball is about the team. Thats one of the reasons I believe UK will not win the NCAA tournament. Too much talent on that team. As for stephenson, if he is eligible (and thats a big IF), theres a strong possibility he could hinder that teams progression.

[Eastside_J]

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/07/02/2009-07-02_university_of_cincinnati_doesnt_see_problem_wit h_lance_stephensons_eligibility.html

Man this kid just looks like a choir boy. Am I the only one wondering why his eyes are bloodshot in the photo?

Yeah, you are almost certainly the only one.

The kid is the all time career scorer in NY HS history.

The only player ever to lead his team to 4 consecutive NY city league titles.

Led his team to 2 NY State Championships.

And if I am placing this photo correctly, and I am pretty certain I am, he is being interviewed after playing in his final HS game where he lost to Rice in the semi-finals of the NY state stournament.

He ends the greatest ever HS run for both a NY public HS team and on an indivdual basis ends as the #1 scorer in the history of the state. And he is a little emotional about seeing it end.

Yeah, bad kid right? Suspicious about the red eyes, huh?

[bobbiemcgee]

There was no one that could guard Beasley either...oh wait.

Or tyreke evans...oh, wait

[SixFig]

There's absolutely nobody on our roster who's capable of guarding him.

What Mack needs to do is walk up and put a photo of Stephenson on Dante's locker and say "We're going to make you into a defender so fierce this guy's gonna regret ever stepping foot in Clifton".

Then go to work

[wkrq59]

Read the story in the Daily News--slug: Who Wants Lance? and you'll see why the NBA's stupid age 19 rule absolutely has to go.
There are so many red flags waving over this young man that most of the big name schools want nothing to do with him, for two reasons : 1)He's only going to be a one-year wonder, 2)His father is the biggest red flag of all.
I really feel for Mick Cronin because I'll guarantee you the father will be at every game loudly criticizing every move, or he'll be on the phone or internet second guessing him every day.
If even St. John's, which needs talent like Dracula needs blood, backs off, you know there are problems; huge problems.:D:D:D

[West is Best]

There was no one that could guard Beasley either...oh wait.

Beasley was a big time scoring threat, but we had a player with a similar build in Josh Duncan. This is a little different... we don't have a 6'6" perimeter defender next year. Dante is a good defender, but he's much thinner than Stephenson. If Raymond was still around, I'd be comfortable, but this will be a lot harder than containing Beasley.

[Masterofreality]

What Mack needs to do is walk up and put a photo of Stephenson on Dante's locker and say "We're going to make you into a defender so fierce this guy's gonna regret ever stepping foot in Clifton".


Correct.

Stephenson........meet Mister Jackson!

[Eastside_J]

Read the story in the Daily News--slug: Who Wants Lance? and you'll see why the NBA's stupid age 19 rule absolutely has to go.
There are so many red flags waving over this young man that most of the big name schools want nothing to do with him, for two reasons : 1)He's only going to be a one-year wonder, 2)His father is the biggest red flag of all.
I really feel for Mick Cronin because I'll guarantee you the father will be at every game loudly criticizing every move, or he'll be on the phone or internet second guessing him every day.
If even St. John's, which needs talent like Dracula needs blood, backs off, you know there are problems; huge problems.:D:D:D


You should have suspected some incomplete info Q102. (But I can understand why you would choose not to ;) ) How else does a story like this completely miss out on the fact that he had been talking to and had interest in UC for the last two years.

If you check the UC boards, people have been talking about Lance being a near lock to go to UC ever since Kansas Signed Henry (and Lance stopped talking to the press about his offers and intentions). Even more hilarious this "piece" came out on June 21st, which is the precise day that I got a message from someone who would know these things that Lance was headed to UC the next weekend and was signing with the program And this guy says Memphis was his only offer?

He was just as wrong about why St. Johns backed off. St. Johns wanted him in the worst way, so did Arizona. Sure they "backed off", the guy never agreed to an official visit with either program and was scheduled to fly to UC.

Fact is there were still a ton of teams contacting him up and offering him until and after he committed to UC, including Kansas. All of which makes the recent string of negative stories read like sensationalist copy-cat hackwork.

Funny how the NY papers (and national sports media outlets) treated him so much better before he stopped giving them information about who was recruiting him and who he was considering.

The story looks like swiss cheese now. It is a piece of garbage.

[AviatorX]

Beasley was a big time scoring threat, but we had a player with a similar build in Josh Duncan. This is a little different... we don't have a 6'6" perimeter defender next year. Dante is a good defender, but he's much thinner than Stephenson. If Raymond was still around, I'd be comfortable, but this will be a lot harder than containing Beasley.

Crawford and Jackson will do just fine on him (if he's eligible.) It's not like he's going to single handily win the game for UC (if he's eligible).

Also, FWIW, Love deserves the credit for shutting down Beasley more than Duncan, IMO.

[xavierj]

You should have suspected some incomplete info Q102. (But I can understand why you would choose not to ;) ) How else does a story like this completely miss out on the fact that he had been talking to and had interest in UC for the last two years.

If you check the UC boards, people have been talking about Lance being a near lock to go to UC ever since Kansas Signed Henry (and Lance stopped talking to the press about his offers and intentions). Even more hilarious this "piece" came out on June 21st, which is the precise day that I got a message from someone who would know these things that Lance was headed to UC the next weekend and was signing with the program And this guy says Memphis was his only offer?

He was just as wrong about why St. Johns backed off. St. Johns wanted him in the worst way, so did Arizona. Sure they "backed off", the guy never agreed to an official visit with either program and was scheduled to fly to UC.

Fact is there were still a ton of teams contacting him up and offering him until and after he committed to UC, including Kansas. All of which makes the recent string of negative stories read like sensationalist copy-cat hackwork.

Funny how the NY papers (and national sports media outlets) treated him so much better before he stopped giving them information about who was recruiting him and who he was considering.

The story looks like swiss cheese now. It is a piece of garbage.


I am sure the kid was dying to go to a school who has not been to the tourney for 4 years and has not won a game in March since Mick has been there? Who wouldn't? I mean really I could go to any school in the country or UC? Which is it? Aw no brainer, UC. Yeah OK.

[XU 87]

Eastside Jay, I get it now! Rivals is wrong when they said this kid is big time trouble and that UC was the only school recruiting him. The New York papers and other national media outlet are also wrong. And now we know why- each and every media outlet threw this kid under the bus because he "stopped giving them information."

Yes, it all makes sense to me now. It is well known that all media outlets will simply destroy an 18 year old kid, and then lie about the kid, if he refuses to give info about his recruiting.

So every media outlet in the country is wrong. And some internet goof named Eastside Jay is right.

[_LH]

Eastside Jay, I get it now! Rivals is wrong when they said this kid is big time trouble and that UC was the only school recruiting him. The New York papers and other national media outlet are also wrong. And now we know why- each and every media outlet threw this kid under the bus because he "stopped giving them information."

Yes, it all makes sense to me now. It is well known that all media outlets will simply destroy an 18 year old kid, and then lie about the kid, if he refuses to give info about his recruiting.

So every media outlet in the country is wrong. And some internet goof named Eastside Jay is right.

EJ is clearly clueless and just hoping like crazy UC does not get on probation for having a kid like KS on their team. Its only a matter of time before he violates another NCAA rule by accepting cash or other gifts. Every program in the country knows this including UC but UC is the only program desperate enough to roll the dice.

[dc_x]

While I'm concerned about some of what has been written about Stephenson I really don't see how this is that much of a gamble. If he doesn't suit up then UC is no worse off than they would have been had they not signed him. But if he does suit up and is the player that most think he is then it could result in a lot of good things for UC.

The risk is that the NCAA finds an issue after he plays some games...kind of like the Derrick Rose and OJ Mayo situations.

[Eastside_J]

Paging Dr. Pavlov.

It has been fun reading all the posts this week. Been a long time since I read this forum with a sh*t eating grin on my face.

[bobbiemcgee]

yep, still unresolved: 1. sexual assualt trial 2. Mtv reality show payments? (of course he got paid!!) 3. UnderArmour deal? 4. Academics? (is he in fact qualified?) Anyone of these could result in a seperate NCAA inquiry. As we know, they do not move swiftly and act just when you think it's blown over. He will probably be in the pro's b4 UC gets slammed. This is why everyone else passed. There is no way Mic does this deal if Nancy the Nazi is still around imho.

[therick44]

yep, still unresolved: 1. sexual assualt trial 2. Mtv reality show payments? (of course he got paid!!) 3. UnderArmour deal? 4. Academics? (is he in fact qualified?) Anyone of these could result in a seperate NCAA inquiry. As we know, they do not move swiftly and act just when you think it's blown over. He will probably be in the pro's b4 UC gets slammed. This is why everyone else passed. There is no way Mic does this deal if Nancy the Nazi is still around imho.

UC won't get hit though because none of these things are connected to UC.

It's not the same as the Mayo situation where money changed hands between Mayo and Floyd. Now who knows what happens with all of this, but I don't think that UC will get nailed because of it. They know the investigation for reality show is coming, which very well could cost Stephenson his amateur status. The sexual assault trial won't amount to anything and the UA deal is only involving Maryland.

[D-West & PO-Z]

UC won't get hit though because none of these things are connected to UC.

It's not the same as the Mayo situation where money changed hands between Mayo and Floyd. Now who knows what happens with all of this, but I don't think that UC will get nailed because of it. They know the investigation for reality show is coming, which very well could cost Stephenson his amateur status. The sexual assault trial won't amount to anything and the UA deal is only involving Maryland.

If he plays before the investigation is complete, or they miss something in the investigation and find out about it later any games he played for UC would have to be forfeited.

Not to mention the risk that this kid will do something while at UC. Its doubtful that a kid who has 3 or 4 major issues over his head wont get into any trouble once he gets onto campus.

Lets just say there is a reason almost every major school in the country backed off a kid with this talent level.

[therick44]

You're probably right... Either way I'm not worried about him. We will be fine with Dante on him.

Hopefully it will make the shootout fun again.

[AdamtheFlyer]

If he plays before the investigation is complete, or they miss something in the investigation and find out about it later any games he played for UC would have to be forfeited.

That means absolutely nothing beyond the media guide. Cal has had one and probably will have his other Final Four trip vacated and no one but opposing fans care. If 2 years from now UC has a good season and, say, a Sweet 16 trip wiped off the books, it'll be worth it to have had the press of a kid like Stephenson on campus (for them to be really good, he'll have to be a national star).

Mick is really taking a minor gamble here. All he has to do is get the team to the dance and he's won. Heck, he probably has an NCAA team without Stephenson.

[therick44]

That means absolutely nothing beyond the media guide. Cal has had one and probably will have his other Final Four trip vacated and no one but opposing fans care. If 2 years from now UC has a good season and, say, a Sweet 16 trip wiped off the books, it'll be worth it to have had the press of a kid like Stephenson on campus (for them to be really good, he'll have to be a national star).

Mick is really taking a minor gamble here. All he has to do is get the team to the dance and he's won. Heck, he probably has an NCAA team without Stephenson.

Exactly.

This has already helped UC with recruiting just by him committing.

[bobbiemcgee]

UC won't get hit though because none of these things are connected to UC.

It's not the same as the Mayo situation where money changed hands between Mayo and Floyd. Now who knows what happens with all of this, but I don't think that UC will get nailed because of it. They know the investigation for reality show is coming, which very well could cost Stephenson his amateur status. The sexual assault trial won't amount to anything and the UA deal is only involving Maryland.

yeah, these things won't be a distraction in the least.

[D-West & PO-Z]

That means absolutely nothing beyond the media guide. Cal has had one and probably will have his other Final Four trip vacated and no one but opposing fans care. If 2 years from now UC has a good season and, say, a Sweet 16 trip wiped off the books, it'll be worth it to have had the press of a kid like Stephenson on campus (for them to be really good, he'll have to be a national star).

Mick is really taking a minor gamble here. All he has to do is get the team to the dance and he's won. Heck, he probably has an NCAA team without Stephenson.

It means a lot if as I said he does something new while at UC. It could mean loss of scholarships, suspension from going to the tournament, and so on. I think it is a lot more than a minor gamble. The kid isnt going to all of a sudden become a choir boy while at UC.

As I said before, there are teams not giving him the time of day. Why would that be so when the kid is good enough to go to the NBA after one year?

[wkrq59]

the Rick44,
The Underarmor thing involves more than Maryland. If the lad took so much as a cap during his tour and reportedly it was much more than that, there is a problem. If he or his family in any way was "compensated" by MTV for the series, there is a problem.
Doubt the sexual assault matter will prohibit his playing at UC. A good attorney will beat the rap easily from what I've read, unless he gets a hanging judge. I haven't heard of any grade problems.
I recommended the NY Times article because it detailed the allegations where many of the other stories didn't.
As far as Eastside J is concerned, Right, blame the bad old media, especially those East Coast liberal minded hatchet men from New York City. I can detail you a case of media bias right here in Cincinnati when a columnist no longer here spent three years before his departure bad mouthing Ken Griffey because he skipped an interview that had not been set up in advance with the Mariners by any member of his paper or himself.
New York has no corner on media bias. And UC has no corner on recruiting athletes with baggage.
Sadly, UC is going to go the certain one-and-done route because of a stupid NBA rule that makes a sham of college basketball. The "due progress" rule should have teeth added to it and the NBA should be forced to compensate the college that loses a one-and doner. The practice would be changed quickly. :D:D:D

[D-West & PO-Z]

the Rick44,
The Underarmor thing involves more than Maryland. If the lad took so much as a cap during his tour and reportedly it was much more than that, there is a problem. If he or his family in any way was "compensated" by MTV for the series, there is a problem.
Doubt the sexual assault matter will prohibit his playing at UC. A good attorney will beat the rap easily from what I've read, unless he gets a hanging judge. I haven't heard of any grade problems.
I recommended the NY Times article because it detailed the allegations where many of the other stories didn't.
As far as Eastside J is concerned, Right, blame the bad old media, especially those East Coast liberal minded hatchet men from New York City. I can detail you a case of media bias right here in Cincinnati when a columnist no longer here spent three years before his departure bad mouthing Ken Griffey because he skipped an interview that had not been set up in advance with the Mariners by any member of his paper or himself.
New York has no corner on media bias. And UC has no corner on recruiting athletes with baggage.
Sadly, UC is going to go the certain one-and-done route because of a stupid NBA rule that makes a sham of college basketball. The "due progress" rule should have teeth added to it and the NBA should be forced to compensate the college that loses a one-and doner. The practice would be changed quickly. :D:D:D

Q, I agree that the one year of college ball has some negatives but lets not pretend the schools are the victims. They know exactly what they are getting themselves into with these players and they are making a lot of money off of them. You think OSU feels the NBA owes them anything because of Oden, Conley, and Cook? Heck no! OSU is thanking the NBA for making that rule. Same with KSU with Beasley and many other schools.

[XU 87]

Paging Dr. Pavlov.

It has been fun reading all the posts this week. Been a long time since I read this forum with a sh*t eating grin on my face.

What a chickensh*t you are. We haven't heard from you since we kicked your ass in December, and now you're back.

Now that you're back, albeit for about a week, you're telling us that you're right, and all of the media are wrong. Classic, even for a shill like you.

Face it. Your team sucks. And your team is so desperate for talent that you recruited some kid that no one else wants.

Instead of admitting the obvious, you have to make a fool of yourself and proclaim, "The media is lying about this kid because he wouldn't tell them about who was recruiting him."

I thought you were a dumbass for proclaiming, "Bob Huggins is just giving these kids a helping hand." I thought you were a bigger dumbass when you claimed, "West gets all those rebounds because he plays bad defense."

But this last claim that ALL media is lying about your recruit is possibly the dumbest thing you have ever said.

And that's saying something.

[therick44]

the Rick44,
The Underarmor thing involves more than Maryland. If the lad took so much as a cap during his tour and reportedly it was much more than that, there is a problem. If he or his family in any way was "compensated" by MTV for the series, there is a problem.
Doubt the sexual assault matter will prohibit his playing at UC. A good attorney will beat the rap easily from what I've read, unless he gets a hanging judge. I haven't heard of any grade problems.
I recommended the NY Times article because it detailed the allegations where many of the other stories didn't.
As far as Eastside J is concerned, Right, blame the bad old media, especially those East Coast liberal minded hatchet men from New York City. I can detail you a case of media bias right here in Cincinnati when a columnist no longer here spent three years before his departure bad mouthing Ken Griffey because he skipped an interview that had not been set up in advance with the Mariners by any member of his paper or himself.
New York has no corner on media bias. And UC has no corner on recruiting athletes with baggage.
Sadly, UC is going to go the certain one-and-done route because of a stupid NBA rule that makes a sham of college basketball. The "due progress" rule should have teeth added to it and the NBA should be forced to compensate the college that loses a one-and doner. The practice would be changed quickly. :D:D:D

I think you misunderstood my post. You are 100% right! There could be problems and big ones with getting him qualified. My point is... It's not going to hurt UC much. They aren't the ones getting in trouble if he is nailed for any of those things, because they aren't connected. Really the only thing that might happen is he won't qualify. If he does something after he's with UC and they have to forfeit the games they win this year... It really doesn't matter to them.

The bottom line is whether he plays or not I'm not sure that this necessarily makes UC a great team and if they are ... then good! I'd rather us beat the crap out of a good team than the teams they've had the past two years. The old beating the No. 1 team in the country days were a hell of a lot more fun.

I'm not trying to pump UC up in any way, shape or form... I'm just trying to be reasonable about why they would take a chance on this guy and how much of a chance they are actually taking.

[therick44]

Q, I agree that the one year of college ball has some negatives but lets not pretend the schools are the victims. They know exactly what they are getting themselves into with these players and they are making a lot of money off of them. You think OSU feels the NBA owes them anything because of Oden, Conley, and Cook? Heck no! OSU is thanking the NBA for making that rule. Same with KSU with Beasley and many other schools.

Very well said!

I hate the one and done rule... but I do think it makes the college game interesting in a lot of ways.

[danaandvictory]

We haven't heard from you since we kicked your ass in December, and now you're back.

Not true, the blubbering vagina also showed up to gloat after we lost to Charlotte and Duquesne. Wasn't heard from during our Sweet Sixteen run but that's to be expected, he was busy at the time singlehandedly ousting Dr. Zimpher.

[danaandvictory]

I think you misunderstood my post. You are 100% right! There could be problems and big ones with getting him qualified. My point is... It's not going to hurt UC much. They aren't the ones getting in trouble if he is nailed for any of those things, because they aren't connected. Really the only thing that might happen is he won't qualify. If he does something after he's with UC and they have to forfeit the games they win this year... It really doesn't matter to them.

It's pretty typical UC that the question is not "should we do this?" but "can we get away with doing this?" Pretty much sums up their program for the last quarter century.

You know what gave me a shit-eating grin? When Mick's brave heroes managed to crap their pants on national TV to an 0-18 team. That's comedy.

[Eastside_J]

the Rick44,
The Underarmor thing involves more than Maryland. If the lad took so much as a cap during his tour and reportedly it was much more than that, there is a problem. If he or his family in any way was "compensated" by MTV for the series, there is a problem.
Doubt the sexual assault matter will prohibit his playing at UC. A good attorney will beat the rap easily from what I've read, unless he gets a hanging judge. I haven't heard of any grade problems.
I recommended the NY Times article because it detailed the allegations where many of the other stories didn't.
As far as Eastside J is concerned, Right, blame the bad old media, especially those East Coast liberal minded hatchet men from New York City. I can detail you a case of media bias right here in Cincinnati when a columnist no longer here spent three years before his departure bad mouthing Ken Griffey because he skipped an interview that had not been set up in advance with the Mariners by any member of his paper or himself.
New York has no corner on media bias. And UC has no corner on recruiting athletes with baggage.
Sadly, UC is going to go the certain one-and-done route because of a stupid NBA rule that makes a sham of college basketball. The "due progress" rule should have teeth added to it and the NBA should be forced to compensate the college that loses a one-and doner. The practice would be changed quickly. :D:D:D

"reportedly much more than that". --- Reported where? If it were reported I would assume you have a reference..


"Blame the bad old media" --- well I did just point out where the article proved to be completely wrong. The major point of the article was that he had no offers beyond Memphis. That was incorrect. It was based on 100% conjecture, because they couldn't get info from Stephenson. It was a Sh*t article, but obviously it works for you, so I fully expected that you would defend it.

[Eastside_J]

It's pretty typical UC that the question is not "should we do this?" but "can we get away with doing this?" Pretty much sums up their program for the last quarter century.

You know what gave me a shit-eating grin? When Mick's brave heroes managed to crap their pants on national TV to an 0-18 team. That's comedy.

Please. You really want a summary of the academic and/or, drug use and character risks you guys have taken in the last several years.

[wkrq59]

Ho hum, ho hum. More of the same. Ho hum.:D

[Ensenberger]

Does anyone believe it is possible that Lance has done nothing wrong???

haha, i just find it funny because everyone here makes it sound like they KNOW he is guilty of all of these things. Maybe he is... ok... will it make a difference to us? I think the plan is to beat them either way, that would be the best thing to be found guilty of, being beat by X!

[xavierj]

Does anyone believe it is possible that Lance has done nothing wrong???

haha, i just find it funny because everyone here makes it sound like they KNOW he is guilty of all of these things. Maybe he is... ok... will it make a difference to us? I think the plan is to beat them either way, that would be the best thing to be found guilty of, being beat by X!

Yeah it is possible but when you see that all the slimy car salesmen coaches would not touch this guy with a ten foot pole, then you have to figure this story has legs. The only people who claim he is clean are affiliated with the UC program.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Does anyone believe it is possible that Lance has done nothing wrong???

haha, i just find it funny because everyone here makes it sound like they KNOW he is guilty of all of these things. Maybe he is... ok... will it make a difference to us? I think the plan is to beat them either way, that would be the best thing to be found guilty of, being beat by X!


Yeah it is possible but when you see that all the slimy car salesmen coaches would not touch this guy with a ten foot pole, then you have to figure this story has legs. The only people who claim he is clean are affiliated with the UC program.

Ya, and when you have multiple accusations against you there is usually something there. I mean I dont think Pacman Jones was ever convicted of any crimes but does anyone actually believe he did nothing wrong over that stretch of time where he was in the news every week for something new?

I also think xavierj's point of every other coach/school backing off is a good one. That doesnt happen to someone with this kid's ability unless there is something going on.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Does anyone believe it is possible that Lance has done nothing wrong???

haha, i just find it funny because everyone here makes it sound like they KNOW he is guilty of all of these things. Maybe he is... ok... will it make a difference to us? I think the plan is to beat them either way, that would be the best thing to be found guilty of, being beat by X!

Ya it doesn't really bother except when the UC fans start making predictions of "final four" before the kid is 1) even eligible 2) played at the collegiate level.

[Stonebreaker]

Give the kid a break. If I was accused of something, I sure as heck would want the benefit of the doubt, at least until it's adjudicated. He's not squeeky clean, but I put alot of the blame on his parents and advisors, and not just him. The parents and mentors should have guided him better, and apparently, that hasn't been the case.

Urban Meyer at Florida has had 19 athletes get arrested 24 times. Tennesse has had issues, as well as Florida St, Miami, and even mighty (and revered) Joe Paterno has had his kids run into police trouble.
Yet most of these schools/coaches get a pass because of their success.

LS doesn't exactly help UC trying to turn around their image, but...he hasn't even been convicted, while other schools let kids continue playing (and giving a slap on the wrist) for athletes that actually get into trouble while enrolled.

Like I said before, I'm glad X and ND stay away from athletes like this, but let's not confuse the fact that major college athletics is a business, and for the most part...everyone is guilty with putting more emphasis on winning and the financial side, and less on academics and character.
When you have college athletes majoring in easy subjects, or schools like Auburn gives out good grades for essentially doing nothing....I have trouble with that. Should the kids be allowed in? Are they simply athletes, or student athletes? It seems as though the colleges could care less.

I blame the system, and not UC...which has actually done a pretty good job in recent years in terms of graduation and getting kids with decent character. We'll see how things develop, but sure as hell.....a whole lot of schools would have taken this kid AFTER the case (supposedly) gets dismissed. UC just grabbed him before.

[Stonebreaker]

Stephenson, the state's all-time leading scorer, said earlier this month that numerous college coaches have been in touch with him.

"A lot of college coaches call me every day to see what I'm doing," Stephenson said. "I'm just trying to take my time and pick a good school."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/06



If he gets the court case put behind him, how can you fault UC for grabbing him...when he was obviously still in high demand just weeks ago. If I were the coach at UC, I'd take him as well...as long as he doesn't get convicted of a felony. He's not there to run a business, teach small kids, etc.
He (like most other potential pros) is there because the NBA demands at least one year of college.

[XU 87]

Stonebreaker, the Daily News article you refer to is obviously a forgery. Eastside Jay already told us that Stephenson is not talking to the media.

And as a result, these numerous members of the media, some in New York and some not in New York, have conspired against Stephenson and are telling a bunch of lies about him.

Really. That is the honest truth from Jay.

So in the future, you need to check your newspaper and internet sites for accuracy. The only one that is accurate anymore is the UC basketball message board.

[therick44]

Stephenson, the state's all-time leading scorer, said earlier this month that numerous college coaches have been in touch with him.

"A lot of college coaches call me every day to see what I'm doing," Stephenson said. "I'm just trying to take my time and pick a good school."

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/high_school/2009/06



If he gets the court case put behind him, how can you fault UC for grabbing him...when he was obviously still in high demand just weeks ago. If I were the coach at UC, I'd take him as well...as long as he doesn't get convicted of a felony. He's not there to run a business, teach small kids, etc.
He (like most other potential pros) is there because the NBA demands at least one year of college.

Lol... He wasn't in high demand just a few weeks ago... He is right now! There are still teams trying to get back in.

[therick44]

Ya it doesn't really bother except when the UC fans start making predictions of "final four" before the kid is 1) even eligible 2) played at the collegiate level.

Lol let them keep dreaming...;)

... But seriously I could see them being a tournament team even without him. Let's not push it by saying final four though haha.

[D-West & PO-Z]

Lol... He wasn't in high demand just a few weeks ago... He is right now! There are still teams trying to get back in.

Who are these teams?

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Who are these teams?

if Henry leaves Kansas to go to Europe like his dad suggested, that could be it.

But i've heard Xavier Henry is staying at KU.

Either way i've spent way too much time typing about Lance Stephonson, who is probably not going to be eligible anyways.

[bearcat65]

Who are these teams?

Per Mike Decoursey,
"Stephenson was the last 2009 McDonald's All American to choose a college. Tuesday, Stephenson committed to Cincinnati over a bunch of schools that leaked to various reporters they were no longer interested but, for some reason, still were endeavoring to contact him as recently as this weekend."

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-basketball/article/2009-06-30/cronin-right-coach-keep-stephensons-attitude-check

[xsteve1]

Per Mike Decoursey,
"Stephenson was the last 2009 McDonald's All American to choose a college. Tuesday, Stephenson committed to Cincinnati over a bunch of schools that leaked to various reporters they were no longer interested but, for some reason, still were endeavoring to contact him as recently as this weekend."

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-basketball/article/2009-06-30/cronin-right-coach-keep-stephensons-attitude-check



We all know Decoursey has an infatuation with Mick Cronin...he thinks he's the reincarnation of John Wooden.:o

[_LH]

Per Mike Decoursey,
"Stephenson was the last 2009 McDonald's All American to choose a college. Tuesday, Stephenson committed to Cincinnati over a bunch of schools that leaked to various reporters they were no longer interested but, for some reason, still were endeavoring to contact him as recently as this weekend."

http://www.sportingnews.com/college-basketball/article/2009-06-30/cronin-right-coach-keep-stephensons-attitude-check

Who are the other schools? No one, NO ONE else offered to this kid. One coach called him a program killer.

[bearcat65]

Who are the other schools? No one, NO ONE else offered to this kid. One coach called him a program killer.

Ask Decoursey, I'd say he has more info on the matter than you do. Does that coach have a name or was it one of the many nameless people who have commented on this kid. If it was his high school coach then I would be very concerned. A Kansas fan commented on one of the UC boards about how Brandon Rush had a similar reputation as a selfish player coming out of high school. That seemed to work out ok.
There are no doubt concerns regarding this recruit but I don't see where Cronin is taking that much of a risk. If it doesn't pan out then they are no worse off than they were prior to him committing. If he does pan out then it puts UC back in the tournament and could well open the doors with other high profile recruits.

[_LH]

If there were really other schools (there weren't) DeCoursey would have specifically named them.

It was a college coach the called Lance and program killer and it had more to do with him potentially taking money or gifts while playing in the NCAA than his selfish attitude. Selfish players don't kill a program. They may kill a team for one or more years but major NCAA violations kill a program and that is a great fear many college coaches have with Lance.

No one else wants the kid. Congrats to UC in this desperate move.

[bearcat65]

So Decoursey is telling a lie? And how would you know that? I notice no name goes with that college coach. You dismiss Decoursey yet accept a reported comment from a nameless college coach as fact. I don't deny there are some concerns about this player but I think some are overstating the risk.

[_LH]

I'm not dismissing DeCoursey. He thinks others showed interest but he DOES NOT say others offered LS and you know why? No one else did.

The coach that called LS a program killer was quoted by a sport's writer. You can believe his opinion on LS or not, I really don't care. What you do have to believe is that NO ONE ELSE offered this kid and that's why he is going to UC (presently anyway).

[bearcat65]

http://www.zagsblog.com/2009/07/01/the-lance-stephenson-timeline/#comments

He took official visits to Kansas, Maryland, St Johns, and UC. How many players take official visits to schools that have not offered them? Kansas got a committment from Xavier Henry, had that not happened most feel Stephenson would have been a Jayhawk next year.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

http://www.zagsblog.com/2009/07/01/the-lance-stephenson-timeline/#comments

He took official visits to Kansas, Maryland, St Johns, and UC. How many players take official visits to schools that have not offered them? Kansas got a committment from Xavier Henry, had that not happened most feel Stephenson would have been a Jayhawk next year.

I heard Kansas wanted him intially until Henry showed interest. And being that Henry had less baggage and is cleared to play in the NCAA without any drop in talent, they chose him. Lance in retaliation, considered Kansas State.
Then when Henry thought about leaving, they were prepared to try to get Lance again.

Either way, this really isn't an important part of the debate. From what I hear and have read, LS has a long way to go before being cleared by the NCAA

[bearcat65]

The reality show is my biggest concern with him. If the NCAA doesn't find anything with that then I think he will play.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

The reality show is my biggest concern with him. If the NCAA doesn't find anything with that then I think he will play.

Exactly....The court case will probably get dropped. The Under Armor thing will be looked into but I don't think it concerns UC at all. Had he not gone to Under Armor and met with that booster, he probably would have gone to Maryland. I bet they are pissed.

The NCAA hasn't been to kind to you guys in the past with Hall/the polish guy/Riek. But ya you're right. His amateur status with those documentaries is the biggest concern.

And no one will know anytime soon since the NCAA is painfully slow, as we all know with Jordan Crawford and Mark Lyons last year...

[AviatorX]

In case anyone hasn't seen this, it's pretty entertaining stuff:

http://www.bornready.tv/

[wkrq59]

I'm curious. Did Arizona recruit this kid? As "needful" as Sean Miller appears to be for players who can help right away, I would think he would have been all over LS. :D

[AviatorX]

I'm curious. Did Arizona recruit this kid? As "needful" as Sean Miller appears to be for players who can help right away, I would think he would have been all over LS. :D

Depends who you want to listen to/believe...but I'm fairly sure the common opinion is that UA backed off and at the time of his commitment, Lance did not hold an official offer from Miller.

[bearcat65]

Exactly....The court case will probably get dropped. The Under Armor thing will be looked into but I don't think it concerns UC at all. Had he not gone to Under Armor and met with that booster, he probably would have gone to Maryland. I bet they are pissed.

The NCAA hasn't been to kind to you guys in the past with Hall/the polish guy/Riek. But ya you're right. His amateur status with those documentaries is the biggest concern.

And no one will know anytime soon since the NCAA is painfully slow, as we all know with Jordan Crawford and Mark Lyons last year...

That's all true. I'm interested to see if Riek gets cleared to play at Miss. St.

[KabeX]

In case anyone hasn't seen this, it's pretty entertaining stuff:

http://www.bornready.tv/

I watched the last episode (Elite 24 Game). He's definitely got a lot of moves and has the long range shot. But I think there was more defense played in the DSL. Seemed like the parting of the Red Sea on some of those drives. That said, it's a no brainer risk for UC. If he actually plays and fits in with the team, then UC will make some noise. Those are big, big If's IMO.
But Cronin really has no other choice at this point. He better get back to the dance soon or his head will be much sought after.

[Masterofreality]

Stephenson copped a plea deal. Guilty to Disorderly Conduct. No jail time. 3 days "Community Service."

Good. Now he'll learn what real basketball is all about- when he gets his grille dunked on at Cintas in December by one "Jammin' Jordan" Crawford.

[bobbiemcgee]

Good thing the NCAA isn't the NFL or he wouldn't be playing for a while.

[gladdenguy]

Good thing the NCAA isn't the NFL or he wouldn't be playing for a while.

He still might not be playing for awhile if ever in the NCAA

[therick44]

He was at the Deveroes Summer League today but didn't play.

[bobbiemcgee]

He was doing the "grope-a-dope" in the parking lot.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

He was doing the "grope-a-dope" in the parking lot.

hahahaha. I've already dubbed him "Born Ineligible"

Joking aside, it'll be fun to watch him play. Although you can't really tell much from summer league. Adrion Graves, Abdul Herrera, Alvin Mitchell all dominated the summer leagues...

Either way its cool to see this many great players in one building.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Stephenson copped a plea deal. Guilty to Disorderly Conduct. No jail time. 3 days "Community Service."

Good. Now he'll learn what real basketball is all about- when he gets his grille dunked on at Cintas in December by one "Jammin' Jordan" Crawford.

He's not out of woods at all. That wasn't the main concern. It was the Documentary and the Under Armor visit to a Maryland Booster.

Although if he is eligible, I share your same "Jammin" Jordan Crawford quote haha

[bobbiemcgee]

He'll be playing for the 'Corey Blunt All-Stars". Practice schedule @ the Cincy Workhouse.

[therick44]

He's not out of woods at all. That wasn't the main concern. It was the Documentary and the Under Armor visit to a Maryland Booster.

Although if he is eligible, I share your same "Jammin" Jordan Crawford quote haha

The Maryland UA deal is only an issue if he went to Maryland.

[D-West & PO-Z]

The Maryland UA deal is only an issue if he went to Maryland.

I thought there were concerns he was paid for the documentary. That would not only be a concern if he went to Maryland would it?

[therick44]

I thought there were concerns he was paid for the documentary. That would not only be a concern if he went to Maryland would it?

Right.

But that has nothing to do with the Underarmour thing. That's all I was commenting on.

Really the only concern right now is the documentary...

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Right.

But that has nothing to do with the Underarmour thing. That's all I was commenting on.

Really the only concern right now is the documentary...

I think the documentary is the main concern, you're right. But what transpired at the Under Armor factory will be researched thoroughly so if anything happened or anything was signed, the NCAA will find out

Anyone stay for the Slats game? i left during the game before. My back was killing me

[therick44]

I think the documentary is the main concern, you're right. But what transpired at the Under Armor factory will be researched thoroughly so if anything happened or anything was signed, the NCAA will find out

Anyone stay for the Slats game? i left during the game before. My back was killing me

Yeah SLATS lost... Vince Cook was killin em.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Yeah SLATS lost... Vince Cook was killin em.

Did "Born Ready" play?

[therick44]

Did "Born Ready" play?

He was a no-show.

[sweet16]

Yeah SLATS lost... Vince Cook was killin em.

Yes he was.......what's the story with that kid? I remember watching him play at Lakota and thought he was very talented and now he's playing at Miami-Hamilton.

[gladdenguy]

He was a no-show.

So all the UC fans who went out to see their savior were disappointed? I love it.
I hope he is a no show for the season as well.

[Lamont Sanford]

So all the UC fans who went out to see their savior were disappointed? I love it.
I hope he is a no show for the season as well.

Agreed, gg. I hope Lance and Mick spend the bulk of the season waiting for the NCAA to make a decision on his eligibility only to say 'no' at the 11th hour. Then watch him announce his intention to get into the NBA Draft the next day.

[???]

So all the UC fans who went out to see their savior were disappointed? I love it.
I hope he is a no show for the season as well.

Lance Stephenson is not considered the UC savior, at least not by UC fans. He is the icing on the cake. The new back up PG JaQuan Parker is the recruit that was a must get.

UC fans should not really be disappointed at all. They saw some good players and some guys who are now ready to compete for Big East titles. This UC team is very talented and ready to move forward. Lance Stephenson is a very good player that will only make them better. I think the fans can wait to see him in November and let him hit the weight room in July.

Apparently Kobe Bryant could not wait to see Stephenson in person so he flew across the country (twice) for high school games.

I would have to think that the XU fans were more disappointed that they had to see the new X recruit "Jeff Robinson", not a very encouraging way to start the new era.

[George Remus]

If they saw Robinson play Sunday I doubt XU fans were disappointed 1.) Since no one expects much from Robinson and 2.) Crawford, Lyons and Tutu were very impressive on Sunday.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

If they saw Robinson play Sunday I doubt XU fans were disappointed 1.) Since no one expects much from Robinson and 2.) Crawford, Lyons and Tutu were very impressive on Sunday.

Once again I agree with George. Robinson is definitely a work in progress.

Tutu and Lyons had an epic battle. JC, as the announcer called him, stole the show. 31 points, tip in dunk, fade away 3's, nasty crossover to dunk, mid range fade-aways, nice fingeroll. He can do it all. JC got the crowd buzzing numerous times. I'll be honest, I had reservations going into this year...After watching the improvement of Tutu, the athleticism of Lyons, and the flat out talent of JC, I'm pumped again. Lance Stephenson vs Jordan Crawford will be awesome (if Born ready doesn't become Born Ineligible)

[Murph85]

There is some heavy back and forth in the enquirer today regarding this recruit. One comment states that we are on the way down with Mack and that they are returning to prominence.

I must admit, this is my darkest fear. Seeing Dayton land top 100 recruits and the uncertainty they exists with X is not fun. I would love it if Mack and company could land a real solid recruit and put my fears to rest. The staff is impressive but until the recruits start getting on board I remain uneasy.

[ballyhoohoo]

There is some heavy back and forth in the enquirer today regarding this recruit. One comment states that we are on the way down with Mack and that they are returning to prominence.

I must admit, this is my darkest fear. Seeing Dayton land top 100 recruits and the uncertainty they exists with X is not fun. I would love it if Mack and company could land a real solid recruit and put my fears to rest. The staff is impressive but until the recruits start getting on board I remain uneasy.

Mack and Co. have already landed more then solid recruits for 2010 and 2011. Stevenson (if eligable) will be one and done. As for Dayton, they will always be Dayton.

[Murph85]

Who are we counting in 2010 and 2011??

Latham returning was a victory for 2010 but we have nobody else.

[Mark 3 Pointer]

Jordan Latham and Dee Davis... ring any bells. You can't be serious right?

Both top 100 recruits.

[Cheesehead]

Keep up Murph.

[PMI]

Davis seems to be getting more and more solid by the day. There's no need to be paranoid. Order will remain.

[DC Muskie]

UC is on the way up for sure. They can't get any lower.

Dayton won it's first NCAA tournament game since 1990. Great job.

We might be on the way down. We might just make it back to the dance. Winning the first game of the tournament for us a downer.

[XU 87]

Mack is doing a very good job recruiting. I would say that the quality of players he is recruiting is as good or better than than Miller's recruits.

Latham will probably be a top 100 recruit. The point guard from Indiana (Davis) is a top 60 recruit. The last kid who just committed (Robinson) originally committed to Purdue. And there's a long list of other top 100 players that X is in the running for.

And Mack isn't just handing out scholarships to warm bodies. They had that big kid in from Indiana (Hale?) a few weeks ago. He already had a scholarship from Purdue so you would figure he was pretty good. After watching him play, Mack wasn't too impressed and never offered.

Mack has assembled a staff who have a past history of being strong recruiters. So I wouldn't be too concerned about our ability to recruit.

[xu15]

Dee Davis is a stud. That is who we have in '11

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Dee Davis is a stud. That is who we have in '11

#72 player right now, and could move up into the top 50 when its all over

[Woodburn]

There is some heavy back and forth in the enquirer today regarding this recruit. One comment states that we are on the way down with Mack and that they are returning to prominence.

I must admit, this is my darkest fear. Seeing Dayton land top 100 recruits and the uncertainty they exists with X is not fun. I would love it if Mack and company could land a real solid recruit and put my fears to rest. The staff is impressive but until the recruits start getting on board I remain uneasy.

Good lord. You decided that you should start an entire thread on this board because some retard that posts comments in the Enquirer talks sh*t about "Eggsavior" etc.? Did you even check the recruiting forum? Do the rest of us a favor - and follow these simple steps before you start another thread:

1. Think of a great question you don't know the answer to.
2. Do a modicum of research about item 1.
3. If you still have a question, then maybe it's worth posting a new thread about.

[XUOHTX]

Good lord. You decided that you should start an entire thread on this board because some retard that posts comments in the Enquirer talks sh*t about "Eggsavior" etc.? Did you even check the recruiting forum? Do the rest of us a favor - and follow these simple steps before you start another thread:

1. Think of a great question you don't know the answer to.
2. Do a modicum of research about item 1.
3. If you still have a question, then maybe it's worth posting a new thread about.

Whoa Woody...take it easy. I think his original post was about his fear, not a response to a comment he read.

[Jumpy]

I am as confident (if not more) in this coaching staff's ability to recruit as I was Miller's staff. Once Mack proves he can coach on the floor the floodgates will open with recruits who were previously on the fence pouring in.

[Cincysportsfan02]

New to the board here and want to throw my two cents around. First of all I am a UC fan ( that is how I was raised) Got my BA from UC and my MBA from Xavier. A very close friend of mine played for Xavier about 10 years ago and I follow Xavier but my heart is with UC. I have been reading this board for some time and have a few connections out in the recruiting circles so I can bring some non biased perspective to some questions or thoughts that are posted on here.

First of all with UC. Lance is going to be eligible and is going to play for UC. Very reliable sources and some high profile coaches confirming this. I know that x fans have their own source who is saying otherwise. I am here to tell you that he has no clue what is going on here. Trust me on this.

Ok enough with UC. X is going to be very good next year. Crawford is an absolute stud. I watched him at Deveroes a few times and WOW. Tutu and Lyons are both solid. I give the edge to Tutu at this point. Lyons handle is weak and he can't shoot. That will come for him down the road but for now Tutu is ahead of him. I am very impressed with Mclean. Looks solid and is a really good kid. The only other guy I have seen play this summer is Redford and I just don't get him. Besides getting hot (does not happen very often when someone is guarding him) I don't think he gives X much at all. He is clearly overmatched against quicker guards but if he can win a game or two with his bombs he is worth it. Just don't expect him to ever be a differnce maker.

Next year's starting 5 and backups
Dante. 3
Jordan 2 Redford
Tutu 1 Lyons
Mclean 4 Taylor ( don't expect much from Robinson he is very very very raw)
Love 5 Freeze

X is capable of a sweet 16 this year if things fall into place. I pick X as the favorite in the A10. I don't buy any of the crap about Dayton being better than X.

Looking forward to a good year. Go UC and go X.

[bobbiemcgee]

Redford's presence will spread the floor for X, assuming he can shoot the same or better percentage next year. I see him more of a disrupting influence on the other team's defense but don't expect any more minutes than he got last year. I am expecting one of the best backcourts in the nation, a huge improvement over last year. Everyone in the post has to get better, but X will have many more options on offense and a lot more open looks IMHO. I think Lance will be a season long distraction for UC, too many issues and given his track record, probably a few more. At any rate, he'll be gone in March or before.

[XU 87]

Cincy, that's a fair analysis except for Redford. As for Redford getting hot, it will happen and did happen in a few games last year. The guy can flat out shoot.

P.S. But without having seen Lyons play, on your analysis as to his play, I render a "no comment".

[bobbiemcgee]

Since I don't follow UC at all and could care-less, I only expect to see 30 or so minutes of his career on 12/13 if elgible. About the same effect as if A-ROD played one game for the D-Backs @ Coors Field.

[surfxu]

Well said Jumpy. I can understand why someone MAY feel like Murph but the reality is wheels have already been set in motion to maintain the success on the court that X has had the last fistfull of years and once coach Mack gets a 25+ win season under his belt next year then he'll be primed to ONLY have 100 recruits banging down the door. To borrow a line from Apollo 13...This will be our finest hour. Anxiety is only normal when there is some unfamiliarity and unknowns, but this is a very competent coaching staff with top notch recruiting abilities. Mack recruited a lot of these guys and Kelsey did a tremendous job at Wake Forest. All will be fine. Back off the ledge slowly. This is the opportunity to show the basketball community that X continues to move forward and accomplish more everytime we have a new general.

[FIGHTING MUSKETEER]

I am as confident (if not more) in this coaching staff's ability to recruit as I was Miller's staff. Once Mack proves he can coach on the floor the floodgates will open with recruits who were previously on the fence pouring in.
Agree. I will only add that if we want to nail a top 50 player every year, we need to put more players into the NBA in a consistent basis. After all, these kids want to go Pro and ultimately want to go to a school/program scouts respect and look at. We have had good players, coaches and certainly have a good/respectful system and program. So in my humble opinion, the last piece of the puzzle to get elite players (top 25/50) every year is to put players in the NBA at least every other year. Now this is a vicious circle. So it is easier said than done. We have other options and should have a contingency plan. In the past, we were able to get excellent players that went under the radar and overlooked and/or undermined by the ranking services.

[Cincysportsfan02]

I agree Lance is one and done. No doubt about it. It was worth the risk for Mick to take him on though. Mick is not letting him play in the DSL because he does not want this to turn into a circus. Every news station in town was there on Sunday since he was supposed to play. I think that is a smart move to let him lay low and get him in the weight room. We don't need him to be a distraction.

I am a UC fan but love college hoops in general. UC could not win a game and I will still watch college hoops every day of the week. For my money it is the best game around. I will watch any game anytime.

Jordan Crawford is the best guard X has ever had. I am throwing that out there. He may be a one and done guy at X if he plays the season like he is playing now. His stock is very very high right now and with all the Lebron talk NBA scouts draw more and more interest. Just be aware of that. There is no shame in going pro early and no shame in getting one and done's. I don't want all one and done's like Ohio State but one here and there is not a bad thing. It means you can recruit good players and you probably had a good year if that player leaves early. I am a huge J. Crawford fan. Got to talk to him at DSL a few times and he seems humble and is not letting the Lebron talk get to his head.

[therick44]

New to the board here and want to throw my two cents around. First of all I am a UC fan ( that is how I was raised) Got my BA from UC and my MBA from Xavier. A very close friend of mine played for Xavier about 10 years ago and I follow Xavier but my heart is with UC. I have been reading this board for some time and have a few connections out in the recruiting circles so I can bring some non biased perspective to some questions or thoughts that are posted on here.

First of all with UC. Lance is going to be eligible and is going to play for UC. Very reliable sources and some high profile coaches confirming this. I know that x fans have their own source who is saying otherwise. I am here to tell you that he has no clue what is going on here. Trust me on this.

Ok enough with UC. X is going to be very good next year. Crawford is an absolute stud. I watched him at Deveroes a few times and WOW. Tutu and Lyons are both solid. I give the edge to Tutu at this point. Lyons handle is weak and he can't shoot. That will come for him down the road but for now Tutu is ahead of him. I am very impressed with Mclean. Looks solid and is a really good kid. The only other guy I have seen play this summer is Redford and I just don't get him. Besides getting hot (does not happen very often when someone is guarding him) I don't think he gives X much at all. He is clearly overmatched against quicker guards but if he can win a game or two with his bombs he is worth it. Just don't expect him to ever be a differnce maker.

Next year's starting 5 and backups
Dante. 3
Jordan 2 Redford
Tutu 1 Lyons
Mclean 4 Taylor ( don't expect much from Robinson he is very very very raw)
Love 5 Freeze

X is capable of a sweet 16 this year if things fall into place. I pick X as the favorite in the A10. I don't buy any of the crap about Dayton being better than X.

Looking forward to a good year. Go UC and go X.

I wouldn't say that I disagree with Tutu being ahead of Lyons at this point... Though I don't know if that will be the case when we start the season... but I thoroughly disagree with your reasoning.

Lyons ballhandling is weak? Based on what? He's a fantastic ballhandler and is a magician at times with the ball. Now if you mean he still has too much street and flair in his game than I'd tend to agree with you but this is summer ball.

And as far as shooting if you had to ask me to pick one of those two in a three-point contest right now it'd be Lyons without question. He is not a bad shooter at all.

And as for Redford not being a difference maker... Ask Derrick Brown how much of a difference maker he WASN'T when DB had an open lane to drive through... Or ask opposing teams who had to assign a decent defender to chase around a 6-foot white kid as soon as he crossed half court how much of a difference that didn't make.

[JimmyTwoTimes37]

Cincy, as far as Lance Stephenson goes, I'll believe it when I see it. I've heard the complete contrary to what you've heard (Albeit not in the last 2 weeks so you may have a development I do not). I hope the kid plays.

the NCAA has not been to kind to your bearcats the last couple years. First Hall was supposed to be eligible. Then Riek was supposed to be eligible. Then the Polish guy (although he played the next year). Mike Williams was denied another year of eligibility. Judging by past events from the NCAA towards UC, and the serious national baggage that Stephenson has, I'd say nothing is for certain.

[paulxu]

You might want to review this article, and note that we now have Derrick Brown in.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/76607-which-colleges-produce-the-most-nba-players

[Murph85]

Good lord. You decided that you should start an entire thread on this board because some retard that posts comments in the Enquirer talks sh*t about "Eggsavior" etc.? Did you even check the recruiting forum? Do the rest of us a favor - and follow these simple steps before you start another thread:

1. Think of a great question you don't know the answer to.
2. Do a modicum of research about item 1.
3. If you still have a question, then maybe it's worth posting a new thread about.

OK Woody...and I think I know how you got your name

1. Why are you such an ass
2. I researched you. Try google if you need a hotel near XU campus
3. See #2

The nerve of some ass that starts thread for Butler tix then a hotel nera campus. Do me a favor and STFU!!!!!!!!

[George Remus]

I wouldn't say that I disagree with Tutu being ahead of Lyons at this point... Though I don't know if that will be the case when we start the season... but I thoroughly disagree with your reasoning.

Lyons ballhandling is weak? Based on what? He's a fantastic ballhandler and is a magician at times with the ball. Now if you mean he still has too much street and flair in his game than I'd tend to agree with you but this is summer ball.

And as far as shooting if you had to ask me to pick one of those two in a three-point contest right now it'd be Lyons without question. He is not a bad shooter at all.

And as for Redford not being a difference maker... Ask Derrick Brown how much of a difference maker he WASN'T when DB had an open lane to drive through... Or ask opposing teams who had to assign a decent defender to chase around a 6-foot white kid as soon as he crossed half court how much of a difference that didn't make.

Not only do I agree with the above but I would like to add that Crawford (at least at this point in his XU career) is no where near the best guard to ever play at XU and that while Cincysportsfan02 seems even handed his posts are certainly biased. Stephenson's eligibility is a great unknown right now. Mick can state all he wants one way or the other but he probably doesn't know. Just review his comments about the eligibility of Reik.

[PMI]

I, for one, would be interested to see Stevenson play. I mean if he can cause this much anger in the two threads he's the subject of, imagine how our crowd will respond to him on that NFL Sunday in December.

[Runningman]

OK Woody...and I think I know how you got your name

1. Why are you such an ass
2. I researched you. Try google if you need a hotel near XU campus
3. See #2

The nerve of some ass that starts thread for Butler tix then a hotel nera campus. Do me a favor and STFU!!!!!!!!

Who gave the thirteen year old unsupervised internet access? I'm with Jumpy I have full faith in this staff. They are working their asses off this summer and really making their presence felt unlike any XU staff before them.

[dnyed]

Staff is set up to recruit solid players. Returning players are solid with four new players coming into the line (Lyons, Robinson, Crawford, & Walsh with four years left). And we are still Xavier, have been through this before, and will come out stronger than going into the situation. Anything less than the Sweet 16 will be a failure for the 09-10 season.

UC landed an awesome player because nobody wanted him. Dayton is a good program but is lucky to have the opportunity to tag along and be mentioned with Xavier. F@#$ Dayton & UC! God bless Yuengling Lager & Xavier!

[Cincysportsfan02]

I am not being biased. I am calling it like it is. I know more about the Lance situation that 99% of Bearcat fans. I guess we will wait and see what happens. Enough Lance talk.

I said I root for UC and X but my heart is with UC. I have a family member who is a booster and several good friends who are big X fans. I watch every X game on TV and went to Game Day several times last year to watch X games and was there for every tourney game. X outplayed Pitt in the sweet 16 game and got beat period.

I have seen Lyons play many many times and say it like it is. Here goes.
Defense: Lock down defender. Maybe one of the best defenders in the A-10 this year at the guard position.
Handle. Shaky. Trust me if he was playing against real defense and coaching he would have alot of turnover. Tries to rush things to much. Do I trust Lyons on press break. No not yet. I said not yet, remember he is a freshman. Will get better. Relax.
Shot. OK. Do I worry about Mark Lyons beating me from deep? No. Again lots of time to get his shot better.
Attitude: Love it. In attack mode at all times. He will be able to beat people off the dribble and attack the hoop. You can't teach that.

People on here who think Lyons is going to be a big time point guard next year are going to be disappointed. I say that from watching him play not reading what people say on a message board. He will be a good one but it might take a year or two for everything to fall together.

That is why I said that Tutu will play more minutes and at this point is better.

As far as Redford. Can he shoot? No question about it. I have my eyes on him at all times during a game if I am playing X. He helps spread the floor. What I don't like is that he looks overmatched on the floor. If he was not a dead eye shooter and just a good shooter he would not be playing at X or many other D-1 programs. Flat out truth. Same thing with Biggie Mcclain. If he were 6-8 and not 7-1 he would not be at UC or many other D-1 programs. It is what it is.

I just like college basketball period. I live in Cincinnati and know a ton about Xavier basketball, Xavier recruiting, and besides a good friend of mine playing for X I know the Kelsey family very well. Pat is a great guy and there is no better guy to root for than him.

[XURunner85]

Oh Murph, if this the Murph85 who I know, who had all A's at X. Murph, lets not get crazy here. Mack has signed some top guys for next year and the next. We are still waiting on Spoon to decide, if he comes that will be another. We also have a good crew that is still here. Lets not circle the wagons, let the others talk. First thing you will know we will see that other school across town in lineups again and that one from the north, they have to win first to prove they are better, and every year it is the same and they lose....let's just wait and see and enjoy, you will see a different Muskie team and they will impress you from staff to players......trust me

[AdamtheFlyer]

Wrong thread.

[XavierSteve]

-I am having a Yuengling Premium right now. Thank God for hookups that know where to get the stuff in Ohio and thank God for Xavier Basketball.

-J Love down to 10% body fat. One of my employees has summer classes with Kenny Frease. He says he is in much better shape than last year and has noticeably lost weight.

[D-West & PO-Z]

I am not being biased. I am calling it like it is. I know more about the Lance situation that 99% of Bearcat fans. I guess we will wait and see what happens. Enough Lance talk.

I said I root for UC and X but my heart is with UC. I have a family member who is a booster and several good friends who are big X fans. I watch every X game on TV and went to Game Day several times last year to watch X games and was there for every tourney game. X outplayed Pitt in the sweet 16 game and got beat period.

I have seen Lyons play many many times and say it like it is. Here goes.
Defense: Lock down defender. Maybe one of the best defenders in the A-10 this year at the guard position.
Handle. Shaky. Trust me if he was playing against real defense and coaching he would have alot of turnover. Tries to rush things to much. Do I trust Lyons on press break. No not yet. I said not yet, remember he is a freshman. Will get better. Relax.
Shot. OK. Do I worry about Mark Lyons beating me from deep? No. Again lots of time to get his shot better.
Attitude: Love it. In attack mode at all times. He will be able to beat people off the dribble and attack the hoop. You can't teach that.

People on here who think Lyons is going to be a big time point guard next year are going to be disappointed. I say that from watching him play not reading what people say on a message board. He will be a good one but it might take a year or two for everything to fall together.

That is why I said that Tutu will play more minutes and at this point is better.

As far as Redford. Can he shoot? No question about it. I have my eyes on him at all times during a game if I am playing X. He helps spread the floor. What I don't like is that he looks overmatched on the floor. If he was not a dead eye shooter and just a good shooter he would not be playing at X or many other D-1 programs. Flat out truth. Same thing with Biggie Mcclain. If he were 6-8 and not 7-1 he would not be at UC or many other D-1 programs. It is what it is.

I just like college basketball period. I live in Cincinnati and know a ton about Xavier basketball, Xavier recruiting, and besides a good friend of mine playing for X I know the Kelsey family very well. Pat is a great guy and there is no better guy to root for than him.

I'm buying everything your selling, but ONLY becauses you said "trust me".

[nuts4xu]

I am not being biased. I am calling it like it is. I know more about the Lance situation that 99% of Bearcat fans. I guess we will wait and see what happens. Enough Lance talk.

I said I root for UC and X but my heart is with UC. I have a family member who is a booster and several good friends who are big X fans. I watch every X game on TV and went to Game Day several times last year to watch X games and was there for every tourney game. X outplayed Pitt in the sweet 16 game and got beat period.

I have seen Lyons play many many times and say it like it is. Here goes.
Defense: Lock down defender. Maybe one of the best defenders in the A-10 this year at the guard position.
Handle. Shaky. Trust me if he was playing against real defense and coaching he would have alot of turnover. Tries to rush things to much. Do I trust Lyons on press break. No not yet. I said not yet, remember he is a freshman. Will get better. Relax.
Shot. OK. Do I worry about Mark Lyons beating me from deep? No. Again lots of time to get his shot better.
Attitude: Love it. In attack mode at all times. He will be able to beat people off the dribble and attack the hoop. You can't teach that.

People on here who think Lyons is going to be a big time point guard next year are going to be disappointed. I say that from watching him play not reading what people say on a message board. He will be a good one but it might take a year or two for everything to fall together.

That is why I said that Tutu will play more minutes and at this point is better.

As far as Redford. Can he shoot? No question about it. I have my eyes on him at all times during a game if I am playing X. He helps spread the floor. What I don't like is that he looks overmatched on the floor. If he was not a dead eye shooter and just a good shooter he would not be playing at X or many other D-1 programs. Flat out truth. Same thing with Biggie Mcclain. If he were 6-8 and not 7-1 he would not be at UC or many other D-1 programs. It is what it is.

I just like college basketball period. I live in Cincinnati and know a ton about Xavier basketball, Xavier recruiting, and besides a good friend of mine playing for X I know the Kelsey family very well. Pat is a great guy and there is no better guy to root for than him.

With all due respect....

I love it when people "call it like it is" when in fact they are guessing about how a guy will do, and have no earthly idea how that player will actually perform. I have yet to see a crystal ball that can accurately predict how well a guy will play. I don't give a rat's ass how many times you have seen anyone play, or who you know that plays on what team, or what family you babysat for growing up-- you have no better idea how well a player will pan out than any Tom, Dick, or Harry on the street.

And no offense, but where you watched Xavier games has no connection with how much you think you know about how well a player will do in his career. You can watch Xavier games on the jumbo tron at cintas center sitting on Muskieman's lap from now until 2035 and it still will not make you any better of a talent scout than anyone else.

You can "call it like it is" but do not take offense when I call your post a bunch of "bullsh**". After all, I did begin my post saying "with all due respect".

Just my 2 cents.

[Masterofreality]

With all due respect....

...you have no better idea how well a player will pan out than any Tom, Dick, or Harry on the street.




Hey, son. I resemble that remark! :)

[FIGHTING MUSKETEER]

You might want to review this article, and note that we now have Derrick Brown in.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/76607-which-colleges-produce-the-most-nba-players

Thank you paulxu. I'm very much aware of it and of the ones that made it prior to DB(and even those that should have). My point is that once we get more consistent in placing players into the NBA, our chances to get elite players increase exponentially. I leave it to you if players that get drafted but never get a contract or do not even play for a full season shoul be considered in the analysis. However, if we take as an example the 3 players mentioned in the article (David West was drafted on 2003 while Posey got drafted back in 1999) we get 3 players in 10 years. Thats certainly not bad. In fact is darn good, but is that good enough to attract the real elite players? I do not think so and feel we need to do a little better than that. Now, what thee school can do to improve that? As i said its a vicious circle where many variables are not in XU's control/hands.

[George Remus]

With all due respect....

I love it when people "call it like it is" when in fact they are guessing about how a guy will do, and have no earthly idea how that player will actually perform. I have yet to see a crystal ball that can accurately predict how well a guy will play. I don't give a rat's ass how many times you have seen anyone play, or who you know that plays on what team, or what family you babysat for growing up-- you have no better idea how well a player will pan out than any Tom, Dick, or Harry on the street.

And no offense, but where you watched Xavier games has no connection with how much you think you know about how well a player will do in his career. You can watch Xavier games on the jumbo tron at cintas center sitting on Muskieman's lap from now until 2035 and it still will not make you any better of a talent scout than anyone else.

You can "call it like it is" but do not take offense when I call your post a bunch of "bullsh**". After all, I did begin my post saying "with all due respect".

Just my 2 cents.

I really agree with this.

02,

You certainly are biased (which is okay) but just admit it. Also, your evaluations based on watching players in the DSL is laughable.

[Woodburn]

Do me a favor and STFU!!!!!!!!

Please tell me you're a parody poster, or are doing your best to imitate one. Are you new to this board? "Do me a favor and STFU!!!"???? Really? I'm too busy laughing to even know how to respond to this. By the way - seems as if the majority of folks here have decided your post was either 1) ill informed or 2) inane. Sorry man - but I stand by my original post here.

[PMI]

Mods, in the future please try to keep Woodburn and Murph out of the same thread during the third week of each month. Thanks in advance.

[Ensenberger]

I think he meant he is telling it like it is when it comes to Stephenson.

I agree with him on Lyons handles, he is long and athletic, and that helps him weave through people driving, but by no means is he Steve Nash (but really... who is?)

The one thing I want to see improvement on from Tutu is his on the court decisions. I'm not really sure if that is the right wording, but basically what I mean is sometimes I thought he tried to do toooo much to try and score. The more he drives and dishes, rather than drive and try an awkward layup the happier I will be.

McLean has looked stunning in the DSL, he has really stepped up his game and I love it!

[Murph85]

Woody. Better be careful about that laughing. We wouldn't want the district manager putting you back on the drive thru window.

[Muskie]

and we're done.

[bobbiemcgee]

Good to hear about McLean.....we will need him bad this yr. To tell you the truth, I'm much more excited by this team then last years.I think It will be more of a "Gunslinger" mentality, which could be good or bad but fun to watch.

[bobbiemcgee]

and we're done.

yep

[bobbiemcgee]

Who are the other schools? No one, NO ONE else offered to this kid. One coach called him a program killer.

Guess that coach was right.